Regarding the Elder Scrolls: Online...

[Degeneracy]

Don't forget Wildstar and EQ:Next and a few others all coming out this year(EQ maybe).  WIth the new stuff this game will see low sub numbers especially since the nexus mod reviewer says the game is ok as an mmorpg but not an Elder Scrolls game.  In his video he points out as an adventurer you start the same as any Elder Scrolls game, but then you become one of many, nobody important.

 

Also would like to point out this week's Imperial beta event is live and I could play...however atm I'm playing WoW....

 

[Arizona_Steve]

This is my fourth or fifth beta (been doing this since November) and I simply cannot bring myself to play it any more. I think I burned out in the January beta when I spent all weekend leveling up to 10 to try out the Cyrodiil PvP.

[Vancien]

So I am going to paste my other post, in the other thread I posted because I confused that topic for this topic of which I had previously responded to. Yeah, that confused me too. 

 

--

 

So, now that I was able to spend about 15 hours over this weekend playing TESO. I can make an educated, experienced more relevant judgment on the game. 

 

My exact previous statements all still stand. 

 

Nothing was extraordinary, revolutionary or amazeballs. The navigation, map and compass system is just as broken as it is in Skyrim. You see a world in 3D but you are looking at a flat map that is barely even 2D. It doesn't help you determine an unmarked road over a mountain to that next quest npc.

 

Quests were bugged to hell and back. And of course the material collecting was implemented like every man for himself. First come first serve. If someone gets to that ore node first and mines it, you are shit out of luck. Did I mention finding them is nearly impossible in the first place? 

 

Overall, I was not impressed. I could go on about what was wrong with the game. However, I'd rather just state everything I thought about it, was exactly as I thought it would be. There was a massive community of dumb shit, asshole, elitist, fuckwads in chat constantly babbling about fucking horses or somebodies mom. Mainly I am sure from World of Failcraft. 

 

The only thing that did impress me was the in depth animation for emotes. Even though, chat gave no indication when someone did an emote. Some of the emotes were damn funny. And I found myself hanging out, gathering crowds just playing my lute. It reminded me a lot of what LOTRO got right with their emote system. 

 

Otherwise though, it wasn't at all a team oriented, inviting or friendly community. I felt I was totally on my own. Fighting for my life. People never bothered themselves to help me in a fight, although I extended that kindness everywhere I turned. I was told "ty" by one person I revived, although I wasted about 20 soul gems on strangers. 

 

That type of game environment, with added frustrating interface, quests and navigation designs is not at all worth my time or money. 

 

$15 dollars a month is an enormously outrageous and ambitious price tag in my opinion. I definitely see it going free to play or it will devolve into a complete and total failure. I am really quite disappointed they really didn't do anything but copy and paste Skyrim into a prettier environment. 

 

Best, 

Van

 

[Guest endgameaddiction]

That's MMO for ya. I've dealt with massive elitists all the time. And I was hardcore gamer with over the top gear. I never let that get over my head though. That is one of the things that ruins a whole MMO. When events are taken place or certain things are being controlled by dickwads and it's tough luck for the rest of the others. Then they walk around like they own the game and you have to kneel upon them. What made me so mad about XI was SE removed the level cap to allow all these newbies to level up super quick. What happened? My 8 years of experience was tossed out of events over some newbie who barely knew how to play his job. Acted like a hardcore player and bragged about this and that. Thankfully I relied on 2 other accounts to get what I needed done. I never liked and will never like having to depend on others to get what I want done. I'm totally cool with teaming up with a small group of close friends, but the problem was is most events had large numbers of people to get things done. Once most of the members got what they want, they left the group to go leach something else and at times it jepordized the guild/LS where it would split up because these elitist got what they wanted and moved on. I co-lead events and I even ran my own guild. I made sure everyone got what they wanted and I made it possible to get it done. I made sure my members remembered that. They were loyal. I know they miss me, but SE killed XI so bad I had to leave.

