rjn Posted February 20, 2019 Posted February 20, 2019 ***Some spoilery*** Does Dogmeat follow a 60-year old trail of cigars and beer bottles? Does Kellog never age? Why would the Brotherhood of Steel not want to take over the Institute instead of nuking it? Everybody wants your help because? (You're 200 years out of date and don't know anyone or the territory). and so much more....
SpyVsPie Posted February 20, 2019 Posted February 20, 2019 Seems like you have a paying attention problem masquerading as a plot problem.
concietedleech07 Posted February 20, 2019 Posted February 20, 2019 In order: 1 The trail is supposed to be from just a little before you make it to diamond city (explained by the synth child upon arrival to institute) 2 Kellog was given implants a long ass time ago, explained in the memory den part 3 The fallout 4 B.O.S. is based of the western chapters (pre-fallout 3). The d.c. chapter, under elder Lions (fallout 3), is more about helping people than the retrieval of technology, there are some still believing in Lions' brotherhood (terminal entries found at Boston air port) but are convinced later during the flight that the "new brotherhood values" are more important than humanitarian aid 4 classic rpg plot, perfect example is Skyrim; there is no way all of the deadric princes would allow you to gain their favor. So i look at it like a huge what if simulator. What if the dragon born decided it was more important to fuck off to become a vampire hunter or to fight in the civil war or to join the college of winterhold? basically it lets the player decide how they want to progress and who they like more.
Invictusblade Posted February 28, 2019 Posted February 28, 2019 On 2/20/2019 at 9:00 PM, rjn said: Everybody wants your help because? (You're 200 years out of date and don't know anyone or the territory). but this is exactly the same as the all of the other Fallout games. Fallout 1. Vault dweller who lived in Vault 13 their entire life Fallout 2. A tribal who lived in their Village their entire life Fallout Tactics. A tribal(I think) who is recruited in the Mid-Western BoS Fallout 3. Vault dweller who lived in Vault 101 their entire life Fallout New Vegas. A courier who lost their memory of their life Fallout 4. A Pre-war survivor who spend the last 200ish years in cyrosleep
Midnight19 Posted February 28, 2019 Posted February 28, 2019 its just a chicle filled excuse for a plot, if their ever is a Fallout 5 it should focus on the world, and the Factions fighting over it, not finding a Lost Family member or some ancient tech.
Invictusblade Posted February 28, 2019 Posted February 28, 2019 now lets have a look at the player in the elder scrolls series 1 Arena. Prisoner 2. Daggerfall. Spy for the emperor (this is a direct sequel to Arena so Prisoner still counts) 3. Morrowind. Prisoner 4. Oblivion. Prisoner 5. Skyrim. Prisoner and the thing is that being a Prisoner is never mentioned again.
FauxFurry Posted February 28, 2019 Posted February 28, 2019 15 hours ago, Invictaxe said: now lets have a look at the player in the elder scrolls series 1 Arena. Prisoner 2. Daggerfall. Spy for the emperor (this is a direct sequel to Arena so Prisoner still counts) 3. Morrowind. Prisoner 4. Oblivion. Prisoner 5. Skyrim. Prisoner and the thing is that being a Prisoner is never mentioned again. The Prisoner thing is mentioned again in TES 5 but only in passing during the Civil War plotline by Balgruuf, Tullius and Ulfric and in the quest No One Esacpes Cidnha Mine when the Dragonborn answers when the question along the lines of "When was the first time that you found yourself clapped in irons?"
