Corrupted Saves

[Guest Vendayn]

I have 54,282 strings in my current save. The save is roughly 10 hours or so of game time.

 

It started at close to (might not be exact, since I have a lot of saves. Pretty sure this is where I started) at 53,186 strings

 

Seems to be quite a jump after 10 hours (might be 9, or might be 11...somewhere around there).

 

Is that a pretty "safe" game to play long-term? Or is that pretty iffy?

Waiting for restringer to be more "complete", otherwise I wouldn't worry about my save game. I'd just start a new game. But I want to keep playing Skyrim Plus dunno how to properly use restringer anyway lol. It never starts up or runs from what I can tell (though it did create an empty folder). But its good it now reads BSA files, which might been why I was having issues before. Maybe with an actual interface it'll be a lot more (stupid) user friendly. Which is what I am Even a guide for dummies on basic modding tools and I still don't figure things out rofl.

 

One thing I noticed. When I slept 31 days, which is part of save cleaning and wiping things out or whatever that is supposed to do. My string count actually went up by 100 or so, because new things spawned, but the string count did NOT go down to compensate.

 

Which means, sleeping at all, especially 31 days, quickly adds up strings.

 

My save right before sleeping 31 days:

 

54,207

 

my save (right after) sleeping 31 days:

 

54,371

 

That means, sleeping (AND waiting) in Skyrim is VERY bad. That also means the needs mods are very bad, because they make your character tired. I found its probably because all the new spawns and new item spawns in containers.

 

(edit: to add...

 

to be honest, I thought doing that would help my save and get less strings. It in fact did the opposite, and gave me a massive amount of new strings (I consider 100+ massive.). That is seriously fucked up tbh lol. But hopefully this is good information.

 

 

[merryMalfunctioning]

I have 54,282 strings in my current save. The save is roughly 10 hours or so of game time.

 

The limit is 65000. I think you'll be okay... as long as you don't start installing and uninstalling mods.  :-)

[Mookeylama]

 

 

The problem was with my methodology not your program. I re-ran this test this time restringing all the mods in one batch.

 

58000 strings > 27000 strings.

 

This time no issues with any MCM menus.

 

https://www.dropbox.com/s/p65cl21lhdrjn61/Papyrus.0.log?dl=0

 

There's definitely some badness in that Papyrus log, but it's about what I would expect under the circumstances.

 

i had a merge about ready to go, which is how i learned of this whole string thing. it put me over the limit. so what's the best way to restring a merge? restring the individual mods before the merge, or merge and  then restring the merge itself?

 

I'd recommend waiting until Restringer has been tested a bit more.

 

That said, the best way is probably to restring some endpoint mods, and then merge with the patches in place. If you try to restring the entire merge, you have no control over which components get restringed. That will make it much harder to track down problems if you've restringed something that cannot be restrung.

 

 

ah okay. well i was getting ready to use the restringer and realized i don't know how to use it lol. no instructions in the readme?

where do i put the lib, json and jar files? basically how do i point it to restring the mods or files i want it to??

 

[Guest Vendayn]

 

I have 54,282 strings in my current save. The save is roughly 10 hours or so of game time.

 

The limit is 65000. I think you'll be okay... as long as you don't start installing and uninstalling mods.  :-)

 

 

I actually removed Crimson Tide - Blood, because one of the mods had it included (forgot which one) and I didn't notice when installing through mod organizer lol. It was from some combat mod I found on a chinese site. And I did actually add a few mods (hunterborn, world of rudra (a big new land mod) and some follower mods)

 

Think I should just start over to be on the safe side then? I know crimson tide is a very bad mod (would never willingly put that in skyrim lol. I need to pay better attention). That was one reason I wanted to sleep 31 days, to clear the left over from that and to see if strings lowered.

 

Or still think I can keep playing? been playing 3 hours since then (latest string number is from when I posted), and things seem fine.

 

Have a feeling I should just start over... and not do anything at all with new mods or removing mods or anything. I didn't realize Skyrim was like walking on glass with mods lol

[merryMalfunctioning]

Or still think I can keep playing? been playing 3 hours since then (latest string number is from when I posted), and things seem fine.

 

Have a feeling I should just start over... and not do anything at all with new mods or removing mods or anything. I didn't realize Skyrim was like walking on glass with mods lol

You'll probably be fine as long as you don't make more mod changes.

[merryMalfunctioning]

Instructions: extract the files into a folder, edit the settings.json file, then double-click the jar file.

