HDT SMP for SSE?

[cminnow]

6 hours ago, Vyxenne said:

Thanks for this link! I finally have my boobs under control!

 

Using the values @zarzil cited, all the (female) breasts in my game were static, as though I didn't have a physics system installed, but by reducing Mass from 1.5 to 1.0, inertia from 100 to 20, linear damping from 0.9 to 0.5 and angular damping from 1 to 0.5, I got lots of motion- still a bit too much for my tastes- but no more jitters at all when standing still! Tonight, I plan to increase inertia in increments of 10 and damping in increments of 0.1 until I see more realistic movement. I'll shoot a short video when I get them puppies tamed...

Have you tried some of my settings? Restricting motion range can help with the jitter by limiting the upper and lower range of motion but it's better to get the underlying physics the way you want them by changing stiffness and damping directly (but that's time consuming).

 

The two biggest sources of ugly jittery motion are the y angular motion (so set a low y-angular limit like +/-0.5 unless you like a bit of titty twisting....) and by having basis or origin values that are non-zero (set them ALL to ZERO because it forces unnatural physics which can't be damped easily and generally won't be applicable to all body positions). Other than that, a sufficient amount of stiffness AND damping (think of increased stiffness as a bigger tree branch to hold things up and increased damping as a larger root support, you can't have one without the other or you'll have a very sad tree) are guaranteed to reduce jitter completely but at the cost of possibly less realistic motion.

 

One last note: Jitter is an underlying failure of the physics system. If you're seeing jitter, your physics calculations are failing to dampen the current motion (which may lead to a crash in extreme circumstances) and you're probably way over taxing your system doing useless calculations on garbage. That's why ZERO values are very important as 0 times anything is computationally very cheap and returns the system to equilibrium more easily thus leading to stability.

[Vyxenne]

18 hours ago, cminnow said:

Have you tried some of my settings?

No, because all of your xml's seem to be for CBBE and I'm one of those diehard UUNP Luddites. The bones are different. The motions are different. Everything is different. So no. If you have done any UUNP xml's I'd love to learn from them.

 

18 hours ago, cminnow said:

Restricting motion range can help with the jitter by limiting the upper and lower range of motion but it's better to get the underlying physics the way you want them by changing stiffness and damping directly (but that's time consuming).

 

The two biggest sources of ugly jittery motion are the y angular motion (so set a low y-angular limit like +/-0.5 unless you like a bit of titty twisting....) and by having basis or origin values that are non-zero (set them ALL to ZERO because it forces unnatural physics which can't be damped easily and generally won't be applicable to all body positions). Other than that, a sufficient amount of stiffness AND damping (think of increased stiffness as a bigger tree branch to hold things up and increased damping as a larger root support, you can't have one without the other or you'll have a very sad tree) are guaranteed to reduce jitter completely but at the cost of possibly less realistic motion.

 

One last note: Jitter is an underlying failure of the physics system. If you're seeing jitter, your physics calculations are failing to dampen the current motion (which may lead to a crash in extreme circumstances) and you're probably way over taxing your system doing useless calculations on garbage. That's why ZERO values are very important as 0 times anything is computationally very cheap and returns the system to equilibrium more easily thus leading to stability.

I may have misled you by citing "jitter." The breast movements I'm getting are smooth, fluid and would be realistic if my breasts were half-filled water balloons. What I meant by "jitter" is breast movement absent any causative body movement. I made a little video to tease Sam Teh Cruel from the Outlaws and Revolutionaries mod that perfectly illustrates what I was (but won't any more) calling "jitter:"

 

Spoiler

 

 

My UUNP-Body.xml has 4 breast bones that my UUNP-Special body does not have. The only breast bones actually in my body are "NPC L Breast 01" and "NPC R Breast 01." Yet the xml also has "NPC Pre-Breast" (L & R) and "NPC Breast" (L & R.) So, of course, given the haphazard way that most of our xml's evolved, with many spoons stirring the pot, I don't know what to do about the bones in the xml but not in my body- why are "we" declaring, defining and dealing with arcane motion settings for bones that don't exist? Are they holdovers from (for example) a CBBE xml?