TheOzoneHole Posted March 1, 2019 Posted March 1, 2019 If we want to get really picky about the TES starts then we can point out that in Arena you were falsely accused and thrown in what was more of a sewer than a prison so you would eventually starve to death. Daggerfall was a shipwreck so not really a prisoner as such. Morrowind was you being released, and while you were not required to play as a Dunmer it was written in such a way that it was kind of expected. Oblivion you pretty much get a royal pardon during the tutorial, because "fate and destiny" are what caused the player to be in that specific cell at exactly the right time. As for Skyrim.... because reasons? And yes, the plot of FO4 is hot garbage. I am unmarried. I have no children. I give exactly zero fucks about Shaun and Nate/Nora. Even knowing who Shaun is I have no problem simply shooting him in the head when he first walks into the room. Why? Spoiler Because that is EXACTLY what a frantic parent who believes the child they are looking at is their kid and the guy who just walked in kidnapped him would do. (Or that's what I would do if it was me.) BGS is not good a writing plots. Often they stink at even writing side quests. Was there any faction in Skyrim that had a really good plot line? Companions were way too short, CoW was predictable as soon as you complete Under Saarthal, Thieves Guild was good right up to the point where you don't have a choice about selling your soul (which is total bullshit and I swear the person who wrote that didn't know what the main quest was). The Dark Brotherhood had potential but was again pretty predictable and not really as difficult or involved as I'd have liked. The civil war is a joke, how often do you have a civil war where the two sides barely attack each other? None of the npcs really care who you support. When the game is about dragons and a civil war and the designers manage to mess up BOTH of those things changes need to be made. And changes were not made and we ended up with FO4. (And changes still haven't been made.) Okay, rant over.
phillout Posted April 2, 2019 Posted April 2, 2019 On 2/28/2019 at 6:31 AM, Invictaxe said: but this is exactly the same as the all of the other Fallout games. Fallout 1. Vault dweller who lived in Vault 13 their entire life Fallout 2. A tribal who lived in their Village their entire life In Fallout 1-2 no one wants your help, no one cares about you at all. The BoS in FO1 sends you off on a suicide mission, they don't care whenever you return or not - and you die there unless you stock up on Rad-X and Rad-Away's (and those are hard to come buy in the game). There are no factions to join, no "good guys" factions around - every faction is a bunch of self-serving assholes. And saving your vault/village is all up to you - you are no great hero, just a random person picked up for a dangerous mission, no one knows why. Judging by the speech of the village elder if you have INT < 3, you are probably the only one stupid enough to agree to it. NCR in FO2 is a police state, one step away from performing cavity searches on everyone entering. oppressing settlers coming to their territories. New Reno? Choose your gangster family. Vault City? You want to shoot them the moment you speak to them (and you actually can). And so on. And even your vault betrays you in the end of FO1. That's what creates this feeling of loneliness and gloom Fallout always had. You are no hero, you aren't special, no one cares about you. It's just you, your gun and probably few friends (and you have to work to earn them still) against the whole extremely unfriendly world. Now compare this to - Hello, we've just met, you are our General now! - Citizen, I need you to help me in a mission which is vital for the Brotherhood. I don't know who you are, but I take you with me anyway - Hey, you've just arrived to the Institute, you are no scientist but we make you the Director anyway. - Hey, you've followed that Captain Obvious red line and had enough brains to solve a puzzle for children - why don't we send you on the most important covert mission we have right now?
heroscomeback Posted April 3, 2019 Posted April 3, 2019 On 4/2/2019 at 9:24 AM, phillout said: In Fallout 1-2 no one wants your help, no one cares about you at all. The BoS in FO1 sends you off on a suicide mission, they don't care whenever you return or not - and you die there unless you stock up on Rad-X and Rad-Away's (and those are hard to come buy in the game). There are no factions to join, no "good guys" factions around - every faction is a bunch of self-serving assholes. And saving your vault/village is all up to you - you are no great hero, just a random person picked up for a dangerous mission, no one knows why. Judging by the speech of the village elder if you have INT < 3, you are probably the only one stupid enough to agree to it. NCR in FO2 is a police state, one step away from performing cavity searches on everyone entering. oppressing settlers coming to their territories. New Reno? Choose your gangster family. Vault City? You want to shoot them the moment you speak to them (and you actually can). And so on. And even your vault betrays you in the end of FO1. That's what creates this feeling of loneliness and gloom Fallout always had. You are no hero, you aren't special, no one cares about you. It's just you, your gun and probably few friends (and you have to work to earn them still) against the whole extremely unfriendly world. Now compare this to - Hello, we've just met, you are our General now! - Citizen, I need you to help me in a mission which is vital for the Brotherhood. I don't know who you are, but I take you with me anyway - Hey, you've just arrived to the Institute, you are no scientist but we make you the Director anyway. - Hey, you've followed that Captain Obvious red line and had enough brains to solve a puzzle for children - why don't we send you on the most important covert mission we have right now? So true. StartMeUp has made a world of difference for me in Fallout 4. The main plot is so fucking bland and boring in the vanilla game that I feel like blowing my own brains out the second I get to the Museum of Freedom. Don't get me wrong, StartMeUp doesn't fix everything. You still play the same bland, boring vanilla story but at least you aren't stuck being the parent of child you don't give two fucks about. It's odd though...like...I still keep coming back to Fallout 4. I go play other games for a few weeks and then I find myself right back in the Commonwealth.
