A Forsworn Story

[3Dmember]

Okay I have a problem. On the Primal Magic beginning quest where i'm sent to Lore Grove with a spriggan mask on. I get there and the whole place is on fire and the spriggan is on the ground dead and it says i'm supposed to talk to her but somehow I think this is borked and not the intended event.

[3Dmember]

Yeah.. so that quest is not the only quest i'm having trouble with getting to work. I'd say now that I've attempted to go and do a bunch of the quests. At least 60% of the mod is not functional for me. I made my current MO Profile for just this mod so basically all I have is the mod requirements and a few of the recommended mods like untamed. Most of the creatures I have zero dialogue for and half the quests just go and trigger all on there own in completely random orders for no apparent reason. 

 

Not complaining I get that it's a WIP. Just wondering why this is because everyone probably has more mods running than me and I seem to have no end of problems.

[3Dmember]

I'm using a custom race(Succubus Race off the nexus). Is there any reason that would conflict... As far as I know it doesn't have anything quest related so yeah I dunno.

[Delzaron]

In my tests, the mod is 70% functionnal.

 

I really dont understand why people cant speak to Moro or the trial spriggan. However, they can speak to the werewolf or the old troll.

 

- In the lore grove, you should talk to Katalia; not the spriggan... she must finish her scene first.

- "and half the quests just go and trigger all on there own in completely random orders for no apparent reason" : you mean core quests, or side quests ?

[aqqh]

I really dont understand why people cant speak to Moro or the trial spriggan. However, they can speak to the werewolf or the old troll.

Because talking with creatures is very unreliable in general (it seems skyrim doesnt rly support such thing). Your mod is no exception here (Animal Mansion, Untamed they had the same problem with unresponsive creatures).

 

Generally you should rather avoid doing such things if possible. Because for some ppl it would work, for others it would be broken and most likely there is nothing you can do to make it work for everyone.

[3Dmember]

 

 

- In the lore grove, you should talk to Katalia; not the spriggan... she must finish her scene first.

Yeah that's the problem, it's not triggering. Not sure why. I sit there for many minutes and nothing happens. Is the place supposed to be burning and stuff?

 

 

 

I really dont understand why people cant speak to Moro or the trial spriggan. However, they can speak to the werewolf or the old troll.

 

I can speak to the trial spriggan and the old troll just not the wolf Moro. Usually I have no problem with animal dialogues this is the first time it's been a problem for me.

 

 

 

- "and half the quests just go and trigger all on there own in completely random orders for no apparent reason" : you mean core quests, or side quests ?

Yeah. I dunno. As far as 60% isn't functional. I'll revise that and say about 30-40% is not currently functional for me. I just did some more tests after removing some more mods and got previously non working quests to function except the Moro wolf and the Lore Grove(the scene is not triggering at all). Also I found out that certain options in Untamed conflict with your mod in a big way. If you leave Untamed at default and don't touch it a lot of stuff in your mod works fine but as soon as I fiddled with options like the untamed trigger functions or the monster type functions all hell broke lose and bam randomly triggering side quests that I know weren't supposed to trigger in that way started going haywire.

 

For example the one where what's her name teaches Katalia how to fuck a wolf. By the time it gets past her turn my character locks in place into an infinite loop and I have to reload the game. There's many others that seem to be affected as well like the shamanism trial, I go in there and every animal is hostile except the old troll and the lion just freezes in place doing nothing. By the way the mods that I removed were Sexlab Deadly Drain and Sexlab Leveling I had them included in my Succubus Package that I always install(completely forgot that I had installed them). Also Estrus Chaurus as well, I removed it on the second test and I found inside the ruins during shaman trial that the animals didn't attack me anymore. So it definitely is screwing with something haha.

 

I'm going to keep playing around with it and testing your mod because I really love it. It's just so far it's been unreliable for me. i'm curious do you think that me playing a Succubus Race is part of the problem? That would be a real shame because Succubus is like the only race I like playing lol. It seems like ALOT of mods conflict with yours. In addition I found that all the breasts on the top less forsworn armor since 1.59 are imploded. Maybe I installed something wrong I dunno. I use CBBE HDT body so maybe that's why I dunno. It would be awesome if it had a bodyslide conversion. Does SevenBase look better with that topless forsworn armor? I have no problem switching over to SevenBase if that's the case.

