Devious Followers (8 June 2019)

[Lozeak]

On 01/05/2018 at 12:28 PM, mufcfan said:

Great mod! I have tried it earlier and it has come a long way since.

 

I just started a new game and I can't seem to get this mod to work. I tried moving it to the top of my load order, checked the papyrus, etc.

I can only see this in the papyrus which has a relation and I think this happened when I hit the reset button in the debug options:

 

[05/01/2018 - 12:30:07PM] ERROR: Array index 8 is out of range (0-0)
stack:
	[_DflowMCM (1D00C545)]._DflowMCM.SetToggleOptionValue() - "SKI_ConfigBase.psc" Line ?
	[_DflowMCM (1D00C545)]._DflowMCM.OnOptionSelect() - "_DFlowMCM.psc" Line ?
	[_DflowMCM (1D00C545)]._DflowMCM.SelectOption() - "SKI_ConfigBase.psc" Line ?
	[SKI_ConfigManagerInstance (42000802)].SKI_ConfigManager.OnOptionSelect() - "SKI_ConfigManager.psc" Line ?
[05/01/2018 - 12:30:07PM] [_DflowMCM <_DflowMCM (1D00C545)>] ERROR: Option type mismatch. Expected toggle option, page "Debug", index 8

 

To clarify: the MCM menu shows up and changes stick, but the events/dialogues mostly don't work. It seems that I can add my follower (Selene's Kate) using the debug option for the dialogue, but nothing else. Debt won't change even after days.

I tried searching for the faction with 'help _DMaster' and it didn't return any results.

 

I think it is safe to say that I did something wrong, but I just can't seem to find what exactly.

 

Could someone please offer me some advice?

loadorder.txt

Papyrus.1.log

Only thing I can think this is that when I updated the MCM the array for pages changed meaning upgrading from an old save "might" cause this.

On 01/05/2018 at 12:40 PM, LolaPheron said:

Yeah, second that! it's way too easy right now.

Would be kinda nice if the DF only sold keys back to you, maybe even at varying prices, through a special deal, or sometimes outright refused. It would still allow you to give the follower keys for "safekeeping", so you can't loose all of them during an unfortunate event, but it would definitely be less of an exploit. Maybe the DF could decide to sell them for profit if your debt becomes too high....

ooh, the possibilities

Key control isn't really in the remit of this mod, like if you want to get down to it, you could put keys/gold into a containers to cheat stuff. I think DCL has options to stop you moving keys around (shaky hands)

On 01/05/2018 at 1:54 PM, Lupine00 said:

I noticed that the armor disappearing code for the cage in DW, which is a cut+paste of the code for the cursed gauntlets, does not check for a quest flag on items before destroying them.

 

I'm not sure there are any vanilla armor items marked quest, but there are certainly mods that add them and would be broken by this.

 

In some cases, the armor items might be Devious; there are many mods that add this. Those devious armors may or may not be marked quest.

 

For example, the Rubber Doll suit is marked quest, not sure if it's marked armor clothing, probably is, as it offers a lot of protection.

With new DD4 items, they'll probably just "come back", but there's certainly explosive potential there.

 

Even if it's judged reasonable to nuke one-of-a-kind-do-a-whole-quest-chain-to-earn-it armor items out of existence, it doesn't seem very compatible to destroy quest items, and it seems against the intent of the cage to destroy devious ones.

Quest items being stolen/deleted is an issue i need to fix 100% it's just lack of experience with CK/Scripting. I'll work it out eventually.

22 hours ago, user9120975435 said:

 

I use Disparity where my char started out with only 70 units of carryweight. With the use of a backpack and investment into stamina she was managing around 116 units of carryweight (limit was around 140) when she got hit by that plug, so she was still almost 180 units overburdened. That was just ridiculous. I was about to simply coc to nearest stables and tgm so she could walk those few yards when my game ctd-ed. At the moment of being plugged she was deep inside Volskygge, with enemy bandits patrolling outside, trying to find her (she sneaked inside instead of getting into a fight with them). If it's possible and the mod author is willing I think it would be great if the follower wouldn't do any of these debilitating decisions while in dangerous areas because they will get the player char killed.

