Tails/Ears with physics inertia

[b00marrows]

Looks like someone finally did it.

 

Thread closed.

 

EDIT: maybe not?

 

 

 

Im not sure why I have not edited this post to reflect what is going on yet but here I go...

 

I am currently making the default skyrim tail havoc based, this means;

 

1. Removing animation (Done, easy as hell)

 

2. Changing bones to HDT enables ones (Done, all thanks to Groovtama! and his skeleton)

 

3. Adding actual HDT physics to said tail bones (Done, thanks to Uriel) I don't believe a spelling mistake held me back for 2 days until they pointed this out (I feel this is "good enough" for now, will probably tweak later)

 

4. Adding Collision to the tail (in progress)

collision with floor - testing -  SUCCESS

Collision with full body - TO BE DONE - ????

 

I hope to have some bunny and cat ears done too at some point, a bunny tail would be almost pointless but maybe... maybe...

 

Releases:

Latest

 

 

 

Discoveries

you can set up multiple XML's on the same file using "NiStringSextradata"

Collision works between Multiple .Xml files, loaded on the same mesh. (unsure is its universal)

 

Speciel Thanks to:

Blabb - Information

Uriel - Information

Canderes - YE KNOW TOO MUCH!

Groovtama - Skeleton/Bones and Information

HydrogensaysHDT

Monsto Brukes

Yoo - Floor.XML and Information

Vioxsis - Information

and anyone else here on loverslab that has spread there knowledge, you have probably helped me too at some point.

 

 

 

Original post:

 

 

I don't know if someone is working on this already (if there is, please post a link)

 

i had a bit of a imagination overflow earlier where I imagined a kajiit-catgirl chasing her tail in circles...

 

anyway I would like to see a tail and maybe ears (hopefully equip-able items) that have phisics/inertia.

 

if there are no mods out there i will probably attempt to make my own.

 

 

 

(had to drop this idea off before work, i have a terrible memory and don't want to forget that amazing things that happened in my head....)

 

 

[b00marrows]

OK, as I am unable to find anything and no-one has posted anything i am going to get started attempting to make my own.

 

My goal at the moment is to make a full collision physics enable tail, so it will collide with everything and will move with a little delay behind the character.

 

when running it will stretch out a bit back and bend upwards, when you stop the tail will catch up and drop to a hopefully flat angle. also hopefully on death the tail will flop down, and lay on the ground.

 

 

As you may already be able to tell i have NO IDEA WHAT I AM DOING and DO NOT KNOW WHAT IS POSSIBLE AND WHAT IS NOT. any help/information would be wonderful!

[blabba]

Should be doable (not sure about ears) but the tail should definitely be do-able.

 

Look through this thread to get some guides from canderes:

http://www.loverslab.com/topic/19897-hdt-physics-extension-modding/

 

I warn you now, you'll need 3dsMax and a lot of patience but if you pull this off, then you sir may be hailed as a god.

[b00marrows]

Should be doable (not sure about ears) but the tail should definitely be do-able.

 

Look through this thread to get some guides from canderes:

http://www.loverslab.com/topic/19897-hdt-physics-extension-modding/

 

I warn you now, you'll need 3dsMax and a lot of patience but if you pull this off, then you sir may be hailed as a god.

thanks for the reply, I have had my mind blown over the last half hour of browsing random guides.. im not sure im cut out for this...

 

i will look into the link you posted next, thanks.

 

a few things:

The "inertia" that SOS uses, is it bone dependant?

If not would ibe able to just ad it to the ears?

 

Onto the tail, I was looking to use just some equip-able tail to start but for some reason the mod I have found doesn't work for me... just my luck...

 

Now I am not entierly sure what to do to start, is there something i should do to the skeleton first.. I am so confused...

(hopefully someone can pick this up for me and i clearly have no hope haha!)

[blabba]

The reason why I say ears will be tricky is because they do not have their own bones/weights and as such do not have the rigid bodies attached. I also have no clue how HDT will react to a head mesh (Easily circumvent this by making them an equip able object). You can then add rigid bodies and such to the ears I think.

 

As for your tail, your in luck. If you use the XPMS skeletons, there is already tail bones to use for the skeleton. All you gotta do is grab the modders file for the skeleton, grab a mesh and import them into 3DSmax. If you look through that thread look for canderes' video guide posts. There should be one where he teches you how to HDT-ify armors and such. You can follow the same method for your tail mesh. (You'll have to have it correctly weighted first, look for some equipable argonian or khajit weight-painted mesh for this) He also includes his MaxScripts that he used.

 

This HDT process is a huge time-consuming matter with to be honest little reward. It's the #1 reason why their are not many HDT armors currently available.

Any further questions is beyond my capability at this time. (I too tried to HDT-ify armors, but quickly learned it was futile)

 

You can always try pming canderes or posting on that thread for more feedback/help.

