Project: Unified UNP

[t3h0th3r]

BringtheNoise, are the weights on special the same as the rest of the UUNP shapes or are they based off Stevie's? Also any plans to add the additional leg weights back to special?

 

Testing now, but thanks in advance to you and cell for your continous great work!

[BringtheNoise]

BringtheNoise, are the weights on special the same as the rest of the UUNP shapes or are they based off Stevie's? Also any plans to add the additional leg weights back to special?

 

Testing now, but thanks in advance to you and cell for your continous great work!

 

I knew I forgot something.

 

The weights are based on UUNP HDT.

Used Mesh rigger to copy all the UUNP HDT weights into Stevierage's v4.3b body (minus the P bones).

 

I might add those extra bones back, but then Cell would probably just delete them again

 

Oh if you need a version of Stevierage's v4.3b in a bodyslide package then check page 2 of his thread (top part).... Something about a Stealth Edit

 

I think I fucked up the slidersets folder name in that one as well...

 

[jc12]

Why in the hell do I keep typing out SlidersSets .... for the life of me I don't know why I keep typing out SlidersSets when I build a new folder to pack zip's from...

 

Lets see... The UUNP Special that is above is experimental, but it works (as far as I know).

It's a full on replacement for the original UUNP Special (can just copy over the original and you should be okay).

Thanks very much, I'll build a few bodies tonight and let you know if I spot anything odd.

[Eireamhoin]

 

 

 

Here's an issue I'm running into guys. It's more of a compatibility issue. 

I've been trying out SAM instead of SOS. It's quite nice, but I've run into an issue where the normal maps (I think that's the one) aren't being applied to females correctly. 

SAM doesn't change females, but it does use NiOverride.

Well I've been trying to fix it, and the way I fixed it was using a body that vector modified for someone that was having the issue. 

 

He was telling the person that there were some issues with settings on the body he was using and to pass along the info to mod developers so they could correct it.  Figured I'd share the info so you could have a look to make it compatible.

 

 

 

http://www.ladymoiraine.com/forum/index.php?topic=8265.125

Reply 148 has a link to the body he had edited. If you'd like to have a look.

 

Now here comes the tech stuff, which I hardly have any understanding of.

 

Anyway, in the best of everyone's interests, if you want here's what you can tranmit to the mod authors:

 

- Skin meshes that have the Skin Tint Shader applied don't need Geometry normals. Its just unneccessary information on the NIF. I reduced the NIFs file size from about 800K to 675K)

- BS Num UV Sets should be set to 1 on Meshes that use Skin Tint Shader

- Enable Vertex Colors

- BSShaderTextureSet had wrong setting for both Normal and Spec maps, they were pointing to wrong, unexisting files. basically these filenames missed a "_1" in the filename

 

I do still believe that this problem may also have been caused by a SKSE function which is in itself a bit problematic sometimes, or maybe even NiOverride. But if this was the case, I would start seeing all khajiits and argonians with huma skin, and I dont think that happens.

 

Now some more extra info that they also might want to correct:

Blender old Nif Scripts only support export for old stuff such as FO3, which is usually the setting used for exporting to Skyrim. However, these old scripts only support up to 18 bones per partition, and Skyrim's default body partitions need more than that and have an extended limit of 62 if I recall correctly (I found it while working on the Vampire Lord mesh, and already reported that issue to the NifTools development team, and the bug was accepted and properly corrected for the new NifTools in development for newer blender versions). They can however, correct this problem easily by editing the NIF_COMMON.PY script. Open it in Notepad or any other text editor, and search for 18 (which is the current limit on the old scripts). they will find 18 4 times, just replace all those 18 for 62, and that should allow them to actually export proper body partitions.

 

 

 

It would be nice to be able to use the UUNP Special setup for women and SAM for males. 

 

 

 

I don't know what kind of settings UUNP Special currently has, but UUNP, UUNP HDT and UUNP HDT+ got all points of what he said down.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Well I played around with it some more. Found an old body mod I was overwriting, so got rid of that. 

Tried a regular UUNP HDT vs a UUNP Special.

No more normal map issues that I've noticed.

 

What I am getting isn't a real big deal, but does bug me a little.

Using UUNP I can create 10 of the same NPC using the Khajiit Khayla.