phillout Posted April 4, 2019 Posted April 4, 2019 2 hours ago, heroscomeback said: So true. StartMeUp has made a world of difference for me in Fallout 4. The main plot is so fucking bland and boring in the vanilla game that I feel like blowing my own brains out the second I get to the Museum of Freedom. Just blow their fucking brains out. Install Preston is killable by SKK and blow their fucking brains out. This is probably the biggest satisfaction you can get from this game. KILL. THEM. ALL. Bhahahaha. "What, Preston? No more settlements needing my help, huh, bitch?". The author has a lot more really nice mods, BTW.
heroscomeback Posted April 4, 2019 Posted April 4, 2019 2 hours ago, phillout said: Just blow their fucking brains out. Install Preston is killable by SKK and blow their fucking brains out. This is probably the biggest satisfaction you can get from this game. KILL. THEM. ALL. Bhahahaha. "What, Preston? No more settlements needing my help, huh, bitch?". The author has a lot more really nice mods, BTW. Thanks for the heads up lol You know, I almost hate to admit it but I like Preston as a character. I can't stand the redundant settlement quests and all but for a Fallout character, I like him. His story was really sad the first time I heard him tell it and I genuinely felt bad for him. I'm actually in the middle of doing a proper Minutemen playthrough but I'll admit having him as a constant companion is eternally grating lmao
phillout Posted April 4, 2019 Posted April 4, 2019 11 hours ago, heroscomeback said: Thanks for the heads up lol You know, I almost hate to admit it but I like Preston as a character. I can't stand the redundant settlement quests and all but for a Fallout character, I like him. His story was really sad the first time I heard him tell it and I genuinely felt bad for him. I'm actually in the middle of doing a proper Minutemen playthrough but I'll admit having him as a constant companion is eternally grating lmao Shrugs I cam't stand the game at all, the only reason I have it installed is to combat Skyrim/Requiem withdrawal symptom w/o wasting too much time on gaming. When it's get bad, I play for 15-20 minutes, I feel better and I quit b/c the game is painfully stupid, boring and stuffed with annoying pathos. It is ironical that I, Skyrim junkie and old Fallout fan, absolutely despise the game that was supposed to be a mix of both, but well, this is how it ended up.
heroscomeback Posted April 4, 2019 Posted April 4, 2019 6 hours ago, phillout said: Shrugs I cam't stand the game at all, the only reason I have it installed is to combat Skyrim/Requiem withdrawal symptom w/o wasting too much time on gaming. When it's get bad, I play for 15-20 minutes, I feel better and I quit b/c the game is painfully stupid, boring and stuffed with annoying pathos. It is ironical that I, Skyrim junkie and old Fallout fan, absolutely despise the game that was supposed to be a mix of both, but well, this is how it ended up. I wouldn't say it's ironic, just more of a shame, really. Though if you can't stand the game...why not just play other games?
phillout Posted April 5, 2019 Posted April 5, 2019 4 hours ago, heroscomeback said: Though if you can't stand the game...why not just play other games? I don't want to play games now. Let's say, Fallout 4 keeps me productive.
