More Nasty Critters Legendary Edition

[Grey Cloud]

3 hours ago, shunter said:

Crash Fixes unfortunately causes CTDs if you try editing your body in-game with Racemenu through the Bodyslide tab. After disabling the memory patch, you can edit it. The problem is, after making ANY changes to your character in that tab, you absolutely cannot enable the memory patch back as far as I'm aware, or your game goes back to CTDing. So, you either choose a more stable game or editing your character through there.

What Bodyslide tab? Do you mean the body shape sliders or the body scales tab? I have never had any problems using Racemenu in-game with Crash Fixes installed. I second @Whizkid said.

[Ruhadre]

Reproducable CTD caused at Pelagia Farm due to this mod.  Some kind of bad edit to Giants.

[Grey Cloud]

15 minutes ago, Ruhadre said:

Reproducable CTD caused at Pelagia Farm due to this mod.  Some kind of bad edit to Giants.

Do you mean the giant with the Companions? If so then that is a well-documented vanilla problem.

You might want to define what you mean by 'bad edit' and how it can cause a CTD.

[WCSC]

went from 11.3 to the current.  Don't seem to have any issues other than dogs and wolves (maybe skinned/zombie dogs), some don't even come equipped.  Any idea what i messed up?  thx

[Ruhadre]

8 hours ago, Grey Cloud said:

Do you mean the giant with the Companions? If so then that is a well-documented vanilla problem.

You might want to define what you mean by 'bad edit' and how it can cause a CTD.

I actually did this testing because it was driving me crazy!  lol.  I too have read about this being a vanilla problem, which led me to investigating many things before deciding to finally point the finger at MNC.  The CTD was clearly coming from the Giant itself, even after a fresh game.  It would CTD on approach and on fast travel to the farm outside of Whiterun.  So I double checked everything until it became clear that the only non-vanilla assets being loaded for giants were coming from MNC in the form of mesh, skeleton, and FNIS integration.  To verify that it was indeed MNC, I first uninstalled all the mods that needed it but kept it loaded.  Still same old CTD with fresh game.  Between tests, I re-ran LOOT, rebuilt Bash patch, re-ran FNIS.  I then uninstalled MNC, and just like magic...no more CTD in that location.  Even helped the companions kill it without a CTD.  Just to make sure that it wasn't script load on my end, I then installed a TON of script heavy mods afterwards that weren't in my load order previously.  Running everything by EnaiSiaion and skyBirds....papyrus is running like a champ.  I seriously went out of my way to crush my script engine....and couldn't.  Running Snapdragon Prime ENB + Expanded Snow Systems/NLA + Supreme Storms/NLA, and I have cloud shadows activated because I'm running Vivid Clouds (interestingly enough, that last trick calms down strobe light torches some).  I went out of my way to even push my ENB as hard as possible in addition to the script engine.  Well...I was able to play for hours without a CTD, all while maintaining 40-60 FPS.  It's not my rig, nor my setup.  Something is wrong with the mesh, skeleton, or animations being generated by FNIS for it.  Giants weren't the only creatures causing CTDs...they were just the only ones causing an immediate CTD that I could verify.  I was having random CTDs whenever I was around horses too.  Older versions didn't have this problem.

[Grey Cloud]

Scripts wont cause CTDs.

I went past the giant fighting with the companions a couple of days ago. I had 15 human followers with me and we had just fought a couple of dozen wolves and a werewolf around the junction near the meadery.

I never have problems there but there again I'm still on version 11b (if it's not broke I don't fix it). The question would be whether MMG has done anything to giants between 11b and your version.

[MadMansGun]

9 hours ago, WCSC said:

went from 11.3 to the current.  Don't seem to have any issues other than dogs and wolves (maybe skinned/zombie dogs), some don't even come equipped.  Any idea what i messed up?  thx

i assume you have Immersive Creatures installed, there's a patch on page 20 of the BDIC support thread:

https://www.loverslab.com/topic/46289-bad-dogs-immersive-creatures-sic-addon/?do=findComment&comment=2394218

 

(or you installed "HDT all in one", it's files are badly outdated and should not be used)

 

6 hours ago, Ruhadre said:

