Sexout Intimacy

[nyaalich]

So is making templates the alternative to control freak mode, or is it coming back, like Mr. Wayne asked?

[t3589]

So is making templates the alternative to control freak mode, or is it coming back, like Mr. Wayne asked?

 

Other way around actually.  Control freak mode was an alternative to what was unfinished at the time.  I'll definitely have some kind of NPC terminal before it's over.  I know I want to put the renamer back in.  The way it works now, a lot of those things are adjustable through game play.  Which settings do you miss from control freak mode?

[BruceWayne]

All of them. (Plus the new ones, of course.) 

[t3589]

All of them. (Plus the new ones, of course.) 

 

lol  That's easy to say, but then do I take out or discontinue the in game aspects.  ie.  Why should I continue to flesh out a a detailed gifting system that allows you to alter stats through game play, when you can just disable it?  And here's the rub really.  This is what I went through with the alpha.

 

I'd think of a new feature or something neat to integrate, then I'd say to myself, 'But oh they can just set that in control freak mode.'.  See what I mean?  It doesn't help encourage me to flesh things out when it becomes meaningless with a button press.

 

With the profile thingy, it would take all of 10 min to completely customize an NPC, with more accuracy and options than control freak ever had.  So I wonder if you're speaking as a player here. lol

 

I'm sure I'll put control freak options back in.  Possibly just so modders don't have to write their own.  Then they could easily enable which ones they want the player to have access to (all of them, yes I know).

[LadyM]

I hope you'll put back their requests for booze and drugs before sex?  Also I have Cook-Cook and Driver Nephi now and they are awesome too!  I would love to see dance, give gift and all the other options we could choose like walk, party, drink, eat, etc.  Now everything seems to be covered under small talk.  For example Lover Options, we had more options like we could choose sex.  I'm not saying to return to the other mod, I'm just making some observations.  I think your mod is THE best mod to come out for FNV I've ever played with and I truly mean that simply because I'm a sims player too.   I get the best from both games (Amra's animations and relationships) with your mod!

[BruceWayne]

 

All of them. (Plus the new ones, of course.) 

 

lol  That's easy to say, but then do I take out or discontinue the in game aspects.  ie.  Why should I continue to flesh out a a detailed gifting system that allows you to alter stats through game play, when you can just disable it?  And here's the rub really.  This is what I went through with the alpha.

 

I'd think of a new feature or something neat to integrate, then I'd say to myself, 'But oh they can just set that in control freak mode.'.  See what I mean?  It doesn't help encourage me to flesh things out when it becomes meaningless with a button press.

 

With the profile thingy, it would take all of 10 min to completely customize an NPC, with more accuracy and options than control freak ever had.  So I wonder if you're speaking as a player here. lol

 

I'm sure I'll put control freak options back in.  Possibly just so modders don't have to write their own.  Then they could easily enable which ones they want the player to have access to (all of them, yes I know).

 

 

I know, I know.

 

I'm strictly talking about the "hard-coded" stuff we can set up with the template. I don't mean calculated values, like progress or features. Just to let the player set up an NPC if they want to test something out or the system set them up "wrong" (3rd party mods, favorite NPC has wrong stats), etc.

[t3589]

I hope you'll put back their requests for booze and drugs before sex?  Also I have Cook-Cook and Driver Nephi now and they are awesome too!  I would love to see dance, give gift and all the other options we could choose like walk, party, drink, eat, etc.  Now everything seems to be covered under small talk.  For example Lover Options, we had more options like we could choose sex.  I'm not saying to return to the other mod, I'm just making some observations.  I think your mod is THE best mod to come out for FNV I've ever played with and I truly mean that simply because I'm a sims player too.   I get the best from both games (Amra's animations and relationships) with your mod!

 

That's because its not complete yet.  All that stuff is coming back I promise.  The beta is just for shits and giggles right now.  Lots of things are still missing or are only placeholders.

 

[t3589]

 

 

I know, I know.

 

I'm strictly talking about the "hard-coded" stuff we can set up with the template. I don't mean calculated values, like progress or features. Just to let the player set up an NPC if they want to test something out or the system set them up "wrong" (3rd party mods, favorite NPC has wrong stats), etc.

 

 

Roger that.  What I wanted to do is flesh out a gifting system that does essentially what the attributes part of control freak did.  ie. Giving certain gifts could correspond to the heart, libido, temper, etc. settings.  Then it could be sort of a side quest to find certain items to give as gifts.  A sort of 'scavenger hunt' where you're trying to find X item because you want to make the NPC more 'soft hearted'.