 

All-in-All cool idea and I do hope that this mod comes to see the light of day sometime (although I'll understand if it doesn't)

[b00marrows]

The reason why I say ears will be tricky is because they do not have their own bones/weights and as such do not have the rigid bodies attached. I also have no clue how HDT will react to a head mesh (Easily circumvent this by making them an equip able object). You can then add rigid bodies and such to the ears I think.

 

As for your tail, your in luck. If you use the XPMS skeletons, there is already tail bones to use for the skeleton. All you gotta do is grab the modders file for the skeleton, grab a mesh and import them into 3DSmax. If you look through that thread look for canderes' video guide posts. There should be one where he teches you how to HDT-ify armors and such. You can follow the same method for your tail mesh. (You'll have to have it correctly weighted first, look for some equipable argonian or khajit weight-painted mesh for this) He also includes his MaxScripts that he used.

 

This HDT process is a huge time-consuming matter with to be honest little reward. It's the #1 reason why their are not many HDT armors currently available.

Any further questions is beyond my capability at this time. (I too tried to HDT-ify armors, but quickly learned it was futile)

 

You can always try pming canderes or posting on that thread for more feedback/help.

 

All-in-All cool idea and I do hope that this mod comes to see the light of day sometime (although I'll understand if it doesn't)

Yeah the idea is to make both ears and tail "equipable". But I'm not focusing on ears yet.

 

I'm wondering.. due to vanilla tail's (khajiit/Argonian) having animations... dose that mean they are already rigged to bones? if so this could be easier than i thought.

 

If its true than all I need to do is HDT'ify the tail which shouldn't be too hard... right?

[Groovtama]

...mmmhhh thinking off making a new bone for ears....

[canderes]

The bones for tails are already there, but if you try to make them behave like rigid bodies it seems to crash often, so what should happen is the use of a second tail without any animations.  Yes you can have multiple tails, but it adds more jitter depending on the thickness of the rb. All the vanilla stuff with a tail for beast races is pre-animated and that is probably what is causing the crashes. I used to have an ear setup somewhere but it was around the time when hair was really unstable, so that crashed most of the time. I could look at it a bit later and see if it still has stability issues. Self collision could be a problem too because the rigid body for the head is so damn big.

[Groovtama]

Maybe a second sets of Tailbones same position and stuff but differently named.

 

Would just be needed to rename the bones in the nif to the new set of tailbones, delete the tail havok behaviour from the nif, make and attach the new xml to it.

 

That way havok shouldn't act like a pussy and blow it.^^

[b00marrows]

if i remember there is already a second set of tail bones (you need to zoom in quite a bit to see it its got the name "TailBoneXXC" where XX is 01-05 and "C" is added to the end) its also a little longer than the main tail bones.

 

also a strange thing is some of the hair bones are called things like "npc L pussy01" i laughed at first than got compleetly puzzled as to why that's there....

 

After browsing a bit i have seen some AWESOME things like bulged stomach from penetration and flabby bouncing stomachs (not a fan of that...) but this venture has also made me think that I am unable to do this, I don't have the knowledge to even get started....

 

 

 

 

[Vioxsis]

if i remember there is already a second set of tail bones (you need to zoom in quite a bit to see it its got the name "TailBoneXXC" where XX is 01-05 and "C" is added to the end) its also a little longer than the main tail bones.

That 2nd set of bones are for this mod http://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/34917/?

 

also a strange thing is some of the hair bones are called things like "npc L pussy01" i laughed at first than got compleetly puzzled as to why that's there....

There not 'hair' bones....

 

After browsing a bit i have seen some AWESOME things like bulged stomach from penetration and flabby bouncing stomachs (not a fan of that...) but this venture has also made me think that I am unable to do this, I don't have the knowledge to even get started....

Don't just give up, at least fail at trying first.

[b00marrows]

That 2nd set of bones are for this mod http://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/34917/?

 Hmm... i dont know if that is helpfull...

 There not 'hair' bones.... 

 That's why I'm confused... why is it up there? it makes no sense....

Don't just give up, at least fail at trying first.

I will probably still try, but here is an idea of how little I can do:

I cant even get a tail mod to work with a Custom race.

 

I have almost 0 knowledge or anything to do with moding so it impossible with what I currently know.

 

from what i can tell im going to need to learn how to:

1. make a tail, preferably one that works with all races.

2. make bones.

3. attach said tail to said bones

4. make said bones interact with hdt.

 

but seriously I don't know what the fuck I am doing....

[Vioxsis]

Hmm... i dont know if that is helpfull...

? The bones are for that mod, there not a 2nd set of bones you can use with out braking compatibility with that mod.

 

That's why I'm confused... why is it up there? it makes no sense....

"Up there" i just double checked and they are where you would expect them to be.

Can you post a pic of the bones you are referring to?

 

I will probably still try, but here is an idea of how little I can do:

I cant even get a tail mod to work with a Custom race.

