slso SexLab Separate Orgasm LE

[Lupine00]

9 hours ago, 7osisg4d said:

Now with your HH fix I no longer get the poor Aroused Creatures behavior!

Really does sound like pure script lag. You might want to consider avoiding any high load mods. The SLA widget mod can be improved a lot by changing the options away from default. Creature Framework can also be improved by reducing radius, and so on.

[predragon]

I do not have a hud when I initiate is there something wrong? I do not have free cam setup. 

[Ed86]

On 2/26/2020 at 11:54 AM, Lupine00 said:

I think some people would like more clarity about what the 'E' value in the on-screen widget is, and why it doesn't change.

Fill bar => orgasm seems easy to understand, but the fixed 'E' number is not self-explanatory.

does that satisfy your clarity needs?

[chipstick]

Hi Ed86,

 

Is it safe to upgrade from 1.6.2 to 1.6.3 on an existing game?

 

I've only just started using SLSO a few weeks ago. Really like it, particularly the changes based on character lewdness =^_^=

[Ed86]

36 minutes ago, chipstick said:

Hi Ed86,

 

Is it safe to upgrade from 1.6.2 to 1.6.3 on an existing game?

 

I've only just started using SLSO a few weeks ago. Really like it, particularly the changes based on character lewdness =^_^=

yes

[Lupine00]

20 hours ago, Ed86 said:

does that satisfy your clarity needs?

Kinda sorta.

 

It doesn't explain much about where E really comes from, but it does explain what it does.

 

Presumably, there are a several factors that go into E calculation.

 

Does it consider arousal?

 

The main thing I want to do with SLAX is "responsive" arousal, so that arousal alters during the sex scene.

 

e.g.

You start the scene at low arousal, but fore-play scenes cause arousal to rise substantially.

Then with each scene arousal increases further, until you have enough to enable orgasm, or you don't.

 

 

I guess this is really not how SLSO works at this point. I suspected I would need to patch it somewhat.

 

 

Then by factoring in "fetishes" that the characters have, arousal will proceed more dramatically, depending on whether those fetishes are present.

This replaces the simple idea of LEWD with a character who may have a fetish for forced sex, or bondage (or who may really hate those things, which I call an aversion, though phobia might be a better term).

 

I did have a prototype of some of this stuff, but canned it, as it was too much to put in a mod that a lot of people might use. Too heavy.

My future plan it to put a framework to support it, but make the detailed scanning a plugin.

[wren888]

I updated from V1.6.2 to V1.6.3. The widgets no longer appeared. I went back and did a clean save, then installed V1.6.3. Still no widgets. The widget toggle had no affect. Just to make sure, I clicked the key just above that toggled the SLSO pause on and off as well. I tried V1.6.3 on a new game. Still no widgets. I don't know if this had any bearing or not, but the odd thing was, even though I deleted my previous mod organizer overwrites and Bash patch, the new game with V1.6.3 just installed had my MSM choices from V1.6.2 still chosen.

 

Then, I re-downloaded V1.6.3 and used it on a new game. The choices were set at the default settings, and the widgets showed up, but the widget toggle still doesn't work. I.e., it fails to turn the widgets off. I'm content, because I always have your mod on with the widgets showing. However, if others have a similar experience as I did, it might be a problem if they want to turn off the widgets temporarily for the purpose of screenshots or videos.

 

Thanks for your excellent mod.

 

--EDIT--

 

A clean save and installation of 1.6.3 also now works with my previous game as well as a new game.

[Ed86]

20 minutes ago, Lupine00 said:

Kinda sorta.

 

It doesn't explain much about where E really comes from, but it does explain what it does.

 

Presumably, there are a several factors that go into E calculation.

 

Does it consider arousal?

 

The main thing I want to do with SLAX is "responsive" arousal, so that arousal alters during the sex scene.

 

e.g.

You start the scene at low arousal, but fore-play scenes cause arousal to rise substantially.

Then with each scene arousal increases further, until you have enough to enable orgasm, or you don't.

 

 

I guess this is really now how SLSO works at this point. I suspected I would need to patch it somewhat.

 

 

Then by factoring in "fetishes" that the characters have, arousal will proceed more dramatically, depending on whether those fetishes are present.

This replaces the simple idea of LEWD with a character who may have a fetish for forced sex, or bondage (or who may really hate those things, which I call an aversion, though phobia might be a better term).

 

I did have a prototype of some of this stuff, but canned it, as it was too much to put in a mod that a lot of people might use. Too heavy.

My future plan it to put a framework to support it, but make the detailed scanning a plugin.

there is no point in explaining where it comes from people cant read so much text

        ActorFullEnjoyment = (FullEnjoyment * MasturbationMod / ExhibitionistMod / GenderMod * sl_enjoymentrate * slaActorArousalMod) as int
 

by default it does, you set it in mcm to something else

 

that sounds wrong, arousal exists beyond sex, you cant drop it because sex starts

[Lupine00]

59 minutes ago, Ed86 said:

that sounds wrong, arousal exists beyond sex, you cant drop it because sex starts

It doesn't drop. It goes up.