 

Like I said I'll keep trying to test and diagnose as best I can.

 

 

[anomalic]

mhhhh im sorry but i didnt get it - what is "AqqH" ?

[Carabosse]

 

Also I found out that certain options in Untamed conflict with your mod in a big way. If you leave Untamed at default and don't touch it a lot of stuff in your mod works fine but as soon as I fiddled with options like the untamed trigger functions or the monster type functions all hell broke lose and bam randomly triggering side quests that I know weren't supposed to trigger in that way started going haywire. 

 

This is a problem that you should highlight in the other mod, it is not a problem with this one. Delzaron has created actors for specific uses in this story, they can't be expected to account for what other gameplay changing mods allow the user to do with those actors.

 

Ideally the mods that are gameplay mechanic changers would take caution in not taking away control of actors that are used by quest mods (I suggested ignoring unique creature actors as they would almost always be quest specific). Unfortunately it seems you have to rely upon the user to exhibit some basic common sense when using combinations of these mods.

 

In defence of Untamed, I believe the author has plans to implement keywords which could be used to forbid use of actors by the mod. It's not ideal, quest mod makers shouldn't be expected to have to implement blocks specifically for other mods (making quest mods is already difficult enough). There are other ways to ensure that your actors (especially creatures) are made incompatible universally but it's more work that would otherwise be unnecessary.

[JesusKreist]

mhhhh im sorry but i didnt get it - what is "AqqH" ?

 

What is anomalic? oO

@aqqh is AqqH.

[Al-Esh]

I cannot activate convesations with the wolf in princess of the wolfves or talk to the spriggan during the trail. please can you help me fix this problem?

 

Same problem for me.

 

everything else worked.

 

Huge improovement from my first try.

 

gj man.

[3Dmember]

 

This is a problem that you should highlight in the other mod, it is not a problem with this one. Delzaron has created actors for specific uses in this story, they can't be expected to account for what other gameplay changing mods allow the user to do with those actors.

 

Ideally the mods that are gameplay mechanic changers would take caution in not taking away control of actors that are used by quest mods (I suggested ignoring unique creature actors as they would almost always be quest specific).

 

Yeah I get that. I just assumed that because it was in the recommended section that there would be no issues. To be fair to untamed(if you don't toy with its options it's fine I think) I believe most of the problem stemmed from the mod Sexlab Leveling because of its triggering functions(which should be expected really). I've found that Sexlab Leveling also messes with your mod Bestial Essence(and I have fewest issues with your mod).

 

 

 

Unfortunately it seems you have to rely upon the user to exhibit some basic common sense when using combinations of these mods.

 

I get that. However it goes a bit beyond common sense because without first trying with all of them running and then slowly discerning through deactivation(it's the same for the opposite approach quite often) and a fresh save(which is extremely tedious - sometimes hours will go by without reaching the troublesome mod) whether or not any of the mods you installed will affect it. It's pretty hard for mod authors to help this either because then they'd probably never get any work done if they explained every detail of what there mod affects lol. I mean yes mods like Sexlab Leveling I should of known better(well I did I just forgot it was part of a package installation I always do). However Estrus Chaurus+ I have no Idea why it causes problems like quests mobs attacking me. It makes no sense to me(the quest mobs were not chaurus or even chaurus related).

[3Dmember]

So far today though after deactivating most of the mods out of a selection of mods that was so sparse to begin with I'm having virtually no issues. So basically if you want to run this mod without issue I suggest creating a separate profile in Mod Organizer for it with as few as possible. After aesthetic player mods I'm running like 12 mods(basically just the requirements and their requirements) and that seems to be okay. I can talk to the creatures and the scene now triggers and the randomly triggering side quests complete as they should. So I thought i'd share this as maybe it will help others. 

 

By the way like I said earlier untamed is fine as long as you don't touch it's options. I'm still using it and without issue now. Oh and succubus race wasn't an issue. I uninstalled it without change to game play and the imploded breasts were caused by me. I had installed conflicting meshes into that folder by accident.