Yea, added it in a basic way meaning mods that alter your carry weight will have problems with this a few things in this mod.

I do want to fix it though because a lot of those mod work well with this mod. Stay tuned.

5 hours ago, SkyAddiction said:

@Lozeak

 

Potential Bug: Slavery failure might not end the quest.

 

I was racing through the slavery aspect of the mod to test it. Upon release, my follower "left", bounties were added, devices were added, and everything seemed fine. Except... my follower never actually left...

I use EFF, and I think that might be the culprit. At least I couldn't pin it on anything else, so... yeah. Dismissing the follower through EFF, resetting the mod, sleeping, and re-hiring allowed testing to continue without interruption. I realllly  want to say it's EFF, but I have no proof and wont have any because I'm not exactly sober enough just now to produce it.

 

If someone else finds their way into the same issue with the same mods, then perhaps you know where to look.

It's EFF, EFF handles adding and removing follower, if DF trys to remove/add a follower it will glitch out, not much I can do about it. It's a minor issue though.

2 hours ago, qawsedrftg765 said:

 

 

I tried updating to 1.16 on a clean save and even if I have literally nothing in my inventory my follower will attempt to steal my items and then set my debt to 1900.

Did your willpower drop though ? 

What should happen .... steal event should happen 3 or more Willpower but you'll lose willpower.

If is happens at less that 3 willpower something is wrong 

If you don't lose willpower on a clean save something is wrong maybe a side effect of injecting a global?

I had a look at the code and I can't see the problem (not to say it isn't there)

Unloading a save with issue might help me find the problem (or eliminate some)

16 minutes ago, Wyrade said:

Shouldn't there be a step of using a save cleaner to delete the scripts of the mod after the unloaded save?

I believe that is generally a better practice when trying to create a "clean save" than not doing it.

A step of loading a cleaned save and saving again before loading the esp might be useful as well.

And possibly waiting 1-2 min between the loads and saves to let all scripts initialize in a mod-heavy environment.

 

To be honest, I'd just recommend a new game with 1.16 cause of the issues it's causing but I think the above would clean DF enough but yea doing above is better.

 

===========================

Other questions....

 

Disable Fast travel - Never (other mods can disable if you want or you can chose not to use it). My mod deals with fast travel well because if you fast travel time passes a lot more if you just do it manually meaning sometime you may want to fast travel but can't afford it which I enjoy more !

 

Heavy bondage stopping you getting in cage (DW) - I need to fix this.

 

 

[Reesewow]

3 hours ago, qawsedrftg765 said:

 

 

I tried updating to 1.16 on a clean save and even if I have literally nothing in my inventory my follower will attempt to steal my items and then set my debt to 1900.

That doesn't sound bugged, if you go over your maximum debt and don't pay your follower in time (you have a few seconds to pay them after "Your follower is angry" pops up in the top left) the following should happen:

 

1. Your follower sets your debt to just under your "maximum" debt
2. Your character takes a big hit to Willpower (3/4 Willpower lost I think)
3. Your follower takes some/all of your gold (this is not affected by the theft slider - gold is always stealable since you should have been using it to pay the follower!)
4. Your follower steals a random # of items equal to your theft slider - question is if there is any bugs where the follower still steals items if the slider is set to 0

I think the main issue with the theft as far as I've seen is that anything you have that is marked *stolen* that is taken by the follower is not sold by Belethor, because he won't sell stolen-marked items.  The other issue is that the follower can currently take quest items and since quest items have a tendency to be marked stolen (dragon claws, barenziah gems, various letters ect) to retrieve them from Belethor's shop you need to clip through the floor and access his vendor chest directly.

[mufcfan]

2 hours ago, Lozeak said:

Only thing I can think this is that when I updated the MCM the array for pages changed meaning upgrading from an old save "might" cause this.

Thanks for checking!

It turns out that only that part of my post was actually true.

 

The mod does work for me too and it seems that I jumped to conclusions and made some counterproductive choices when trying to test it.

This time, I added the same follower using the debug option and waited for more than 12 hours. The debt was added and I could pay it back.

 

Thanks again and sorry for the misleading info!