 

I have almost 0 knowledge or anything to do with moding so it impossible with what I currently know.

 

from what i can tell im going to need to learn how to:

1. make a tail, preferably one that works with all races.

2. make bones.

3. attach said tail to said bones

4. make said bones interact with hdt.

 

but seriously I don't know what the fuck I am doing....

Every one has to start somewhere, and they tend to have zero knowledge when they start.

[b00marrows]

 

? The bones are for that mod, there not a 2nd set of bones you can use with out braking compatibility with that mod.

this is why i know i can not do this. I dont know why I could not use those bones OR the normal bones. also why would it break compatibility? ( dont answer that im just roving a point)

"Up there" i just double checked and they are where you would expect them to be.
Can you post a pic of the bones you are referring to?

ill attach a pic showing it

Every one has to start somewhere, and they tend to have zero knowledge when they start.

exactly. I'm probably going to drop this (as people are telling me HDT is hard...) and maybe go make the tail and ears first.

[Vioxsis]

That skeleton, i don't know where you got it but i would replace it, and tell who ever made it about its problem.

[b00marrows]

that specific screenshot if from xp32's. I would like to point out that its from the male model, the female one is correct.

[Groovtama]

Lol I think something was forgotten when the bones were copied^^

 

Edit: Now I also know why messed up esps with female bbp armors set for males never crashed the game..^^

 

Error starts in 1.9c first XPMS Nexus release of 1.9.

[canderes]

Jesus christ this looks horrible for bunny ears (they look like antennae/feelers). I think I went too high on the subdivs for the ears and did a sloppy job at rigging, but atleast the ears collide with the head neck shoulders and torso. 

 

bunny ears.rar

[blabba]

...mmmhhh thinking off making a new bone for ears....

Lol, if you've got room/can put up with another request. Add a pre-thigh bone so we can get jiggle legs...

 

Screw it add ALL the bones, and while your at it just rename the skeleton to Groovtama's REAL MAX skeleton, because xp32's just didn't have enough.

 

(just kidding about all the bones, though I am serious about at some point to add thigh and maybe arm jiggle, just not yet)

 

All right enough of my hijacking main topic:

 

I don't see why you wouldn't use those additional tail bones, or even the normal ones. AFAIK, HDT is incompatible with deadly mutilation anyway? Also using vanilla bones can't be such a big deal because users can simply turn off the effect via xml edit if they use the normal tails. Of course I speak in ignorance not having tested or any deep knowledge of this stuff.

[b00marrows]

Jesus christ this looks horrible for bunny ears (they look like antennae/feelers). I think I went too high on the subdivs for the ears and did a sloppy job at rigging, but atleast the ears collide with the head neck shoulders and torso. 

 

 

holy crap that looks amazing! not the sort of bunny ears that i imagin but cool either way. I wana see what this would be like in-game, how do i use this?

[canderes]

Nothing it was just proof of concept. Could you post examples of the types of ears/tails you had in mind? The short stubby ones (elins?) aren't something I'd try for, but I guess it is doable.

[b00marrows]

Nothing it was just proof of concept. Could you post examples of the types of ears/tails you had in mind? The short stubby ones (elins?) aren't something I'd try for, but I guess it is doable.

for a proof of concept its fucking cool, would love to see it in-game.

 

Anyway my idea of bunny ears is sort of like what you made but shorter (just after the bend) and start a bit higher on the head/closer together, also a bit straighter until the bend.....

 

this is the best example I could find for now.

[Uriel]

This thread makes my interests relevant to it. Or something like this.

[b00marrows]

Ok, im going to take the first steps!

 

if anyone could help me out with learning how HTD works;

EG: what's bones it needs, why that bone Cant just be a normal bone and how you make a bone respond to HDT.

also how to add the bones to HDT.

 

ALSO, I would like to add that I will be using this mod (hopefully) as a base (its equip-able and uses base skyrim parts.)

I have been testing it's compatibility with some custom races and just finished. (took a little work and I derped a bit, but its finished now.)

 

BUT BEFORE I DO ALL THIS (i just remember this)

Could someone explain this "lag-bone" business to me?

Someone said it to me recently and i was wondering if I could start by adding that to a tail for an experiment and to help me learn a bit about modding!

[canderes]

Watch the Thalmor video tutorial and then this is a recording of what I did for the ears, but it has almost no commentary. I made a stupid mistake when making them the first time: when mirroring bones make sure mirror IK is checked in the box otherwise you can't mirror paste.

 

lagbone is a controller in a nif file that delays the movement of a bone. The old crappy way to do hair was using lagbone so when your character was running around the hair bones with lagbone would move slowly behind. It doesn't look very good and if you set the delay too high it will crash the game. It isn't worth using imo because you have to add the new bones to the skeleton.hkx/skeletonbeast.hkx and nifs if you want them to work. It also helps if you read into animation tutorials.