Rebellion Side? (Spoilers)

[Myst42]

This "rebellion" thing is quite double in Skyrim

I waited till now to pick a side and I really didn't want to, but it seems to be the only way to access certain parts and achieve storyline peace

 

So the thing is I really like Jarl Elisif

She's really nice and also pretty (I have ECE so she looks very pretty)

But I like her character ya know... I'm talking about roleplay here, my main character met her, did a few quests and I get the feeling they're good friends... she even helped with a prank to cause distraction in the Thalmor embassy quest

 

So for the sake of making her the new High Queen I thought siding with the imperials was the best choice but it seems that even after the imperial questline wins, she doesn't get crowned 

 

I tried to dig up information but it's all a little vague

So it's impossible?

Or perhaps there is a mod for it?

I know of a few where you can marry her and be high king (don't know if two high queens are available) but in the roleplay mood it would be a convenience marriage since I get a vibe involving friend zone with her...

 

I dug up what happens if the stormcloaks win and it's pretty much the same, she doesn't get crowned and she pledges allegiance to Ulfric...

[Mud]

There's no crowning event in the game, but the implication is that the Imperials winning leads to Elisif being High Queen, and Stormcloaks winning leads to Ulfric being High King and Elisif is just a Jarl. Tullius already says the Legion is backing Elisif for the throne, and by winning Skyrim for the Empire, all the Jarls are Imperial-aligned and will vote for Elisif in the Moot.

[Mallomar42]

i know how you feel I really like elisif she's one of the few people in the game who isn't an asshole to you right off the bat (this is a problem a lot of bethesda npcs have, I call it bethesda-npc-syndrome when a game has a large quantity of characters who are such huge assholes to you for no reason when you first meet them that roleplay wise you kind of just have to kill them) but at the same time the thalmor eat people so I can't really support the empire because they are just a puppet regime for the thalmor who again eat people. So I'm just happy that you don't have to kill elisif when you join the rebels. My only regret when doing so is you can't convince jarl balgruuf to see reason, he to was really just a nice guy and he seemed reasonable and like a good leader for his people.

[flutie]

Jarl Balgruuf and Elisif are my favorites too, I always thought that the Balgruuf/stormcloak story was lacking, he seems to be a just leader in regards to his people, and a corination of Elisif would have been nice or even Ulfric

[Mud]

i know how you feel I really like elisif she's one of the few people in the game who isn't an asshole to you right off the bat (this is a problem a lot of bethesda npcs have, I call it bethesda-npc-syndrome when a game has a large quantity of characters who are such huge assholes to you for no reason when you first meet them that roleplay wise you kind of just have to kill them) but at the same time the thalmor eat people so I can't really support the empire because they are just a puppet regime for the thalmor who again eat people. So I'm just happy that you don't have to kill elisif when you join the rebels. My only regret when doing so is you can't convince jarl balgruuf to see reason, he to was really just a nice guy and he seemed reasonable and like a good leader for his people.

Uh... where the heck did you get the Thalmor being cannibals? They do a lot of things way worse than cannibalism, but I've never encountered anything about them eating people.

[Guest]

i know how you feel I really like elisif she's one of the few people in the game who isn't an asshole to you right off the bat (this is a problem a lot of bethesda npcs have, I call it bethesda-npc-syndrome when a game has a large quantity of characters who are such huge assholes to you for no reason when you first meet them that roleplay wise you kind of just have to kill them) but at the same time the thalmor eat people so I can't really support the empire because they are just a puppet regime for the thalmor who again eat people. So I'm just happy that you don't have to kill elisif when you join the rebels. My only regret when doing so is you can't convince jarl balgruuf to see reason, he to was really just a nice guy and he seemed reasonable and like a good leader for his people.

 

In older games they may have started as assholes but you were atleast able to win them over...or simply bribe them.

 

Oh and if you read the letters you find in the embassy you'd know that

Ulfric may be a Thalmor sleeper agent, Tullius on the other hand tells you at the end of the questline that the Imperial Army will go to war with the Thalmor again, just not immediately.

 

 

It's all kinda murky.

