Pete Hines changed his mind about FO4's last DLC? Or am I reading too much into it?

[DrMojoDoc]

So I just came across the interview MMORPG did with Pete Hines during QuakeCon on Aug. 9th, shortly after the VaultTec DLC. He talked mostly about ESO and other Bethesda games/projects, but this line caught my attention:

 

 

MMORPG: You've got another DLC coming later this month, right?

PH: Right, Nuka World is the last one for this year. It's the last one we have planned [for the Season Pass]. It's not too far off; we'll have more to talk about on that one before too long.

 

"the last one for this year"?

 

Am I reading too much into it or did Bethesda changed its mind about Nuka World being the last DLC for FO4?

Although, if they actually plan to make more DLC I imagine they'd be even more workshop contents.  (/shrug)

[Ark of Truth]

Well looking at that it can be taken as they plan to release more DLC For Fallout 4 after Nuka World.

[panthercom]

 I'm not listening to anything that 'Marketing' sleazeball says anymore. They need to wrap shit up so we

have a stable platform to mod

[mercplatypus]

I've seen plenty of updates that Nuka World is the last for this year and not necessarily for the game.  The original story was not accurate when it stated nuka was the last they would ever make.

[Halstrom]

You're reading too much into it, better to spend this time on more constructive stuff

I don't recall them ever saying there was a fixed number of DLC's or that Nuka-World was the last ever or that there wouldn't be another season next year. It depends on how much money is in it I guess, which might not be much once some serious modders DLC's start happening.

[Guest]

im actually just waiting for Ultimate Edition

[tazdotnet]

the job of pete hines is to manipulate people, he does not make the descisions but he was asked on twitter if nuka world was the last DLC and he said it was

 

HOWEVER he was getting pestered alot and the way he said it makes it feel like he said it was for sure the last one just to stop people asking

 

also fraud howard has also said it was the last of the year - can identical wording that often really be a coincidence?...

[Guest kimbale]

The Fallout 4 Season Pass: Get ALL DLCs¹ for a single price! Just pay once² and don't worry about us supplying you with new, great content³! 

 

¹Any stapled together assets will do. Just look at what modders make and cheaply copy it. If they whine, hit em with the CK EULA.

^2"Season pass" means that you will receive any number of DLCs we deem fit for the price. If we make something that is really an effort, we expect you to pay again, of course.

³We pride ourselves in making everything - even optional content - as one-dimensional as possible, to keep it digestable by everyone.

 

 

 

TL;DR: It's Bethesda.

[Eth4rlad]

I don't recall them ever saying there was a fixed number of DLC's or that Nuka-World was the last ever

 

I think various blogs had reported that Nuka World is the last one period based on a tweet on Pete Hines. Make of that what you will.

Personally i'm fairly sure they will make a standalone (full-priced) expansion similar to New Vegas and then sell a couple of DLCs for that too. It's the most lucrative method to wring as much money out of it as possible.

 

[Halstrom]

People believing tweets would probably believe anything the internet tells them

[Frel]

Here is the thing: a company will not say something that would close their options.

when the person saying it is kind of the HR guy it is even more true (he does not necessarily know all the things that goes on BGS and hence when asked it is easier to answer "last this year" -- as he probably know at least the planned releases -- than "dead last"

There is also always the possibility that should they decide few years later to make "Fallout 4 ultimate" they decide to add some extra  DLC should this new updated version been successful.

The thing is there's a lot of conditional above but this how a marketing person will work: let things open so people can try to conjecture and speak morte about the product. What we know is that Nuka world is the last DLC for the season pass. And, while Bethesda could pull a Borderland (ie endless stream of DLC even after the "GoTY edition"), it is not something they have done in the past.

 

conclusion: never read too much on what Hines is saying if it is not backed by official press release. His job is to generate hype around products and this rarely -- if ever -- include revealing what is going on behind closed doors. 

[Ernest Lemmingway]

when the person saying it is kind of the HR guy it is even more true (he does not necessarily know all the things that goes on BGS and hence when asked it is easier to answer "last this year" -- as he probably know at least the planned releases -- than "dead last"

 

Hines isn't in Human Resources; he's in Marketing. But the statement holds since Marketing usually doesn't know squat about the products, either.

