Mass Effect 3

[GSBmodders]

Oh' date=' I'm also completely insane. It's official.[/quote']

 

I was going to suggest that

 

[gregathit]

I found it to be a long and complete game with more stuff feeling like it played differently depending on my choices than previous ME games. So' date=' to me, you sound like some crazy nutcase here.

[/quote']

 

Well, we shall have to disagree on pretty much everything here (except me being crazy but that is a totally separate issue) and here is why:

 

 

The game was shorter than one or two by around 10 hours if you are the type to visit every nook and cranny scanning every single world, which I do. I don't have a huge issue with this as it makes a little it of sense as you should be hurrying to gather forces to retake earth.

 

Now on the played differently front....so you pick "a" and get a war asset or "b" and get a war asset or "c" and get perhaps a large war asset. This doesn't strike me as a big deal. You make run out to planets, to grab items based on conversations you heard while ease dropping and get a war asset....again not real impressive. You see cameo's of old crew here or there....cool but not ground breaking. You have to put up with crazy sword ninja dude who you can't kill until the script allows it.....yea, pure lazy, lack of innovation there.

 

You can make peace with Geth and Quarins....AGAIN....cause in my ME2 play through I had everyone talked in this during and after the trial...not sure WTF happened on that one......oh yea, another choice that didn't carry over.

 

You can revisit the rachni again regardless of whether you killed the last queen or not. Oh, where were my rachni troops/ships for retaking earth??? More lazy bioware crap.

 

This is just stuff from the top of my head that I can remember. Yea the game is cool but it has issues in that it doesn't account for quite a few decisions that you made. All of this would be glossed over if they did as they had advertised and promised. The damn theme of the game was to retake earth and promised closure.

 

So how about we look at a few of the bioware promises:

“Experience the beginning, middle, and end of an emotional story unlike any other, where the decisions you make completely shape your experience and outcome.”

Sorry, this game isn't any different than DA2 or Baldur's Gate or even Dungeon Siege if you want to go further back. Small cameo's or war assets are not enough to make it stand out.

 

“The presence of the Rachni] has huge consequences in Mass Effect 3. Even just in the final battle with the Reapers."

Clearly this is a straight up lie. Kill the queen or let her live they are in the game and a little bit of a war asset doesn't stack up.

 

“I’m always leery of saying there are 'optimal' endings, because I think one of the things we do try to do is make different endings that are optimal for different people “

Well, we wouldn't be having this discussion if this puppy had been true now would we?

 

“And, to be honest, you [the fans] are crafting your Mass Effect story as much as we are anyway.”

Not so much on this one either. Force fed ending doesn't compute.

 

“There are many different endings. We wouldn’t do it any other way. How could you go through all three campaigns playing as your Shepard and then be forced into a bespoke ending that everyone gets? But I can’t say any more than that…”

Ah, yes...this is a rather large insert foot in mouth situation right here. If only it had been true!

 

“Every decision you've made will impact how things go. The player's also the architect of what happens."

Nope, that ending wasn't on my blueprint, that is for damn sure!

 

“You'll get answers to everything. That was one of the key things. Regardless of how we did everything, we had to say, yes, we're going to provide some answers to these people.”

Foot...in....mouth. Or head up ass, take your pick. The ending has raised more questions and speculation that the entire rest of the series. Epic Fail on this puppy.

 

“Because a lot of these plot threads are concluding and because it's being brought to a finale, since you were a part of architecting how they got to how they were, you will definitely sense how they close was because of the decisions you made and because of the decisions you didn't make”

I am guessing that receiving a war asset counts so they "kind of" covered their base here....

 

“For people who are invested in these characters and the back-story of the universe and everything, all of these things come to a resolution in Mass Effect 3. And they are resolved in a way that's very different based on what you would do in those situations.”

Again, nope. Had to find out about emily wong on twitter

Fate of those on the citadel, and the fleet and army you gathered, the rest of the galaxy.....?

And WTF happened to explaining the Dark Energy deal and the dying suns?????

 

“Fans want to make sure that they see things resolved, they want to get some closure, a great ending. I think they’re going to get that.”

Oh, my....getting closure....yea, bioware dismissed that claim.

 

“Mass Effect 3 is all about answering all the biggest questions in the lore, learning about the mysteries and the Protheans and the Reapers, being able to decide for yourself how all of these things come to an end.”

I guess that three different colors qualifies on this one......NOT!!!