 

Sounded fun to me.

 

[Sagebrush61]

I'd like to comment on the "Control Freak Mode" thing.  Just because people can change settings doesn't mean that the majority of them will change them.  I would like to see a more fleshed out gifting system because I think it would be fun.  The only thing I ever used the customizer for in the Alpha was to give a name to random generic trooper girl who was pretty cute (then I came back to the Mojave Outpost a week later and her appearance had been reset by the game and the name was gone).  I like unpredictablity in my gaming so I'll generally roll with whatever the RNG in the mod gives me, even if I have the option to mess with settings I don't use them because it messes up my fun, but it can be nice for players to have the option to change things if it really bothers them.

[t3589]

I'd like to comment on the "Control Freak Mode" thing.  Just because people can change settings doesn't mean that the majority of them will change them.  I would like to see a more fleshed out gifting system because I think it would be fun.  The only thing I ever used the customizer for in the Alpha was to give a name to random generic trooper girl who was pretty cute (then I came back to the Mojave Outpost a week later and her appearance had been reset by the game and the name was gone).  I like unpredictablity in my gaming so I'll generally roll with whatever the RNG in the mod gives me, even if I have the option to mess with settings I don't use them because it messes up my fun, but it can be nice for players to have the option to change things if it really bothers them.

 

True.  I've only ever used control freak to make sure it worked.  So yeah, I tend to arrive from that same perspective.

 

[BruceWayne]

Like the idea with the gifts. I've used that feature in the alpha mainly to give NPCs different outfits. Always got [Thanks:Sarcasm] in return, but they wore that stuff nevertheless.

 

It would be cool if modders could override or add to the gift list, so we can tie them into quests. This would also be useful for custom items and/or custom formlists.

 

 

[t3589]

Right now I want to try and give companions some love.  So far I know:

 

- Put the sandbox back in? (I've forgotten completely what this part was all about, what purpose it served, why I did it, etc. lol)

- I need to put in some stalker apprehension when you're traveling together.

- Stalkers should size up companions and maybe stalk them too?

- I need to fix the follow thing somehow.

 

Anything else?

 

Like the idea with the gifts. I've used that feature in the alpha mainly to give NPCs different outfits. Always got [Thanks:Sarcasm] in return, but they wore that stuff nevertheless.

 

It would be cool if modders could override or add to the gift list, so we can tie them into quests. This would also be useful for custom items and/or custom formlists.

 

Yep the old one was very lazily implemented (and probably broken in places).  I can't believe they actually wore anything you gave them.  I thought all that wearing stuff was still broken...?

 

Ooo great idea.  I will do that thing!

 

[LadyM]

 

I hope you'll put back their requests for booze and drugs before sex?  Also I have Cook-Cook and Driver Nephi now and they are awesome too!  I would love to see dance, give gift and all the other options we could choose like walk, party, drink, eat, etc.  Now everything seems to be covered under small talk.  For example Lover Options, we had more options like we could choose sex.  I'm not saying to return to the other mod, I'm just making some observations.  I think your mod is THE best mod to come out for FNV I've ever played with and I truly mean that simply because I'm a sims player too.   I get the best from both games (Amra's animations and relationships) with your mod!

 

That's because its not complete yet.  All that stuff is coming back I promise.  The beta is just for shits and giggles right now.  Lots of things are still missing or are only placeholders.

 

 

 

Oh I figured that!  It's just so much fun testing it!  I'm with you totally on this mod, I ain't going nowhere except the last few hours, we had a power outage LOL 

 

[BruceWayne]

I wanted to suggest stalkers stalking companions, but I think I hit my request limit for today.

 

Not sure how far you would want to take it with the companions, but I'd find it cool if they could have romances too (maybe guided/assisted by the player, so it won't get boring). Or have them as whore buddies in the casinos, if they trust, like, love you enough and/or you have achieved a good dom/sub level with them.

[LukeDuke]

Forgive me stupid question, but does this mod have MCM menu or do I need to change settings some other way?

 

Nice update btw.

[nyaalich]

The settings I used in control freak mode (or most used) were for heart (soft > hard) and libido.  Part of the way that I play my game is in reaction to previous DRLs.  "Hey, remember when you spent all that time bonding, had sex, and then you basically lost all respect for me?"  Realistic?  Sure.  Why I'm playing DRL?  Um.  No.  Heart = Softest.  Libido = Strongest (although more on that later).  The last versions of the alpha, I'd get partners/marriage after just a few days.  I even restarted the mod turning the pace to slowest.  So while yes, I do want to make it be a sure thing, this mod isn't about instant gratification.  In real life, you don't always get who you want, but in the video game, I want a relationship with my favorite character.  If I wasn't playing TTW, there are fewer people in NV that I am drawn to, so I wouldn't be tweaking the settings.  Let the rejection fall where it may.