 

The next version will look for the mod organizer directory, and show you a selectable list of all the mod folders. I'm not sure what to do for users who don't use mod organizer. I fear there may be no hope for them.

[badaxe]

I m using NMM and I can use Restringer with no problem

I just change the line in setting to point the mod in my virtual folder 

[Mookeylama]

I tried using Restringer, but its probably too early to use lol. I tried opening it in Mod Organizer, and it never opens...no window nothing. And I have the latest java, though the version I had was a tad bit higher than what Restringer was on. So I just renamed the java folder to match the version Restringer was looking for, and it stopped complaining about not finding the java program (even though I already have it lol)

 

But it still doesn't open. Even if I open directly in the folder, it doesn't open. Maybe cause I have steam installed into a custom folder/drive (I have everything from Steam installed to a drive X), and mod organizer is also in X+custom folder.

 

Or maybe its cause I'm on Windows 10, dunno.

 

I did change the output to the custom Skyrim folder, and added the mod organizer folders to modpath

 

so it looks like this currently

 

  "outputPath": "X:\\Skyrim\\MO MODS\\RestringerPatch",

  "modPaths": [

        "X:\\Skyrim\\Data\\",

        "X:\\Skyrim\\MO MODS\\AHZmoreHUD",

}

 

I didn't want to add every single mod folder to the list, if it wasn't gonna work. Thats too much tedious work for me to find out it doesn't work lol, I'd have a ton of annoying folders to add. Since it seems I'd need to go to every mod folder and add the path to settings by itself. And not every mod I installed was through mod organizer (95% of them were), so I put in the data entry where the rest of them are.

 

Don't want to keep playing my game if its just gonna break down the line, thats kinda bullshit lol. I really want to keep playing Skyrim, but not if its gonna just be a fail game that breaks lol.

 

Also to add. That is probably why my friend's game on his Xbox360 always gets corrupted rofl. He plays 200+ hour games, and eventually they always get corrupted on him.

 

yeah i can't figure out how to set the restringer up either. i don't use MO but i set up the paths that the json calls for. put in my Wearable Lanterns files, commented out the other mods. made sure it has Admin correct privileges...just can't get it to do anything

[Mookeylama]

Instructions: extract the files into a folder, edit the settings.json file, then double-click the jar file.

 

The next version will look for the mod organizer directory, and show you a selectable list of all the mod folders. I'm not sure what to do for users who don't use mod organizer. I fear there may be no hope for them.

 

hmm curious. why would a non MO user not be able to use this? does it rely on some a specific part of MO?

for instance, i have Optimizer Textures program set to a folder on my desktop. i then just drop textures in that folder and run the OT program to condense them. was hoping i could do that w/ Restringer. just set a path to a folder, drop the mod in question in that folder, and run ReST on it

 

[merryMalfunctioning]

I didn't realize NMM used virtual folders. Glad to hear it works.

 

The reason that I say MO (and NMM too now) are required is that otherwise mod are generally not stored in separate folders; they all just live together in the skyrim\data directory and there's no way to tell which mod each script belongs to. Wrye Bash has folders for mods, but they aren't structured in any kind of reliable way and are often compressed.

[merryMalfunctioning]

 

yeah i can't figure out how to set the restringer up either. i don't use MO but i set up the paths that the json calls for. put in my Wearable Lanterns files, commented out the other mods. made sure it has Admin correct privileges...just can't get it to do anything

 

Are you getting any error messages or anything? If something is configured wrong, you should at least get error messages or something.

 

Can you post your settings.json for me to check? I'd like to try to recreate your issue.

[TheBlackSilhouette]

As far as I can tell, there are two options:

 

1.      Work with what we have, which means convincing the modding community as a whole to use less strings for each mod.

 

Or

 

2.      Figure out some sort of workaround, which seems the more optimal choice.

 

Problem with 2, is it is a rather nasty bit of coding.  That said, I have a couple ideas.  Disclaimer, though, I’m not a programmer.  I’m a writer and brainstormer, so take these ideas for what they are, brainstorm sparks that might lead to a solution.  Anyway, as far as workarounds, here are the spitball ideas.

 

A.    “Parts” – A Skyrim core workaround that alters the way that Skyrim looks at the saves themselves.  This would be similar to how people get around file size limits with media sharing platforms and compressing files into .part1, .part2, etc., idea being to going around the problem by tricking the program into loading larger saves by loading multiple chunks.  Instead of having Skyirm look for “Strings” have Skyrim look for “Strings01, Strings02, etc.” 

 

B.     “Offload” – Embed a redirect into the saves themselves.  Skyrim save structure is altered and redirected to a utility architecture that allows for larger string counts. 