 

I wouldn't believe Pete Hines if he told me the Earth is round, at this point. We already know he and Howard both are liars who gave up all but the pretense of being independent developers who release a game "when it's ready" rather than bowing to what big businesses do. Hines, especially, ran with the whole "mod support for consoles" angle when official mod support even for PCs was a good six months after launch, is still only a beta, and PS4 players still don't have it yet. Promise the world and never keep your word. Hines would make an excellent politician.

 

#HowardAndHinesMustDie

[Frel]

 

when the person saying it is kind of the HR guy it is even more true (he does not necessarily know all the things that goes on BGS and hence when asked it is easier to answer "last this year" -- as he probably know at least the planned releases -- than "dead last"

 

Hines isn't in Human Resources; he's in Marketing. But the statement holds since Marketing usually doesn't know squat about the products, either.

 

I wouldn't believe Pete Hines if he told me the Earth is round, at this point. We already know he and Howard both are liars who gave up all but the pretense of being independent developers who release a game "when it's ready" rather than bowing to what big businesses do. Hines, especially, ran with the whole "mod support for consoles" angle when official mod support even for PCs was a good six months after launch, is still only a beta, and PS4 players still don't have it yet. Promise the world and never keep your word. Hines would make an excellent politician.

 

#HowardAndHinesMustDie

 

My bad I meant PR (public relation) but had a brainfart and wrote HR instead. 

For Hines. I would not go as far as you, what he does is pretty standard for his position (yeah, yeah, that says more about the industry than the quality of Hines himself, but it is also the case for many other industries). This statement from me could just be applied to 99% of the big guys. As for "independent developer" or even "such a small team for a AAA" I never really bought it: both have always been put out of proportion for BGS since at least Oblivion and this both thanks to people like Hines or Howard but also so many fans buying into it.

BGS is not independent -- well it is independent as much as Naughty Dog -- nor that small (mos team which are larger often works on more project at once than BGS so the only difference is frequency of output, or you know much more polished games like CDPR which is twice as large)

[Ernest Lemmingway]

The state of the industry and the people in it is one thing I know all too well. Part of my opinion on Hines has been his "unofficial" tweets and what he says whenever he's interviewed in text or on video. His attitude has consistently come across as arrogant and defensive about complaints regarding Bethesda games. Like players are brain dead sheep who have no right to complain and should be grateful we got anything.

 

Another huge part is how he claims works with Todd Howard. If he and Howard are truly gamers, then FO4 is an indication their tastes do not match up with what made Fallout such a hit: an RPG with a rich and detailed world that forced players to make hard moral choices that affected the final outcome. Had they done what they did with this game with a TES title, I would be no more or less disappointed. The game feels like a skeleton, or a framework, with a thin skin pulled over it to hide the gross lack of major content. The DLCs are just as empty.

 

Then there's the fact Hines was involved in that aborted attempt at paid mods on Steam. If he, or Howard, truly understood the modding community then there would have been some sort of public notification saying it was a bad idea before it happened. I'm all for giving mod authors some patronage but not when the company that made the game gets a cut. They don't deserve a dime of whatever I give to independent modders. The company already got its money. Anything more goes to those who keep the game fun after so long.

[ralfetas]

Metacritic scores are going down more and more, if they want to save the game reputation and put fo4 in a step closer to skyrim and other beth games, they may release some more DLC, another season pass maybe, don't know... But i think it all depends what is coming next year, they have new IP on the works, don't know if they have the incentive to "save" fo4.

 

I really like this settlement stuff, but is terrible when you see that you spend hours building stuff and they don't worth nothing... They should explore better this, and not with crap workshop dlc's, but with quests, i can think in more them 10 ways to save this.

[Benmc20]

Metacritic scores are going down more and more, if they want to save the game reputation and put fo4 in a step closer to skyrim and other beth games, they may release some more DLC, another season pass maybe, don't know... But i think it all depends what is coming next year, they have new IP on the works, don't know if they have the incentive to "save" fo4.

 

I really like this settlement stuff, but is terrible when you see that you spend hours building stuff and they don't worth nothing... They should explore better this, and not with crap workshop dlc's, but with quests, i can think in more them 10 ways to save this.

As for the settlements ... Go check the mod called Simply Modular Housing, far better than Beth would do ... (personnaly, I'm stuck with the 0.05 version because the next version makes some changes I don't like).

[ralfetas]

 

Metacritic scores are going down more and more, if they want to save the game reputation and put fo4 in a step closer to skyrim and other beth games, they may release some more DLC, another season pass maybe, don't know... But i think it all depends what is coming next year, they have new IP on the works, don't know if they have the incentive to "save" fo4.