 

The mod is definitely worth creating a profile for. Thanks Delzaron.

[Delzaron]

Why ?

 

Do you want to know how many mods i currently use for my tests ?

150. And SexLab mods of course.

 

I also use untamed, animal mansion, Maria Eden, SL aroused creatures, etc... i dont met the problems you got.

 

 

Oh, another thing : in the nordic ruins. all animals are created for attakcing you, except the old troll, the saber cat, and the spriggan.

[3Dmember]

That's great that you don't have these problems but I do. Also I found I was incorrect about untamed. It does cause problems, at least for me. Even if I enabled and don't fiddle with it's options it still conflicts with your mods animal conversations, it makes it so I simply cannot talk to them at all. Some saves it would work and some it wouldn't, untamed usability was unreliable for me when combined with this mod. As soon as I disabled untamed the problem went away and I was able to talk to all animals across all saves. So there's obviously something conflicting. Also are you using the latest build of untamed? He's at 117 now which is what i'm using and it for sure conflicts with it.

 

You can say these mods don't conflict man but that can't be said for everyone using your mod because why would the problem cease when said mods are disabled? Like i'm not stupid I disable one mod at a time and painstakingly sort through them with fresh saves. It's the only way to be sure a mod is doing something it shouldn't. TES5Edit can be unreliable in that department or confusing.

 

Look i'm not trying to be an ass or anything. I do love your mod. I am simply posting this here so that others who have clearly encountered similar problems can know why. The only way to truly achieve the stability you have running your own mod is for us to have 1) cloned mod setup and 2) have the exact same patches. A lot of people use the unofficial patches and they were just recently updated. Not saying that is a problem but it could be. 

 

For the record before running this mod I had 247 mods all working perfectly until I installed this. Now this mod didn't break them but they broke it making your mod unplayable for me. Now i'm at 128 mods and 116 of those mods are aesthetic mods that don't affect anything but textures, UI, custom music, basically nothing script changing.

[Delzaron]

I heard your argument.

 

You must know tests are related to each tester Skyrim configurqtion...

 

If you have solutions, i will be glad to implement them.

[MyGronix]

Moro wasn't working for me at all until I downloaded More nasty critters. That solved it for me I guess.

 

 

But...... The next problem I have is that I'm on the quest where you choose your way it's called something like "Quick and hard" or something like that. Anyways, I get to the point when a bunch of spriggans appear, and I can't interract with them in any way, and nothing happens.

[Delzaron]

Moro wasn't working for me at all until I downloaded More nasty critters. That solved it for me I guess.

 

 

But...... The next problem I have is that I'm on the quest where you choose your way it's called something like "Quick and hard" or something like that. Anyways, I get to the point when a bunch of spriggans appear, and I can't interract with them in any way, and nothing happens.

 

I know.... At this point, the mod is bugged, and I dont still suceed to fix it.

Use console for now.

 

Spriggans dont talk. When Frisson and Arlwyn will behead anoher Dibella sister, a serry of sex scenes will begin. The first scene is with Katalia. So, Try to speak to her first.

 

 

I need help : In will integrate Ethrane Love Affair in the core quests. So, I need a good scenario (and not too long) for a love story between Ethrane, who loves Katalia and already made a declaration publicly, and Katalia, who never answered it.

[MyGronix]

 

Moro wasn't working for me at all until I downloaded More nasty critters. That solved it for me I guess.

 

 

But...... The next problem I have is that I'm on the quest where you choose your way it's called something like "Quick and hard" or something like that. Anyways, I get to the point when a bunch of spriggans appear, and I can't interract with them in any way, and nothing happens.

 

I know.... At this point, the mod is bugged, and I dont still suceed to fix it.

Use console for now.

 

Spriggans dont talk. When Frisson and Arlwyn will behead anoher Dibella sister, a serry of sex scenes will begin. The first scene is with Katalia. So, Try to speak to her 

 

Hmmm, yes the first scene triggers, but after that everyone is awkwardly standing still with nothing happening.

Also.... what is the quest code thingy that I can use the console with?

