Arachnophobia

DonQuiWho · May 7, 2017

@ Kazyn

Thanks for the reply

'b - The spiders' 'spit' being lobbed at the PC last time all seemed greenish, no white stuff. This time white stuff was fired over the water and the PC went down cocooned straight away. Spiders then came in to attack OK and after a while dragged PC away. So I guess it's probably OK (I tested the Zaz implementation at the same gamepoint start with 0.3 and the cocoons were OK there too

Something's messing with your textures and meshes in the ZAZ pack it sounds like. Nothing green over here.'

I may not have explained that too well

I'm not talking about the PC when cocooned. The cocoons are all white. So that sounds all OK

What I meant was that when my PC stands at about 50 to 100 metres from the spider (in these tests small/medium Frostbite ones), on the other side of a piece of water that they seem unable to wade through, the spiders spit 'gobs' of stuff that hurtle through the air towards the PC. Some of those are greenish and, on hit, poison the PC. Some are whitish and, on hit, cocoon the PC. I thought that was how it was meant to be

Is that different to what you 'see'/how your game plays? If it is, it's very possible we are talking at completely cross purposes

wookiee27 · May 7, 2017

Is this going to progress into a spider rape dungeon? Asking for a friend.

Kazyn · May 8, 2017

From the mod description:

"1) This mod is not, never was and never will include any sort of sex from spiders. "

Kazyn · May 8, 2017

What I meant was that when my PC stands at about 50 to 100 metres from the spider (in these tests small/medium Frostbite ones), on the other side of a piece of water that they seem unable to wade through, the spiders spit 'gobs' of stuff that hurtle through the air towards the PC. Some of those are greenish and, on hit, poison the PC. Some are whitish and, on hit, cocoon the PC. I thought that was how it was meant to be

Is that different to what you 'see'/how your game plays? If it is, it's very possible we are talking at completely cross purposes

It sounds as though something in your load order is adding spider attacks together. It may even be possible that your load order is merging attacks from one mod or another - though I know of no mods that do that (but that doesn't mean they don't exist).

This mod does what it can to avoid altering vanilla records where possible, but of course some modifications will ultimately be made somewhere in there (or else it wouldn't be a mod(ification), would it? : P ) With that said, the only modifications made to vanilla (that I can recall at this very late hour) are the magic effects added to the spider attacks. Those additions are the entanglement. The other modification to those same attacks are the nerf in their poison damage and duration. The spiders themselves are unaltered.

So with that said, in my game, there is only one spit attack and the rest are the spider's various claw and bite attacks.

DonQuiWho · May 8, 2017

What I meant was that when my PC stands at about 50 to 100 metres from the spider (in these tests small/medium Frostbite ones), on the other side of a piece of water that they seem unable to wade through, the spiders spit 'gobs' of stuff that hurtle through the air towards the PC. Some of those are greenish and, on hit, poison the PC. Some are whitish and, on hit, cocoon the PC. I thought that was how it was meant to be

Is that different to what you 'see'/how your game plays? If it is, it's very possible we are talking at completely cross purposes

It sounds as though something in your load order is adding spider attacks together. It may even be possible that your load order is merging attacks from one mod or another - though I know of no mods that do that (but that doesn't mean they don't exist).

This mod does what it can to avoid altering vanilla records where possible, but of course some modifications will ultimately be made somewhere in there (or else it wouldn't be a mod(ification), would it? : P ) With that said, the only modifications made to vanilla (that I can recall at this very late hour) are the magic effects added to the spider attacks. Those additions are the entanglement. The other modification to those same attacks are the nerf in their poison damage and duration. The spiders themselves are unaltered.

So with that said, in my game, there is only one spit attack and the rest are the spider's various claw and bite attacks.

@Kazyn

Thank you for your patience with my queries over the last few days. Many would be less kind

Being a total non techie, I have no real idea why things may look, or even just feel, different from one person's set up to another. Other than perhaps, as this is Skyrim, and as my tests were done on a Saturday, my setup on that day of the week may be more weird than yours

Leaving all such basically irrelevant issues aside, I still really like your innovative adaptation of these creepy crawlies capabilities, and your mod is something I would unhesitatingly recommend to anyone who might consider trying this out.

