Arachnophobia

[Kazyn]

Unfortunately, I don't think logs are going to tell me anything in this case. Let me get this part straight, at least: The spider only comes to check on you as you struggle. Basically what's going on under the hood is that the spider has a random chance of appearing after every key press. So leaving yourself hanging is definitely not going to cause it to appear. However, I think you've also said that you've mashed buttons before while hanging around. Now, you're either very lucky, have a high sneak skill, or something is indeed going wrong with your input not registering against the spider.

 

However, what's raised my eyebrow is that it behaves the first time for you - that is, subsequent captures are where the spider decides "eh, not feeling it this time!" Am I understanding you correctly?

[xir1111011]

Almost entirely correct.

 

I have mashed buttons for a number of minutes and nothing's happened (I'm doing this all at level one, by the way, so all my skills are more or less at their minimum value). See, thing is, the first time I ever booted up the game with the mod and all prerequisite mods installed, everything was seeming to work properly. I was caught, tied up, I started escaping, and periodically the spider would come around to check on me. During this run, though, I actually managed to escape the web. The problem was, I escaped during a spider check-up, so it was literally right next to me as I got out. It defeated me again, and I was re-wrapped and hung. The same thing happened. Sensing a repeating loop, I decided to load my previous save file (just before the spiders attacked me the first time), and try again after adjusting the mod difficulty to be harder (I increased the amount of webbing slider). This time, the spiders were not hostile. They would not attack me until I attacked them first. So I did, I attacked them, they won again, and again I was sent to the spider's lair, wrapped, and hung. This time, however, no matter how much I struggled, the periodic spider visit would not happen. I escaped the webbing, and (with no resistance in the cave to speak of) started walking around. Realizing that this was too easy, I loaded the save file again. I tried again, and the same result.

 

Since then, I've not been able to get the spider to check up on me while I'm hanging in the cave, seemingly no matter what I do. I've tried creating new characters, I've tried increasing the difficulty all the way (in terms of the amount of webbing)... nothing seems to get the spider to show up.

Okay, wait, there was one exception. Once, during this investigation, I got a character to the cave, hanging and wrapped, and started mashing buttons all which ways, so I made no progress. I went to the Death Alternative Mod menu and used the utility, "Reset Current Quests (Cheat)" option. I clicked it, and left the menu, then went back to button mashing.

 

The spider did appear once, and wrapped me in more webbing as I chose to continue struggling. However, that was the last I'd seen of it, no matter how much button mashing I did.

[Kazyn]

The wonky things that happen to you are the reason I rarely release updates for the mod publicly. It's also part of the reason I've kicked around various rewrites and builds that haven't seen the light of day. This, plus the unpredictable behavior of Skyrim's papyrus engine make for some strange encounters.

 

All I can really say right now is thank you for your "testing." I don't believe there's much going wrong on your end, if anything at all. A rewrite has been in the works for some time, and well... the mod's going to be going even further back to basics as I try implement a more modular approach to this.

[xir1111011]

Honestly, I don't mind testing the heck out of stuff, I'm just really happy that you haven't stopped work on this mod. It's an awesome idea, and for those who it works for, I'm sure it's an awesome mod in general!

Anything I can do from here on out to help you out or provide any kind of information, please don't hesitate to PM me, or throw a request up here. All I ask is that you don't give up on the idea.

[TemporalWolfwing]

This mod is creative as all hell, well done. I do have one question though: What would the escape 'buttons' be if rather than using the keyboard someone is using an xbox controller?

[Kazyn]

This mod is creative as all hell, well done. I do have one question though: What would the escape 'buttons' be if rather than using the keyboard someone is using an xbox controller?

Controllers use analog input to determine directional movement on your character. That said, there is no equivalent input on a control without manually rebinding your controller's buttons to be up, down, left and right.

 

Long story short, the mod does not support controllers.

 

Why does it not support controllers? Because I honestly don't know how. If someone knows how, please let me know and I'll look into implementing it.

[MechaUnitRaven]

I agree with dropping DA. I've looked around, cus anytime I bleedout using DA it CTDs, and it seems to be a bit of a common problem, even when you have JUST the needed mods.

[bleeb]

I agree with dropping DA. I've looked around, cus anytime I bleedout using DA it CTDs, and it seems to be a bit of a common problem, even when you have JUST the needed mods.

 

Yeah I get crashes with it now with Death Alternative now, or it flat out doesn't work once bleedout is entered. several times I've gone into bleedout, and then recovered, and the spiders are no longer hostile. So I can run around past them, or stand next to them without any threat. That's when it doesn't crash during bleedout.