It goes down after orgasms.

 

Or do you mean in the case of aversion?

What is so strange about arousal dropping when you realize you are about to be raped, and you don't like it?

Or tied up and you fear it?

Or whipped, when you hate the pain?

In those cases, mixing is sex increases the horror, and any arousal that was present for other reasons would vanish.

 

Try it yourself. Next time you are having a nice time, stop and think about US politics. Your arousal drops right?

No? Oh well, no accounting for some people.

 

When I say "consider arousal" I mean dynamically. In most scenes it is going to be increasing until orgasm.

At which point is is reduced (and that even happens already).

Sexy Bloomberg not withstanding.

[Ed86]

3 hours ago, Lupine00 said:

It doesn't drop. It goes up.

It goes down after orgasms.

 

Or do you mean in the case of aversion?

What is so strange about arousal dropping when you realize you are about to be raped, and you don't like it?

Or tied up and you fear it?

Or whipped, when you hate the pain?

In those cases, mixing is sex increases the horror, and any arousal that was present for other reasons would vanish.

 

Try it yourself. Next time you are having a nice time, stop and think about US politics. Your arousal drops right?

No? Oh well, no accounting for some people.

 

When I say "consider arousal" I mean dynamically. In most scenes it is going to be increasing until orgasm.

At which point is is reduced (and that even happens already).

Sexy Bloomberg not withstanding.

eh i though you want to drop it to 0 at sex start and then raise

 

hm... us politics? im not a citizen of us but i guess should try next time

[chipstick]

On 3/2/2020 at 7:15 PM, Ed86 said:

yes

Neat. Thanks Ed86

[DayTri]

On 3/2/2020 at 3:24 AM, Lupine00 said:

Kinda sorta.

 

It doesn't explain much about where E really comes from, but it does explain what it does.

 

Presumably, there are a several factors that go into E calculation.

 

Does it consider arousal?

 

The main thing I want to do with SLAX is "responsive" arousal, so that arousal alters during the sex scene.

 

e.g.

You start the scene at low arousal, but fore-play scenes cause arousal to rise substantially.

Then with each scene arousal increases further, until you have enough to enable orgasm, or you don't.

 

 

I guess this is really not how SLSO works at this point. I suspected I would need to patch it somewhat.

 

 

Then by factoring in "fetishes" that the characters have, arousal will proceed more dramatically, depending on whether those fetishes are present.

This replaces the simple idea of LEWD with a character who may have a fetish for forced sex, or bondage (or who may really hate those things, which I call an aversion, though phobia might be a better term).

 

I did have a prototype of some of this stuff, but canned it, as it was too much to put in a mod that a lot of people might use. Too heavy.

My future plan it to put a framework to support it, but make the detailed scanning a plugin.

 

 

To be honest this sounds like a lot of work for little pay-off, arousal does very little during the scene, and what it does is configurable, so most users are probably not going to know how and why it's changing during the scene.

 

 

Why not dynamically modify enjoyment instead? OnAnimationStart, you can calculate some bonus enjoyment. Then either OnUpdate, or OnStageStart, add (or subtract) that enjoyment amount. That is much more visible to the user (it's displayed in a nice widget for the whole animation).  This seems much more like what you want. Otherwise characters with strong aversions to certain things could still orgasm, still have high enjoyment, and therefore still play the "hot" voice or use the "enjoying it" dialogue from STA.

 

 

If you want it to affect arousal too (so the effects last outside of the scene) you can modify the arousal once at the end of the scene, based on the aversion/fetish value. Maybe after high fetish scenes arousal is set to at least 50, after high aversion scenes it's set to at most 25, or something like that.

 

This is a bit hacky, but I have an (unreleased) mod that:

 

1. Calculates bonus enjoyment based on a simple fetish system, and applies it as a bonus every stage

2. Sets arousal == enjoyment at the end of every scene.

 

This works pretty well if you use the "flat bonus" arousal modifier type, it effectively makes arousal always equal to enjoyment.

 

[GenioMaestro]

On 2/28/2020 at 10:40 AM, Lupine00 said:

You might want to consider avoiding any high load mods.

Can i know what you consider a "high load mod"?

[Lupine00]

11 hours ago, GenioMaestro said:

Can i know what you consider a "high load mod"?

Some depend on how you set them up. the SexLab Aroused Widget falls in that category.

 

Generally high loadish...

HDT HH

Wet & Cold

Birds of Skyrim and Flocks

Maria Eden

Slaverun Reloaded

Barefoot Realism

Devious Training

DCL

SD Plus (assuming you are enslaved)

Creature Framework + MNC (less bad if you turn down the radius/update rate)

PoP (after arrest)

Naked Dungeons

DEC

SLD can also be a bit heavy if you turn the updates down to 1s - but there's no real need to do that, by default it's fine.

