OSA\Osex and SexLab\LoversLab installs

[BDNelson]

In the Vortex\Dashboard\Plugins menu there are icons showing esp's\esm's that are light and icons showing esp's\esm's that can be made light. I can put together a list of these so I can go to xEdit and\or R88_ESLify to change them. I just don't know how.

 

I know this should be done a little farther into my install order but I wanted to get the info ahead of time.

[Bluegunk]

I would not touch that R88 utility. No no no. Nooo way.

 

First up read:  https://www.afkmods.com/index.php?/topic/5079-plugin-files-and-you-esmeslesp/  by Arthmoor. You'll get an idea of the limitations of ESPFEs from this.

 

Second, read: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/21289 

 

Now, SSEEdit should have a script you can run to test a mod and see if it will convert to ESL or, more accurately, a ESPFE, which is an ESP that is "in ESL Space".

If you don't have a script, you can get one here: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/27568 but I think it is already in SSEEdit's scripts.

See pictures below for the process.

 

A major, major warning!  Not every mod is suitable for converting to ESL/ESPFE. I find that single armour mods, small mods, small mods with some scripts, etc., are the best. If an author offers an ESL version, grab it over the ESP. If a mod has patches, you can probably ESL the patches. but leave the main mod.

**Do not ever ESL the SOS Add-On schlongs. They look like they will work but in reality the SOS DLL loses them and it becomes a right problem.

 

Do not convert mods that have dialogue. The process detaches the dialogue IDs from the quest and the mod is destroyed.

If a mod adds a new CELL, or radically alters a vanilla game cell, it will not convert.

 

Never convert an ESP to an ESL/ESPFE mid-game. It changes the file IDs and the save game will be corrupted.

 

The process is

1. new mod 

2. look at mod and consider options - will it go to ESPFE?  Back up mod.

3. do a conversion

4. test in game. Test again!

5. failed - roll back to good save and backup. Success, then all good.

 

I prefer to do this one mod at a time, with lots of checks to make sure it will work. I don't want to risk my game on some dodgy batch utility.

 

You can actually convert a basic follower with no additional dialogue but you have to update the Facegen and NIF files for it to work. Let me know if you want to do that and I'll go through it.   Followers with dialogue are best left to the experts.

 

Here's the process I use

Make sure you start at picture 1 and go through to 6. It looks like the website has put 1 at the bottom so start there and work up.

 

 

 

 

Hope this helps!

 

Edited November 9, 2021 by Bluegunk

[BDNelson]

Yeah... I don't think I want to mess with this, blows my KISS rule out of the water. Deleting R88. I already download esl's whenever offered. Guess I'll just have to some shuffling.

[Bluegunk]

There's plenty you can change to ESL/ESPFE. Don't be disheartened!

[BDNelson]

Ok, I'll make this a favorited page and come back to it. Give it a try after I get my mods installed. R88 is gone though.

 

 

I've finished up the body stuff. Did F.G., Cicera, Lydia and the Sorority Girls(7 girls) at Winterhold(just couldn't leave them out). Holding off on installing Sgt. Followers, there are 26 Followers\NPC's in that mod. So at this point I'm thinking clothing, armor, weapons and jewelry(in that order) next. I still haven't done my overhauls yet(Alchemy, camping...etc.). That's an option. They need PapUtil though. Some of the SL\LL mods are going to require the PapUtil mod to be installed as well, trying to hold off on that until I need to put it in.

 

Input?

[Bluegunk]

There's no need to hold off the Papyrus Utility mod. I would consider it an essential for games these days.

[BDNelson]

Ok, I thought the later in the load order the better. Just a matter of when it should be installed. So... clothing, armor...etc. or overhauls or SL\LL stuff next. What do you think? 

[BDNelson]

Actually, after looking at my Vortex. There are a couple of mods that I think I should get cleared up. The Underground bathhouse and BBLS. These are listed as player home mods but they contain followers\NPC's. I just finished installing the followers\NPC's that I am going to run. I have not installed any City\Town mods or JKSkyrim, interior mods... etc. which is where I installed the player homes last time. Should I install them now, keeping with the followers\NPC's category or wait until I'm ready to install them when I install JKSkyrim,etc. . The mixture of categories is throwing me off. I have to translate the BBLS mod set(3 mods), pain in the ass. 