[Lozeak]

8 hours ago, mufcfan said:

Thanks for checking!

It turns out that only that part of my post was actually true.

 

The mod does work for me too and it seems that I jumped to conclusions and made some counterproductive choices when trying to test it.

This time, I added the same follower using the debug option and waited for more than 12 hours. The debt was added and I could pay it back.

 

Thanks again and sorry for the misleading info!

No need to be sorry, like I get with feedback some stuff will be inaccurate at times but if people feel afraid to post because they might be wrong, I will not get the information to fix bugs. (i've been on the other side of it too being a lurker on here for like 6 years lol)

 

=======================================

 

So mod update woot.

 

Content is low, makes the removal of items a little more interesting and handles items that were buggy before.

Quest items ..... are annoying so Fallout 4 has IsQuestItem function. Skyrim does not, I looked at some solutions and well it's just awkward. So rather than buy your items back you can get them all back for 200 gold from a npc that moves around. I like to think that it makes it so that the player goes "shit I needed that golden claw but I can't afford to travel so far to get it back so I better sort my issues out".

O yea, I don't know how the follower teleported your items to the merchant so far away but skyrim has magic ..... so magic??!

 

I tweaked the weight on some items because of mod incompatibility 

[Reesewow]

1 hour ago, Lozeak said:

So rather than buy your items back you can get them all back for 200 gold from a npc that moves around. I like to think that it makes it so that the player goes "shit I needed that golden claw but I can't afford to travel so far to get it back so I better sort my issues out".

Heh, I like it, plus the fun little bonus.   Minor barely-bug - buying your items back triggers a debug calculation to show up in the top-left of the screen.

[Lupine00]

Last night, follower would not remove devices.

 

First time, the follower talked about how she liked the chance to make extra money.

I then got the dialogue about how it works, then the popup with costs, and after OK on the popup, two topics that had "..." as text came up.

I couldn't tell exactly what those topics were.

 

I clicked on the top one, and it took me back to the top level dialogue (main follower "menu").

 

I clicked on remove items again, but this time, after This is how it works... no popup appeared, and the a single topic "..." appeared (it was the usual top level follower dialogue).

 

After that, though I could get the This is how it works... and the popup with the explanation of removal costs, it always went straight to the top level menu after that, and never removed any items, or provided additional dialogue for it.

 

I tried many times to get the follower to remove items, but the dialogue always just looped back to the top level after the "how it works" popup.

 

It was possible to remove them easily using an ordinary restraints key.

 

There's nothing at all in my log about it.

 

I'm going to re-test this again later. Tested...

 

Dismissed follower and re-added. Remove items dialogue now working as expected.

 

Problem seems to come and go. It seems that if you have a piercing, the remove devices dialog bugs out, even if you have other devices that would normally be candidates for removal.

[CGi]

Love this mod. Here's a german translation for version 1.20.
 

[Deleted. See this mods download page.]

[Guest]

Great mod. It's sad that Devious World needs Heretical Resources. Will it be removed in future?

[Reesewow]

37 minutes ago, Bobbert6996 said:

Great mod. It's sad that Devious World needs Heretical Resources. Will it be removed in future?

Quote

This in alpha so yea not much content but it works on the willpower from devious follower (it also will independently calculate Willpower so it could bug out)

 

It's requires https://www.loverslab.com/files/file/3398-zazextensionpack/ and https://www.loverslab.com/files/file/4688-zaz-animation-pack-v-80-2017-11-15/ and all there requirements (this will never change and it will eventually use slave tats and maybe more)

Being as all of the content currently in Devious World is built using ZEP assets, doubtful. 

 

You could certainly try using TES5Edit to remove HR as a master of ZEP as so far the HR themselves aren't used by Devious World.  Up to Lozeak if that changes in future however, since the ZEP requirement would mean that 99% of users would also have HR installed, and not all HR items have versions included in DD4.

[CGi]

Noticed a few oddities.

When i got no dept, i can still make a deal or upgrade a deal with my follower what results in a negative dept.
Asking to remove the restraints, i only get the explanation as dialogue option.
And trying to pay the depth i can of course not afford it.

