Devious Devices

[Elsidia]

50 minutes ago, Mistah F said:

I'm not sure if it's one or the other instead of both that have to be installed, that's the one thing I didn't test for.

Both MCM are conflicting for sure. I use old DCW without MCM mod and DD 2.0 RC8 and DD MCM works fine. So i recommend remove DCW custom mod, what add MCM

[Mistah F]

3 hours ago, Elsidia said:

Both MCM are conflicting for sure. I use old DCW without MCM mod and DD 2.0 RC8 and DD MCM works fine. So i recommend remove DCW custom mod, what add MCM

You're not following.

Installing Deviously Cursed Wasteland AND its MCM alongside Devious Devices 2.0 RC8 FIXES THE PROBLEM with RC8's menu options. I explicitly said that multiple times and ways in my previous two posts.

Are you even reading my posts?

[RebelDragon]

On 3/27/2023 at 2:44 PM, Enlightnd said:

Your first line even more confirms the issues I'm having is exactly this bug, as the starting corpse when crossing the bridge out of Sanctuary Hills is the first corpse that shows up like that. When you loot it without a modifier mod for raiders, it renders the naked body correctly, but when you do have a mod that applies shapes and tattoos to raiders, the body will be invisible most of the time.

 

Then the body when you're almost at the Red Rocket (dunno if it's a DD placement or from one of the mods that uses DD gear like the one that starts the Jack the Belter quest, but that body is equiped with a full set of DD gear), that body has the same issues.

 

So, seems I need to look into tweaking my OCBP presets.

Guess the issue coming up harder with Fusion Girl than CBBE is because on CBBE I didn't bother even trying to get body physics to work with nuances like different behaviors with/without body armor, because it was so finicky to get any physics to work with it to begin with.

 

As info for everyone, I was having a similar issue with the body being invisible sometimes and then for some reason it would show up again. I kept tinkering with my install till I figured out that if I load up all my mods on a fresh save EXCEPT for DD, save and logout, then enable DD and log back in, magically the body appears. I have no idea why, but if it helps someone figure it out, great. I had THOUGHT that it was just a plugin/load order, but by moving it down to dead last, made no difference. I had to completely disable DD. Create a save. Then turn on DD and let it load the first time. Repeated it multiple times for testing and confirmed this was my particular issue. Hopefully someone smarter than me can make sense of this.

 

EDIT: So now after playing a little while in Sanctuary and sleeping, body is invisible again when I crossed the bridge. I tried logging out and resorting plugins, but that made no difference.

Edited May 20, 2023 by RebelDragon

[Elsidia]

11 hours ago, Mistah F said:

You're not following.

You too. I said - DD 2.0 RC8 MCM works without any DCW MCM addons. Anyway you download a fixes for that in that post and update MCM?

From the same download post.

So i made video for prof

MY DCW is without MCM and in video i use only DD 2.0 RC8 MCM.

My modlist:

Spoiler

0  0     Fallout4.esm
  1  1     DLCRobot.esm
  2  2     DLCworkshop01.esm
  3  3     DLCCoast.esm
  4  4     DLCworkshop02.esm
  5  5     DLCworkshop03.esm
  6  6     DLCNukaWorld.esm
  7  7     TortureDevices.esm
  8  8     Devious Devices.esm
  9  9     AAF.esm
254 FE   0 Devious Devices Item Remover.esp
254 FE   1 FO4HHS_AAF.esp
 10  a     Deviously Cursed Wasteland.esp
 11  b     HHFootsteps.esp
 12  c     Devious Devices Addon - High Heels Sound.esp
254 FE   2 DD_hider_addon.esp
 13  d     del.esp
 14  e     AAF_debug_on.esp
 15  f     LooksMenu.esp
 16 10     CBBE.esp

Warning! In video are spoilers from DD 2.0 CE9 (temporally name) and MCM is changed, but works the same as original MCM!!!!

If you don't want see those, not open a video!

 

Video size 152 mb - resolution 1920x1080.

Uploaded on mega. If need can upload on other service (except youtube as it breaks youtube rules)

https://mega.nz/file/lzYDCZKD#OBhFe2tFS1KxOJFXMOY7N-MHtxW1nCqU9_oONqzewZc

 

[izzyknows]

14 hours ago, Mistah F said:

Installing Deviously Cursed Wasteland AND its MCM alongside Devious Devices 2.0 RC8 FIXES THE PROBLEM with RC8's menu options.

That's because you don't have RC8 installed correctly.

Completely remove, not just disable, everything DD related, ie: DD, DCW and any patches and or mods, then install only RC8, build the outfits, start a new game and have fun.

