ctd Please help. Game CTDs right before Main Menu shows. This is NOT a mssing master issue

[nilead]

11 hours ago, GenioMaestro said:

 

The numbers 511.28.46 mean that i play in that savegame 511 real time hours. In game say 698 day's.

I'm level 141 and, of course, in one year and half i add and remove hundreds of mods from my game and clean it with ReSaver hundreds and hundreds of times. 

I have one of the most script heavy configuration that any user can install, half of my mods come from this web site, but i can play at full hd 1920x1080 with average frame rate of 50 FPS and average script latency below 100 ms. I not find any problem or limit in my game.

 

I can asure you that the scripts, in general, not have any influence in yours problems. 

Only a bad script from a bad mod can cause problems and that is a problem in one mod. Simply, remove it.

Well, apprently you're the said wizard) Visual performance never was the problem, my builds used to crumble with script lag and increasing CTDs. Wich ultimately led me to give up on alot of mods i really liked, INPCS and Battle fatigue and injuries being the two i miss the most. I know this topic has different purpose, but if you dont mind, two questions:

1st - How do you test your builds? I guess its a silly question, but often its hard to tell if mod will cause problems down the line.

2nd - Under ReSaver you mean the one posted be markdf on nexus?

[DarkChaoX]

9 hours ago, GenioMaestro said:

The general CPU and memory usage is not important. We know that you have enougth CPU and RAM.

 

We need know EXACTLY how many memory use each executable. Take a look to this post where the user have Win10 and take a screenshot of the exact memory usage of each process ussing the task manager.

That is exactly the numbers that we need know. How many memory are used in each process.

 

Seems that you have some problems. First, I not know why you disable Dual Shealth Redux. Maybe only for make a diferent test disabling others mods? And why run the patcher again? And why is so slow?

But works? Because is not clear.

 

What exactly happend again? The message from Crash Fixes saying that you run out of memory?

Then, the game has started. You are not getting CTD before the Main Menu.

But what mods have you enabled? Have you activated 3DNPC and the game start whitout Dual SR?

with 3DNPC.esp on, the game does not load at all as i said. It goes up to the main menu with the ENBhost.exe using only 10mb of memory and skyrim using about 30% from the entire pc memory. Idk if that helps but i will definitelly try capturing as soon as i can. Sorry for the delayed response

[GenioMaestro]

4 hours ago, nilead said:

Well, apprently you're the said wizard) Visual performance never was the problem, my builds used to crumble with script lag and increasing CTDs. Wich ultimately led me to give up on alot of mods i really liked, INPCS and Battle fatigue and injuries being the two i miss the most. I know this topic has different purpose, but if you dont mind, two questions:

1st - How do you test your builds? I guess its a silly question, but often its hard to tell if mod will cause problems down the line.

2nd - Under ReSaver you mean the one posted be markdf on nexus?

Yours problems, specifically "script lag and increasing CTDs" has nothing to do whit what mods you have.

Is a simple problem of game configuration. If a mod give you problems report it to the developer. If the developer say "yours problems are NOT caused by my mod" is because, really, that mod not have any relation to the problem.

 

I'm bored of read comments like yours about mods with millons of downloads. Use your head a bit.

You can not say that a mod like Interesting NPCs, with 4 millons of downloads, give problems or not works.

We can say exactly the same about mods like Frostfall, OBIS, RDO... or SexLab, DCUR, Slaverun...

If you have problems whit any of that mods everybody can asure you the problem is not in that mods.

The idea that the game or the mods break with the time, as we advance in the game, is stupid.

Simply, you must learn to correctly configure your game.

 

The only way for test the mods is play the game.

I'm a bit bored of Skyrim after playing it for 6 years but that not mean i not play. Read this message and see how i can play 4 or 5 consecutive hours with 250 plugings, one day after another, ussing my savegame with one year of history. In this other message you can see my pluging list whit another usefull info. Take a look to my histoy of messages and you can find a lot of good information about the problems in the game and how solve it.

 

The only ReSaver for Skyrim that i know is published by markdf.

[DarkChaoX]

11 hours ago, GenioMaestro said:

The general CPU and memory usage is not important. We know that you have enougth CPU and RAM.

 

We need know EXACTLY how many memory use each executable. Take a look to this post where the user have Win10 and take a screenshot of the exact memory usage of each process ussing the task manager.

That is exactly the numbers that we need know. How many memory are used in each process.