And the whole "dude, we kill organics so synthetics won't kill organics" premise is so F'ing retarded that I am just not even going to go there.

The prothean DLC was actually cool. It should not have been released on day one as that sent the wrong signal to those that bought the special editions. It should have been released a week or two later.

 

Interviewer: “So are you guys the creators or the stewards of the franchise?”

Hudson: “Um… You know, at this point, I think we’re co-creators with

the fans. We use a lot of feedback.”

Well if we the fans ARE the co-creators then the whole "artistic integrity argument goes sailing out the window now doesn't it....

 

Interviewer: [Regarding the numerous possible endings of Mass Effect 2] “Is that same type of complexity built into the ending of Mass Effect 3?”

Hudson: “Yeah, and I’d say much more so, because we have the ability to build the endings out in a way that we don’t have to worry about

eventually tying them back together somewhere. This story arc is

coming to an end with this game. That means the endings can be a lot

more different. At this point we’re taking into account so many

decisions that you’ve made as a player and reflecting a lot of that

stuff. It’s not even in any way like the traditional game endings,

where you can say how many endings there are or whether you got

ending A, B, or C.....The endings have a lot more sophistication and

variety in them.”

Ah, yes.......this is a rather large, ironclad F'up here. Cause there is just an A, B or C choice ending. Anytime you throw this up at folks, be it bioware or the I love the ending, you don't get it crowd, they change the subject. Like the endings or not Casey should have duct tape on his mouth.

 

 

“We have a rule in our franchise that there is no canon. You as a player decide what your story is.”

I guess they forgot about this one with the rachni queen, or sticking Liara as your default LI in the flash backs, or Anderson not staying as the council rep and the list goes on and on and on.

Fact of the matter is bioware dug too deep of a hole and couldn't figure out how to climb out of it with all the possible permutations.

 

“The whole idea of Mass Effect3 is resolving all of the biggest questions, about the Protheons and the Reapers, and being in the driver's seat to end the galaxy and all of these big plot lines, to decide what civilizations are going to live or die: All of these things are answered in Mass Effect 3.”

Sorry, no definitive answer to any of this. Hell, we don't really know if the shock wave of the mass relays going boom wiped everyone out or not!! And for the record....we were NOT in the drivers seat for that ending...back seat driver is more like it.

 

“There is a huge set of consequences that start stacking up as you approach the end-game. And even in terms of the ending itself, it continues to break down to some very large decisions. So it's not like a classic game ending where everything is linear and you make a choice between a few things - it really does layer in many, many different choices, up to the final moments, where it's going to be different for everyone who plays it.”

Did I mention duct taping Casey's mouth.....cause this is another large, ironclad F'up right here. Everyone gets the SAME THREE ENDINGS!!!

 

 

 

In our culture' date=' it is unacceptable to ever point to the truth that intelligence is varied within the population. I get that. It's still true though. And my insults are rarely just insults. Call it brutal honesty.

[/quote']

 

[spoiler=My Retort:]

You can call it brutal honesty or a monkey fart, but rude is still rude in any damn language I can think of. Your opinion is NOT a fact and holds as little value to me as mine does to you. The sooner you get that through your head, the better off everyone will be.

 

Intelligence is a factor of a TON of things like experience, age, schooling, and environment to just hit on a few. No one person sees things the same as another, as no two people have the exact same factors that contribute. That others think your point of view is not relevant to them does NOT constitute a lack intelligence, but rather them seeing the issue from a different side then you.

 

 

 

Please forgive me of any typo's or formatting errors as I kept falling asleep at my keyboard while I typed this

[Mars]

Another beauty to the ending is that you kill hundreds of billions since when the relays explode they destroy the entire system they are in, but Bioware likely forgot that little bit of their own lore.

 

And gregathit dont be offended by this intellectual superiority our conspiracy theory logic compadre is claiming. I had a misfortune recently to have a "discussion" with a similar type who thought the moon landings were faked.

Needless to say after blowing holes in he's dizzying logic the size of a jumbo jet he claimed superiority and a deeper insight as that was the only thing he had left to hang on to regarding he's belief.

 

This whole indoctrination theory is reaching at straws and if I had the time I could convince you Sheppard was Batman by using bugs, poor design and conspiracy logic. Hmm maybe I'll make that into a video and have some gullible folks believe Bioware was actually that clever.

