Real Handcuffs

[Kharos]

Version 0.4.0 beta 3
====================
various improvements for shock collars and explosive ones
- be more persistent when trying to connect the pip boy to a shock collar
- allow triggering of explosive collars even after their wearer has died
- allow booby-trapping corpses with explosive collars (also add ThirdPartyApi function for booby-trapping corpses)
- new mod for remote trigger: powerful transmitter (much longer range)
- remove perk requirements for some mods to make them more accessible for players

@izzyknows @fred200   I would be interested to hear if the improved open pipboy routines work with Valkyrie or not.

 

Also for those who are planning to use slaves as walking bombs, it should now work a bit better, you can trigger the collar even after the slaves have died, and from further away with the powerful transmitter. Basically give them a melee weapon and watch the fight, if they survive fine, if not explode them for revenge. The bombs are still rather weak though.

[JB.]

Excellent. Thank you. 

[fred200]

0.4.0 Beta 3

I hate giving good people bad news... 

Valkyrie has no high level Trade. Under Talk, she has Exchange. This window was harder than usual to open. Took me three or four tries.

Clicking on shock collar I got the option to connect pipboy. Window closed.

A bit later I got the notification {Real Handcuffs] Unable to open terminal on pipboy.

Sarah (another O & R) does have a Trade high level. That works as expected. In Talk, she has another Trade. That works like Valkyrie.

 

(Some authors I like to help. Others - not so much. You are in the first set.)

[izzyknows]

@Kharos
ValKyrie still doesn't connect.

[izzyknows]

IF I can get the second trade menu closed fast enough, the Pip-Boy will connect normally.
It works the same on all Thuggy's NPC's.

A little bit longer delay would be nice... but my tremors are a little bad today. LOL

 

 

Edit:
Removing the collars, from Thuggy's NPC's, (for me) is a royal PIA. The timing has to be perfect (closing the 2nd trade menu) in order for the collar to be "actually" unlocked.
If it's not perfect, then nothing happens when closing the Pip-Boy. So it "seems" that sometimes the Pip-Boy is making connection to "nothing"... maybe!

[fred200]

1 hour ago, izzyknows said:

IF I can get the second trade menu closed fast enough, the Pip-Boy will connect normally.
It works the same on all Thuggy's NPC's.

A little bit longer delay would be nice... but my tremors are a little bad today. LOL

 

 

Edit:
Removing the collars, from Thuggy's NPC's, (for me) is a royal PIA. The timing has to be perfect (closing the 2nd trade menu) in order for the collar to be "actually" unlocked.
If it's not perfect, then nothing happens when closing the Pip-Boy. So it "seems" that sometimes the Pip-Boy is making connection to "nothing"... maybe!

Crazy's utility gun is a perfect work-around. It works every time - on everyone.

And to think I learned about it here...

 

[Tentacus]

5 hours ago, Kharos said:

Version 0.4.0 beta 3
====================
various improvements for shock collars and explosive ones
- be more persistent when trying to connect the pip boy to a shock collar
- allow triggering of explosive collars even after their wearer has died
- allow booby-trapping corpses with explosive collars (also add ThirdPartyApi function for booby-trapping corpses)
- new mod for remote trigger: powerful transmitter (much longer range)
- remove perk requirements for some mods to make them more accessible for players

@izzyknows @fred200   I would be interested to hear if the improved open pipboy routines work with Valkyrie or not.

 

Also for those who are planning to use slaves as walking bombs, it should now work a bit better, you can trigger the collar even after the slaves have died, and from further away with the powerful transmitter. Basically give them a melee weapon and watch the fight, if they survive fine, if not explode them for revenge. The bombs are still rather weak though.

Haha... That's great. Thank you.

[Tentacus]

12 minutes ago, fred200 said:

Crazy's utility gun is a perfect work-around. It works every time - on everyone.

And to think I learned about it here...

 

@izzyknows Crazy's gun is very handy for many things but if you don't want another mod, there is always good old OpenActorContainer 1 in the console

[Kharos]

6 hours ago, izzyknows said:

@Kharos
ValKyrie still doesn't connect.

