Infinite Loading Screens; Help!

[CoxcombCornking]

Hi.

If you haven't solved this Goodspring entry issue yet, may I ask you to first try typing "coc goodsprings" in the console. This is just to see if that cell will even load up, and place you there. Perhaps a mod is trying to add something to your inventory, or give a message.

 

Remember experiencing this problem with FO3. Different occasions with different causes.

1. Megaton's door. In that case, it was an npc exiting the door as my character attempted to enter. Crash. Repeat. Crash.

2. Citadel. Someone's modding had changed the height of an npc in the courtyard to 100. Enter. Crash.

3. Vault 87. (Everyone's favorite CTD.) Abducted by Enclave. Crash. Game was trying to remove modded quest items from inventory.

[Odessa]

I think you need to remove all of your mods and play a new game for a few hours. If you hit the issues, then you need to reinstall the game.

 

If it does work then the problem is either savegame corruption or a bad mod.

 

- If the problem is save game corruption then you're going to have to throw that save away (sadly)

 

- If the problem is your mods, then your old save might work without them. Or it might not depending on how 'bad' the bad mod is. Hopefully you will be lucky.

 

[Abiose]

I'm afraid it's already too late for that. I already uninstalled the game and I'm downloading it again as I type. I'll trim down my mod list even further and won't use any major texture packs either and I'm gonna do a save file in Goodsprings without anything, right after the installment basically. That's the plan for now.

 

I'll gladly keep you guys in the loop and if maybe the whole thing will be fixed by itself (more or less). Fingers crossed.

[Nite_Star]

This used to happen when I used the custom race CW DOLLS.

[labrat]

I found that if a save game hung on the loading screen (roulette wheel spins for ever) then it was extraordinarily difficult to find the reason, but there was a very easy solution.

 

Instead of continuing the game from the last saved game, back pedal and load a previous game, one that you know will load, then immediately hit esc and load the latest game.

It should miraculously load now.

 

You may find that several recent saves won't load and you have to go back aways, but note the one that works and every now and again try continue to see if the problem has sorted itself out . I found that the problem just comes and goes.

 

Also note that steam will overwrite your ini files, so updates you have made will disappear.

 

EDIT: It may be a good idea to start your new game with no mods at all until you have a small bank of save games.

[Guest carywinton]

 

Good advice KainsChylde, unfortunately when using FOMM, most mods are not offered in the wonderful *.fomod format and when trying to "create from folder" it will crash. I do not trust NMM to install mods properly, so unfortunately again, the only good method is the manual method.

I am compelled to say.. this is terrible advice!

 

When you download a mod that isn't a .fomod, there are only two "right" ways of installing it.

 

The first, which applies to pretty much all the mods out there, including those here on LL that aren't .fomod's, is to simply click "add fomod" in the FOMM package manager and select the zip/7z file. These are called "fomod ready" archives and nearly every mod you download is one.

 

Second, if the above does not work, is to extract the archive, follow the manual install instructions into an empty directory -- not your game directory, and when you're done, zip that directory up and install it as if it was fomod ready as in the first step.

 

Manually installing things is terrible unless you have no choice, and there are only two things I know of where you don't have a choice -- NVSE and ENB -- because they install some things into the root FONV directory, one level above 'data'.

 

The 'make from directory' thing is... kinda wonky. Avoid using it.

 

 

Well I suppose everyone is entitled to their opinion, I have yet to have either a supposedly "FOMOD" ready zip achieve or anything along those lines work and install properly either. The manual method of installing the appropriate folders to the data directory is the most sure fire way of knowing they went where they were supposed to. The majority of mods once extracted will have usually a textures, meshes and *.esm or *.esp file, it's really quite simple to dump them into the data directory and answer yes to the files being over ridden. If the initial zip or rar file is packaged properly, then perhaps I would feel more comfortable trying the other method mentioned here. But usually when I unpack mods they are not in the correct order and proper file structure.

 

[prideslayer]

Well I suppose everyone is entitled to their opinion, I have yet to have either a supposedly "FOMOD" ready zip achieve or anything along those lines work and install properly either.

I find this impossible to believe as someone who's used only FOMM (or OBMM) to install mods over the past three years, and as someone who is actively working on the FOMM sourcecode. It works.

 

The manual method of installing the appropriate folders to the data directory is the most sure fire way of knowing they went where they were supposed to.