[gregathit]

I don't have a problem per say with the indoc theory. I DO have problem that the game ends as it does regardless of whether Shepard is indoctrinated or not. As I said before, if indoc was intended, it should have been a mid/late game mechanism that either resulted in you failing and the reapers win or you choose destroy and continue the game.

[gregathit]

Here is a pretty good vid on ME3 I snagged off of BSN. It is a bit long but is interesting take on how to fix the ending:

[video=youtube]

[Surenas]

Would it be so much trouble to take the end as granted and to wait for more detailed explanations in the upcoming DLCs?

 

To make a demand on a more pleasing, easier understandable end often leads nowhere, for misunderstood designers (like modders) easily tend to give the playing crowd the finger, especially when the crowd acts in mob fashion...

[GSBmodders]

Would it be so much trouble to take the end as granted and to wait for more detailed explanations in the upcoming DLCs?

 

To make a demand on a more pleasing' date=' easier understandable end often leads nowhere, for misunderstood designers (like modders) easily tend to give the playing crowd the finger, especially when the crowd acts in mob fashion...

[/quote']

 

it is not that people do not understand the end, it is that the end completely disregards mass effect lore, forces shepard to act out of character regardless of how you approach the game and disregards your accomplishments once you meet the spacemagicfairygodchild

 

additional clarity to this Mass Effect meets Cinderella meets Final Fantasy is not the answer. It is a step in right direction though since I would love to know how ashley williams went from lying dead at the top of a pile bodies inside the citadel to walking out of the normandy after joker

 

I also wouldnt mind knowing how grunt, jack, samara and others fared as well which to my understanding is all Bioware intends to provide answers to.

 

Even IGN Editor's are starting to take notice of Mass Effect 3's problems

http://xbox360.ign.com/articles/122/1221492p1.html

 

 

[windpl]

I also wouldnt mind knowing how grunt' date=' jack, samara and others fared[/quote']

 

That is easy, they starved to death.

It seams that Bioware didn't played half-life and didn't had idea about "unforeseen consequences"

[Jerbsinator]

thesapien, I realize that some people are going to love the ending. But if you played a game like Big Rig Over The Road Racing and loved it, that does NOT mean that everyone that criticizes for being a mess of a game are wrong, quite the opposite. An overwhelming majority hate the ending of ME3. Just because you like the ending, doesn't make that majority wrong. Fact is the current ending is a slap to the face, Bioware promised multiple endings where choices meant something, and they never delivered and that is unacceptable. Adding more to this ending doesn't change the fact that Bioware lied through their teeth and were lazy and rushed one of the most important endings to one of the most beloved franchises ever made.

[GSBmodders]

Fact is the current ending is a slap to the face' date=' Bioware promised multiple endings where choices meant something, and they never delivered and that is unacceptable.

[/quote']

 

a thread related to the stuff that got cut popped up on BSN, that shows examples from the end that did not make it in. With everything that ended up being cut the game ending it indeed would have varied greatly and would have been wildly different from any other game ending but unfortunately it all got cut and we got fucked

 

I did some digging on my own None of it seems relatded to what I found of course who ever is doing the extraction for that may be waiting to put the pieces together a bit more before posting

 

So far though it looks like liara's gift at the end was shortned. the liara pregnancy theory may be right after all, unless of course bioware shortned the scene to avoid that route there are gaps in the script that indicate something more was suposed to happen and dialog that appears to fit the scene

[thesapien]

 

And gregathit dont be offended by this intellectual superiority our conspiracy theory logic compadre is claiming. I had a misfortune recently to have a "discussion" with a similar type who thought the moon landings were faked.

Needless to say after blowing holes in he's dizzying logic the size of a jumbo jet he claimed superiority and a deeper insight as that was the only thing he had left to hang on to regarding he's belief.

 

 

I'm not one to hold to a belief simply because I used to believe it. (see this thread for an example of my inconsistencies.) I like to remember all the times I've been wrong. I can't learn by being right. Socrates, Kuhn, and similar have been my fools to listen to most. Though, I could change my mind on being inconsistent, tomorrow.

 

As to the Apollo moonwalks, I once had a deep interest in the subject and would be more than happy to debate you on the the topic. Maybe start on off topic thread?

 

Why tell someone not to be offended? I ask to go ahead and offend me. Hurt my feelings if need be. Please, never hold back with me.

[thesapien]

Would it be so much trouble to take the end as granted and to wait for more detailed explanations in the upcoming DLCs?

