SexLab Disparity

[lalabee]

How about add time since sex(including rape) and time since masturbation?

 

These two would be cool because it can make a 'need', not 'want'(arousual)!!

I know there is an option about 'time since rape', but that is different in some cases.

 

If I set penalty not to being raped, then strange situation comes up. I try to be raped, but can't prostitute.

[Lupine00]

Time since sex would be fairly straightforward.

Not sure about masturbation. Needs a look. Why would you want to explicitly distinguish it?

 

I mean I can imagine a character who you want to have an addiction specifically to masturbation, but it seems a bit niche, even for SLD  

[Nazzzgul666]

Why not just 'time since orgasm'? That masturbation counts as relief towards such an addiction would make sense imho.

 

Btw, do you currently work on the "breasts become heavy" features and how is that going? Those are the features i'm still lookin forward to mostly.^^

[lalabee]

3 hours ago, Lupine00 said:

Time since sex would be fairly straightforward.

Not sure about masturbation. Needs a look. Why would you want to explicitly distinguish it?

 

I mean I can imagine a character who you want to have an addiction specifically to masturbation, but it seems a bit niche, even for SLD  

Sorry, I can't write English well...

Well, You wrongly guessed

 

I always thought that masturbation should have penalty. Because getting high arousual has some penalty(Cursed Loot or SL Adv, you know).

 

So, If PC can masturbation freely in any time, penalty is meaningless, because PC can masturbate before something. SLAdv support the function that limits masturbate by considering it as crime, but not enough.

 

I know there is a chastity belt, but it blocks not only masturbation but others too. That can be a very huge penalty.

 

So, by setting some masturbation penalty, it removes "free lunch" and managing arousual is not easy, and eventually arousual penalty retrieves its meaning.

 

That is why I think "time since masturbation" has some usage and can be made in SLD

 

I wrote an practical example

 

1) I set SLAdv's rape function and gives OR in arousual condition.

2) I can masturbate before getting in to city.

3) arosual condition is meaningless now because after masturbation, my arousual will be 0.

4) But with masturbation penalty, PC can choose to masturbate or not to masturbate. So arousual condition have works well.

 

 

So, "Why not just 'time since orgasm'? That masturbation counts as relief towards such an addiction would make sense imho." is clearly not same as 'Time since masturbation"....

[Lupine00]

38 minutes ago, retrev said:

So, If PC can masturbation freely in any time, penalty is meaningless, because PC can masturbate before something. SLAdv support the function that limits masturbate by considering it as crime, but not enough.

In the SexLab Aroused arousal model, the penalty for masturbation is increased sex addiction and faster time-rate afterwards.

Though that's the down side of all sex in SLA. It's a fairly dumb model TBH.

 

I see what you are trying to do though.

 

 

I know I could detect solo animations, but that would be quite a lot of fiddling about.

 

If SexLab itself counts masturbations - and it probably does - that will be the easier way. I can use that pretty easily.

[chipstick]

On 12/31/2018 at 5:27 PM, Lupine00 said:

The time since rape feature is broken in SLD 12.

 

Perhaps I should issue an interim patch for that, as it's a trivial fix.

I fixed it ages ago in dev version and though that would soon be released at the time - but then I decided to do stuff I'd planned for the next phase right away, because each release adds a lot of overhead for me.

May I ask/cajole you for the patch then? Would love to play around with that.

 

BTW, would we be able to do inplace upgrades from one version to the other? Or would it require new games/"clean" saving?

 

I've ignored this mod since its release because I thought it only applied to bodymorphs. Realising it also interacts with arousal has really gotten my attention.

 

 

[Lupine00]

What I need to do, is finish the morphs support and push out V13.

There really isn't much to do so that I can do that.

 

I was planning to do the worn items support too, but it's been too long. That will have to wait for V14.

 

It is my intent that SLD will never require a clean save, as they are largely mythical. The upgrade is automatic if SLD is running already

The only downside of installing SLD V12 is that it has DD as a hard requirement. That is gone in V13, but of course once DD is in, you can't remove it, or its very large number of replacement animations.

 

I've done all my testing on games that had the old version installed first. I do need to go back and check that it works as a clean install though.

[Lupine00]

If you want to fix your own script, the important bit is that the calculation of "time since last raped" is back to front, resulting in negative time, that is interpreted as 'never been raped'.