It's also the most surefire way of ending up in a situation where you have no idea which files need to be removed during an mod uninstall if you haven't kept meticulous track of which files you've copied in from what mods, and what files overwrote vanilla assets vs. assets from other mods. Because of this, manually installing mods is the #2 reason for support requests around here, right behind not reading the requirements/instructions.

 

If the initial zip or rar file is packaged properly, then perhaps I would feel more comfortable trying the other method mentioned here. But usually when I unpack mods they are not in the correct order and proper file structure.

That is why I said you look in it first and if it's not, you restructure it into a new 'empty' data directory, zip it up, and then use FOMM to install that. This eliminates any possibility of not being able to cleanly uninstall the mod, and if you get the reorganization wrong, you just uninstall it and try again.

 

This is such a better solution than just dropping files in the data directory and hoping that you or the mod author got the structure right that it's unbelievable anyone suggests another course of action, especially to people already having problems with mods not being installed (or uninstalled) properly.

[Abiose]

So I finally downloaded the game again, made a save game, right after I did so right in the middle of Goodsprings with no mods whatsoever. Then I began extracting mods again, mostly via NMM if the directory inside the archive was right, just because of the fairly smart (at least for my perspective) backup system it provides when you decide to just deactivate it again in NMM.

Anyway, I slimed down the mods as well, for example I don't have the NCR Texture Pack anymore or no texture packs for that matter actually and some other mods hit the fan as well but I do still use almost all Loverslab mods, that just as a heads up. So far it all seems to work. I've been playing for a bunch of hours now with certain crashes and hangs after a few hours (most of the time, not always) but it's not exactly gamebreaking for me and I can deal with that.

My guess is that it was something left over previously. Or something from the mods/texture packs I previously had. I do however still have bugs now. Namely 3 actually that kinda annoy me, but again, they are not breaking the game.

The first would be that the "Brahmin-Skin Outfit" has a weird texture bug where it would constantly change depending on angle/enviroment like it didn't have a proper texture. Once the character is pregnant and it switches to P1 it'll not only have a working texture but it will also look completly different with T3 Cali Body when it previously had the (I think) BnB Body. The reason that's odd is, that I'm using all the standard settings, meaning T3 Cali and I don't have any BnB Body Armors/Clothing installed, unless they are in the SCR Requirements in which case it would still be weird because I'm 99% certain that I have installed everything correctly in there and there just shouldn't be a missing texture. I read up on that and it might just be a bug from the game itself once you hit a certain number of textures installed or something. Again, I barely have any texture mods installed. Every single one is armors and replacers too. On a sidenote: The only thing I played around with is added bouncing to my body which works fine by the way, even with pregnancy and all.

That leads to the second 'bug' if we shall call it that: I can't change body textures for some reason. I mean it can't be hard, right? Textures folder and replace the files for female upper body and such. That's not rocket science, but for some reason it just won't apply in game at all. It work's for head and hand meshes but it's like the body itself just gets overridden by something. My guess is that it's the pregnancy stuff but I'm actually just scared to play around with mods at all right now in fear I might mess up again and make FNV unplayable for me. The reason I mention this minor thing is becaue I think it plays into the bigger issue that the sex animations won't display the current body (when the character is pregnant) 90% of the time but always goes into the standard T3 Cali body. I don't know if that's on purpose or something is messed up.

The third and last issue is some armors, all ending with "OW" (e.g. "Field Hand Outfit OW") or 'over worked' I think it was, won't display at all. They make the body disappear and I installed every armor mesh I have twice now without a fix. I didn't find anything googling that either, so in case someone had this issue... let me know please.

 

That's just to update you guys and let the mods know that the original issue is resolved and the topic could be closed if wanted to.

Also a huge thanks again to all who helped and tried to help me. Especially people like Odessa who made multiple suggestions and don't worry it was none of your great mods. :-)

 

Regards,

Abiose.

[Guest]

I think that for your first problem if you really installed everything correctly even eventual requirements etc. maybe it's a texture path on the mesh that is wrong, I think it would deserve a try to take a look at the texture paths with nifskope and see if everything's in the right place. Or if you prefer you could attach the specific mesh to a message.

For the second problem, are you using a custom race? could it be that this custom race is pointing to a different file which is not the standard female upperbody dds so that even if you replace it you still see the same old texture?

[Guest carywinton]

Actually I do keep meticulous track of every single mod and know exactly what it installs. Uninstall is usually quite simple, just delete the folders and *.esp or *esm associated with the mod. What do you think was done before FOMM, NMM and any other mod manager was even conceived? That's right mods were manually installed. I have looked over your posts regarding your work on FOMM Prideslayer and when you have a stable release I will have a look at it. Until then I will stick with my manual method that works. Your support issues are of serious concern with regards to installation of mods, it is unfortunate people do not read the install instructions and do not follow their installation process. I have been working in the game productions and IT industry for over 25 years and until recently there were no such Mod Managers to install mods with.