Ok, thanks for testing. I think the fact that a menu is open prevents the game from opening the pip boy. I may have to finally install Valkyrie, recruit her, and do some testing myself to find a workaround.

[izzyknows]

37 minutes ago, Kharos said:

Ok, thanks for testing. I think the fact that a menu is open prevents the game from opening the pip boy. I may have to finally install Valkyrie, recruit her, and do some testing myself to find a workaround.

Just a tip if you do install Project Valkyrie, (for testing only)
coc parsonsstate02

she's on the  3rd floor down.
tcl back up and exit normally... she has "key" dialogue right outside the prison.

I just jump back up through the hole.. but I use fJumpHeightMin 600

 

@fred200
I've been using Crazy's Multi tool since I joined this forum. Actually, it was the reason I joined! LOL
Bloody love that thing!

Oh! Ya wanna have some fun?
Have Violate trigger and one of the assailants equip it! NPC's are stupid accurate with it! 99 of 100 shots will hit you. hehehehehe

[guangmi]

20 hours ago, Kharos said:

Hi guangmi

 

Package 00079790 is a vanilla package (I know because it starts with 00), so this NPC is at the moment not under the control of Real Handcuffs. Scene 0007978F means that this NPC is currently in a scene that may override the NPC behavior. Again the 00 at the start of the id means that it is a vanilla scene.

 

Looking at things in FO4Edit, 00079790 is package EE_SuspiciousShootingPackage. 0007978F is scene EE_SuspiciousShootingScene. These are both part of quest EE_RaiderSuspiciousShooting. Looking at things in Creation Kit, this is the "random scene" where a raider suddenly starts shooting because they are nervous. It looks like her AI is stuck at the moment where she should fire her weapon. I am not sure why, maybe because she is not able to fire a weapon? You can try to give her a weapon and equip it (openactorcontainer 1), if you are lucky it will allow her to get unstuck.

 

Can you give me more details about how you got her into this situation?

- How did you get her? Is she a Just Business slave, or from another mod?

- When the problems started, was she cuffed?

 

Cheers

Kharos

 

[Edit] I forgot to explain this, you might not know it. Packages are how the game controls what NPCs are doing. Think of them as small computer programs running the AI of the NPC. I added information about the current package to the Debug Settings because I had a lot of trouble creating packages when I made the handcuffs, to better find conflicts or mistakes.

Hi Kharos

 

I forgot the details, but I'm sure she is a Just Buiness slave, 

 

All my new slaves in these days, got a shock collar and hinged cuff at the moment I caught her.

 

So, I'm not sure what triggered this situation, but I'm sure she have these cuffs when the error occurred, and I unequip all her restrains by the MCM.

 

She can't talk so I can't open her inventory, and can't order her to move. Those slaves just stuck on the ground with hands free.

 

This had happend serveral times in one night(6 hours playing), maybe I order some of them to "sit" on a chair or something after unlock their handcuff. I'm not sure.

 

These situations haven't seen before, but in some versions I update realhandcuffs, I found some of them like this, unusually, because I can't fix them in any way, so I just disable them.

 

I ask you because there is a strange "package" in the RH MCM, I thought this is something new in your mod.

 

By the way, I think one action is very bad for immersion.

 

When you use shock collar to make slaves unconscious, their hands are free form handcuffs immediately.

 

And if you wake them up, they will stand up with both hands free on the ground, then got cuffed strange like a ham actor.

 

You know, they should be cuffed securely even if they are unconscious, that is called "Real handcuffs"

 

I hope these wouldn't be a hard requirements, if so, maybe I should try my best to ignore this.

 

As always, thank you for all you done.Great work.

 

Cheers

Guangmi

[Kharos]

3 hours ago, guangmi said:

This had happend serveral times in one night(6 hours playing), maybe I order some of them to "sit" on a chair or something after unlock their handcuff. I'm not sure.