 

Other stats...I basically didn't know what they affected, so I went with what seemed safe.  I did turn jealous to 1 because I thought maybe he'd freak out if I just talked with other people if it was high.  I disabled stalker if it was on because no for a variety of reasons.  I turned good nature on because...I figured that whole fuck and ditch thing could happen again or something.

 

I also got shut down every time things did go south and I tried "Let's Talk."  People eventually have difficulties, but when gifts don't change things and they won't talk to you, it seems unsalvageable.  Of course, my mucking around with variables could have broken it anyway.  *shrug*

 

You mentioned that you did [Relax Here] to force comps to sandbox.  I wasn't clear on its intent at the time...wasn't sure if it was working as designed.

 

This past version, we had the "no sex until partners, oh wait make that marriage, and maybe not even then" fun ordeal.  Because I didn't understand how foreplay worked (that's where the Lust arousal HUD would be cool if it tied to it...but that's another paragraph or so), I cheated and used Sexout Sex for when sexy times should have been happening.  Using SO Sex, he figured out that sex was the best thing ever, and started initiating it every few minutes in game.  I tried turning down his libido, but it didn't ever seem to have any affect. 

 

Huh.  I don't remember anyone else turning green.  Interesting.

 

I too always got sarcasm for gifts.

@LukeDuke There should be a SOI Controls entry under the Armor menu.  It'll open a terminal after you close your pip-boy where you can set your hotkey and set some other stuff.

[t3589]

@Nyaa:

 

A lot of the things you mention are why I cut out some of the things that I did.  Much of that was broken or open ended.

 

Foreplay is supposed to be somewhat tricky but not that difficult (unless you can't accept falling off the horse as part of the process).  What you describe just sounds like something was broken.  Think of it like a game of three card monte.  Also to improve this situation I haven't hidden any of the dialog states in this new one.  This should allow you to see what you've selected before, and by process of elimination figure things out easier.

 

Because your needs are so specific in regards to your favorite companion, why not use the profile dealy and really set him up?  It literally works like a configuration file.  Then you'll have it and never have to set anything ever again.

 

I'm working on companions now.  I've got some weird behavior going on when I don't set their wait state.  They do sandbox, but then every now and again they'll evp back into their follow package.  I had veronica start sandboxing in the PC home, walked outside, she teleported with, and started sandboxing again.

 

The thing is, I'm not sure if this is undesirable behavior?  It was kind of neat to tell you the truth.  But I don't usually play companions so what do I know.  Before I had it to where when you sandbox them that was it, they also went into wait mode and you could leave them there.

 

  I'm also wondering how they are running their activity packages while in follow mode?

 

[LadyM]

@nyaalich you have some interesting points here and it's good because they differ somewhat from mine so we can give t a better overall view of how the mod is working in our games. At least I sure want to help.
 

The settings I used in control freak mode (or most used) were for heart (soft > hard) and libido.  Part of the way that I play my game is in reaction to previous DRLs.  "Hey, remember when you spent all that time bonding, had sex, and then you basically lost all respect for me?"  Realistic?  Sure.  Why I'm playing DRL?  Um.  No.  Heart = Softest.  Libido = Strongest (although more on that later).  The last versions of the alpha, I'd get partners/marriage after just a few days.  I even restarted the mod turning the pace to slowest.  So while yes, I do want to make it be a sure thing, this mod isn't about instant gratification.  In real life, you don't always get who you want, but in the video game, I want a relationship with my favorite character.  If I wasn't playing TTW, there are fewer people in NV that I am drawn to, so I wouldn't be tweaking the settings.  Let the rejection fall where it may.

I used the libido myself, I made sure they were all set on strongest because I use the sexout perks of nymphomaniac and insatiable. So I need my guys to be ready willing and able. I also enable 'stalker' on all of them. Billy comes with stalker disabled yet he use the 'rape' command a few times on me which I thought was fun. Scrambler always has stalker enabled which is one of the many reasons I love playing with him. I like to have the variety of different 'hearts'. Driver Nephi always surprises me because, I'd say- 95% of the time -his heart came up as soft. Now Scrambler and Billy Creel vary from soft to hard.  
 

Other stats...I basically didn't know what they affected, so I went with what seemed safe.  I did turn jealous to 1 because I thought maybe he'd freak out if I just talked with other people if it was high.  I disabled stalker if it was on because no for a variety of reasons.  I turned good nature on because...I figured that whole fuck and ditch thing could happen again or something.