 

Perhaps providing a "blank" script template that people could use to facilitate the installation of their mods using FOMM would be a better direction to consider, I believe this would seriously cut down on support issues if the mods would install properly this way.

 

I always verify the file and folder structure before installing, copying the files into the data directory, I never just blindly drop them in, as you implied.

[prideslayer]

Before continuing, I must remind you that this sidetrack started with you saying a manual install is "the only good way." This is wrong, and what kicked off our little hijack. It's not the only good way, and for a newbie (like the one asking for help), it's the worst way. Period. They will simply end up with a screwed up game and have to reset it with the cache validator, if not completely reinstall it.

 

So on with it then.

 

Actually I do keep meticulous track of every single mod and know exactly what it installs. Uninstall is usually quite simple, just delete the folders and *.esp or *esm associated with the mod.

Most are a plugin and a few assets. Keeping track of them in a textfile is easy, if tedious. Some -- the ones most users want -- are much more complex. Un-fomoding BBR and installing it manually would be a nightmare. Installing BNB already is a nightmare.

 

What do you think was done before FOMM....

It may surprise you to know that while I haven't been in the game industry, I've been a modder and developer almost as long; about 22 years. Long before there were cars, there were horse drawn buggies. Suggesting a horse drawn buggy, or walking, is the "only good way" to get to work because the car might break down, crash, or run out of gas is.. silly.

 

I don't know what you mean when you say 'support issues' or 'stable release'. I have no support issues I'm aware of, and the current and last 4 or 5 releases (except for one) have been fine. One yesterday had a problem installing new mods, that was fixed within a few minutes of being reported. The existing "official" FOMM is perfectly stable, and absolutely works, so long as you don't try to check for updates and don't use it after using NMM to manage the same game in the same mod lib directory.

 

Perhaps providing a "blank" script template that people could use to facilitate the installation of their mods using FOMM would be a better direction to consider, I believe this would seriously cut down on support issues if the mods would install properly this way.

I'm in favor of this, and in fact, the install script for sexout core can already be used for exactly this purpose. It has no fancy UI junk asking questions about what you want to install or don't, it simply copies everything. It's rather large to post here, but anyone is free to look at it and use it.

 

The XML install method (sexout uses the C# install script) is easier for newbies to understand and smaller. Here's the one I created for the stutter remover to make it into a fomod, because as I said, we work in exactly the opposite way. I turn *everything* I install (except NVSE itself) into a FOMOD, and *only* use FOMM to install. It has never given me problems. Not once.

 

New Vegas stutter remover fomod instructions:

 

 

Make an NVSR directory. Inside it make two more, 'fomod' and 'files'. Put the nvsr .dll in 'files'. In the fomod dir, put these two files, then zip it up and rename the file with a '.fomod' extension.

 

info.xml:

<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-16"?>
<fomod>
  <Name>NVSR - Stutter Remover</Name>
  <Author>skyranger-1</Author>
  <Version MachineVersion="4.1.30">4-1-30</Version>
  <Description>The New Vegas Stutter Remover

Requires:
  1. NVSE.
</Description>
  <Groups>
    <element>modresource</element>
  </Groups>
</fomod>

ModuleConfig.xml:

<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?>
  <config xmlns:xsi="http://www.w3.org/2001/XMLSchema-instance" xsi:noNamespaceSchemaLocation="http://qconsulting.ca/fo3/ModConfig5.0.xsd">
    <moduleName>NVSR - Stutter Remover</moduleName>
    <requiredInstallFiles>
      <file source="files/sr_New_Vegas_Stutter_Remover.dll" destination="nvse/plugins/sr_New_Vegas_Stutter_Remover.dll" />
    </requiredInstallFiles>
  </config>

Adapt this to your own purposes by changing the names/descriptions to suit you, and add your mods files in more 'file' tags in the second xml.

 

 

 

I always verify the file and folder structure before installing, copying the files into the data directory, I never just blindly drop them in, as you implied.

New users, like the one asking the question, do not. They do not know what a correct structure looks like to begin with.

[Abiose]

[...]

New users, like the one asking the question, do not. They do not know what a correct structure looks like to begin with.

