Deviously Enslaved Continued [2019-11-11]

[Verstort]

12 hours ago, RegisteredUser said:

All in all, the situation is largely the same as before. Faendal does find containers, and does approach me with items. It feels quite unreliable, though that might be only because I'm not sure what the actual condition is for a follower to find a container, and which containers are valid. All I know is that I walked through Riverwood opening every barrel in town, and Faendal found nothing. Then I went into Embershard Mine, and fought my way through to the central room (the one that's behind a locked cage door). Faendal did successfully pick up the one single barrel on the way between the mine entrance and that room. Once in the room, I opened at least six sacks, several barrels, and one ornate chest. And Faendal... discovered no new containers. Then I fast traveled to Crystaldrift Cave, which has something like one chest, two barrels and a sack in all of its entirety... and he discovered 3 containers. Found one item (because I had the chance intentionally set ridiculously high for testing purposes) and rolled for a second item but missed the roll.

 

Later, I took Inigo into Silverdrift Lair, where I looted several barrels, a locked chest, and several urns. He discovered nothing.

 

Sex approach still works perfectly fine on both Inigo and Faendal, as does friendly fire detection and them complaining about it.

 

Follower IDs are correct in the crdePlayerMonitor readout.

 

At this point, I can see one of two possibilities: Either Inigo is just not 100% compatible, OR my install is not working properly (might explain the issues with Faendal).

 

I've attached the Papyrus log of these events. There are some other error messages which may or may not have something to do with it, for example something about Factions. Are Factions relevant for this feature to work?

Papyrus.0.log

The chance your follower finds an item is not evaulated at the container, I felt that kind of system ignored the possibility that the follower found something but got distracted, or was busy healing, focused on the dungeon, ect. I wanted followers to be able to come up to you later for reasons, also its harder on the game engine, doing so much code per container. I might add a quick check at container opening, but since its the player opening the container later, but for now the roll to decide if the follower found something is on the same loop that rolls if NPCs should attack the player.

 

The chance of finding an item is a power function of containers found since last item found, where X axis is containers, and Y is chance, such that there is a sloping line between (0,0) and (Max containers, Max Chance), after which the function flatlines on Max Chance. How the line slopes between these points is determined by the exponent, where EXP of 1 is a straight line, and as the exponent increases the line curves to the floor, such that you need more containers before getting an acceptable chance of finding something. This was the most freedom I could give users with limited math background on my part.

 

 

 

I need to update the formula, it was designed before I updated the mod so it could detect if the player actually found items in a chest that the follower could find too, which allows us to skip some of the randomness of the rolling. I think this randomness is throwing you off for the most part. Your log makes it look like the code is working and checking every container you visit. I think, but I wouldn't mind you proving me wrong, that the containers missed by your follower was because there is a lag, we update follower containers discovered on the loop, which delays when means the container count per follower doesn't get updated in real time.

 

Another bug, if followers are interrupted before they can reach you, they drop the item the found. That can reduce the frequency you get approached without you noticing.

12 hours ago, RegisteredUser said:

I've attached the Papyrus log of these events. There are some other error messages which may or may not have something to do with it, for example something about Factions. Are Factions relevant for this feature to work?

Papyrus.0.log

No the faction bug is because you didn't save clean between updates and the faction didn't initialize correctly, but it's not used for this feature, its for a different feature I haven't finished so it doesn't hurt anything just fills your log with errors.

 

This however...

[01/16/2018 - 12:22:13PM] [CRDE] Follower chosen randomly is Inigo out of 1
[01/16/2018 - 12:22:16PM] [CRDE] not high enough for sex approach, and the current friendlies aren't followers so no item possible

Would suggest that Inigo wasn't considered a "follower" follower at the time. Since there is no error message, in order to be ignored he has to meet one of these conditions:

 

Hasn't had sex with the player before. AND Does not think the player enjoys being submissive > 0.

Is not in the current follower faction AND is not in the paradise hall following faction.

 

I'm betting its the former, that the player hasn't had sex with them yet. I forgot you can get around this by making the follower think the player enjoys being sub, you can use that as a workaround if you want.

2 hours ago, Targuinius said:

Is there any chance we can get the follower dialogue in more places? Right now it seems like it only works in dungeons, and there is an option in the MCM, however it is greyed out. I tried writing my own patch, but I know jackshit about Papyrus so I couldn't figure out how to get it to compile. Something like Naked Dungeons' way of doing it, where you can choose exactly what types of cells/architectures are viable would be ideal, however, even a toggle for just wilderness or something would be great.

 

Thanks!

Follower dialogue should happen anywhere so long as you have enough containers or your follower is aroused enough.

 

The biggest reason it doesn't happen elsewhere is because there are other NPCs about, the follower should only approach the player when they are alone or in a player house.

 

Getting denied because there are NPCs nearby, when the player looks alone with their follower, is mainly because I set the NPC search distance to 4096 units, which is quite a bit. I made it long to search for as many NPCs as possible for attacks, but the number gets re-used for NPC check on follower interaction as well, if you lower it to a more reasonable distance, like 1000, you'll get fewer false possitives for nearby NPCs.

 

If by option in the MCM that is greyed out, you mean the dungeons only feature, that feature was going to limit item finding in dungeons only, so that if the player had not yet entered a dungeon yet, the follower could not find items until they did. That was not a feature meant to allow you to get more approaches.

 

If debugging is on, you can open console to see what reasons the mod gives for followers not approaching, or at least you if you see NPCs being listed then you are too close to be considered safe.

 

There are a few cases where NPCs that would never attack you are not counted, and your follower can approach around those. I need to go back and add a few cases to that inclusion list since off my head, slave NPCs tied up in furniture and armbinders aren't considered safe, there's probably more I should add.

