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Fallout 76 announcement? (Bethesda Live Stream)

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Just now, Kendo 2 said:

Todd Howard stating in an interview that the game can be modded is not a license for published software, the EULA is.  When Bethesda releases the CreationKit/editor/whatever they will amend the license (without prior notice) just like they did with 32bit Skyrim and paid mods on Steam back in 2015.  The game won't launch until you install an 'update' that doesn't update any files other than your online registry for the game, showing that you agreed to the terms of the new license.

 

Todd Howard can say anything he wants.  Bethesda.net can post anything they want.  Those instances do not constitute a change in the EULA downloaders agree to when they install the game.  Only your acknowledgement of a  new or amended license changes what you originally agreed too.  You can argue all day but that won't change the facts; you agreed to a license that says you can't edit or alter the software you installed.  I don't get why this is so hard to understand.  It's a contract you willingly entered into and you don't have a valid claim to remedy or amend it.  If you don't like the fact that you can't mod the game without violating the license then you never should have installed it.

 

 

The EULA's for older Fallout/Elder scroll games I looked at still contained that "g) Reverse engineer, decompile, disassemble or otherwise modify the Software, in whole or in part;"  part...so not sure how valid that is for modding the game like what LL does. 

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2 hours ago, patches13 said:

The EULA's for older Fallout/Elder scroll games I looked at still contained that "g) Reverse engineer, decompile, disassemble or otherwise modify the Software, in whole or in part;"  part...so not sure how valid that is for modding the game like what LL does. 

Not for multiplayer online-only games with EULAs that prohibit editing or modifying the files.  There aren't any mods on LL for games like that.

 

Listen, you can change or edit the files in your game, but if Bethesda gets wise to it somehow they can revoke your license and legally block you from accessing the software.  You agreed to that.  Provisions like that are generally included in most paid license software.  You're not allowed to edit something you don't own and only have a license to use.  You're not supposed to mod the game.  It ain't good; it ain't bad.  It's just the way it is.

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2 hours ago, patches13 said:
Spoiler

I missed that then. Where does it state you can NOT mod Fallout 76? I showed where it clearly said that if you DO mod Fallout 76 they will not be responsible if your game stops functioning properly. Not functioning properly =/= you are not allowed to mod. Todd even did interviews in the past talking about how they plan to roll out "official" support for mods in 2019. Also, this game isn't ESO. Not made by the same company, not ran by the same company. Also, ESO says clearly you cannot mod their game or you are breaking their EULA. Fallout 76 doesn't say this.

 

But once again, I'm saying what some of us are doing. Do what you want or if you don't even have the game...why do you care?

 

Edit: Here's a interview with Todd Howard himself saying Fallout 76 will someday officially support mods. They just will be concentrating on making sure the game runs right in the beginning. So...I guess this settles it then?

 

 

https://www.pcgamer.com/fallout-76-will-have-mod-support-but-not-at-launch/

 

Edit 2: Was bored so did a little research into ESO....it looks like you CAN mod that game too lol. Per their TOS;

 

https://account.elderscrollsonline.com/terms-of-service#_EN_Toc_02

 

Game Mods 
 

Content also includes Game Mods. The term "Game Mod" means downloadable, user-generated Content developed or created by You or a third party using an Editor Tool (as defined below). In certain cases, as determined by ZeniMax, Game Mods may be made available to other users of a Service or a Game and in such cases, such other users may download the Game Mods from ZeniMax or third parties and use such Game Mods in connection with playing a Game or receiving a Service from ZeniMax.

 

If You desire to develop or create one or more Game Mods, then You will be required to download from a ZeniMax website or otherwise gain access to via a ZeniMax website one or more software tools through which You may create or develop Game Mods (each such tool is an "Editor Tool"). To obtain a copy of or get access to any such Editor Tool, You will be required to agree to the terms of a separate EULA (the "Editor EULA"). If there is a conflict between the terms and conditions in any such Editor EULA and the terms and conditions in these Terms of Service, the terms in the Editor EULA will control over the conflicting terms in these Terms of Service but solely for purpose of the specific Editor Tool and not for any other purpose. Please review the terms in the Editor EULA carefully.

 

With respect to Game Mods made available for download from a ZeniMax website or made available from a ZeniMax server, ZeniMax may, at any time and in its sole discretion, elect to remove such Game Mods from the ZeniMax website(s) or server(s) without notice to You.

 

 

 

So I guess you can mod ESO AND Fallout 76! Good news for anyone interested!!! You're welcome.

