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Prison Overhaul Patched (LE)

Inte

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Punga

Punga

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Are we discussing the dialogue surrender arrest? If so, this discussion might be a mute point since I am fairly sure that Inte already said that will be changed for POP 8s with the 'turn around' submission animations from maria eden. 

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Code Serpent

Code Serpent

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Posted

Are we discussing the dialogue surrender arrest? If so, this discussion might be a mute point since I am fairly sure that Inte already said that will be changed for POP 8s with the 'turn around' submission animations from maria eden. 

 

I thought we were talking about how the guards could arrest a dragonborn mid-combat without using spells.

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bicobus

bicobus

Posted
Posted

Actually Nords aren't opposed to magic, they just don't like it very much. If you get into the college of winterhold, the different mages do say they deal with the nords and think they are a bunch of hypocrites for requesting the mage's help while shunning them at the same time.

 

Now you get a dragon born lose in skyrim the first thing you do is research a way to contain its power, thus you go to the college and ask for a counter measure. You don't like it, but it's better than a dragonborn running amok.

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Code Serpent

Code Serpent

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Posted

Actually Nords aren't opposed to magic, they just don't like it very much. If you get into the college of winterhold, the different mages do say they deal with the nords and think they are a bunch of hypocrites for requesting the mage's help while shunning them at the same time.

 

Now you get a dragon born lose in skyrim the first thing you do is research a way to contain its power, thus you go to the college and ask for a counter measure. You don't like it, but it's better than a dragonborn running amok.

I think the key here is that Nords tolerate other people being mages, because they know they might need magical help at some point, hence the court wizards. However, they are incredibly opposed to themselves learning how to cast magic, as they see it as a sort of blasphemy, dishonoring Nord heritage or something like that.

 

However, they don't seem to mind having access to enchanted weapons and armor, as Sergius Terrianus often says.

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Inte

Inte

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Bug Report and a "Problem" Feature

 

1/ Bug - I was having a problem with a repeat visit to Dawnstar jail so did a forced reset. When I got back to Whiterun there was a stray PO BH so looks like that is what is producing them. I then tried another forced reset but the BH remained though it did not appear to produce another one. Minor issue as they're easy enough to zap.

 

2/ Problem Feature - not really a bug but could be nasty with the wrong mods. After I was released from Dawnstar jail the Jail Master says "I have a surprise for you" and fits the pc with devices from a previous visit. In this case it was a CD collar and belt but as that quest had already been completed the devices cannot be removed except by using a quest reset in CD. Is there a way to stop this, if not it really needs a toggle to switch it off as it doesn't seem a good idea to have to reset other mods to remove stuff.

 

EDIT: Thought I'd best add some details on the CD issue, it was late last night when I posted the above.

 

My first arrest was in Dawnstar where I'd handed myself in to a guard, I wasn't wearing any devices. My second arrest was by BH's and I was taken to Wildhelm. Now my memory is a bit flaky here, but I think I had just made a CD delivery to Winterhold when the BH turned up and took me to Wildhelm so I think I was wearing the CD belt and collar. Unfortunately my memory is a bit hazy as I was probably drunk (or going senile). I'm still using CD v3.84 btw.

 

I have POP set to NOT remove devices so that it only removes standard DD stuff but it seems like it's remembered that I had the devices fitted previously and then added them to me after I completed my third jail term back again in Dawnstar (poor old Betild had an "accident" with an arrow in the back - oops)

 

I will look into the CD issue.

The BH issue, try and do a reset in Whiterun and see if they disappear. They spawn by the smithy.

 

 

 

Thanks Inte

 

I tried a forced reset but the BH just remained in fromt of me. Neither were at the Whiterun smithy, the first was outside the Whiterun gate and this one is standing by the river near the Honningbrew Meadary.

 

I've still got a game with the second one, I'll get you a screenie and a log with a forced reset

 

EDIT: Here's the screenie and logs. Log 0 is a normal log and log 1 is a trace log though I'm not sure if it's of any use as it seems to be mainly errors with Trace

 

attachicon.gifPapyrus.0.log attachicon.gifPapyrus.1.log

 

attachicon.gifScreenShot9.jpg

 

 

Ok, CD devices bug confirmed and murdered, hopefully ... no time to test. ^_^

 

For the BH, if you have DDe,

  1. Select your PC in 'Select Actor' page.
  2. Go to 'Debug' page.
  3. Select 'Regular Log'.
  4. Check 'Dump only for (Your PC's name).
  5. Hit 'Dump FORM only'.
  6. Post that log here.   

It seems that the BH StorageUtil list keeps getting deleted.

 

EDIT:

I've set the BHs to 'Initially disabled'. Will have to test that and see how that plays.

Oh, right. IronDusk33 said Nords are oposed the use of any kind of magic. Still a club would not be an immersive way to arrest someone you cannot get close to. 

 

It's actually CCCP. 

Also, through all your ramblings I am yet to see an immersive solution other than knocking the DB out while he/she sees it coming.

 

Well, the majority of my ramblings have been trying to prove that Nord guards would never cast spells.

 

A possible third option, besides spell casting or mace bashing, could be enchantments. Specially enchanted swords or collars that are used by guards to capture important criminals.