 

These situations haven't seen before, but in some versions I update realhandcuffs, I found some of them like this, unusually, because I can't fix them in any way, so I just disable them.

Interesting that you have seen it multiple times. I have not seen this happen before. I think I know how to fix the situation, my problem that I am not sure about how to detect it, and how to test it (because I have not seen it happen in my game). I will try to investigate it a bit more.

 

By the way, if it happens again, can you open the MCM debug settings and see if the package id / scene id are the same or if they are different? If they are different, write them down and send them to me (or just send me the screenshot). If we can make a list of package/scene ids that trigger the bug, this could help creating a fix.

 

3 hours ago, guangmi said:

By the way, I think one action is very bad for immersion.

 

When you use shock collar to make slaves unconscious, their hands are free form handcuffs immediately.

 

And if you wake them up, they will stand up with both hands free on the ground, then got cuffed strange like a ham actor.

 

You know, they should be cuffed securely even if they are unconscious, that is called "Real handcuffs"

Yeah, I'm aware of the problem, and I agree that it does not look good. It is not impossible to fix, but it is hard. Basically when NPCs get unconscious they start to ragdoll. This means that they are no longer playing the "hands behind back" animation. As far as I know the only way to fix this is by making animations where the NPCs get unconscions and then "fake" unconsciousness by playing these animations instead of the real thing. I am not a very experienced animator, so fixing it is at the moment not on the top of my list. But I do dislike the current situation...

 

The only workaround at the moment is to just shock the slaves until they go into bleedout and then stop (so they don't go unconscious). Sorry.

 

Kharos

[Nebuchadnezzer2]

14 hours ago, guangmi said:

When you use shock collar to make slaves unconscious, their hands are free form handcuffs immediately.

 

And if you wake them up, they will stand up with both hands free on the ground, then got cuffed strange like a ham actor.

As @Kharos mentioned, Ragdoll.

And short of a way of forcibly keeping the hands pinned together when the model gets ragdolled, there's not a whole lot that can be done that isn't a metric fuckton of work.

[Kharos]

10 hours ago, Nebuchadnezzer2 said:

As @Kharos mentioned, Ragdoll.

And short of a way of forcibly keeping the hands pinned together when the model gets ragdolled, there's not a whole lot that can be done that isn't a metric fuckton of work.

I have not found such a way. Actually it looks bad in other situations, too. For example when you use Prisoner Shackles (https://www.nexusmods.com/fallout4/mods/18436, see this image: https://staticdelivery.nexusmods.com/mods/1151/images/18436-0-1473951382.png), the arms of the unconscious victim will slip out of the shackles. When they wake up, they get up, turn around, and sit down into the shackles. Makes sense as it is technically a furniture object.

 

The whole unconsciousness thing is very hard to do in a good way, and I am asking myself if I should just remove it and keep exhausted victims in bleedout (and for furniture like prisoner shackles, I would just keep them in the furniture). Or I could make it an option in MCM...

[protectandserve]

On 9/23/2019 at 4:59 PM, JBpy said:

So ... When do you start? 

im no modder!

[Tentacus]

22 hours ago, Kharos said:

Yeah, I'm aware of the problem, and I agree that it does not look good. It is not impossible to fix, but it is hard. Basically when NPCs get unconscious they start to ragdoll. This means that they are no longer playing the "hands behind back" animation. As far as I know the only way to fix this is by making animations where the NPCs get unconscions and then "fake" unconsciousness by playing these animations instead of the real thing. I am not a very experienced animator, so fixing it is at the moment not on the top of my list. But I do dislike the current situation...

For a while between quitting my previous mod and starting Hardship I was toying with making a skyrim mod which would let you knock down and Knock out bound NPCs The solution I came up with is what you describe. It sorta worked though the transitions were crap... and yes it's not worth the effort.

[Kharos]

14 minutes ago, Tentacus said:

For a while between quitting my previous mod and starting Hardship I was toying with making a skyrim mod which would let you knock down and Knock out bound NPCs The solution I came up with is what you describe. It sorta worked though the transitions were crap... and yes it's not worth the effort.