I look forward to experiencing many more yards of refined silk in the days to come

TheBoredGamer492 · May 9, 2017

Hey Kazyn,

I really like the new combat system with webbing and all! but I've seem to run into some issues.

1. Followers dont usually get entangled when you are caught inside the cave. They've been kinda just standing there.

2. I've seem to also run into a bug where I get transferred to the cave instantly upon PC entanglement but, then the screen goes black and I don't think the quest ever loads.

Note: this was done after I just got out of the cave recently.

Any help would be appreciated!

Kazyn · May 9, 2017

Hey Kazyn,

I really like the new combat system with webbing and all! but I've seem to run into some issues.

1. Followers dont usually get entangled when you are caught inside the cave. They've been kinda just standing there.

2. I've seem to also run into a bug where I get transferred to the cave instantly upon PC entanglement but, then the screen goes black and I don't think the quest ever loads.

Note: this was done after I just got out of the cave recently.

Any help would be appreciated!

1. My vanilla-system follower that isn't Serana gets entangled every time - though I'm trying to track down a bug where their webbing doesn't appear on them. I cannot reproduce your issue above, however.

2. Do me a favor for this one and check if the quest is still running after you leave the cave. This can be done by typing the following into the console:

getQuestRunning kzy_arachnophobia

It'll return either a

GetQuestRunning >> 0.00 Indicating it's not running

or a

getQuestRunning >> 1.00 Indicating that it is running

Let me know what you get, should it occur again.

*Content Consumer* · May 9, 2017

@Kazyn, I found a good spot for a cave in the Rift. But I couldn't remember where the Arachnophobia cave was situated, and I didn't want to overwrite it or conflict with your cave entrance. So I opened up Arachnophobia and I can't find your external exit. It looks like all Arachnophobia does when you exit the cell is stop the quest?

My question now is, how do you exit the spider's lair? And where do you end up?

CptMurphy · May 9, 2017

Hey,

just tried the new update, I like the idea with the combat webbing but after getting hit by the spit I don't get the chance to struggle out of the webbing, I simply get the lose consciousness screen and I'm transfered to the cave.

The rest works fine and nice work so far!

TheBoredGamer492 · May 9, 2017

Hey Kazyn,

I really like the new combat system with webbing and all! but I've seem to run into some issues.

1. Followers dont usually get entangled when you are caught inside the cave. They've been kinda just standing there.

2. I've seem to also run into a bug where I get transferred to the cave instantly upon PC entanglement but, then the screen goes black and I don't think the quest ever loads.

Note: this was done after I just got out of the cave recently.

Any help would be appreciated!

1. My vanilla-system follower that isn't Serana gets entangled every time - though I'm trying to track down a bug where their webbing doesn't appear on them. I cannot reproduce your issue above, however.

2. Do me a favor for this one and check if the quest is still running after you leave the cave. This can be done by typing the following into the console:

getQuestRunning kzy_arachnophobia

It'll return either a

GetQuestRunning >> 0.00 Indicating it's not running

or a

getQuestRunning >> 1.00 Indicating that it is running

Let me know what you get, should it occur again.

Okay, so I fixed the issue #2 by just cleaning the save and deleting the scripts it created to reload it. It works as intended now!

and then for #1 I'm currently running 2 Followers using EFF. Does the mod work with custom followers as well? My 2 followers are Sofia and Tania, but I'm thinking it has something to do with EFF. Ill keep ya updated on what I find out!

Kazyn · May 9, 2017

@Kazyn, I found a good spot for a cave in the Rift. But I couldn't remember where the Arachnophobia cave was situated, and I didn't want to overwrite it or conflict with your cave entrance. So I opened up Arachnophobia and I can't find your external exit. It looks like all Arachnophobia does when you exit the cell is stop the quest?

My question now is, how do you exit the spider's lair? And where do you end up?

It USED to let you out in an area north of Whiterun. It's actually a path (not snowy) leading between the Pale and Whiterun holds. However, I've removed that. It will probably come back, however, when I get around to making additional caves. That said, when you find the place in Rift, let me know! I need to start finding various points to scatter caves.

