The Animal Mansion

[Jmathers]

I appreciate that everyone is trying to respect the original author's wishes and also give JMathers space to work. But I'm not sure there's any need for all this angst.

 

Sky_mds said, "I included all the files (scripts, source code, etc.) so if anyone wants to continue the mod, take some pieces out of it or make a better one, please feel free to do so. Anyone can take what I made and use it for their own purpose without asking for permission." He also handed over the mod itself to JMathers, but it's clear he didn't mean to make it exclusive so far as the original mod assets go. 

 

So if anyone wants to start posting bugfixes on their own, I think that's fine. If anyone wants make their own variants, that should be fine. The author has already given explicit permission. If the mod becomes unavailable (right now there seem to be a few versions available for download) anyone should be able to re-post the original version.

 

No one should repost JMather's work, including bugfixes, without his permission, of course. And common courtesy would say as long as he's doing the work, don't crowd his space. But there's no reason to feel like we lost the mod.

 

you are completely right there Bad dog, and If people want to make there own versions of the mod from sky_mds' old version.

there more then welcome to it.

 

and your also right that people should not publish my version and that is where I am having a ton of problems with at the moment.

[mybrainhurts]

@ Jmathers:

and your also right that people should not publish my version and that is where I am having a ton of problems with at the moment.

 

You're having a ton of problems with people publishing your version? Where? Where are they publishing it? It's not on LL as far as I can tell.

 

Edit: Fixed quote tags.

[razgriz416]

The ton of problems Jmathers refers to is the problems with the LL ToS/Admins.

 

The issue here is that (and I totally understand and respect the reason why) Jmathers wants to finish the mod using this thread as sky_mds had intended it to be. It makes sense that the completed version of the mod would be located here. The problem is that while Jmathers has taken up the mantle of completing this mod and using this thread until he's finished it as sky_mds would have, he can't. Either he needs to start his own thread (so he can keep his own set of permissions) and post the finished version there, or drop his no modification/no distribution permissions on the work he's done, and post it here before moving on to his own thread.

 

Alternately, sky_mds could come back and say "Only Jmathers has permission to do ______ with my mod" which would kill anyone elses mods based on The Animal Mansion that are being worked on. And since he hasn't even logged into LL in over a month, I doubt that will happen any time soon.

 

 

tl:dr;

 

The only way development of this mod can continue is either Jmathers starting his own thread, or changing his usage/distribution permissions.

 

 

[Alploochra]

Maybe I'm candid but I don't seem to grasp any issue there.

[Jmathers]

The ton of problems Jmathers refers to is the problems with the LL ToS/Admins.

 

The issue here is that (and I totally understand and respect the reason why) Jmathers wants to finish the mod using this thread as sky_mds had intended it to be. It makes sense that the completed version of the mod would be located here. The problem is that while Jmathers has taken up the mantle of completing this mod and using this thread until he's finished it as sky_mds would have, he can't. Either he needs to start his own thread (so he can keep his own set of permissions) and post the finished version there, or drop his no modification/no distribution permissions on the work he's done, and post it here before moving on to his own thread.

 

Alternately, sky_mds could come back and say "Only Jmathers has permission to do ______ with my mod" which would kill anyone elses mods based on The Animal Mansion that are being worked on. And since he hasn't even logged into LL in over a month, I doubt that will happen any time soon.

 

 

tl:dr;

 

The only way development of this mod can continue is either Jmathers starting his own thread, or changing his usage/distribution permissions.

 

 

You hit the nail on the Head.

[Bad Dog]

Huh. Then I think this is silly. Leave sky_mds's last version up in perpetuity so anyone can pick up his work and reuse it or build on it. Let JMathers add downloads that are just fixes with his own restrictions on his downloads. It may be unusual to have one download page with work done by different authors, but is it that hard?

 

If it is, create the new page for Animal Mansion Classic Version owned by JM, he puts his fixes there, and then creates another page for when he takes it in his own direction. No different than Aroused Redux where every time somebody says "Aroused!" four people say "Use Redux!". 

[razgriz416]

 

 

You hit the nail on the Head.

 

 

No offense, but while the sentiment for sky_mds' work being complete is great, and I'm sure he appreciates it. It does seem as though your needlessly tripping over your own feet.

 

 

The easiest solution it seems is moving on to your own thread, and creating two separate file downloads.

 

One for the completed version of sky_mds' mod. (ie: The Animal Mansion 1.0) and another for your continuing work (ie: The Animal Mansion Extended, or whatever =P) all with your own permissions.