 

Compiling DEC's papyrus scripts is annoying because you need the source files for many soft dependency mods, some of which comes free some of which is locked up in BSA files where the stupid compiler doesn't look for them. See this post for info: https://www.loverslab.com/topic/54135-deviously-enslaved-continued-2017-12-26/?do=findComment&comment=1359904

[Guest]

Ah, thanks.

 

What I edited was wrong in that case anyway, I already had a feeling it wasn't, because it seemed like it didn't fully make sense. (I looked at some stuff in crdefollowermonitorscript.psc and crdefollowerscript.psc, where there was something about LocType*, which seemed like the only place that made sense to me, the way I thought it worked.)

 

Also, thanks for the guide, I like tweaking with things, and now I might actually be able to do that

[RegisteredUser]

Wow, thanks for the detailed response!

 

12 hours ago, Verstort said:

The chance your follower finds an item is not evaulated at the container, I felt that kind of system ignored the possibility that the follower found something but got distracted, or was busy healing, focused on the dungeon, ect. I wanted followers to be able to come up to you later for reasons, also its harder on the game engine, doing so much code per container. I might add a quick check at container opening, but since its the player opening the container later, but for now the roll to decide if the follower found something is on the same loop that rolls if NPCs should attack the player.

Ah, I understood that wrong, then. Probably the config option "can find items the player missed" made me think that in order for a follower to discover a container in the first place, the player has to open it first. But it rather sounds like the follower checks all containers in a certain radius (how big?) around them whenever the periodic check runs, and the entry for "containers discovered" in the MCM menu is the number of times the item finding roll failed since the last successful find?

 

Perhaps this explains some of the extreme randomness I have experienced. You see, I have configured the periodic check to the maximum value of 60 seconds because I only want a few approaches and my game has a lot of mods so I wanted to minimize the script load. But if it's like this, the follower probably misses a huge amount of containers because the check runs so rarely that I just walk past them without them getting picked up.

 

Another thing that might explain things is what you mentioned in reply to Targultoon... other NPCs nearby. When I was in Crystaldrift cave and got successful discoveries, I had cleared the place of all life (not hard, since it's a single room with a few beasts). Meanwhile, when I was in Embershard Mine and wondering why Faendal wasn't picking up the huge treasure room full of containers, there were still bandits alive further in. So I'm assuming that hostile NPCs and beasts also stop the follower dialogue from triggering?

 

...How big is an area of "4096" anyway? Would that cover for example all of Riverwood if I stood in the center?

 

12 hours ago, Verstort said:

The chance of finding an item is a power function of containers found since last item found, where X axis is containers, and Y is chance, such that there is a sloping line between (0,0) and (Max containers, Max Chance), after which the function flatlines on Max Chance. (...)

You may be surprised, but the math part was actually the most easy to grasp part of this for me.

 

In order to test the item finding machenic, I set the MCM to maximum chance 100, maximum containers 2, and slope 1 (linear). That way followers would have a 50% chance of discovery on the first container, and a guaranteed after that. Which would allow me to check precisely if and when containers were found, because I would get the near instant reaction from the follower.

 

12 hours ago, Verstort said:

This however...

[01/16/2018 - 12:22:13PM] [CRDE] Follower chosen randomly is Inigo out of 1
[01/16/2018 - 12:22:16PM] [CRDE] not high enough for sex approach, and the current friendlies aren't followers so no item possible

Would suggest that Inigo wasn't considered a "follower" follower at the time. Since there is no error message, in order to be ignored he has to meet one of these conditions:

 

Hasn't had sex with the player before. AND Does not think the player enjoys being submissive > 0.

Is not in the current follower faction AND is not in the paradise hall following faction.

 

I'm betting its the former, that the player hasn't had sex with them yet. I forgot you can get around this by making the follower think the player enjoys being sub, you can use that as a workaround if you want.

I'm actually betting it is the latter.

 

Why? Because Inigo has (by now) a 11 in the "thinks player is submissive" stat, which he gained all by himself without me having to set it. From, among other things, him approaching me for sex on his own just fine. Even if that didn't also have the caveat that it only triggers after having sex at least once, it would definitely have fulfilled the condition for item finding several times over by now.

 

No, I think he's missing factions. After some research, I came across this blurb on the Nexus page for Inigo, under upgrade instructions from earlier versions: "Step 1 is the critical part. He is completely removed from the standard game factions, if other mods (including Vilja) are still trying to affect him then they are going to get confused when he's no longer in those factions."

 

Which at first I took as meaning "upgrading resets his faction associations". And I think that it's still true, but I also think it means even more - that he doesn't come with any factions by default, at all. And likely isn't using factions the same way that vanilla followers do.

 

Now I wonder if I should do something like "addtofaction 0005C84E 0" in the console to force him into the CurrentFollowerFaction. It might break his AI if he's using a completely custom, faction-less follower system. Well, I guess trying doesn't hurt...

[RegisteredUser]

Alright, so I have been testing.

 

I have to add Inigo to the faction everytime I (re)load the game, and it creates an additional dialogue option about combat behavior in his dialogue menu that I must never ever touch... but other than that, it appears to be working! He now successfully discovers containers and finds items in them. And after playing with the MCM settings and observing the results in the console, I now understand much better what actually goes on behind the scenes.

 

I was positively surprised by the large variety of different lines and possible outcomes in the dialogue.

 

 

A few things that struck me, though:

 

One, I've had multiple situations in which the containers discovered stat didn't get reset to zero at the end of the dialogue because the follower wasn't able to put something he found on me. And it just makes the follower reroll a new item in the next pass and approach again. When he fails repeatedly, that can get pretty silly! Can I assume that this is a bug, or are there actually cases where it is supposed to happen?

 

The weirdest of these situations went as follows: the console said that a zad_DeviousCollar was rolled. I was already wearing a collar. When choosing "what do you have in mind" in the dialogue, the follower went "shut up for a moment while I set this up" and proceeded to fit me with a chastity belt and a plug, a piercing (which I assume was randomly added by the config setting for adding piercings when getting belted by this mod), and a gag. None of these had anything to do with the collar roll result... and at the end of all this, the containers discovered amount was not even reset.

