Status of FO4 scene? Almost dead?

[GinsengKhan]

Whats the status of this thread? Almost dead yet?

Not if we keep bumping it. Anyways, The Fallout 4 scene, while certainly not dead, is grinding to a halt. It's mainly Bethesda's fault for failing to bring the tools that the creators need and an experience satisfying enough to keep the masses locked into the game. I'm not going to go into a whole spiel about what's wrong with the game, cause we already got someone (from a site whose name escapes me) who wrote a whole bloody thesis paper on why Fallout 4 is a bad game. (If it rings a bell for anyone, feel free to post a link or something.)

 

From what I can hear and see, the DLC is nothing impressive. Nothing truly time-consuming and entertaining for the public, and not a lot of cool new assets to work with for the mod creators. Fallout 4 got 3 workshop bundles and 2 expansions (with one in the process of being made), all of which were met with mixed results. Most of these didn't really add too much to go through, whereas if you compared it to Fallout 3 or New Vegas' DLC, all of them had a new area to explore, a new arsenal of weapons to muck around with, and new characters that you may or may not remember in a positive light. Far Harbour was the closest they've gotten to those kinds of DLC. 

 

Not to mention the delayed train wreck of a release that they called the GECK, it's no wonder that modding has been lackluster; because nobody can make anything yet. (That and because it's only been out recently)

[markyy0902]

 

Whats the status of this thread? Almost dead yet?

Not if we keep bumping it. Anyways, The Fallout 4 scene, while certainly not dead, is grinding to a halt. It's mainly Bethesda's fault for failing to bring the tools that the creators need and an experience satisfying enough to keep the masses locked into the game. I'm not going to go into a whole spiel about what's wrong with the game, cause we already got someone (from a site whose name escapes me) who wrote a whole bloody thesis paper on why Fallout 4 is a bad game. (If it rings a bell for anyone, feel free to post a link or something.)

 

From what I can hear and see, the DLC is nothing impressive. Nothing truly time-consuming and entertaining for the public, and not a lot of cool new assets to work with for the mod creators. Fallout 4 got 3 workshop bundles and 2 expansions (with one in the process of being made), all of which were met with mixed results. Most of these didn't really add too much to go through, whereas if you compared it to Fallout 3 or New Vegas' DLC, all of them had a new area to explore, a new arsenal of weapons to muck around with, and new characters that you may or may not remember in a positive light. Far Harbour was the closest they've gotten to those kinds of DLC. 

 

Not to mention the delayed train wreck of a release that they called the GECK, it's no wonder that modding has been lackluster; because nobody can make anything yet. (That and because it's only been out recently)

 

 

I concur. Fallout 4 was a great game but a mediocre RPG, which reduced its repetitive gameplay appeal. In previous fallout games, you can roleplay as either a scientist, doctor, genius, dumb, brute or charismatic guy depending on your skills. FO4 reduced all these aspects into charisma only; which unintentionally killed the RPG elements of FO4.

 

That being said, in terms of modding, alot of people wont get back into the game, or mod it like skyrim until:

 

1. the GECK has matured (its a crash fest from what i heard)

2. the game's DLCs are done (releasing dlcs can screwup your modding plans or vice versa: it can/might destroy your new DLC)

3. the game patches are done (i find it pointless to make a mod and fix it right after the devs release a new patch every month or so)

4. The mod authors have completely mastered the GECK (I know a lot of authors having trouble with this recently released GECK; apparently even the skyrim mod veterans are still figuring stuff out)

 

And lets not forget, despite skyrim having tons of mod during its initial year, the interesting mods only happened after a year or two of its release. Gods, a lot of awesome mods for skyrim are STILL in development (and its been bloody 5 years haha). So i think its a bit too early to compare FO4 mods to the caliber of skyrim mods, give it a year or two, and we can say for certain if it died a little too early.. or not

 

 

That being said, im personally withholding my FO4 playthrough until SexTec comes out Havent even touched Far Harbor yet.

[Jazzman]

Fortunately, none of these complaining settler guys is in charge of the Fallout4 game mission... I am. Otherwise I'd have to cheat ammunition via unholy console mechanism to get rid of them or send them into the crops, something I'd pretty much like to avoid. Preston Garvey could tell a tale for he's still pissed off about his new job in the corn fields.

[Rpgamer123]

 

 

Whats the status of this thread? Almost dead yet?