 

you lay you everything so rightly, how you like best.
you're right, Todd said mods will come in 2019, but he also said END 2019 and he said Mod distribution about Creations Club.
you believe but not seriously, that Bethesda after this disaster, free modding will allow! :classic_wink:

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27 minutes ago, Alkpaz said:

The point is that Beth can come in here and any other mod site that hosts Beth mods and shut them down. So, "we who use mods" are the same kind of people who don't do a complete stop at a stop sign (rolling stop). A cop has every right to pull you over and ticket you, but they seldom do. 

 

I think DoctaSax had a point about that as well. When the whole Nexus "contribution to modders" https://www.patreon.com/nexusmods thing started, I asked a very similar question. 

 

As for CPU's Ubisoft thing.. I did read that when he first posted it, and I figured that is why other companies don't have very good mod support, because they keep it "locked tight". It's kinda crazy how they (other companies) can monitor such things. 

All the work I did was on the Ubisoft forums, so was quite easy to check it.

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18 hours ago, Kendo 2 said:

Not for multiplayer online-only games with EULAs that prohibit editing or modifying the files.  There aren't any mods on LL for games like that.

 

Listen, you can change or edit the files in your game, but if Bethesda gets wise to it somehow they can revoke your license and legally block you from accessing the software.  You agreed to that.  Provisions like that are generally included in most paid license software.  You're not allowed to edit something you don't own and only have a license to use.  You're not supposed to mod the game.  It ain't good; it ain't bad.  It's just the way it is.

 

 

There's nothing that says what you are claiming concerning offline vs online games in law or for Fallout games. Fallout 4's EULA has the exact same thing as Fallout 76's EULA. Both also mentions mod's being allowed  (without support from Bethesda if you screw up your game).

 

Either modding communities like LL is 100% in the wrong modding any Bethesda titles or Fallout 76 can be modded and therefore removing seperate  threads that talk about Fallout 76 modding isn't being done for the reason's you claimed. 

 

As far as everyone's stance goes (who's been using mod's for over a decade) to quote a favorite movie, "Well...Let's be bad guys!"

 

 

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1 hour ago, patches13 said:

There's nothing that says what you are claiming concerning offline vs online games in law or for Fallout games. Fallout 4's EULA has the exact same thing as Fallout 76's EULA. Both also mentions mod's being allowed  (without support from Bethesda if you screw up your game).

Either modding communities like LL is 100% in the wrong modding any Bethesda titles or Fallout 76 can be modded and therefore removing seperate  threads that talk about Fallout 76 modding isn't being done for the reason's you claimed. 

As far as everyone's stance goes (who's been using mod's for over a decade) to quote a favorite movie, "Well...Let's be bad guys!"

Yeah, sure whudever.  So you have the mandated official Zenimax Editor Tool software?  No?  Thought so.  At this point you're just arguing for the sake of arguing and that's annoying.  Done with this line conversation.  Don't bother quoting me or responding.

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22 minutes ago, Ernest Lemmingway said:

This is beyond insane. It's like Bugthesda (and likely Zenimax as a whole) is deliberately doing everything it can to make a bad situation worse. And paid loot boxes now? See my last comment.

I always knew they were going to add loot boxes at some point.  In ESO they did it so that new players would be up to speed with people who had been grinding the game for a year.  All in the name of 'fairness' they shit on the people who had been playing (grinding) since day one.  They intentionally made devoted players less than scrublords with a credit card.

I'm surprised they're introducing loot boxes this early but they have to make up for the lost revenue somehow; so they update the game to make it more of a grind and then provide the fix with loot boxes.  Create a problem and make players pay to fix it.  Good job B(EA)thedsa 10/10. 

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2 minutes ago, Kendo 2 said:

I always knew they were going to add loot boxes at some point.  In ESO they did it so that new players would up to speed with people who had been grinding the game for a year.  All in the name of 'fairness' they shit on the people who had been playing (grinding) since day one.  I'm surprised they're introducing loot boxes this early but they have to make up for the lost revenue somehow; so they update the game to make it more of a grind and then provide the fix with loot boxes.  Create a problem and make players pay to fix it.  Good job B(EA)thedsa 10/10.  Devoted players are now less than scrublords with a credit card.