 

I wouldn't expect any different in TESO. It's going to shift over the WoW and FF11/FF14 crowd. I was excited about it at first. I even told my members that I'll be going to TESO over FF14. They all wanted me to go to 14, but during that whole massive fail of beta that it went free, I stayed away.

 

Expect nothing but self-centered elitists. All standing in town in a group wearing HQ weapons and armor like they are high kings.

[daggerfish]

Been tracking TESO since it was announced. Recently I got an actual legit beta key (having been signed up since the first public round opened) for a weekend test, only to find out that both keys provided (one for a friend also) weren't accepted by the website operated by the people administer the game.

Needless to say, that pissed me off quite a bit. To mention nothing of my distaste for the forced Steam platform when I unboxed Skyrim. I got over that eventually though.

Bethesda has earned my loyalty as a consumer with games like Morrowind, Oblivion, Skyrim and the Fallout series, which in my opinion are among the few games that are very much worth every cent at full retail price. But that blind loyalty will only extend to single player games, I've heard and experienced enough already to take a cautious 'wait and see' approach to TESO, lest I repeat the colossal disappointment experienced with SWTOR & Bioware.

[Kofina]

 They all wanted me to go to 14, but during that whole massive fail of beta that it went free, I stayed away.

 

Expect nothing but self-centered elitists. All standing in town in a group wearing HQ weapons and armor like they are high kings.

 

Abyssea ruined FFXI for me, I've never touched it again since the announcement of the level 99 cap and the fact that new players could level to 99 in less than 2 days. As a 10 year vet of that game, that killed it for me. (I was a major hardcore player with 3 characters and all level 75 capped jobs with relic gear)

 

 

*cough* As a legacy member and beta tester it never went free.

(Unless you meant the 1.0 grace period back in 2010 when the game still sucked)

 

There are elitists in the game and I'm one of those players wearing HQ weapons and coil gear (Yes I've taken my occasional breaks from such douchebag players in FFXIV) but I can assure you that just because some of us wear HQ gear =/= elitist, it took me since it's re-launch in August to get where I am though.

(Sorry you've had run ins with shitty players though, but they're in every mmo)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Jeffrey Lane]

<snip> And of course the material collecting was implemented like every man for himself. First come first serve. If someone gets to that ore node first and mines it, you are shit out of luck. Did I mention finding them is nearly impossible in the first place?<snip>

 

Wondering, in how many MMO games isnt that common? only one i can think of that i've played is Guild wars 2. and they arnt that hard to find, even without the skill to make them glow. (tho iron deposits looked like little gobs of poop)

 

the game isnt bad, alot better then 99% of the f2p games out there. and it isnt a Diablo clone or Moba as it seems to be the fad now. tho i will say the game is more fun with friends, specially if your leveling together... so boring if ya have to wait for them, tho a good time to gather or search for treasure map locations.

 

I enjoyed it and hope it does well.

[Degeneracy]

Not sure if you even played any F2P MMORPG's but ESO is not bad in terms of F2P but for a full priced game, with a sub. it's ridiculous.  While you may not like other F2P titles in the MMORPG world and not referring to moba/dungeon crawlers, the content included in ESO is lacking.  Yea I know MMORPG's newely released are always lacking in that department, however it doesn't remove the fact the game isn't worth the 60$+15$.  The UI is bland, and frankly relying on modders to fix it is just sad.  Since now everyone will be begging mod author's to release new UI's every update that breaks them, and that's only if you can change the UI a great deal without breaking any ToS Agreements.  Also while a lot of players say the graphics are good, I disagree with them since the textures/shadows are ok, but the terrain is flat, angular so essentially to me is like slapping HD textures on Oblivion, 10 poly's is only 10 poly's. http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d66/Whitemn/NewBitmapImage_zps5445b66d.png here's one of the textures in the world,  City textures are good but their is a few out there that are sad(Settings on High, Note the background textures are far superior)

[Mebrilia]

When i play a game in TES setting i expect to play in tamriel not in a generic mmo crap where the location looks bland and generic and also toss the lores on the window..... I honestly hope TESO will fail so hard... so they can spend more time to make a decent elder scroll game

[Guest hemitris]

It will definitely have a huge following but it removes largely the people who play it for modding. Graphical mods will still exist of course but game play changes would not be possible.