Aside from that:
The texts for the rules and other explanations in messageboxes are hardcoded and not pulled from the plugin depsite the texts being in there.
This way the messages in the plugin are unused and to translate them the scripts would have to be localized.

 

Edit:
Restarting my game my follower lost all DF functionality but her devices where ofc still and place.

So i had to dismiss her and rehire her to make DF trigger again but and everything started from scratch.

Was not a thing with the previous version.

[Lupine00]

Was just checking through my dialogue "translation".

 

Found this original text:

 

Multiplier for extra followers at 20% with 3 follower it will time 1.6 to overall

Debt per day 0 will disable this

 

Isn't this incorrect?

 

Shouldn't the formula be:   costPerDayScale = 1.0 + (followerCount - 1.0) * extraFollowerScale   ?

and not  costPerDaysScale = 1.0 + followerCount * extraFollowerScale

...so the cost scale for three followers at 20% ought to be 1.4, not 1.6 ?

 

I imagine the intent is that if this is 100% you pay full-fee per follower?

So...

1 follower the scale is 1.0,

3 followers the scale is 3.0

 

And at 0% followers after the first cost no extra.

1 follower the scale is 1.0

3 followers the scale is 1.0

 

But what the example suggests is that, with only one follower, at 20% the scale would be 1.2, and at 100%, the scale would be 2.0 ! 

Which it doesn't seem to be.

 

So the correct text would be:

Multiplier for extra followers, beyond the first. At 20% with a total of four followers, it will scale debt-per-day by 1.6

Debt per day 0 will disable this

???

[Pupkin]

inspired by your mod, I got the following idea. I posted it in the suggested mods section, you might want to take a look

https://www.loverslab.com/topic/98852-idea-sugardaddy-mod/

[Lozeak]

6 hours ago, CGi said:

Noticed a few oddities.

When i got no dept, i can still make a deal or upgrade a deal with my follower what results in a negative dept.
Asking to remove the restraints, i only get the explanation as dialogue option.
And trying to pay the depth i can of course not afford it.

Aside from that:
The texts for the rules and other explanations in messageboxes are hardcoded and not pulled from the plugin depsite the texts being in there.
This way the messages in the plugin are unused and to translate them the scripts would have to be localized.

 

Edit:
Restarting my game my follower lost all DF functionality but her devices where ofc still and place.

So i had to dismiss her and rehire her to make DF trigger again but and everything started from scratch.

Was not a thing with the previous version.

Negative debt - Yea i made it so you could get -200 Debt (at most) cause well maybe you only need to remove 300 debt but do it because it's better than the interest.

Can I remove a device? - only removes some devices I should of put that in the message.

Paying Debt - dialogue is a little messy but it isn't glitchy right?. I may rework it a little one day.

 

Hardcoded message.... never thought about that. Putting variable into Messages in to CK was annoying so I hardcoded them. I think I will move all the messages to one script (MCM) so they only need to localise one script.

 

No idea how DF lost all functionality on a restart of a game unless the quest alias was lost somehow, maybe unclean save upgrade I dunno. I need to play the mod more myself really lol.

 

great feedback btw <3

5 hours ago, Lupine00 said:

Was just checking through my dialogue "translation".

 

Found this original text:

 

Multiplier for extra followers at 20% with 3 follower it will time 1.6 to overall

Debt per day 0 will disable this

 

Isn't this incorrect?

 

Shouldn't the formula be:   costPerDayScale = 1.0 + (followerCount - 1.0) * extraFollowerScale   ?

and not  costPerDaysScale = 1.0 + followerCount * extraFollowerScale

...so the cost scale for three followers at 20% ought to be 1.4, not 1.6 ?

 

I imagine the intent is that if this is 100% you pay full-fee per follower?

So...

1 follower the scale is 1.0,

3 followers the scale is 3.0

 

And at 0% followers after the first cost no extra.

1 follower the scale is 1.0

3 followers the scale is 1.0

 

But what the example suggests is that, with only one follower, at 20% the scale would be 1.2, and at 100%, the scale would be 2.0 ! 

Which it doesn't seem to be.

 

So the correct text would be:

Multiplier for extra followers, beyond the first. At 20% with a total of four followers, it will scale debt-per-day by 1.6

Debt per day 0 will disable this

???