I do a console unequipall, and 2 of the 10 will have the khajiit fur.

 

I switch to using that bombshell version Vector modified and I get just the opposite. 2 will have human skin and the rest have fur.

 

I'm not sure what'd be causing it. Tried a couple old women and 1 of the 2 had old skin.

 

Anyway, is there a high def UNP compatible argonian/khajiit skin I could try installing that might just create a new file structure and fix the issue?  

[Eikichi Onizuka]

BringtheNoise, are the weights on special the same as the rest of the UUNP shapes or are they based off Stevie's? Also any plans to add the additional leg weights back to special?

 

Testing now, but thanks in advance to you and cell for your continous great work!

 

a Legs weight slider for UUNP Special ? (weight reduction)

 

could eliminate these HDT legs deformations..?

[zenna11]

 

there its 1 more issu with slaiders ShoulderWitdh look like its moves whole arms so if you move to 0% dosent fit to hands 

 

It moving the whole arm is correct, but I might have to smooth it out a bit.

 

 

 

Here's an issue I'm running into guys. It's more of a compatibility issue. 

I've been trying out SAM instead of SOS. It's quite nice, but I've run into an issue where the normal maps (I think that's the one) aren't being applied to females correctly. 

SAM doesn't change females, but it does use NiOverride.

Well I've been trying to fix it, and the way I fixed it was using a body that vector modified for someone that was having the issue. 

 

He was telling the person that there were some issues with settings on the body he was using and to pass along the info to mod developers so they could correct it.  Figured I'd share the info so you could have a look to make it compatible.

 

 

 

http://www.ladymoiraine.com/forum/index.php?topic=8265.125

Reply 148 has a link to the body he had edited. If you'd like to have a look.

 

Now here comes the tech stuff, which I hardly have any understanding of.

 

Anyway, in the best of everyone's interests, if you want here's what you can tranmit to the mod authors:

 

- Skin meshes that have the Skin Tint Shader applied don't need Geometry normals. Its just unneccessary information on the NIF. I reduced the NIFs file size from about 800K to 675K)

- BS Num UV Sets should be set to 1 on Meshes that use Skin Tint Shader

- Enable Vertex Colors

- BSShaderTextureSet had wrong setting for both Normal and Spec maps, they were pointing to wrong, unexisting files. basically these filenames missed a "_1" in the filename

 

I do still believe that this problem may also have been caused by a SKSE function which is in itself a bit problematic sometimes, or maybe even NiOverride. But if this was the case, I would start seeing all khajiits and argonians with huma skin, and I dont think that happens.

 

Now some more extra info that they also might want to correct:

Blender old Nif Scripts only support export for old stuff such as FO3, which is usually the setting used for exporting to Skyrim. However, these old scripts only support up to 18 bones per partition, and Skyrim's default body partitions need more than that and have an extended limit of 62 if I recall correctly (I found it while working on the Vampire Lord mesh, and already reported that issue to the NifTools development team, and the bug was accepted and properly corrected for the new NifTools in development for newer blender versions). They can however, correct this problem easily by editing the NIF_COMMON.PY script. Open it in Notepad or any other text editor, and search for 18 (which is the current limit on the old scripts). they will find 18 4 times, just replace all those 18 for 62, and that should allow them to actually export proper body partitions.

 

 

 

It would be nice to be able to use the UUNP Special setup for women and SAM for males. 

 

 

 

I don't know what kind of settings UUNP Special currently has, but UUNP, UUNP HDT and UUNP HDT+ got all points of what he said down.

 

 

 

 

 

Ok so, I see someone else had this issue and OP mentioned you would need HDT+ comp. textures. Now, I am currently using Realgirl(swapped to Ningheim textures for testing purposes) for npc and the included textures for the ningheim race which is a modified SG if I recall and I have no issues on the most recent version of 7B-Oppai, but when I load up the body in Bodyslide it does not show the vag area. I hope I can get some help, because this is an amazing thing you did for us and I made my body exactly how I thought the 7BO should look 

 

 

Stock 7BO with my installed textures 

2015-03-12_00001.jpg

 

Bodyslide 7BO

Untitled.jpg

 

So you put the HDT+ body and textures in the Ningheim race folder, but left default UNP textures for the base body correct???