[...0...]

When i play a game in TES setting i expect to play in tamriel not in a generic mmo crap where the location looks bland and generic and also toss the lores on the window..... I honestly hope TESO will fail so hard... so they can spend more time to make a decent elder scroll game

 

This!

[Deedlit]

This!

Agree, i bought that game, played 2 entire days and regret ea time of buying that, the combat / animation/ movement its omg bad, next time when buy a new mmo if goes bad at beta, belive its not getting better later or so soon.

[Skyrimfloo]

I love MMOs.

 

But I don't like RPG franchises turning into ones.

 

RPGs are literature. They're just another way of reading a book or watching a series. There are things that can happen in RPGs precisely because they're about you as the main character. MMOs are stagnant, a setting that can't ever change due to the actions of a single player because there are thousands of "main characters". The only way this can ever change is usually through some sort of "story mode" with single-player missions where you don't really do anything meaningful lore-wise because of the previous reasons; or massive updates that change the world in an annonymus way.

 

It's just a sandbox where all the kids don't really do anything because at the end of the day, it's all sand that will fall back off into the puddle. The person in charge of the park might change the sand, might even change the sandbox altogether, but you're not really building anything that will change the playthrough of other players.

 

I really hate this new habit of turning many good franchises into MMOs. Just make a new game altogether, which is more original, damnit. I've seen screens of TESO and it doesn't even compare to my modded Skyrim.

 

And that's another one: MMOs always fall flat on the development due to stuff like class balance, bugs and simply content that people don't like but they had paid to be done anyways. After playing Skyrim with over 360 mods installed, the idea of trusting Bethesda to make a game that would satisfy me without even a tiny personal customization seems ridiculous.

[Guest]

 

 

And that's another one: MMOs always fall flat on the development due to stuff like class balance, bugs and simply content that people don't like but they had paid to be done anyways. After playing Skyrim with over 360 mods installed, the idea of trusting Bethesda to make a game that would satisfy me without even a tiny personal customization seems ridiculous.

Yeah it's something I can't get past either. Modding a game like this is proper pandora's box, no going back because anything less feels flat, like you're being short changed. Of the 180 odd mods I currently run, I'd say 80% of them are essential to me, and if I couldn't use them I'd probably stop playing. 

 

I'll be honest, I'm not into the sex mods here, they're not my thing. I originally found this site because I wanted bodies with anatomical details and the armors that showed them off. Now when I play games that don't let me strip off my armor and prance about with my bush out, it feels weird lol. 

[crusher]

seems the only way TES can go 'online' at this point [particularly with the modularity genre/paradigm it has created] is something akin to BF4 + Skyrim, with a sprinkle of co-op. Mods are simply downloaded/updated when a client logs into the hosted server. Using a framework similar to Mod Organizer, you'll have different 'mod profiles' for different hosted servers. Your save games can even, optionally, be cleaned of scripts, thanks to the amazing modding community. 

 

Last step is to balance out level nonsense by creating something similar to GW original <== May do a S.T.E.P Pack to reflect this idea. 

[Coopervane]

seems the only way TES can go 'online' at this point [particularly with the modularity genre/paradigm it has created] is something akin to BF4 + Skyrim, with a sprinkle of co-op.

 

BF4+Skyrim? I definately woulden't agree with that..

 

Drop-in co-op is how i could see it working, look at the Saints Row games, that's the formula that would work. They are very different games of course, but with something in common, they are both open-world games where you run around at your leisure and do side-missions, and the main plot missions as you please.