I actually did this testing because it was driving me crazy!  lol.  I too have read about this being a vanilla problem, which led me to investigating many things before deciding to finally point the finger at MNC.  The CTD was clearly coming from the Giant itself, even after a fresh game.  It would CTD on approach and on fast travel to the farm outside of Whiterun.  So I double checked everything until it became clear that the only non-vanilla assets being loaded for giants were coming from MNC in the form of mesh, skeleton, and FNIS integration.  To verify that it was indeed MNC, I first uninstalled all the mods that needed it but kept it loaded.  Still same old CTD with fresh game.  Between tests, I re-ran LOOT, rebuilt Bash patch, re-ran FNIS.  I then uninstalled MNC, and just like magic...no more CTD in that location.  Even helped the companions kill it without a CTD.  Just to make sure that it wasn't script load on my end, I then installed a TON of script heavy mods afterwards that weren't in my load order previously.  Running everything by EnaiSiaion and skyBirds....papyrus is running like a champ.  I seriously went out of my way to crush my script engine....and couldn't.  Running Snapdragon Prime ENB + Expanded Snow Systems/NLA + Supreme Storms/NLA, and I have cloud shadows activated because I'm running Vivid Clouds (interestingly enough, that last trick calms down strobe light torches some).  I went out of my way to even push my ENB as hard as possible in addition to the script engine.  Well...I was able to play for hours without a CTD, all while maintaining 40-60 FPS.  It's not my rig, nor my setup.  Something is wrong with the mesh, skeleton, or animations being generated by FNIS for it.  Giants weren't the only creatures causing CTDs...they were just the only ones causing an immediate CTD that I could verify.  I was having random CTDs whenever I was around horses too.  Older versions didn't have this problem.

Bash/Smash patches are known to mess up MNC's body template flags, also Crash Fixes v11/12 likes to crash around the horses when the skeleton.hkx is in place so maybe the giants have the same problem.

[Grey Cloud]

1 hour ago, MadMansGun said:

Crash Fixes v11/12 likes to crash around the horses when the skeleton.hkx is in

I've never had this problem with CF 12 and MNC 11b if that helps anyone.

[MadMansGun]

25 minutes ago, Grey Cloud said:

I've never had this problem with CF 12 and MNC 11b if that helps anyone.

that's because v11 did not have skeleton.hkx files.

[Grey Cloud]

1 hour ago, MadMansGun said:

that's because v11 did not have skeleton.hkx files.

Ah, I see.

[Ruhadre]

7 hours ago, Grey Cloud said:

Scripts wont cause CTDs.

I went past the giant fighting with the companions a couple of days ago. I had 15 human followers with me and we had just fought a couple of dozen wolves and a werewolf around the junction near the meadery.

I never have problems there but there again I'm still on version 11b (if it's not broke I don't fix it). The question would be whether MMG has done anything to giants between 11b and your version.

I was using latest version (12RC3).  And....scripts can cause CTDs, just not immediate ones usually.  Bad scripts damage your game in the form of run away save bloat, eventually making your save file unusable, causing Load CTDs.  To quote Chesko, "Skyrim is a pipe".  With ENB, Skyrim essentially has 2 pipes now.  Graphics and script engine.  Which is why my tests involve pushing both to find the culprit.

[Ruhadre]

4 hours ago, MadMansGun said:

i assume you have Immersive Creatures installed, there's a patch on page 20 of the BDIC support thread:

https://www.loverslab.com/topic/46289-bad-dogs-immersive-creatures-sic-addon/?do=findComment&comment=2394218

 

(or you installed "HDT all in one", it's files are badly outdated and should not be used)

 

Bash/Smash patches are known to mess up MNC's body template flags, also Crash Fixes v11/12 likes to crash around the horses when the skeleton.hkx is in place so maybe the giants have the same problem.

I read everything on your mod page to make sure I got the install done correctly.  I see that there is a warning about Crash Fixes in regard to 12RC1.  But nothing about Bash/Smash patches.  Wyre Bash primarily settles issues with leveled lists, so it surprises me that it would conflict.  Smash, oh yeah, you can make some serious trouble for yourself if you don't know what you are doing.  My manual patching with TES5Edit does a much better job than a blind script can.

 

Well, this presents a bit of an issue.  Can install instructions be provided for older files on the mod page that don't have an issue with Wyre Bash and Crash Fixes?

[Vuzzar]

So, I am playing as a Khajiit and when I go into werewolf form, the werewolf penis does not show up no matter if it's in or out of a sexlab scene. Every race seems to work fine except khajiit and argonian.

[btasqan]

Funny that some wannabe pros around here think they know it all. I m not forcing anyone to downgrade their crash fixes. If you love CF12, good for you. Stick with it.  Those having specific reproductable problems when using CF 12 and none of these when it is uninstalling it, are the ones I am adressing. The open minded ones ready to take alternative approaches to solve a problem. The fact is that some CTDs start appearing, mostly related to textures and heavy scripts, when CF is not installed. And no one needs to understand code to notice this. How do I know this. Simple, reread CF and MNC threads and you can that people are mostly complaining about the same stuff. And of course through own experience. It is like people know they need Cf somehow, but unluckily are faced with other issues when they have it installed.

 

I for my playthroughs have found CF 6 (a friend of mine also uses CF 10 and like Madmansgun, confirms smooth gameplay) to be the one which allows me to play for days without CTD. The only time I get CTD is when I tweak my inis because of lags after testing some script heavy mods for other modders, or when some mods are just badly coded.