 

To make a demand on a more pleasing' date=' easier understandable end often leads nowhere, for misunderstood designers (like modders) easily tend to give the playing crowd the finger, especially when the crowd acts in mob fashion...

[/quote']

 

Did you ever read Extraordinary Popular Delusions and the Madness of Crouds? Twas written in 1841 and still in print. It covers examples from stock bubbles to witch hunts. History repeats when people forget or never learned.

[Surenas]

Men, it has been well said, think in herds; it will be seen that they go mad in herds...

 

Already seen that the control choice leads to indoc eyes like the one of rhe Illusive Man in ME3, quite similiar to the left of Saren in ME2? and that much on the Citadel (after the beam seq.) reminds of a deja-vu? That on continuity of the lore in the end sequence. Food for thought.

[gregathit]

Would it be so much trouble to take the end as granted and to wait for more detailed explanations in the upcoming DLCs?

 

To make a demand on a more pleasing' date=' easier understandable end often leads nowhere, for misunderstood designers (like modders) easily tend to give the playing crowd the finger, especially when the crowd acts in mob fashion...

[/quote']

 

How "should" folks react when they are lied to? Go and read post 427 in the top spoiler for a list of just "some" of the lies bioware told. Bioware lied and took our money, is it any wonder that folks are mad? I don't know of any outlet that will refund digital downloads so many PC folks are stuck.

 

Calling angry, lied to consumers a mob. Now that is quite funny. I have seen no evidence of this, so perhaps you should provide some proof before making generalized insults.

 

As to the finger......bioware gave us the finger when they force fed us that crap ending. An ending which is another F'ing lie to what was promised (again see the top spoiler in post 427).

 

Detailed explanations.....please spare me. A set of encyclopedia's can't explain away throwing all the decisions the player made and all the promises bioware made out of the window.

They can keep those explanations and do you know what with them. Give us the ending that they promised - what did they promise you ask? Go see post 427.

 

 

As I have said before, I do like the game and would be willing to overlook any of its faults if that F'ing star child had not been in the game. I would have been content with the crucible firing as Shepard sat with Anderson who was dying and the weapon fired and fade to black...then roll the credits. If I can figure out how to edit my game that is exactly what I am going to do for myself. Sure that ending damn sure doesn't provide the answers or closure as was promised but it DOES NOT raise more questions like the space-fairy-god-child-abomination.

[gregathit]

Men' date=' it has been well said, think in herds; it will be seen that they go mad in herds...[/i']

 

Just so we are all clear.....women are no better. Need proof? One goes to the bathroom and they ALL go.

 

 

[Surenas]

I fear the star child is the Shepard-to be protagonist... ^^

And no, above an IQ of 80 no gal follows the leading blonde hairdresser into the bathroom.

[windpl]

I fear the star child is the Shepard-to be protagonist... ^^

And no' date=' above an IQ of 80 no gal follows the leading blonde hairdresser into the bathroom.

[/quote']

 

Because she is alone?

[gregathit]

I fear the star child is the Shepard-to be protagonist... ^^

 

You could be right' date=' but IMHO this is a poor choice of direction to go with the series.

 

And no, above an IQ of 80 no gal follows the leading blonde hairdresser into the bathroom.

 

You quite clearly missed my sarcastic point. You made an insulting generalization and I retorted only try to point out that generalizations are lazy and more often than not end up being wrong.

[Mars]

There is no star child, the deus ex machinma character appeared in form of the kid who was on Shepards mind. The dream sequences are common in soldiers who witness something traumatic, like not being able to save someone they helped before. It's taken right out of basic psychology and they presented it rather well, including Shepards fear of death as they both burn in the last dream.

 

Another funny thing about the ending is the soldiers cheering after reapers die/leave, considering that the blown Sol relay near Pluto would destroy the whole solar system. Another "small" oversight.

 

And seriously synthetic forms come to destroy organics so they would not create synthetics who would destroy organics. Brilliant.

 

[gregathit]

Another funny thing about the ending is the soldiers cheering after reapers die/leave' date=' considering that the blown Sol relay near Pluto would destroy the whole solar system. Another "small" oversight.

[/quote']

 

One thing that most forget when they argue that the exploding relays are "dialed down" so as not to destroy the system that they are in:

The citadel is also a mass relay and is right up close to earth. No amount of "dialing down" is going to cut it. Earth is going to be obliterated by the explosion and then suffer again as the station crashes into it. This is valid for both the red and green ending.