 

 

Two, there maybe an extraneous check and/or unintended interaction. At some point I configured the chance for getting nipple piercings together with belts to be 0%. Then later-on, my follower found nipple piercings. But even though he found them as a separate item, there was a warning message in the console that said, paraphrased: "nipple piercings were selected, but the weight for nipple piercings is zero!". The item was added properly in the end, so not a real problem - but it's likely not intended behavior.

 

 

Also, are you open to suggestions for further improvements? Or do you have more than enough left on your plate for the time being?

 

 

[shadowwolf2k7]

@RegisteredUser

i have been using CRDE for a while now, it does take a while for them to actually approach you with and item, but if you set up the follower finds things the player missed. it will be stored, where i dont know, until a new scan is done. then all the items that you have scene and they have picked up they will go through a random roll and then approach you with the item that was chosen. i have noticed that at times they seem to change their minds about bringing an item to you, or there may not be enough items to do a roll with.

 

i have a question for you, do you use Cursed Loot? if so you can turn up the restraints drop chance in that mod to 100% and your follower will find those items, again they will go into a storage to be used later as the roll for an item.

[Verstort]

16 hours ago, RegisteredUser said:

Ah, I understood that wrong, then. Probably the config option "can find items the player missed" made me think that in order for a follower to discover a container in the first place, the player has to open it first. But it rather sounds like the follower checks all containers in a certain radius (how big?) around them whenever the periodic check runs,

Checking all containers in a radius sounds cool, but I'm worried about performance...

 

Might be alright, I'll need to run a test or two. I'd rather not check every container found in a radius of the player ~3 times per 10 seconds. I don't think I can set formlist as unique list but I'll check.

16 hours ago, RegisteredUser said:

and the entry for "containers discovered" in the MCM menu is the number of times the item finding roll failed since the last successful find?

No that's a simple container count that the player has opened, since followers don't naturally go around opening containers it was the best metric I had to track if the player was in an area with stuff the follower could search through, the idea being if you bothered to stop and search, they might have found something too, best I could think of given limits of papyrus set down by Bethesuda

16 hours ago, RegisteredUser said:

...How big is an area of "4096" anyway? Would that cover for example all of Riverwood if I stood in the center?

According to this: https://www.creationkit.com/index.php?title=Unit

 

A game unit is 1.428 cm, or 0.5625". 16 units is 9 inches. 64 game units to a yard. 14,080 units a furlong.

 

4096 is 2^12, and in game units is 32 fathoms.

16 hours ago, RegisteredUser said:

I'm actually betting it is the latter.

 

Why? Because Inigo has (by now) a 11 in the "thinks player is submissive" stat, which he gained all by himself without me having to set it. From, among other things, him approaching me for sex on his own just fine. Even if that didn't also have the caveat that it only triggers after having sex at least once, it would definitely have fulfilled the condition for item finding several times over by now.

 

No, I think he's missing factions. After some research, I came across this blurb on the Nexus page for Inigo, under upgrade instructions from earlier versions: "Step 1 is the critical part. He is completely removed from the standard game factions, if other mods (including Vilja) are still trying to affect him then they are going to get confused when he's no longer in those factions."

 

Which at first I took as meaning "upgrading resets his faction associations". And I think that it's still true, but I also think it means even more - that he doesn't come with any factions by default, at all. And likely isn't using factions the same way that vanilla followers do.

 

Now I wonder if I should do something like "addtofaction 0005C84E 0" in the console to force him into the CurrentFollowerFaction. It might break his AI if he's using a completely custom, faction-less follower system. Well, I guess trying doesn't hurt...

9 hours ago, RegisteredUser said:

Alright, so I have been testing.

 

I have to add Inigo to the faction everytime I (re)load the game, and it creates an additional dialogue option about combat behavior in his dialogue menu that I must never ever touch... but other than that, it appears to be working! He now successfully discovers containers and finds items in them. And after playing with the MCM settings and observing the results in the console, I now understand much better what actually goes on behind the scenes.

 

Hmm... I put in the current follower limit to stop previous followers, who might be in your house, bothering the player for items they found what might have been ages ago. There is no other requirement in DEC or the base game that requires our mod to use that faction, it was just an easy way to keep it to the people recently following you.

 

I could change the code to use any old follower with the CRDE faction and remove current follower, then find some way to put a time stamp on last item container found and if its too old we throw it out.

9 hours ago, RegisteredUser said:

One, I've had multiple situations in which the containers discovered stat didn't get reset to zero at the end of the dialogue because the follower wasn't able to put something he found on me. And it just makes the follower reroll a new item in the next pass and approach again. When he fails repeatedly, that can get pretty silly! Can I assume that this is a bug, or are there actually cases where it is supposed to happen?

You shouldn't get approached to get new items if you are already wearing them, that would would be a bug and if you can be specific about which item and what dialogue you got I can fix it.

 

That said, DEC can roll the same item you are already wearing, but you should either be give the item or they should put it on themselves. It shouldn't try to put a second item on you.

 

Containers counted should get reset to zero before you get approached, actually... I'll see if I can find the cause of that.

9 hours ago, RegisteredUser said:

The weirdest of these situations went as follows: the console said that a zad_DeviousCollar was rolled. I was already wearing a collar. When choosing "what do you have in mind" in the dialogue, the follower went "shut up for a moment while I set this up" and proceeded to fit me with a chastity belt and a plug, a piercing (which I assume was randomly added by the config setting for adding piercings when getting belted by this mod), and a gag. None of these had anything to do with the collar roll result... and at the end of all this, the containers discovered amount was not even reset.

That's special dialogue that ignores the item found, there isn't too much dialogue that does that.

 

But the belt+extra function should have detected that you set piercing to zero and given you a belt without it, I'll check and see if its not working.