Right now, the cave actually doesn't lead "anywhere" per se, but rather it attempts to drop you off at the entrance of the place you originally went down at - basically, you're getting back to it and now you've arrived back at your original place of adventure before you were so rudely interrupted.

This is accomplished by a trigger volume that the player enters near the exit of the cave.

Hey,

just tried the new update, I like the idea with the combat webbing but after getting hit by the spit I don't get the chance to struggle out of the webbing, I simply get the lose consciousness screen and I'm transfered to the cave.

The rest works fine and nice work so far!

I need more details. If you get hit, does the meter appear below your compass? If so, how far does it fill?

Hey Kazyn,

I really like the new combat system with webbing and all! but I've seem to run into some issues.

1. Followers dont usually get entangled when you are caught inside the cave. They've been kinda just standing there.

2. I've seem to also run into a bug where I get transferred to the cave instantly upon PC entanglement but, then the screen goes black and I don't think the quest ever loads.

Note: this was done after I just got out of the cave recently.

Any help would be appreciated!

1. My vanilla-system follower that isn't Serana gets entangled every time - though I'm trying to track down a bug where their webbing doesn't appear on them. I cannot reproduce your issue above, however.

2. Do me a favor for this one and check if the quest is still running after you leave the cave. This can be done by typing the following into the console:

getQuestRunning kzy_arachnophobia

It'll return either a

GetQuestRunning >> 0.00 Indicating it's not running

or a

getQuestRunning >> 1.00 Indicating that it is running

Let me know what you get, should it occur again.

Okay, so I fixed the issue #2 by just cleaning the save and deleting the scripts it created to reload it. It works as intended now!

and then for #1 I'm currently running 2 Followers using EFF. Does the mod work with custom followers as well? My 2 followers are Sofia and Tania, but I'm thinking it has something to do with EFF. Ill keep ya updated on what I find out!

Good to know #2 was fixed. As for your followers, the mod description says it doesn't play nice with followers outside of the Vanilla system or vanilla followers that don't normally follow the vanilla system such as Serana. However, I would like to work on getting support for those followers, I just don't know how to do it yet. With that said, EFF is the mod I'm looking at starting with, but that's a bit further down the line. So for now, the system works with the basic of basic vanilla followers only. Any other followers may and probably will produce unexpected results.

DonQuiWho · May 10, 2017

Good to know #2 was fixed. As for your followers, the mod description says it doesn't play nice with followers outside of the Vanilla system or vanilla followers that don't normally follow the vanilla system such as Serana. However, I would like to work on getting support for those followers, I just don't know how to do it yet. With that said, EFF is the mod I'm looking at starting with, but that's a bit further down the line. So for now, the system works with the basic of basic vanilla followers only. Any other followers may and probably will produce unexpected results.

FWIW, I tried 0.31 again today, with a follower who I took into battle with my PC.

I use the original version of AFT for preference (I have tried the redux version but find the dialogue command structure doesn't feel as comprehensive as the older, albeit more time consuming, style . Combat settings were 'Bow and Arrow', ie no magic, and with that, everything seemed to work fine. Follower went down in web on spit hit, and if managed to kill the spider horde, freed the PC if she was webbed. T/f to 'Reprieve' was OK, subject to what seem to be my set up's idiosyncratic glitches.

As AFT may be more current than EFF, especially given that there is the the redux version, might be worth starting with that? But I have no real idea if there is any huge difference to the underlying mechanics, so you might be as well as just toss a coin

Hope that adds to the knowledge base, if nothing much else

*Content Consumer* · May 10, 2017

@Kazyn, I found a good spot for a cave in the Rift. But I couldn't remember where the Arachnophobia cave was situated, and I didn't want to overwrite it or conflict with your cave entrance. So I opened up Arachnophobia and I can't find your external exit. It looks like all Arachnophobia does when you exit the cell is stop the quest?

My question now is, how do you exit the spider's lair? And where do you end up?