 

C.     “Translation/Compression” – Devise a method for compression so that scripts can be combined.  Such as “1. Hey, the dragon born did this” and “2. Hey, the dragon born did that” becomes “1. Hey, the dragon born did this and that.”  The scale would be bigger and take

 

D.    “Filter” – Utility that actively removes unnecessary/obsolete strings, should they turn up. 

 

These all depend on how important these strings and saves are.  If they are relied upon to load but are then irrelevant, that’s a good sign.  If they are active files, there’s a bigger problem.

 

Feel free to take these ideas and make use of them.  I’ve been troubleshooting loads that “should” be stable for months now, only to find out that this is the problem.  The sooner a workaround is found, the better and I’ll do anything I can to help

[merryMalfunctioning]

As far as I can tell, there are two options:

 

1.      Work with what we have, which means convincing the modding community as a whole to use less strings for each mod.

 

That's what the Restringing tool is for -- so that modders can use as many strings as they need, and we can patch their mods ourselves if we need to. The GUI for it is nearly done, I swear.

 

C.     “Translation/Compression” – Devise a method for compression so that scripts can be combined.  Such as “1. Hey, the dragon born did this” and “2. Hey, the dragon born did that” becomes “1. Hey, the dragon born did this and that.”  The scale would be bigger and take

 

D.    “Filter” – Utility that actively removes unnecessary/obsolete strings, should they turn up. 

 

The kind of strings you're talking about are stored in the ESP/ESM files and do not show up in the string table. The string table is purely a feature of the Papyrus scripting language -- used to store the names of Papyrus entities and the occasional message string. That's why my Restringer tool just rewrites scripts.

 

After examining how Skyrim's parts work during the Restringer project, I'm pretty sure that this issue is not fixable without access to Skyrim's source code. The 16bit String table limit is built into Skyrim at every level. I'd love to be proven incorrect though... Boris or the SKSE team could surprise us all with a miracle fix. Until then, using Restringer (or something comparable) to patch mods is probably the easiest and most convenient solution. Once Restringer is finished anyway....

 

 

Feel free to take these ideas and make use of them.  I’ve been troubleshooting loads that “should” be stable for months now, only to find out that this is the problem.  The sooner a workaround is found, the better and I’ll do anything I can to help

 

I'd love more testers...

[TheBlackSilhouette]

 

I'd love more testers...

 

 

I'd love to help!  Point me in the right direction for testing?  

 

I'm using mod organizer and my computer is positively a monster.  Also, if I can get a good enough step by step from some one who can guide me through it, I can produce a video how-to (no point in doing it until I'm sure I do it right).    

 

Let me know

[merryMalfunctioning]

 

 

I'd love more testers...

 

 

I'd love to help!  Point me in the right direction for testing?  

 

I'm using mod organizer and my computer is positively a monster.  Also, if I can get a good enough step by step from some one who can guide me through it, I can produce a video how-to (no point in doing it until I'm sure I do it right).    

 

Let me know

 

 

Awesome! I hope to post another alpha tonight or tomorrow. I'll start a new thread for the tool at that time, and post a link here asking for testing.

 

[TheBlackSilhouette]

 

 

Awesome! I hope to post another alpha tonight or tomorrow. I'll start a new thread for the tool at that time, and post a link here asking for testing.

 

 

 

Also, I thought it was worth mentioning, since Sexlab's animations take up like 6-8 strings each (apparently due to animation stages) and those animations seem to be the backbone of most of the mods on this site, that it might be with mentioning this little string issue to @Ashal.  Perhaps Sexlab's next version might be configured to use some other means to control the stages and preserve the strings.  If that's the case, Loverslab's mods might have a far lesser impact on the overall string count.  Furthermore, it seems like an issue that should be made a high priority message for the ears of all modders.  

[merryMalfunctioning]

 

Also, I thought it was worth mentioning, since Sexlab's animations take up like 6-8 strings each (apparently due to animation stages) and those animations seem to be the backbone of most of the mods on this site, that it might be with mentioning this little string issue to @Ashal.  Perhaps Sexlab's next version might be configured to use some other means to control the stages and preserve the strings.  If that's the case, Loverslab's mods might have a far lesser impact on the overall string count.  Furthermore, it seems like an issue that should be made a high priority message for the ears of all modders.  

 

Already talked to Ashal about it, did not seem to be very interested in fixing it. Ashal is a proponent of just using fewer mods.

 

I did make a little patch for this issue though. It requires JContainers 3.3.0alpha or better.