There's a more subtle problem with the on game load code not running, which ironically masks another bug that would reset time since last raped incorrectly as well.

As the on load code doesn't run, that bug doesn't occur.

 

Fortunately, the lack of on load handling has a fairly minor impact. Probably only impacts soft-deps that magically vanished since last load.

Should all be fixed in V13. Then there will be new bugs!  

[Lupine00]

13 hours ago, chipstick said:

I've ignored this mod since its release because I thought it only applied to bodymorphs. Realising it also interacts with arousal has really gotten my attention.

V12 supports arousal, 'denial', which is days since last *orgasm*, 'sex addiction' value, and 'days since last raped'.

However, the last one is broken in V12, and always returns 'never been raped'.

 

It doesn't track 'days since last sex', which is somewhat different to days since orgasm.

 

V12 also support MME milk levels.

 

 

V13 fixes the existing known bugs. I might add the requested values as well, or that might get held back until later. Will see how it goes.

 

V13 adds support for apropos2, with slider sets for all the different W&T values that it normally shows you (overall, creature, daedric, vaginal, anal, oral).

 

Also, you can load and save multiple profiles; it's fairly easy to swap between them.

 

It improves configuration and options for staggers, trips and bleedouts, and some other things, and adds masturbation and rape as events you can trigger.

You can also ask friends and lovers to start an orgy for you.

 

It adds support for reading SLIF directly, and the intention is to support configurable weighting of body-morphs to create values for breast, belly, and butt inflation.

I wrote some code to read the SLIF values, but it still needs the menu.

 

 

I was going to do a ton of stuff for worn items/naked and other binary conditions, but no harm in putting that off until the next version.

My plan now is that V14 will be all about that, along with any small things that come up from 13.

[Lupine00]

2 hours ago, Nazzzgul666 said:

Btw, do you currently work on the "breasts become heavy" features and how is that going? Those are the features i'm still lookin forward to mostly.^^

Ah, this needs an output to create fake encumberance.

 

You can already remove carry limit, or mess with your movement speed, but I know that's not the same thing, though it sort of achieves the same results.

 

That stuff about falling over and not getting up ... well you can do falling over already ... the not getting up part is still a way away, as I need to implement crawling, and not screw up the animation resets that everyone screws up when they do crawling, and it needs not to fight SD+.

 

DF's crawling is still ... a bit broken and causes problems with sex scenes. Slaverun's has reset problems that have been sort of community patched. I don't want another lame crawling implementation that is all buggy, so I'm expecting it to take some time.

 

Rapes, that took a lot longer than I wanted. A lot. I would have skipped it if I'd known.

[chipstick]

19 hours ago, Lupine00 said:

What I need to do, is finish the morphs support and push out V13.

There really isn't much to do so that I can do that.

 

I was planning to do the worn items support too, but it's been too long. That will have to wait for V14.

 

It is my intent that SLD will never require a clean save, as they are largely mythical. The upgrade is automatic if SLD is running already

The only downside of installing SLD V12 is that it has DD as a hard requirement. That is gone in V13, but of course once DD is in, you can't remove it, or its very large number of replacement animations.

 

I've done all my testing on games that had the old version installed first. I do need to go back and check that it works as a clean install though.

*bounces up and down in anticipation*

 

Many thanks. Looking forward to it!

[Nazzzgul666]

22 hours ago, Lupine00 said:

Ah, this needs an output to create fake encumberance.

 

You can already remove carry limit, or mess with your movement speed, but I know that's not the same thing, though it sort of achieves the same results.

 

That stuff about falling over and not getting up ... well you can do falling over already ... the not getting up part is still a way away, as I need to implement crawling, and not screw up the animation resets that everyone screws up when they do crawling, and it needs not to fight SD+.

 

DF's crawling is still ... a bit broken and causes problems with sex scenes. Slaverun's has reset problems that have been sort of community patched. I don't want another lame crawling implementation that is all buggy, so I'm expecting it to take some time.

 

Rapes, that took a lot longer than I wanted. A lot. I would have skipped it if I'd known.

