Devious Followers 2.03 (2025)

[Seeker999]

Hi there! Looking forward to trying out the new version. I'm in the middle of a playthrough but am definitely bookmarking this for my next run. Glad to see you back.

[lordgdavid]

Guess I am doing a new skyrim install. FUCK YEAH!

[Aldid]

18 hours ago, Lozeak said:

 

Yes it's optional. As far as I know the mod works on it's own esp.  

If you build them it'll not be the best... it would be better to replace them with something you think you'd like (or 1 of them with what 3BA+ armor you want)

You can do this by copying it into \meshes\armor\DFCustWhoreArmor 
Anyway, you need to copy and rename both .nif files from 'CustomArmorYouWantToUse_F_0.nif' to 'Mage_F_0.nif' and 'CustomArmorYouWantToUse_F_1.nif' to 'Mage_F_1.nif'. After renaming them move them to the DF folder for custom whore armor and overwrite what's there. You need the _0 and the _1 .nif files to get the weight range.

Yes, the SLACS patch just makes the cum deal react properly with the new effects added in SLACS if I recall correctly, been a while since I made that lol

 

Welcome back!

[Lozeak]

6 hours ago, bubba999 said:

Will be testing soon. I think support for "Licenses Player Oppression" would be awesome.

 

Will think about. I know Licenses with Survival kinda work with the mod at the moment. Would be nice to know why you'd prefer it over the current system... if it's a case of not wanting to install Ssurival it's less of a concern, if it's because that mod is better and it lets DF do more then I'll consider it more. (To be clear I'm working on other stuff so it'll be a while)

 

6 hours ago, mnonyhc said:

STB integration

 

Might be redux thing. it has a Spank that ass integration. 

------------------------------------------

 

What I'm working on next is rebuilding the deal controller so all deal work under the same system and new ones can be added by other esps as I think I've worked out to do it in a manner that doesn't need send mod event.

Which means it's a lot of work for ZERO content but I can bugfix while I do this. 

 

The reason I want to do this... is it's something I wish i did before I left and I think was something Devious Follower Framework was trying to do because say someone wants to make a deal for DF right now the only way if to publish a fork which sucks for everyone if something has content they want but what it also does is say I like cool mod X and want to make deals for it I can just use the make an esp to bridge the connect and directly use the mod rather than all the work around bs and while I KNOW people don't like more and more esp ... some could be made esl and the work needed to make such mod should lower massively.

 

Ideally, I'd like to have a DF as a extremely stable mod and extra content could be added via esp/esl. 

 

I would love to pull some content out of DF and turn them into these kind of mods (MME, Spank that ass, Lola) just to make the mod easier to work on by random people but this will 99% won't happen because the effort isn't worth the result. 

[NenyaBit]

That sounds a bit like ponzipyramid's project: he was aiming to make it so extensions could be made by creating YAML config files, not even an esp. Dynamic Dialogue Replacer would have been in charge of customizing the dialogue, and his Adversity framework would have been managing events read from config, and serving them to DFR. 

 

That was indeed a massive undertaking, and while he reached a decent part of the way there, he left before he could finish :/.

Don't burn yourself out!

 

 

Edited September 19, 2025 by NenyaBit

[bubba999]

As to "Licenses:" I like it as it does one thing only and I don't have to commit to a full Survival install.

[mnonyhc]

Is there a reason in particular for the mod to include a full Jenassa appearance change?

Personally I enjoy the gman conversion of her the most.

[Lozeak]

2 hours ago, mnonyhc said:

Is there a reason in particular for the mod to include a full Jenassa appearance change?

 

No idea lol. If I did it, it was by mistake, that is one of the NPCs I use a lot when testing.

[SacredDatura]

Oh neat! I was just thinking "I wonder if Devious Followers has any new developments going on right now" and came to LL to search. Must have been psychic waves through the aether. 🙃 Welcome back!

Devious Followers has always been my favorite mod on LL, I've built entire load orders and playthroughs around it. Nothing else has scratched the itches of findom and slow-burn dubcon quite the same way for me. I'm playing a lewd-ish Wabbajack list at the moment and the whole time I had a follower and having loving Hallmark channel sex with him I was thinking man, I wish he was devious. lol

I'll be keeping a close eye on this!