[GenioMaestro]

8 hours ago, Lupine00 said:

(Let me order your list in other way)

 

Quote

HDT HH

Birds of Skyrim and Flocks

SD Plus (assuming you are enslaved)

PoP (after arrest)

I not use any of that mods and i can not talk directly about them.

 

 

Quote

Devious Training

That need a special comment because a 1 month ago i contacted directly with skyrimfet explaining why Devious Training have problems and how solve it.

That is a screenshot of my personal mail.

Spoiler

skyrimfet is working in a new version of Devious Training and I strongly recommend nobody use Devious Training until the new version is released.

 

 

For other side, I have installed and working in my game 10 of yours theoretically high loadish mods without any problem.

8 hours ago, Lupine00 said:

SexLab Aroused Monitor Widget

Wet & Cold

Maria Eden

Slaverun Reloaded

Barefoot Realism

DCUR

Creature Framework + MNC 

Naked Dungeons

DEC

SLDisparity

 

Of course, joined whit another 240 mods when a lot of them has been cataloged as Script Heavy or Script Intensive or problematic.

Take a look to my plugins list:

Spoiler

  0  0     Skyrim.esm
  1  1     Update.esm
  2  2     Dawnguard.esm
  3  3     HearthFires.esm
  4  4     Dragonborn.esm
  5  5     Unofficial Skyrim Legendary Edition Patch.esp
  6  6     Skyrim Project Optimization - Full Version.esm
  7  7     Falskaar.esm
  8  8     ApachiiHairFemales.esm
  9  9     ApachiiHair.esm
 10  a     SMSkyrim.esp
 11  b     ZaZAnimationPack.esm
 12  c     SexLab.esm
 13  d     BDSMMechanics.esm
 14  e     BeeingFemale.esm
 15  f     SexLabAroused.esm
 16 10     Devious Devices - Assets.esm
 17 11     MariaBase.esm
 18 12     MiasLair.esp
 19 13     Campfire.esm
 20 14     CreatureFramework.esm
 21 15     Devious Devices - Integration.esm
 22 16     Devious Devices - Expansion.esm
 23 17     EagleEyePerk.esm
 24 18     Heretical Resources.esm
 25 19     moonpath.esm
 26 1a     UndergroundBathhouse.esm
 27 1b     ITortureFramework.esm
 28 1c     PSQ PlayerSuccubusQuest.esm
 29 1d     paradise_halls.esm
 30 1e     Schlongs of Skyrim - Core.esm
 31 1f     Skyrim - Utility Mod.esm
 32 20     Cutting Room Floor.esp
 33 21     Weapons & Armor Fixes_Remade.esp
 34 22     Clothing & Clutter Fixes.esp
 35 23     ABBA.esp
 36 24     LootandDegradation.esp
 37 25     iEquip.esp
 38 26     SexLabAddActor.esp
 39 27     AI Package Manager.esp
 40 28     360WalkandRunPlus-RunBackwardSpeedAdjust.esp
 41 29     AHZmoreHUD.esp
 42 2a     UIExtensions.esp
 43 2b     AddItemMenu2.esp
 44 2c     AMatterOfTime.esp
 45 2d     AllNudePlay.esp
 46 2e     Apropos.esp
 47 2f     Hair Physics Project.esp
 48 30     Immersive Arousal.esp
 49 31     BeeingFemaleBasicAddOn.esp
 50 32     RaceMenuMorphsCBBE.esp
 51 33     Cumshot.esp
 52 34     CumshotSL.esp
 53 35     SkyUI.esp
 54 36     Customizable Camera.esp
 55 37     DD_Helpers.esp
 56 38     DW.esp
 57 39     DisableHDREffects_MCM.esp
 58 3a     Elephant'sScriptLatencyTester.esp
 59 3b     EnhancedLightsandFX.esp
 60 3c     FNISSexyMove.esp
 61 3d     GY_NPC_Enemy_Rep_DG.esp
 62 3e     HDT Female Hairstyles.esp
 63 3f     HDTTailsEquipable.esp
 64 40     HelmetToggle2.02b.esp
 65 41     PredatorsLostTribesV1.esp
 66 42     LegacyoftheDragonborn.esp
 67 43     SLAL_AnimationByBakaFactory.esp
 68 44     3DNPC.esp
 69 45     NPCs Protected and Uncapped.esp
 70 46     WARZONES - Civil Unrest.esp
 71 47     paradise_halls_SLExtension.esp
 72 48     Skyrim Immersive Creatures.esp
 73 49     Shout Like a Virgin.esp
 74 4a     ZaForswornStory.esp
 75 4b     SkyFalls + SkyMills + DG + DB.esp
 76 4c     OBIS.esp
 77 4d     SexLab_Solutions.esp
 78 4e     SkyrimURWL.esp
 79 4f     RealisticNeedsandDiseases.esp
 80 50     Purewaters.esp
 81 51     SexyBanditCaptives.esp
 82 52     Skyrim Immersive Creatures - DLC2.esp
 83 53     SexLab_DibellaCult.esp
 84 54     SkyTEST-RealisticAnimals&Predators.esp
 85 55     Cidhna Mine Expanded.esp
 86 56     MrissiTailOfTroubles.esp
 87 57     DFB - Random Encounters.esp
 88 58     The Brotherhood of Old.esp
 89 59     animal_mansion.esp
 90 5a     FalskaarRNDPatch.esp
 91 5b     AmazingFollowerTweaks.esp
 92 5c     JobsofSkyrim.esp
 93 5d     MilkModNEW.esp
 94 5e     EMCompViljaSkyrim.esp
 95 5f     Milk Addict.esp
 96 60     Inconsequential NPCs.esp
 97 61     Relationship Dialogue Overhaul.esp
 98 62     BarefootRealism.esp
 99 63     RDO - iAFT Patch.esp
100 64     ZIA_Complete Pack_V4.esp
101 65     troublesofheroine.esp
102 66     SkyrimUnhinged.esp
103 67     Dwarfsphere.esp
104 68     Immersive Encounters.esp
105 69     Realm of Lorkhan - Custom Alternate Start - Choose your own adventure.esp
106 6a     SMIM-Merged-All.esp
107 6b     Slaverun_Reloaded.esp
108 6c     MoreNastyCritters.esp