 

As to your suggested values to try in order to tone down my rampant motions (I'm more of a "blatant" kind of girl - "wanton," even, so these "rampant" boobs have to go ☺ ) I'll apply your suggestions to all 6 "breast-like"  bones in the xml, whether real or imagined, and give them a try before I do anything else. Thanks. ♥♥♥

 

EDIT to add: Setting Basis and Origin values to zero in all 6 breast-like bone declarations removed all breasts from feminine chests and sent them plummeting to the center of the earth. Really. So I reverted all changes from backup and then set mass, inertia and damping as detailed above but only in the 4 "NPC Breast xxxxx" bones, leaving the "NPC Pre Breast" entries the hell alone. This resulted in reasonably normal breast movements.

 

I could not find any declaration or parameter labeled "angular limit" so I can't "set a low y-angular limit like +/-0.5." I'll keep looking, because I do recall seeing angular limits somewhere- but they're not in my breast-like bone declarations.

 

My next step is to set all four basis/origin axes (x, y, z and w, wtf-ever a "w" axis is) to 0 but again leaving the two "Pre Breast" imaginary bones alone.

 

 

 

[jesseg]

NPC Pre-Breast is a kinematic bone, basically a bone that has a skin modifier but is not physics enabled, it's static...

So all values for the Pre-Breast bones should be zero, except under basis where w=1

Other than those two kinematic bones, there are 4 other breast bones for UUNP, NPC LR Breast and NPC LR Breast 01, these are physics enabled bones, you can change values for these but not for Pre-Breast....

Im sure there is a way to add the NPC RL breast bone in nifskope/outfit studio.....but i don't know how to do that, i just copy them from another nif and then weight them in outfit studio....I know this doesn't help much but at least you now know what the NPC Pre-Breast is for....

 

Also, please correct me if I am wrong.....Thanks

 

 

 

[Gromilla]

 

27 minutes ago, jesseg said:

NPC Pre-Breast is a kinematic bone, basically a bone that has a skin modifier but is not physics enabled, it's static...

So all values for the Pre-Breast bones should be zero, except under basis where w=1

Other than those two kinematic bones, there are 4 other breast bones for UUNP, NPC LR Breast and NPC LR Breast 01, these are physics enabled bones, you can change values for these but not for Pre-Breast....

Im sure there is a way to add the NPC RL breast bone in nifskope/outfit studio.....but i don't know how to do that, i just copy them from another nif and then weight them in outfit studio....I know this doesn't help much but at least you now know what the NPC Pre-Breast is for....

 

Also, please correct me if I am wrong.....Thanks

 

 

 

Just past in body from skeleton in Outfit studio.  Look at the xpmsse skeleton (female :)) as attached and what else are the bones that are needed in the body. But if there were no bones in the body, then with simple copying you need to draw the weight of the mesh, otherwise everything will fall to the floor  In the base bodies, the final bones are fixed and weighed, as if attached to the mesh. All the most important lies in the skeleton.

 

[cminnow]

2 hours ago, Vyxenne said:

 

My next step is to set all four basis/origin axes (x, y, z and w, wtf-ever a "w" axis is) to 0 but again leaving the two "Pre Breast" imaginary bones alone.

 

 

Oh I'm sorry. I didn't mean to say to set EVERYTHING to zero. Here's a UUNP.xml I found and changed to my settings. It doesn't appear that UUNP has more bones as far as I can tell. Really the only difference is you would have to change the per-triangle-shape name to "UUNP" instead of "CBBE" as in mine I believe (though UUNP may have more butt or lady part bones).

 

As for the "6 breast-like bones", they are actually 4 "bones" or node anchors for where your first bone (inner boob?) and outer bone (outer boob?) would be. The last 2 are instead describe the physical connection between the 2 anchor points (for each boob).

UUNP.xml

[Vyxenne]

4 hours ago, cminnow said:

Really the only difference is you would have to change the per-triangle-shape name to "UUNP" instead of "CBBE" as in mine I believe (though UUNP may have more butt or lady part bones).

Well, as you hinted at, UUNP has at least 1 bone (Belly) that CBBE doesn't have, but the last time I looked at a "new CBBE" body it has Breast01's and Breas02's so two extra breast bones, plus (going from memory, don't have one to look at) extra thigh and forearm bones too.