 

Seems that you have some problems. First, I not know why you disable Dual Shealth Redux. Maybe only for make a diferent test disabling others mods? And why run the patcher again? And why is so slow?

But works? Because is not clear.

 

What exactly happend again? The message from Crash Fixes saying that you run out of memory?

Then, the game has started. You are not getting CTD before the Main Menu.

But what mods have you enabled? Have you activated 3DNPC and the game start whitout Dual SR?

I managed to fix it my man. Thank you and all the others SOOO much for all the advice!

Apparently, even tho the reference number wasnt 1.000.000, it still made the game crash on opening.

 

So i kept searching to find info about the reference limit. That link you posted here:

 

19 hours ago, GenioMaestro said:

I don't know why you are so sure that your mergers are perfectly done and can not cause any problems.

The simple fact that you activate 3DNPC and have a CTD that disappears when you disable it does not mean that the problem is within 3Dnpc. The 3DNPC.ESP may refer to a record that does not exist and that is why you have the CTD. Have you verified it with Tes5Edit?

Apart, taking your words as true and assuming that all your merges are perfect, that they have no problem and that they can not cause the problem...

Maybe, if you have really merged 250 plugings and you are playing with 500 ESP's, maybe, and just maybe, you can be one of the very few people who has reached the limit of 1 million of references.

 

Look at this post, download the script, run it on Tes5Edit and see how many references you have. Really, I doubt you can reach the million whit that mod list, but who knows, maybe you can.

 

The author is mentioning how turning some heavy esps into esms will remove their temporary references thus, reducing the total reference number by an insane amount.

 

So, having tried everything else i was like, well why not just try.

Opened xEdit, took a few esps that were really heavy on reference load and turned those into ESMs (by first making sure they have NO requirements by any other mods).

I reenabled 3DNPC.esp afterwards and now the game is working smooth like silk.

 

Thank you ❤️

[GenioMaestro]

3 hours ago, killer8217 said:

Opened xEdit, took a few esps that were really heavy on reference load and turned those into ESMs (by first making sure they have NO requirements by any other mods).

I reenabled 3DNPC.esp afterwards and now the game is working smooth like silk.

If flaging some ESP's as master solve the CTD is because, REALLY, you have more than 1 millon of references.

But is really strange because you run the script and count 800k references. A margin of 200k is really big.

If the margin is below 100k can be posible but with a margin of 200k is practicaly imposible.

 

The script must have some fail or the number of 800k that your provide is not correct.

Maybe you run the script with some mods or esps disabled while you are making some others test.

Other posibility is that you have some special merge that is bad computed by the script.

 

Please, run the script again. Verify that you really have all yours mods/esps enabled and report again the reference count.

[DarkChaoX]

13 minutes ago, GenioMaestro said:

If flaging some ESP's as master solve the CTD is because, REALLY, you have more than 1 millon of references.

But is really strange because you run the script and count 800k references. A margin of 200k is really big.

If the margin is below 100k can be posible but with a margin of 200k is practicaly imposible.

 

The script must have some fail or the number of 800k that your provide is not correct.

Maybe you run the script with some mods or esps disabled while you are making some others test.

Other posibility is that you have some special merge that is bad computed by the script.

 

Please, run the script again. Verify that you really have all yours mods/esps enabled and report again the reference count.

at this point i will just assume that its happening due to some faulty merges. however i cannot seem to tell if there is an actual incompatibility between some mods and not with others.

Using 3dnpc along with The second great war STILL causes a ctd on the main menu. This happens only with that certain combination. Thus im assuming it can only be due to some sort of incompatibility between the two and one more mod i have merged in my last merged pack

 

I will post the script's result as soon as the redux patcher finishes once more. I had to run it again since i rebuild some merges, removing some potential problematic plugins.

[DarkChaoX]

43 minutes ago, GenioMaestro said:

If flaging some ESP's as master solve the CTD is because, REALLY, you have more than 1 millon of references.

But is really strange because you run the script and count 800k references. A margin of 200k is really big.

If the margin is below 100k can be posible but with a margin of 200k is practicaly imposible.

 

The script must have some fail or the number of 800k that your provide is not correct.

Maybe you run the script with some mods or esps disabled while you are making some others test.

Other posibility is that you have some special merge that is bad computed by the script.

 

Please, run the script again. Verify that you really have all yours mods/esps enabled and report again the reference count.

