HDT SMP for SSE?

[Aldebaran]

1 hour ago, nappilydeestruction said:

I have to say I love SMP but man its tough to get into.  I'm still confused about the whole thing, lol

Don't feel bad if it seems utterly confusing. It's hard. It can become familiar and therefore seem easier with time and repetition, but that doesn't mean it isn't hard. ?

[Vyxenne]

13 hours ago, Gromilla said:

But "Limit bones per partition to 80 for SSE (then split automatically)." does not solve the problem with over the number of bones in the mesh.

You are saying the 80-bone limit is per mesh (which I don't understand- I thought a "mesh" was a nif file.)

 

For months, I (and others) have been saying that the 80-bone limit is per shape- there can be many shapes within a nif file.

 

Last week, @ousnius corrected both of us: the 80-bone limit is per partition. I don't think there is anyone on the planet with more expertise in Bethesda nif meshes than Ousnius, so as far as I'm concerned that settles it- the 80-bone limit is per partition, not per mesh and not per shape.

 

My problem with this is that I don't know how to make Outfit Studio show me a bone list by partition or even by shape- every time I highlight a shape or partition and look on the bones tab, it's still showing me every bone in the project, including every bone in the reference body- even those bones that are not used in the highlighted shape or partition. So, it seems impossible to me to count the bones in a partition OR a shape in Outfit Studio.

[Gromilla]

6 hours ago, Vyxenne said:

You are saying the 80-bone limit is per mesh (which I don't understand- I thought a "mesh" was a nif file.)

 

For months, I (and others) have been saying that the 80-bone limit is per shape- there can be many shapes within a nif file.

 

Last week, @ousnius corrected both of us: the 80-bone limit is per partition. I don't think there is anyone on the planet with more expertise in Bethesda nif meshes than Ousnius, so as far as I'm concerned that settles it- the 80-bone limit is per partition, not per mesh and not per shape.

 

My problem with this is that I don't know how to make Outfit Studio show me a bone list by partition or even by shape- every time I highlight a shape or partition and look on the bones tab, it's still showing me every bone in the project, including every bone in the reference body- even those bones that are not used in the highlighted shape or partition. So, it seems impossible to me to count the bones in a partition OR a shape in Outfit Studio.

I have already said that the limit is still imposed on the number of bones in the shapes (I sometimes call it a mesh, which is not quite right) and not in the partitions.

In the picture, BSTriShape this is a shape that contains several partitions, the total number of bones is 101, but in partitions the number of bones does not exceed 18 (the nif is ported from LE) 

Spoiler

 

 

If someone explained how it can be seen in the OS, it would be great.

[OmeNova]

On ‎11‎/‎18‎/‎2018 at 9:54 AM, Vyxenne said:

Yay! SMP hand-to-labia collisions are working for me! Thank you, @Gromilla !

  Reveal hidden contents

 

 


 

 

Hi, I'm new to SSE physics. Anyway you can link the files you are using to achieve this effect please? Is this also possible with CBBE version or just UNP? 

[GodWearsGucci]

Anyone else notice comments being deleted talking about UUNP on the bodyslide mod page or CBBE on the nexus? Just tried helping a guy port over UUNP for himself and my comments were deleted lol. I really hope someone comes up with a body mod other than CBBE. I will never use that now.

[SpyVsPie]

1 hour ago, OmegaNovaios said:

Hi, I'm new to SSE physics. Anyway you can link the files you are using to achieve this effect please? Is this also possible with CBBE version or just UNP? 

works with CBBE out of the box with the SMP config file on the CBBE nexus page.