 

 

i know how you feel I really like elisif she's one of the few people in the game who isn't an asshole to you right off the bat (this is a problem a lot of bethesda npcs have, I call it bethesda-npc-syndrome when a game has a large quantity of characters who are such huge assholes to you for no reason when you first meet them that roleplay wise you kind of just have to kill them) but at the same time the thalmor eat people so I can't really support the empire because they are just a puppet regime for the thalmor who again eat people. So I'm just happy that you don't have to kill elisif when you join the rebels. My only regret when doing so is you can't convince jarl balgruuf to see reason, he to was really just a nice guy and he seemed reasonable and like a good leader for his people.

Uh... where the heck did you get the Thalmor being cannibals? They do a lot of things way worse than cannibalism, but I've never encountered anything about them eating people.

 

Indeed, they're not cannibals but Nazis. Their intentions are to commit genocide on all human races.

 

[Mallomar42]

I can't remember exactly where but if memory serves me correct you can find a building really far north that's one of there bases of operation, there's nothing you can do there except find plates of human meat, dead prisoners, and fight thalmor who are really cross with you for breaking in.

[Mud]

Sounds like a mod-added area. The northernmost Thalmor base is Northwatch Keep, the target for the Gray-Mane quest, and that's a straight up concentration camp.

[Cynical Misanthrope]

"if you have any businesses, talk to my Stuart"

 

"But, but, I just did this task for you. I ran across the land facing many dangerous beats and men alike, just for you!

It took me days and sometimes I wasn't sure I was going to survive"

 

"Elisif walks to her chamber, goes to bed and fall asleep"

 

- I hate her!

 

 

 

 

[carnifex]

Jarl Balgruuf and Elisif are my favorites too, I always thought that the Balgruuf/stormcloak story was lacking, he seems to be a just leader in regards to his people, and a corination of Elisif would have been nice or even Ulfric

The whole civil war questline is very disappointing RP-wise. The coolest thing about it are the optional negotiations in High Hrothgar, at least there your choices are somewhat meaningful. Also, telling the Thalmor ambassador to get the fuck out was beyond satisfying.

[Guest]

 

Jarl Balgruuf and Elisif are my favorites too, I always thought that the Balgruuf/stormcloak story was lacking, he seems to be a just leader in regards to his people, and a corination of Elisif would have been nice or even Ulfric

The whole civil war questline is very disappointing RP-wise. The coolest thing about it are the optional negotiations in High Hrothgar, at least there your choices are somewhat meaningful. Also, telling the Thalmor ambassador to get the fuck out was beyond satisfying.

 

 

That's because Bethesda took out the real civil war questline, probably because dipshits, aka the majority of gamers nowadays, don't like consequences in their games.

 

[Jexsam]

 

 

 

That's because Bethesda took out the real civil war questline, probably because dipshits, aka the majority of gamers nowadays, don't like consequences in their games.

 

 

More like "lol 11/11/11 release date".

 

For whatever reason they absolutely had to hit that mark, and a lot of cool features got the shaft due to this rush.

[Mallomar42]

yeah i agree it would have been nice if they at least had the decency to add a civil war expansion dlc or something. I've also heard that a lot of the mods that add to the civil war are terribly buggy

[Myst42]

Yeah I know what you all mean... even though I'm siding with the empire, I hate the Thalmor's guts...

First encounter I had with them before the main questline was a bunch of people attacking me without any provocation like they were hunting me or something... one carried a letter specifically saying they wanted me dead... what did I ever do to them?

Of course I sent their sorry behinds to Oblivion in agony and screams... after that came the embassy, the politics, the freedom oppression, the Nazi thing about thinking they are better than everyone else, the whole "being an asshole" thing, etc etc... After that I tell them to fuck off every time I can, or better, I kill them on sight

 

That thing about the letters and Gral. Tullius with the real good intentions makes the Imperial option sound even better

 

But to the point... I guess I really can't get Elisif to be crowned except on an imaginary future... (Sigh) Well then... That'll have to do 

[Mallomar42]

