Diary Of Mine for Paradise Halls

[TrollAutokill]

13 hours ago, Saeros said:

yes, I gave her a love potion (just for try).

here are some screenshots of her personality and info

 

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and PAHE spell info

 

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The inlove potion effects don't have a duration. It will go away when her mood changes. Or just punish her and the spell will wear off automatically.

[TrollAutokill]

14 hours ago, DarkMaster13 said:

I use PonyGirl mod for travel

ponygirl-ENG-SE 1.0.7z

 

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And Followers Can Loot by powerofthree [link nexus]

i modify only quest priority

Followers Can Loot - 1.8-4744-1-8.7z

 

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Maybe you may want to add support for this modules. Many thanks for you work

 

My guess is the interface with these mods should be integrated at PAHE level. But I will take a look at them. It might just be a faction to add to the slaves.

[TrollAutokill]

15 hours ago, DarkMaster13 said:

Hi @TrollAutokill thank you for you mod. I am old slaver from Morrowind and I love how enslavement mods evolve hehe
Have a simple idea for immersion: when PC give potion to slave with dialog line "Drink the potion I gave you" can you add animations:
 

akTarget.playidle(IdleDrinkPotion)
utility.wait(10.0)
akTarget.playidle(IdleUncontrollableCough)
utility.wait(10.0)
akTarget.playidle(IdleDrunkStart)
utility.wait(10.0)
akTarget.playidle(IdleUncontrollableCough)
utility.wait(10.0)
akTarget.playidle(IdleDrunkStop)

 

Will be cool to add some interactions with drunk NPC, but I understand it more hard to realise of course

Thanks I will try it and hopefully keep it for next version.

[TrollAutokill]

On 5/17/2021 at 12:01 AM, InsanityFactor said:

Yes, the only issue I would be way of is accidentally changing a slave's stats. For example, if you have sex with your slave a lot and train them as a prostitute, then their sensual skill would reasonably be expected to go up, and would be helpful in the training you are doing anyway. In this case it makes sense and is helpful. But on the other hand pain punishments shouldn't raise masochism, since that would sabotage your efforts in making a decent HSH trainer.

As you said for masochism. Those are not skills but traits. You don't learn traits, they are factors of a much bigger mechanism used by your brain and body to process the real world.

This is not to say they can't change, but you first have to create a relationship to be able to affect them. Or magic!

 

On 5/17/2021 at 12:01 AM, InsanityFactor said:

What I think could be ideal is after you train up your slave like normal to a decent level, you can perform "psychological training" which lets you alter their personality traits deliberately and in parallel to normal training, so you don't have unintended outcomes as byproducts of normal training. It sounds like you are already thinking in that direction  

Yes, that's the direction this mod is aiming at. Not saying it is realistic or scientific. I just aim for fun with a reasonable amount of "realism", because too easy means boring.

 

On 5/17/2021 at 12:01 AM, InsanityFactor said:

 

Yes! I have studied Classical Era slavery systems quite a bit and you are certainly right. That could be a nice addition. However, I wonder what "Smart" means in DoM context, since it affects taskmaster efficiency. It certainly isn't historical knowledge or arithmetic right?

You are right knowledge can be learn by anyone. "Smart" covers puzzle solving but also street smart and empathy, depending on other traits. Fox example kind+smart=empathic.

 

On 5/17/2021 at 12:01 AM, InsanityFactor said:

 

So I wonder how you would train a slave to be more "Smart." Maybe having books in their inventory, like the potions? "Read that book I gave you!" and maybe that would do it? Could be already in-game books too maybe, or a new book describing Dark Elf slavery processes?

Maybe teach them how to read first. Then reading books could definitely change their traits, not only make them smarter. Like reading Machiavel (or its Tamriel equivalent) would raise smart and lower kindness.

 

On 5/17/2021 at 12:01 AM, InsanityFactor said:

 

And yes those perks seem very interesting. I really like the idea of perk progression, since AYGAS has perks for selling slaves now there would be another set for training them. Very nice.

Perhaps there could be some sort of a capture perk(s)? Maybe a perk that lets you make a super paralysis poison that lasts like 5 minutes or something, could even be a trick learned from Drelas  Or one that when using a mace auto knocks down NPCs for capture rather than killing them? That one might not be as practical I'll admit  

 

This sounds a bit too much like Defeat. But it could be interesting to not rely on defeat actually. Like with defeat you can knock someone from behind, we could have that and if you progress in "abduction" skill you could capture them from front too. ?