GrimReaper tried to call bullshit on me for saying the same thing a month ago in this very thread before they up and disappeared. And I agree, these sorts of scams actually ruin MMOs. It's a vicious cycle of alienating older players who put in their time, attracting newer players who don't have the patience or devotion to stick with it who demand further simplification streamlining, which then alienates more older players as the devs give in, repeat ad nauseum. The newer players don't have the attention span to stick with the game, the older players who do have already left in disgust, and the game eventually goes under. Maybe it finds new life on private servers, maybe it's just forgotten.

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27 minutes ago, Kendo 2 said:

I always knew they were going to add loot boxes at some point.  In ESO they did it so that new players would be up to speed with people who had been grinding the game for a year.  All in the name of 'fairness' they shit on the people who had been playing (grinding) since day one.  They intentionally made devoted players less than scrublords with a credit card.

I'm surprised they're introducing loot boxes this early but they have to make up for the lost revenue somehow; so they update the game to make it more of a grind and then provide the fix with loot boxes.  Create a problem and make players pay to fix it.  Good job B(EA)thedsa 10/10. 

This I hate like the plague *Pay and Win*, I also see it in my online RPG that I've been playing for 4 years.
when I started with this game there was not that yet, I had to work (fight for) hard for everything.
now new players come added, they pay and immediately have a top gear! :classic_angry:

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6 hours ago, Kendo 2 said:

Yeah, sure whudever.  So you have the mandated official Zenimax Editor Tool software?  No?  Thought so.  At this point you're just arguing for the sake of arguing and that's annoying.  Done with this line conversation.  Don't bother quoting me or responding.

Well when I'm right I'm right. But no problem we can be done discussing it.

 

5 hours ago, shadowlord445 said:

20 fucking dollars for 2 Santa outfits, a stuffed ragstag, and some icons??

 

Ya, this is not only a rip off but also insulting. I can't imagine anyone willing to pay $20 for 2 santa outfits that don't even look that good. The icing on the cake was them throwing the "discount!" on their on release. It's 33% off it's regular price that has never been sold at....

4 hours ago, Kendo 2 said:

I always knew they were going to add loot boxes at some point.  In ESO they did it so that new players would be up to speed with people who had been grinding the game for a year.  All in the name of 'fairness' they shit on the people who had been playing (grinding) since day one.  They intentionally made devoted players less than scrublords with a credit card.

I'm surprised they're introducing loot boxes this early but they have to make up for the lost revenue somehow; so they update the game to make it more of a grind and then provide the fix with loot boxes.  Create a problem and make players pay to fix it.  Good job B(EA)thedsa 10/10. 

 

 

Well they haven't added them yet, so maybe they will see this blowback and not do it.

 

LIke some others have mentioned, P2W/loot boxes is horrible, and is ruining the gaming industry. Instead of gaming companies making games the best they can be, they do the bare minimum they think the playerbase will let them get away with and then everything else that used to be in the game by default they tack on for micro-transactions. 

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6 hours ago, Ernest Lemmingway said:

GrimReaper tried to call bullshit on me for saying the same thing a month ago in this very thread before they up and disappeared. And I agree, these sorts of scams actually ruin MMOs. It's a vicious cycle of alienating older players who put in their time, attracting newer players who don't have the patience or devotion to stick with it who demand further simplification streamlining, which then alienates more older players as the devs give in, repeat ad nauseum. The newer players don't have the attention span to stick with the game, the older players who do have already left in disgust, and the game eventually goes under. Maybe it finds new life on private servers, maybe it's just forgotten.

I'm actually glad Bethesda has blown their cover and people are seeing them for the shit stain company they are.  Everyone playing FO76 deserves to be royally fucked out of their money and time invested.  And seeing the FO76 shit show, I'm also glad I never invested myself in FO4 and modded it.  Saves me the trouble of freezing out the inevitable content thieves.

Anyway, I doubt FO76 will have the reprieve of private servers.  Bethesda has pumped too much effort into locking down the game so they can control everything.  Basically they painted themselves into a corner; their website, their launcher, their servers, their store, etc.  All of it's a big shit sandwich they'll have to eat eventually since games don't recover from bad initial reception.  The only way to do that is good PR and better product. and we all know that Bethesda is incapable of that.  The damage is done and it's fucking hilarious.  Andromeda, Battle Front 2, Battlefield 5; they pale in comparison.  The only thing missing is Bethesda going EA-level woke.  Now I'm wishing that would happen too. ?

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In the midst of all this negativity on Bugthesda and FO76, it's been all too easy to ignore the fact that one-time MMO king Blizzard has undergone a precipitous drop in stock price in just two months. For all the same reasons that Bugthesda is in hot water, too: treating players like idiots, overpriced microtransactions, and really ? product.