 

If so then yes it will not look correct in bodyslide but once you place the femalebody_0 and _1 nif's into the mesh folder for the Ningheim race it should work correctly in game.

 

 

I do the same with the HDT+ body but I do it for the Temptress race.

So I have the fairskin UN7B skin sets in the "\textures\temptress\actors\character\female" folder(head, body, and hands).

And I have the nif files in the "\meshes\temptress\actors\character\character assets" folder.

 

Then I have the Stevierage v4.3b bodies in a DF shape in the regular "meshes\actors\character\character assets" folder... as well as in the succubus folder for the temptress race.

 

Now to go and install UUNP v1.10o and rebuild UUNP Special... that should be fun.

 

Textures are the same in vanilla & ningheim folders I did it after my original post while I was waiting for a response just to confirm it was working on both so I have the stock 7BO mesh from the original mod in both ningheim and vanilla folders. So basically it works with the Original Mods mesh, but when the mesh is created in body slide something is going wrong for me, and I don't know what. lol

 

 

Nord/Ningheim same thing

 

 2015-03-12_00002.jpg

 

 

EDIT: Also, I did both Build & CTRL +Build just to be sure something wasn't going on with that but either way its the same issue.

 

I don't know if someone is willing to test my preset on their end, see if the textures load for them?

 7BOSGX.xml

 

 

 

The preset XML file doesn't really matter. What you can upload, though, is the two NIF files that BodySlide created for you for the body.

 

in most body sliders when you move your shoulder lower lower part arms stay in place so mach hands mesh but if move wholesholder with whole arm then need make same sliders for hands or will never mach 

[ShadowGearX]

 

BringtheNoise, are the weights on special the same as the rest of the UUNP shapes or are they based off Stevie's? Also any plans to add the additional leg weights back to special?

 

Testing now, but thanks in advance to you and cell for your continous great work!

 

a Legs weight slider for UUNP Special ? (weight reduction)

 

could eliminate these HDT legs deformations..? 2015-02-26_00034.jpg

 

flabby girls need love to.

[Eikichi Onizuka]

Dicking around with UUNP v1.10o and Stevierages v4.3b set and well... some short bus special.

UUNP Special (03-12-15).7z

 

Cell if we can get this thing sorted then I'll add it to the main page

This update adds in UUNP v1.10o the new Stevierages Vagina v1.43b, right..?

 

 

IMPORTANT (@ BringtheNoise, read please..!)

 

I tried this your new update for UUNP Special - Vagina 1.43b (manual update and I have the last XPMSE v2.50), these are the results:

 

 

Positive aspects

 

1) New Stevierages Vagina v1.43b seems to move better during SOS penetration, although in some sexual positions does not open well yet, only partially

 

 

2) seems resolved the textures overlapping, inside the Vagina (internal vagina textures)

 

 

 

Negative aspect

 

1) I had never happened before with Unified Project (before this your update, I have only a very little neck seam on UUNP Special), but now after the update I have a Big neck seam, a really huge gap, like a severed head! (body is UUNP Special, UNP Skinny preset, weight 0)

 

Before the update "UUNP Special (03-12-15)"  

 

After the update "UUNP Special (03-12-15)", I have this Huge neck seam..

 

 

2) when the vigina is open or partial open, shows the tip of the clitoris with a strange form, as if it were cut, as broken on one side

 

here the screens show on tip of the clitoris a strange shape/cut

 

 

 

3) the nif files of the body have become smaller size (now framle bofy nif is 800kb, before the update female body nif over 900kb), and now.. when I open a female body nif file created with Bodyslide2, no longer see the 3D body model of the body when I open with NifSkope , mow I see only a 2D silhouette of the body, all White!

 

 

4) the new UUNP Special generated after this update, seems to have a less graceful shape, her buttocks and the part between the neck/shoulders and breasts, now seem uglier, compared to your previous update (Vagina 1.3b combined with UUNP v1.10o

 

 

Summing up:  After this your new update for UUNP Special to Add the new HDT Stevierages Vagina 1.43b, belonging to some improvements in the movement of the Vagina and eliminating Vagina textures Overlapping, but after this update, now I have a Huge Neck Seam, some things are worse, than UUNP v1.10o combined with your previous HDT Vagina 1.3 update for UNNP Special was OK, except have the old Vagina 1.3

 

How to deal with all these points which I have reported, please ?