[KaribouOfDoom]

On 11/19/2018 at 5:28 AM, Gromilla said:

I adapted this by picking up @Vyxenne and I would hardly have worked with this clothing if it were not for her request
The main problem was already voiced here more than once - this is an excess of the bone limit (for the SE it is 80 bones) for one shape in the nif file. In this dress, there were 81 in the mesh of the skirt and corset. So we had to split the mesh and restore the weight of the bones. This can be done in the 3D program, but since I am a noob in this, I had to do everything in Outfit Studio. The most important thing after splitting the mesh into parts is to precisely split the bones of the skeleton into new parts of the mesh and check all the weight of the bones. Otherwise there will be holes or strong distortions of the mesh and the game. Do not know whether it is necessary to explain the separation process in more detail, this has already been described many times. And editing of scales and transfer of bones in each case is different. And each time you have to “dance with a tambourine” around the mesh in order to ensure the correct operation of all the clothes in its entirety.
And of course, you need to add new parts of the mesh to the ml file and configure collisions.
I do not even know what else to help with the explanation
The same problem exists in some wigs and other clothes.

You did all that in Outfit Studio?!  ? Wow.  Consider me duly impressed!!  I understand the painstaking nature of grouping mesh zones and settting up weight maps, but I didn't know about the 80-bone limit.  (Totally makes sense from a hardware resource perspective, though.)  My 3D experience is in art and animation.  Simulations are set up ahead of time and then run while you sleep or are uploaded to a render farm, so I'm used to dealing with high-res, subdivided mesh.  I regularly deal with upwards of 25 bones in a figure's FACE, lol.  I'm finding myself pretty amazed by what has been done within the nif limitations. And that's even before I think about the custom xml that goes into these projects.  I now understand why there's not much "flowing/draping" physics-enabled content out there!

On 11/19/2018 at 3:10 AM, Yinkle said:

I couldn't get the blender nif plugin to export without messing up the rigging. After reading the wiki it seems there's an issue with exporting transforms. If you want to change the shape of an smp/pe enabled outfit for sse then you have to re-skin the skirt bones and 3ds max + nif plugin appears to be the only option. Sadly documentation on this is pretty limited. I found this article which has some useful tips: https://beyondskyrim.org/rigging-3ds-max/

Thanks for that link.  I'll look into it. I am admittedly terrible at actually creating any type of soft-body/organic mesh from scratch, but I could probably manage a re-rig of something already out there.  The more I read about this, though, the more I think I probably will never have the time to do anything that ambitious.  With my luck, I'd finish my crowning achievement just in time for Skyrim's 10th anniversary and the roll-out of TES VI, which I'm convinced will happen at the same time. 

 

Thanks for the help, all.  I'll be lurking and learning...

[turtle321]

anyone had any luck using CBP(C) for body and SMP for hair?

 

When I have them both installed in the data directory the SMP hair stretches to the floor, but I have the CBP body collisions.

 

While, if I have SMP in data directory and CBP through MO, SMP overrides the body collisions.

 

Is there a way to make SMP just do the hair?

 

Cheers

[full_inu]

46 minutes ago, turtle321 said:

anyone had any luck using CBP(C) for body and SMP for hair?

 

When I have them both installed in the data directory the SMP hair stretches to the floor, but I have the CBP body collisions.

 

While, if I have SMP in data directory and CBP through MO, SMP overrides the body collisions.

 

Is there a way to make SMP just do the hair?

 

Cheers

Looks like you need to delete body part from every hair NIF. And leave only hair (delete head).

[turtle321]

12 hours ago, turtle321 said:

anyone had any luck using CBP(C) for body and SMP for hair?

 

When I have them both installed in the data directory the SMP hair stretches to the floor, but I have the CBP body collisions.

 

While, if I have SMP in data directory and CBP through MO, SMP overrides the body collisions.

 

Is there a way to make SMP just do the hair?

 

Cheers

Nevermind I got it to work.

 

CBPC in MO

 

SMP in data directory. Remove reference to body in defaultbpps

[Vyxenne]

On 11/21/2018 at 10:40 AM, GodWearsGucci said:

Anyone else notice comments being deleted talking about UUNP on the bodyslide mod page or CBBE on the nexus? Just tried helping a guy port over UUNP for himself and my comments were deleted lol. I really hope someone comes up with a body mod other than CBBE. I will never use that now.

They regularly delete any posts about UUNP in Bodyslide. One of them (not Ousnius) has now taken to outright saying "UNP is not compatible with Bodyslide."