I'm trying to remember which problems you're talking about, but i don't use SD+ so that might be a huge point. I can't remember much problems with Slaverun (v2) except that after reloading the amputation framework took a while, but afaik that's rather unrelated to the crawling by default. You might check SLAV or ask VirginMarie for advice, there it's implemented quite flawless imho, although i'm not sure if it would break SD+.

 

Milk addict has a "trip & rape" feature that seems to work fine now, didn't test too much yet, though.

[NoirXiaoba]

I have kinda a strange bug report: SLDisparity does not recognize my installed XPM Skeleton and therefore does not activate. It's loaded and shows up in MCM, but all options are greyed out and the status screen claims that no XPMS was found.

[Lupine00]

1 hour ago, Nazzzgul666 said:

I'm trying to remember which problems you're talking about, but i don't use SD+ so that might be a huge point. I can't remember much problems with Slaverun (v2) except that after reloading the amputation framework took a while, but afaik that's rather unrelated to the crawling by default. You might check SLAV or ask VirginMarie for advice, there it's implemented quite flawless imho, although i'm not sure if it would break SD+.

I'm sure it will be feasible, just time consuming. Looking at the other mods, and figuring out what they did right and wrong, how to co-exist with them, and then actually delivering it, and wiring it usefully into features other than fall-and-can't get up, is bound to take longer than I think. So, first things first. It will get its day in the sun, but I have to finish the existing version, and clear away various responsibilities in reality before I can work on it.

[Lupine00]

1 hour ago, NoirXiaoba said:

I have kinda a strange bug report: SLDisparity does not recognize my installed XPM Skeleton and therefore does not activate. It's loaded and shows up in MCM, but all options are greyed out and the status screen claims that no XPMS was found.

I'm sure this has some common pattern to it, that will emerge, as common problems arise and are solved.

 

Right now, my only guess is that you have the skeleton, but you don't have the required scripts.

 

You need something that drags in the NiOverride scripts. Various mods install them.

Do you have an up to date Racemenu?

That is where my NiOverride script is coming from, but you can install it standalone, or pick it up from some other mods.

 

If your skeleton is being overridden by something else, so the extra nodes are lost, that will also cause it to fail.

So, if you use MO, but your XP32MSE skeleton is being overridden by ... some wacky mod that's later in the LO, it might not work.

 

I think that's a long shot, and your problem is probably missing scripts  -  somehow.

 

I keep my XP32MSE very low down in my left pane of MO, so it's one of the very last mods to overwrite.

[Lupine00]

1 hour ago, Nazzzgul666 said:

I can't remember much problems with Slaverun (v2)

In the latest (June?) beta, it keeps resetting the animation, whether it needs to reset or not, which wipes out DD overrides.

 

DF doesn't override the turn animations, causing extreme popping when SL rotates you in the pre-sex idle.

 

SD+ and SLAV, I don't recall any problems, though SD+ also has to cope with kneeling. I believe you pop in and out of kneel with SD+ when SL rotates for pre-sex. Funny, was looking at it just a few days ago. I know there's a minor 'pop' but nothing like the DF, crawl to stand 'flickering'.

[NoirXiaoba]

3 hours ago, Lupine00 said:

If your skeleton is being overridden by something else, so the extra nodes are lost, that will also cause it to fail.

It was indeed a problem with the skeleton being overwritten by an older file, so SLDisparity didn't recognize it any longer. After shuffling around a bit with the load order it now seems to work okay. Thanks for the fast and great help. ^^

[Bushi Neko]

I ve been using this a few days now. Other than a mistake I made on speed de-buff at first it's been great! Easy to fix the de-buff issue I created and the MCM is really well laid out and easy to follow.  It seems confusing on first glance, but taking a minute to look over the menu and it becomes clear.  My error was I went negative when I meant to go positive and didn't catch it. Fix? Change it back to positive.  

 

It's not messed up any game play so far for me. 

?

[Lupine00]

I am considering requiring SLIF for morph support.

 

The reason is that interrogating and totalling all the morph values is an expensive task to perform, or can be, if there are a non-trivial number of "keys" involved.

Typically, you will have one key per morph-aware mod.

Then you have to check/fetch for every morph, for every key, so it's an Morphs * Mods cost.

 

The only mod I'm aware of that uses morphs directly is MME, though I haven't looked that hard, it's possible there are many others, perhaps EC+?

So, in practice, the number of mods ought to be small.