109 6d     SexLab UtilityPlus.esp
110 6e     Immersive Wenches.esp
111 6f     Deviously Cursed Loot.esp
112 70     The Manipulator.esp
113 71     dc-untamed-000.esp
114 72     SexLab Beastess.esp
115 73     SkyFalls DB + FS Small Waterfalls.esp
116 74     SexLabSkoomaWhore.esp
117 75     moonpath_questdata.esp
118 76     PAH_HomeSweetHome.esp
119 77     PAH_AndYouGetASlave.esp
120 78     Skyrim Shadow Striping Fix.esp
121 79     Immersive Patrols II.esp
122 7a     MistySkye.esp
123 7b     Frostfall.esp
124 7c     SofiaFollower.esp
125 7d     MariaProstitution.esp
126 7e     SexLab-AmorousAdventures.esp
127 7f     DeviousFollowers.esp
128 80     More Interesting Loot for Skyrim.esp
129 81     Hateful Wenches.esp
130 82     Devious Cidhna.esp
131 83     MilkMod_MilkPumpsBasic.esp
           SMSkyrim - Alternate Start + General Patch.esp
132 84     MariaDevices.esp
133 85     Recorder Follower Base.esp
134 86     MariaQuests.esp
135 87     Deviously Enslaved.esp
136 88     Schlongs of Skyrim.esp
137 89     Blacksmithforge water fix DB.esp
138 8a     Blacksmithforge water fix Vanilla.esp
139 8b     VorpalBlade.esp
140 8c     Sassy.esp
141 8d     SMSkyrim - 3DNPC Patch.esp
142 8e     DragonPriestMasks.esp
143 8f     SexLab Eager NPCs.esp
144 90     Brevi_MoonlightTales.esp
145 91     ESFCompanions.esp
146 92     Remodeled Armor - Vanilla Replacer.esp
147 93     Beastess Vampire.esp
148 94     Better Vampires.esp
149 95     Blacksmithforge water fix DG.esp
150 96     Companions No Werewolf Option.esp
151 97     EtR_HearthfireDungeonAddon.esp
152 98     ZIA_Daedric Pack_V4.esp
153 99     pahe_lakeview_manor_cell.esp
154 9a     LunariWarriors.esp
155 9b     Naked Dungeons.esp
156 9c     slavers_spellbook.esp
157 9d     DanarielStormbow.esp
158 9e     Deadly Wenches.esp
159 9f     VRJessi.esp
160 a0     Devious Devices - Equip.esp
161 a1     SexLab_DibellaCult_Sisters.esp
162 a2     ELFX - Moonpath.esp
163 a3     Forgotten Wenches.esp
164 a4     Giada.esp
165 a5     HentaiCreatures.esp
166 a6     Imaginator BETA.esp
167 a7     Japanese.esp
168 a8     JaxonzZoom.esp
169 a9     Judgment Wenches.esp
170 aa     SLAL_K4Anims.esp
171 ab     KS Hairdos - HDT.esp
172 ac     KS Hairdo's.esp
173 ad     aleGetNaked.esp
174 ae     Liz Follower.esp
175 af     M2M_Animations.esp
176 b0     SMSkyrim - Compressed.esp
177 b1     SMSkyrim - Encounters.esp
178 b2     paradise_halls_farengars_study.esp
179 b3     MilkModNEW CF.esp
180 b4     MilkModNEW HF.esp
181 b5     MilkModNEW Sanbox.esp
182 b6     MilkModNEW ZaZ Sanbox.esp
183 b7     Milker Movil Armor.esp
184 b8     mintylightningmod.esp
185 b9     Modern Brawl Bug Fix.esp
186 ba     OBISDB.esp
187 bb     OpenFaceGuardHelmets.esp
188 bc     PC Head Tracking - MCM.esp
189 bd     PC Head Tracking - Patch.esp
190 be     InigoPerkPointGiver.esp
191 bf     PermaZONESLegendaryBalanced.esp
192 c0     PetCollar.esp
193 c1     KomAnimObjects.esp
194 c2     KomAnimScaler.esp
195 c3     RDO - USLEEP Patch.esp
196 c4     Remodeled Armor - Underwear.esp
197 c5     Remodeled Armor - Vanilla Replacer - Dawnguard.esp
198 c6     Remodeled Armor - Vanilla Replacer - Dragonborn.esp
199 c7     skyrimespawn.esp
200 c8     RohZima_AnimObjects.esp
201 c9     RutahTattooPack.esp
202 ca     SAP.esp
203 cb     SL Deadly Drain.esp
204 cc     SLA Monitor Widget.esp
205 cd     NibblesAnimObjects.esp
206 ce     SLAL_ProxyAnimObjects.esp
207 cf     SLAL_SHanimAnimObj.esp
208 d0     SLAL_AnimationsByLeito.esp
209 d1     SLALAnimObjBillyy.esp
210 d2     SexLab TDF Aggressive Prostitution.esp
211 d3     pahe-tdf-patch.esp
212 d4     SLAnimLoader.esp
213 d5     SLPleasure.esp
214 d6     SLSW Addicted.esp
215 d7     pahe-DeviousDevices-addon-DDx-patch.esp
216 d8     SexLab Aroused Creatures.esp
217 d9     FWB_SexLabDisparity.esp
218 da     SLSO.esp
219 db     SexLabCumRegenerator.esp
220 dc     SexLabSquirtR.esp
221 dd     SexlabAmmoUnequip.esp
222 de     Size Does Matter.esp
223 df     SkyFalls + SkyMills Falskaar.esp
224 e0     SlaveTats.esp
225 e1     SlaveTatsEventsBridge.esp
226 e2     SlaveTatsMagicManager.esp
227 e3     TheCoenaculiCBBE.esp
228 e4     TheEyesOfBeauty.esp
229 e5     ub_npc_rework.esp
230 e6     beinz_plugin.esp
231 e7     UnreadBooksGlow.esp
232 e8     Weapons & Armor_TrueWeaponsLvlLists.esp
233 e9     WetandCold.esp
234 ea     WetFunction.esp
235 eb     SOSRaceMenu.esp
236 ec     ZIA_Ancient Pack_V4.esp
237 ed     SC07SexLabRandomAttack.esp
238 ee     Circular_Reference.esp
239 ef     FNIS.esp
240 f0     MassMatchMakerSE.esp
241 f1     Memory_Test.esp
242 f2     multi_cloak.esp
243 f3     RaceMenu.esp
244 f4     RaceMenuPlugin.esp
245 f5     ScriptTest.esp
246 f6     SexLabTools.esp
247 f7     SOS_Merge.esp
248 f8     XPMSE.esp
249 f9     ELFXEnhancer.esp
250 fa     Bashed Patch, 0.esp