 

 

 

 

I'm pretty sure this is an outright lie since thousands of us are using SSE Bodyslide for UUNP every day. There is a difference between "we have chosen not to support UUNP any more and have deliberately removed the UUNP files from SSE Bodyslide" and "Bodyslide is not compatible with UUNP." It just stinks.

 

For my part, I have stopped responding to anyone in the Bodyslide thread, and I have started backing up my entire Bodyslide folder weekly in case their next step is to poison my UUNP files when Bodyslide phones home the first time I launch it every day. If they will outright lie about it publicly, I no longer trust them not to take active measures to disable my existing installation and files I created.

 

Here is a short guide I wrote to getting your tasty UUNP stuff back into SSE Bodyslide:

Adding UUNP to SSE Bodyslide

The CBBE Team removed all of the UUNP stuff from Bodyslide, apparently to force people to switch to their CBBE body against their will because "UUNP doesn't work in Bodyslide any more."

 

You need to get the UUNP Presets, Templates, Slidersets and Groups into SSE Bodyslide.:

 

Skip these steps if you already have an Oldrim Bodyslide installation with UUNP.

1. Manually download Bodyslide FOR OLDRIM from Skyrim Nexus but DO NOT INSTALL IT.
2. Extract the archive to some convenient place that you can find again.

 

Now, either from your existing Oldrim Bodyslide OR a newly-extracted version of it:

1. Back up your current SSE Data\CalienteTools\Bodyslide folder just in case something goes wrong in the following steps.
2. From the Oldrim Data\CalienteTools\Bodyslide folder, multiselect the ShapeData, SliderCategories, SliderGroups & SliderPresets folders and Copy them.
3. Now go to your SSE Data\CalienteTools\Bodyslide folder and Paste the copied Oldrim folders into it so as to merge the Oldrim folders with the identically-named SSE folders. Be careful not to overwrite any of the new CBBE stuff with the Old CBBE stuff from Oldrim because new CBBE and old CBBE are incompatible.
4. Now, merge the Oldrim RefTemplates.xml with the SSE (all-CBBE) one by Copy>>Pasting the internal UUNP entries from the Oldrim RefTemplates.xml into the SSE one. Be careful not to select any CBBE entries, and also do NOT include the opening and closing tags (first and last lines) of the Oldrim xml file because they are already in the new SSE xml file. You will find Notepad++ very helpful for this but if you don't have that and don't want to get it, Notepad will also work for this.
5. Finally, run NifOptimizer on the Shapedata folder to update the meshes there to SSE specs.
6. Once you have done the above, which takes no more than 5 minutes, you will be able to use SSE Bodyslide to create and modify all that UUNP goodness in SSE.

[Vyxenne]

On 11/21/2018 at 8:51 AM, OmegaNovaios said:

Hi, I'm new to SSE physics. Anyway you can link the files you are using to achieve this effect please? Is this also possible with CBBE version or just UNP? 

Here is the group that Gromilla put together, slightly modified by me:

SMP-XMLs-Gromilla-Vyxenne

 

They won't work in CBBE as-is because they point to UUNP shape-names. Also, I have read that CBBE has a working SMP-XML setup on the CBBE page on SSE Nexus, so I would start there for any CBBE stuff.

[GodWearsGucci]

4 hours ago, Vyxenne said:

They regularly delete any posts about UUNP in Bodyslide. One of them (not Ousnius) has now taken to outright saying "UNP is not compatible with Bodyslide."

  Reveal hidden contents

 

 

 

I'm pretty sure this is an outright lie since thousands of us are using SSE Bodyslide for UUNP every day. There is a difference between "we have chosen not to support UUNP any more and have deliberately removed the UUNP files from SSE Bodyslide" and "Bodyslide is not compatible with UUNP." It just stinks.

 

For my part, I have stopped responding to anyone in the Bodyslide thread, and I have started backing up my entire Bodyslide folder weekly in case their next step is to poison my UUNP files when Bodyslide phones home the first time I launch it every day. If they will outright lie about it publicly, I no longer trust them not to take active measures to disable my existing installation and files I created.