The code is

F = ((PlayerFollowerCount.getValue() - 1)*(DebtPerFollower.getValue()/100))+1

which is 

Follower multiplier = ((Follower Count - 1)*(Multi for followers))+1

 

Which is correct(I'm sure)

 

The MCM text is wrong if that's what you ment (i'll correct it)

48 minutes ago, Pupkin said:

inspired by your mod, I got the following idea. I posted it in the suggested mods section, you might want to take a look

https://www.loverslab.com/topic/98852-idea-sugardaddy-mod/

I like the idea ^^. I do want to make things similar to it like ....

Event happens ---> You are Freed ---> Event repeat every X days until you complete a quest or buy out of it. done 0 work towards it tho so maybe a while before you see anything like that from me.

[CGi]

40 minutes ago, Lozeak said:

Negative debt - Yea i made it so you could get -200 Debt (at most) cause well maybe you only need to remove 300 debt but do it because it's better than the interest.

Can I remove a device? - only removes some devices I should of put that in the message.

Paying Debt - dialogue is a little messy but it isn't glitchy right?. I may rework it a little one day.

 

Hardcoded message.... never thought about that. Putting variable into Messages in to CK was annoying so I hardcoded them. I think I will move all the messages to one script (MCM) so they only need to localise one script.

 

No idea how DF lost all functionality on a restart of a game unless the quest alias was lost somehow, maybe unclean save upgrade I dunno. I need to play the mod more myself really lol.

Didn't even think of that possibility. Nice!
And from translating your mod (uploaded here), i know what the follower removes and my toon had only those items (given by her) equipped. Still no such option.
Paying the dept works just fine. The dialogue options are unsorted but i doubt that'll be a problem with the loose/almost loose scenario this mod ships with.

i would prefer you localize the script because redoing this everytime is a chore. Or use aliases in messages instead of variables and hardcoded messages.

i tried on a new game. Everytime my follower lost all DF functionality after i restarted the game and DF didn't pick her up again unless she was rehired.

And yes, play the game for once instead of only modding for it. Might be fun, you know? ^^

[r5e4w3q2]

Quote

It's requires https://www.loverslab.com/files/file/3398-zazextensionpack/ and https://www.loverslab.com/files/file/4688-zaz-animation-pack-v-80-2017-11-15/ and all there requirements (this will never change and it will eventually use slave tats and maybe more)

ZEP is for ZAP 7, Tara's ZAP 8 recommends not using ZEP with it?

 

Quote

 

ZEP (Zaz Extension Pack) may not be compatible with this mod

and If  ZEP (Zaz Extension Pack) Will be Installed After This Mod,

ZAP 8.0 May Not Work Anymore!!!

 

Are there any particular work-arounds necessary for this?

[Reesewow]

2 minutes ago, r5e4w3q2 said:

ZEP is for ZAP 7, Tara's ZAP 8 recommends not using ZEP with it?

 

Are there any particular work-arounds necessary for this?

At least for myself, installing ZEP and not letting it over-write ZAP 8.0+ (I think a few scripts conflict), and having it after ZAP 8.0+ in the load order didn't cause any obvious issues.  Mostly ZEP adds tags to some of the old ZAP 7 items.

 

The main issue some people seem to have is FNIS throwing a fit with certain combination of ZAP and ZEP.  If you install ZEP and can run FNIS without an error, you are probably fine.  Either way, try it out, as Lozeak built Devious World using ZAP 8 and ZEP.

[Lozeak]

 

1 hour ago, CGi said:

Didn't even think of that possibility. Nice!
And from translating your mod (uploaded here), i know what the follower removes and my toon had only those items (given by her) equipped. Still no such option.
Paying the dept works just fine. The dialogue options are unsorted but i doubt that'll be a problem with the loose/almost loose scenario this mod ships with.

i would prefer you localize the script because redoing this everytime is a chore. Or use aliases in messages instead of variables and hardcoded messages.

i tried on a new game. Everytime my follower lost all DF functionality after i restarted the game and DF didn't pick her up again unless she was rehired.

And yes, play the game for once instead of only modding for it. Might be fun, you know? ^^

Dunno what you mean by localising the script.