 

Edit: Oops, would always give piercing when set to 0, backwards.

Edit 2: That special dialogue didn't take user preferences into account, could have sworn It did..

9 hours ago, RegisteredUser said:

Two, there maybe an extraneous check and/or unintended interaction. At some point I configured the chance for getting nipple piercings together with belts to be 0%. Then later-on, my follower found nipple piercings. But even though he found them as a separate item, there was a warning message in the console that said, paraphrased: "nipple piercings were selected, but the weight for nipple piercings is zero!". The item was added properly in the end, so not a real problem - but it's likely not intended behavior.

 

Also, are you open to suggestions for further improvements? Or do you have more than enough left on your plate for the time being?

I'll check if the code for follower finding items ignores preferences on piercings, but it shouldn't it should just ignore those items normally.

 

I like bug reports, as I can't fix bugs I don't know about. I don't mind suggestions, although I can't guarentee they ever make it out of my todo list.

8 hours ago, shadowwolf2k7 said:

@RegisteredUser

 i have noticed that at times they seem to change their minds about bringing an item to you, or there may not be enough items to do a roll with.

The approach can get canceled for all the same reasons that non-follower approaches can get reset, is that what you're seeing?

 

Lack of items isn't enough to cancel a roll because there is a backup pull-an-item-out-of-thin-air solution for when the follower didn't find any items. Did you mean the roll itself, based on container count, not being high enough to continue?

 

Even if there are items the follower could have found in a container you have already visited, we don't take it as given the follower found it, we still use the random roll to determine if they found something, with only a minor bump in the percent chance of approach.

[shadowwolf2k7]

@Verstort

not exactly. i have had times were i am notified that the follower has found an item, and when i go to talk to them there is no mention of "hey i have found an item"  and the console has ho indication as to what or why it stopped. i do know if they player and/or follower get brought into it will cancel the conversation, but i have had it happen inside of breezehome, where combat usually cant start. i have also noticed that later in the game there is plenty of items for the follower to choose from but early it tends to take longer for them to approach with items, that is what i meant by lack of items. i add followers manually when i get them so i dont have to wait for the first sex scene with them and so i can add in their sub/dom stats for the play through i want with them. which i think speeds up their approach with both the items and the sex conversations.

 

 

on a side note, the newest test version has the trigger on all sex events is blacked out, which is causing every sex scene, even the ones that are set as attacks, any rape ones, to be detected as non attacks.

[Verstort]

2 hours ago, shadowwolf2k7 said:

@Verstort

not exactly. i have had times were i am notified that the follower has found an item, and when i go to talk to them there is no mention of "hey i have found an item"  and the console has ho indication as to what or why it stopped. i do know if they player and/or follower get brought into it will cancel the conversation, but i have had it happen inside of breezehome, where combat usually cant start. i have also noticed that later in the game there is plenty of items for the follower to choose from but early it tends to take longer for them to approach with items, that is what i meant by lack of items. i add followers manually when i get them so i dont have to wait for the first sex scene with them and so i can add in their sub/dom stats for the play through i want with them. which i think speeds up their approach with both the items and the sex conversations.

When an NPC, or follower, approach is active, the DEC loop gets sped up to every 2 seconds and checks if A) too much time as passed, in which we reset, and B) if the player is busy.

 

You should get either a busy explanation in your log or a timeout message, but I agree I have seen two bugs at least: NPCs set to approach, if they are sitting in furniture (alchemy, bench) can sometimes fail to get up and start walking. No idea what causes this, but if you walk too close them they SAY their first lines but don't engage dialogue, this actually stops the attack, if you talk to them nothing happens.

 

I have seen the follower approach stop without giving an output to log. I haven't figured out what causes this though, but it never happens if the player is idle and not doing other stuff, like opening containers/dialogue/walking/activating. Standing still the follower always seems to make it.

2 hours ago, shadowwolf2k7 said:

on a side note, the newest test version has the trigger on all sex events is blacked out, which is causing every sex scene, even the ones that are set as attacks, any rape ones, to be detected as non attacks.

I don't think 1 leads to 2 here.

 

I don't remembering blacking that MCM option out, and it's fixed for the next release, but it should only lock the MCM value from changing through the interface, it doesn't affect how the code views the MCM option..

 

1) That feature doesn't (or at least isn't meant to) do what you describe. It should do the opposite; set all sex from all mods as accceptable for DEC post-sex attack, rather than set all of them as unacceptable for attack.

 

2) If you type "SQV crdeMcm" in console and scroll waaay to the top, you'll see bHookAnySexlabEvent is set false. If you type "SetPQV crdeMCM bHookAnySexlabEvent_var TRUE" then open your MCM it will have changed. The blackout doesn't stop the feature from working only stops the user from changing the value; It's a feature of the interface not the code. You can still set the value and experiment with the difference through console, although in most cases where I greyed options intentionally, nothing will happen because there is no code using that option.

 

If you say you aren't getting post-sex attacks, Then there's an actual bug in the code and the MCM value is unrelated. I'll double check on my end, but what debug output from DEC do you get after sexlab has finished?

[RegisteredUser]

8 hours ago, Verstort said:

But the belt+extra function should have detected that you set piercing to zero and given you a belt without it, I'll check and see if its not working.

 

Edit: Oops, would always give piercing when set to 0, backwards.

Edit 2: That special dialogue didn't take user preferences into account, could have sworn It did..

Actually at the time I did not have the piercing weight set to zero, so I didn't think anything was wrong. I set it to zero afterwards. But if the misunderstanding led to you finding an actual bug, hey, why not!

 

8 hours ago, Verstort said:

I'll check if the code for follower finding items ignores preferences on piercings, but it shouldn't it should just ignore those items normally.

You know, piercings are kind of a special case, because Deviously Enslaved does not normally select them separately. You can only get them from postsex events or NPC interactions if you get belted, and then roll a random chance. The follower finding a belt can also get you pierced that way.