[shanyu]

Gotta say that I love seeing this being picked up again.   

Of course it comes right as I try what seems to be a more "wholesome romance" run-through with Kaidan.   Welp, That's on the backburner.

If you're looking to add "deal" extensions, one feature I'd like to see is some kind of deal "score."   
Like the more innocent-sounding deals could be selected first, lulling the player in.  Right now, I just manually edit what deals are active to get a similar effect.

First deal, entered with some apprehension:
*A ring? Ok... not really my style, but ..he got me jewelry... and I caught him looking at me like that.. so maybe he's interested?*
next:
*A tiara?  uh... not a very practical one, but it's the thought that counts.  He really mustn't care much about the money if he's just forcing me to wear jewelry...*
next, possibly far more eager to enter a deal and see what he gets her next:
*He's going to put WHAT WHERE? nowwaitaminute!*


That controlled progression worked somewhat well with the "Dealer's choice" option that ran on that other followers branch back in the day.  I treated it as a veteran follower using the deals to "train" a rookie player merc until they've accepted that the merc life isn't for them.

Serve Food: paying your dues as the least experienced rookie on the team.  A little humility is good for the overconfident rookie.
Control Diet: You're not eating right for a lean and mean mercenary life.  You're going to start
Exercise: wait, why does PT have to be NAKED, sir? No, I'm not speaking back. No sir.  Yes sir! 1...2...3... why do they get to watc... No sir! 1...2..3
Maid Outfit: "You haven't PROVEN you deserve  armor, merc?  You can't earn enough as a mercenary to pay your team dues so you'll dress as a maid until you CAN.  You gotta prove to me you're better than a simple servant, got that?  Got that?  I SAID GOT THAT, MERC!?! No, correction, GOT THAT, MAID?"
Offer Sex, offer to merchant, offer to inkeeper: "Until you stop fighting like a worthless tavern whore, I'm going to keep treating you like one"
Collar.  "Not even a whore... a slave whore.  I'm still giving you a chance to pay me back, but don't expect to ever be a merc.  The only talent you've shown since I joined with you has been when you're on your back or knees.  Set your sights a little lower- maybe someday you'll earn the right to your clothes.

[belegost]

Man, it's a season of returns. First Kenjoka and new Slaverun, now you and original but improved DF. Amazing!

 

Who's next? Kimy with DCL10? One can dream....

Edited September 19, 2025 by belegost

[Talesien]

On 9/18/2025 at 8:17 PM, Lozeak said:

Maybe I should of worked off that, but few things stopped me, mod is gone (though I sure I could find it), I heard it was buggy and my main purpose was to debug the mod so people would have a more stable version of the mod.  It's hard to know what's mod has added without the mod page and I'd also have to deal with more content I might not understand.  I might look at Redux mod when I find a link and pull things from it but the odds are low... what content did it add?

Oh yea the support thread being gone kinda makes it harder to debug.

Honestly, having followed the DFR development closely and discussed features and plans with Ponzi, I've to agree, you should not use it as a base. It was, at the time of Ponzi leaving, very much in flux and a hot mess. It had many nice ideas and mechanics, most of which sadly required Adversity and other mods from Ponzi and their tailor made DLL's. In theory they were a great way to expand on DF while simultaneously lowering it's impact on the papyrus engine. In practice it's only worthwhile if you are proficient enough in C++ to build such skse plugins.

That said a more recent version than what is available in the Ponzi dump can be found at the Github Miss Corruption established for it: https://github.com/NenyaBit/DFR-SOURCES/tree/master
You might also want to check DFR channel on the DD NG Discord server and Nuascaras Discord Server. I guess it's fair to say that DFR's development, while technically still ongoing, has been very slow since Ponzi left.
The version on github mostly removed all features that relied on adversity, IIRC. (OTOH Adversity is still in the sources, so maybe it was some other dependency that got removed, Dynamic Dialogue Replacer perhaps.)

Oh and welcome back. Does that mean DF's curse is broken?

Edited September 19, 2025 by Talesien

[NenyaBit]

  

22 minutes ago, Talesien said:

That said a more recent version than what is available in the Ponzi dump can be found at the Github Miss Corruption established for it: https://github.com/NenyaBit/DFR-SOURCES/tree/master

What you linked are the dependencies' headlined papyrus stubs used to compile the scripts (made using the great Papyrus Headliner). I linked the source repos in my previous post

 

22 minutes ago, Talesien said:

The version on github mostly removed all features that relied on adversity, IIRC

I'm not sure what you mean by that -- Adversity is still very much required in the current version. 