 

 

I don't mean to pride in on your discussion, I just felt like correcting this. I do kinda know the right structure for the usual mods. Obviously if a 'mod' or rather resource, I guess, would branch out like let's say SCR, then I don't know if all the folders are alined correctly but when it comes to the usual stuff, I know about meshes/textures folder and even the following folders within mostly, unless they are named absolutely silly.

Anyway, that's just a decourse, back to A.J.'s suggestions, sorry.

 

I don't know how to use nifskope and I don't even have the program, so I'm not sure I could really help there. I could search for the mesh if I knew what the name for it was. If someone wouldn't mind telling me what the name for "Brahmin-Skin Outfit" in the meshes/textures folder is...

I don't use any custom races. That's one of those things I stayed away from since the last time and I checked if there's multiple upperbodyfemale.dds files, which there are (I mean besides the one for raiders), one in textures\characters\Female and the others in textures\characters\Female\female. I tried replacing those manually too but even that just won't get recognized by the game properly, so I don't know.

[prideslayer]

My apologies if you're more knowledgable than I assumed.

 

I don't know the name for the outfit you're looking for, but if you look it up the GECK, it will tell you.

 

The texture thing indicates an incorrectly installed mod. There is not supposed to be a 'female\female' directory structure. If you *did* use FOMM, use the built in filemanager to tell you which package installed that file.

[Guest]

Well Abiose if you manage to find which nif is and send it to me, I'll be glad to take a look if it has an incorrect path for texture, I find strange that a full armor pack is working but only brahmin outfit isn't working, it more sounds to me that in the big number of armours there was a mistake in a path.

 

I don't know how a pregnant body works, unfortunately I don't know anything about all these lovely mods. So these are only assumptions from me... Maybe it switches the mesh, changing the race, I've read it's possible doing something like that ingame even if I never tried it, if it's so it wouldn't be different from a sort of custom race, with all the "problems" that could be originated by different linked upperbody textures etc. Or it could wear a body armour with a belly, which could have inside a different upperbody like the Cali so it would be normal you'll see your body changing in shape entirely.

In both cases it would be nice to me to know more about it... I did a NPC some time ago, at a certain point she was getting injuried: I had to create a clone of herself, and make a different race, just to link the different "injuried" texture, then disable the orignal NPC and enable the clone... with alll the consequences on duplicating the GetIsID and place a OR with the new clone Base ID etc... If there's a faster and better way, it would be definetely interesting to know... NPCs changing when the time changes are soooo realistic...

[prideslayer]

Pregnancy uses armor/clothing items for the visual side. These are either modified versions of the vanilla (or 3rd party) meshes and textures with a larger belly and breasts, or modified body meshes. All of them are based on T3 Cali. There are no custom races involved, it's all clothing (or armor) items with their meshes adjusted to reflect the state of the pregnancy.

 

There were (are?) plans for all those meshes to be converted again, for different body types, but I'm not sure how far along it is. This is what the SCR body type selections in MCM are for, and also why they're marked WIP.

[Halstrom]

Pregnancy uses armor/clothing items for the visual side. These are either modified versions of the vanilla (or 3rd party) meshes and textures with a larger belly and breasts, or modified body meshes. All of them are based on T3 Cali. There are no custom races involved, it's all clothing (or armor) items with their meshes adjusted to reflect the state of the pregnancy.

 

There were (are?) plans for all those meshes to be converted again, for different body types, but I'm not sure how far along it is. This is what the SCR body type selections in MCM are for, and also why they're marked WIP.

Well, basically I just add the meshes as they are supplied and no ones added any new meshes for a while. 95% of the outfits only have T3Cali available. I'm not impressed with the naming myself, being partially blind I often can't tell the minor differences between 2 similar outfits in the tiny GECK window, the standard Beth names are all screwed up as well, some of that is because the game name is something like "Sexy Nightwear" for both male and female but 2 completely different meshes are used. But then again some of the Maternity clothing is just named p1.nif which leaves it very open for me to add the wrong mesh to the wrong outfit.

The Body type selection just adds a token to the Actors for bodytype so Pregnancy swapping and other clothing mods can make outfit decisions based on that token. It also does nude bodies but only for Pregnant variations.

[prideslayer]

Details details.. I was just trying to answer the "is this meshes, or a custom race?" question. It's not a custom race was the 'tl;dr' version.

[Guest carywinton]

Before continuing, I must remind you that this sidetrack started with you saying a manual install is "the only good way." This is wrong, and what kicked off our little hijack. It's not the only good way, and for a newbie (like the one asking for help), it's the worst way. Period. They will simply end up with a screwed up game and have to reset it with the cache validator, if not completely reinstall it.