 

 

Edit: replaced the first screen for Point 1), Add screens for Point 2

[ousnius]

 

Dicking around with UUNP v1.10o and Stevierages v4.3b set and well... some short bus special.

UUNP Special (03-12-15).7z

 

Cell if we can get this thing sorted then I'll add it to the main page

This update adds in UUNP v1.10o the new Stevierages Vagina v1.43b, right..?

 

 

IMPORTANT (@ BringtheNoise, read please..!)

 

I tried this your new update for UUNP Special (manual update and I have the last XPMSE v2.50), these are the results:

 

 

Positive aspects

 

1) New Stevierages Vagina v1.43b seems to move better, although in some sexual positions does not open well yet, only partially

 

 

2) seems resolved the textures overlapping, inside the Vagina (internal vagina textures)

 

 

 

Negative aspect

 

1) I had never happened before with Unified Project (before this your update, neck is Always Ok), for the first time I have the neck seam.. also the huge gap, like a severed head!

 

Before.. 2015-03-13_00007.jpg After this update.. 2015-03-13_00005.jpg 2015-03-13_00006.jpg 2015-03-13_00008.jpg

 

 

2) when the vigina is open or partial open, shows the tip of the clitoris with a strange form, as if it were cut, as broken on one side

 

 

3) thenif files of the body have become smaller size (now is 800kb, before over 900kb), and now, when I open the nif bodies files created with Bodyslide2, no longer see the 3D model of the body when I open the body nif files with NifSkope , mow I see only a 2D silhouette of the body, all White!

 

 

4) the new UUNP Special generated after this update, seems to have a less graceful shape, her buttocks and the part between the neck/shoulders and breasts, now seem uglier, compared to your previous update (Vagina 1.3b combined with UUNP v1.10o

 

 

Summing up: After this your new update for UUNP Special to Aff the new HDT Stevierages Vagina 1.43b, belonging to some improvements in the movement of the Vagina and eliminating Vagina textures Overlapping, but after this update, now I have a Huge Neck Seam, some things are worse, than UUNP v1.10o combined with your previous HDT Vagina 1.3 update for UNNP Special was OK, except have the old Vagina 1.3

 

How to deal with all these points which I have reported, please ?

He knows. Or at least I told him it wouldn't work.

 

I've already fixed everything for the next update. UUNP Special will use the same sliders as the regular UUNP then.

 

No clue about #2 though, as I don't use 3D vaginas myself.

[Eikichi Onizuka]

 

 

Dicking around with UUNP v1.10o and Stevierages v4.3b set and well... some short bus special.

UUNP Special (03-12-15).7z

 

Cell if we can get this thing sorted then I'll add it to the main page

This update adds in UUNP v1.10o the new Stevierages Vagina v1.43b, right..?

 

 

IMPORTANT (@ BringtheNoise, read please..!)

 

I tried this your new update for UUNP Special (manual update and I have the last XPMSE v2.50), these are the results:

 

 

Positive aspects

 

1) New Stevierages Vagina v1.43b seems to move better, although in some sexual positions does not open well yet, only partially

 

.....CUT (Read the Full post Up!)

 

He knows. Or at least I told him it wouldn't work.

 

I've already fixed everything for the next update. UUNP Special will use the same sliders as the regular UUNP then.

 

No clue about #2 though, as I don't use 3D vaginas myself.

 

 

For the point 1)

 

I upload a wrong screen, Before the update "UUNP Special (03-12-15)", is present a little neck seam on my UUNP Special body (default UNP Skinny preset, weight 0)

 

here the right screen before that update UUNP Special Vagina 1.43b on this screen have only install UUNP v1.10o and th previsu update for HDT Vagina v1.3b

 

and now After install the new update "UUNP Special (03-12-15)", same default skinny preset and weight 0, I have this Huge neck seam

 

 

For the point 2)

 

here the screens show on tip of the clitoris a strange shape/cut

 

 

Edit:

 

if you look carefully the two screens of Point 2) will notice that the shape and proportions between the neck, the shoulders, the armpits and and hanging breasts, seems different..! in the first screen (before the update) has a more beautiful and natural shape and proportions, I may be wrong, it's just an impression..?