Not if we keep bumping it. Anyways, The Fallout 4 scene, while certainly not dead, is grinding to a halt. It's mainly Bethesda's fault for failing to bring the tools that the creators need and an experience satisfying enough to keep the masses locked into the game. I'm not going to go into a whole spiel about what's wrong with the game, cause we already got someone (from a site whose name escapes me) who wrote a whole bloody thesis paper on why Fallout 4 is a bad game. (If it rings a bell for anyone, feel free to post a link or something.)

 

From what I can hear and see, the DLC is nothing impressive. Nothing truly time-consuming and entertaining for the public, and not a lot of cool new assets to work with for the mod creators. Fallout 4 got 3 workshop bundles and 2 expansions (with one in the process of being made), all of which were met with mixed results. Most of these didn't really add too much to go through, whereas if you compared it to Fallout 3 or New Vegas' DLC, all of them had a new area to explore, a new arsenal of weapons to muck around with, and new characters that you may or may not remember in a positive light. Far Harbour was the closest they've gotten to those kinds of DLC. 

 

Not to mention the delayed train wreck of a release that they called the GECK, it's no wonder that modding has been lackluster; because nobody can make anything yet. (That and because it's only been out recently)

 

 

I concur. Fallout 4 was a great game but a mediocre RPG, which reduced its repetitive gameplay appeal. In previous fallout games, you can roleplay as either a scientist, doctor, genius, dumb, brute or charismatic guy depending on your skills. FO4 reduced all these aspects into charisma only; which unintentionally killed the RPG elements of FO4.

 

That being said, in terms of modding, alot of people wont get back into the game, or mod it like skyrim until:

 

1. the GECK has matured (its a crash fest from what i heard)

2. the game's DLCs are done (releasing dlcs can screwup your modding plans or vice versa: it can/might destroy your new DLC)

3. the game patches are done (i find it pointless to make a mod and fix it right after the devs release a new patch every month or so)

4. The mod authors have completely mastered the GECK (I know a lot of authors having trouble with this recently released GECK; apparently even the skyrim mod veterans are still figuring stuff out)

 

And lets not forget, despite skyrim having tons of mod during its initial year, the interesting mods only happened after a year or two of its release. Gods, a lot of awesome mods for skyrim are STILL in development (and its been bloody 5 years haha). So i think its a bit too early to compare FO4 mods to the caliber of skyrim mods, give it a year or two, and we can say for certain if it died a little too early.. or not

 

 

That being said, im personally withholding my FO4 playthrough until SexTec comes out Havent even touched Far Harbor yet.

 

 

Agreed one day 3+ years from now I will buy it from steam for $19 and have a great time playing the finished game with mods seya in 3 years. Skyrim still kicks ass. FO4 DOA but the hype train was REAL !

 

[V The Heretic]

 

 

 

Whats the status of this thread? Almost dead yet?

Not if we keep bumping it. Anyways, The Fallout 4 scene, while certainly not dead, is grinding to a halt. It's mainly Bethesda's fault for failing to bring the tools that the creators need and an experience satisfying enough to keep the masses locked into the game. I'm not going to go into a whole spiel about what's wrong with the game, cause we already got someone (from a site whose name escapes me) who wrote a whole bloody thesis paper on why Fallout 4 is a bad game. (If it rings a bell for anyone, feel free to post a link or something.)

 

From what I can hear and see, the DLC is nothing impressive. Nothing truly time-consuming and entertaining for the public, and not a lot of cool new assets to work with for the mod creators. Fallout 4 got 3 workshop bundles and 2 expansions (with one in the process of being made), all of which were met with mixed results. Most of these didn't really add too much to go through, whereas if you compared it to Fallout 3 or New Vegas' DLC, all of them had a new area to explore, a new arsenal of weapons to muck around with, and new characters that you may or may not remember in a positive light. Far Harbour was the closest they've gotten to those kinds of DLC. 

 

Not to mention the delayed train wreck of a release that they called the GECK, it's no wonder that modding has been lackluster; because nobody can make anything yet. (That and because it's only been out recently)

 

 

I concur. Fallout 4 was a great game but a mediocre RPG, which reduced its repetitive gameplay appeal. In previous fallout games, you can roleplay as either a scientist, doctor, genius, dumb, brute or charismatic guy depending on your skills. FO4 reduced all these aspects into charisma only; which unintentionally killed the RPG elements of FO4.