 

Trying to convert a CBBE xml to UUNP reminds me of something my dad used to say- "You might as well try to bolt a Ford manifold on a Chevy, baby- although they look alike and serve the same purpose, they might as well have come from different planets." (He told me that about me and my first husband but I refused to listen and he turned out to have been right the whole time.)

 

My problem with trying to "convert" a CBBE xml to UUNP is, given that I already know about so-called bones that don't actually exist *cough*PreBreast*cough*, I don't know which of the bones in converted CBBE xml's should be left alone even though they are don't actually exist in UUNP bodies.

 

In other words, I can't tell the "real" fake bones from the "fake" fake bones  so I just don't delete (or comment out) any of them. As a result of that ignorance on my part, I'm very leery of any converted-from-CBBE xml's.

 

The xml you linked is missing at least one breast bone (L+R) so I'm not able to just pop it into my game and test it.

Here is my current xml (as edited so far today.) It came to me from Gromilla and work fine, although it chews up my fps in crowds of females and has ridiculous amounts of breast movement. Please note the non-zero origin and basis parameters for the breasts.

Vyxenne's UUNP.xml

[Vyxenne]

1 hour ago, Gromilla said:

 

Just past in body from skeleton in Outfit studio.  Look at the xpmsse skeleton (female :)) as attached and what else are the bones that are needed in the body. But if there were no bones in the body, then with simple copying you need to draw the weight of the mesh, otherwise everything will fall to the floor  In the base bodies, the final bones are fixed and weighed, as if attached to the mesh. All the most important lies in the skeleton.

 

Hey, friend, where have you been? ♥

I have no trouble adding BBB physics bones to outfits, I do it all the time. However, there is only 1 bone in the body (two counting L & R) that can be added: NPC L/R Breast. There is no NPC Breast01 or NPC Breast02 in the UUNP body, at least as far as Outfit Studio knows.

 

So thanks for your guidance but painting bone weights onto outfits (or anything else in Outfit Studio or NifSkope) isn't the subject  @cminnow and @jesseg  are trying to help me understand- it's these execrable xml's! I'm using your UUNP-body.xml but trying to tame the jitter and tone down the overall breast movement to a credible level.

 

[rb888]

On 12/13/2018 at 12:35 AM, Matsuho said:

Hello,

 

Does one of you have the latest hdt physic and hdt framework for the last update of sse (1.5.62) all the mod i use have all been updated so i can update my game but i will need these 2 i used to get them from the site but my translator not working anymore and i cant read chinese unfortunately to find where to log in, so if one of you could send me the files or the link for the log in it would be really appreciated thanks you.

Yes I do but you have to PM me if you want the files will upload to mediafire anyone else please feel pm I got them from 9down

[cminnow]

To explain the underlying physics of the configs a better for those who care to understand more about it:

 

The first two bones, NPC L PreBreast and NPC R PreBreast, should have zero mass (and basically all zeros) and thus zero moment so that it acts as a true grounded anchor point meaning that it can NEVER move. Without this, the physics would be unbound and you'd see classic infinite stretch boob.

 

The next two bones, NPC L Breast and NPC R Breast, will give you an object that can move freely in the environment. So for this, you're going to want to add some mass and inertia. Mass times acceleration gives you your forces that give you nice wobbly bits and though they call it "inertia" it really just acts as a modifier to how much force there is (think of being on the moon being an inertia of 0.1 to Earth being 1.0 and 0 would cause you to float away forever aka "boob stretch").

 

You'll notice I have ignored the values below center of mass transform which are damping, friction, and restriction. That's because you wouldn't want them to effect the prebreast since it "can't move". The origin and basis do something like defining an offset for the node in space. Think of it like holding a rubber band where you aren't straining at all. Then try holding the rubber band apart with this "offset" and you start to put a lot of energy (and weird physics which can be good if you WANT an unstable motion) in your motions. So the other options of damping, friction, and restitution act similar to "inertia" in that they change certain entire forces by a percentage (so damping 0.1 would offer a slightly slower response, 0.5 would be like watching molasses drip and 1.0 would basically "stop time"). Usually this is fine at zero but if you find a slight "sway" to motions appealing, you might want a value of 0.1 for these.