 

The mods marked in red are in your list, the mods marked in yellow cause a big overload in the game, the mods marked in green run a lot of scripts.

If my counts are correct, i have 15 in red, 14 in yellow and 29 in green. That give me 58 mods that, theoretically, must give me a lot of problems.

But my game not have any problem of any kind. I can play for 4, 5 or 6 consecutive hours in full hd 1920x1080 with average 50 FPS in a 6 years old machine.

The latency reported by Elephant Script Latency Tester is below 100 ms 90% of the time.

 

Do you know why?

Because the high loadish mods, or Script Heavy mods or Script Intensive mods NOT EXIST. I fight against this stupid mantra for years. I develop and publish specific mods, as Script Test and MultiCloack, to demonstrate it without any kind of doubt. Please, download my mods, analyze them and run it in your own game to discover that is IMPOSIBLE cause problems to the Script Engine running 1 script or 50 script or 200 scripts, not matter what make that scripts.

 

The only way to create problems in the Script Engine is ACUMULATE scripts to the infinite and that only happen when the mod has been bad developed, bad designed or bad implemented. That happen in some specific mods, like Go to Bed, Locational Damage, Devious Training, the cum inflation feature of PSQ or the magic processor of BeingFemale...  Letting apart the exact problem caused by exact mods, the game and the Script Engine not have any problem to run all the mods with all the scripts that you want.

[DayTri]

4 hours ago, GenioMaestro said:

 

I not use any of that mods and i can not talk directly about them.

 

...

 

Do you know why?