This here is the FULL script result WITH both 3dnpc and The Second Great War that cause the crash. The number is not even remotelly high, thus im assuming (?) that there is some sort of incompatibility

 

[00:00] Start: Applying script "count_loaded_refs_in_load_order"
Found 0 temporary and 41433 persistent (41433 total) loaded references in [00] Skyrim.esm.
Found 0 temporary and 4799 persistent (4799 total) loaded references in [02] Dawnguard.esm.
Found 0 temporary and 4871 persistent (4871 total) loaded references in [03] HearthFires.esm.
Found 0 temporary and 6656 persistent (6656 total) loaded references in [04] Dragonborn.esm.
Found 0 temporary and 421 persistent (421 total) loaded references in [05] Lanterns Of Skyrim - All In One - Main.esm.
Found 0 temporary and 241 persistent (241 total) loaded references in [06] Unofficial Skyrim Legendary Edition Patch.esp.
Found 0 temporary and 3016 persistent (3016 total) loaded references in [07] Falskaar.esm.
Found 0 temporary and 137 persistent (137 total) loaded references in [0B] EnhancedLightsandFX.esp.
Found 0 temporary and 12050 persistent (12050 total) loaded references in [0C] LegacyoftheDragonborn.esp.
Found 0 temporary and 2088 persistent (2088 total) loaded references in [0D] CollegeOfWinterholdImmersive.esp.
Found 0 temporary and 4330 persistent (4330 total) loaded references in [19] 3DNPC.esp.
Found 0 temporary and 2090 persistent (2090 total) loaded references in [1A] Helgen Reborn.esp.
Found 0 temporary and 805 persistent (805 total) loaded references in [1B] Undeath.esp.
Found 0 temporary and 1023 persistent (1023 total) loaded references in [1D] DwemerColosseum.esp.
Found 0 temporary and 848 persistent (848 total) loaded references in [1E] Phenderix Magic World.esp.
Found 0 temporary and 505 persistent (505 total) loaded references in [1F] Evil Lair of Hydra.esm.
Found 0 temporary and 720 persistent (720 total) loaded references in [20] SkyrimSewers.esp.
Found 0 temporary and 2367 persistent (2367 total) loaded references in [21] Dwarfsphere.esp.
Found 0 temporary and 5381 persistent (5381 total) loaded references in [22] BSHeartland.esm.
Found 0 temporary and 618 persistent (618 total) loaded references in [23] BBLuxurySuite.esm.
Found 0 temporary and 6518 persistent (6518 total) loaded references in [24] HammetDungeons.esm.
Found 0 temporary and 690 persistent (690 total) loaded references in [25] AemersRefuge.esm.
Found 0 temporary and 220 persistent (220 total) loaded references in [27] Campfire.esm.
Found 0 temporary and 107 persistent (107 total) loaded references in [28] Inn Girls Resources.esm.
Found 0 temporary and 4435 persistent (4435 total) loaded references in [2B] Vigilant.esm.
Found 0 temporary and 115 persistent (115 total) loaded references in [2C] Naruto Overhaul.esp.
Found 0 temporary and 2385 persistent (2385 total) loaded references in [2E] Shrouded Lair.esm.
Found 0 temporary and 872 persistent (872 total) loaded references in [2F] Gray Fox Cowl.esm.
Found 0 temporary and 1106 persistent (1106 total) loaded references in [31] Haem Projects Goblands.esp.
Found 0 temporary and 6174 persistent (6174 total) loaded references in [32] LevelersTower.esm.
Found 0 temporary and 2712 persistent (2712 total) loaded references in [33] MolagBalsInferno.esm.
Found 0 temporary and 1761 persistent (1761 total) loaded references in [38] GreatWarSkyrim.esp.
Found 2827 temporary and 198 persistent (3025 total) loaded references in [3C] Cutting Room Floor.esp.
Found 12806 temporary and 521 persistent (13327 total) loaded references in [3F] Complete Project Alpha Merge.esp.
Found 4305 temporary and 95 persistent (4400 total) loaded references in [40] RealisticRoomRental.esp.
Found 1752 temporary and 60 persistent (1812 total) loaded references in [42] immersivemerchants.esp.
Found 3210 temporary and 74 persistent (3284 total) loaded references in [43] Smokin' Hot anime Package Merge.esp.
Found 148 temporary and 5 persistent (153 total) loaded references in [45] Complete Crafting Overhaul_Remade.esp.
Found 618 temporary and 79 persistent (697 total) loaded references in [48] Complete Alchemy & Cooking Overhaul.esp.
Found 75 temporary and 27 persistent (102 total) loaded references in [57] EatingSleepingDrinking.esp.
Found 792 temporary and 0 persistent (792 total) loaded references in [7B] RRR_ELFX-Patch.esp.
Found 1232 temporary and 138 persistent (1370 total) loaded references in [7C] Skyrim Immersive Creatures.esp.
Found 3910 temporary and 148 persistent (4058 total) loaded references in [7D] Beasts of Tamriel.esp.
Found 109 temporary and 36 persistent (145 total) loaded references in [7E] Immersive Wenches.esp.
Found 2681 temporary and 695 persistent (3376 total) loaded references in [7F] GTX Armors Merge.esp.
Found 1500 temporary and 26 persistent (1526 total) loaded references in [81] MilkMod_MilkPumpsFancy.esp.
Found 9306 temporary and 631 persistent (9937 total) loaded references in [82] xazPrisonOverhaulPatched.esp.
Found 897 temporary and 0 persistent (897 total) loaded references in [86] CWIELnFXPatch.esp.
Found 553 temporary and 277 persistent (830 total) loaded references in [89] SL Survival.esp.
Found 100 temporary and 19 persistent (119 total) loaded references in [8A] Skyrim Immersive Creatures - DLC2.esp.