Thanks Tentacus! Unfortunately that confirms that unconsciousness might be a dead end...

[Kharos]

Version 0.4.0 beta 4
====================
npc handling improvements
- handle active command mode and dialogue menu when trying to connect the pip boy to a shock collar
- make sure that npcs who get cuffed while they are in combat (especially player teammates) put away their weapon
- add option to MCM for resetting AI of currently targeted NPC, this might help to "unstuck" npcs

This is another release that only contains bugfixes and no new features.

 

@izzyknows @fred200 In my tests, the first change finally makes shock collars work with Valkyrie. There is one small thing that I cannot fix, because how the dialogue/trade menu is set up: After exiting the pip boy menu, the game thinks that you are still in dialogue mode with her, so you need to either look at her from close distance (and the dialogue menu will reappear) or you walk away (and the game will cancel dialogue mode).

@guangmi I added an experimental "reset npc ai" function to the MCM (see screenshot below; just click the line, similar to the existing functionality for freeing characters). It may be able to "fix" the NPCs that get stuck. I cannot promise because I cannot reproduce the problem in my game, so I cannot fully test it.

 

[izzyknows]

@Kharos So far, it's working perfectly with Thuggy's wonky trade menu. (I really need to look at fixing that. LOL)

[fred200]

Beta 4 looks good to me. I was able to open terminal on both Valkyrie and Sarah.

I was not able to talk to Valkyrie after until I talked to someone else. Then I got the normal dialogs.

As far as I am concerned, this is good as is.

Thanks!

[izzyknows]

Hey @fred200 just walk away from her and the game will clear/cancel the current (invisible) dialogue, then walk back to her & all's good.

 

But I agree with you.. "good as is"!

[guangmi]

Hi Kharos

 

I found something weird this time.

 

Lots of my slaves just out of control.

 

I said"Follow me" and they say"Whatever you say", but still don't follow.

 

They still do the things as before.

 

A lot of JB slaves. I caught them days ago in the real world, and nearly 2 days in the game.

 

I check the Info in the dialogue and found the new slaves, whitch I caught in this version, their submission is less 20, near 10~15.

 

And lot of my old JB slaves (which had locked in a old cell for nearly one year in the real world), still have a 50 submission now, and still can be ordered normally.

 

I found a message in the JB "How to use it"

 

"All enslaved NPCs have "submission level"  which represents their escape chance. "Submission" is being increased automatically while slave wears "Shock collar" or works in your settlement. You can see slave's "submission"  in information option in dialogue. There you can also change NPC's name and appearance."

 

He didn't mention low submission level will cause a "Disobedient slave", I close the "escape slaves" in the JB MCM.

 

My question is, if your "new" shock collar is auto replace the JB shock collar, then will your collar will do the same thing to keep slaves' submission level?

 

[Kharos]

Hi guangmi

 

You are using the newest version of Just Business (0.7.5), right? Make sure that it really is the newest Just Business. Using a old version will cause bugs as my compatibility plugin makes changes to Just Business

 

35 minutes ago, guangmi said:

My question is, if your "new" shock collar is auto replace the JB shock collar, then will your collar will do the same thing to keep slaves' submission level?

As far as I can see in the script sources of the newest Just Business version, the slave collar is no longer necessary for increasing submission of slaves (so this is old information). Submission will instead grow slowly each game hour (not real world hour) depending on the situation: It will grow by 1 per hour if they are restricted (= assigned to a furniture that prevents them from escaping), 0.5 when serving as a follower, 0.3 when working as prostitute, 0.2 when working in a settlement (farm, etc), 0.1 in all other cases. In my tests it does grow as it should.

 

53 minutes ago, guangmi said:

And lot of my old JB slaves (which had locked in a old cell for nearly one year in the real world), still have a 50 submission now, and still can be ordered normally.