[Bluegunk]

35 minutes ago, BDNelson said:

I have to translate the BBLS mod

 

I'm curious; why does this need translating? Unless English is not your first language?  

 

Forgive me I'm wrong but I'm wondering if we might be talking at cross purposes on the install order of mods?

 

It's not when you install a mod, it's where.  You can install any mod at any time in terms of hours and minutes, but the install order has to be such that some mods may overwrite others. Things like Papyrus Utilities needs to be "late" in the load order but not in the sense of when you install it, but it's position.

 

It is a problem with modder language, and I apologise, because I forget I also went through the whole shebang trying to understand "before" and "after" and "early" and "late"! 

 

Your install list is a top to bottom list where the top are the basic needed mods like Skyrim, and the ones at the bottom are things like final patches, Papyrus Utilities and the bashed patch. Since Skyrim is the game, all the mods going down the install list 'below' it are overwriting, adding to, or changing the Skyrim game master. 

 

Sexlab Framework, for example has a copy of Papyrus Utility script. So does BBLS. Papyrus Utilities has the most recent version and is regularly updated. So it does not matter when you put these mods into your game time-wise, but the order in the list is important and Papyrus Utilities must go close to the bottom (or 'late') in your install so that is overwrites the stuff above it. So the 'later' mods overwrite the 'earlier' mods.

 

Using LOOT to organise the game ESM/ESP/ESL/and ESPFEs gives you the mod load order Skyrim game should use. Again, Skyrim at the top, other mods further down the list overwriting it.  It is normal practice to arrange the Install mod list in the same order as the LOOT sorted ESPs.

 

Hence the use of ESMs - Elder Scrolls Masters, that set up the basic structure of the game, and ESPs - Elder Scrolls Plugins that add aspects to the game over the masters.

 

Sorry about all that but I hope it clarifies we're on the same wavelength.

 

JK's Skyrim is a large mod. It will overwrite a lot of game parts. It doesn't matter at what time you install the mod but what comes before and after it in the install order does matter. I actually tend to put it in my game quite early time-wise, but then I use landscape mods, trees and grasses. So it's important to me to see how they interact with JK's Skyrim.

By the way, JK's Skyrim (exterior) does hit FPS in some places. But I like it so much I take the hit.

 

The biggest problem with what goes where in the install order are the mods affecting the vanilla NPCs. This is where the dreaded 'black face bug' turns up. This happens when more than one mod affects the vanilla NPC's face and hair files. It may also show up with Interesting NPCs and makeovers for various NPCs added by mods. My 'test' vanilla NPC is Alvor. If his face is affected then I know the game has a problem. He's usually one of the first that breaks.

 

Unfortunately I have no idea how Vortex categorises anything. Using MO2 I just throw the mods in and run LOOT to position the ESPs, re-arranging the installation order to match.

 

There is a kind of recommended order of mods. I can't remember where I got this from but the general recommended list is:

 

Spoiler

#01: Your ESM Files;
#02: Bug-Fix type Mods;
#03: Game Structure and/or UI Mods:
#04: Character Appearance Mods (For NPCs and Self);
#05: Mods that Add and/or Change Locations; *
#06: Mods that Add and/or Change Items;
#07: Mods that Add NPCs;
#08: Texture Mods;
#09: Environmental Mods (things like Climates of Tamriel, Sounds of Skyrim, etc.);
#10: Mods with Gameplay Changes; Then,
#11: Reproccers, AV, and Bashed Patches.
 

 

But this is not a rigid rule. LOOT will sort the mods on its algorithms and it may, or may not look like the above by the time it is done. LOOT does put things in strange places; XPMSSE being one of them; but I mentioned that in an earlier post.  In my game LOOT puts the audio mods early, the followers later, and the houses, locations around the middle.