 

EDIT: I totally forgot mentioning that in the princess of wolves quest, I don't have dialogue option to introduce Romula to the chief after she agreed to join the tribe

[Delzaron]

AFS4koldunwayinitiation

 

I will made a release tonight. I made somne changes (wolves faction, condtionnals for odoacre...)

 

[mybrainhurts]

That's great that you don't have these problems but I do. Also I found I was incorrect about untamed. It does cause problems, at least for me. Even if I enabled and don't fiddle with it's options it still conflicts with your mods animal conversations, it makes it so I simply cannot talk to them at all. Some saves it would work and some it wouldn't, untamed usability was unreliable for me when combined with this mod. As soon as I disabled untamed the problem went away and I was able to talk to all animals across all saves.

</snip>

 

Despite everyone's best efforts and knowledge (Skyrim being Skyrim) bad stuff happens. My problems with Moro for example are ... hell, I don't know. I tried everything I could think of to fix whatever the problem with her is. W/out success so far. The bottom line is that mods can conflict and the reasons for the conflicts are not always discernible. Although I have to say that when activating an animal NPC to open dialogue with it, Untamed pops up that pin wheel dohickey. So ... you have two mods trying to do two different  things to one NPC.

 

Be that as it may, in your case it seems you have two choices: dump Untamed and play this mod, or dump this mod and play with Untamed. If you want to play this mod, you could always reinstall Untamed after AFS quests with talking to animals are done. It's frustrating and unsatisfactory, I know, but sometimes that's just the way it is.

[3Dmember]

To be clear I wasn't arguing that this mod is terrible or anything, in fact very much the opposite. All I was trying to do is to tell people that if you want the best bug free experience possible to use Mod Organizer which has a really nicely implemented Profile system and create a separate profile with a very spartan mod loadout with basically only the AFS requirements and there requirements + aesthetic mods for the best experience. 

 

Bottom line this mod is insanely good and worth it's own profile to net better stability. It's not just Skyrim(even though lets be honest the creation kit is a bloody nightmare - i'm amazed Skyrim runs normally as good as it does) but also the scope of this mod as well. It's a big mod and I don't think Delzaron can be expected to make it compatible with everything and vice versa. All I was trying to relay is what mods may cause issues and what can be done about it.

 

A Spartan loadout specifically setup for this mod will achieve this. Doing so completely fixed this mods stability for me and now i'm free to play it without issue. I hope this helps people. Like I said untamed is a great mod I just don't advocate using it with this mod because the results are unpredictable. It might work and it might also completely disable creature interaction, depending on which version you're using.

 

As you for you Delzaron keep up the damned amazing work. I hope you finish this mod and I wish you the best of luck with your 'From the Deep' mod project as i'm sure it will be amazing and i'm looking forward to playing it.

[Delzaron]

The funny thing is I also have untamed... and I got no problems for speaking to Moro or the trial sprigan.

[aqqh]

thats what i told you - talking with creatures in unpredictable. in 80% it would work and for remaining 20% it wont - and why is that is anyones guess...

 

When i was giving untamed a try (several versions back) i had a pack of 5 wolfs - 3 were working fine, 2 were bugged. Even when there was exactly the same code to handle talking to every single one of them. Why is that is anyones guess...

 

So basically talking to creatures is unreliable. For some ppl it just wont work and you cant do anything to change it.

Thats why Sky_mds (Animal Mansion mod) replaced dialogues with message menus

and Darkconsole (Untamed) replaced dialogues with Wheel Menu

 

Not saying that it is impossible to make it work in 100% cases. But it seems that no one figured how to do it yet.

 

What you could do is to make two new NPC (or use some existing ones) which would speak instead of Moro and spriggans.

 

[Delzaron]

Spriggan replqcement could be easy : just a NPC with the spriggan armor.

 

Moro... it will be hqrder... Maybe adding a debug diqlogue to Romula San.

[aqqh]

you can make that genserie or other girl would come with you to where wolf pack is

and you will be talking with that girl about moro instead of talking with moro.

 

guess this should be easy enough.

 

 

For spriggans the same - some NPC in spriggan armor that would be talking in spriggans name.