Scrab and MissCorruption (respectively for Adv and DFR) only made superficial changes on their repos to get compilation working and get acquainted with the codebase. 

AFAIK, no dependency is removed

Quote

Dynamic Dialogue Replacer perhaps

When Dynamic Dialogue Replacer was taken over from ponzi by Scrab (yes, it was yet another ponzi mod), she made many breaking changes, and I ported the DDR config for DFR to the new syntax. So if you want to use the Github DFR, Scrab's DDR from Nexus is required instead of ponzi's DDR.

Edited September 19, 2025 by NenyaBit

[Lozeak]

7 hours ago, NenyaBit said:

That sounds a bit like ponzipyramid's project: he was aiming to make it so extensions could be made by creating YAML config files,

 

1 hour ago, Talesien said:

Adversity and other mods from Ponzi and their tailor made DLL's. In theory they were a great way to expand on DF while simultaneously lowering it's impact on the papyrus engine.

 

So this is an approach won't go down. While I have no knowledge of making DLLs I'm sure I could work it out. I don't think it's something DF needs to function. I do understand the pro of not being laggy in papyrus but I have endless tried to avoid loops, firing cloak spell and a lot of DF stuff fires when the game is ready via Misc Dialogue/Forced greet which seems to be fine and I want to keep it that way. (Now I will say stuff has been rewrote to function more in pap than CK which isn't something I wouldn do BUT nothing seem like it will lag anything.) 

 

But correct me if I'm wrong DF isn't laggy and I don't think it's footprint is even that heavy. I do worry all the conditions I load in comments would crash stuff... but it never seems to...

 

There is also the literally awesomeness of you install DF it works on all Skyrim versions and I'm sure I'll abandon this again when I get bored(well probably more to do with real-life) but the mod should be solid (hence why I want to come back and make sure it's a bug free as possible before I go right it's done, NOW I'll add stuff via additional esps never needing to compromise the mod with extra stuff)

 

Now the other reason for doing it this way is once I make the first esp... for someone to make the next all they need to do copy a small mod and altering it till it works and then just changing the mods name and quest name (tho you might not even need to do that). Which I thing will be a lot easier. (that said getting the endless amount of script you need to compile DF is annoying especially because it uses can use MME/Spank that ass which is something I might consider moving to an external esp to fix that but that feels like something I'd never do as there are better things to use my time on)

 

As for every issue I have for a external source adding a deal I have a solution for (or I hope so)

The biggest hurdle is converting the existing deals into the new deal system 

It will come at a cost... the user will need to preset the Deal stages so no more rules picked at random (though in the future that can be fixed I'm sure or just have a randomizer in the MCM) which deal is picked by the follower will still be random. 

When you exit a deal the devices won't be able to automatically removed so you'll be given the keys instead BUT I have an idea how to do this in one of 2 way either via a grace period dialogue or script.

(Will also add, I'm not saying my way is the best way but it's the way that plays to my skill set and from knowledge of the CK/pap.)

Edited September 20, 2025 by Lozeak

[Whollupwhozit]

This mod has the most interesting development history.

[eurytheia]

the mod does not seem to recognize resting, as in sleeping does not restore willpower nor follower lives. this has never been an issue with various devious followers versions i've played.

 

it's also been a while since i've played with devious followers and i have changed modlist loads since then so the issue could be entirely on my end. can anyone confirm?

playing on sse 1.5.97

[Lozeak]

7 hours ago, eurytheia said:

the mod does not seem to recognize resting, as in sleeping does not restore willpower nor follower lives. this has never been an issue with various devious followers versions i've played.

Fixed and new version with it is up. You won't need a new save as it was a script error. 

[mnonyhc]

Almost 🤣
Some Jenassa still included in 2.201

[Lozeak]

43 minutes ago, mnonyhc said:

Some Jenassa still included in 2.201

 

Thank you for showing me that.

I've done it now (guessing deleting the entry will fix it). I didn't intend to fix anything but the sleep bug because it will break the whole mod if you can't recover lives/willpower. It'll be included in next update but the esp is here for anyone that might want it. 

