XP32 Maximum Skeleton (Special) Extended - XPMS(S)E

[Groovtama]

I got a, "tricky" question.

I have a series of old follower mods that were "shiped" including the unp bodie. An oooold UNP bodie.

I also have the Underground Bathhouse mod (a player home) and I have sent a lot of those followers to live there. Resently I have experienced a tremendous loss of FPS only in that house. Could the fact that those followers are using an old version of UNP bodie, but the new skeleton cause that fps loss? Their bodies are not deformed and I have renamed NPC PreBelly to HDT Belly where appropriate. 

If you have replaced their skeleton it should not be an issue.

[azmodan22]

no I haven't.

They did not have an included skelleton so i figure the use the main one. The one the player uses too.

In short their are using your skeleton and a UNP body that came out before the rope was invented. When I downloaded those followers FNIS was still an unoficial [WIP] 

[sharonasbar12]

 

 

 

 

First of all, keep up the excellent work. You are a genius. Could you please tell me why this happens? Skeleton ver. 93 plenty of bounce. Version 2+ including your latest, very little or no bounce with the same body. Have all of the requirements.

What body are you using?

And did you check on the original post for whether your body is compatible with a 2.xx skeleton? Groovtama has listed which bodies are compatible with which skeleton. 

 

 

Yes, I'm using the new cbbe v3.3 hdt.

 

because XPMS 1.93a has TBBP animation bounce + conflciting HDT physics bounce, XPMSE2 only has conflict free HDT physics bounce. If you want more bounce install an xml file with more bounce.

 

 

Yes, that was tried too. Trepleen suggested an xml that only gave it a very slight bounce. tried JFF, same effect.

 

 

 

 

Can anyone point me to a very bouncy xml?

 

 

[Groovtama]

no I haven't.

They did not have an included skelleton so i figure the use the main one. The one the player uses too.

In short their are using your skeleton and a UNP body that came out before the rope was invented. When I downloaded those followers FNIS was still an unoficial [WIP] 

Post a HDT log and we can look when there is no error in it's just havok that is crumbling from to many tits bouncing^^

[azmodan22]

something is wrong with hdt. I have replaced the body of everyone in the baths with mine.. here is the log

(the same thing happend with their stock boddies though)

 

 

 

*Edit

My chars body was made using HDT BodySlide 0.4

*Edit 2-My xmls

hdt.xmlhdtm.xml

[backthere]

 

Yeah...no thanks, I'll stick with 2.06 and ECE, theres absolutely nothing that is going to make me switch to Racemenu any time soon. The tri's are horrifying. Whats more my characters face is the result of years of tweaking and work...

Well that's unfortunate for you. You do realize the tri files are identical right? I'm not even sure why you mentioned the tri files at all. The reason they don't look 100% the same is because there are maybe 4 'base' morphs which are used in ECE, but not in RM, these overwrite the morphs found in replacer tri files for the race. RM doesn't do overwrites because this is retarded, you have to alter the information at cache level, which by nature is volatile and you have no idea if it will even be there. This is why vertex editing stutters so badly, it has to call a full update function repeatedly because they didn't know how to do it any other way. There are also a few other morphs that also act as overwrites to the Nose/Mouth/Eye type sliders, their intention was to just simply add more presets, but they did it by making a new file, then overwriting the entries of the replacer. The reason these morphs don't work correctly in RM is because every morph is relative to the base mesh, when you create a new set of presets (Ones with Shape/Type suffixes) you are changing the preset in addition to what you already have, to make it look as intended you need to change your vanilla type to the base appearance. This isn't always possible as the base preset isn't always an option, usually when you go out of boundaries of the number of actual morphs you have this happens and you end up seeing multiple sets of the no vanilla preset (Your slider has more options than your TRI has presets, which are controlled by global setting).

 

I personally recommend switching over to RM completely and  redo the face of the character with Citrus head because it's just so much more smooth.

Face importing will solve the problems with moving over to RM from ECE as it will take vertex differences and apply them directly to your characters face regardless of what your sliders are set at (You can still use the sliders after import so you probably want to just reset all of your sliders prior to editing so you can get the full range after import). Imported vertex data will get saved to the slot file as well so you only need to import once, save a preset, then you can just load the preset thereafter.