 

That being said, in terms of modding, alot of people wont get back into the game, or mod it like skyrim until:

 

1. the GECK has matured (its a crash fest from what i heard)

2. the game's DLCs are done (releasing dlcs can screwup your modding plans or vice versa: it can/might destroy your new DLC)

3. the game patches are done (i find it pointless to make a mod and fix it right after the devs release a new patch every month or so)

4. The mod authors have completely mastered the GECK (I know a lot of authors having trouble with this recently released GECK; apparently even the skyrim mod veterans are still figuring stuff out)

 

And lets not forget, despite skyrim having tons of mod during its initial year, the interesting mods only happened after a year or two of its release. Gods, a lot of awesome mods for skyrim are STILL in development (and its been bloody 5 years haha). So i think its a bit too early to compare FO4 mods to the caliber of skyrim mods, give it a year or two, and we can say for certain if it died a little too early.. or not

 

 

That being said, im personally withholding my FO4 playthrough until SexTec comes out Havent even touched Far Harbor yet.

 

 

Agreed one day 3+ years from now I will buy it from steam for $19 and have a great time playing the finished game with mods seya in 3 years. Skyrim still kicks ass. FO4 DOA but the hype train was REAL !

 

 

I wouldn't say that it was DOA, but I am noticing that Bethesda went MIA on updates to really fix the game. But, at the same time, why push out a plethora of huge updates for a game that will break on the next DLC. 

 

Step 1: Finish pushing out all DLC's.

Step 2: Finish updating all aspects of the game.

Step 3: Add assistance and updates to finalize Creation Kit and subsequent programs.

Step 4: Mod flow begins slowly growing to a high rate.

Step 5: Profit?

[Guest Lehshara]

Pretty much, FO4 modding is dead compared to Skyrim's early stages.

Just leave this game for a year or two and come back then and hope there will be some decent mods.

 

I've waited since release, still nothing notable.

I think people don't have as much interest in modding this game as Skyrim, probably because it's... below average.

[Reginald_001]

This thread needs to die, period.

[aloevera5]

This thread needs to die, period.

 

This thread refuses to die Just like modding for awesome games!

[TheLastHanna]

 

This thread needs to die, period.

 

This thread refuses to die Just like modding for awesome games!

 

 

Could never think of a better answer.

[Guest]

I feel like there is less interest in modding FO4 them when Skyrim got released.

FO4 is too similar to Skyrim. No major upgrade to make modders really interested.

Skyrim SE is one month out and I fell like it will still get more attention them FO4.

[Halstrom]

Well a lot of good modders left when the paid mods debarcle showed how little the users cared for them by shutting down the steam mod site.

[garg]

Well there is always that donate button but really I think mod thieves and an incomplete F4SE is what's slowing down FO4. Honestly I cannot see what makes this game any less interesting then what Skyrim or FNV are, if your just comparing a vanilla game with no mods! Graphics wise Fallout 4 has it all over them, Skyrim was all washed out and FNV was and is too old school with almost no shadowing system!

[LukeDuke]

I would go with ''archaic'' FNV graphics everyday over FO4 which is not that great too as for game from 2015.

Because maybe you don't know, but there is much more in the games for me than just cool graphics, plus FNV with HD textures mods, and good ENB can also look very good.

 

P.S. Most modders don't like the whole mod support (fiasco) from Beth for FO4, stealing content, but also they simply don't like FO4 that much like older Bethesda games or especially FNV, and we can't force them to change thier minds, can we?

 

[MisukoB]

People mention Skyrim but there was not that much modding for it either, in the beginning. And even less for Oblivion, Morrowind, F3, FNV, etc. Personally I did not get into modding it (Skyrim) until around a year after release. I did however start to mod F4 almost immediately. And even more once CBBE and it's tool was released. Even though I don't really release stuff for others instead I just mod things for myself.

 

However, right now the modding seemed to have slowed down. Why? Reasons. No seriously but I know that I can only speak for myself and I do still mod F4 a bit but mostly I actually finally started playing it now that all the DLC is out. At the same time I really, really want to get back into Skyrim. Especially when I see mods such as OSA, wich I hope will work sooner rather than later with the Special Edition of Skyrim. The engine for Skyrim needs updating, badly. I should not have to use a plugin to make it stable or an ENB to make it look good. I want it to be as stable as F4 is for me.