Because the high loadish mods, or Script Heavy mods or Script Intensive mods NOT EXIST. I fight against this stupid mantra for years. I develop and publish specific mods, as Script Test and MultiCloack, to demonstrate it without any kind of doubt. Please, download my mods, analyze them and run it in your own game to discover that is IMPOSIBLE cause problems to the Script Engine running 1 script or 50 script or 200 scripts, not matter what make that scripts.

 

The only way to create problems in the Script Engine is ACUMULATE scripts to the infinite and that only happen when the mod has been bad developed, bad designed or bad implemented. That happen in some specific mods, like Go to Bed, Locational Damage, Devious Training, the cum inflation feature of PSQ or the magic processor of BeingFemale...  Letting apart the exact problem caused by exact mods, the game and the Script Engine not have any problem to run all the mods with all the scripts that you want.

 

But Lupine only mentioned "script lag", not stack dumps or FPS reduction. I remember reading your posts before about stack dumps and lag, and they were really good. But I think in your post you mentioned that scripts can delay the execution of other scripts?

 

 

Quote

"My events are running constantly and the game may take a few seconds to find a free execution slot and that may delay the execution of others scripts a lot."

 

That was from one of your tests, so if some mods are running lots of events, it could also cause other scripts to delay execution right?

[GenioMaestro]

56 minutes ago, DayTri said:

you mentioned that scripts can delay the execution of other scripts?

56 minutes ago, DayTri said:

That was from one of your tests, so if some mods are running lots of events, it could also cause other scripts to delay execution right?

Yes and yes.

 

But do you know how many scripts are need to you have a noticeable script lag? NO?

Install Script Test and see it with yours own eyes. Launch Test Type 2 = Mathematical and open any MCM while the test is running. Or launch spells with scripts to determine the script lag imposed by my test.

 

I can execute 200 Mathematical Events without any problem, that is noticeable Script Lag = 0 

With 400 Mathematical Events I start notice a script lag that can be below 1 second.

With 800 Mathematical Events I have a very noticeable script lag from 1 to 5 seconds.

With 1600 Mathematical Events the script lag is tremendous, from 10 to 30 seconds.

With 3200 Mathematical Events the game is unmanageable and can need minutes to execute a script.

 

Do you know a mod that need execute 200 simultaneous scripts? 

That mod need execute theirs script in a constant way without stop?

 

NO? Then where is the problem?

 

My game, and your game, and any Skyrim... can execute 200 Mathematical Events that are executed in constant way, without stop, without any problem. But at the same time, while my 200 Mathematical Events

are executed, the game can execute any other script from any other mod without show any kind of scrip lag.

 

That means, without any doubt, that the game can execute, at the same time, all the scripts of all the mods installed multiplied by 4 or 6 and, probably, the game would still have free time to execute more scripts.

 

Is IMPOSSIBLE saturate the Script Engine by running normal scripts. You need run more than 200 simultaneous special scripts, designed by me to create problems in the game, before notice the most minimum script lag.

 

The only way to have script lag is use a bad developed mod, that generate scripts as crazy. In that situation, the game can start the accumulation of scripts, and that cause all the problems because the game must execute each one of that scripts, not matter how many they are. Can be 200, 400, 800... or 5600 as i see in some post.

That is what REALLY cause problems in the game.

[Lupine00]

12 hours ago, GenioMaestro said:

Do you know a mod that need execute 200 simultaneous scripts?

Oh, here we go...

 

Not all scripts are made equal. There is considerable difference between intense mathematical processing, and processing that has an interplay with latent functions and events. Similarly, there is a difference between loading from multiple small simple scripts and small numbers of high-memory consuming scripts... And then, yes, we do also have mods that add hundreds of scripts inappropriately - cloaks were the favorite for this.

 

SLD processes thousands of arithmetic operations, but this has almost no impact on script load and happens very quickly in terms of start to finish time.

 

OTOH, simply requesting information on the item worn in a single slot can take multiple frames to reschedule. It spends much longer determining slot use than it does processing thousands of weighting interpolations and compositions.

 

 

But hey, lets all take one narrow piece of evidence and extend its meaning far beyond its actual applicability in a sort of noisy attention seeking performance.

I'm checking out now. This discussion just turned into nonsense.

 

In a logical sense. We figured out that X implies Y. That doesn't mean we can infer the entire rest of the alphabet here.

[Lupine00]

On a different topic ... sexually broken ...

 

When I play normally (not broken), I click like crazy and use up all my stamina as fast as I can. My character has high stamina, and SLS also helps stamina regen in some situations, so it comes back quite quickly. Somebody almost always gets an orgasm that way.

 

 

I find when I have no mana (which often results from MME skooma effect), that the "sexually broken" behavior just doesn't try very hard.

It barely uses any of my stamina.

 

It seems reasonable that if you are "broken", you would go all out and burn stamina until you don't have enough for another action ... then once there's enough stamina, act again, immediately.

 

Instead, almost the opposite happens.

 

When I have no mana, I get to sit and watch an almost full stamina bar, and a sex scene that can drag on without much change for several minutes, while the auto-pilot only "clicks" once every five seconds or so. In that case the scene often ends without anyone getting an orgasm, while my stamina bar sat full and unused.