 

Anyhow, I've written enough!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[BDNelson]

No, I'm an American, I speak, read and write English. The mods are in Russian. The Vortex translation app(?) doesn't translate the mod at all, only the Nexus page so I can read what I'm looking at. That is why I have xTranslator as one of my tools, in my game folder. This is the only set of mods I have to do this with, there are 3 mods in total that are in the Russian language after installation. In addition the map markers for these 2 locations have little white boxes where the words(Bath Lux, Paradise Valley...etc.) should be and text when talking to NPC's at these locations is non-existent. Using xTranslator fixed all of this.

 

Yeah(lol)... I still don't have a grip on the before\after thing, but I'm learning. For instance, base mods first(mods with no required mods that have to be installed first) add-on's after and patches after that. Do I have that, at least, right? And when conflicts arise add-on's go "after" and patches "after" that. I hope I have that right.

 

Yes, thank you. Explaining all that has expanded my knowledge of what mods\esp's and esm's are. I did not know the definitions, hence the way they work. Nice.

 

I am using the JK AIO mod and then I have a few city\town overhaul mods. after that interior mods. This is where I usually install UB\BBLS stuff. I did NPC's before Change Location sand Change Items, you think that will be a problem? I'm not using any foliage mods(Ultra setting, no God rays). Looks pretty good already, for me.

 

As for LOOT, every time I install a mod, the FNIS auto-runs. I go to the dashboard and run FNIS(again) then xEdit then LOOT, looking for anything wrong along the way. LOOT controls my load order, I don't\haven't ever changed it. I didn't know I could even do that, don't think I have to, do I? Gameplay mods almost last, hmmm, I have already blown that one. I did them with the bugfixes and UI mods. Before my body stuff.

 

Am I getting on your nerves? I do not want to piss you off, tell me if that happens, ok, please. I think you can still teach me a lot.

[Bluegunk]

Weird. Have you checked the current version of BBLS?   The one I had is in English.  How strange. But it has gone off the Nexus now and the link is the current available mod. I just checked it and it's all in English.

Paradise Valley is on the Nexus (at the moment) and in English.

 

Yes - you got it with the base loads and further mods. I hope I wasn't being OTT. It's sometimes difficult with comment boxes to know for sure. 

 

I'm sure the order you loaded up JKs and NPCs won't be an issue. Just watch for conflicts which you can check with SSEEdit anyway. I just moved to 4.04 SSEEdit today.

 

LOOT is a real help, but it sometimes makes odd decisions. The XPMSSE is a classic one for me. Why put it halfway through the ESP load order when 99% of people say put it after anything that changes bodies? 

We can make a rule in LOOT to force a mod to load after another one. So I made a rule that gets XMPSE to load after 3BBB, and those to load after some random mod that is close the bottom of my ESP list. Seems to work, and it saves manually dragging it around every time I use LOOT.

 

And hey you're not getting on my nerves! No way. I really enjoy chatting and helping out. I learn from other modders, too. There's a guy helping me script my first mod right at this moment!

 

 

[BDNelson]

Ok, something strange is going on. I was just on Nexus this morning checking the BBLS page again looking for anything I may have missed. The page was in Russian, I had to activate the "translate" button 5 times before it finally got to english. I didn't re-download the mod , I already have it and there is no update listed. Maybe I should try to download it again? I did use Vortex\dashboard\mods\BBLS mod info to get there. Maybe it still "see's" my mod as being in Russian? I downloaded it a while ago. Had it in my install order ever since, I really want to see this one in action! That's why I got the pose mod info from you, for BBLS(music and dancing mod).

 

Ok, you need to concentrate on that for a while, I'm going to leave you alone to do that. Give me a shout when you want to resume. I'll check LL site later.

[Bluegunk]

The BBLS mod is not on Nexus. Migal withdrew it in protest about the "Collections."

Oh, wait I know where you are going, it's here.  That's a Russian translation on the Nexus LE site.

That's not going to work in SE anyway as the meshes will be LE. You can safely scrub the Russian one and download it fresh from the Migal Site I linked at https://migal3d.com/bbls/ .

This one is for SE and up to date.

There are a few nice patches and addons for it on the Nexus SE site, too, as I am sure you know.

 

Don't worry about me learning to make a mod. We're only catching up once a week. I'm off to have a beer and watch some trash on TV now. Feel free to write, I'll be back.