 

I really have to debug the HSH part. Still didn't get far enough to get a clean training house working...

 

 

[InsanityFactor]

2 hours ago, TrollAutokill said:

Yes, that's the direction this mod is aiming at. Not saying it is realistic or scientific. I just aim for fun with a reasonable amount of "realism", because too easy means boring.

Yes exactly, "immersion" seems to be the word here.  

 

2 hours ago, TrollAutokill said:

Maybe teach them how to read first. Then reading books could definitely change their traits, not only make them smarter. Like reading Machiavel (or its Tamriel equivalent) would raise smart and lower kindness.

Haha yeah, maybe it could be any slave above 40 or 50 smart is considered literate, and under that amount would require some other training before moving to "Brief History of the Empire Volume 1." I do really like the idea of specialized books like you're saying, that could be really cool.

 

2 hours ago, TrollAutokill said:

This sounds a bit too much like Defeat. But it could be interesting to not rely on defeat actually. Like with defeat you can knock someone from behind, we could have that and if you progress in "abduction" skill you could capture them from front too. ?

 

Yeah, while Defeat is great and is integrated pretty well into PAHE captures, I think it would be interesting to have slave capture as some sort of skill. Like the restraint to deliberately wound or incapacitate someone for capture rather than killing them. I suppose on some level that's what the PAHE "Mark for Capture" hotkey does, but having some kind of progression would be nice. But that might be outside the main focus of this mod, since this seems to be a psychological component primarily. I suppose that would be at your discretion  

 

2 hours ago, TrollAutokill said:

I really have to debug the HSH part. Still didn't get far enough to get a clean training house working...

Yeah it's interesting; I honestly can't make sense of why or how it works and doesn't work. Resignation and humiliation don't work, while pose training and sex training work sometimes, but other vanilla traits still don't. (e.g. respect and submission) Very strange... 

[pinky6225]

44 minutes ago, InsanityFactor said:

Yeah it's interesting; I honestly can't make sense of why or how it works and doesn't work. Resignation and humiliation don't work, while pose training and sex training work sometimes, but other vanilla traits still don't. (e.g. respect and submission) Very strange... 

 

Think its relationship rank myself, you can have a HSH trained slave with 100 respect and move them into PAH and the initial dialogue will be the respectful "what you want my thane" but then the closing dialogue will be hostile - for me "want do you want lizard man" "get out of my face" etc

 

If you change them from arch nemesis using manipulator to something like ally then the closing dialogue will also be appropriate for there PAH respect value of 100

[TrollAutokill]

4 hours ago, pinky6225 said:

 

Think its relationship rank myself, you can have a HSH trained slave with 100 respect and move them into PAH and the initial dialogue will be the respectful "what you want my thane" but then the closing dialogue will be hostile - for me "want do you want lizard man" "get out of my face" etc

 

If you change them from arch nemesis using manipulator to something like ally then the closing dialogue will also be appropriate for there PAH respect value of 100

Yes, that's something I didn't fix yet. It's linked with the relationship rank not being updated correctly as you said. It's on my to-do list.

[CliftonJD]

On 5/18/2021 at 8:43 AM, TrollAutokill said:

This sounds a bit too much like Defeat. But it could be interesting to not rely on defeat actually. Like with defeat you can knock someone from behind,

this:

23 hours ago, InsanityFactor said:

I suppose on some level that's what the PAHE "Mark for Capture" hotkey does,

yes, mark them from behind while sneaking. if sneaking and undetected, pressing the key a second time knocks them down for enslavement and prevents them from being killed the same as essential

[CliftonJD]

22 hours ago, pinky6225 said:

 

Think its relationship rank myself, you can have a HSH trained slave with 100 respect and move them into PAH and the initial dialogue will be the respectful "what you want my thane" but then the closing dialogue will be hostile - for me "want do you want lizard man" "get out of my face" etc

 

If you change them from arch nemesis using manipulator to something like ally then the closing dialogue will also be appropriate for there PAH respect value of 100

next time you notice this type of behavior note the voice type of the slave, for example nord voice types have dialogs written that should prevent that but young and eager or condescending voice types don't have that

18 hours ago, TrollAutokill said:

Yes, that's something I didn't fix yet. It's linked with the relationship rank not being updated correctly as you said. It's on my to-do list.

eventoned and nord voice types seem to be the only 2 voices that have goodbye topics written in to prevent that behavior, but eventoned is also the default voice type when they don't fall under any of the other pah voices types written so that covers all but sultry or young or condescending. sultry was copied over from a much older version of pah but only some of its dialogs have been updated to current standards. when young and condescending voices were added was just too overwhelming to fix goodbye topics after fixing the main dialogs.