 

Here is a short guide I wrote to getting your tasty UUNP stuff back into SSE Bodyslide:

 

  Reveal hidden contents

 

 

Adding UUNP to SSE Bodyslide

The CBBE Team removed all of the UUNP stuff from Bodyslide, apparently to force people to switch to their CBBE body against their will because "UUNP doesn't work in Bodyslide any more."

 

You need to get the UUNP Presets, Templates, Slidersets and Groups into SSE Bodyslide.:

 

Skip these steps if you already have an Oldrim Bodyslide installation with UUNP.

 

1. Manually download Bodyslide FOR OLDRIM from Skyrim Nexus but DO NOT INSTALL IT.
2. Extract the archive to some convenient place that you can find again.

 

Now, either from your existing Oldrim Bodyslide OR a newly-extracted version of it:

1. Back up your current SSE Data\CalienteTools\Bodyslide folder just in case something goes wrong in the following steps.
2. From the Oldrim Data\CalienteTools\Bodyslide folder, multiselect the ShapeData, SliderCategories, SliderGroups & SliderPresets folders and Copy them.
3. Now go to your SSE Data\CalienteTools\Bodyslide folder and Paste the copied Oldrim folders into it so as to merge the Oldrim folders with the identically-named SSE folders. Be careful not to overwrite any of the new CBBE stuff with the Old CBBE stuff from Oldrim because new CBBE and old CBBE are incompatible.
4. Now, merge the Oldrim RefTemplates.xml with the SSE (all-CBBE) one by Copy>>Pasting the internal UUNP entries from the Oldrim RefTemplates.xml into the SSE one. Be careful not to select any CBBE entries, and also do NOT include the opening and closing tags (first and last lines) of the Oldrim xml file because they are already in the new SSE xml file. You will find Notepad++ very helpful for this but if you don't have that and don't want to get it, Notepad will also work for this.
5. Finally, run NifOptimizer on the Shapedata folder to update the meshes there to SSE specs.
6. Once you have done the above, which takes no more than 5 minutes, you will be able to use SSE Bodyslide to create and modify all that UUNP goodness in SSE.

 

 

I was only helping out someone that wanted help porting it. Then the other admin for the modpage flat out said they don't want anyone using UUNP in Skyrim SE and that it doesn't work. 

[Vyxenne]

2 hours ago, GodWearsGucci said:

I was only helping out someone that wanted help porting it. Then the other admin for the modpage flat out said they don't want anyone using UUNP in Skyrim SE and that it doesn't work. 

Yes, I know. And obviously, UUNP works fine in SSE.

[Aldebaran]

Sounds like a ripe topic for a Nexus forum discussion. The mod admins can't delete anything from there.

[nappilydeestruction]

OH right, UUNP should not be allow to be used with Bodyslide.....?

 

Amazing really.....

[noreg]

On 1/20/2018 at 10:46 AM, thisnameisrequired said:

I got it working after having the same difficulties as you.

 

My solution: open up malebody_0 and malebody_1 in nifskope from data/meshes/actors/character/character assets and rename the genitals object in the .nif from "malegenitals xxxx" to simply "malegenitals". The second thing I did was add the genital xml code to the malebody.xml from Farass's suggestion (but removing the "_muscular" part). I changed no other XML. Now it works. 

 

I have the same problem, no collision with the male bodyparts.

 

Reply to post 354:

 

Sorry to ask but which "genitals object" in the malebody.nif you speak of?

i do not have something like that.

Perhaps you can be so kind and Post your files?

[Voltanis]

I searched this thread and couldn't find anyone who posted about TMBE. I'm just curious if its possible to get that body working with this?

[R246]

3 hours ago, Juugon said:

I searched this thread and couldn't find anyone who posted about TMBE. I'm just curious if its possible to get that body working with this?

TMBE is lacking a 3D vagina, so it'll function as a basic HDT body only.

[Vyxenne]

On 1/20/2018 at 3:46 AM, thisnameisrequired said:

I got it working after having the same difficulties as you.