 

However, unlike the rest of the mod, the follower can find nipple piercings as an item on its own, no belting required.

 

If you now go and make the follower obey all user weight settings, then there's a problem, because there's no weight setting for piercings on their own. If you let the piercings-with-belts chance setting block piercings as separate items, then the player can't configure things properly. For example, I intentionally set that chance to zero because I didn't want them to come attached with belts (a belt is bad enough on its own!), but I am perfectly fine with getting them separately. In fact, I want to get them separately. The follower dialogue for attaching them is quite immersive and believable.

 

So regardless of how you choose to solve this, I'd like to request still being able to allow the follower to find piercings separately even if the piercings-with-belts setting is zeroed out. And if possible, it would be nice if he could find clitty piercings too.

 

 

 

Right, and now a suggestion - I hope this qualifies as a low-hanging fruit, though I honestly don't know how much work it would really take.

 

A dominant follower keeps telling the player that they look good in bondage, or that they find them hot, or that they are pleased with their response, and so on. However, since it's the player that gets the gear, it's also the player that starts getting exposure arousal from it. Meanwhile, the follower... doesn't. Not unless he found a wrist restraint and the player ends up nude with no option to re-dress. But shouldn't the follower get turned on if he gets to tie up their submissive player?

 

You could try sending for example 5 base exposure (or any other value you think appropriate) to the follower at the end of the dialogue if they got what they wanted, and player did not respond negatively. At Sexlab Aroused Redux's standard 2.0 exposure rate, that would add 10 arousal to the follower. A similar thing could happen in the allow-being-tied-for-rewards dialogue, perhaps with more arousal for the medium option than the small one (the big reward option includes sex so it's pointless there). And any other such special dialogues, where you think it applicable.

 

Perhaps other followers witnessing the exchange could get the same bonus, if they also like being dominant.

 

Finally, if the player puts something on a follower who enjoys being submissive, that follower could also get this arousal boost.

 

[shadowwolf2k7]

3 hours ago, Verstort said:

When an NPC, or follower, approach is active, the DEC loop gets sped up to every 2 seconds and checks if A) too much time as passed, in which we reset, and B) if the player is busy.

 

You should get either a busy explanation in your log or a timeout message, but I agree I have seen two bugs at least: NPCs set to approach, if they are sitting in furniture (alchemy, bench) can sometimes fail to get up and start walking. No idea what causes this, but if you walk too close them they SAY their first lines but don't engage dialogue, this actually stops the attack, if you talk to them nothing happens.

 

I have seen the follower approach stop without giving an output to log. I haven't figured out what causes this though, but it never happens if the player is idle and not doing other stuff, like opening containers/dialogue/walking/activating. Standing still the follower always seems to make it.

I don't think 1 leads to 2 here.

 

I don't remembering blacking that MCM option out, and it's fixed for the next release, but it should only lock the MCM value from changing through the interface, it doesn't affect how the code views the MCM option..

 

1) That feature doesn't (or at least isn't meant to) do what you describe. It should do the opposite; set all sex from all mods as accceptable for DEC post-sex attack, rather than set all of them as unacceptable for attack.

 

2) If you type "SQV crdeMcm" in console and scroll waaay to the top, you'll see bHookAnySexlabEvent is set false. If you type "SetPQV crdeMCM bHookAnySexlabEvent_var TRUE" then open your MCM it will have changed. The blackout doesn't stop the feature from working only stops the user from changing the value; It's a feature of the interface not the code. You can still set the value and experiment with the difference through console, although in most cases where I greyed options intentionally, nothing will happen because there is no code using that option.

 

If you say you aren't getting post-sex attacks, Then there's an actual bug in the code and the MCM value is unrelated. I'll double check on my end, but what debug output from DEC do you get after sexlab has finished?

i have it set so that they follower doesnt auto approach, due to the odd time of being mid cast/drawing of the bow and ending up shooting the follower. if i havent started combat i will engage the follower with the convo, and had the item find fail to progress, with no output to the console as to why it failed.

 

as for the sex attack not registering in the console, on my newest play through i have it set to 100% to equip items for regular sex and on rape events. for regular sex it says it was not an attack, wasnt started by CRDE or the override wasnt set (not sure what over ride it is talking about) so it ignores it. for the rape events it triggers the regular sex event and will roll to see if the person steals the keys and/or locks devices. it happens with a follower there (set to prevent enslavement) or with out. with 13.13.3 and .4 the rape roll would be the enslave/device roll i went to .6 and it is rolling the steal/device for rape. this play through was started on 13.13.6. and is the only updated mod since before i installed 13.13.3.

 

edit: one of my other playthroughs that i  started  on was no longer even listing that CRDE had registered that the scene had ended, sexlab registered the scene ending though. so im going to delete that play through and remake the character since somewhere it broke. this play through that is broken was started on 13.13.3.

[Verstort]

14 hours ago, RegisteredUser said:

Actually at the time I did not have the piercing weight set to zero, so I didn't think anything was wrong. I set it to zero afterwards. But if the misunderstanding led to you finding an actual bug, hey, why not!

 

You know, piercings are kind of a special case, because Deviously Enslaved does not normally select them separately. You can only get them from postsex events or NPC interactions if you get belted, and then roll a random chance. The follower finding a belt can also get you pierced that way.

 

However, unlike the rest of the mod, the follower can find nipple piercings as an item on its own, no belting required.

 

If you now go and make the follower obey all user weight settings, then there's a problem, because there's no weight setting for piercings on their own. If you let the piercings-with-belts chance setting block piercings as separate items, then the player can't configure things properly. For example, I intentionally set that chance to zero because I didn't want them to come attached with belts (a belt is bad enough on its own!), but I am perfectly fine with getting them separately. In fact, I want to get them separately. The follower dialogue for attaching them is quite immersive and believable.