 

 

[BDNelson]

NO SHIT!!! I didn't see that it was an LE mod. I have installed this a number(?) of times. This could very well be at the heart of my problems. Will all of the patches work?, ya think? I have all of those including a couple from LL... I think. I'm going to get the mod, be back.

[BDNelson]

OMG OMG OMG!!! You are, without a doubt, my new HERO! I got everything BBLS, NO MORE TRANSLATING!!! AND updated to SE!!! 

 

OK OK, I just finished NPC's. Should I install this now, following the NPC category, or when I install new locations?

[Bluegunk]

Glad you are sorted on the BBLS! Just install away and do a load of testing.  BBLS is a location as much as anything else. It introduces new buildings to the landscape. NPC-wise it is fairly self-contained so hopefully few problems there.

 

It's a solid, good mod. If I remember rightly, it might interact with Immersive Wenches, Interesting NPCs, Amorous Adventures and Flower Girls and therefore may need patches on those. But since I don't currently use it, I can't really remember.  Only use patches that are for Skyrim SE.

 

Remember, if any NPC mods update the BBLS girls, you may have a conflict. Use SSEEdit to spot your conflicts.

 

Enjoy!

 

I'm heading for bed. Late here in the UK. I'll catch up tomorrow.

 

 

Edited November 11, 2021 by Bluegunk

[BDNelson]

Just updated to SSEEdit 4.0.4 as well, thank you again. Skips right over those other 2 updates for 4.0.3. If you discover or already know any neat stuff to with this(SSEEdit) let me know, will ya? I only use the edit and quick clean, I know it can do a lot more, right? Well... maybe later. I want to get back to the install order. BBLS... nummmm.(lol).

[BDNelson]

Yes, of course. Now I know why I am seeing a communication lag time\difference\gap(?). British. I live in Idaho, pacific northwest U.S. . More later, good night.

[BDNelson]

For tomorrow, so I don't forget. I checked my SSEEdit and LOOT load orders about XMPSE. In mine XMPSE is almost last, like 7 or 8 to the WACCP(?) merge patch at the end. As I scroll down the list, I see 3BBB first, CBBE right after(scrolling down) and farther down the list is XMPSE. I think that is just how it should be, right?

[BDNelson]

Damn memory, for tomorrow. Installed PapUtil, had 2 conflicting mods. SexLab Framework and OSA, set both to after. FYI.

[Bluegunk]

9 hours ago, BDNelson said:

Installed PapUtil, had 2 conflicting mods

 

Remember to allow Pap Util to overwrite any other mod. It's script version is the most recent. So put it at the end of your install list.  And your XPMSSE position sounds good.

 

 

[BDNelson]

Nice. Did you notice the 3BBB and the CBBE placement. 3BBB comes before CBBE, is that good as well? Shouldn't it be CBBE, 3BBB and then XMPSE. Nah... for some reason that doesn't look right. On to locations next. I have a number of city rebuilds that I install after I install JK's Skyrim AIO. I got mods for the cities that JK's mod did not cover, also I have the updated Bruma DLC, Vominhiem, Blackthorn and Depths of Skyrim. I know that I need to install JK's AIO 1st and the new locations after that so the new locations overwrite(after) JK's mod... I think? So when should I install the interior mods that I have? before or after JK's AIO? I don't think the interior mod does anything to Bruma, Vominhiem or Blackthorn mods.

[BDNelson]

I'm going to install BBLS\UB after.

[BDNelson]

 

I also discovered that the Whiterun Expansion mod does not play well with Bath Lux or Laura's Bondage Shop. A lot of overlapping of textures and a Giant that I am pretty sure doesn't belong there, right in front of Bath Lux. I stepped out of the Bath Lux and promptly got attacked by him, with no weapons on me. This was when I started the game IN the Bath Lux via alternate start. Only did that once. I'll let you know what happens with these new mods installed.

[BDNelson]

I also want to give you a mod count. LOOT 140 active & total. Vortex\Dashboard\Plugins menu, 107 active 33 light. This is the 1st time these numbers have matched that I remember seeing. In the past they were different totals. I think WE might be doing something right. This looks good to me, you?