 

Edit: I got distracted writing this and didn't see nightwolf post a similar suggestion

 

 

Ninja Edit;

IronDusk33, I meant to ask about your profile picture. Is that a little guy holding a giant sickle, or a sideboob?

 

 

 

 

Actually, it's a prosthetic iron hook.

 

I see a sideboob everytime. :)

 

Sideboob. :blush: 

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Madrias

Madrias

Posted
Posted

Regarding the spell thing, wouldn't it be theoretically possible that they're using scrolls?  It'd make sense that the guards had some mage in either the College of Winterhold (or one of the various other groups of mages in lore) create some scrolls so that the 'average' guard had the ability to cast this spell without having too many people wandering around who actually know it?

 

It solves both problems, if you ask me.

 

The first is that 'common' guards shouldn't have access to a spell that powerful.  Except they really don't have access to it, they have scrolls (probably purchased at insanely over-inflated prices) that allow them to use a one-time capture spell strong enough to bind an effective demigod (or demigoddess for those who play female characters).

 

The second problem is that everyone thinks the Nords shouldn't be using magic, except you look all over Skyrim and see evidence that the Nords use magic.  Sure, not all of them throw spells, but there's more than enough staff-wielding maniacs, jack-asses with enchanted war-hammers, and enchanted armor floating around to justify the guards having a Scroll of Binding.

 

It's never really bothered me, personally.

 

(Though I will admit, my version of POP is, well, quite out of date.  I don't follow it as closely as I do some other mods only because the way I play characters means that once a mod's in the load order, it stays in, and performing 'clean' saves breaks that rule.  So I'm quite a way out of date until I finish this particular playthrough.)

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Slorm

Slorm

Posted
Posted

Ok, CD devices bug confirmed and murdered, hopefully ... no time to test. ^_^

 

For the BH, if you have DDe,

  1. Select your PC in 'Select Actor' page.
  2. Go to 'Debug' page.
  3. Select 'Regular Log'.
  4. Check 'Dump only for (Your PC's name).
  5. Hit 'Dump FORM only'.
  6. Post that log here.   

It seems that the BH StorageUtil list keeps getting deleted.

 

EDIT:

I've set the BHs to 'Initially disabled'. Will have to test that and see how that plays.

 

 

Here's the log with the from dump Inte

 

Papyrus.0.log

 

 

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Inte

Inte

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Posted

Thank you.

Unfortunately the list I was looking for was not there. :-/  


Spell don't bother me either so I vote for it to stay, unless I see a viable alternative, which has not been the case so far. 

 

Will stay it shall.

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Slorm

Slorm

Posted
Posted

@Inte

 

I haven't done a lot of jail time this game (I forgot to restart the random bounty when I reset in Dawnstar - doh) but the three time I have been in jail I've only got the cage never the pillory. Does the cage take precedence or is it just the RNG hasn't picked the parade/pillory options.

 

Just curious

 

EDIT: Was just a "guest" of Morthal jail and got the pillory

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JulioRosario89

JulioRosario89

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Posted

Hi Inte!

Let me start by asking you kindly not to hate me, but I do have an idea that needs to be let out of my head.

 

Lately, I've been heavily using POP in my current game, the idea was to play a headstrong bandit always in trouble with the law. What I noticed is the lack of rebellious options in the scenarios POP offers. The only instance in fact, where you can show a little disagreement with the law system of skyrim, is when the BHs come for you, in that you fight them (and inevitably loose), instead of submitting to the arrest.

 

This said and done, my idea was to implement dialog options everytime a guard comes to visit you in the cell or the jailer wants to put you through one of the possible ordeals. The scenes themselves would not change (e.g. you would still get whipped or paraded), but by being rebellious you could increase the chance of stealing a key while the guards enjoy themselves and later on escaping prison. Since you are a cool bandit and not a meek sheep like the rest of them skyrim citizens, this would be your way!

The initial level of defiance or willingness would be set when you choose to submit or fight the guards/BH during the arrest scene. Everytime you tell a guard to "Fuck off!" or comply to their demands, the modifier would change. Being rebellious would also increase the possibility of being sold into slavery, though. So a player would have to be careful how much defiance to show in order to escape and not end up as someone's property. So, either you serve your sentence willingly or you escape or you get sold.

Now, in case you manage to escape, there would be no fun if the only thing that would happen is for guards or BHs to catch you again and send you to prison a second time. So to make the escape worthwhile I thought it could trigger a quest where the Jarl of the Hold you were arrested in sees your resourcefulness (you escaped his prsions after all) and sends a BH to return your gear and send you on a mission to kill a bandit (for example) that has plagued the Hold for a long time. You have a time limit and should you succeed, your bounty would be counted as paid. If you don't hunt the bandit down, BHs would come after you again and the mod would resume as usual.

 

What do you think, is this something you would like to see too? Anyone else has other opinions on this?

 

Anyway, you're doing a great job on these patches, so even if this is something that you do not want to implement, keep up the good work! ;)

Julio out!

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Brommer

Brommer

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Posted

Hi there, long time no POP for me. I found a tiny bug regarding the time scale. It seems that when you get transferred to the cage scenario, the mod uses the fast timescale during the long walk (the jailers place really needs a subway). So the cage scenrio ends up being "get in the cage - get out of the cage" because it's already too late.

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