 

So on with it then.

 

Actually I do keep meticulous track of every single mod and know exactly what it installs. Uninstall is usually quite simple, just delete the folders and *.esp or *esm associated with the mod.

Most are a plugin and a few assets. Keeping track of them in a textfile is easy, if tedious. Some -- the ones most users want -- are much more complex. Un-fomoding BBR and installing it manually would be a nightmare. Installing BNB already is a nightmare.

 

What do you think was done before FOMM....

It may surprise you to know that while I haven't been in the game industry, I've been a modder and developer almost as long; about 22 years. Long before there were cars, there were horse drawn buggies. Suggesting a horse drawn buggy, or walking, is the "only good way" to get to work because the car might break down, crash, or run out of gas is.. silly.

 

I don't know what you mean when you say 'support issues' or 'stable release'. I have no support issues I'm aware of, and the current and last 4 or 5 releases (except for one) have been fine. One yesterday had a problem installing new mods, that was fixed within a few minutes of being reported. The existing "official" FOMM is perfectly stable, and absolutely works, so long as you don't try to check for updates and don't use it after using NMM to manage the same game in the same mod lib directory.

 

Perhaps providing a "blank" script template that people could use to facilitate the installation of their mods using FOMM would be a better direction to consider, I believe this would seriously cut down on support issues if the mods would install properly this way.

I'm in favor of this, and in fact, the install script for sexout core can already be used for exactly this purpose. It has no fancy UI junk asking questions about what you want to install or don't, it simply copies everything. It's rather large to post here, but anyone is free to look at it and use it.

 

The XML install method (sexout uses the C# install script) is easier for newbies to understand and smaller. Here's the one I created for the stutter remover to make it into a fomod, because as I said, we work in exactly the opposite way. I turn *everything* I install (except NVSE itself) into a FOMOD, and *only* use FOMM to install. It has never given me problems. Not once.

 

New Vegas stutter remover fomod instructions:

 

 

Make an NVSR directory. Inside it make two more, 'fomod' and 'files'. Put the nvsr .dll in 'files'. In the fomod dir, put these two files, then zip it up and rename the file with a '.fomod' extension.

 

info.xml:

<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-16"?>
<fomod>
  <Name>NVSR - Stutter Remover</Name>
  <Author>skyranger-1</Author>
  <Version MachineVersion="4.1.30">4-1-30</Version>
  <Description>The New Vegas Stutter Remover

Requires:
  1. NVSE.
</Description>
  <Groups>
    <element>modresource</element>
  </Groups>
</fomod>

ModuleConfig.xml:

<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?>
  <config xmlns:xsi="http://www.w3.org/2001/XMLSchema-instance" xsi:noNamespaceSchemaLocation="http://qconsulting.ca/fo3/ModConfig5.0.xsd">
    <moduleName>NVSR - Stutter Remover</moduleName>
    <requiredInstallFiles>
      <file source="files/sr_New_Vegas_Stutter_Remover.dll" destination="nvse/plugins/sr_New_Vegas_Stutter_Remover.dll" />
    </requiredInstallFiles>
  </config>

Adapt this to your own purposes by changing the names/descriptions to suit you, and add your mods files in more 'file' tags in the second xml.

 

 

 

I always verify the file and folder structure before installing, copying the files into the data directory, I never just blindly drop them in, as you implied.

New users, like the one asking the question, do not. They do not know what a correct structure looks like to begin with.

 

 

Not knowing the folder structure, overall structure and functionality of the game you are trying to mod is a direction headed for disappointment and frustration. To understand the file formats and core structure is imperative to completing any mod installation , conflict resolution and overall game playability. I agree with you on the FOMOD install scripts, XML is a far easier scripting foundation for new folks to the whole scripting scene. C# is a bit of a cluster mess for coding, but is fairly stable and has a decent support following.

It is good to try to ease the installation woes of the general user and player base, so the fact that the majority of your work takes this into account is admirable.

[DoctaSax]

Glad you guys worked this out

I'm a part-fomm, part-wrye user myself - I wouldn't recommend it to noobs, but there's a couple of things that flash does that fomm just doesn't. Maybe I oughta give this MO thing a try.

[Odessa]

 

Not knowing the folder structure, overall structure and functionality of the game you are trying to mod is a direction headed for disappointment and frustration. To understand the file formats and core structure is imperative to completing any mod installation , conflict resolution and overall game playability

 

 

I suspect the number of people installing game mods who understand the above is rather a lot smaller than 1%. I didn't know a whole lot when I started actually making my own mods either, have picked it up along the way when it was relevant.