[Guest enip]

Well a lot of good modders left when the paid mods debarcle showed how little the users cared for them by shutting down the steam mod site.

 

You are looking at this the wrong way. Basically you're saying these modders threw a tantrum because they didn't get paid by mod users, or didn't get the opportunity to make money from mod users and this translates to not caring about modders. I'm pretty sure some got butthurt, but not many. One of the most butthurt modders was Chesko and he's still around. He's still modding. And I'm sure most people have put all that drama behind them.

 

Two things that made this whole paid mods fiasco completely bad:

 

1. Moderation - You have Bethesda who already does a piss poor job on moderating mod content on Bethesda.net not caring about the original modders wishes respect. It's a good thing paid mods failed, becuse with console mods, we are actually seeing the way Bethesda manages mod content. All this would of done was expand mod thievery to a whole new level and push away even more modders,  their work, and the mod scene would lose more talented people. But this is exactly why modders hid their mods and some just stopped trusting Bethesda and moved on.

 

2. Profit Split - People aren't dumb and saw that this whole profit split was unfair from the start. Those that didn't are just dumb. The modder gets the littlest profit even though they did all the work. This showed how greedy Bethesda was, but I'm pretty sure Zenimax had something to do with that as well. There was no win win out of this whole thing. This clearly was in favor for the greedy corporate mind. And ever since paid mods, Bethesda hasn't been the same. Fallout 4 is a prime example of corporate greed. Season Pass, but mainly the workshop DLCs were a prime example of that. All they are, are just paid mods. The difference is hat it's profit straight to Bethesda. That's all.

[Hamguy31]

 

Well a lot of good modders left when the paid mods debarcle showed how little the users cared for them by shutting down the steam mod site.

 

You are looking at this the wrong way. Basically you're saying these modders threw a tantrum because they didn't get paid by mod users, or didn't get the opportunity to make money from mod users and this translates to not caring about modders. I'm pretty sure some got butthurt, but not many. One of the most butthurt modders was Chesko and he's still around. He's still modding. And I'm sure most people have put all that drama behind them.

 

Two things that made this whole paid mods fiasco completely bad:

 

1. Moderation - You have Bethesda who already does a piss poor job on moderating mod content on Bethesda.net not caring about the original modders wishes respect. It's a good thing paid mods failed, becuse with console mods, we are actually seeing the way Bethesda manages mod content. All this would of done was expand mod thievery to a whole new level and push away even more modders,  their work, and the mod scene would lose more talented people. But this is exactly why modders hid their mods and some just stopped trusting Bethesda and moved on.

 

2. Profit Split - People aren't dumb and saw that this whole profit split was unfair from the start. Those that didn't are just dumb. The modder gets the littlest profit even though they did all the work. This showed how greedy Bethesda was, but I'm pretty sure Zenimax had something to do with that as well. There was no win win out of this whole thing. This clearly was in favor for the greedy corporate mind. And ever since paid mods, Bethesda hasn't been the same. Fallout 4 is a prime example of corporate greed. Season Pass, but mainly the workshop DLCs were a prime example of that. All they are, are just paid mods. The difference is hat it's profit straight to Bethesda. That's all.

 

I would rather there be no mods than whiny retards who think they can mod a game and expect money for it like its career, if you don't like modding than don't do it. You can ask for donations and kind people may give you money because they like your mods and want you to continue because its giving your precious time away but don't expect to be paid to mod. Modding was always about fun and extending the game in new ways, not about making money what disgusting people. makes me want to spit just thinking about them.

[garg]

I would go with ''archaic'' FNV graphics everyday over FO4 which is not that great too as for game from 2015.

Because maybe you don't know, but there is much more in the games for me than just cool graphics, plus FNV with HD textures mods, and good ENB can also look very good.

 

P.S. Most modders don't like the whole mod support (fiasco) from Beth for FO4, stealing content, but also they simply don't like FO4 that much like older Bethesda games or especially FNV, and we can't force them to change thier minds, can we?

 

Well not for me, gameplay gets boring quite quickly when your constantly looking at out dated boring graphics! If people were only interested in gameplay then ENB and SweetFX wouldn't be so popular!

 

[A She-Wolf]

Somebody with the patch release dates should do the math and compare the months since FO4's last game-changing patch with how many years it's been since Skyrim's. Guessing there's something significant to that and modding. 