 

The way it works in Saints Row, for those not familiar, is that you start a co-op game (which is the same as the singleplayer game, only flagged as co-op and with a higher difficulty to match 2 players), and then a freind can plop into the game and you can play through it togeather, also save the game and resume where you left off the next time.

 

And it works really well (the concept atleast, the SR netcode perhabs not as much), it's a system that could really easilly be applied to a TES game without compromising the Singleplayer game, or the mod support (keep sepperate plugin lists for SP and Co-op sessions, and the SP can still be modded to Oblivion and back, and the co-op part can run unmodded, or both players could agree to load some mods created for the co-op).

 

 

That's really what people want, or at least most people, just the optional abillity to play a TES game, and have a freind (or perhabs up to 3) join in and follow them on their adventure. Nothing more, and nothing less.

 

You don't need to make a whole bloody MMO for that, and by it's very nature, an MMO will always compromise mod-support and any kind of single-player mechanic and feel. An MMO is completely contrary to what TES games have been, and what people expect and want from them, it's actually a hindrance to making a good TES game, not a help.

 

Drop-in co-op though? That'd work just fine and provide people with what they have been asking for. People just want to go questing with their freinds, not with 500 random strangers who add nothing of value to the experiance, and just serve to lessen any immersion that could have been had from the game.

[crusher]

I agree, co-op be the way, similar to what you suggest, or a bit like GW1, but locally hosted servers. I was thinking more the BF4 'hosted' server paradigm. Not so much the PvP, but It would be kinda cool to see how the mod community would grow the PvP to fit the SexLab styled mods.

[AimoHauki]

IMO TES games in general are just 'good' but not great. There are always some annoying features or blatant flaws that keep the games from being great. Fortunately there are usually MODS to fix the things that annoy you to the most and can elevate these games to greatness. This cannot happen in MMO setting.

For example Skyrim's one of the greatest faults IMO was the inventory system that *should* have been patched. No such thing happened, but fortunately the modder community covered that blatant oversight. Some may say it's just a small thing, but for me the inventory system left a very bitter taste. And there are many small things that also add up. For some I have found a mod and with some I can live with. The point however is that in MMO setting you can't fix a thing. The best you can do is whine on the forums and hope something gets changed.

Personally I have not yet seen Elder Scrolls Online yet and neither do I have the time to change that for months. Around September I will have time on my hands again and can start with some research on the matter to decide whether or not is it worth trying out. My gut says no. Most MMO are pretty shoddy for the first year or so and it is far more cost effective to join in at that time. It also means you should meet about a billion bugs less.

[randomname172]

So, people understand that the studio behind this game isn't the same as bethesda right (zenimax online studios)? And this game certainly isn't made to appeal to people who meticulously mod their games either, or even most of the elder scrolls base. They're either too cheap to play for long (as evidenced by a lot of the free 2 play supporters) or just won't enjoy the gameplay. Not that I don't think it isn't a blatant money grab on their part for people desperate to play more elder scrolls or to play it with their friends.

 

Personally, not grabbing it after the whole paywall to be an Imperial, even if it makes sense in a lore fashion to keep Imperials low populated (a mechanic akin to deathknight class unlocking or even some imperial faction rep grinding would be fine with me). Also fairly let down by how limited the action bar (and thus combat options) was at 6(?), Guild Wars 2 had 10 slots and I felt that was a big step down from the number of abilities and items you would slot in WoW (yes, that evil mainstream game, before the last 2 expansions anyhow). I honestly miss how complicated WoW was (as a stance dancing warrior especially!) as far as what abilities to use optimally, at least as a raider (as a warrior anyhow, mileage may vary *cough* arcane mages in Wrath) though I also understood that streamlining a rotation for all classes made balancing easier.

 

I did like the fact that classes weren't totally un-customizable, you could theoretically play a dragonknight in light armor for magicka boosts (wouldn't recommend up close combat that way but if it makes you happy, hey). Interrupts and Power Attacks being built into melee combat was nice too, even if the animation was always off on when you could interrupt (in the beta at least).