I'm not sure it's possible to make the messages in the CK because the variables change. I did try before and never worked it out hence the hardcoding them. Either way, I will move all the hardcoded messages to the MCM script at least.

Do you want me to put ur translation on the file page?

[CGi]

11 minutes ago, Lozeak said:

Do you want me to put ur translation on the file page?

You can do with it as you see fit, it's your mod afterall.

But putting it there would prevent it from getting burried.

[quantumrex]

I really like this mod, but playing it mostly makes me want to avoid using followers at all... I have a few suggestions (if someone hasn't already posted these):

 

 

I miss having the ability to use my followers as pack-mules. Would it be possible to add in some way to give them items?

• It would make sense that their debt could scale based on the weight of items they're holding.
• If they aren't paid, maybe I don't get my loot back? Once enslavement happens it's gone forever?
• Having them accept items as a way to pay debt seems too much like cheating (insert summon-able merchant mod here).
• I would suggest using a separate container from their inventory, so that storing DD items won't equip them on your follower (EFF / Convenient Horses do this).
• If they're holding a huge number of items, or a few very heavy ones, my debt would scale too quickly to ever be payable... I'm not sure if that's a bad thing considering the purpose of this mod, but maybe a weight cap would help with balance/immersion.

 

Followers with quests are suddenly charging me money to do their dirty work (Amorous Adventures, etc.)... Makes it very strange when they're forced to follow you for quest objectives.

• Would it be possible to add certain followers to an exempt list? Something MCM based?
• Would it be possible to establish positive credit? Pay the follower ahead of their debt requirements, to prevent their dialogue restrictions?

 

 

I've noticed the "Nice to meet you" greeting happens within minutes of getting a follower, and even though my debt is 0 their dialog is changed. It seems like the dialog should only change when I actually have debt. I'm not sure how that would affect removing devices or borrowing money; Those would absolutely make sense to be included before the change.

 

 

Anyway, keep up the good work!

 

[Reesewow]

17 minutes ago, quantumrex said:

I really like this mod, but playing it mostly makes me want to avoid using followers at all... I have a few suggestions (if someone hasn't already posted these):

 

 

I miss having the ability to use my followers as pack-mules. Would it be possible to add in some way to give them items?

• It would make sense that their debt could scale based on the weight of items they're holding.
• If they aren't paid, maybe I don't get my loot back? Once enslavement happens it's gone forever?
• Having them accept items as a way to pay debt seems too much like cheating (insert summon-able merchant mod here).
• I would suggest using a separate container from their inventory, so that storing DD items won't equip them on your follower (EFF / Convenient Horses do this).
• If they're holding a huge number of items, or a few very heavy ones, my debt would scale too quickly to ever be payable... I'm not sure if that's a bad thing considering the purpose of this mod, but maybe a weight cap would help with balance/immersion.

 

Followers with quests are suddenly charging me money to do their dirty work (Amorous Adventures, etc.)... Makes it very strange when they're forced to follow you for quest objectives.

• Would it be possible to add certain followers to an exempt list? Something MCM based?
• Would it be possible to establish positive credit? Pay the follower ahead of their debt requirements, to prevent their dialogue restrictions?

 

 

I've noticed the "Nice to meet you" greeting happens within minutes of getting a follower, and even though my debt is 0 their dialog is changed. It seems like the dialog should only change when I actually have debt. I'm not sure how that would affect removing devices or borrowing money; Those would absolutely make sense to be included before the change.

 

 

Anyway, keep up the good work!

 

 

A lot of this is doable already in the mod - in fact I personally play the mod in a way that exactly fits what it sounds like you want:

 

Pack Mule

 

- in the debug menu turn off "Custom/Quest dialogue debug" option. 

 

This will mean that running Devious Followers does *not* block regular follower interactions like inventory access or commanding them.  I personally don't want to have to pay my follower each time I want to have them hold some items, so this works well for me.  You don't actually miss out on anything as far as I can tell - all the Devious Follower dialogues will be there along with your regular follower commands, and you shouldn't be able to dismiss them without paying them off.  It also means if you have custom followers with stuff like combat aggression controls ect you will have access to that at all times.