DocClox Posted May 4, 2019 Posted May 4, 2019 Oh, boy! Don't get me started! The institute need pre-war DNA that hasn't been exposed to radiation right? I mean apart from the huge flash when everyone sees that nuke go off at the start of the game, but what they hell, they'll chance it. So anyways, all the institute need to do is send a scientist along to take cell scrapings from everyone in the vault. Only it's not that simple. Apparently they need pre-war baby DNA, because baby DNA is mwagical! and has special powers. Which actually verges on making sense if you think about it. I mean Nate's been in the military, he's seen action, he'll have been exposed to broken PA suits and leaking tank coolant, he'll have soaked up no end of rads in his day. So yeah, it makes sense that they need the baby. And it continues to make sense right up until Kellogg tells Nate that he's "the backup". Because mwagical Baby DNA is so super-dooper-mwagical that it retroactively cleanses parental DNA of radiation damage. But only if one parent has been murdered and the other left alive but frozen, presumably. Of course, there wasn't any need to kill anyone. All they needed to do was thaw out the family and offer them a place as guests of The Institute. I mean it is literally the only place in the 'Wealth where you can raise a baby without any risk of it being eaten by a deathclaw/feral/supermutant/whatever. Also it has the best medical care on the planet, bar none; it wouldn't have been a particularly difficult sales pitch. But no! Kellogg has to shoot Mumsy in the face and gloat at Daddy. I'm reliably informed that this makes sense because the Institute are cold, clinical, bad-assess who place no more value on human life than on that of a lab rat. This is why they promptly stick the little brat in a baby-sized blender, hit "liquidize", and then pour the resulting DNA smoothie into a shielded, refrigerated, bottle where it would be safe from radiation and other hazards. Oh, wait! That's not what happens! What they do is they take the adorable little tyke back to the Institute, feed him, educate him and raise him as one of their own. Because that's what cold clinical bad-assess do. Apparently. This all makes perfect sense because "D'awww! Look at is liddle-widdle fingers! Lookit his teensy-tiny feed! D'awww!" Which is a surprisingly hard argument to refute. Except perhaps by making fart noises and shouting "what a load of bollocks!" Let's have a quick straw poll: how do you suppose they got liddle baby Shaun to the Institute? Did they take him overland and subject his magical DNA to all the random radiation hazards of the Commonwealth? Or did they rip his molecules apart with a high energy spike, transmit the information about his structure back to base encoded as Beethoven's Fifth, and then reassemble his body from that information which is unlikely to have been compromised in any way by being transmitted as radio-waves across a wasteland filled with hard radiation sources and charged radiation storms. Because it's hard to imagine any of that having a detrimental effect on the child's DNA. Because mwagical Baby DNA is mwagical!! So that does for the prologue. Let's fast forward a few decades, and look at the actual plot. Shaun has learned that he is dying, and feels the need to reconnect with the mother he never knew (let's assume Nora is the survivng parent here), and so he has her thawed out. Now most normal people at this point would meet her as she exited the pod, of if he really had to make her walk to Diamond City, he could at least have sent her some flowers and offered to buy lunch at the Dugout Inn. But not Shaun. Nope, Shaun makes it look like she thawed out by accident, and then starts laying breadcrumbs intended to lead her to Diamond City and a confrontation with the man that killed her husband. He does this, by his own admission, because he wasn't sure who would win in fight. Kellogg, a stone cold psychopath with sixty plus years of combat experience, cybernetic augmentation, and a small army of synths, or Nora, an angsty mum with a Law Degree. Now there are two interpretations under which this behavior makes sense. One of them is that years of meditation have led Shaun to achieve chim. He knows that he is a character in a computer game, and armed with this insight he can confidently predict that his mother is capable of gaining levels, using perk points to buy superpowers, and that she can plausibly become as big a bad-ass as Kellog by the time the two meet. The other explanation, and I find this one just as likely as the previous, is that Shaun is completly and utterly, barking at the moon and chewing on the carpet, Daffy-Duck-bouncing-on-his-head-all-the-way-to-the-horizon, insane. Not just a little eccentric. Not just a touch sociopathic. This is a chap who seriously believes that his mother (who probably never did anything more violent that change the TV channel) has at least a 50/50 chance against the meanest human being ever, who wasn't made on a 3D printer. Better yet, all his academic colleagues are so busy being cold clinical bad-asses that they have totally failed to notice that Shaun and Reason have parted company and that the most hardline, ultra-rationalist faction on the East Coast is now being run by a total Looney Tune. (Alternatively, it's possible that the story had a plot that made sense