 

Importing will NOT allow you to move up to Citrus, it not only has a different topology but a very different number of vertices, the only way I could even get this remotely close is to do skin wrapping or something similar within RM, but yeah that's not happening. Sculpt mode will get basic push/pull/move/lock and that's pretty much it. When you import your head you are essentially importing the vertex differences as though you sculpted them yourself based on what you started with. I will likely have import head available before I actually get sculpt mode working, I still have to program all the manipulation tools. Importing is pretty much already done, I just need to serialize the data to the co-save and refresh it on game load.

 

 

Not to dump directly on you because I do respect the work you do but if the tri's are exactly the same I'd be able to get the same results from RM as I get from ECE and generally the differences are fairly stark...I can get close, but the morphs simply cannot be refined as closely.

 

I recently dumped ECE for RM because of everyone here, generally people I respect for their work like Groovtama (who does great rig work even though his general bedside manner could use a huge improvement) and blabla and people I still consider friends like Shocky all are pretty big on the Racemenu train and hey I understand why, ECE is effectively an "abandoned" system which eventually will be outmoded or invalidated by something updating and causing ECE to no longer function correctly.

 

But what I get out of RM in regards to facial reproduction doesn't get close to what I've already built in ECE, if the morphs are the same how come the noses in RM are so horrifying? I restart Skyrim a lot, I really don't want to have to rebuild my faces cause that by itself is going to be a huge investment of time and if the resources can't produce the same results I've effectively "lost my character" entirely.

 

Whats more, as much as the overlay textures for body and facial tattoos and warpaints is really awesome, you take that and then introduce a system like Sexlab Hormones and every time Hormones updates your entire color schema on these overlays goes white. A minor annoyance and largely I don't use a lot of tattoos and warpaint either so I can ignore that, but I can't ignore you saying the tri's are exactly the same when other than to assume you're talking about the base game tris that are common between both systems. if the tri's are the same how come there are 26 lip morphs in ECE and not 26 lip morphs in RM? I mean I get that you guys probably don't want to argue semantics with the peanut gallery and I can respect that too....this is important to me.

 

 

If RM can't reproduce that accurately and in my recent swap to RM from ECE in a game restart, it was not able to...then its not an option for me at all. Cause that took me pretty much my entire history of playing Skyrim to refine...using ECE, for RM to work for me, I have to be able to reproduce that and unfortunately I cannot, the result is close, but the variances are incredibly obvious.

 

So in all fairness I get that RM is potentially superior to ECE, I respect that you've spent years working on it and continue to do so, and I'd think, out of anyone, someone like you who designs character creation systems, would understand how important peoples characters are to them and would be somewhat understanding of why someone might have deep concerns about using your system if it meant sacrificing characters that are important to them to do so.

 

So while I respect your work and I of course respect the work that Groovtama does and I also respect the effort that blabla is putting into CITRUS and high poly body upgrades....I can't jump on the RM train cause RM can't remake my character accurately and its not as if I haven't tried.

 

I am never critical of anything I haven't tried to work with. You know RM and ECE's systems way better than I likely ever will, but I've been building my characters as long as you've been offering a different way to build them, so its not as if I don't know how to make a character without ECE its just that I can't get the same results from RM and I'd think that would be an understandable concern.

 

Anyways thats off topic for this thread, but I wanted to address it just the same. Far as editing skeletons in nifskope to add weapon placement assignments, I'd rather not, I've done enough modding, I'm not interested in modding other peoples mods simply to play the game. So it looks like I'm going to have to stick with an out dated skeletal rig because...thats the option available to me. Next time I put out a mod (which is likely to be my light armor sets I'm making that fill the gaps in certain Bethesda armor tiers that had no light options) perhaps I'll tell people that if they want features that I've delivered previously on armors I've converted on the Nexus...like....I dunno...textures...that all they have to do is open up Photoshop and use the UV Map PSD's I've provided and they can make their own. Sounds fair right?

[Groovtama]

something is wrong with hdt. I have replaced the body of everyone in the baths with mine.. here is the log

(the same thing happend with their stock boddies though)

 

hdtPhysicsExtensions.log

 

*Edit

My chars body was made using HDT BodySlide 0.4

*Edit 2-My xmls

hdt.xmlhdtm.xml

e3435880

e3b4dc80

 

Load your whole load  order in tes5edit and loook up these twos they don't have th HDT Belly bone and are causing slow downs.