 

but also the shape-proportions-ass buttocks seem a little worse (now seem leggemente more square and large buttocks) after the update UUNP Special (03-12-15), creating a new body UUNP Special with the same preset, there seems to be a live worsening aesthetic in some areas of the body, but of this I am not 100% sure, tonight I will make more photos of more detailed body shape/proportions comparison.

 

And finally.. now after the update if I open with NifSkope the new female body nif, no longer see the 3D body model, now you only see the 2D white outline of the body.

[guk]

a Legs weight slider for UUNP Special ? (weight reduction)

 

could eliminate these HDT legs deformations..? 2015-02-26_00034.jpg

 

I had already reported this as a bug in earlier builds, but apparently it is meant as a bounce for the thighs and calves.

Which is a good idea, i think a lot of people have also asked for males getting a subtle muscle bounce.

 

Now i think Cell had removed the leg bounce 1-2 test builds ago, because it currently causes these extreme deformations, and only works by attaching the body.xml to the bodymesh over the NiStringExtraData entry.

So i'm not sure why it is back, but you can remove it by deleting those NiStringExtraData entries from the body meshes. Probably not a good idea if the "special" body needs those entries, which i think you are using.

Edited March 14, 2015 by guk

[ousnius]

Unified UNP v1.10p:

- merged UUNP Special into this main archive (including its XML's and TexBlend).

- made UUNP Special use the regular sliders of the other bodies (experimental, please test for various results in-game, both sliders and weights).

- fixed Dream Girl feet seam.

- reverted texture paths to the "old format" because I forgot that I haven't released the new version of BodySlide yet.

 

Expired and I have also finished the in-game morphing of the BodySlide sliders through RaceMenu now. That will be out with the next version of BodySlide + RaceMenu (you will still need BodySlide for replacing all NPC's meshes, zap sliders and building the morph data).

Unified UNP v1.10p.7z

[BringtheNoise]

Afor I go to sleep...

 

1. UUNP v1.10p is now the only version offered in the main download section (besides the old resource file which needs to be updated).

2. Even though I can't keep my eyes open currently I threw together a step by step armor building guide in post 2 on page 1

"The Crackhead guide to UUNP armor building".... yeah yeah I'm an asshole

 

Currently the HDT leg muscle bones are not in the HDT body or in the Special (unless Cell added them and I didn't see it)....

The only body that currently has these installed is the HDT PLUS (HDT+) body. They are kinda cool when moving around and doing things but not so much when kicking off a sex scene where the female is in any position other then standing up.... probably due to the gravity setting for the hdt bones in the bodyplus.xml file.... yeah gravity and not standing up will make shit sag... go fucking figure.

 

 

I was going to try out Cell's combined set tonight, but I can't keep my eyes open (I've already drop'd out of the IRC chat cause one I hit "post" I'm headed for bed)....

 

 

Edit: I'm awake and I can see where I made grammar errors (but I'll leave them).

1. I added step 6a to the step by step armor conversion process.

2. I added an alternative listing on how to weight paint an armor set for Bodyslide using mesh rigger and  some  most of the steps from the conversion process.

The main difference is in OS I recommend only copying the HDT bones into the meshes.

With Mesh Rigger I recommend copying ever bone from the UUNPHDT.nif file into the target.

Why: simple mesh rigger tends to not over spray the weight paints. Which means the armor and body having matching weight paintings for all of the XMPSE bones.... Thus you have an even LOWER chance of clipping.

But you will still need to check for clipping on each slider in Outfit Studio....

[ousnius]

WIP of UUNP morphs in-game in RaceMenu (works for CBBE and all armors as well).

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Eeu0rfKu3w

 

Try to be patient, there's still a few things to be done before I can release the BodySlide update.

(RaceMenu update, CBBE update, UUNP Underwear)

[Mdy]

Holy shit ... how should one be patient if even the farmer can't stop moaning?

[BringtheNoise]

Fap Fap Fap... IN GAME MORPHS!!!!

 

Fap Fap Fap.... IN GAME MORPHS!!!

 

Expired, Cell, Groove, Blabba, and one or two others have been tweaking that for a couple of weeks (and I'm actually impatiently waiting for it myself).

 

How it works:

Bodyslide builds a .TRI file for the sliders to work with the armor.

Then Racemenu uses the .TRI file to morph the shape in game.