once, and then Bethesda turned it over to the marketing department, because no-one is "interested in discussing how realistic things are in an alternate universe post-apoc game w/ talking mutants and ghouls" as Bethesda VP in charge of Public Relations, Pete Hines once put it). Having got past the Kellogg hurdle, Shaun now expects you to find him and take over the Institute on his death. This is entirely reasonable since Shaun's powerful deductive mind has enabled him to foresee that you will keep a lump of Kellogg's head as a souvenier (Say WHAT!?!?!) discover that you just happen to have the bit with the memories in it, attached to a handy dandy lump of Intitute tech, hack into those memories with the help of the only Synth in the Commonwealth that the Institute don't want to recover and discover the Institute's most closely guarded secret: the Molecular Relay. Then all you have to do is travel to the heart of a deadly nuclear desolation to find a mutated scientist who hasn't even defected yet at the time these plans are laid, get him to draw up schematics capable of accessing the Relay, and then find a defeat a Courser, decode the chip in his head with the aid of the Institutes sworn enemies, and then construct a device from duct tape and old TV dinner trays that can hack into the Relay signal and thus infiltrate the Institute. I mean who couldn't have seen that coming? There are things to like about Fallout 4, but the story is not one of them :(
concietedleech07 Posted May 5, 2019 Posted May 5, 2019 Spoiler On 5/4/2019 at 4:33 AM, DocClox said: Oh, boy! Don't get me started! The institute need pre-war DNA that hasn't been exposed to radiation right? I mean apart from the huge flash when everyone sees that nuke go off at the start of the game, but what they hell, they'll chance it. So anyways, all the institute need to do is send a scientist along to take cell scrapings from everyone in the vault. Only it's not that simple. Apparently they need pre-war baby DNA, because baby DNA is mwagical! and has special powers. Which actually verges on making sense if you think about it. I mean Nate's been in the military, he's seen action, he'll have been exposed to broken PA suits and leaking tank coolant, he'll have soaked up no end of rads in his day. So yeah, it makes sense that they need the baby. And it continues to make sense right up until Kellogg tells Nate that he's "the backup". Because mwagical Baby DNA is so super-dooper-mwagical that it retroactively cleanses parental DNA of radiation damage. But only if one parent has been murdered and the other left alive but frozen, presumably. Of course, there wasn't any need to kill anyone. All they needed to do was thaw out the family and offer them a place as guests of The Institute. I mean it is literally the only place in the 'Wealth where you can raise a baby without any risk of it being eaten by a deathclaw/feral/supermutant/whatever. Also it has the best medical care on the planet, bar none; it wouldn't have been a particularly difficult sales pitch. But no! Kellogg has to shoot Mumsy in the face and gloat at Daddy. I'm reliably informed that this makes sense because the Institute are cold, clinical, bad-assess who place no more value on human life than on that of a lab rat. This is why they promptly stick the little brat in a baby-sized blender, hit "liquidize", and then pour the resulting DNA smoothie into a shielded, refrigerated, bottle where it would be safe from radiation and other hazards. Oh, wait! That's not what happens! What they do is they take the adorable little tyke back to the Institute, feed him, educate him and raise him as one of their own. Because that's what cold clinical bad-assess do. Apparently. This all makes perfect sense because "D'awww! Look at is liddle-widdle fingers! Lookit his teensy-tiny feed! D'awww!" Which is a surprisingly hard argument to refute. Except perhaps by making fart noises and shouting "what a load of bollocks!" Let's have a quick straw poll: how do you suppose they got liddle baby Shaun to the Institute? Did they take him overland and subject his magical DNA to all the random radiation hazards of the Commonwealth? Or did they rip his molecules apart with a high energy spike, transmit the information about his structure back to base encoded as Beethoven's Fifth, and then reassemble his body from that information which is unlikely to have been compromised in any way by being transmitted as radio-waves across a wasteland filled with hard radiation sources and charged radiation storms. Because it's hard to imagine any of that having a detrimental effect on the child's DNA. Because mwagical Baby DNA is mwagical!! So that does for the prologue. Let's fast forward a few decades, and look at the actual plot. Shaun has learned that he is dying, and feels the need to reconnect with the mother he never knew (let's assume Nora is the survivng parent here), and so he has her thawed out. Now most normal people at this point would meet her as she exited the pod, of if he really had to make her walk to Diamond City, he could at least have sent her some flowers and offered to buy lunch at the Dugout Inn. But not Shaun. Nope, Shaun makes it look like she thawed out by accident, and then starts laying breadcrumbs intended to lead her to Diamond City and a confrontation with the man that killed her husband. He does this, by