 

So regardless of how you choose to solve this, I'd like to request still being able to allow the follower to find piercings separately even if the piercings-with-belts setting is zeroed out. And if possible, it would be nice if he could find clitty piercings too.

Will do.

 

14 hours ago, RegisteredUser said:

Right, and now a suggestion - I hope this qualifies as a low-hanging fruit, though I honestly don't know how much work it would really take.

 

A dominant follower keeps telling the player that they look good in bondage, or that they find them hot, or that they are pleased with their response, and so on. However, since it's the player that gets the gear, it's also the player that starts getting exposure arousal from it. Meanwhile, the follower... doesn't. Not unless he found a wrist restraint and the player ends up nude with no option to re-dress. But shouldn't the follower get turned on if he gets to tie up their submissive player?

 

You could try sending for example 5 base exposure (or any other value you think appropriate) to the follower at the end of the dialogue if they got what they wanted, and player did not respond negatively. At Sexlab Aroused Redux's standard 2.0 exposure rate, that would add 10 arousal to the follower. A similar thing could happen in the allow-being-tied-for-rewards dialogue, perhaps with more arousal for the medium option than the small one (the big reward option includes sex so it's pointless there). And any other such special dialogues, where you think it applicable.

 

Perhaps other followers witnessing the exchange could get the same bonus, if they also like being dominant.

 

Finally, if the player puts something on a follower who enjoys being submissive, that follower could also get this arousal boost.

This is only more annoying then you realize because I have to go find every script fragment for all possible dialogue outcomes to add the necessary extra code. Probably close to 40 scripts would have to be updated, which is just tedious, also slow to look them all up through creation kit.

 

Worth looking at though.

 

12 hours ago, shadowwolf2k7 said:

i have it set so that they follower doesnt auto approach, due to the odd time of being mid cast/drawing of the bow and ending up shooting the follower. if i havent started combat i will engage the follower with the convo, and had the item find fail to progress, with no output to the console as to why it failed.

I didn't even think of that, but I think I too have seen my character whip around and shoot my follower because of the approach.

 

I bet I can detect that though, detect if the player is pulling an arrow or casting a spell at least.

 

That said, DEC still considers a non-forcegreet approach as an approach for the sake of looking for reasons to cancel. Setting no physical approach should still set DEC into a state looking for reasons to cancel.

 

12 hours ago, shadowwolf2k7 said:

as for the sex attack not registering in the console, on my newest play through i have it set to 100% to equip items for regular sex and on rape events. for regular sex it says it was not an attack, wasnt started by CRDE or the override wasnt set (not sure what over ride it is talking about) so it ignores it.

The MCM variable you pointed at earlier was the override. "wasnt started by CRDE or the override wasnt set " was saying one of those had to be true to continue, where the override bypasses the DEC only test.

 

That message should show up for "regular sex", assuming you mean sex started through a different mod and not DEC.

 

12 hours ago, shadowwolf2k7 said:

for the rape events it triggers the regular sex event and will roll to see if the person steals the keys and/or locks devices. it happens with a follower there (set to prevent enslavement) or with out. with 13.13.3 and .4 the rape roll would be the enslave/device roll i went to .6 and it is rolling the steal/device for rape. this play through was started on 13.13.6. and is the only updated mod since before i installed 13.13.3.

 

edit: one of my other playthroughs that i  started  on was no longer even listing that CRDE had registered that the scene had ended, sexlab registered the scene ending though. so im going to delete that play through and remake the character since somewhere it broke. this play through that is broken was started on 13.13.3.

Follower should stop enslave/device roll and switch to steal/device for rape though, since the follower stops enslavement approach it should stop enslavement roll too, or did you mean it switched without a follower?

[shadowwolf2k7]

4 hours ago, Verstort said:

 

That message should show up for "regular sex", assuming you mean sex started through a different mod and not DEC.

 

Follower should stop enslave/device roll and switch to steal/device for rape though, since the follower stops enslavement approach it should stop enslavement roll too, or did you mean it switched without a follower?

both with and with out a follower i am getting the steal/devices roll.

[Verstort]

this version has a few fixes:

the MCM option was unblocked

the CurrentFollowerFaction for follower item appraoch can be skipped if they've in the crdeFormerFollowerFaction (old follower or added through MCM manual follower add)

belt piercing is separated from piercings in general, which now have their own weights

 

added:

pony gag, but only the harness one, three colors

elbowbinder (dd4 req)

catsuit collar (dd4 only, cursed loot seems to have removed locking catsuit collars in 6.2)

 

haven't gotten to yet:

simple vs harness gags, going to need to do some gag code overhauling for that one

straitjacket

other things mentioned recently

 

Deviously Enslaved Continued(v13.13.7 Testing).7z

 

Might want to save clean for this one, especially the user who plays with the special follower, otherwise the faction might not load

17 minutes ago, shadowwolf2k7 said:

both with and with out a follower i am getting the steal/devices roll.

What enslave level were you at?

 

And/or papyrus log

[shadowwolf2k7]

it was lvl 2, same as the default, the attacker didnt roll high enough for the enslave conversation so it was a sex one, gave a aggressive scene. to test it out i also set DCURs device comments to trigger a rape event which up through .4 would triggered the enslave/device roll. with .6 it choose the steal/device. i will test with .7 and see how that works.

[Verstort]

11 minutes ago, shadowwolf2k7 said:

it was lvl 2, same as the default, the attacker didnt roll high enough for the enslave conversation so it was a sex one, gave a aggressive scene. to test it out i also set DCURs device comments to trigger a rape event which up through .4 would triggered the enslave/device roll. with .6 it choose the steal/device. i will test with .7 and see how that works.

Ah, well you don't get the enslave/device if you have any enslavement level above 0.

 

steal/device was meant as the non-enslave outcome.

 

I should redesign it so that theft can happen in either case, and enslave alone gets canceled out. Its leftover from 1.04

[shadowwolf2k7]

i have an item i would like to suggest, the iron ring slave shoes, not sure if they are an option to be equipped or not, those would be interesting to see added

[Verstort]

kinda wish you mentioned that a few days ago...