It USED to let you out in an area north of Whiterun. It's actually a path (not snowy) leading between the Pale and Whiterun holds. However, I've removed that. It will probably come back, however, when I get around to making additional caves. That said, when you find the place in Rift, let me know! I need to start finding various points to scatter caves.

Right now, the cave actually doesn't lead "anywhere" per se, but rather it attempts to drop you off at the entrance of the place you originally went down at - basically, you're getting back to it and now you've arrived back at your original place of adventure before you were so rudely interrupted.

This is accomplished by a trigger volume that the player enters near the exit of the cave.

Whiterun, eh? I could have sworn it was in the Rift.

I'll frequently find good spots for various kinds of locations as I wander, but I rarely remember to note the actual location. I sometimes remember to take a screenshot though.

Here are a couple of good ones that I have screenshots for:

The first is somewhere between Raldbthar and Uttering Hills Cave. I think it's on the ledge just above Uttering Hills and back a bit.

https://srmap.uesp.net/?locx=98887&locy=21730&zoom=16&showcells=true

The second is in the Rift, pretty close to Ivarstead. Just north of the road here IIRC.

https://srmap.uesp.net/?locx=89623&locy=-76606&zoom=16&showcells=true

I don't have a map for the third one, but a cave could go here:

The problem is, I'd be willing to bet that some other mod takes that spot. It's an excellent spot for almost any sort of thing you'd want to build.

There are two more good cave spots in the Rift that I know of right off, but I'm using both.

There are lots of good off-road spots in the Reach, even though some spots are a bit more vertical than I'd like. The Rift is a good spot to find cave-entrance locations too. I generally try to stay away from snowy areas when playing, so I'm not as familiar with those spots, but the Pale and Winterhold have some good areas.

Something that always sticks in my mind is that there are about a dozen really good spots on the way up the mountain to High Hrothgar.

Whiterun hold has a few good spots, but not very many - too open and flat, most of it. Of course, I'm talking about natural crevices that can very easily be converted - a couple in the Rift only need like an autoload door and that's about it - but you could always build up a cave entrance a la Beastess Lairs.

Kazyn · May 10, 2017

Good to know #2 was fixed. As for your followers, the mod description says it doesn't play nice with followers outside of the Vanilla system or vanilla followers that don't normally follow the vanilla system such as Serana. However, I would like to work on getting support for those followers, I just don't know how to do it yet. With that said, EFF is the mod I'm looking at starting with, but that's a bit further down the line. So for now, the system works with the basic of basic vanilla followers only. Any other followers may and probably will produce unexpected results.

FWIW, I tried 0.31 again today, with a follower who I took into battle with my PC.

I use the original version of AFT for preference (I have tried the redux version but find the dialogue command structure doesn't feel as comprehensive as the older, albeit more time consuming, style . Combat settings were 'Bow and Arrow', ie no magic, and with that, everything seemed to work fine. Follower went down in web on spit hit, and if managed to kill the spider horde, freed the PC if she was webbed. T/f to 'Reprieve' was OK, subject to what seem to be my set up's idiosyncratic glitches.

As AFT may be more current than EFF, especially given that there is the the redux version, might be worth starting with that? But I have no real idea if there is any huge difference to the underlying mechanics, so you might be as well as just toss a coin

Hope that adds to the knowledge base, if nothing much else

The follower freeing the PC while webbed is fixed in the upcoming update. Not sure if I mentioned that previously a few posts back but it's noted. To add to that, kicking the spider looks to also be fixed but needs further testing to confirm.

The reason I'd focus on EFF is because it's by Expired, the author of RaceMenu. I also am running mods in my load order that actually recognizes EFF if it is running, so in my case, I'd be killing a few birds with one stone. That's not to say AFT sucks or is otherwise not worth looking at, but it's still something I'd like to get going.

Regardless, neither EFF, AFT or any follower extension mod is high on my list of priorities right now.

Some definitely good spots there. In fact it's given me some ideas for the actual layouts of the lairs. Might get started on those new locations while the idea is fresh in my mind...

But yes, the lair was originally in Whiterun if not the Pale. It was still a green area just as it starts to get mountainous. Think the area north of Silent Moons Camp. In fact that may have even been it.