 

Ashal hasn't sanctioned my patch because it uses JContainers instead of PapyrusUtil (which is actually a very legitimate criticism). But JContainers is much easier to use as a drop-in replacement for Papyrus arrays. PapyrusUtil would have required more effort and MUCH more testing -- JContainers was practically a copy-paste job. :-)

 

Sexlab Strings Patch 2016-04-30.7z

[TheBlackSilhouette]

 

 

Also, I thought it was worth mentioning, since Sexlab's animations take up like 6-8 strings each (apparently due to animation stages) and those animations seem to be the backbone of most of the mods on this site, that it might be with mentioning this little string issue to @Ashal.  Perhaps Sexlab's next version might be configured to use some other means to control the stages and preserve the strings.  If that's the case, Loverslab's mods might have a far lesser impact on the overall string count.  Furthermore, it seems like an issue that should be made a high priority message for the ears of all modders.  

 

Already talked to Ashal about it, did not seem to be very interested in fixing it. Ashal is a proponent of just using fewer mods.

 

I did make a little patch for this issue though. It requires JContainers 3.3.0alpha or better.

 

Ashal hasn't sanctioned my patch because it uses JContainers instead of PapyrusUtil (which is actually a very legitimate criticism). But JContainers is much easier to use as a drop-in replacement for Papyrus arrays. PapyrusUtil would have required more effort and MUCH more testing -- JContainers was practically a copy-paste job. :-)

 

 

 

I assume installation is simple as giving it priority in Mod Organizer?  Also, is a new save still required?  

 

Also that bit about preferring fewer mods is a bit annoying.  I guess a papyrus expert needs to be recruited to make a Sexlab adaptation.  

[Guest]

 

Already talked to Ashal about it, did not seem to be very interested in fixing it. Ashal is a proponent of just using fewer mods.

 

I did make a little patch for this issue though. It requires JContainers 3.3.0alpha or better.

 

Ashal hasn't sanctioned my patch because it uses JContainers instead of PapyrusUtil (which is actually a very legitimate criticism). But JContainers is much easier to use as a drop-in replacement for Papyrus arrays. PapyrusUtil would have required more effort and MUCH more testing -- JContainers was practically a copy-paste job. :-)

 

 

 

Please include the sources in your patch.

Or it will be difficult to analyze.

[merryMalfunctioning]

 

I assume installation is simple as giving it priority in Mod Organizer?  Also, is a new save still required?

 

Yes and yes.

 

You might be able to get away with uninstalling Sexlab, making a clean save, and then reinstalling it with the patch in place. But I don't recommend it. For existing savegames, you probably just have to register fewer animations.

 

 

Please include the sources in your patch.

Or it will be difficult to analyze.

 

Done.

I'm starting a new thread just for discussing the String Table Bug issue. This thread has become excessively large; like seven pages of it happened before we even knew what was going on, and the bulk of it now is discussing Restringer. I'll make a thread for Restringer soon.

 

http://www.loverslab.com/topic/61277-savegames-that-crash-skyrim/?p=1542542

[merryMalfunctioning]

I started a thread for the newest alpha version of Restringer, for those people who want to test it. I'll be posting all information about Restringer in that thread and directing questions there.

 

The GUI is working, although still a bit clunky and in need of polish.

 

http://www.loverslab.com/topic/61279-restringer/

 

 

[Monoman1]

There's been another development on this issue.

http://www.loverslab.com/topic/61293-help-test-fix-for-save-game-string-table-overflow/?p=1542999

Great to see progress being made on every front. 

[Kenjoka]

Just came in, to say what fantastic work you do  *clap*

 

I did use the sexlab patch in the OP with my latest slaverun testruns, done probably 100s of sexlab calls without any problems *cheer*

 

and will probaly try to use the restringer now for some mods in my MO profile

[merryMalfunctioning]

Just came in, to say what fantastic work you do  *clap*

 

I did use the sexlab patch in the OP with my latest slaverun testruns, done probably 100s of sexlab calls without any problems *cheer*

 

and will probaly try to use the restringer now for some mods in my MO profile

Thanks! :-)

[Pinute]

It's my turn to say thank you and to you and vyper00 markdf. I'd just about given up on a heavily modded skyrim after repeated bouts of games suddenly not loading. It turns out you two put the finger right on my problem! With your sexlab patch installed and culling a few lesser mods I've now got 77 hours into a save that nearly never CTDs (I can count on one hand the number of times it's crashed). 

 

When they write the history of Skyrim modding you two should be right up there with Sheson, Boris,and Fores