[Kimy]

There is a lot of planning and development going on behind the scenes, users aren't necessarily aware of. No, FO4 modding is not dead. It has barely begun. For naughty stuff, there are just so many middleware components needed before we can start making content mods, and this will take a bit more time to get done.

[Mauler158]

Somebody with the patch release dates should do the math and compare the months since FO4's last game-changing patch with how many years it's been since Skyrim's. Guessing there's something significant to that and modding. 

speak of the devil,

 

7 hours since last F4 patch (29/09/16)

3 Years 5 months 8 days since last TESV patch (21/4/13)

[Halstrom]

You are looking at this the wrong way. Basically you're saying these modders threw a tantrum because they didn't get paid by mod users, or didn't get the opportunity to make money from mod users and this translates to not caring about modders. I'm pretty sure some got butthurt, but not many. One of the most butthurt modders was Chesko and he's still around. He's still modding. And I'm sure most people have put all that drama behind them.

No whether they threw a tantrum or not is not the point, they left is the point. If someone puts 3 years into a mod continuing to support it with upgrades and fixes, some of us modders are near fulltime, some of us don't work for whatever reason, modding tools can be expensive for mesh/ texture people, and some of the scripters are professional programmers so now spend their time on mobile games/apps instead. Many spend more time modding than playing. Why should modders not be allowed to sell mods on Steam?

 

And some of them left not because they wanted to charge for their mods but because users were denying the right of people to do so. Many didn't put it behind them and those that are still modding aren't magically now happy about the way users openly abused modders in the discussions. Some are still modding but just not releasing to the public anymore.

I don't want to chage for my mods, but I find it deplorable that users shafted those modders that did want to just because they outnumber modders immensely and want everything for free. Instead we have the Peahtron bullcrap instead of just being able to pay $5 for a good outfit mod you sign up for $10 a month to get them. Now people wonder where those modders went.......

And so what if Steam take a slice, welcome to the world, E-Bay and other sites do exactly the same thing.

[Guest enip]

I can completely understand that. But you are only looking at it from one side. Either way, this was going to be a hit below the belt. I personally think that if paid mods became successful, it would of driven more talent away rather than together. This is a case as to which problem weighs more than the other and do something about it. People figured since mods have always been free, there shouldn't be an issue. But if paid mods would of kept going, it would of just opened a new gateway for mod thievery, piracy and much more disrespect towards mod authors and their wishes. Someone one way or the other will take that person's mod and upload it somewhere else for free. And when that happens, How would that modder feel about it? Probably drive them away from modding. Again, this was going to be a hit below the belt no matter what side you were on.

 

If people would be more mature about it and respect people's wishes and let them choose to put their mods behind a pay wall it would just make things easier. As long as Bethesda keeps their mod tool kit for free it matters not to me if people want to sell their mods. But also, I think Bethesda deserves a much much less cut out of it because they've made their money already, and before Fallout 4 and console mods, there have been many people who have repurchased Fallout or TES just to be able to experience the game on PC with mods. If it was more in favor for the modder, and if Bethesda made it possible to moderate mods and take people's complaints on stolen mods and assets far more serious, then I'd have zero problem with it.

[Halstrom]

I can completely understand that. But you are only looking at it from one side. Either way, this was going to be a hit below the belt. I personally think that if paid mods became successful, it would of driven more talent away rather than together. This is a case as to which problem weighs more than the other and do something about it. People figured since mods have always been free, there shouldn't be an issue. But if paid mods would of kept going, it would of just opened a new gateway for mod thievery, piracy and much more disrespect towards mod authors and their wishes. Someone one way or the other will take that person's mod and upload it somewhere else for free. And when that happens, How would that modder feel about it? Probably drive them away from modding. Again, this was going to be a hit below the belt no matter what side you were on.

 

If people would be more mature about it and respect people's wishes and let them choose to put their mods behind a pay wall it would just make things easier. As long as Bethesda keeps their mod tool kit for free it matters not to me if people want to sell their mods. But also, I think Bethesda deserves a much much less cut out of it because they've made their money already, and before Fallout 4 and console mods, there have been many people who have repurchased Fallout or TES just to be able to experience the game on PC with mods. If it was more in favor for the modder, and if Bethesda made it possible to moderate mods and take people's complaints on stolen mods and assets far more serious, then I'd have zero problem with it.