If other mods are found to conflict with things being placed in the same location, I'd be okay with simply relocating the entrance and calling it good. I'm not doing any crazy decorating on the outside.

CptMurphy · May 10, 2017

Hey,

just tried the new update, I like the idea with the combat webbing but after getting hit by the spit I don't get the chance to struggle out of the webbing, I simply get the lose consciousness screen and I'm transfered to the cave.

The rest works fine and nice work so far!

I need more details. If you get hit, does the meter appear below your compass? If so, how far does it fill?

Yes the meter shows up and is about half way full

Kazyn · May 12, 2017

Some fixes are going out today. Was hoping to include something new with this one but it doesn't seem to have made the cut right now. I also haven't been able to fully test each fix in its entirety so report those bugs as per usual.

Fixes

-Choosing to "continue struggling" in the dialog popup now actually gives you a chance to continue struggling, instead of just auto-failing to escape entirely.

-Kicking the spider and subsequently being rewrapped due to not escaping in time (or outright failing) should now properly allow the spider to return.

-Webbed followers should no longer be able to help you escape from your own webbing.

-Fixed web meter from showing up when NPCs are webbed and stricken by spiders. This should also fix certain errors from appearing in papyrus logs.

DonQuiWho · May 12, 2017

Some fixes are going out today. Was hoping to include something new with this one but it doesn't seem to have made the cut right now. I also haven't been able to fully test each fix in its entirety so report those bugs as per usual.

Fixes

-Choosing to "continue struggling" in the dialog popup now actually gives you a chance to continue struggling, instead of just auto-failing to escape entirely.

-Kicking the spider and subsequently being rewrapped due to not escaping in time (or outright failing) should now properly allow the spider to return.

-Webbed followers should no longer be able to help you escape from your own webbing.

-Fixed web meter from showing up when NPCs are webbed and stricken by spiders. This should also fix certain errors from appearing in papyrus logs.

Thank you

Are we safe to overwrite 0.31, or do we need a new game, pls?

Kazyn · May 12, 2017

Overwrite is fine. Just make sure you're not in the middle of escaping any sort of entanglement, both in and out of the lair.

iorelsan · May 15, 2017

Made a quite extensive testing of the mod and it seems smooth as balls. Really impressed.

Only bug I could encounter is that the "Hungry Spider" option is not working, I made a clumsy run where I kept trying to get myself wrapped up... she wrapped me up more than 3 times and still no death.

Besides that I have a question about the "kick or keep struggling" mechanics. I assume those two are for the last part when you are about to get free but the spider shows up? I managed to kick the spider away and get free, but as I was getting up the spider proceeded to hit me and it was over for me as she wrapped me up again. Shouldn't kick stun the spider for longer when successful?

Nitpick apart I honestly feel that the mod is done and ready. Great job!

Kazyn · May 15, 2017

Made a quite extensive testing of the mod and it seems smooth as balls. Really impressed.

Only bug I could encounter is that the "Hungry Spider" option is not working, I made a clumsy run where I kept trying to get myself wrapped up... she wrapped me up more than 3 times and still no death.

Besides that I have a question about the "kick or keep struggling" mechanics. I assume those two are for the last part when you are about to get free but the spider shows up? I managed to kick the spider away and get free, but as I was getting up the spider proceeded to hit me and it was over for me as she wrapped me up again. Shouldn't kick stun the spider for longer when successful?

Nitpick apart I honestly feel that the mod is done and ready. Great job!

Hungry spider: Was it enabled in the MCM? If so, I'll have to have a look.

Kick and keep struggling are meant to be last-ditch efforts, since if you held still with next to webbing left on you, you're basically guaranteed to get wrapped back up. Keep struggling allows you to keep struggling at the increased risk of being rewrapped if you don't escape in time.

Kicking the spider away guarantees you'll get rewrapped, but only if it recovers after being "stunned" and you're still entangled. That said, the duration of the stun varies on a number of values between your character, how much webbing is around him/her, and the spider itself. If you're low level (like below 15), and have a lot of web left on you and you still somehow manage to succeed in kicking it, it'll be stunned, just not for very long...