 

The idea of the follower charging extra for pack mule duties is interesting however.

 

 

Followers breaking immersion by charging you when you "help" them on a quest

 

- again in the debug menu, turn off "Mod Enabled/Paused" option when you feel that a follower charging you doesn't make sense.  

 

There is no reasonable way for the mod to know if you want a follower to be "devious" ahead of time, and each player is different.  Some would only want mercenaries to charge, while other players want all followers, including custom ones, to charge.  The best way to fix this is to manually turn the mod off if you plan to do stuff like Amorous Adventures quests, or Serana stuff ect and don't want Devious Followers breaking immersion by having them charge you money for helping them out. 

 

For instance I pause the mod when running some of the Interesting NPC quests, because that mod likes to dynamically add and remove followers as you complete quests and a Devous Follower doesn't fit well with it, but I will keep it on if I just have some of that mod's followers with me for regular adventuring.

[Lupine00]

With regard to translation. The ESP-ESM Translator can translate text in scripts, but you have to be very careful about saving your translation afterwards, though the data at risk is your translator database, not the integrity of the mod.

As for centralising all text data in one mod, it's ultimately better, but I'd have to reapply all my stuff, as would anyone who translated scripts to German etc.

 

 

Returning to my problems with item removal. It was obvious enough that some items cannot be removed by design, and piercings seem to be one of them.

 

However, I believe there may be a bug. If you have any unremovable item on you, the dialogue simply presents the This is how it works... text and pop-up, and loops back to the main topic list.

 

In my experience, wearing a piercing was enough to make the follower unable to remove anything, and just produce the introductory dialogue.

 

I haven't looked at the code to confirm this is a real diagnosis, but it seems fairly consistent in my game. Removal works as long as every single item you're wearing is removable, and doesn't, if they aren't. Possibly, "heavy bondage", is tested differently, and if you have that, it works despite other blockers. I haven't properly confirmed this last part, it was just a one-time observation.

 

However, if a follower can't remove any items, they should probably...

(a) recognise there are items there they can't deal with, and say so,

(b) still consider the explanation as read, and not keep re-presenting it.

 

I know the mod is set up so that (a) is intended to happen for quest/cursed items, but it should also work for ordinary items that are simply tricky, like high-security items, custom items, and piercings.

[CGi]

26 minutes ago, Lupine00 said:

With regard to translation. The ESP-ESM Translator can translate text in scripts, but you have to be very careful about saving your translation afterwards, though the data at risk is your translator database, not the integrity of the mod.

As for centralising all text data in one mod, it's ultimately better, but I'd have to reapply all my stuff, as would anyone who translated scripts to German etc.

Translating the scripts directly is ineffective and SKSE translations cut down on string length what helps the save game.
Not to forget that scripts that are localized this way support all vanilla languages without forking the script.

 

Downside: The mod other only sees the iD's in the script and has to port new strings into the SKSE translation file every time.

[Lupine00]

Another idea for the mod...

 

Make it so it costs extra to dismiss followers away from their home location.

 

You can pick up a follower at the College of Winterhold and drag them across the world to Markarth. 

Then you can pay them off at the normal rate, and they have to walk home to Winterhold at their own expense!

 

That's not very devious!

 

I think it would be a nice extra "trap" if the player had to get followers home, or close to their home, before dismissing them.

 

Currently, you can pay off your follower anywhere, do the fast travels, and then pick them up again when you're done. Player savings!

 

It just feels too easy to avoid a situation where you would run up a big debt right now.

Obviously, if I want, I can always avoid debt. I could just hit Pause, but that's not playing the game, while simply releasing a follower is fully immersive, just too easy.

 

 

If the follower added a penalty to the discharge rate, based on how far away from home they are, you'd have to take the follower home to get rid of them, possibly running up more debts on the way. Follower profit!

 

e.g.

PC: I'd like to pay you.

Follower: Of course, how much do you want to pay:

> [Pay 100]

> [Pay 300]

> [Pay 500]

> [Clear debt - follower may be dismissable]

> [Pay 1000

 

Player selects Clear debt...

 

Player selects It's time for us to part ways...