Found 3762 temporary and 437 persistent (4199 total) loaded references in [8B] Ambriel.esp.
Found 54 temporary and 90 persistent (144 total) loaded references in [8C] RE_RealEstate.esp.
Found 208 temporary and 47 persistent (255 total) loaded references in [8D] JobsofSkyrim.esp.
Found 4217 temporary and 1157 persistent (5374 total) loaded references in [8E] Morskom.esp.
Found 175 temporary and 18 persistent (193 total) loaded references in [8F] Milk Addict.esp.
Found 86 temporary and 15 persistent (101 total) loaded references in [91] ZIA_Complete Pack.esp.
Found 554 temporary and 72 persistent (626 total) loaded references in [92] Wintersun - Faiths of Skyrim.esp.
Found 121 temporary and 0 persistent (121 total) loaded references in [93] SMIM-Merged-All.esp.
Found 4588 temporary and 283 persistent (4871 total) loaded references in [94] zMirai.esp.
Found 133297 temporary and 3117 persistent (136414 total) loaded references in [96] General Merge Pack Second.esp.
Found 29 temporary and 115 persistent (144 total) loaded references in [98] Immersive Encounters.esp.
Found 921 temporary and 106 persistent (1027 total) loaded references in [9B] ChaosDragons.esp.
Found 17404 temporary and 2263 persistent (19667 total) loaded references in [9C] Little Big Pack Merge.esp.
[SimpleSlavery_English.DLSTRINGS] Using encoding (from language): 1252  (ANSI - Latin I)
[SimpleSlavery_English.ILSTRINGS] Using encoding (from language): 1252  (ANSI - Latin I)
[SimpleSlavery_English.STRINGS] Using encoding (from language): 1252  (ANSI - Latin I)
Found 257 temporary and 61 persistent (318 total) loaded references in [9D] SimpleSlavery.esp.
Found 16230 temporary and 322 persistent (16552 total) loaded references in [9E] BrhuceLegacy.esp.
Found 30845 temporary and 1969 persistent (32814 total) loaded references in [A2] Clockwork.esp.
Found 341 temporary and 105 persistent (446 total) loaded references in [A3] Immersive Patrols II.esp.
Found 294 temporary and 26 persistent (320 total) loaded references in [A5] sr_FillThemUp.esp.
Found 557 temporary and 45 persistent (602 total) loaded references in [A6] UchihaClan.esp.
Found 80 temporary and 72 persistent (152 total) loaded references in [A7] Frostfall.esp.
Found 120 temporary and 12 persistent (132 total) loaded references in [A8] MiraakFollower.esp.
Found 296 temporary and 14 persistent (310 total) loaded references in [AD] xamnant.esp.
Found 4770 temporary and 867 persistent (5637 total) loaded references in [B1] flaho_shi_eagles_nest_ENG.esp.
Found 116 temporary and 53 persistent (169 total) loaded references in [B2] AemersRefuge-DG-DB.esp.
Found 1271 temporary and 306 persistent (1577 total) loaded references in [B3] HoamaiiClearskyHideout.esp.
Found 1040 temporary and 393 persistent (1433 total) loaded references in [B4] Moonwatch Manor.esp.
Found 184 temporary and 4 persistent (188 total) loaded references in [B5] KNM_Mour.esp.
Found 1307 temporary and 115 persistent (1422 total) loaded references in [B7] WorldEaterBeater.esp.
Found 1000 temporary and 72 persistent (1072 total) loaded references in [B9] Undriel_Ebongrove.esp.
Found 198 temporary and 5 persistent (203 total) loaded references in [BA] SOS - Shop.esp.
Found 5307 temporary and 1065 persistent (6372 total) loaded references in [BC] DwemerManorExotic.esp.
Found 6946 temporary and 35 persistent (6981 total) loaded references in [BE] darkproject.esp.
Found 1963 temporary and 146 persistent (2109 total) loaded references in [CA] Magic of the Magna-Ge.esp.
Found 3229 temporary and 216 persistent (3445 total) loaded references in [CB] Dwemertech - Magic of the Dwarves.esp.
Found 507 temporary and 8 persistent (515 total) loaded references in [CC] Sneak Tools.esp.
Found 1095 temporary and 22 persistent (1117 total) loaded references in [CE] Haem Projects Hermits Stump.esp.
Found 317 temporary and 695 persistent (1012 total) loaded references in [D2] vMYC_MeetYourCharacters.esp.
Found 257 temporary and 5 persistent (262 total) loaded references in [DD] Gray Fox Cowl - Alternative Start.esp.
Found 235 temporary and 21 persistent (256 total) loaded references in [DE] Apocalypse - The Spell Package.esp.
Found 799 temporary and 40 persistent (839 total) loaded references in [DF] Haem Projects Shalidor.esp.
Found 158 temporary and 40 persistent (198 total) loaded references in [EA] Ordinator - Perks of Skyrim.esp.
Found 1530 temporary and 962 persistent (2492 total) loaded references in [EB] Immersive Citizens - AI Overhaul.esp.
Found 641 temporary and 25 persistent (666 total) loaded references in [EC] RealisticWaterTwo.esp.
Found 138 temporary and 2 persistent (140 total) loaded references in [EF] Immersive Citizens - RRR patch.esp.
Found 20708 temporary and 623 persistent (21331 total) loaded references in [F0] Darkend.esp.
Found 973 temporary and 206 persistent (1179 total) loaded references in [F5] Alternate Start - Live Another Life.esp.
Found 737 temporary and 61 persistent (798 total) loaded references in [F7] HDT Armor Pack 2 Merge.esp.
Found 4564 temporary and 3 persistent (4567 total) loaded references in [FA] SoS, VW and 6paths Merge Pack.esp.
Found 321666 temporary and 141167 persistent loaded references, for a grand total of 462833 loaded references.
[04:53] Done: Applying script "count_loaded_refs_in_load_order", Elapsed Time: 04:53
 