I loved the jealousy. I don't know what I did to him but one time but I got ole Billy really pissed at me and he kept giving me the 'hairy eyeball!' I eventually had to reset him but it was so funny in the meantime. He just glared at me and call it my imagination or AI but his expression seemed to GLARE! LOL There is so much to the old version I never understood if it was even working. Something else I LOVE is the settings where they stare at your body parts! MORE of that please! Stare at my tits and then end up getting tit fucked, now that's immersion!
 

I also got shut down every time things did go south and I tried "Let's Talk."  People eventually have difficulties, but when gifts don't change things and they won't talk to you, it seems unsalvageable.  Of course, my mucking around with variables could have broken it anyway.  *shrug*

Oh I only tried that once and realized it's how you break off their relationship but I NEVER, EVER got a proposal! How did you manage that? I want to get married to!! LOL 
 

You mentioned that you did [Relax Here] to force comps to sandbox.  I wasn't clear on its intent at the time...wasn't sure if it was working as designed.

I tried relax early on with Lt Hayes and he froze in my portable tent, I never used it again.
 

This past version, we had the "no sex until partners, oh wait make that marriage, and maybe not even then" fun ordeal.  Because I didn't understand how foreplay worked (that's where the Lust arousal HUD would be cool if it tied to it...but that's another paragraph or so), I cheated and used Sexout Sex for when sexy times should have been happening.  Using SO Sex, he figured out that sex was the best thing ever, and started initiating it every few minutes in game.  I tried turning down his libido, but it didn't ever seem to have any affect.

 
I can't play without having sex THROUGH the relationship layer! Using the prompts seem to meaningless to me know since I can actually have sex through this mod. But the sex here needs to be way more prominent, same with party here and like I said before to have dancing options.
 

Huh.  I don't remember anyone else turning green.  Interesting.

They flash pink in my game, no green. It seems when maybe something new comes up in their layer, they flash? Or is this just a coincidence but when I do see them flash pink, I go talk to them and seem to get a little further than before in 'conversing.'
 

I too always got sarcasm for gifts.

Me too. But I still gave them gifts. I always gave Scrambler money.

 

[t3589]

Flashing Red (or pink I guess) = Not ready yet.  Green (or not pink) = Ready to go.  This only happens on their very first cycle through as a visual cue to tell the player that the NPC is now running in the system.

 

I badly wanted to add the video game sounds from the classic 'pole position', but figured someone would complain about the assets. lol

[LadyM]

@Nyaa:

 

1. A lot of the things you mention are why I cut out some of the things that I did.  Much of that was broken or open ended.

 

2. Foreplay is supposed to be somewhat tricky but not that difficult (unless you can't accept falling off the horse as part of the process).  What you describe just sounds like something was broken.  Think of it like a game of three card monte.  Also to improve this situation I haven't hidden any of the dialog states in this new one.  This should allow you to see what you've selected before, and by process of elimination figure things out easier.

 

3. Because your needs are so specific in regards to your favorite companion, why not use the profile dealy and really set him up?  It literally works like a configuration file.  Then you'll have it and never have to set anything ever again.

 

4. I'm working on companions now.  I've got some weird behavior going on when I don't set their wait state.  They do sandbox, but then every now and again they'll evp back into their follow package.  I had veronica start sandboxing in the PC home, walked outside, she teleported with, and started sandboxing again.

 

5. The thing is, I'm not sure if this is undesirable behavior?  It was kind of neat to tell you the truth.  But I don't usually play companions so what do I know.  Before I had it to where when you sandbox them that was it, they also went into wait mode and you could leave them there.

 

6.  I'm also wondering how they are running their activity packages while in follow mode?

2. I love the foreplay game, especially when it lights up and gives me new options!

 

3.  t, so far I've not had the companion profile for any of my current companions.  I have Driver Nephi, Lt Hayes, Sgt McGee (who I'm having some trouble with) and Cook-Cook.  It might be because they are not the usual NPCs but they are so much fun to play with!

 

4.  In all honesty from my style of play I don't care to use your commands for companions.  I use JIP and just set the commands univerally for all of them at once.  Mind you I play with hordes so having commands for each companion is not practical for my style.

 

6.  Again, I use JIP and steer clear of altering my JIP commands. It might be your follow that is borked in my game, although I didn't use it on Sgt McGee he still is just frozen.  If I go through a door he'll be with the rest of the guys but then he won't move.  I've dismissed him and removed the intimacy layer but now he's just broken.  I've gone back to a previous save.