[InsanityFactor]

6 hours ago, CliftonJD said:

yes, mark them from behind while sneaking. if sneaking and undetected, pressing the key a second time knocks them down for enslavement and prevents them from being killed the same as essential

Oh very cool, I didn't actually know that, I'll start using that from now on  

[Saeros]

So...I would like to understand...?

when I praise the slave for something, "anger training" value lowers?

when I scold her or punish her with whipping or sex, increases the value of fear training (not the anger training?).

 

the anger training value, directly affects this feeling / response?

because it dropped up to 0, but she always wants me dead?

 

how do I change this attitude / feeling?

I should increase the anger training (but how?) or "over time" it changes on its own based... on other behaviors?

 

tnks!

bye!

S.

[pinky6225]

Think to train anger you need to catch them when they are giving the angry notification and then punish them for that but with the other values your slave has might be a challenge catching them in that mood

 

Using the come here slave - you've been a bad slave for no reason is meant to make them angry so you could try that but might affect the respect stat as that gets lowered when you tell them off for no reason

[Saeros]

@pinky6225 tnks for the explanation

 

but to recap, for me it is also an aesthetic matter ?

with all the other values she has, shouldn't want me dead anyway... or not?

since she is almost completely subjugated to submission and respect and nearly broken ?

 

she shouldn't have the will to want me dead anymore...

 

 

[TrollAutokill]

5 hours ago, Saeros said:

@pinky6225 tnks for the explanation

 

but to recap, for me it is also an aesthetic matter ?

with all the other values she has, shouldn't want me dead anyway... or not?

since she is almost completely subjugated to submission and respect and nearly broken ?

 

she shouldn't have the will to want me dead anymore...

 

 

She is too afraid to act but she still dreams about it. A bit of hope is ok, too much hope and it's rebellion, as used to say my old friend President Snow. I wonder what happened to him? Long time no see.

 

Anyhow, that's where we are now. The rebellion part is not implemented yet...

[CliftonJD]

10 hours ago, Saeros said:

because it dropped up to 0, but she always wants me dead?

similar issue to what pinky mentioned above, check the voice type when you get this type of response from the slave

6 hours ago, Saeros said:

with all the other values she has, shouldn't want me dead anyway... or not?

since she is almost completely subjugated to submission and respect and nearly broken ?

 

she shouldn't have the will to want me dead anymore...

so far that i've noticed this comes from the sultry women, i'll need to fix the greetings and/or goodbyes for that voice type

edit:

can't remember what voice type that is, sultry had the problem with sabre cats that might be fixed now, but otherwise looks ok so ya if you get that response, report the voice type for fixing

[CliftonJD]

On 5/18/2021 at 8:23 AM, TrollAutokill said:

My guess is the interface with these mods should be integrated at PAHE level. But I will take a look at them. It might just be a faction to add to the slaves.

last i tried that mod its effects were permanent to 1 npc and if used on a slave, it can't escape, so there wasn't really anything for pahe to add there

[sickboy791]

11 hours ago, Saeros said:

I should increase the anger training (but how?) or "over time" it changes on its own based... on other behaviors?

I think the only way to train anger is to punish with sex... would be nice if there is another option

8 hours ago, pinky6225 said:

Using the come here slave - you've been a bad slave for no reason is meant to make them angry so you could try that but might affect the respect stat as that gets lowered when you tell them off for no reason

can anybody confirm this ? seems like some npc´s are resistant to anger, (lydia)

Spoiler

 

[InsanityFactor]

11 minutes ago, sickboy791 said:

I think the only way to train anger is to punish with sex... would be nice if there is another option

 

11 minutes ago, sickboy791 said:

can anybody confirm this ? seems like some npc´s are resistant to anger, (lydia)

So to train anger you need to punish them when they are angry. Any punishment works for that, whipping, sex or whatever. An untrained slave will get angry very often, so just whip them when that happens, but avoid punishing them for no reason because that lowers anger training. You can also tie them up and whip them when they start struggling and it raises their anger training too, that's probably the fastest way. Be careful about when and how much you punish them, you can lower their anger training really quickly on accident. 