his own admission, because he wasn't sure who would win in fight. Kellogg, a stone cold psychopath with sixty plus years of combat experience, cybernetic augmentation, and a small army of synths, or Nora, an angsty mum with a Law Degree. Now there are two interpretations under which this behavior makes sense. One of them is that years of meditation have led Shaun to achieve chim. He knows that he is a character in a computer game, and armed with this insight he can confidently predict that his mother is capable of gaining levels, using perk points to buy superpowers, and that she can plausibly become as big a bad-ass as Kellog by the time the two meet. The other explanation, and I find this one just as likely as the previous, is that Shaun is completly and utterly, barking at the moon and chewing on the carpet, Daffy-Duck-bouncing-on-his-head-all-the-way-to-the-horizon, insane. Not just a little eccentric. Not just a touch sociopathic. This is a chap who seriously believes that his mother (who probably never did anything more violent that change the TV channel) has at least a 50/50 chance against the meanest human being ever, who wasn't made on a 3D printer. Better yet, all his academic colleagues are so busy being cold clinical bad-asses that they have totally failed to notice that Shaun and Reason have parted company and that the most hardline, ultra-rationalist faction on the East Coast is now being run by a total Looney Tune. (Alternatively, it's possible that the story had a plot that made sense once, and then Bethesda turned it over to the marketing department, because no-one is "interested in discussing how realistic things are in an alternate universe post-apoc game w/ talking mutants and ghouls" as Bethesda VP in charge of Public Relations, Pete Hines once put it). Having got past the Kellogg hurdle, Shaun now expects you to find him and take over the Institute on his death. This is entirely reasonable since Shaun's powerful deductive mind has enabled him to foresee that you will keep a lump of Kellogg's head as a souvenier (Say WHAT!?!?!) discover that you just happen to have the bit with the memories in it, attached to a handy dandy lump of Intitute tech, hack into those memories with the help of the only Synth in the Commonwealth that the Institute don't want to recover and discover the Institute's most closely guarded secret: the Molecular Relay. Then all you have to do is travel to the heart of a deadly nuclear desolation to find a mutated scientist who hasn't even defected yet at the time these plans are laid, get him to draw up schematics capable of accessing the Relay, and then find a defeat a Courser, decode the chip in his head with the aid of the Institutes sworn enemies, and then construct a device from duct tape and old TV dinner trays that can hack into the Relay signal and thus infiltrate the Institute. I mean who couldn't have seen that coming? There are things to like about Fallout 4, but the story is not one of them i will address these in order of paragraphs with rebuttals, do not take this as a serious defense of a game that could have been much better, its just little details I've caught over time mixed with one theory i found. 1 "institute needs dna"-"frozen presumably": ill give the possibility of nate's dna being completely fucked, but nora has a law degree and, according to ironside, has not seen combat. this means she was working as/looking for work as lawyer, so chance of her dna being a mess is slim to none. as for the institute needing more than a scraping of skin, if there first test failed than they would need more dna. its easier to get that if you have a living being. now i will grant that based off the red rockets selling only coolant it means that all the vehicles in game run off of nuclear power, supported by established cannon, there might be some fuckery in the dna for both parents, which i will address in moment. 2 "of course"-"sales pitch": your right on kellogg not needing to kill anyone, except if looking at the game from the player is a synth theory (more in a moment). as for the place in the institute, these people were pre-war, meaning they no clue what a ghoul/supermutant/deathclaw is or even if the person thawing them out is part of vault tech. kellogg certainly doesn't look like vault tech and on approach to the cryo pods it shows no where that there are people in full body environment suits. circling back to back to the synth theory for moment, it explains the need to for kellogg to kill the parent holding shaun and magically fixed dna. it also explains why everyone is dead when getting out of the pod better then "deus ex machina, your the only one to survive this shithole". the shooty and gloat moment drives nate/nora to go kill kellog, who most of the institute doesnt like anyway, as well as return to the institute so shaun can decide if you were a success or failed along the way. there is just enough of pre-war view and driving forces to be false memories planted there, as for the bit were you talk to daisy about pre-war life that could been a generic description from an old log entry by a now dead founder of the post war institute. for evidence of this theory of your an advanced gen3 or possible gen 4 made by shaun, use tfc when your at kidnap part, the area just outside of view from the pod has same neurons as when you enter kellogg's