 

Finally, the last two bones define the physical conditions or "the rubber band" between the anchor and the pivot point. As I've mentioned before linearLower/UpperLimit and  angularLower/UpperLimit define the maximum motion in this directions from their origin (which is why we set origin and basis to 0 usually). I described stiffness and damping before but to stick with the rubber band analogy, a higher stiffness is like a thicker rubber band and a higher damping is like adding shock absorbers to your rubber band. Thus a low stiffness, or weak rubber band, leads to droopy physics and low damping leads to uncontrollable motion. Of course, excessively high stiffness or damping also leads to uncontrollable motion (like if I were you push you and you kicked me across the room).  The equilibrium values are similar to the basis and origin so I usually leave them at zero. And finally, as far as I can tell, bounce does nothing (please prove me wrong).

[cminnow]

2 hours ago, Vyxenne said:

Hey, friend, where have you been? ♥

I have no trouble adding BBB physics bones to outfits, I do it all the time. However, there is only 1 bone in the body (two counting L & R) that can be added: NPC L/R Breast. There is no NPC Breast01 or NPC Breast02 in the UUNP body, at least as far as Outfit Studio knows.

 

So thanks for your guidance but painting bone weights onto outfits (or anything else in Outfit Stuyido or NifSkope) isn't the subject  @cminnow and @jesseg  are trying to help me understand- it's these damned xml's. I'm using your UUNP-body.xml but trying to tame the jitter and tone down the overall breast movement to a credible level.

 

 

If you're testing things out, here's the value ranges to try and recommendations:

 

mass 0.1 - 10 recommend 2

inertia 0.1 - 1 recommend 0.5

basis -2 - 2 recommend 0

origin -2 - 2  recommend 0 except perhaps origin z = -2 to introduce instability

linearDamping, angularDamping, rollingFriction, restitution  0 - 1 recommend 0.1 for slight delay or 0 for instantaneous reaction 

 

linearLowerLimit -20 - 0 recommend x="-5" y="-20" z="-20" for left and x="-10" y="-20" z="-20" for right

linearUpperLimit 0 - 20 recommend x="10" y="5" z="20" for left and x="5" y="5" z="20" for right

angularLowerLimit -1.5 - 0 recommend x="-1.5" y="-0.5" z="-1.5" for left and  x="-0.5" y="-0.5" z="-1.5" for right

angularUpperLimit 0 - 1.5 recommend x="1.5" y="0.5" z="1.5" for left and x="1.5" y="0.5" z="1.5" for right

linearStiffness 10-10000 recommend 200

angularStiffness 10-10000 recommend 80

angularDamping 1-100 recommend 12

angularDamping 1-100 recommend 10

linearEquilibrium ???? recommend 0

angularEquilibrium ???? recommend 0

linearBounce ???? recommend 1

angularBounce ???? recommend 1

 

A good thing to remember is that positive x is to your left (or your character), negative y is directly forward (or where your character is looking) and positive z is upwards. Thus the angular equivalents of these are where x is like a front flip, y is like flipping on your side (or titty twisting), and z is spinning in place (or like a swaying motion). Also, units for motion are something relative to your bone scale so 1 is usually a good number. Hence, 1 for angular motion means 1 full rotation (of a boob) and 1 for linear means 1 full movement (or about the length of a boob). 

 

[jesseg]

Attached is a UUNP body with breast bones that you are looking for, open your femalebody and this one up in nifskope, copy the LR Breast01 from UUNP dismemberment skin, and then weight them in outfit studio....

femalebody_1test.nif

[Vyxenne]

15 minutes ago, jesseg said:

Attached is a UUNP body with breast bones that you are looking for, open your femalebody and this one up in nifskope, copy the LR Breast01 from UUNP dismemberment skin, and then weight them in outfit studio....

femalebody_1test.nif

OK, thanks, but my UUNP bodies all come from Bodyslide\Shapedata or somewhere similar- almost nothing I wear in-game was converted to SSE when I got it, and the BodySlide Team had removed all vestiges of UUNP from Bodyslide, so I had to copy-in the UUNP female body from Oldrim. I read something somewhere (a long time ago in a Ford Galaxie far, far away) that overwriting the Shapedata body with femalebody_1.nif from my live game was not a good idea because the Bodyslide reference bodies used some proprietary skeleton (or something) and if I overwrote them with femalebody_1.nif the moon would fly out of its orbit and the planet would be engulfed in a massive solar flare... or something similarly disastrous.