[Ed86]

well i guess you have a lot of 

Quote

a bad developed mod

slso scripts update every second(or so they should)

[GenioMaestro]

4 hours ago, Lupine00 said:

Not all scripts are made equal. There is considerable difference between intense mathematical processing, and processing that has an interplay with latent functions and events.

Of course, that is the BIG difference between Test Type 1 = Cell Scan and Test Type 2 = Mathematical.

The game can execute 3200 simultaneous Cell Scan without show the most minimum script lag but when execute 400 Mathematical Test the game start having script lag. Use Script Test to see it whit your own eyes.

 

4 hours ago, Lupine00 said:

Similarly, there is a difference between loading from multiple small simple scripts and small numbers of high-memory consuming scripts...

Not, here we not have any difference. For the game, execute hundreds of small script is exactly the same as execute a big script that need a lot of memory and time. You can run CumShot2 whit drop objects and see how the game create hundreds of small script, one for each drop, without any problem. In the same way, any big mod have big script, that are executed and loaded dynamically, and the game not have any problem.

 

4 hours ago, Lupine00 said:

And then, yes, we do also have mods that add hundreds of scripts inappropriately - cloaks were the favorite for this.

That are caused by mods bad developed, bad designed and bad implemented.

If a mod have a cloak to add a spell to each nearby NPC and we enter, through a loading door, in a cell that have 50 NPC's the game must create and execute 50 new scripts. That is not a problem for the game.

 

The problem happen when the mod run the cloak again BEFORE the older script end their execution.

In that case, we have 50 OLD running script plus another 50 NEW scripts. That is ACCUMULATION.

If the mod apply the cloak again the count up to 150, and next to 200, 250, 300, 400, 600, 1000, 1500, 5000...

That is the REAL problem = bad developed mods whit a bad designed and bad implementation.

 

The cloaks in the game works perfectly and not have any problem. Download MultiCloak and make test in your own game to see it in your own game whit yours own eyes.

 

4 hours ago, Lupine00 said:

simply requesting information on the item worn in a single slot can take multiple frames to reschedule

How many frames need a script to be executed is indifferent. That only determine how many time we must wait to have the result of the script. Some functions in Papyrus are tremendously slow but we can make absolutely nothing, except develop a DLL in C++ to make exactly the same.

We can have thousand and thousand of script in suspend state waiting the answer from the game about the worn object without have any kind of overload in the game.

 

4 hours ago, Lupine00 said:

In a logical sense. We figured out that X implies Y.

That not have any kind of logic from any point. If you imagine that X implies Y, you can imagine a lot of incorrect thing. The only way to know, whit a 100% of security, that X implies Y is demonstrate that, REALLY, X implies Y. Please,  stop imaging things.

 

4 hours ago, Lupine00 said:

That doesn't mean we can infer the entire rest of the alphabet here.

Of course, because each letter of the alphabet is different. When we combine the different letters in different ways we have different results. That is the difference between good developed mods and bad developed mods.

[Lupine00]

4 hours ago, GenioMaestro said:

Not, here we not have any difference.

It's rubbish. Running multiple high memory consumers will run you out of stack and crash the script.

 

  

4 hours ago, GenioMaestro said:

We can have thousand and thousand of script in suspend state waiting the answer from the game about the worn object without have any kind of overload in the game.

Yes, that's the actual script lag we're talking about.

 

You defined script lag - visible delay in processing - as something else you made up, which is useless to measure.

Good job!

 

If my script takes 10 seconds to get a result, if it takes 20 seconds to start my sexlab animation ... THAT IS LAG.

 

If the player hits a hot key, and a minute later, the PC kneels ... THAT IS LAG.

 

It doesn't matter that you ran 400 mathematical tests every frame in that time.

That is meaningless to the player and meaningless to the mod that needed to be responsive but WAS NOT.

SLD is one of the very few mods that does any meaningful maths, and it does most of it in C++, so again, math tests prove nothing useful about real world mods. They just reveal an interesting but mostly irrelevant property of the script engine. As you yourself pointed out, we don't make 400 scripts (doing math tests), we make a couple of dozen scripts doing things that may, or may not have high latency - and may or may not cause the script to be suspended and not rescheduled (for some time, or ... ever).

 

See what I said in the first place. Script lag comes from rescheduling delays, not computational load. There are virtually no mods that have any computational load. Of the mods that do, I can think of SMP and SLD, and neither does the math in Papryrus. Most people know this. Why are you talking like it's a revelation we all need to realize?

 

 

It's really tiresome when you spout things that are (mostly) correct, but utterly irrelevant to the point in hand, and written in that super-patronising mansplaining voice where you tell me how cloaks work. I know how cloaks work, I raised the actual example for you. So, repeating it back at me like I don't understand? Is that designed to troll me, or what?