So give me some additional details as to what exactly you did, what level you were, how much web was left (including the visual stage around your character) etc.

iorelsan · May 16, 2017

Made a quite extensive testing of the mod and it seems smooth as balls. Really impressed.

Only bug I could encounter is that the "Hungry Spider" option is not working, I made a clumsy run where I kept trying to get myself wrapped up... she wrapped me up more than 3 times and still no death.

Besides that I have a question about the "kick or keep struggling" mechanics. I assume those two are for the last part when you are about to get free but the spider shows up? I managed to kick the spider away and get free, but as I was getting up the spider proceeded to hit me and it was over for me as she wrapped me up again. Shouldn't kick stun the spider for longer when successful?

Nitpick apart I honestly feel that the mod is done and ready. Great job!

Hungry spider: Was it enabled in the MCM? If so, I'll have to have a look.

Kick and keep struggling are meant to be last-ditch efforts, since if you held still with next to webbing left on you, you're basically guaranteed to get wrapped back up. Keep struggling allows you to keep struggling at the increased risk of being rewrapped if you don't escape in time.

Kicking the spider away guarantees you'll get rewrapped, but only if it recovers after being "stunned" and you're still entangled. That said, the duration of the stun varies on a number of values between your character, how much webbing is around him/her, and the spider itself. If you're low level (like below 15), and have a lot of web left on you and you still somehow manage to succeed in kicking it, it'll be stunned, just not for very long...

So give me some additional details as to what exactly you did, what level you were, how much web was left (including the visual stage around your character) etc.

Yes Hungry Spider was enabled.

Also the whole kicking thing now makes sense.... I didnt think you would even think on considering character level/stats on the stun duration, then it makes a lot of sense as I was testing on a lvl 4 character.

I think thats about it!! very good job with the mod

Ghrolath(blabla77777) · May 19, 2017

The update seemed to fix all the issues I had before, but I needed to start a new game to get it to run at all. Not a big deal for me, as I was due for a restart, but I thought I would mention it. The meter wasnt showing up on my high level save, and I wasnt getting brought back to the cave on my level 15ish character.

orgs1n · May 19, 2017

I can't figure out the escape rhythm. I'm testing this at level 1 so my PC has no stamina or sneak skill to speak of. To compensate I have the escape difficulty set at 0 and the failure penaly at 0.5. Each keypress costs 25% stamina, thus trying all 4 WASD keys runs my PC out of stamina. I wait 30 seconds for it to recover, then try again. Occasionally, I get the escape slider down to 98% with a lucky keypress. On the next false key, it skips back to 100%. After each 30 seconds wait, I get to try again, now and then choosing another initial key since the sequence might have changed during my 20 seconds wait. This went on for about 10 minutes. I never got the slider below 98%.

Couldn't there be a random option where you simply press Tab a few times and eventually it lets you off the hook? Like with an armbinder?

It's a great idea and offers super immersion, but the unforgiving minigame makes it no-go for me.

theuncleanone · May 19, 2017

I really love the idea and the mechanics of this mod but something doesn't really seem to work for me

Won't ever die. Even now with Version 0.31a.

I'll get the message that the spider grabs it's victim and all that... but nothing happens and after a few seconds I'm asked again what I want to do (Spider checking again).

Have to admit I didn't read through the whole thread by now. Just wanted to know if someone else also has/had this issue and if there is a possible solution to it? 'Cause you know, not dying makes it less thrilling somehow ö.ö

iorelsan · May 19, 2017

I really love the idea and the mechanics of this mod but something doesn't really seem to work for me

Won't ever die. Even now with Version 0.31a.

I'll get the message that the spider grabs it's victim and all that... but nothing happens and after a few seconds I'm asked again what I want to do (Spider checking again).

Have to admit I didn't read through the whole thread by now. Just wanted to know if someone else also has/had this issue and if there is a possible solution to it? 'Cause you know, not dying makes it less thrilling somehow ö.ö

This is a known issue of the last version (or at least happened to me too) I agree to that it adds thrill to the mod. Though I appreciate is optional for those who dont like this

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