mind. in the dlc far harbor there is dialog flat out stating your synth and you can either embrace the truth or deny it calling them a liar ( which is the default smooth-brained response when given something that counters what you think know). now back to your regularly scheduled rebuttal, i will concede that yes its the best medical in the commonwealth but not necessarily the planet, we little to no information outside the good old us of a. for all we know there could be whole countries or even continents, like africa/ south-central america that werent nuked and are now the "super powers" of the world. flipped side of the coin it, they could have been nuke too, or even been spared and killed themselves at a later date. my point is we dont know. 3 "but no"- "load of bollocks": kellogg is the one doing the shooting, even ignoring the previously stated theory, he does this because they're on a time limit and doesnt want to wait for the scientist to try to calm the parent down, long enough to get the baby. the scientists wanted both parents alive in case shaun died at some point, hell if they kept the whole vault alive and in the pods they would have all the dna the needed, but seeing as how shaun was the only baby/child in vault he would have the least amount of exposure to rads in the entire vault. as for the blender/ raising him, see my previous argument on fresh dna samples toward the beginning. 4 "let's have"-" dna is mwagical": this clearly before the "broken mask" incident seeing as that was a gen3 which they needed unfucked dna. they either had the relay down to a science, or stuffed him in some kind of rad resistant suit, for the trek back (though official cannon puts the relay built and perfected well before getting shaun) . its stated by liberty prime that the upperlevel of the institute is only 5 meters underground, that means with just little digging they could have connected the entrance to the sewers which would have stopped most radiation other then that brought in by rain water. 5 "so that"-"not shaun": yes most normal people would go meet her, but seeing as he's the head of the institute he'd be lucky if his day was only 8 hours of paperwork/meeting with department heads. and on top of that there's most likely a rule stating he cant leave (ignored by player if choosing institute in favor of letting players continue after endgame mission), this is of course ignoring the fact that he kept the thawing and meeting a secrete until the last possible moment, imagine be the guy who runs the relay and having your boss show up, "hey i need you to send me to a vault ALONE, and not tell anyone about this, ever. also delete any records of me leaving and/or me coming back with or without some rando from said vault. remember no one can ever know this has happened". yeah that'll work perfectly. if we go with synth theory, he probs made you in secrete, then had kellogg put you in the pod to test if this next gen synth can be more useful, but shaun falls very ill before the test is complete. and now he has to come up with some bullshit to let you stay and not be dissected/vivisected to see why you can beat not only the best agent they have but a courser designed to bring in runaways. by making you the next leader of the cit, he has ensured that you can get shit done before they might run some test and find out your synth leading to said dissection/vivisection you. 6 "nope"-"looney tune": if we stick with human argument he can only hope that your going to make it. if we go synth theory, its all to test you. the chim thing is really far fetched (yes i get you did this as the most ludicrous idea you could think of to help your other argument). as for he's crazy please defer to my previous paragraph as to why he did it. minor aside here, but for your argument, shaun's actions would be considered psychotic or psychopathic at worst (not sociopathic), at best it would be delusional. 7 skiping past your aside as it has merit and is a completely valid point, "having got"-"that coming": in shaun's master plan, he probably meant for kellogg to bring you back with him, not thinking of whole revenge part, or assuming you killed kellogg, have a courser meat you afterwards. only to have said courser be reassigned by the reclamation team because they tracked a runaway down and shaun not telling anyone he wanted to see you. this concludes my itemized rebuttable, i hope you enjoyed it
DocClox Posted May 5, 2019 Posted May 5, 2019 You know in the original Blade Runner? Deckard dreams of a unicorn, and later finds an Origami Unicorn left by Gaff. That's supposed to tell us that that Gaff knows what Deckard dreams of because Deckard is a replicant.. It's the one piece of evidence in the film to confirm the theories about Deckard's nature and origins. My problem with the "player is a synth" theory is that there is no origami unicorn in the game. There's nothing apart from bad writing to support the idea. The closet you get is in Far Harbor where Dima asks you how you know that you are not synth, but in true Bethesda fashion he stops short of nailing it down and leaves it to the player to decide. I mean you're absolutley right: if you accept the Player Is A Synth (PIAS) theory then a great many plot holes close up, in a manner almost as magical as baby DNA. I'm just not convinced there's the evidence to support the idea.