 

They should be at 100 submission level if they are really that old. If you captured them in a old version of Just Business, then try the "reset slave" functionality. It is possible that the way how Just Business calculates submission has changed; "reset slave" will make sure that Just Business handles them in the correct, new way.

 

59 minutes ago, guangmi said:

He didn't mention low submission level will cause a "Disobedient slave", I close the "escape slaves" in the JB MCM.

As far as I know low submission level should not cause disobedient slaves. The packages in your screenshots look ok. RH_BoundHandsTravelToWorkshopGuardedByPlayer is the AI package for slaves who have been sent to a workshop while they are tied up (usually by the "go home" dialogue). 00038c0e is the game's default workshop sandbox package, it is very typical for NPCs who are working in a settlement.

 

Maybe the AI is just slow? I had that problem with one of my settlements, it caused bad slowdowns of the AI and I was not able to find out why. Take one of the disobedient slaves with you to a place far away from the settlement (or maybe to another, small settlement) and try if they follow your commands there.

 

[guangmi]

1 hour ago, Kharos said:

Hi guangmi

 

You are using the newest version of Just Business (0.7.5), right? Make sure that it really is the newest Just Business. Using a old version will cause bugs as my compatibility plugin makes changes to Just Business

 

As far as I can see in the script sources of the newest Just Business version, the slave collar is no longer necessary for increasing submission of slaves (so this is old information). Submission will instead grow slowly each game hour (not real world hour) depending on the situation: It will grow by 1 per hour if they are restricted (= assigned to a furniture that prevents them from escaping), 0.5 when serving as a follower, 0.3 when working as prostitute, 0.2 when working in a settlement (farm, etc), 0.1 in all other cases. In my tests it does grow as it should.

 

They should be at 100 submission level if they are really that old. If you captured them in a old version of Just Business, then try the "reset slave" functionality. It is possible that the way how Just Business calculates submission has changed; "reset slave" will make sure that Just Business handles them in the correct, new way.

 

As far as I know low submission level should not cause disobedient slaves. The packages in your screenshots look ok. RH_BoundHandsTravelToWorkshopGuardedByPlayer is the AI package for slaves who have been sent to a workshop while they are tied up (usually by the "go home" dialogue). 00038c0e is the game's default workshop sandbox package, it is very typical for NPCs who are working in a settlement.

 

Maybe the AI is just slow? I had that problem with one of my settlements, it caused bad slowdowns of the AI and I was not able to find out why. Take one of the disobedient slaves with you to a place far away from the settlement (or maybe to another, small settlement) and try if they follow your commands there.

 

Now I'm really confused,

 

I tried to reinstall the JB, and now, every my new slaves got 0 submission and can't order in any ways!

 

I think this is not your mod's fault, but...how?!

 

And I check those slaves in my base, yes, their submission is increasing slowly....

 

What should I do now......I felt as if I had gone from being a successful slave owner to a tired middle-aged man...

[Kharos]

2 hours ago, guangmi said:

Now I'm really confused,

 

I tried to reinstall the JB, and now, every my new slaves got 0 submission and can't order in any ways!

 

I think this is not your mod's fault, but...how?!

 

And I check those slaves in my base, yes, their submission is increasing slowly....

 

What should I do now......I felt as if I had gone from being a successful slave owner to a tired middle-aged man...

I am not the author of JB, so I have no idea why it would do this. I am pretty sure that my mod does not modify submission of JB slaves.

 

First thing, you can try to go back to the save before you updated JB (you did make a save before updating it, right?). That might be the best way to fix things.,

As an alternative, you can set the submission values of slaves using the console. Submission is a actor value (AVIF).

help JBIsSubmissive 4

This will show you the ID of that actor value, it should be something like XY03D7C6 where XY is the load order number of JB. After that, select a slave when the console is open and use getav/setav get or set submission. For example, if the actor value ID was 2403D7C6, type the following to set the submission of a slave to 50:

setav 2403D7C6 50

[Edit] I cannot help you if you cannot give them orders, I have no idea what would cause this. You may have to ask in the JB thread.