After going over the whole thing with ulfric stormcloak possibly being a thalmor sleeper agent, on he matter, I don't think the case. When you go over the dossier from the embassy and the thalmor's goals with the civil war overall; the thalmor don't control Ulfric, in as much as give him orders, suggestions, ideas. He in fact has no idea that he is helping them, though he is. The thalmor wish to keep the skyrim in a state of civil war as it weakens the empire and keeps skyrim fractured, both of which are to their ends. The empire constantly has to pour resources into skyrim so they can't think about fighting against the thalmor; and as skyrim continues to fight the empire it remains devided and any able bodied men and women throw their lives away, not paying attention to the group that is the real threat, the thalmor. If skyrim were to unite too soon the thalmor could risk not securing a puppet government (I believe that they want elisif to be high queen about as much as ulfric stormcloak; which is to say not at all), furthermore if skyrim was to unite the empire would be able to (after some diplomatic treaties were raised) focus on much more pressing matters: throwing off the yoke of the thalmor. So as to Ulfric Stormcloak being a Thalmor sleeper agent, I would say no. The description "dormant resource" is a much more apt description. He is a resource in the fact that people rallying around him keeps skyrim destabilized and in a civil war against the empire which keeps the empire occupied and weakened; and he is dormant as he doesn't know that the thalmor are using him as a resource in the first place. Therefore, whichever side of the civil war you choose to side with the outcome is in many ways the same, you are simply deciding whether or not skyrim is a part of the empire when they inevitably go to war with the thalmor or whether they will be allies of the empire in that scenario; as both sides in fact hate the thalmor.

 

TL;DR

Ulfric is almost definitely not a sleeper agent and if you want to fight the thalmor it doesn't matter which side of the argument you were on as long as a side is victorious.

 

In a way I find the idea that both sides leads to the same outcome (for the most part worse than when I thought that they had different outcomes.

[limbo]

the game should have enabled the Dovahkin to become high king, uniting both factions with or against the empire ... personally i'd side against.. those arrogant thalmor piss me off.

 

i can worship whoever i want.

[Redflyingmonkey]

At Bethesda they went full retard and deleted shitloads of content from the civil war quest to release it on time (because you know, people whining and shit since they'd prefer to have a rushed game instead of waiting another month).

That dude who made "Civil War Overhaul" dug out tons of vagrant deleted scripts that were referring to a much, much larger Civil War questline, it's deep coded and certainly impossible to resurrect right now, but he found stuff like giants clans taking a role in the war, wolves, bigger and longer battles, Ulfric and Tullius actually showing up on some battles (not just the last one), and I think something that was related to a big election for high king. 

So the producers, looking at the clock, said "fuck it", and made the devs hack through hours worth of content (as well as possibly screwing up the AI in the civil war combats). 

 

I hope someone will mod the crap out of it one day, and edit the whole storyline to underp it, because let's face it, it's botched up. 

[Benmc20]

the game should have enabled the Dovahkin to become high king, uniting both factions with or against the empire ... personally i'd side against.. those arrogant thalmor piss me off.

 

i can worship whoever i want.

 

Hmmmm like this idea . Anyone knows of such mod ?

[Mebrilia]

The problem is... The imperials don't love the thalmor but they are realist and they wait the best opportunity to strike them back...On the other hand Ulfric with all his Rebels want to fight for the right to Talos worshipping and to give skyrim to the north... The reality is the rebellion don't do nothing more to bring thalmor in advantage with skyrim divided and the Empire fighting the Stormcloack for the thalmor there is a nice opportunity to finish of an already weak empire...

 

So in the end who side with stormcloack help the thalmors..

[Benmc20]

This is exactly what i think. I don't like much the Empire but this is a far better solution than helping Ulfric. Plus, this one is a complete a**hole ! (in my own opinion of course).

[gvman3670]

I've played this game through many, many times since it's been released (and I bought it the day it came out). I've played the civil war quest line several times. And only ONCE did I side with the Empire.

 

SKYRIM'S FOR THE NORDS, MOTHERFUCKERS!!!

 

I can't side with the Imperials after they tried to cut my friggin' head off, man. I just can't do it.

[pinky6225]

I've played this game through many, many times since it's been released (and I bought it the day it came out). I've played the civil war quest line several times. And only ONCE did I side with the Empire.

 

SKYRIM'S FOR THE NORDS, MOTHERFUCKERS!!!

 

I can't side with the Imperials after they tried to cut my friggin' head off, man. I just can't do it.

 

Until i started using live an alternative life and the live a deviant life mods i totally know where you are coming from, like hell i'm gonna help the bastards that tried to execute me merely for being in the wrong place.