[mybrainhurts]

Jmathers, I'm sorry to say that your main concern does not seem to be Animal Mansion. Your main concern seems to be establishing your dominance in 32pt red letters. You did not create this mod. You do not "own" it in any meaningful sense of the word. Otherwise you would not be having problems with LoversLab's ToS, would you?

 

Now, I am considering taking this up myself but I have one serious reservation: I am not as knowledgeable as you or sky_mds. But at least we'll have something to work on and play with. Before it comes to that, though, *please* reconsider your stance. Everyone here is ready to help and support you. You just need to be a little flexible and meet us halfway in the interest of making a great mod greater.

[tj3n123]

I maybe not understand TOS and other kind of permission bullshit, but i read from the post where jmather took the mod and say its his own, well, for seriously, i just wish anyone other than him would take care of this mod already, at first i got some hope, but now im just fucking dissapointed.

 

i rather play the mess that sky_mds left than waiting and using *perfect* version by jmather. im done.

[Jmathers]

Greetings All,

 

so I finally got an answer from the admins and I'll be taking there advice, I'm sorry for the delay but it was a rather complicated matter.

because you guys where help full and given me good advice, I will past some Pieces out of the Admin's rulling to let you know why it took so long, and that it was not on purpose.

 

the below will hopefully clearify things abit as to why I had problems because he put conditions on ME continuing the mod.

and no body else and so on.

 

Jmathers

 

 

 

---- from an admin

Sent Yesterday, 10:03 PM

 The hold-up is really due to the fact that the two statements sky_mds made in the thread's OP about what can be done with the mod seem to contradict each other. The first is a statement declaring a basic permissive approach, saying everybody can copy the mod or parts of it for whatever purpose. The other declares you the new owner, on the condition that you're nice to folks. This makes things complicated, as you must realize.

 

, and you can see that the overall picture wasn't clear enough for us to give you the clarity you asked for.

 

........ and it does become apparent that by both of sky_mds's statements, you are free to place more restrictions on your version than sky_mds placed on the original. The first statement, a basic permissive one, leaves you free to do so. The second, while problematic, does the same.

 

 

.................. giving the impression to some that the permissive rules for the original have changed. This is compounded by the second statement.

 

The idea that you're the 'owner' as long as you're 'nice' can't be given as much worth as the very clear, and earlier, statement that people can use the original for whatever purpose. The earlier one has to take precedence. You can choose to be nice to folks, it's obviously preferred, but as a condition for being able to use copies of something, it isn't solid at all. It's not objectively verifiable and thus arbitrary, unfair to you, especially because it only applies to you personally. Anyone else could copy some assets from the original, going by the first statement, and not be nice. You started work on your version being at liberty to do so because everyone was given that liberty, and the conclusion must be that this liberty is still in place for yourself, as well as for any other modder.

 

...............................................................................

 

[spoonsinger]

 

Greetings All,

 

so I finally got an answer from the admins and I'll be taking there advice, I'm sorry for the delay but it was a rather complicated matter.

because you guys where help full and given me good advice, I will past some Pieces out of the Admin's rulling to let you know why it took so long, and that it was not on purpose.

 

the below will hopefully clearify things abit as to why I had problems because he put conditions on ME continuing the mod.

and no body else and so on.

 

Jmathers

 

 

 

---- from an admin

Sent Yesterday, 10:03 PM

 The hold-up is really due to the fact that the two statements sky_mds made in the thread's OP about what can be done with the mod seem to contradict each other. The first is a statement declaring a basic permissive approach, saying everybody can copy the mod or parts of it for whatever purpose. The other declares you the new owner, on the condition that you're nice to folks. This makes things complicated, as you must realize.

 

, and you can see that the overall picture wasn't clear enough for us to give you the clarity you asked for.

 

........ and it does become apparent that by both of sky_mds's statements, you are free to place more restrictions on your version than sky_mds placed on the original. The first statement, a basic permissive one, leaves you free to do so. The second, while problematic, does the same.

 

 

.................. giving the impression to some that the permissive rules for the original have changed. This is compounded by the second statement.

 

The idea that you're the 'owner' as long as you're 'nice' can't be given as much worth as the very clear, and earlier, statement that people can use the original for whatever purpose. The earlier one has to take precedence. You can choose to be nice to folks, it's obviously preferred, but as a condition for being able to use copies of something, it isn't solid at all. It's not objectively verifiable and thus arbitrary, unfair to you, especially because it only applies to you personally. Anyone else could copy some assets from the original, going by the first statement, and not be nice. You started work on your version being at liberty to do so because everyone was given that liberty, and the conclusion must be that this liberty is still in place for yourself, as well as for any other modder.

 

...............................................................................

 

 

The 'admin' sure does talk pretty. (IGMC).