concietedleech07 Posted May 7, 2019 Posted May 7, 2019 yeah its almost as flimsy evidence as the elder scrolls are earth millions/billions years after fallout, where theres just the brotherhood's plant and one anecdote of some guy doing some fuckery and stepping into a world were theres just destruction and death everywhere. i cant find the exact book its in but he basically describe fallout as parallel world or the distant past of nirn
DocClox Posted May 7, 2019 Posted May 7, 2019 11 hours ago, concietedleech07 said: yeah its almost as flimsy evidence as the elder scrolls are earth millions/billions years after fallout I believe Bethesda have (unusually for them) gone on record and categorically stated that this is not the case. 11 hours ago, concietedleech07 said: where theres just the brotherhood's plant and one anecdote of some guy doing some fuckery and stepping into a world were theres just destruction and death everywhere Easter eggs are Easter eggs. There's still no evidence for the player as synth theory. I like the theory, and I'm exactly one origami unicorn away from believing it. But until that happens ... well, it makes nice headcanon. [edit] Also, you do have to do some mental gymnastics to explain why no-one uses the player's factory reset code when he's busy destroying the Institute.
llddb Posted June 3, 2019 Posted June 3, 2019 I always played Nora as being a secret agent type infiltrator (which is where she met Nate, rescued him on a mission (scouting Anchorage). The whole law thing was a cover since it seems Boston was a hotbed of Intelligence locations and Research projects. What I really think is Main Plot was cut for time. I think it was to be a more intensive search. You have Shaun's DNA in Danse. You have Shaun's DNA in Glory. There is Deacon's unhealthy interest in the Sole Survivor (not romancable, may be a synth (no matter what he says). You have Biometric Scanners laying around as junk and a whole lot of stuff that looks like you were meant to be a frustrating search for a long period of time to even find Shaun (who may or may not have been Institute Director Shaun (if he had been a Synth Also). Not sure if that would have been more fun. I don't know. I just don't think they thought it through. Do the math. Parent searching for child > than anything else. Not really something you put on hold until you play out every lead. The other side quests don't make sense in the context. Its just not a good motivator for an open world game. Edit: If I was writing it, Deacon would have been Real Shaun (was director, gave it up when realized Synths had real personalities and emotions if they were raised (for want of a better word) right. Institute Director Shaun was a Synth he made to escape the institute and found the Railroad. Patriot...not sure how he plays into this, probley some famial connection to Deacon/Shaun through mother (who isn't in game).
Zor2k13 Posted July 21, 2019 Posted July 21, 2019 This game is terrible I just finished a BOS run and blew up the institute did all the side missions for every faction too except most of the institute side quests. My institute quest count stopped at 5 after nuking them. Liberty prime was baddass once he got out of that gantry. The propaganda stuff he says is really stupid while he is still in there but once he gets out and stomps all the way to bunker hill... badass. One thing about bunker hill I found funny during the battle of bunker hill was, that one guy that rents out the flop house above the bar he wants to join the railroad sooooo bad and when the time comes to fight at bunker hill I find him getting repeatedly shot in the gut by a railroad heavy. She was firing a short hunting rifle at his gun constantly only stopping to stare at one of the BOS PA users standing on top of the market roof. He got up there by falling out of a vertibird shot down directly over the market. I had to console kill him and the railroad heavy then leave the area to go have a chat with shaun. I come back later and spend two in game days cleaning up bunker hill and building up defenses. I have a mod installed that allows me to build down to the stone walls around the place. Was good feelz and all having liberty prime walk to the monument and salute it I know beth was trying to meme there but took it a different way just to spite them. Dr Li is a real bitch she just had to tow the lefty line when I went to talk to her later on in the prydwen. She along with all the other institute assholes made those mutants in the basement probably from the various people they kidnapped over the years to replace them. I was thinking hey wonder whatever happened to the original danse well... he was probably one of the many super mutants I killed in the game and just didn't know it. I think this is why fallout 76 is so popular there is just so many other things to do and no real story to get in the way just OCD shit everywhere.
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