 

Anger training is essentially how much the slave likes you, she can be well trained and do everything you say, but can still be angry at you on the inside. Punishing for no reason makes the slave hate you because she will think you are crazy and unreasonable, so that can mess everything up if you are not careful.

 

Also yes some NPCs can be resistant to anger, just ask her what kind of slave she is and it will say what she is resistant or weak to.

[TrollAutokill]

2 hours ago, InsanityFactor said:

 

So to train anger you need to punish them when they are angry. Any punishment works for that, whipping, sex or whatever. An untrained slave will get angry very often, so just whip them when that happens, but avoid punishing them for no reason because that lowers anger training. You can also tie them up and whip them when they start struggling and it raises their anger training too, that's probably the fastest way. Be careful about when and how much you punish them, you can lower their anger training really quickly on accident. 

 

Anger training is essentially how much the slave likes you, she can be well trained and do everything you say, but can still be angry at you on the inside. Punishing for no reason makes the slave hate you because she will think you are crazy and unreasonable, so that can mess everything up if you are not careful.

 

Also yes some NPCs can be resistant to anger, just ask her what kind of slave she is and it will say what she is resistant or weak to.

Couldn't have said it better.

 

Also, for slaves with high training stat, you might want to try praising them, as it will be more efficient. On the opposite if they are not well trained it can be devastating.

 

Finally shocked/broken/loyal and in love slaves are relatively immune to anger. So it's a good time to raise anger training without too much risk.

[Kalysto]

Ok, I think that explains something weird that is happening with one slave of mine.

 

Many updates ago I started to notice random punishments to one PAHE slave (always the same). The punishments I think happen when a HSH trainer is working on another HSH slave. Unfortunatelly this made the Anger Training go all the way to 0 when every other training stat is at 100, I'm pretty sure it was not 0 before.

 

No wonder she hates my guts. Tried releasing and re enslaving to reset the stats, but nope, it's saved deep into her psyche!! She wants to chop my head off.

 

Edit: After more testing, I was wrong it happens with any PAHE slave while staying at a HSH cell.

[lostlegends]

@TrollAutokill Sorry been busy check these out if you wish, but they may be a little too subtle.

DoMTears.7z

[lostlegends]

@TrollAutokill Sorry been busy check these out if you wish, but they may be a little too subtle.

[Saeros]

another thing i noticed, after installing PHAE_DOM (and updating PAHE to the last verson), in MCM  i have 2 Defeat menu?

in ModOrganizer the only mods that override defeat are these:

 

 

1. PAHE 7.5.8

2. PAH_DOM 1.5.1

3. VioLens

 

apparently, Violens is last on the "load list", but after installing PAHE (updated) and PAH_DOM, I've never had this double Defeat MCM menu.

I also tried starting a new game but the problem remains.

the strange thing is: in a menu, defeat is "started"..

in the second menu, defeat in not in execution.

 

how is it possible?

 

S.

 

[TrollAutokill]

26 minutes ago, Saeros said:

another thing i noticed, after installing PHAE_DOM (and updating PAHE to the last verson), in MCM  i have 2 Defeat menu?

in ModOrganizer the only mods that override defeat are these:

 

 

1. PAHE 7.5.8

2. PAH_DOM 1.5.1

3. VioLens

 

apparently, Violens is last on the "load list", but after installing PAHE (updated) and PAH_DOM, I've never had this double Defeat MCM menu.

I also tried starting a new game but the problem remains.

the strange thing is: in a menu, defeat is "started"..

in the second menu, defeat in not in execution.

 

how is it possible?

 

S.

 

This is not related to PAHE or DoM, but is due to the way the MCM menu is implemented, or rather to the limitations of the Skyrim script engine.

 

What it means is either MCM has not started normally or the defeat MCM script is referenced twice in your save game.

 

First thing to try in the console is:

 

setstage ski_configmanagerinstance 1

 

If it doesn't fix it, you can try to correct your save game with resaver and look for the defeat mcm script which is called "DefeatMCMscr". Delete all instances save under another save game name. Restart your game and restart MCM with the same command as above.

 

 

[TrollAutokill]

On 5/22/2021 at 2:32 AM, lostlegends said:

@TrollAutokill Sorry been busy check these out if you wish, but they may be a little too subtle.

DoMTears.7z 76.28 kB · 4 downloads

Thanks, I will try those this week.