[azmodan22]

Found the problem. Those two were custom followers that had custom skeletons.. Thanks a lot Groovtama. !

[SaiyanHeretic]

 

Is anybody else having a problem with v2.12/2.14 having broken sliders for waist, glute, leg parts? (Height, head, and arm part sliders still work.)  I tried the repair file, but that didn't seem to change anything.

Why should the Repair help?

 

Install the RaceMenu version in the description and don't use an old one.

 

 

So I made sure RaceMenu was up-to-date too.  The waist, glute, and leg sliders are working, but now height, head, and arm sliders are broken.

 

XPMSE 2.06 and RM 2.9.1 together were working for me just fine, so I'll go back to those for now.  If XMPSE or RM ever gets around to a version 3, maybe then they'll be worth installing.

 

Thanks anyway.

[malisbad1]

Hey there.  Love the vast options and abilities of these skeletons, buuut I have an issue.

 

A few pages back someone mentioned an issue with 'jittery breasts' but never got a reply.  I have the same issue.  Breasts just randomly start spazzing out, sometimes just one, sometimes both.  Sometimes my character's, sometimes NPCs.  If I could pinpoint a trigger, I would almost offer that getting close to light sources seems to set them off, but I can't reliably repeat it, so... 

 

Not trying to be lazy, but I've scanned through a few dozen pages and still have 40+ to go, so I'm just gonna ask for help.

 

I'm using MO & the mods are in this order:

SevenBase Bombshell

RRaF

DBC

htdPhysicsExtensions

XP32MSE 2.05 and also tried 2.14

 

Any help to make the breasts stop jittering?  Thank you kindly!

 

Side note, I see a ton of doubling listings for sliders in RM.  Any idea why & how can I eliminate them?

[fizzybutt]

Was going to wait to update all of this until RM 3 came out but went ahead and did it to check out all the nifty updates. Usually I've got tons of issues getting everything to work the first go-round and I'm happy to say all the sliders (OMG so many sliders now) function properly for me.

 

I think I'm going to post a suggestion though on racemenu about moving all the weapons sliders to their own tab. There's just so much on that one tab it's a little overwhelming when I'm just scrolling down to adjust a pitch angle on the dagger lol.

[Sunja44]

Me seems the best decision I ever made was to NOT install the RaceMenu Skeleton slider addon (as far as I know it was a separate mod once, not incorporated into XPMSE). I can understand that it is a nice tool for a not Bodyslide user though. As I am used to CBBE Bodyslide I decided to have no need for it.

[Groovtama]

Me seems the best decision I ever made was to NOT install the RaceMenu Skeleton slider addon (as far as I know it was a separate mod once, not incorporated into XPMSE). I can understand that it is a nice tool for a not Bodyslide user though. As I am used to CBBE Bodyslide I decided to have no need for it.

 

RaceMenu slider mod on Nexus has nothing to do with my XPMSE plugin. I made it from the ground up.

 

 

 

 

Is anybody else having a problem with v2.12/2.14 having broken sliders for waist, glute, leg parts? (Height, head, and arm part sliders still work.)  I tried the repair file, but that didn't seem to change anything.

Why should the Repair help?

 

Install the RaceMenu version in the description and don't use an old one.

 

 

So I made sure RaceMenu was up-to-date too.  The waist, glute, and leg sliders are working, but now height, head, and arm sliders are broken.

 

XPMSE 2.06 and RM 2.9.1 together were working for me just fine, so I'll go back to those for now.  If XMPSE or RM ever gets around to a version 3, maybe then they'll be worth installing.

 

Thanks anyway.

 

 

Height, head, and some arm sliders are not part of the XPMSE Pliugin anymore since 2.1, XPMSE leaves them with 2.1 untouched meaning the fefault sliders which are part of RM are used for it. You think Expired releases a broken plugin with his mod? You use some old/incompatible RaceMenuPlugin script. RM and XPMSE on version 3 will also not be able to solve user errors.

 

[Kalthen]

Just wanted to update and I did not find the bow "over the shoulder" add-on from 2.067. Any reason I is gone? For me it is quite a must have.

[SexProvider]

never mind,i've read your earlier post,edited the nif file,and problem solved.

[Anurabis]

What happens if you don't install Realistic Ragdolls and force? I downloaded it and forgot to install it that was almost 4 months ago and i don't seem to have any trouble.