 

My solution: open up malebody_0 and malebody_1 in nifskope from data/meshes/actors/character/character assets and rename the genitals object in the .nif from "malegenitals xxxx" to simply "malegenitals". The second thing I did was add the genital xml code to the malebody.xml from Farass's suggestion (but removing the "_muscular" part). I changed no other XML. Now it works. 

I believe it would be much better to fix the xml's to point to the actual malebody shapes than to change the malebody shape names themselves.

 

And yes, I realize this post is almost a year old, but now that someone has necro'd it I wanted to respond before too many people put themselves in the position of losing malebody collisions every time they update SoS or Tempered Skins or [insert name of other full-featured male body mods here].

[sharonasbar12]

So if I want to use cbp with hdt-smp, I have to go in the hdt physics file and delete body references. Hopefully that is correct. I only want to use the smp hair mods. Wouldn't it be easier to say which lines not to delete? There are so many body references, I don't want to delete the wrong ones. I would then save the hdt physics file with a new name.

[Vyxenne]

3 hours ago, sharonasbar12 said:

So if I want to use cbp with hdt-smp, I have to go in the hdt physics file and delete body references.

Yes, if by "hdt physics file" you mean DefaultBBPs.xml, and if by "body references" you mean "body shape name declaration."

 

3 hours ago, sharonasbar12 said:

I only want to use the smp hair mods.

SMP in SSE supports only equippable-item physics (so far.) Therefore, there is no actual "hair physics" possible in SSE yet- it is only simulated by equippable-wig physics. This is an important distinction since many people erroneously believe, and write about, hair physics in SSE as we had in Oldrim, i.e. physics hairstyles selected during character creation or via Racemenu or a few other hairdo-changing mods. It's simply not possible in SSE- wig physics is all we have.

 

All the SMP equippable-item physics rely on per-item xml files, generally stored in the same folder as the item meshes or a nearby folder. So, for example, in my Data\meshes\armor\scarletdawn folder, I have 2 files named scarletdawn_torso_1.nif and scarletdawn_torso_0.nif, the high- and low-weight meshes for the armor. Inside the meshes, there is a line of data pointing to Data\meshes\armor\scarletdawn\sc.xml (the same folder the meshes are in.) Thjis sc.xml file is the SMP file for the armor. There are no other SMP files associated with that armor, so the only way I could "turn physics off" for that armor would be to move or rename sc.xml, or to remove the NiStringExtraData that points to that file from inside the armor meshes.

 

So, there is no "master switch" for equippable-item physics items- if you have HDT-SMP working, it will provide physics for any and all SMP-capable equippable items that have valid SMP xml files. It does this automatically. So technically, the only way you can use only wig mods is to avoid installing any earrings, amulets or clothing/armor that has SMP physics.

 

3 hours ago, sharonasbar12 said:

Wouldn't it be easier to say which lines not to delete?

No, it wouldn't. See below.

 

3 hours ago, sharonasbar12 said:

There are so many body references, I don't want to delete the wrong ones.

There is only one body shape reference. In my case it's "UUNP." Yours might be "CBBE."

 

3 hours ago, sharonasbar12 said:

I would then save the hdt physics file with a new name.

"The hdt physics file" is DefaultBBPs.xml. It will not work under any other name. The body-shape-name file is UUNP-body in my case, yours may be different. You could disable body physics by removing or renaming UUNP-body.xml, but I prefer using the switch on the wall to turn off the lights in a room, and deleting or renaming the UUNP-body file is like unscrewing the lightbulbs instead of using the switch.  So I would suggest just using the switch as shown below so that you have 100% reversion option at any time.

 

Here is an image of my DefaultBBPs.xml contents with the body physics disabled by "commenting out" the UUNP shape. In xml, you comment-out a declaration by putting

 <!-- 

in front of whatever you want to disable, and

 --> 

at the end of whatever you want to disable. By commenting it out instead of deleting it, or even worse, deleting or renaming the entire file, you retain your ability to re-enable body physics when you finally come to your senses.

Note that I have disabled only the body shape declaration: "UUNP." All the rest are for collisions only and don't control whether or not I get body physics.