 

TL; DR:

1. Is it safe for me to overwrite the Bodyslide reference UUNP body with my femalebody_1.nif, with or without extra the breast bones?

2. If I do #1 above, is there some way to replace the reference UUNP-HDT or UUNP-Special reference bodies in my outfits without replacing them one at a time, opening every Project (hundreds of them) and manually replacing each reference body?

[cminnow]

12 minutes ago, jesseg said:

Attached is a UUNP body with breast bones that you are looking for, open your femalebody and this one up in nifskope, copy the LR Breast01 from UUNP dismemberment skin, and then weight them in outfit studio....

femalebody_1test.nif

Wow. I need someone to show me a good way to learn how to do that some time. I'm also amazed at that UUNP has a lot fewer vertices but has more bones. What are all the bones for besides belly bouncing??

[jesseg]

@Vyxenneyeah, i'm not sure about that, your guess is as good as mine....sorry

[jesseg]

5 minutes ago, cminnow said:

Wow. I need someone to show me a good way to learn how to do that some time. I'm also amazed at that UUNP has a lot fewer vertices but has more bones. What are all the bones for besides belly bouncing??

Thighs, calves, belly, vagina, butt, breast physics....

[cminnow]

@Vyxenne Oh, I just saw your video as it was hidden. I think I might know what might be causing that. Do you have random collisions with objects happening? It's really better that boobs don't collide with anything besides hands (.... and maybe dongs?). Make sure you have a no collide tag set for the entire body. I believe this is what you should have...

 

    <per-triangle-shape name="UUNP">
        <margin>0.0</margin>
        <prenetration>0.2</prenetration>
        <tag>body</tag>
        <no-collide-with-tag>body</no-collide-with-tag>
        <no-collide-with-tag>MaleBody</no-collide-with-tag>
        <no-collide-with-tag>Lbreast</no-collide-with-tag>
        <no-collide-with-tag>Rbreast</no-collide-with-tag>
        <no-collide-with-tag>Belly</no-collide-with-tag>
    </per-triangle-shape>

[Vyxenne]

Well, here's what I have:

  <per-triangle-shape name="UUNP">
    <margin>0.04</margin>
    <penetration>0.04</penetration>
    <tag>body</tag>
	<no-collide-with-tag>body</no-collide-with-tag>
	<no-collide-with-tag>Labia</no-collide-with-tag>
	<no-collide-with-tag>Genitals</no-collide-with-tag>
	<no-collide-with-tag>Lbreast</no-collide-with-tag>
	<no-collide-with-tag>Rbreast</no-collide-with-tag>
	<no-collide-with-tag>Belly</no-collide-with-tag>
	<no-collide-with-tag>MaleBody</no-collide-with-tag>
    <weight-threshold bone="NPC L Butt">0.25</weight-threshold>
    <weight-threshold bone="NPC R Butt">0.25</weight-threshold>
    <weight-threshold bone="NPC Belly">0.5</weight-threshold>
    <weight-threshold bone="NPC L Pussy02">0.1</weight-threshold>
    <weight-threshold bone="NPC R Pussy02">0.1</weight-threshold>
    <weight-threshold bone="NPC L Breast">0.5</weight-threshold>
    <weight-threshold bone="NPC R Breast">0.5</weight-threshold>
  </per-triangle-shape>

I'm pretty sure "prenetration" has been deprecated- it's just a misspelling, a typo- for penetration, which, unlike "prenetration," is an actual word in English.