 

Likewise, I doubt many Obsidian/Bethesda developers had a grounded understanding of the GameBryo engine, and most programmers (especially web + higher level language users) don't understand what is going on at the lower levels. Its sort of the point isn't it? You don't need to understand how tools were built to use them, and deciding to skip them is usually a waste of time that's likely to get most people worse results.

[prideslayer]

Glad you guys worked this out

I'm a part-fomm, part-wrye user myself - I wouldn't recommend it to noobs, but there's a couple of things that flash does that fomm just doesn't. Maybe I oughta give this MO thing a try.

Just FYI, getting the fomods rebuilt so they're wrye compatible is still on my list. I just don't like the fact that the wrye format is so.. restrictive, so I keep procrastinating on the attempt.

[DoctaSax]

Heh, I know you don't like it pride - it's just that I like the overall BAIN feature of treating your data install like a load order you can move around, color tags giving you at-a-glance info on your packages' sync status, and the anneal thing letting you restore overwritten files when you uninstall or moved the overwriting files. Things like that. Fomm's file manager is just too restrictive for me in that respect, except for its per-file moving that you can do which wrye lacks, but overall it's handier to install mods than do post-install management with it. So I just keep it for HUD stuff (uHUD script) and texture replacers that I may wanna switch around on a per-file basis, while I choose wrye for beauty & clothing comps and simple drop-in mods, where all I really need to know is if everything's still there.

[prideslayer]

 

Not knowing the folder structure, overall structure and functionality of the game you are trying to mod is a direction headed for disappointment and frustration. To understand the file formats and core structure is imperative to completing any mod installation , conflict resolution and overall game playability

 

I suspect the number of people installing game mods who understand the above is rather a lot smaller than 1%. I didn't know a whole lot when I started actually making my own mods either, have picked it up along the way when it was relevant.

 

Likewise, I doubt many Obsidian/Bethesda developers had a grounded understanding of the GameBryo engine, and most programmers (especially web + higher level language users) don't understand what is going on at the lower levels. Its sort of the point isn't it? You don't need to understand how tools were built to use them, and deciding to skip them is usually a waste of time that's likely to get most people worse results.

 

Asking players to understand the game structure before installing mods is akin to asking them to understand the byzantine windows layout (program files, appdata, services, registry, etc) before installing any programs. Likewise suggesting that they manually install said mods is no different from suggesting they unpack application installers and install those manually, including everything from copying the files to adding entries to the registry.

 

It would certainly make life easier on *us* if everyone understood these things, but I could make my life a lot easier by ditching the whole fomod thing too. Slam all the sexout files into one directory, zip it up, and include the following install instructions: "Figure it out."

 

Both of the users it had would be very technically savvy I'm sure.

[prideslayer]

Heh, I know you don't like it pride - it's just that I like the overall BAIN feature of treating your data install like a load order you can move around, color tags giving you at-a-glance info on your packages' sync status, and the anneal thing letting you restore overwritten files when you uninstall or moved the overwriting files. Things like that. Fomm's file manager is just too restrictive for me in that respect, except for its per-file moving that you can do which wrye lacks, but overall it's handier to install mods than do post-install management with it. So I just keep it for HUD stuff (uHUD script) and texture replacers that I may wanna switch around on a per-file basis, while I choose wrye for beauty & clothing comps and simple drop-in mods, where all I really need to know is if everything's still there.

I don't like or dislike wrye itself, hell I've only used the thing once. I dislike the installer *format* it has (BAIN), compared to the fomod format. The last time I looked at it there was a very specific directory structure I had to make to enable multiple options and such (like in sexout data or tryouts) that made the scripting on the fomod side very tedious and cumbersome.

 

I enjoy the freedom the fomod format gives me. I can name the files whatever I like, structure the directories however I like, etc. The details of how to install it are in the script -- not in a rigid structure that I have no control over.

 

Would it be so difficult for whoever is writing that thing to let you describe the layout in an XML or INI file? Why force me into this 00, 01, etc system?

 

I'll get it done eventually, but really.. I am not looking forward to it.

 

Also of course, lots more to come with FOMM, including a better file manager.

[DoctaSax]

Also of course, lots more to come with FOMM, including a better file manager.

If such a file manager were to have the things I mentioned in addition to the individual file moving it already has, there really wouldn't be any need for bain anymore, in which case getting fomods bain-ready becomes moot, really.