RC8 has several of the patches/fixes already in it, so it's critical not to use any of the old DD patches.

 

Now if you want to use DCW don't use any MCM patches as they are not updated to work with RC8 and can cause issues. Besides bat commands are waaay faster. LOL

 

Roggs Devious Device Manager still works fine with RC8, but doesn't cover the newly added devices. Which is only a few items and very rarely or never seen organically in game.

[lee3310]

@Elsidia Is there a better way to tell if a slot is occupied or not other than F4SE function GetWornItem() ? cause the "Armor Slot Precedence" is problematic in my situation: i want to check if "Headband" slot is occupied or not since it's the one used by "DD_Hood_Balloon_Latex" for exemple but if "hair long"/"hair Top" are also occupied, it will return "None".

Edited May 21, 2023 by lee3310

[vaultbait]

42 minutes ago, lee3310 said:

@Elsidia Is there a better way to tell if a slot i occupied or not other than F4SE function GetWornItem() ? cause the "Armor Slot Precedence" is problematic in my situation: i want to check if "Headband" slot is occupied or not since it's the one used by "DD_Hood_Balloon_Latex" for exemple but if "hair long"/"hair Top" are also occupied, it will return "None".

 

The only effective way I'm aware of in pure script is to use F4SE's GetWornItem() since there's no native function equivalent for the WornCoversBipedSlot condition function in the CK. However, if you have a plugin, you could set up a conditional effect and then check it from your script as a proxy. Since there's only one slot you care about, that probably wouldn't be much work at all.

[Elsidia]

1 hour ago, lee3310 said:

DD_Hood_Balloon_Latex" for exemple but if "hair long"/"hair Top" are also occupied, it will return "None".

I don't heard about it.

Can you give a example? What you testing and what returned.

Hairs not armor so possibly it returns none

If need check DD items there is keywords.

[lee3310]

38 minutes ago, vaultbait said:

 

The only effective way I'm aware of in pure script is to use F4SE's GetWornItem() since there's no native function equivalent for the WornCoversBipedSlot condition function in the CK. However, if you have a plugin, you could set up a conditional effect and then check it from your script as a proxy. Since there's only one slot you care about, that probably wouldn't be much work at all.

GetWornItem() is not flexible, you can't for exemple check if multiple slots are covered or not (hair top, eyes, mouth). Your approche (MGEF) is a good solution. I wish the occupied flag was accessible in script.

[lee3310]

8 minutes ago, Elsidia said:

I don't heard about it.

Can you give a example? What you testing and what returned.

Hairs not armor so possibly it returns none

If need check DD items there is keywords.

I want to check vanilla armors too, for exemple "Clothes_RaiderMod_Hood1" that covers "hair, headband, eyes, mouth" and get the same result (true).
For that i think i'll have to edit DD_Hood_MaskofShame_AA for exemple and add "hair top" as occupied slot because of this clause:
 

Quote

An Armor form only properly exists on the highest slot it covers, lower slots will return none.

 

Edited May 21, 2023 by lee3310

[vaultbait]

50 minutes ago, lee3310 said:

GetWornItem() is not flexible, you can't for exemple check if multiple slots are covered or not (hair top, eyes, mouth).

 

You have to use GetSlotMask() on the returned WornItem's Item attribute and then use Utility.LogicalAnd() to compare against a mask of the slots you care about. It's definitely not an example of user-friendly program flow.

 

50 minutes ago, lee3310 said:

Your approche (MGEF) is a good solution. I wish the occupied flag was accessible in script.

 

Yeah, I've considered asking the F4SE author to implement a native WornCoversBipedSlot() function (or look into proposing the patch myself, but ENOTIME).

Edited May 21, 2023 by vaultbait

[Elsidia]

33 minutes ago, vaultbait said:

GetSlotMask()

Here is wikipedia about this operand?

[vaultbait]

4 minutes ago, Elsidia said:

Here is wikipedia about this operand?

 

https://www.creationkit.com/index.php?title=GetSlotMask_-_Armor

 

The same function from SKSE is available in F4SE but isn't covered in the Fallout4 sub-wiki on creationkit.com.

Edited May 21, 2023 by vaultbait

[lee3310]

1 hour ago, vaultbait said:

 

https://www.creationkit.com/index.php?title=GetSlotMask_-_Armor

 

The same function from SKSE is available in F4SE but isn't covered in the Fallout4 sub-wiki on creationkit.com.

This would be an even better solution than MGEF if it returns an int[] of slot index. I don't even know what a slot mask is?. 