And users are only looking at it from one side, most of them know zero about modding, (remember we are talking mostly Steam users), its everything for nothing mentality, their greater numbers somehow make them experts on the subject. Paid mods keeps some modders going and drives them to do more, if people expect lots of DLC sized mods, better than what Beth make for free, its not going to happen.

 

Users don't talk to modders in the FONV community who haven't jumped over to FO4, and you can't expect all the Skyrim big guns to jump over because its a different genre. There's a lot of reasons like FO4's storyline, learning the new CK, waiting for the game to stabilise, F4SE and a animation system, but a lot of them are also pissed off about the abusive attitude of users too. The FONV community died off pretty quick when Prideslayer and the other big gun modders lost interest over the paid mods stuff, its never really recovered.

 

I've spent 10 odd years on Second Life to know how paid content works, if you want free stuff you mostly get crap, the really good stuff you pay for, but people their still whine about forking over $5 for something they like while jamming cigarettes and pizza into their mouths. Even in its impending demise there is a lot of cool stuff still being made there by people who aren't avid SecondLife users, they make it because it sells and makes money. Paid mods attract thieves but they also attract skilled people too.

 

Simply users used their numbers to deny modders the right to sell mods on Steam. That's denying their right as an author to publish their works on that site the way they want to. It's like people trying to make everything on Amazon, Bookworm or E-Bay free to me. Paintings should be also free so people don't copy them to make money I guess, artists are all happy to work for free aren't they? Users wanted a storm in a teacup and they got one and the cups not so good anymore.

 

If modders upload stuff to steam they are more likely to charge for it there just to compensate for the time lost dealing with the quality of the users there, where here at LL we seem to have more intelligent user base.

[Knaeggchen]

I don't see a reason as to why steam (or anything else) doesn't go for a donation system instead. While most users might be against paying for mods (or simply aren't mentally prepared for such a change yet), there are still a lot of people out there that would be willing to donate a few bucks for a mod they really like. It most probably wouldn't sum up to the same amount as forced paying, it still would give them a little bit of additional income and reason to continue their work.

 

Personally, I think the reason as to why it ended up in such a shitstorm was mostly because it was too sudden. If the things you always had been getting for free without a second thought suddenly become a product you have to pay for, people will get angry about that. It doesn't even matter if it is justified or not.

 

 

I haven't been too much into the whole modding scene on either side (modder and user). But as far as I can see it, there aren't many ways to actually support a modder via donation or whatsoever. The only thing I know of is a not-easy-to-find donation system on Nexus, in which you either can donate premium membership, or directly to their paypal adress, IF they set it up. Either way, it is not exactly obvious that such a system is actually in place, so I would guess that not many people even consider doing so.

[LordJerle]

 

You are looking at this the wrong way. Basically you're saying these modders threw a tantrum because they didn't get paid by mod users, or didn't get the opportunity to make money from mod users and this translates to not caring about modders. I'm pretty sure some got butthurt, but not many. One of the most butthurt modders was Chesko and he's still around. He's still modding. And I'm sure most people have put all that drama behind them.

No whether they threw a tantrum or not is not the point, they left is the point. If someone puts 3 years into a mod continuing to support it with upgrades and fixes, some of us modders are near fulltime, some of us don't work for whatever reason, modding tools can be expensive for mesh/ texture people, and some of the scripters are professional programmers so now spend their time on mobile games/apps instead. Many spend more time modding than playing. Why should modders not be allowed to sell mods on Steam?

 

And some of them left not because they wanted to charge for their mods but because users were denying the right of people to do so. Many didn't put it behind them and those that are still modding aren't magically now happy about the way users openly abused modders in the discussions. Some are still modding but just not releasing to the public anymore.

I don't want to chage for my mods, but I find it deplorable that users shafted those modders that did want to just because they outnumber modders immensely and want everything for free. Instead we have the Peahtron bullcrap instead of just being able to pay $5 for a good outfit mod you sign up for $10 a month to get them. Now people wonder where those modders went.......

And so what if Steam take a slice, welcome to the world, E-Bay and other sites do exactly the same thing.

 

 

I'm not forking over money for a mod.  Hell, I think the concept of DLC is complete and utter bullshit.  It only encourages companies to release an incomplete game and go "Oh, we'll put this in the DLC".