[Groovtama]

2.06 had a bug with RR and was working without RR, 2.1+ had it fixed, so now you will not be able to lift up corpses as it is supposed to be.

[chajapa]

Groovtama,

Can you explain a little about the skeleton rig option? I have some profiles using the milk mod and the milking machine. If I select the BBP skeleton rig I get breast animation in the milking machine and it looks like I'm also getting HDT bounce. What's different between the default skeleton rig and the BBP rig? 

 

I appreciate your patience answering questions. It helps me to know whether to keep using a mod that requires BBP or just drop it.

 

Thanks!

[Groovtama]

Groovtama,

Can you explain a little about the skeleton rig option? I have some profiles using the milk mod and the milking machine. If I select the BBP skeleton rig I get breast animation in the milking machine and it looks like I'm also getting HDT bounce. What's different between the default skeleton rig and the BBP rig? 

 

I appreciate your patience answering questions. It helps me to know whether to keep using a mod that requires BBP or just drop it.

 

Thanks!

The BBP option is exactly if you wanna use that mod. But yeah HDT will conflict with it.

[Anurabis]

2.06 had a bug with RR and was working without RR, 2.1+ had it fixed, so now you will not be able to lift up corpses as it is supposed to be.

Thanks for the explanation might reinstall it later somewhen. It's not like you need to lift corpses in skyrim anyways except for that 1 Dark brotherhood quest

[Mookeylama]

last i used was version 2.05. does this newer have a lot more sliders for customization? i've been hoping for crotch gap, core or torso length, upper arm and forearm length (2.05 had sliders to make 'em thinner).

[Groovtama]

last i used was version 2.05. does this newer have a lot more sliders for customization? i've been hoping for crotch gap, core or torso length, upper arm and forearm length (2.05 had sliders to make 'em thinner).

Just a few more, the main goal was to transfer from NetImmerse, to NiOverride Transforms so people see how they can make their own slider plugins which will be conflict free to mine with NiOverride Transforms, so people will not need to edit and rerelease my scripts.

[Morferous]

I had a problem with 2.13 that followed to 2.14.

 

When dealing with weapons behind back, all draw and shteath animations are displayed properly, but weapons themselves remain positioned at the side. I am in the middle of testing this, but so far it looks like that the problem is related to skeleton. I have removed and installed it several times, started new games and tried combinations.

 

Did I understood correctly that you had some problems with weapons in 2.13? Is it possible that all the problems were not saved properly, when you uploaded 2.14?

 

I will try to make a clean test later this evening. In the meant time, it would be nice to know, if others are facing the same problem?

[Groovtama]

I had a problem with 2.13 that followed to 2.14.

 

When dealing with weapons behind back, all draw and shteath animations are displayed properly, but weapons themselves remain positioned at the side. I am in the middle of testing this, but so far it looks like that the problem is related to skeleton. I have removed and installed it several times, started new games and tried combinations.

 

Did I understood correctly that you had some problems with weapons in 2.13? Is it possible that all the problems were not saved properly, when you uploaded 2.14?

 

I will try to make a clean test later this evening. In the meant time, it would be nice to know, if others are facing the same problem?

The problem that was fixed in 2.14 also with the Repair plugin was only the RaceMenu script and the staff loop which caused freezing.

 

Most other people who had your problem didn't read the description...

[Morferous]

 

The problem that was fixed in 2.14 also with the Repair plugin was only the RaceMenu script and the staff loop which caused freezing.

 

Most other people who had your problem didn't read the description...

 

 

Heh, I can respect getting that. I am modding another game myself and are a bit tired for peoples not reading my instructions.

 

However, this time I do not follow. I have used this skeleton for a long time now. It loads almost last in my priority list. Nothing is overwriting it, expet FNIS output in MO, but I already tried to switch the skeleton below it.

 

You sound like I am missing something here. It might be so. I have read your first post over and over again, but I do not understand what I am missing. I have started completely new games, with clean saves folder. This should not be related to anything that was lingering around old saves.

 

 

Previous versions have worked just fine. It jus started with the version 2.13 and continues with this one as well.

 

Otherwise everything seems to be working correctly. If no one is not willing to point out what I have been missing during these last days, then I guess I will just have to re-install the skeleton with standard weapon positions.