 

But I might add them, sure

[bicobus]

About the devices, does this mod allow the player to find or request keys from NPC? IIRC followers can find keys, but that's leaving the thing to chance a bit too much.

[RegisteredUser]

13 hours ago, Verstort said:

Deviously Enslaved Continued(v13.13.7 Testing).7z

 

Might want to save clean for this one, especially the user who plays with the special follower, otherwise the faction might not load

Tested this today. Trying to save clean didn't produce anything cleanable, so I went without.

 

It... sort of works? It definitely did not work right after upgrading. Still had to manually add him to a faction. But after starting Skyrim again after dinner, he did get selected for an item roll without me doing anything. I will observe this some more.

 

Something else I tested for the first time today: two followers together. Everything worked just fine, although the console output gets a little weird (it occasionally re-chooses a random follower in the middle of rolling for no discernable reason).

 

 

Minor bug: was wearing a panel gag and a chastity belt and was approached for sex. The conversation ended with the follower saying something like "Oh right, you are still tied up... oh well, only one end needs to be open, right?" Upon which he removed the chastity belt so that sex could be had. Just one problem with that: it was a Belt of Shame from Cursed Loot. Those are not meant to be openable at all, by anything - they have a timed lock that opens on its own after a while.

(Also, the belt was not re-equipped after sex, but that may have been intended behavior, I don't know.)

 

 

I saw you added a config option for wood plugs weighting. Suggestion: rename to "mundane plugs" and allow it to randomly select from wood and metal plugs.

 

Also, what does the Training Plug do? I thought I read somewhere in the thread that it was not meant to be used. But the weighting slider for it is active on my end, so it seems like it can be set to be randomly selected when belted. Intended?

 

 

Suggestion: move the "unique collars" weight slider from the Event Weights section down to the Single Event Weights section, where the other individual items are, and have it be a possible result from rolling for individual items like all the others. This makes the config behavior consistent across all items, and makes the unique collar selection itself consistent. Right now, they are selected as an event by postsex, but as an individual item by followers, both using the same weight setting. Making this change would make them become an individual item for postsex as well.

 

 

12 hours ago, shadowwolf2k7 said:

i have an item i would like to suggest, the iron ring slave shoes

 

12 hours ago, Verstort said:

kinda wish you mentioned that a few days ago...

While we're at it, then: bondage mittens? I believe they come standard with DDi 4.0 now.

[shadowwolf2k7]

4 hours ago, RegisteredUser said:

Tested this today. Trying to save clean didn't produce anything cleanable, so I went without.

 

It... sort of works? It definitely did not work right after upgrading. Still had to manually add him to a faction. But after starting Skyrim again after dinner, he did get selected for an item roll without me doing anything. I will observe this some more.

 

Something else I tested for the first time today: two followers together. Everything worked just fine, although the console output gets a little weird (it occasionally re-chooses a random follower in the middle of rolling for no discernable reason).

 

 

Minor bug: was wearing a panel gag and a chastity belt and was approached for sex. The conversation ended with the follower saying something like "Oh right, you are still tied up... oh well, only one end needs to be open, right?" Upon which he removed the chastity belt so that sex could be had. Just one problem with that: it was a Belt of Shame from Cursed Loot. Those are not meant to be openable at all, by anything - they have a timed lock that opens on its own after a while.

(Also, the belt was not re-equipped after sex, but that may have been intended behavior, I don't know.)

 

the belt not being reequipped is normal, as for the follower removing that belt not sure if @Verstort can set it up to check and see if it has no key or not.

 

I saw you added a config option for wood plugs weighting. Suggestion: rename to "mundane plugs" and allow it to randomly select from wood and metal plugs.

 

Also, what does the Training Plug do? I thought I read somewhere in the thread that it was not meant to be used. But the weighting slider for it is active on my end, so it seems like it can be set to be randomly selected when belted. Intended?

 

the training plug is broken, so dont set it above 0%, it is also set to not be used with the random plug settings

 

Suggestion: move the "unique collars" weight slider from the Event Weights section down to the Single Event Weights section, where the other individual items are, and have it be a possible result from rolling for individual items like all the others. This makes the config behavior consistent across all items, and makes the unique collar selection itself consistent. Right now, they are selected as an event by postsex, but as an individual item by followers, both using the same weight setting. Making this change would make them become an individual item for postsex as well.

 

 

 

While we're at it, then: bondage mittens? I believe they come standard with DDi 4.0 now.

 

 

[Verstort]

14 hours ago, bicobus said:

About the devices, does this mod allow the player to find or request keys from NPC? IIRC followers can find keys, but that's leaving the thing to chance a bit too much.

There is no dialogue where the player asks a follower/NPC for keys, or to find keys.

 

I've thought about adding a dialogue to ask the follower to look for keys, which would increase chances, but it would still be random. Asking NPCs for anything felt like it was redundant, it felt like there were already > 3 mods that allowed the player to ask NPCs for keys/help, adding another felt like a waste.

7 hours ago, RegisteredUser said:

Tested this today. Trying to save clean didn't produce anything cleanable, so I went without.

 

It... sort of works? It definitely did not work right after upgrading. Still had to manually add him to a faction. But after starting Skyrim again after dinner, he did get selected for an item roll without me doing anything. I will observe this some more.

 

Something else I tested for the first time today: two followers together. Everything worked just fine, although the console output gets a little weird (it occasionally re-chooses a random follower in the middle of rolling for no discernable reason).

Auto save clean doesn't always pick up that changes have been made, I never use just auto clean for that reason. I always try to specify specific mods and remove all their contents when I want to clean them.

 

The reason for reroll is not all followers that can approach you for sex can approach for items. It's maybe debug that doesn't need to be seen by the user though, should probably just state which follower is chosen IF the approach is decided.