[Grey Cloud]

17 minutes ago, btasqan said:

Funny that some wannabe pros around here think they know it all.

That may well be true but this retired pro doesn't know it all. Hell, he doesn't even want to any more.

 

One could also make the point that dropping back to an older version of CF may well cause other problems. Presumably CF moved on from version 5 etc for specific reasons.

The obvious thing to me would be to drop back to a previous version of MNC.

[waiyan]

Can someone tell me the most stable version of MNC so far?

[MadMansGun]

1 hour ago, Ruhadre said:

I was using latest version (12RC3).  And....scripts can cause CTDs, just not immediate ones usually.  Bad scripts damage your game in the form of run away save bloat, eventually making your save file unusable, causing Load CTDs.  To quote Chesko, "Skyrim is a pipe".  With ENB, Skyrim essentially has 2 pipes now.  Graphics and script engine.  Which is why my tests involve pushing both to find the culprit.

script wise there is nothing different between v11 & v12.

1 hour ago, Ruhadre said:

I read everything on your mod page to make sure I got the install done correctly.  I see that there is a warning about Crash Fixes in regard to 12RC1.  But nothing about Bash/Smash patches.  Wyre Bash primarily settles issues with leveled lists, so it surprises me that it would conflict.  Smash, oh yeah, you can make some serious trouble for yourself if you don't know what you are doing.  My manual patching with TES5Edit does a much better job than a blind script can.

 

Well, this presents a bit of an issue.  Can install instructions be provided for older files on the mod page that don't have an issue with Wyre Bash and Crash Fixes?

the Bash stuff mostly effects the horse patches in the mod compatibly kit but it has sometimes effected other things as well.

the install instructions are the same for all versions of MNC, the only difference is the links used for 32bitSLE vs 64bitSSE.

59 minutes ago, Antaufein said:

So, I am playing as a Khajiit and when I go into werewolf form, the werewolf penis does not show up no matter if it's in or out of a sexlab scene. Every race seems to work fine except khajiit and argonian.

this is a known problem with Creature Framework, try disabling & re-enabling it's penis in the MCM when playing a animation.

40 minutes ago, Grey Cloud said:

The obvious thing to me would be to drop back to a previous version of MNC.

if you want it then go to the freaking google drive.

[MadMansGun]

11 minutes ago, waiyan said:

Can someone tell me the most stable version of MNC so far?

if you use "Crash Fixes V12" use MNCv11, if you use "Crash Fixes V10" or lower (or not at all) then any MNC version is stable.

[Ruhadre]

5 minutes ago, MadMansGun said:

if you use "Crash Fixes V12" use MNCv11, if you use "Crash Fixes V10" and lower or not at all then any MNC version is stable.

Thank you for clarifying.  I know that none of this is easy stuff.  I should of started out the conversation thanking you for the hard work that obviously goes into this!  I appreciate you taking the time to address this.  Thanks again!

[btasqan]

22 minutes ago, MadMansGun said:

if you use "Crash Fixes V12" use MNCv11, if you use "Crash Fixes V10" or lower (or not at all) then any MNC version is stable.

 

9 minutes ago, Ruhadre said:

Thank you for clarifying.  I know that none of this is easy stuff.  I should of started out the conversation thanking you for the hard work that obviously goes into this!  I appreciate you taking the time to address this.  Thanks again!

This seems very reasonable. At least there are some people here who really try out things before saying that there is no corelation between problem x and mod y.

[Vuzzar]

27 minutes ago, MadMansGun said:

this is a known problem with Creature Framework, try disabling & re-enabling it's penis in the MCM when playing a animation.

I tried to disable and enable in the creature section of the Creature Framework MCM without success. I have the vanilla werewolf mesh in werewolf form instead of the MNC one even though it's enabled in the MCM. Only does that to argonian and khajiit for some reason. ?

[Vuzzar]

26 minutes ago, MadMansGun said:

if you use "Crash Fixes V12" use MNCv11, if you use "Crash Fixes V10" or lower (or not at all) then any MNC version is stable.

I am using Crash Fix v12 and MNC v12 without any problems ?

[Grey Cloud]

32 minutes ago, btasqan said:

before saying that there is no corelation between problem x and mod y.

Correlation is not cause. There is a correlation between snow and cold weather but snow does not cause the cold weather.

[WCSC]

9 hours ago, MadMansGun said:

i assume you have Immersive Creatures installed, there's a patch on page 20 of the BDIC support thread:

https://www.loverslab.com/topic/46289-bad-dogs-immersive-creatures-sic-addon/?do=findComment&comment=2394218

 

(or you installed "HDT all in one", it's files are badly outdated and should not be used)

 

Ha, I do have HDT Pussy All in one installed.  Do I overwrite those with something?

 

Also, just tried that patch, nothing changed after I manually installed

[Grey Cloud]

Hoss.

CF 12, MNC 11b, 20 followers and not a CTD in sight.