 

The Imperial side is also missing the cool speaches that the stormcloak side has, Ulfric may go on a bit but i always feel charged up for some imperial slaying at the end

[XunAmarox]

Personally I can't really play Skyrim as anything but a racist Nord. I don't really like Argonian, Khajiit, or Elves myself personally (the way they look creeps me out), so it plays in pretty easily to my own feelings on the races in Skyrim.
 
The bigger dilemma is which side to choose, or to choose any at all. The way I see it, Ulfric challenged Torygg in the old ways and won. By rights, he should have been named High King. But the holds are ran by a bunch of milk drinkers.
 
The bad thing is that I can see that Skyrim really probably will fall to the Thalmor without the Empire's help, but with that said... The Empire is no longer the Empire and has not had a legitimate ruler since Potema, or Pelagius, when the Septim bloodline died out. Without one of dragon blood on the throne it is an illegitmate empire. Akatosh made a deal with St Alessia to hold back the gates of Oblivion as long as one of the dragon blood sat on the Imperial throne. Not to mention it's just so damned corrupt! Every single one of the major Imperial holds...
 
Siddgeir the Jarl of Falkreath is as bad as they come. He allows bandits to operate freely within his hold as long as he gets a cut of the profits. Has he forgotten a Jarl's duty is to protect its people? He's also clearly attached to the Thalmor's backside. Hell, he didn't even become Jarl legitimately...
 
Maven Blackbriar, not a Jarl yet, but if Riften were to fall under Imperial control... the horror. She is everything wrong with Riften. She has her hands in both the Thieves guild AND the Dark Brotherhood. She has hired thugs, and I wouldn't touch that poison she calls mead even if you paid me! (Everyone talks about it being good but truth be told it's terrible. Look at the stamina gained and then the regeneration hit. Honningbrew is far superior. The best in Skyrim? You can get that from Talen-Jei at the Riften Inn. 25 stamina with no downside whatsoever.
 
Markarth... Do I even need to mention the Forsworn, corruption, and the, ahem...

Cidhna Mine (e.g. concentration camp)

And of course Solitude doesn't get any better... Elisif is a total airheaded idiot, completely dependent on her steward Falk Firebeard and General Tulius. Not even fit to be a Jarl in my book, well alone High Queen.

All of those mentioned are seen at the Thalmor embassy as well, kissing Thalmor backside.

With all of that in mind, it's kind of hard to side with the Imperials. You're Dragonborn, the Stormcloaks support Talos, worshiping Talos yourself even grants you a reduction in your shout recharges, and Ulfric himself can even shout. Even the Companions side with the Stormcloaks. I think they really set the game up where it would be hard not to side with the Stormcloaks, especially considering they were trying to take off your head at the beginning of the game, and for no good reason. Hell, on many a playthrough I've joined the rebellion just for revenge.

[EternalDamned]

Most of what you need to know about Ulfric you learn in the first few minutes of the game. He killed Toryg (by all accounts not a man yet but a boy) Then he was running for the border with at least a half dozen guards to protect his wimpy ass. When the dragon attacks, he is the first to run and doesn't help anyone, just use them as bait and cover for his own escape.

 

Later you find out he was a Thalmor asset, one they say was uncooperative but could be approached directly if need be. So he obviously knew he worked for the Thalmor, rather than him just being a situation they were taking advantage of. They actually went to Helgen to save Ulfric, but the return of Alduin made direct intervention unnecessary.

 

Not that the Empire is all that much better. They cow tow to the Thalmor since the end of the war biding their time until strong enough to fight again...But then the books do say that when a Dragonborn is no longer the Emperor the empire will begin to fall. So honestly, you as the Dragonborn should become the Emperor!

[EternalDamned]

I'd also point out that the ONLY Jarls or potential Jarls in all of Skyrim that are any good are Balgruuf who is the best Jarl there is and Elisif who is obviously young and was not yet prepared to rule, but has potential. Balgruuf's first concern is for his people. IE: immediately orders troops to Riverwood despite the objections put forth by Proventus Avenicci. Elisif showed the same type of potential when told about things happening at Wolfskull cave. But being young she mistakenly listened to Falk Firebeard. All the other Jarl's in Skyrim look out only for themselves.