 

7 hours ago, RegisteredUser said:

Minor bug: was wearing a panel gag and a chastity belt and was approached for sex. The conversation ended with the follower saying something like "Oh right, you are still tied up... oh well, only one end needs to be open, right?" Upon which he removed the chastity belt so that sex could be had. Just one problem with that: it was a Belt of Shame from Cursed Loot. Those are not meant to be openable at all, by anything - they have a timed lock that opens on its own after a while.

(Also, the belt was not re-equipped after sex, but that may have been intended behavior, I don't know.)

Belt re-added after sex is not intended, except for sex started by specific dialogues. That dialogue might have been one, I need to recheck.

 

I was sure the code checks for blocking before trying to remove a belt, but it might not. I'll recheck.

 

7 hours ago, RegisteredUser said:

I saw you added a config option for wood plugs weighting. Suggestion: rename to "mundane plugs" and allow it to randomly select from wood and metal plugs.

I didn't just add that, its been greyed out there for months now. Was just too lazy to add boring plugs.

 

Not sure what you mean by 'metal' though, herrtics plugs?

 

7 hours ago, RegisteredUser said:

Also, what does the Training Plug do? I thought I read somewhere in the thread that it was not meant to be used. But the weighting slider for it is active on my end, so it seems like it can be set to be randomly selected when belted. Intended?

 

Pretty sure its broken.

 

It was in the mod when I took over for chase. What he planed for it I don't know, but it was just a copy of the DD training plug, which was never used by anyone as far as I know beyond being a proof of concept for one mod author's use case. The DDi plug shouldn't do anything except count the days its been worn and print some flavor text.

 

It shouldn't be used, I thought I set the MCM to zero AND greyed out already, guess not.

 

7 hours ago, RegisteredUser said:

Suggestion: move the "unique collars" weight slider from the Event Weights section down to the Single Event Weights section, where the other individual items are, and have it be a possible result from rolling for individual items like all the others. This makes the config behavior consistent across all items, and makes the unique collar selection itself consistent. Right now, they are selected as an event by postsex, but as an individual item by followers, both using the same weight setting. Making this change would make them become an individual item for postsex as well.

Sure

7 hours ago, RegisteredUser said:

While we're at it, then: bondage mittens? I believe they come standard with DDi 4.0 now.

I didn't know if anyone actually use those. I'll add them to the next batch

[DexesTTP]

39 minutes ago, Verstort said:

 

8 hours ago, RegisteredUser said:

Also, what does the Training Plug do? I thought I read somewhere in the thread that it was not meant to be used. But the weighting slider for it is active on my end, so it seems like it can be set to be randomly selected when belted. Intended?

 

Pretty sure its broken.

 

It was in the mod when I took over for chase. What he planed for it I don't know, but it was just a copy of the DD training plug, which was never used by anyone as far as I know beyond being a proof of concept for one mod author's use case. The DDi plug shouldn't do anything except count the days its been worn and print some flavor text.

 

It shouldn't be used, I thought I set the MCM to zero AND greyed out already, guess not.

 

So you have no plans for the training plug yet ?

 

It always felt like it could be an interesting gateway into parts of the mod (force-triggered enslavement at the end of the timer, unlocking extra follower dialogs/behaviors, ...) even if each sound like a fair amount of work to make it happen.

[Verstort]

25 minutes ago, DexesTTP said:

So you have no plans for the training plug yet ?

 

It always felt like it could be an interesting gateway into parts of the mod (force-triggered enslavement at the end of the timer, unlocking extra follower dialogs/behaviors, ...) even if each sound like a fair amount of work to make it happen.

Plans to integrate it into a not-yet-existing 'follower becomes master to player slave' system are sitting next to the non-existing system in the backlog.

 

That's a lot of dialogue, a lot of possible outcomes and practically requires a mini slave system all byitself, and I work too slow for it to happen any time soon, especially with how slow I am to conceive dialogue and my tendency to want options and variety at all levels.

 

Edit: I lost a lot of interest in the plug when I realized that it was going to be really round about to try to block orgasm with it too, I wanted control over who and how the wearer could orgasm but it didn't seem easy when I looked at sexlab/SLA code.

[bicobus]

9 hours ago, Verstort said:

There is no dialogue where the player asks a follower/NPC for keys, or to find keys.

 

I've thought about adding a dialogue to ask the follower to look for keys, which would increase chances, but it would still be random. Asking NPCs for anything felt like it was redundant, it felt like there were already > 3 mods that allowed the player to ask NPCs for keys/help, adding another felt like a waste.

I see mods as self contained. DEC might be lacking synergy with the devices. Which venues should I take to remove them? Especially with DDi4 which lacks support from some utility/quest mod like Captured Dreams (as Veladarius is working on an update). By default DDi4 items may get stuck on the player, and as DEC adds devices on it becomes increasingly annoying to remove them: one by one with a potential of several hours of cooldown decided by chance.

 

So if a follower enjoy putting devices on the player, wouldn't that same follow agree to remove some? At least, for a price...

 

Anyhow, what are those 3 mods you are referring to?

 

Unrelated question: to disable enslavement, all I need to to is to set the chance slider to 0%?

[valcon767]

5 hours ago, bicobus said:

So if a follower enjoy putting devices on the player, wouldn't that same follow agree to remove some? At least, for a price...

 

Anyhow, what are those 3 mods you are referring to?

 

not sure if these are the ones he was talking about but 

Cursed Loot - has multiple ways to ask for keys (as well as have keys drop) and has a couple of ways to get out of devices (pay and otherwise)

Captured Dreams Shop - way you can ask to buy keys (your stats within that mod determine if you can buy any) and way to pay to get out of some devices

also:

For The Masses - can add keys to NPCs

Devious Followers Beta - follower can remove some devices (will cost you though) also (if you are willing to have a beta running)

 

i have forgotten off-hand which other mods i have installed that can do similar things.

 

hope this info is helpful.