DeviousFollowers.esp

[mnonyhc]

18 minutes ago, Lozeak said:

 

Thank you for showing me that.

I've done it now (guessing deleting the entry will fix it). I didn't intend to fix anything but the sleep bug because it will break the whole mod if you can't recover lives/willpower. It'll be included in next update but the esp is here for anyone that might want it. 

DeviousFollowers.esp 799.76 kB · 0 downloads

Thanks man,

Concerning the .esp (I'm just exploring and trying to learn some stuff)

I also noticed a couple of worldedits, to skyrim and a cave, which I'm not sure should be included, they dont seem to be doing anything but might overwrite other stuff.
thre is also a change on the hireling gold cost which I'm not sure what it does but changes (<global=hirelinggold> gold) to [<global=hirelinggold>] I'm curious what it's about.

 

 

As for papyrus vs dll, personally, I'm more fan of dll, or a more hybrid approach, while I understand the papyrus should be light (personally, I've had a lot of papyrus spam in other versions where the mod's worked fine or they'd complain about being stuck in a scene randomly), I wish we had some simpler external .ini integrations so we could easily setup and share stuff like outfit and device sets.

There is also stuff like KID, skypatcher and SPID, which can allow use to distribute the necessary stuff, it can be use for example to mark some follower NPCs as immediately turn devious, possible or never-devious (I'm assuming those could be configured like with a keyword existing or not), or to distribute stuff like a personality, altering their behaviour when devious. Like one might be sadist, another want to share more, get bored more easily, or demand sexual service more often (or make each its own keyword so we can add them all at once 🤣)

The skyrim modding ecosystem has and should change quite a lot around those mods as they are great in their compatibility, configuration and in sharing them. Too many mods these days want you to take the time to customize them in MCM to tailor your experience.

That reminds me, MCM helper makes mcm changes permanent, or you can use it to make a profile of settings for players to import, export or share, would be great to have as currently I have to use MCM recorder to set DF up and constantly have to tweak the recording whenever I change something.

Anyway, love the mod

[Lozeak]

1 hour ago, mnonyhc said:

(<global=hirelinggold> gold) to [<global=hirelinggold>]

Change in dialogue when hiring a follower probably should still be the first but it doesn't matter has Hire X for 100 is as understandable as Hirt X for 100 gold

 

1 hour ago, mnonyhc said:

I also noticed a couple of worldedits, to skyrim and a cave, which I'm not sure should be included

Maybe, the cave my the dump spot for bad end. They'll stay unless they break something because removing something that might break something is more risky.

 

1 hour ago, mnonyhc said:

As for papyrus vs dll, personally, I'm more fan of dll, or a more hybrid approach, while I understand the papyrus should be light (personally, I've had a lot of papyrus spam in other versions where the mod's worked fine or they'd complain about being stuck in a scene randomly), 

I can understand the pros of this 100% but I feel it's more of a case of the right tool for the job. (Do understand I've never bothered with DLL stuff so I may be coming from a point of inexperence)
With DLLs there isn't really anything that my mod would need to move to DLLs. If does fire a few cloaks spells but they aren't on a loop.
The discussion of making the deals addable by an external source. I'd rather make is they are made in CK/Pap and not add another skill requirement and I'd feel the system would 100% lesser for that. 
To put it more simply there isn't any problem or something I want to do that I think using DLL stuff would help with.
 

1 hour ago, mnonyhc said:

I wish we had some simpler external .ini integrations so we could easily setup and share stuff like outfit and device sets.

 

I do as well and there are reason it hasn't/won't happen and it's hornets nest I'm not touching. I did make LDC which while isn't is an example of a espless script that can be attached to any mod and function as a device controller (NG I'm told is better for it which I'll look at later), same could be done for outfits/sets but someone needs to make it but honestly, things are good as they are there are real reason why stuff like this doesn't exist.

 

2 hours ago, mnonyhc said:

There is also stuff like KID, skypatcher and SPID, which can allow use to distribute the necessary stuff, it can be use for example to mark some follower NPCs as immediately turn devious, possible or never-devious (I'm assuming those could be configured like with a keyword existing or not), or to distribute stuff like a personality, altering their behaviour when devious. Like one might be sadist, another want to share more, get bored more easily, or demand sexual service more often (or make each its own keyword so we can add them all at once 🤣)

 

While I know your not directly talking about this. There is something when it comes to making stuff I believe in and like to talk about so here's the ramble.