 

I really like this settlement stuff, but is terrible when you see that you spend hours building stuff and they don't worth nothing... They should explore better this, and not with crap workshop dlc's, but with quests, i can think in more them 10 ways to save this.

As for the settlements ... Go check the mod called Simply Modular Housing, far better than Beth would do ... (personnaly, I'm stuck with the 0.05 version because the next version makes some changes I don't like).

 

 

Is a nice mod yes, but don't put a objetive to the settlements. What i say is, you don't have why to build settlements, what you get building them? You only get visual satisfaction, but there is no point in building a settlement, ok you get experience, lots of it...

 

I could think in a lot of stuff that would save settlement part, functions to it, visitors, life, real attacks, loyalty problems, faction wars... lot of stuff, adding stuff to build is just what bethesda do.

[DrMojoDoc]

 

 

 

Is a nice mod yes, but don't put a objetive to the settlements. What i say is, you don't have why to build settlements, what you get building them? You only get visual satisfaction, but there is no point in building a settlement, ok you get experience, lots of it...

 

I could think in a lot of stuff that would save settlement part, functions to it, visitors, life, real attacks, loyalty problems, faction wars... lot of stuff, adding stuff to build is just what bethesda do.

 

 

While I'd love to see such features and functions implemented in FO4, I'm not sure if "saving settlement part" will be enough. Back before the release of the game, The devs mentioned that settlement will be an optional part of the game - and it is partly true, you can progress thru the game without workshop contents - but the settlement is a big part of FO4. Maybe, at the beginning of the development cycle, BGS simply considered settlement system to be Hearthfire 2.0 that will be part of the base game. But the end product is FO: Minecraft Edition. Now don't get me wrong, I absolutely enjoy the workshop parts of the game, and I find the game worthy of the money it asked for. However, it is also true that FO4 did not deliver a proper RPG experience, and that is not something that can be fixed with additions of more DLC contents, features, and functions. Because those need to be separate and independent of the base game, the degree of "corrective measure" that DLCs can have on the game as a whole is limited. 

 

What would be called for - in other word the best case and not-very-likely scenario - is BGS go after the suit laid by CD Projekt Red, deliver a 'overhaul' of the game (Fallout 4: Enhanced Edition?). I couldn't care less about graphical improvement (though, it'd be nice), I just want a story arc and the delivery of it to be more cohesive and sensible. Instead of hiding behind the illusion of choices, I want the game to actually portray the interactions between player and the environment in terms of story. (e.g. if the player decides to forego doing Battle of the Bunker Hill quest in favor of exploring other factions quests, can we at least have the Institute consider the player deep cover double agent? instead of keep repeating "good job bringing back that rogue Synth from Libertalia"?) 

 

I will be fine if they decide to make more DLC to "save the game", and I'll probably buy them, but I'd rather see them working on a overhaul if possible.

[ExecutorBill]

It would be kind of cool if there was a Shattered Steel type expansion or DLC for FO4. The default storyline is pretty complete by itself, but it feels oddly incomplete.

[AsariX]

Metacritic scores are going down more and more, if they want to save the game reputation and put fo4 in a step closer to skyrim and other beth games, they may release some more DLC, another season pass maybe, don't know... But i think it all depends what is coming next year, they have new IP on the works, don't know if they have the incentive to "save" fo4.

 

I really like this settlement stuff, but is terrible when you see that you spend hours building stuff and they don't worth nothing... They should explore better this, and not with crap workshop dlc's, but with quests, i can think in more them 10 ways to save this.

 

Best way to save FO4 would simply be saying: "We're finished, expect final patches for bugfixes within the next two months, so Fallout should be a relatively consistent modding environment well before Christmas."

 

There's a reason why Fallout 4 mods aren't too elaborate yet. The more intricate mods break with every DLC and patch, so as long as DLCs and patches are released, there's simply no point in releasing any mods. Way too much work to keep stuff updated.

[ousnius]

There's a reason why Fallout 4 mods aren't too elaborate yet. The more intricate mods break with every DLC and patch, so as long as DLCs and patches are released, there's simply no point in releasing any mods. Way too much work to keep stuff updated.

 

No, the reason is less modders are interested in it (bad game or not).

The only mods that break with patches are things like F4SE and DEF UI.

[Rod Broward]

The Fallout 4 Season Pass: Get ALL DLCs¹ for a single price! Just pay once² and don't worry about us supplying you with new, great content³! 