Edited May 21, 2023 by lee3310

[vaultbait]

9 minutes ago, lee3310 said:

This would be an even better solution than MGEF if it returns an int[] of slot index. I don't even know what a slot mask is?. 

 

It's a bitmask where each biped slot represents a bit in the mask. If you're unfamiliar with bitwise operations, you'll have a bit of reading to do. Anyone who started to learn computer programming before 1980 should be fine though, it's just like riding one of those antique bicycles while sporting a handlebar mustache.

[Anonym0us2DF1CD]

On 5/18/2023 at 6:19 PM, izzyknows said:

You need RC8 which fixes that among other things.

Even with RC8, the "mouths moving through gags" glitch still happens, and gagged companions will still comment

[izzyknows]

2 hours ago, Anonym0us2DF1CD said:

Even with RC8, the "mouths moving through gags" glitch still happens, and gagged companions will still comment

That's because you do not put DD items companions. Just don't do it.

 

There is a grace period after the initial mmm... dialogue for the PC, then you can talk normal for a bit. Some mods "can" interfere with it though.

[lee3310]

7 hours ago, vaultbait said:

Yeah, I've considered asking the F4SE author to implement a native WornCoversBipedSlot() function (or look into proposing the patch myself, but ENOTIME).

Yesterday, i asked SUP for this function (very helpful):
 

Faction[] Function GetAllActorFactions(ObjectReference MyRef) global native

 

so you can ask him for "WornCoversBipedSlot()" and explain it better than me. Or we can ask Snapdragon but he probably has his hands full with an ambitious project atm.

Edited May 22, 2023 by lee3310

[Anonym0us2DF1CD]

8 hours ago, izzyknows said:

That's because you do not put DD items companions. Just don't do it.

 

There is a grace period after the initial mmm... dialogue for the PC, then you can talk normal for a bit. Some mods "can" interfere with it though.

I guess DD for companions is still bugged?
Hopefully in RC9 they finally fix this

[izzyknows]

40 minutes ago, Anonym0us2DF1CD said:

I guess DD for companions is still bugged?
Hopefully in RC9 they finally fix this

It's not an easy task by any means, or it would have been fixed long ago. The way Bugthesda handles the AI and equipped items for NPC's is interesting but very fragile.

Changing the behavior often results in breaking other things, like the game. LOL

[vaultbait]

8 hours ago, lee3310 said:

Yesterday, i asked SUP for this function (very helpful):
 

Faction[] Function GetAllActorFactions(ObjectReference MyRef) global native

 

so you can ask him for "WornCoversBipedSlot()" and explain it better than me. Or we can ask Snapdragon but he probably has his hands full with an ambitious project atm.

 

There's also Baka Framework and LLFP as optional places to get it added, but at the end of the day I'm not sure I want a mod to have to depend on half a dozen different F4SE plugins that extend the native function space; user support quickly becomes a nightmare.

 

I'm currently maintaining a mod that uses some functions from SUP F4SE, because one of its major dependencies had already made the decision to rely on SUP F4SE for some things, and the most common user mistake is failing to install SUP F4SE even though it's linked and mentioned in big bold lettering in the mod description. The way I finally put an end to it was to add a startup routine which checks whether SUP F4SE is present and throws up an informative messagebox if it's not found. But in order to do that, I had to make sure that the script where it's checked doesn't actually use any functions from SUP F4SE so that the interpreter doesn't immediately toss out the entire script (I should move that checker to a dedicated quest form/script actually, so I don't accidentally break it later... adding that on the to do list backlog).

Edited May 22, 2023 by vaultbait

[lee3310]

3 hours ago, vaultbait said:

 

There's also Baka Framework and LLFP as optional places to get it added, but at the end of the day I'm not sure I want a mod to have to depend on half a dozen different F4SE plugins that extend the native function space; user support quickly becomes a nightmare.

 

I'm currently maintaining a mod that uses some functions from SUP F4SE, because one of its major dependencies had already made the decision to rely on SUP F4SE for some things, and the most common user mistake is failing to install SUP F4SE even though it's linked and mentioned in big bold lettering in the mod description. The way I finally put an end to it was to add a startup routine which checks whether SUP F4SE is present and throws up an informative messagebox if it's not found. But in order to do that, I had to make sure that the script where it's checked doesn't actually use any functions from SUP F4SE so that the interpreter doesn't immediately toss out the entire script (I should move that checker to a dedicated quest form/script actually, so I don't accidentally break it later... adding that on the to do list backlog).

We all wish that everything was part of F4SE but what can you do, i also don't like having multiple dependencies but in order to paly modded FO4 you should be able to follow some simple installing steps. 