 

[Jmathers]

lol? huh?

i removed his name for his privacy,

and that i cut alot of things out of his final post hence alot of "........." 

[spoonsinger]

lol? huh?

i removed his name for his privacy,

and that i cut alot of things out of his final post hence alot of "........." 

 

Re: - "i removed his name for his privacy,"

 

Yep I understood that. Oh!, never mind. Keep up the good works, (both of you).

[Jmathers]

Well, I'm taking the Admin's advice & suggestion right now.

[Jmathers]

To All Users Using My Modded version of "The Animal Mansion"

 

Please Delete my modded version Immediately and downgrade to v0.6e by Sky_mds

 

I will NOT be updating "The Animal Mansion" mod anymore.

 

By Suggestion of the Administration on LL.

 

Thank You.  

 

 

 

Respectfully

 

JMathers

 

 

[yolobomber]

To All Users Using My Modded version of "The Animal Mansion"

 

Please Delete my version and downgrade to v0.6e

 

I will NOT be updating "The Animal Mansion" mod anymore.

 

By Suggestion of the Administration on LL.

 

Thank You.  

 

 

 

Respectfully

 

JMathers

Well that esculated quickly, I must say I don't understand this whole situation for a long time...

I don't quite know why this is all that hard.

As a mod liek sexllab aroused and sexlab aroused redux have no problems. 

That sky_mds commented it 'wrong'on the main topic is just a shame, But not a problem as you don't have to be the "owner"of the mod but jsut somebody like all other peaple that is free to edit and make a new version of it. Like a redux mod.

[Jmathers]

@yolo bomber

 

not really, I been in discussions with Administrators for over a month now in regards to Sky_mds terms and conditions.

and I took the best advice, the Administrators suggested to me.

 

while it is regretable at best, They and I, agree it is the best course of action.

 

please read up for more clearifications, as to why. 

[spoonsinger]

That's sad. You obviously have talent and still seem to have an interest. Any idea what you are going to do next? (for ideas on how to progress ref "the whole Fertile Breeder for Fallout:NV being an all new version of the fallen by the wayside Sexout Breeder" thing. Same idea in that case but done differently).

[Jmathers]

That's sad. You obviously have talent and still seem to have an interest. Any idea what you are going to do next? (for ideas on how to progress ref "the whole Fertile Breeder for Fallout:NV being an all new version of the fallen by the wayside Sexout Breeder" thing. Same idea in that case but done differently).

 

 

I prefer not to comment as of yet what I will do next.

and yes, i still do have interest but lets not go there just now.

[Bad Dog]

All too bad, perhaps, but here's hoping JMathers takes his own ideas and turns them into a great mod. For those who think he's slightly whacked about sharing: Yabbut, creative people b creative, yo. If he can't feel like he can be creative when everyone else is mucking with his stuff (conceptually or actually), he can't -- and no one else can change that. So maybe this is best. As the admin above said, he's just as free as anyone to take the AM assets and do his own thing with them.

[Whizkid]

all that drama, i mean if you arent even interested in sharing why put up your hand in the first place.....

[spoonsinger]

all that drama, i mean if you arent even interested in sharing why put up your hand in the first place.....

 

There is an etiquette. However in this case it's seems it went into a grey area. Probably not helpful to us nonpaying consumers - who spend hours trying to frig installs together to make them work -  but it was still an issue within the terms. Now whether this situation could haven been brokered in a more sympathetic manner is probably just hindsight at this point.

 

[Jmathers]

All too bad, perhaps, but here's hoping JMathers takes his own ideas and turns them into a great mod. For those who think he's slightly whacked about sharing: Yabbut, creative people b creative, yo. If he can't feel like he can be creative when everyone else is mucking with his stuff (conceptually or actually), he can't -- and no one else can change that. So maybe this is best. As the admin above said, he's just as free as anyone to take the AM assets and do his own thing with them.

 

 

I've actually been working on a new mod of my own design,

while waiting for an answer on This mod, grant you its still in early early alpha but, I think It'll be interesting.

[mybrainhurts]

Please Delete my modded version Immediately and downgrade to v0.6e or v0.6f by Sky_mds

 

Where is version 0.6f? The download page has only versions 0.6c, 0.6d, and 0.6e.

[FinalCloud]

 

FROM NOW ON THE USER

 

Jmathers

 

OWNS THE MOD AND HAS MY PERMISSION TO DO WHATEVER HE WANTS TO DO WITH IT AS LONG AS INTERACTION WITH OTHER USERS ON THIS FORUM HAPPENS IN A CIVILIZED AND FRIENDLY MANNER.

 

Heh pretty damng confusing, you would think that this statement on the main page would be pretty conclusive. Sad to hear. Look forward to seeing your own mod!