 

Since we can't find out what's going on in Bugthesda financially, and their finances are apt to change drastically when the refund lawsuit is over, win or lose, this is the best comparison I could find to show what happens when you alienate the overwhelming majority of your fans. If it was just the one bad game I'd be fairly confident that Bugthesda would sleaze its way through and make something else. But when other companies are getting hammered for the same things, the company is still dealing with a lawsuit that will cost them not just the price of refunds but damages and fines to be paid if they lose, and that they're under fire over in the EU for violating data protection laws, it's questionable if they'll survive as a company. If they do, it will be as a mere shadow of what they are now as they cut costs and downsize to pay off their debts.

 

I'm just playing the devil's advocate here. The facts don't paint a rosy picture.

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I dont know anymore, I waited eagerly for FO4 and I felt shunned, saddened, disillusioned, and  angry. FO76 was to me the end I said my farewells to a company hat I once believed was king of all game makers. Now its just a speck of dust in the putrid dust bowl of the AAA market. EA, Ubisoft, Bethesda, and more are just that dead ends in a maze of Predatory schemes and turd covered biscuits. I have had more fun and great gaming playing Rimworld, Darkest dungeon, Nimbatus, Star-bound, the Binding of isaac, and many more independent Devs. There is no innovation in AAA games and Bethesda is not innovating, This online game is exactly the same as many others its not new its more of the same but somehow they took tried and tested and made it significantly worse. Independent Developers are the only ones who innovate and make new fresh things because those games will make or break them, they base their survival around the investors that truly matter; The people who buy the game. Beth and the rest are dead as this is all my own opinion I have finally let go of beth and moved on. TES6, and starfeild are not going to be any different just more shit to scrape off a McDonald's tiles bathroom floor after Ronald McDonald leaves during a serious bout of explosive diarrhea. Its time to just leave it all behinde and move to pastures that not trampled down with Micro-transactions and loot boxes.

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43 minutes ago, Alkpaz said:

I am all for a downsized Bethesda. 

I doubt that would make the games better.  The industry is saturated with assholes who think Madlibs story arcs and snark dialogue are good ideas.  The state of AAA gaming might not be salvageable.  Is it worth saving if games like FO76, Andromeda and Battlefield5 are the best they can offer?  Maybe there needs to be an industry-wide crash and burn like there was in the late 90's.  Wipe the slate and start over.

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I have been looking the things from the side, not bothered to look all of the "Drama" videos that are in the youtube. I own both PC and PS4 versions and am enjoying the gameplay, not really having bugs .. been streaming gameplay through PS4/Twitch. So what is the "main problem" for people?

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4 hours ago, Twist3dM1nd said:

I have been looking the things from the side, not bothered to look all of the "Drama" videos that are in the youtube. I own both PC and PS4 versions and am enjoying the gameplay, not really having bugs .. been streaming gameplay through PS4/Twitch. So what is the "main problem" for people?

We're all lying, there's nothing wrong with the game.  It's perfect, a work of genius.  It won game of the year.

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5 hours ago, Twist3dM1nd said:

So what is the "main problem" for people?

Beside shitload of bugs, being absolutely devoid of content, forced multiplayer, lack of mods, lootboxes, criminal marketing practices, constant server crashing/updates/maitnance that prevents you from playing the game, shit radiant quests being 100% of quests, lack of NPC's, awful performance, awful visuals and sound, lack of dev console ?? 

Nothing, the game is flawless. True GOTY. 

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14 hours ago, Alkpaz said:

They don't need a massive staff, 30 guys built Morrowind (according to the vid above your post) and they increased in size at each release till it numbered over 320 people (F76), it shows that throwing more people/money at the problem/product does not necessarily make/solve the problem/product. If they downsize to 10 people (iD software's number when they made Doom) they could probably make a better product, since their lives DEPEND on it. So, honestly, I am all for a downsized Bethesda. 

That was actually something I said in a Camelworks video until I got pressured into deleting my comment. Manpower =/= quality. The people who made Morrowind actually cared about the game. And it's become clear that ever since then Bugthesda didn't care about the games. FO76 is the end result of a company that just doesn't care.

 

I'm all for Bugthesda getting massively downsized as well. But the equally likely outcome is that they go under completely. Either of which I'm all for now. Twenty years of lies, streamlining, and using the same damn engine without once trying to optimize and/or properly debug the base code? They deserve whatever negative consequences they get.

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