 

Did they ever have a diminishing returns or other pvp balance system in regards to stuns and other crowd control? I remember having the stone fist knockdown being my only use for magicka and spamming that between the get up animation on mobs for hilarous results.

 

And as a side note, since I see this game series keep getting mentioned as a good one in these ESO topics: what is up with people here liking the Witcher series so much? I think I tried 2 and the horribly common storyline, crappy ui and level up system, along with just boring combat ( I know, I said I liked stance dancing! but it was so flat and unneeded as far as creating a combat system that kept you involved) that I gave up fairly early in; It was just so generic. I suppose I don't really enjoy most games where I can't at least create a character where story is a big factor though and may be judging it harshly on that (but if I really wanted to find out about some emo silver hair guy I'd watch a movie or read a book :3 ). Just seems weird it'd be popular with a skyrim modding community, since it's so linear (could be one of those "look it's got old style rpg annoyances and trivialities, awesome!" things though).

 

 

[crusher]

Tom's Hardware Review ...ouch

[Guest]

Tom's Hardware Review ...ouch

Sheesh, that's about the least flattering review I've read so far, even more so because it's skillfully written - no fluff, no grandstanding or setting of scenes, no waxing lyrical, just a straight up "this will not do".  Weighed, measured, and found wanting. 

[Mebrilia]

well in metacritic TESO dropped by 10 point.. now is 6.1

[Coopervane]

 

Tom's Hardware Review ...ouch

Sheesh, that's about the least flattering review I've read so far, even more so because it's skillfully written - no fluff, no grandstanding or setting of scenes, no waxing lyrical, just a straight up "this will not do".  Weighed, measured, and found wanting. 

 

 

Yeah, that's really all that can be said about that.

 

Ouch indeed.

[Sunja44]

Ok, I was very careful with my expectations for ESO and I played it a while (til lvl 40) and have to admit for a MMO it is pretty well made and I experienced the smoothest launch ever.

 

I play MMOs since pre 2000. I played the good old Everquest (56k modem and up to 72 players in a raid...imagine the laaaag), Everquest 2, WoW, LotRo, SWTOR, LotRO again and now ESO. ESO copied a lot from WoW, which isn't a bad thing, because WoW just set some sort of standards and you are just dumb as a publisher to not integrate them, because people expect that they are there.

 

The following is from a MMO point of view (ESO isn't really comparable with a modable standalone game like Skyrim, such a comparison leads to nothing):

 

Pros:

-a really not bad grafic for an MMO. I played it in 1440p in ultra settings and it looked pretty nice, especially the lighting.

-open .lua port, the game was out and you could download already a lot of UI improvements

-a pretty well made world and truly well made quests, the game has atmosphere

-I damned like the ability and skill system of ESO (how this is balanced in endgame needs to be proved first)

-not a single issue with animation and skill execution, they work flawlessly and look pretty well made (SWTOR for example had issues here...and not only a few and unimportant ones)

 

Can't say anything about the endgame, but it should be like WoW and/or any other MMO...it's all about character developement and improvement.

 

Why I am not playing it anymore yet ? It's not because the game is bad, it's more the reason that I am just satisfied with MMOs, because I played them nonstop over ten years. I am pretty glad that the addiction does not hook me anymore.

 

...and there we come to the big Contra of ESO:

 

Although it's pretty well made for an MMO and has some sort of unique features it feels like the same old sauce as all other MMOs. It's all about character evolution and improvement and haggling over a few stats.

 

Sorry...a well made and new coded bloom effect from an ENB preset modder or a well made body texture just gives me more.

 

 

[crusher]

... yeah fewer and fewer people are falling for the Gerbil-Wheel-Grind addiction baked into these products; aka, apes hording coconuts, computer crack or asian grinder. It's good to see others finally getting it.