 

EDIT: I know what knocked Sgt McGee out.  I used the command 'Argue'.  After that he just stopped doing idles and any movement.  All he could do was join me through a door but he'd stay there and not follow.  Chances are I might be having a conflict with JIP and that would be catastrophic!  Any one else using JIP with no problems?

[nyaalich]

I can totally use the template rather than etc. with the control freak mode.  I feel like I both validated and invalidated your purpose for removing it (ignoring the template).

 

I did [Relax Here] previously, which had him relax and then teleport into regular follow when I left the cell.  *shrug*  It was neat.

 

@LadyM  The marriage thing was way less exciting than that, although again, it could have been that something was broken because I got a few zoom-ins or [Nevermind]s with the topic being "commitment".  But still, I got those AFTER I got [Commentment: Marriage].  No hoopla.  Just [spouse Dialogue] instead of Casual or Partners.

 

Foreplay was confusing to me because it seems like whatever you did, they'd do that opposite.  Firm > Gentle.  Mutual > Mutual.  Gentle > Firm.  I never got "[More]" unless I did dirty talk, but again, it didn't seem to matter if it was dom/mutual/sub.  I could never tell if [...] was a good thing or not.

 

I've not used JIP.  When I got a [Follow] last night, Charon was already following me, and we were running around the Mojave anyway, so nothing different happened.  Maybe something panicked when you changed cells.

[t3589]

@ Lady: JIP crashes often for me which is why I don't use it.  But for my play style it isn't a huge loss because I hardly play companions.

 

@ Nyaa: I'll do a write up on foreplay soon.  It's really a battle of wills.  Not trying to show your cards too soon, while tying to expose theirs.  Quick tip if you see dirty talk it means they're hot.  Avoid being too eager to score until you've worked them into a nice froth.  Once they're hot, it becomes a game of 3 card monte.  At that point all of the choices read 'score', but the whammy is hiding under some of them.  You have to... find the lady.  Come on folks, find the lady.  She's hiding under there somewhere.

 

Did a few things on companions today so far.  Will post a new esm sometime tonight.

[BruceWayne]

I did some more testing just now and I've noticed two things, which I want to bring to your attention:

 

1) The dialogue activation distance is off. It doesn't reach as far as it does with the standard activation distance. While the NPCs get their dialogue token, they just stand there until I crawl right up in their face, if I initiated a little too far off.

 

2) I got little over an hour in, but I've noticed that NPCs, even with really high temporary stats like attraction, lust, desire, etc. rarely initiate any dialogue. I'm aware that this is probably due to early development stuff. I just always liked that NPCs show some initiative, as opposed to the player being the only instigator. Same goes for activities, which seem like a one-(wo)man show now. I did get some interactions, but they were few and far in between.

 

Other than that, I really like the back-and-forth "frenzies" you can go into if you choose wisely. 

 

[t3589]

I did some more testing just now and I've noticed two things, which I want to bring to your attention:

 

1) The dialogue activation distance is off. It doesn't reach as far as it does with the standard activation distance. While the NPCs get their dialogue token, they just stand there until I crawl right up in their face, if I initiated a little too far off.

 

2) I got little over an hour in, but I've noticed that NPCs, even with really high temporary stats like attraction, lust, desire, etc. rarely initiate any dialogue. I'm aware that this is probably due to early development stuff. I just always liked that NPCs show some initiative, as opposed to the player being the only instigator. Same goes for activities, which seem like a one-(wo)man show now. I did get some interactions, but they were few and far in between.

 

Other than that, I really like the back-and-forth "frenzies" you can go into if you choose wisely. 

 

I'll see what I can do about the distances.  But if I remember right the close distance was a result of some idles not working with startconversation unless you're closer than 200.  I'll play with it.

 

Yes the stats are base atm and almost all of them need tweaked.  ie. gains are very small atm for normal NPCs (though stalkers and gang members should be a bit speedier).

[LadyM]

I'm still having some trouble with frozen companions I've JIPed but I don't think it's the JIP.  Now it's Scrambler that's frozen and I didn't argue with him, I just had sex and he froze, standing in place after that act was complete.  T, if you need to see any debug stuff from my game, please let me know what you need and how I get it for you.

 

EDIT:  There is definitely something going on.  I'll put in an older version tomorrow and see if they still are freezing.  I know it's not the JIP, it's right after they have sex, instead of following me they just stand there.  I don't always have the 'follow' prompt from the mod also or I'd give that a try to move them out of the area on their own motivation.