 

This also invalidates the blue ending as in it the mass relays still blow up (smaller explosions but still parts are flying off) and the citadel DOESN'T????? Major plot hole there. Either all relays blow up or they don't...PERIOD!

 

 

 

And seriously synthetic forms come to destroy organics so they would not create synthetics who would destroy organics. Brilliant.

 

Yea' date=' this will be the "took an arrow to the knee" for ME3. Anytime someone tries to debate about the deepness of meanings for the ending I just explode with laughter as that line runs through my mind.

 

 

[GSBmodders]

Another funny thing about the ending is the soldiers cheering after reapers die/leave' date=' considering that the blown Sol relay near Pluto would destroy the whole solar system. Another "small" oversight.

[/quote']

 

One thing that most forget when they argue that the exploding relays are "dialed down" so as not to destroy the system that they are in:

The citadel is also a mass relay and is right up close to earth. No amount of "dialing down" is going to cut it. Earth is going to be obliterated by the explosion and then suffer again as the station crashes into it. This is valid for both the red and green ending.

 

This also invalidates the blue ending as in it the mass relays still blow up (smaller explosions but still parts are flying off) and the citadel DOESN'T????? Major plot hole there. Either all relays blow up or they don't...PERIOD!

 

 

 

And seriously synthetic forms come to destroy organics so they would not create synthetics who would destroy organics. Brilliant.

 

Yea' date=' this will be the "took an arrow to the knee" for ME3. Anytime someone tries to debate about the deepness of meanings for the ending I just explode with laughter as that line runs through my mind.

 

 

[/quote']

 

but didnt you get the memo/ we are apparently just to fucking stupid to buy into the ending

 

 

[Surenas]

[snip]

 

You quite clearly missed my sarcastic point. You made an insulting generalization and I retorted only try to point out that generalizations are lazy and more often than not end up being wrong.

I got your point, np, but you failed to see the irony in both the "insulting generalization" (the mob feels insulted when nabbed) and the classical blonde joke.

[gregathit]

but didnt you get the memo/ we are apparently just to fucking stupid to buy into the ending

 

 

Yea, I went in to work and told my boss he could reduce my salary by half, because I am too dense to remember to put that damn TPS cover page on all the memo's.........

 

Them's the breaks I guess.......

 

I am kinda jazzed to see what bioware does with their "big" announcement in April. Any one betting they try the ole April Fools Rick Roll on us by announcing the ending isn't really the ending buy the real DLC ending for MORE money jazz?????

 

I am just going to laugh my freaking butt off if they do something stupid and BSN goes up in flames again. Kinda morbid I know but I am at that unfeeling stage towards them right now. Those chaps over at bioware must be a bit nervous right now.

 

[GSBmodders]

I am just going to laugh my freaking butt off if they do something stupid and BSN goes up in flames again. Kinda morbid I know but I am at that unfeeling stage towards them right now. Those chaps over at bioware must be a bit nervous right now.

 

You may not need to wait till april, people are slowly starting to figure out that Bioware only intends to clarify the existing endings not change or add anything on to them.

 

So it's slowly starting to heat back up again only now the french, german and japanese communities are going through the same shit storm. They french even posted an open letter to Bioware on our BSN forum so it can be translated. I still have no idea whats going on with the russain and polish communities yet but I think it's time to grab some coffee and enjoy the show

 

 

[Nexussfire]

I am just going to laugh my freaking butt off if they do something stupid and BSN goes up in flames again. Kinda morbid I know but I am at that unfeeling stage towards them right now. Those chaps over at bioware must be a bit nervous right now.

 

You may not need to wait till april' date=' people are slowly starting to figure out that Bioware only intends to clarify the existing endings not change or add anything on to them.

 

So it's slowly starting to heat back up again only now the french, german and japanese communities are going through the same shit storm. They french even posted an open letter to Bioware on our BSN forum so it can be translated. I still have no idea whats going on with the russain and polish communities yet but I think it's time to grab some coffee and enjoy the show

 

 

[/quote']

 

"Does the phrase political sh*t storm mean anything to you?" - Udina - ME2

 

Well its not politics but they certainly have stirred one up. They either do this right or they keep their fans and customers forever gone. Thanks EA... and Bioware... shame on them... shame!! I think they should all be forced to wear the collars of shame (dogs lamp shades) till they get this right... by court ruling or something.