[cminnow]

27 minutes ago, Vyxenne said:

Well, here's what I have:

  <per-triangle-shape name="UUNP">
    <margin>0.04</margin>
    <penetration>0.04</penetration>
    <tag>body</tag>
	<no-collide-with-tag>body</no-collide-with-tag>
	<no-collide-with-tag>Labia</no-collide-with-tag>
	<no-collide-with-tag>Genitals</no-collide-with-tag>
	<no-collide-with-tag>Lbreast</no-collide-with-tag>
	<no-collide-with-tag>Rbreast</no-collide-with-tag>
	<no-collide-with-tag>Belly</no-collide-with-tag>
	<no-collide-with-tag>MaleBody</no-collide-with-tag>
    <weight-threshold bone="NPC L Butt">0.25</weight-threshold>
    <weight-threshold bone="NPC R Butt">0.25</weight-threshold>
    <weight-threshold bone="NPC Belly">0.5</weight-threshold>
    <weight-threshold bone="NPC L Pussy02">0.1</weight-threshold>
    <weight-threshold bone="NPC R Pussy02">0.1</weight-threshold>
    <weight-threshold bone="NPC L Breast">0.5</weight-threshold>
    <weight-threshold bone="NPC R Breast">0.5</weight-threshold>
  </per-triangle-shape>

I'm pretty sure "prenetration" has been deprecated- it's just a misspelling, a typo- for penetration, which, unlike "prenetration," is an actual word in English.

Good point. Hydrogen might have fixed that. I'll try seeing if  I can get a cape to penetrate through the head or body using penetration instead of prenetration. Too bad that wasn't it because it would be a good reason to have motion while standing still.

 

Did you try retarding the physics with something like?

 

        <linearDamping>0.5</linearDamping>
        <angularDamping>0.5</angularDamping>
        <friction>0.5</friction>
        <rollingFriction>0.5</rollingFriction>
        <restitution>0.5</restitution>

[Vyxenne]

2 hours ago, jesseg said:

Attached is a UUNP body with breast bones that you are looking for, open your femalebody and this one up in nifskope, copy the LR Breast01 from UUNP dismemberment skin, and then weight them in outfit studio....

femalebody_1test.nif

I have just investigated my assemblage of UUNP bodies, including my years-old Oldrim ones that have not been updated since SSE launched, and not one of them has more than the one Breast bone (per side, of course) labeled "NPC [L/R] Breast" with no "01" or "02" appended to it. So I must conclude that the Breast bones I already have in all of my various UUNP bodies are the only ones needed for the body to work and show BBB physics and also match my XPMSSE skeleton.

 

This (possibly erroneous) conclusion suggests that all the references to "NPC [L/R] Breast01" in my xml are:

• not needed in the xml at all and are holdovers or artifacts from some other body type that the xml was originally designed for; OR
• not needed in the xml at all and are simply errors similar to "prenetration" that were spuriously introduced for some reason in the past; OR
• needed in the xml just like "PreBreast" is needed in the xml- the actual bones don't exist in the body but they are nonetheless useful (for what??????) in the xml.

Anyway, thanks for linking that body, but I wasn't looking for any bones, just trying to understand why the references to them are in my xml.

[Vyxenne]

48 minutes ago, cminnow said:

Good point. Hydrogen might have fixed that. I'll try seeing if  I can get a cape to penetrate through the head or body using penetration instead of prenetration. Too bad that wasn't it because it would be a good reason to have motion while standing still.

 

Did you try retarding the physics with something like?

 

        <linearDamping>0.5</linearDamping>
        <angularDamping>0.5</angularDamping>
        <friction>0.5</friction>
        <rollingFriction>0.5</rollingFriction>
        <restitution>0.5</restitution>

Here is my entire Doctoral Dissertation on my breasts:

Spoiler

  <bone name="NPC L PreBreast">
    <mass>0.000000</mass>
    <inertia x="0" y="0" z="0"/>
    <centerOfMassTransform>
      <basis x="0" y="0" z="0" w="1"/>
      <origin x="0" y="0" z="0"/>
    </centerOfMassTransform>
    <linearDamping>0</linearDamping>
    <angularDamping>0</angularDamping>
    <friction>0</friction>
    <rollingFriction>0</rollingFriction>
    <restitution>0</restitution>
  </bone>
  <bone name="NPC R PreBreast">
    <mass>0.000000</mass>
    <inertia x="0" y="0" z="0"/>
    <centerOfMassTransform>
      <basis x="0" y="0" z="0" w="1"/>
      <origin x="0" y="0" z="0"/>
    </centerOfMassTransform>
    <linearDamping>0</linearDamping>
    <angularDamping>0</angularDamping>
    <friction>0</friction>
    <rollingFriction>0</rollingFriction>
    <restitution>0</restitution>
  </bone>
  <bone name="NPC L Breast">
    <mass>1.000000</mass>
    <inertia x="20" y="20" z="20"/>
    <centerOfMassTransform>
      <basis x="0" y="0" z="0" w="1"/>
      <origin x="0" y="0" z="0"/>
    </centerOfMassTransform>
    <linearDamping>0.5</linearDamping>
    <angularDamping>0.5</angularDamping>
    <friction>0</friction>
    <rollingFriction>0</rollingFriction>
    <restitution>0</restitution>
  </bone>
  <bone name="NPC R Breast">
    <mass>1.000000</mass>
    <inertia x="20" y="20" z="20"/>
    <centerOfMassTransform>
      <basis x="0" y="0" z="0" w="1"/>
      <origin x="0" y="0" z="0"/>
    </centerOfMassTransform>
    <linearDamping>0.5</linearDamping>
    <angularDamping>0.5</angularDamping>
    <friction>0</friction>
    <rollingFriction>0</rollingFriction>
    <restitution>0</restitution>
  </bone>
  <bone name="NPC L Breast01">
    <mass>1.000000</mass>
    <inertia x="20" y="20" z="20"/>
    <centerOfMassTransform>
      <basis x="0" y="0" z="0" w="1"/>
      <origin x="0" y="0" z="0"/>
    </centerOfMassTransform>
    <linearDamping>0.5</linearDamping>
    <angularDamping>0.5</angularDamping>
    <friction>0</friction>
    <rollingFriction>0</rollingFriction>
    <restitution>0</restitution>
  </bone>
  <bone name="NPC R Breast01">
    <mass>1.000000</mass>
    <inertia x="20" y="20" z="20"/>
    <centerOfMassTransform>
      <basis x="0" y="0" z="0" w="1"/>
      <origin x="0" y="0" z="0"/>
    </centerOfMassTransform>
    <linearDamping>0.5</linearDamping>
    <angularDamping>0.5</angularDamping>
    <friction>0</friction>
    <rollingFriction>0</rollingFriction>
    <restitution>0</restitution>
  </bone>

 

Who knew I had such bony boobs?

The only two of those 6 bones that exist in my body are the "NPC [L/R] Breast" bones. The rest are vaporbones.

 

I'll go revisit my breasts and make the last 2 adjustments in your suggestion above- "I'm long, and I'm strong, and I'm down to get the friction on..." *

 

*Insincere Apologies to Sir Mix-A-Lot

[Matsuho]

3 hours ago, rb888 said:

Yes I do but you have to PM me if you want the files will upload to mediafire anyone else please feel pm I got them from 9down

thank you but i managed to dl it, i sat calmly in front of the page tried to remember where i used to click when i had the translator and done, the miracle your memory can achieve when you want bouncing boobies ahah&

[markTheLustOne]

So is my first post, can someone give me a hand.

Short history, I'm using a hdt smp hair and to reduce the cripping I tried to use collisions(I tried to strap Lute on the back) but nothing actually works. My questions are.

1- Is possible to use collisions in a mesh with no bones?

2- Is necessary for the Lute be in the same mesh as the armor or is possible create the lute as a another item.

3- I already configurate the xml as the tutorial teaches, how I make it work?

Thanks for all

[cminnow]

3 hours ago, markTheLustOne said:

So is my first post, can someone give me a hand.

Short history, I'm using a hdt smp hair and to reduce the cripping I tried to use collisions(I tried to strap Lute on the back) but nothing actually works. My questions are.

1- Is possible to use collisions in a mesh with no bones?

2- Is necessary for the Lute be in the same mesh as the armor or is possible create the lute as a another item.