 

Hope this helps you.

[sharonasbar12]

On 11/25/2018 at 12:43 PM, Vyxenne said:

Yes, if by "hdt physics file" you mean DefaultBBPs.xml, and if by "body references" you mean "body shape name declaration."

 

SMP in SSE supports only equippable-item physics (so far.) Therefore, there is no actual "hair physics" possible in SSE yet- it is only simulated by equippable-wig physics. This is an important distinction since many people erroneously believe, and write about, hair physics in SSE as we had in Oldrim, i.e. physics hairstyles selected during character creation or via Racemenu or a few other hairdo-changing mods. It's simply not possible in SSE- wig physics is all we have.

 

All the SMP equippable-item physics rely on per-item xml files, generally stored in the same folder as the item meshes or a nearby folder. So, for example, in my Data\meshes\armor\scarletdawn folder, I have 2 files named scarletdawn_torso_1.nif and scarletdawn_torso_0.nif, the high- and low-weight meshes for the armor. Inside the meshes, there is a line of data pointing to Data\meshes\armor\scarletdawn\sc.xml (the same folder the meshes are in.) Thjis sc.xml file is the SMP file for the armor. There are no other SMP files associated with that armor, so the only way I could "turn physics off" for that armor would be to move or rename sc.xml, or to remove the NiStringExtraData that points to that file from inside the armor meshes.

 

So, there is no "master switch" for equippable-item physics items- if you have HDT-SMP working, it will provide physics for any and all SMP-capable equippable items that have valid SMP xml files. It does this automatically. So technically, the only way you can use only wig mods is to avoid installing any earrings, amulets or clothing/armor that has SMP physics.

 

No, it wouldn't. See below.

 

There is only one body shape reference. In my case it's "UUNP." Yours might be "CBBE."

 

"The hdt physics file" is DefaultBBPs.xml. It will not work under any other name. The body-shape-name file is UUNP-body in my case, yours may be different. You could disable body physics by removing or renaming UUNP-body.xml, but I prefer using the switch on the wall to turn off the lights in a room, and deleting or renaming the UUNP-body file is like unscrewing the lightbulbs instead of using the switch.  So I would suggest just using the switch as shown below so that you have 100% reversion option at any time.

 

Here is an image of my DefaultBBPs.xml contents with the body physics disabled by "commenting out" the UUNP shape. In xml, you comment-out a declaration by putting

 <!-- 

in front of whatever you want to disable, and

 --> 

at the end of whatever you want to disable. By commenting it out instead of deleting it, or even worse, deleting or renaming the entire file, you retain your ability to re-enable body physics when you finally come to your senses.

Note that I have disabled only the body shape declaration: "UUNP." All the rest are for collisions only and don't control whether or not I get body physics.

 

Hope this helps you.

I'm sorry, I should have been more specific. Yes I meant wigs. KS wigs to be honest. The rest is very clear, I do have cbbe. Thank you very kindly for taking the time to point these things out. Also would I need and have to edit the cbbe smp config file or do I only need the hdt smp framwork and physics files?

Edit... yea cbbe cmp config is for the body. Of course I don't need it DUH. This worked out perfectly. Thank You again libertine!

[Vyxenne]

I'm trying to color an SMP wig.  Read the following how-to on Page 3 of this forum.:

"... move to the bottom pane, scroll down till you see "Hair Tint Color" - this is the one to tweak.

Double click on the little colour wheel to bring up an interactive one, or double click the hex colour value to enter numbers directly as RGB values."

 

On an auburn ("redhead") wig, I have the following "RGB values": 0.330, 0.200, 0.200. These are not "hex color values." They aren't RGB values either- RGB ranges from 0 to 255 and a fractional RGB value between zero and less than one would be such a light tint as to be virtually undetectable.

 

Can someone please tell me what format "0.330, 0.200, 0.200" could possibly be so I can recolor a wig? Thanks.

[Vortec]

 Is SMP-PE (mempatch) Still required?, one I found in my Load order is dated from March 6 2018.