 

I really am exasperated with this twaddle now, because as usual, it just feels like trolling (whatever you may intend).

[GenioMaestro]

2 hours ago, Lupine00 said:

It's rubbish. Running multiple high memory consumers will run you out of stack and crash the script.

You can demonstrate that in any way? Because i can demonstrate the opposite.

 

2 hours ago, Lupine00 said:

Yes, that's the actual script lag we're talking about.

Again, you are totally confused and you are mixing the delay with the lag.

 

The two concepts are totally different but related. The two things happen at the same time and have similar effects. I can admit that a normal user can not differentiate it but you, as professional developer, must not mix it.

 

The delay is the time need to execute the script without be affected by the execution of others script.

The lag is the exceed of time need to execute the script caused by the execution of others script.

You can see and understand the difference? Do you know what mean that words?

 

Mean that we go to have delay ALWAYS. We can make absolutely nothing to remove the delay because every script need a specific time to be executed. Papyrus is not C++. Papyrus can not execute 1000 functions in one millisecond. Papyrus need 1000 frames to execute 1000 functions and, at 60 FPS, that means 60 frames, or what is the same ONE entire second. If we develop a script that require ONE entire second to be executed, every time the script is executed, need ONE entire second to be executed. That is the processing time and is called delay. The only way to reduce the delay is make a good script or use a DLL in C++.

 

2 hours ago, Lupine00 said:

Script lag comes from rescheduling delays, not computational load.

THAT IS TOTALLY FALSE and i write it RED CAPS intentionally. That is one of yours BIG misconceptions.

 

When you make are rescheduling, for example making a RegisterForSingleUpdate(0) you are delaying you script one entire frame. At 60 FPS, the delay is 16 ms, at 30 FPS the delay is 32 ms. THAT IS DELAY NOT LAG

Is the time required to execute the script.

 

 

The lag is practically nonexistent in Skyrim. At 60 FPS, the minimum script lag reported by Elephant Script Latency is 32 milliseconds because need two frames to make the computation, one to start the process and another to compute and show the results, and that is exactly 16+16 = 32 milliseconds.

If we not execute any other script, the latency go to be 32 milliseconds ALWAYS.

 

If we have a script that need 500 ms to be executed and we not execute any other script, the time REQUIRED to execute that script go to be 500 ms ALWAYS. That is the time required to execute the script and is called DELAY. We can not reduce that time in any way until we change the lines of code.

 

When the game start executing others scripts the latency reported by Elephant can up to 100 milliseconds.

The maximum difference is 100-32 = 68 milliseconds.

Do you think a human person can notice a difference of 68 milliseconds?

Execute our script, that need 500 ms, in 568 ms is not a noticeable difference.

 

The maximum Script lag that you can have in Skyrim is near 100 millisecond but the maximum delay that you can have is defined by what the scripts do and how the scripts are written and can be a lot of seconds.

 

 

If you really have script lag, or excessive delay when execute scripts, is because something is not correctly configured in your game or because you are using a mod that is causing problems in the game. That is, REALLY, the only way to have Script lag is having thousands and thousands of Active Scripts created by a bad script from a bad mod.

 

I repeat: Is IMPOSIBLE saturate the Script Engine executing normal scripts. The only way is ACUMULATE thousands and thousands of scripts and that only can be made by a bad mod with a bad script.

 

 

The problem never, absolutely never, can be caused by have a lot of mods that execute scripts. I show my pluging list, is tremendously overcharged, I not like half of the mods i have installed. I have it installed and running, only and exclusively, to demonstrate that have a lot of mods with scripts that execute hundreds and hundreds of script each minute is NOT a problem to the game.

 

Take a look to my last session, you can see how i can play two consecutive hours with 250 plugings, exactly the same pluging list i posted yesterday, whitout any CTD and with a latency below 100 ms the 90% of the time, of course, while i kill a lot of NPC's, run DCUR events and play sexlab animations.

Papyrus 2 horas con Latency.0.rar

[2Dimm]

"This mod tries to fix above problem by modifying sslThreadController script to only play "OrgasmStart" and "OrgasmEnd" events when player has "Separate Orgasms" option disabled."

 

"3)goto sexlab mcm enable separate orgasms"

 

after all this years i still dont know if we are supposed to enable or disable the separte orgasm option in the sexlab mcm since the description contradicts itself, can anyone enlighten me? i think i'm just dumb and i guess its supposed to be enabled?

[jpee1965]

On 3/8/2020 at 10:26 PM, 2Dimm said:

"This mod tries to fix above problem by modifying sslThreadController script to only play "OrgasmStart" and "OrgasmEnd" events when player has "Separate Orgasms" option disabled."

 

"3)goto sexlab mcm enable separate orgasms"

 

after all this years i still dont know if we are supposed to enable or disable the separte orgasm option in the sexlab mcm since the description contradicts itself, can anyone enlighten me? i think i'm just dumb and i guess its supposed to be enabled?

3)goto sexlab mcm enable separate orgasms