[323starlight]

 

I agree with dropping DA. I've looked around, cus anytime I bleedout using DA it CTDs, and it seems to be a bit of a common problem, even when you have JUST the needed mods.

Yeah I get crashes with it now with Death Alternative now, or it flat out doesn't work once bleedout is entered. several times I've gone into bleedout, and then recovered, and the spiders are no longer hostile. So I can run around past them, or stand next to them without any threat. That's when it doesn't crash during bleedout.

I have to agree as well. Ill admit my computer isn't the best for playing Skyrim but whenever I try the latest. Erosions, my game always crashes when my character bleedsout via DA.

 

I agree with dropping DA. I've looked around, cus anytime I bleedout using DA it CTDs, and it seems to be a bit of a common problem, even when you have JUST the needed mods.

Yeah I get crashes with it now with Death Alternative now, or it flat out doesn't work once bleedout is entered. several times I've gone into bleedout, and then recovered, and the spiders are no longer hostile. So I can run around past them, or stand next to them without any threat. That's when it doesn't crash during bleedout.

I'm having the same problem.

[Kazyn]

It's a funny thing about DA: It either works amazingly for people, or it barely works at all if any for others. My personal review of the author's code looks to be pretty sound to me but I'm also careful about what mods I install that may possibly conflict with the framework. Not saying anyone here isn't being careful, but considering DA is a core component in my load order, I have to make sure it's working right.

 

That said, the older version is still available and works (to the best of my knowledge anyway) for those who don't want a DA version of it.

[Yuni]

This mod is hot,a nd I also agree with dropping Death Alternative. Death alternative just has me die... should this mod be listed anywhere in DA's config? Does it have to be a WILD Frostbite spider, or can I just spawn one with the console? Hard to test if I can't spawn one.

 

Edit: I tried spawning one of the spiders from YOUR mod and it still just kills me. Are there specific settings needed in Defeat Alternative for this to function? I get the feeling that the reason most people have wildly varying results is that there are quite a few different options to tweak in Death Alternative, and it's one of these options, somewhere in here, that passes control over to your mod, and I don't know which one it is.

 

Defeat would seem... to be an easier tie-in to me.

[Kazyn]

Assuming you're using the latest version:

1. Death alternative must first be started in the MCM by selecting the appropriate option.

2. Another option right beneath DA's startup option is a Register option, which registers all possible scenarios loaded, both for DA and other mods using DA.

3. Check that DA has loaded this mod properly in the blackout scenario options section in the MCM. If Arachnophobia pops up, DA's registered its presence successfully.

[Yuni]

Assuming you're using the latest version:

1. Death alternative must first be started in the MCM by selecting the appropriate option.

2. Another option right beneath DA's startup option is a Register option, which registers all possible scenarios loaded, both for DA and other mods using DA.

3. Check that DA has loaded this mod properly in the blackout scenario options section in the MCM. If Arachnophobia pops up, DA's registered its presence successfully.

 

Yes, latest version. 1 and 2 are successful, I do both of those, but..

 

Step 3 does not work. I see no 'Arachnaphobia' checkbox on the Blackout scenarios page. It doesn't seem to want to register Arachnaphobia for some reason... here's my papyrus, if it helps. This would explain why some people can't get it to work, it's difficulty in getting DA to register your mod.

 

Papyrus.0.log

[Kazyn]

 

Yes, latest version. 1 and 2 are successful, I do both of those, but..

 

Step 3 does not work. I see no 'Arachnaphobia' checkbox on the Blackout scenarios page. It doesn't seem to want to register Arachnaphobia for some reason... here's my papyrus, if it helps. This would explain why some people can't get it to work, it's difficulty in getting DA to register your mod.

 

Which version are you using? There's an old one: 

-Version 0.10.1 which doesn't require DA nor interacts with it.

-Version 0.21 is the DA version.

 

Either version works (I think - at least it did for me, dunno about other people) but 0.21 registers with DA.

 

That said if you want a version without DA, feel free to use that old one. I'm heavily looking at reverting back to that one anyway. With that said, kindly report any problems you have with it so I know what needs fixing. I didn't have any problems on my end with that previous version (with the exception of followers because followers SUCK, sometimes, but yeah...).

 

However: The ZaZ pack has gotten some updates since that old-old version (0.10.1) so some things may look or behave oddly. Again, if you do use it, let me know what you experience

 

(That applies to anyone else reading this too.)

[Yuni]

I seee. Ah well, I wanted to try the escaping minigame from the new one, with the rotational keys, and trying to play quiet when the spider came to check on me. I'll poke ya if I have problems with the old version, and use it.

[Kazyn]

Well yes, that isn't available in the older version unfortunately.