 

Memory Usage right before the crash with those 2 enabled at once:

 

[GenioMaestro]

2 hours ago, killer8217 said:

at this point i will just assume that its happening due to some faulty merges.

I do not. I'm more in the side of 1 millon of references. But you must make some specific test.

 

Get a point where the game start. Remove the flag of master in any of the ESP's and start the game.

If you get the CTD, probably is because you get the 1 millon of references.

To verify it put again the flag as master in the ESP.

If you not get the CTD we can be totally sure is caused by the limit of 1 millon of references.

 

1 hour ago, killer8217 said:

Found 321666 temporary and 141167 persistent loaded references, for a grand total of 462833 loaded references.

That number not have any sense. Is below my reference count with 251 plugins.

Is practicaly imposible that you have that number with all yours merges actives.

But i see the merges in the list.

But the numbers not have any sense.

 

What is hapening here??? Do we have goblins?

Please, run again the script to verify the numbers.

[DarkChaoX]

2 hours ago, GenioMaestro said:

I do not. I'm more in the side of 1 millon of references. But you must make some specific test.

 

Get a point where the game start. Remove the flag of master in any of the ESP's and start the game.

If you get the CTD, probably is because you get the 1 millon of references.

To verify it put again the flag as master in the ESP.

If you not get the CTD we can be totally sure is caused by the limit of 1 millon of references.

 

That number not have any sense. Is below my reference count with 251 plugins.

Is practicaly imposible that you have that number with all yours merges actives.

But i see the merges in the list.

But the numbers not have any sense.

 

What is hapening here??? Do we have goblins?

Please, run again the script to verify the numbers.

They show the exact same numbers. The number was reduced due to me switching the quest esps into esms, which in turn gave a number of 0 Temporary references.

I used it in almost all reference heavy mods