Irony the shape stays the base CBBE Curvy 1 in the nif file and Skyrim does the morphing with the base shape and the tri file.

 

And thanks to all those body shapes being included in UUNP... when armors and bodies are created with the tri files they should be able to morph to any shape that is included in UUNP.

 

 

Now if it would also work with NPC's.... fuck if that can be done then the idea of "Everybody is different" could be made a reality.

Just set some predifned settings for each race for what height, weight, and morph the should have and then all the ladies could be different.... not sure if that will work though.

 

[FVHrc0E]

Thank you very much for all the incredible amount of work you have put into UUNP to make it easy for anyone to generate body shapes that appeal to their tastes.

 

Have not tried to make any armor yet, because that appears to be much more complicated. From reading your instructions, I get the idea that you can produce armor with breast/butt jiggle from armor that doesn't jiggle (for instance UNPetite armor). Is this true?

 

 

[DorkDiva]

WIP of UUNP morphs in-game in RaceMenu (works for CBBE and all armors as well).

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Eeu0rfKu3w

 

Try to be patient, there's still a few things to be done before I can release the BodySlide update.

(RaceMenu update, CBBE update, UUNP Underwear)

 

 

WOOOOOOOOOW!!!!               I want it so badly! That is going to be so fun!

[WaxenFigure]

WIP of UUNP morphs in-game in RaceMenu (works for CBBE and all armors as well).

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Eeu0rfKu3w

 

Try to be patient, there's still a few things to be done before I can release the BodySlide update.

(RaceMenu update, CBBE update, UUNP Underwear)

That is so awesome, I just hope Bethesda is watching and learning. By incorporating some of this stuff into the base game by default for their next game they can make their character customization the envy of game developers everywhere.

[afa]

...or it makes it clear for them that "we don't need to spent time doing it cause some modder will patch it in instead..."

 

But fuck, this is amazing!

This is the kind of stuff that I see in Korean MMO that makes me jealous! Yet it is here now!

[zenna11]

hands now are fit to body when i move sholders to 0% thank you for that fix 

i used CBBE long time bicost of nice sliders i can make my favorite shape but i want somethink more high poly so i go for UUNP body was so minor issu but you guys fix it fast  i rly like this body replacer and weight keep your good work 

 sry for bad english

[guk]

Absolutely awesome
 

Next up we need a tri-mesh body&outfit system for females, so we can define 3 shapes instead of just 2. Like femalebody_0 / 1 / 2.nif

Just imagine you could have skinny, sporty AND chubby in the same body replacer.

 

Talking about NPCs of course, assuming that the bodymorph system only works on the player?

[ousnius]

Absolutely awesome

 

Next up we need a tri-mesh body&outfit system for females, so we can define 3 shapes instead of just 2. Like femalebody_0 / 1 / 2.nif

Just imagine you could have skinny, sporty AND chubby in the same body replacer.

 

Talking about NPCs of course, assuming that the bodymorph system only works on the player?

It works for any NPC, but not something like "all NPCs at once". Has to be done through NiOverride scripts.

[WaxenFigure]

 

Absolutely awesome

 

Next up we need a tri-mesh body&outfit system for females, so we can define 3 shapes instead of just 2. Like femalebody_0 / 1 / 2.nif

Just imagine you could have skinny, sporty AND chubby in the same body replacer.

 

Talking about NPCs of course, assuming that the bodymorph system only works on the player?

It works for any NPC, but not something like "all NPCs at once". Has to be done through NiOverride scripts.

 

 

Future project then for someone, build a mod that applies those overrides to NPCs maybe from a set of saved profiles.  Even if done just to major NPCs, the ones the DB interacts with the most it would add a lot of additional realism to the game. 

[guk]

 

It works for any NPC, but not something like "all NPCs at once". Has to be done through NiOverride scripts.

 

 

Alright so one could make an NPC overhaul with this, probably this is also gonna work on top of everything else if it only uses its own scripts.

 

Looks like the extraordinary BS2 presets will be even more interesting, when you can simply apply them to NPCs in a unique way. Like giving your favorite innkeeper lady a special PAWG body that nobody else in the game has.

All bodyguard followers with UNPSH, elves with Fitness Bodyslide or UNP Skinny, and so on.

 

Woot! Sounds like *someone* will have a lot of work to do once this goes live