I'm not one for trying mark "This person is a sadist, this one get bored more easily, this one will never get devious" because I like to tell those story elements differently (or not tell them) and that's by the players perception.

For example... You set a 3% chance a follower get Devious every 6 hours

Player A - The follow never turns devious - They see the follower as never being devious.
Player B - The get's devious on the second roll - The see the follower as greedy and devious

Player C - Follower gets devious after 6 days - Ok that makes sense I have been taking all the gold they seem fair.

Big part of chao mode was to add this as well like some days there mood is different and depending on your luck it can make the follower seem more/less harsh.
I do understand the flaws of this as sometimes it won't make sense or after a long period lucky/unlucky rolls just feel like RNG or if you can't break that immersion barrier to believe things like this it's impossible to enjoy but eh I make what I enjoy and at a certain point I can't make content I'm not passionate about. 

 

The basic of it is make the system, give the player enough dialogue to know what's going on, let the player read between the line and imagine what's happening.

There is a personality/boredom system added by Lupine00 which adds to the mod and imo makes it better even if I don't understand what's going on fully but it only adds depth to the mod. 

 

Now don't get me wrong, I'm not saying this is the best way of doing things, it more the kind of mod I want to exist and I'm good at. I wanted a player slave mod where you could play the game so a made a gameplay loop with what made narrative sense and intentionally left things blank because things will dynamically tell a story (you hit DCL chest, you have a mod that demand you need a follower, you get robbed, you get an unlucky chao roll to get a ton of debt) and just imagine the blanks.

There is also the massive fact if I was to write dialogue for predefined elements, It would suck. Basically, all the dialogue for my mod was rewritten by Lupine00 which I'd say improved it a massive amount for loads of people, it's not a strong point for me. 

[Vladel]

With all the different versions out there, devious followers is going to give skyrim a run for its money. I used to use devious followers continued which was cool because it has the voices built in and it pretty much worked. The only part that bothered me was the tier system for deals so some of the tier 3 modular stuff couldn't be implemented unless you had the lower ones and often i found that i didn't want those so some things were blocked off to me. 

 

I moved onto redux from the ponzi dump i think which needed DDR and Adversity and liked that all the deals were modular and on the same tier so you could have whichever ones you wanted however, the DF wouldn't implement deals and was a buggy mess. I'm currently on DF redux 0.3.10 which is an older version and uses an older adversity framework and mostly functions but is another Ponzi evolved version. I've been super hesitant to change because it works now.

 

I don't know where this version lies in relation to the rest?

[NenyaBit]

2 hours ago, Lozeak said:

There is also the massive fact if I was to write dialogue for predefined elements, It would suck. Basically, all the dialogue for my mod was rewritten by Lupine00 which I'd say improved it a massive amount for loads of people, it's not a strong point for me. 

In case you're looking for some inspiration for the tone of your dialogue, the DDR config of DFR contains most of the lines ponzi introduced, in an easy-to-browse text file (if you ignore everything but the "text:" fields which contain the dialogue) . I think it's well in line with the tone of Lupine's writing (and I personally enjoy it).

Edited September 20, 2025 by NenyaBit

[Lenore]

O.O Welcome back!! I'll be def trying this out!

[Lozeak]

4 hours ago, Vladel said:

I moved onto redux from the ponzi dump i think which needed DDR and Adversity and liked that all the deals were modular and on the same tier so you could have whichever ones you wanted however, the DF wouldn't implement deals and was a buggy mess. I'm currently on DF redux 0.3.10 which is an older version and uses an older adversity framework and mostly functions but is another Ponzi evolved version. I've been super hesitant to change because it works now.

 

I don't know where this version lies in relation to the rest?

I mean there isn't much new from OLD DFC, I fixed some content basically and added an alternate start setting.  Also can't promise everything works as I had to mess with a lot of stuff.

As for the deal thing, once the controller is done all the modular deals will be able to go on any tier. The sequenced deals however won't you pick it on tier 1 and it'll lock out tier 3 and 2... However, I might break them apart into modular deals if I'm sure they won't break anything.