[Elsidia]

21 hours ago, Anonym0us2DF1CD said:

Hopefully in RC9 they finally fix this

Behaviours mostly are in torture devices and i not touch it. I heard that in latest version is some fixes of it. NPC support still not supported. Also DD companions have own script so gagged dialogue is always skipped and i not plan to fix it. As for NPC in CE9 is implemented: easy manipulators with restraints (you can equip many and unequip many restraints in one time without problems - if you do it on free NPC then there will be problems with visual update and if you equip and unequip in same moment also if trigger some device equip restrictions there can be heavy script running). Fixed broken animations and td spells. No more NPC or player stuck on wrong animation. If stil it done for NPC you need equip or uneqip any armor piece and it will rework all animations. As for player... well i never stuck into wrong animation so can't say. In theory for player you need equip or unequip some restraint with spells. As for player spells work different as on NPC. Fixed hang up save if you equip restraints on NPC or got it by script. Added silent equip system by scripts (no more menus when you are in chest or pipboy if are running equip script) Fixed device conflict notifications if equip by script - so no more bug in DCW blank screen, now notifications is pushed into papyrus. Added NPC support for unequip device by keyword, function works slower with big inventory and faster if inventory is always empty.  Made some performance upgrade, but scripts are more heavy as before, fixed all old DD equip bugs and variables reset.

Edited May 23, 2023 by Elsidia

[Mistah F]

On 5/21/2023 at 5:28 AM, Elsidia said:

You too. I said - DD 2.0 RC8 MCM works without any DCW MCM addons. Anyway you download a fixes for that in that post and update MCM?

From the same download post.

So i made video for prof

MY DCW is without MCM and in video i use only DD 2.0 RC8 MCM.

My modlist:

  Reveal hidden contents

0  0     Fallout4.esm
  1  1     DLCRobot.esm
  2  2     DLCworkshop01.esm
  3  3     DLCCoast.esm
  4  4     DLCworkshop02.esm
  5  5     DLCworkshop03.esm
  6  6     DLCNukaWorld.esm
  7  7     TortureDevices.esm
  8  8     Devious Devices.esm
  9  9     AAF.esm
254 FE   0 Devious Devices Item Remover.esp
254 FE   1 FO4HHS_AAF.esp
 10  a     Deviously Cursed Wasteland.esp
 11  b     HHFootsteps.esp
 12  c     Devious Devices Addon - High Heels Sound.esp
254 FE   2 DD_hider_addon.esp
 13  d     del.esp
 14  e     AAF_debug_on.esp
 15  f     LooksMenu.esp
 16 10     CBBE.esp

Warning! In video are spoilers from DD 2.0 CE9 (temporally name) and MCM is changed, but works the same as original MCM!!!!

If you don't want see those, not open a video!

 

Video size 152 mb - resolution 1920x1080.

Uploaded on mega. If need can upload on other service (except youtube as it breaks youtube rules)

https://mega.nz/file/lzYDCZKD#OBhFe2tFS1KxOJFXMOY7N-MHtxW1nCqU9_oONqzewZc

 

I meant that you didn't need to continue to help me fix anything with Deviously Cursed Wasteland and its MCM, because as I already said everything is working now with both installed. I didn't at all doubt it could work without the MCM addon (although I guess that's not what I actually said ).

But I've been mistaken about either of those plugins fixing the problem. After Izzy's post I realized I've never tried Devious Devices without either cursed loot mod and when I did, it worked just as well as it does with DCW + MCM installed. But when I have DD Cursed Enchantings installed instead, that's when all the functions I've listed stop working. DCW isn't fixing RC8, DDCE is breaking it.


And that's infuriating, because I almost immediately asked if that was possibly the case and you said "probably not":

On 5/9/2023 at 6:33 PM, Mistah F said:

This doesn't appear to be true. I keep getting up to 9 hours on 9 difficulty, not once has it been an hour.

I have Cursed DD Enchantings installed, does that override this?

 

On 5/10/2023 at 1:19 AM, Elsidia said:

In difficulty 9 is one hour. It build into scripts and cursed enchantments not change a scripts so probably not. You sure that difficulty is 9, not 0? Also difficulty not affect to already equipped items need fresh equip after change difficulty.

9 hours sound like you have difficulty 0, what is most harder version.

 

[Elsidia]

1 hour ago, Mistah F said:

But when I have DD Cursed Enchantings installed instead,

Yes that's a cause as this mod replaces spells, but DD 2.0 RC8 have modified spells. so there is conflict. Still not patch from that mod.