Follower: Thanks. But you can't expect me to get home from here. I need another 1725 gold for the journey.

> I can't afford that right now.

> Here's some money to get you home. [Pay 1725 and dismiss follower]

 

Player selects Pay travel allowance...

Follower: Thanks partner. If you need me again, you know where to find me.

 

 

In this new regime, you have to be outside to dismiss the follower. It saves having to work out where interiors are. If you already have a solution for that, then bonus. If the player doesn't tick this option, then they can still dismiss in interiors. Small worlds (cities etc) may be a special case worth handling.

 

If you know the player home location - which is either the player home, or a hard-coded hiring location (for certain followers), if the distance is below a threshold (probably the size of a single cell diagonal), no charge, otherwise price is proportional to distance over that threshold, so it scales up from the point you start being charged.

[xboronx]

Untill now i played as merchant/whore/smith, but i have advanced enough to go adventuring. Since i never played much with a follower before i have some questions about which combat defeat/slavery mods work best with this mod in case i lose.

 

I have installed SD+, Devious Cidna, Defeat, Slaverun Reloaded and Deviously Enslaved.

 

With Defeat i had the same issue as a fellow member posted that either my follower gets constantly new debt when Defeat tries to initiate a rapescene or that he interrupts it with the line "Followername is witnessing what happens".

Here's the post i mean:

https://www.loverslab.com/topic/82710-devious-followers-3rd-may-2018/?do=findComment&comment=2228256

 

The other mods i haven't tried yet, but i think they might all lead to problems if they try to enslave your follower too.

 

So anybody tried yet and can share some tips about MCM settings/temporarily disabling the mods while adventuring with a follower because otherwise bad stuff happens?

 

 

[Lupine00]

Another nice feature that would avoid Pause or Reset use, be more immersive, and create unexpected debts...

 

If you really must get rid of an existing follower for a while (e.g. a certain quest is going to inflict a compulsory follower on you) ... currently you have to use Debug menu features.

This also has the bonus for forcing PCs with ready cash into deals despite not having a debt they can't pay.

 

What if... you could do a deal in exchange for the follower taking some "time off"?

 

But... Only when you don't have any existing deals, and your willpower is high.

 

e.g.

 

PC: I need you to take some time off.

Follower: That's a lot of trouble for me, but I'm prepared to make a deal.

PC: Alright, let's make a deal for time off.

Follower: How long do you want?

 

PC is offered a dialogue with times from 1 day, 3 days, 5 days, a week, and selects three days.

 

Follower: Alright, we'll make a deal for time off, and I'm going to add 3000 gold debt.

 

(The amount varies with length of time off, it's set to 1000 per day in this example).

 

Follower then presents the make a deal dialogue, and the player gets some consequence game, such as Slut or Corset.

If the player refuses to deal, they keep the debt from above, but the follower does not go on a break.

 

Assuming the player takes a deal, the follower is dismissed and goes home.

The pending deal, existing deals, and current debt is tracked in a (single) set of variables.

 

 

After the agreed duration expires, if the player has no follower, the old follower will follow the player into the next inn they enter, and automatically re-enter service.

 

Follower: "I'm glad I found you. It's time for you to pay me back. You haven't forgotten our agreement have you?"

The deals and debts are all imposed on the player.

 

However, at the end of the duration, if the player has some other follower still in tow, the vacationing follower can't return. As long as they're blocked they'll add debt, and once they've hit the failure threshold of debt, they'll add deals. Also, the current follower will never agree to taking a break, so only one copy of stored states is needed.

 

After a maximum of another week, the angry follower shows up anyway, same method as before, and demands the player make good on their debt.

The old follower transacts some scene dialogue with the vacationing follower, and they agree to transfer the debt.

The old follower is paid off and leaves again, while the PC's current follower adds all the accumulated debt and deals from the old follower. All at once. 

This debt will probably be enormous.

 

If not in endless mode, the debt is capped after application, items sale etc, so it doesn't push you over the "follower deserts you" threshold.

However, deal levels are added together, and days remaining added together.

 

Oh dear. Poor PC. Everything you own got sold to Belethor, and you got enslaved by your follower.

 

That will teach you not to mess your old follower around!