[skyrimdragon]

I haven't heard any news on this in a while... hopefully the mod's progress hasn't stopped? I've been using this from time to time when I want a challenge and I don't want to use my controller, but I'm curious to know how far it has developped since the last time I checked in.

[Kazyn]

I haven't heard any news on this in a while... hopefully the mod's progress hasn't stopped? I've been using this from time to time when I want a challenge and I don't want to use my controller, but I'm curious to know how far it has developped since the last time I checked in.

 

I'd like to progress on it, the problem is that I haven't planned out this mod very well and frankly I'm not sure what I do or don't like about it. I've been hesitant to work on it as a result. It's a nasty form of indecision that has ultimately cost it many an update, but wugh, I just don't know what to do anymore.

[Nazzzgul666]

 

I haven't heard any news on this in a while... hopefully the mod's progress hasn't stopped? I've been using this from time to time when I want a challenge and I don't want to use my controller, but I'm curious to know how far it has developped since the last time I checked in.

 

I'd like to progress on it, the problem is that I haven't planned out this mod very well and frankly I'm not sure what I do or don't like about it. I've been hesitant to work on it as a result. It's a nasty form of indecision that has ultimately cost it many an update, but wugh, I just don't know what to do anymore.

 

You could publish some of your thoughts what could be done and/or ask us for input. I think has has worked very well for some other mods, collect suggestions and ideas, see if you like some of them and if you can do them, drop everything else. Which reminds me that i still have to write a more detailed story line for the dark "amorous adventures" mod vinfamy is planning.

[323starlight]

You know, when you finally add the draugr and wispmother additions, you could change the name of the mod to Perils of Skyrim.

[iorelsan]

You know, when you finally add the draugr and wispmother additions, you could change the name of the mod to Perils of Skyrim.

 

Hahahaha I like that idea very much =)

[ingeloak]

this mod does not work well with Smart Spells, especially if you have auto-cast heals set up for a health percentage. i wanted to see the cocooning in action, so i kept my followers at home and wandered into a spider den alone.

 

i let them surround me and they were spitting poison and whacking on me with their legs. finally i got paralyzed and went down. i waited to see the cocoon animation, but they just kept beating on me. i thought the cocoon would proc as soon as you went down, but no; it has to be defeat. my spell kept bringing me to full health when i dropped below 50%

 

 

perhaps modify this mod to entangle victims when they are rendered helpless by paralysis? it makes more sense, and would work with followers who heal (like Vilja) and mods that auto-cast certain spells. not sure if it's possible, but it's a good idea.

[Kazyn]

In the old version, entanglement began on hit from a bite attack or the spit attacks. In the current version, it is only on hit, and then it occurs once defeated. As for mod compatibility, I've never heard of Smart Spells, but I could see why something like that would be incompatible or otherwise wonky. Followers are still something I still struggle to track, but I also don't have plans to implement anything for mods that add followers that have their own follower system. If I ever get vanilla-system followers working, I MAY consider messing around with EFF. I don't think I'll go any further than that.

 

Right now, I'm leaning toward reverting it back to on-hit because it made the combat a wee bit more engaging - in fact I'm pretty much set on it. I've begun laying out some groundwork for me to worth with that allows for multiple disabling effects on the player character (but right now it's not playing nice with NPCs). This allows for future effects to be implemented by other enemies in the far future, but also to streamline the entangling and escape process. More on that as it begins to take better shape.

[gilgameshmkii]

Yes, the previous versions had nice impact on gameplay and npc interaction. It was also interesting when the entanglement was instant after 1st hit, getting surprise sniped by a spider you didn't see was really interesting compared to how the rest of the game plays - unique threat. Besides, daymoyl has a tendency to behave badly (at least from my experience).

I don't know if it's within your abilities to introduce special spiders that entangle with 1 hit or have an option in mcm that makes them do that, but it would be nice to see since it provides unique challenge instead of brainessly hacking at hp meatsacks.

[Kazyn]

Hacking at damage sponges is one of many problems Skyrim has with its enemies. Block an attack, make an attack. Repeat until one of you dies. There were no special mechanics or approaches you needed to make toward any target in particular except MAYBE a troll (lol-attack-it-with-fire-kDone ... probably could've beat it to death anyway). Like, this technique works on even dragons - this is all assuming you're not running any mods that alter the behavior of any enemies, of course, but you get my point.

 

The DA version of this mod basically reinstates this recurring problem and probably even just adds a frustrating mechanic: Paralysis, which you can do nothing about except wait it out. Does this paralysis make spiders more dangerous? Yes, but not in a fun and engaging way.