 

¹Any stapled together assets will do. Just look at what modders make and cheaply copy it. If they whine, hit em with the CK EULA.

^2"Season pass" means that you will receive any number of DLCs we deem fit for the price. If we make something that is really an effort, we expect you to pay again, of course.

³We pride ourselves in making everything - even optional content - as one-dimensional as possible, to keep it digestable by everyone.

 

 

 

TL;DR: It's Bethesda.

 

DELET THIS

 

MODS

 

DELETE THEM

 

DELETE THAT

 

NOW

[ralfetas]

 

There's a reason why Fallout 4 mods aren't too elaborate yet. The more intricate mods break with every DLC and patch, so as long as DLCs and patches are released, there's simply no point in releasing any mods. Way too much work to keep stuff updated.

 

No, the reason is less modders are interested in it (bad game or not).

The only mods that break with patches are things like F4SE and DEF UI.

 

 

Agreed 100% with you Cell.

Don't think this is because is a bad game, can be bad sure, but is not for that, modding is always cool, and bethesda is making a huge advertise about modding, so we should be getting more modders, but no.

Don't know, maybe everyone is playing pokemon go.

[Halstrom]

Agreed 100% with you Cell.

Don't think this is because is a bad game, can be bad sure, but is not for that, modding is always cool, and bethesda is making a huge advertise about modding, so we should be getting more modders, but no.

Don't know, maybe everyone is playing pokemon go.

A lot of us modders are just spinning wheels at the moment, most people have no idea how hard it is to do any scripting mods at the moment without F4SE. I spend days resorting to primitive token counting and keywords to just send basic information from a door to a collar. A level 4 door detects a level 2 collar wearer trying to access it, to issue a level 2 infringement the door script has to give 2 tokens to the actor and then the actors script counts them and does its stuff.

I spend hours day writing script then hit compile to find I need a simple function that doesn't exist like Armor.HasMod(). Or hours tracking an issue to find some functions you can compile but just completely fail with certain types or if they aren't in the right type of object reference.

I find I can't do a function in an Armor attached script so I copy the script over as an enchantment effect on the Armor only to find that function now works but 2 crucial functions of my existing code don't work in enchantments :/

I end up blocking off the whole color changing code block of my collar script because it's just flat out impossible to do without hoop jumping and juggling from a secondary scripted object. The wiki documentation is still incomplete and a bit fuzzy in places (but thanks to those guys who are working on it) so those of us learning Papyrus waste hours learning basics

So us modders are here but many are waiting for decent tools and things to stabilise. I'm still seeing a lot of minor changes in FO4Edit with each update that mean I have to then re-update many of the assets I edit in a mod too

[ralfetas]

 

Agreed 100% with you Cell.

Don't think this is because is a bad game, can be bad sure, but is not for that, modding is always cool, and bethesda is making a huge advertise about modding, so we should be getting more modders, but no.

Don't know, maybe everyone is playing pokemon go.

A lot of us modders are just spinning wheels at the moment, most people have no idea how hard it is to do any scripting mods at the moment without F4SE. I spend days resorting to primitive token counting and keywords to just send basic information from a door to a collar. A level 4 door detects a level 2 collar wearer trying to access it, to issue a level 2 infringement the door script has to give 2 tokens to the actor and then the actors script counts them and does its stuff.

I spend hours day writing script then hit compile to find I need a simple function that doesn't exist like Armor.HasMod(). Or hours tracking an issue to find some functions you can compile but just completely fail with certain types or if they aren't in the right type of object reference.

I find I can't do a function in an Armor attached script so I copy the script over as an enchantment effect on the Armor only to find that function now works but 2 crucial functions of my existing code don't work in enchantments :/

I end up blocking off the whole color changing code block of my collar script because it's just flat out impossible to do without hoop jumping and juggling from a secondary scripted object. The wiki documentation is still incomplete and a bit fuzzy in places (but thanks to those guys who are working on it) so those of us learning Papyrus waste hours learning basics

So us modders are here but many are waiting for decent tools and things to stabilise. I'm still seeing a lot of minor changes in FO4Edit with each update that mean I have to then re-update many of the assets I edit in a mod too

 

 

Halstrom, like i already to said to you in PM, i think you script guys are genius.

 

About the tools, the question that i see is, will fo4 have life when the tools arrive? For me yes, but for most people... don't know, i don't see the hype for fo4 like we have for older bethesda games... or i am getting old, don't know