3- I already configurate the xml as the tutorial teaches, how I make it work?

Thanks for all

So it's my understanding that collisions can only happen with an xml. This can be a bit misleading because this isn't to say something can't have physics. Physics in skyrim works in two way: first the bones, or basically nodes, that are created as articulating points can transform based on physics (moving and jumping that can make your boner swing around) and then there is vertices that can shift and move according to physical collisions or movement of the bones they are supported on (hence SKINNED MESH PHYSICS that can make boobs undulate and capes flutter). As long as the bones exist in place, they will automatically define your physics without an xml, however, if you have vertices that require bones to be configured to support them, it will fail and fall to the infinity in an "infinite stretch". This is why some objects (like a cape I believe) can be used without an XML while other objects (like boobs) cannot.

 

A simple example of the difference between the two physical systems might be to think of laying a curtain on a rod where the rod is your bone and the curtain is your model's vertices. The first type of physics arises from shaking the rod around making the curtain flutter (hence purely based on bones created in your model). The second type would be adding some vertical rods into your curtain so that you can make a tent out of it (so skinned mesh physics based on constraints between bones and the vertices between them). Obviously if you remove some bones or don't add the proper constraints between bones, the tent collapses to.... infinity.

 

Not sure what you are asking with your other questions.

 

[jesseg]

6 hours ago, Vyxenne said:

I have just investigated my assemblage of UUNP bodies, including my years-old Oldrim ones that have not been updated since SSE launched, and not one of them has more than the one Breast bone (per side, of course) labeled "NPC [L/R] Breast" with no "01" or "02" appended to it. So I must conclude that the Breast bones I already have in all of my various UUNP bodies are the only ones needed for the body to work and show BBB physics and also match my XPMSSE skeleton.

 

This (possibly erroneous) conclusion suggests that all the references to "NPC [L/R] Breast01" in my xml are:

• not needed in the xml at all and are holdovers or artifacts from some other body type that the xml was originally designed for; OR
• not needed in the xml at all and are simply errors similar to "prenetration" that were spuriously introduced for some reason in the past; OR
• needed in the xml just like "PreBreast" is needed in the xml- the actual bones don't exist in the body but they are nonetheless useful (for what??????) in the xml.

Anyway, thanks for linking that body, but I wasn't looking for any bones, just trying to understand why the references to them are in my xml.

OK, although I never said the NPC LR01 were required for anything, you said you could not locate it in your nif, I merely attached a nif with the missing bones... Its being referenced in your xml because wherever/whoever you got it from has those bones and included it in the xml or they got the xml from someone else who has those bones..... Pre breast has to exist as these are kinematic bones if they don't exist in your nif then your breasts would be falling to the floor, probably check under NPC COM in the nif for pre  breast, I'm sure I have seen pre breast under the cme spine node.... 

[markTheLustOne]

2 hours ago, cminnow said:

So it's my understanding that collisions can only happen with an xml. This can be a bit misleading because this isn't to say something can't have physics. Physics in skyrim works in two way: first the bones, or basically nodes, that are created as articulating points can transform based on physics (moving and jumping that can make your boner swing around) and then there is vertices that can shift and move according to physical collisions or movement of the bones they are supported on (hence SKINNED MESH PHYSICS that can make boobs undulate and capes flutter). As long as the bones exist in place, they will automatically define your physics without an xml, however, if you have vertices that require bones to be configured to support them, it will fail and fall to the infinity in an "infinite stretch". This is why some objects (like a cape I believe) can be used without an XML while other objects (like boobs) cannot.

 

A simple example of the difference between the two physical systems might be to think of laying a curtain on a rod where the rod is your bone and the curtain is your model's vertices. The first type of physics arises from shaking the rod around making the curtain flutter (hence purely based on bones created in your model). The second type would be adding some vertical rods into your curtain so that you can make a tent out of it (so skinned mesh physics based on constraints between bones and the vertices between them). Obviously if you remove some bones or don't add the proper constraints between bones, the tent collapses to.... infinity.

 

Not sure what you are asking with your other questions.

 

The xml already exist but the collisions doesn't work at all, the mesh have literally no bones, is possible to create collision on this scenary with smp?