SLIF can add a lot, but then you'd use SLIF ... but you could choose not to, and then you might have a lot of mods, and not go through the SLIF path.

 

I don't want to make the SLIF path obligatory if you have SLIF installed, but clearly, if I go down that path, the non-SLIF path is a second-class citizen anyway.

 

 

If you know of a mod that uses morphs, and you don't use SLIF, I'd like to hear you shout out, as I don't really know what the user-base is like on this.

 

 

I probably need to shunt the non-SLIF morph inspection off into a thread, so it's a bunch of extra work.

Most old mods don't bother with morphs though, and bash away at nodes, which can be pretty ugly.

 

Any thoughts?

 

 

[lolmods37]

MME has SLIF support or SLIF has MME support not sure, either way they work together

[Lupine00]

Is there anyone out there that has time to test a dev version of SLD?

 

It's quite a chore, as the following need testing:

Spoiler

 

 

1) Clean install

2) Upgrade over V12

3) With MME

4) Without MME

5) With SLIF with and without morphs

5) Without SLIF with and without morphs

6) With DD

7) Without DD

8] With Apropos2

9) Without Apropos2

10) What happens if SLA(R) missing

11) Misconfigured NiOverride

12) Check for events clash with Hormones

13) Check for events clash with DH

14) Check for events clash with DCL

 

And of course, that things are working generally, and any other mod combinations that seem especially likely to blow it up. SL Adventures perhaps? 

 

Here is my dev test of V13. It has a lot of debug spam in it, and will fill your log with crap.

Saves with it in will block upgrading to the proper release V13, so don't play anything you want to keep.

(Though you may be fine, if I don't make any changes to the ESP).

Reverting to a save prior to installing this will allow a proper update.

This installs on top of existing SLD. Should be automatic. Wait for the message in the top left - normally over very quickly unless you're installing other mods.

See the readme.

 

Now updated to beta 2!

Updated to beta 3 - fixes some missing tool-tips, extends node range up to 16.

 

Beta is over. Release is up.

 

If (and only if) you tested a beta, you will have some issues with installing the final release over the beta. The following explains how to fix this.

However, if you are on release V12, and never installed V13-beta, you are fine, and can upgrade to release V13 without doing anything special.

 

Spoiler

 

If you tested the V13 beta, this is what you need to do to avoid having to rollback to your V12 state.

 

1. Install the new release.
2. Go into the MCM.
3. Go to Load + Save page.
4. Save your current settings to a slot of your choosing.
5. Go to Debug page. 
6. Hit "Reset all Sliders"
7. Hit "Reset all Effects"
8. Hit "Reset the mod"
9. Quit the MCM
10. Open MCM, re-enable. Quit the MCM again.
11. Open MCM.
12. Go to Load + Save page.
13. Load your settings from the slot you used before.

 

 

Most things are self-explanatory if you used SLD already.

Morph support probably isn't. See below...

 

The morph system provides a way of deriving an artificial body-node value from morph changes.

Spoiler

 

SLD triggers changes off the node values it reads from your body, or from SLIF directly.

 

However, if a mod changes body shape via morphs, rather than simply changing the node value - MME and most SLIF patches work like this - then your node will always be 1.0 and so SLD does nothing interesting.

 

The way around this is to look at the morph changes relating to breasts, belly and butt and create a sort of imaginary node value from them.

This value is then fed into SLD instead of the real node value, so your buffs, debuffs and chances can work.

 

It doesn't happen unless you enable morph support.

 

For each group you can adjust the amount that each morph contributes to the final value.

For each morph you can offset it (make the value higher or lower by a fixed amount), to account for changes you made in your racemenu setup, or just because you like the result.

 

For each group you can adjust the scaling of the derived value - this is the easiest way to make the value bigger or smaller overall.

 

For each group you can adjust how it blends with the existing node value...

 

Let's say you have old mods that change the node, and new ones that change the morphs, and you don't have SLIF, then you want to take both the morphs and the node value into account, so you can set a 50% mix (use half node, half morphs), or an 80% mix (20% node, 80% morph) or anything between 0 and 100.

 

Note that 0 effectively disables the morphs for that group, you'll only get the node value.

 

There are also two "modes". In multiply mode, the morph value is multiplied by the node value, so that's another way to include the node value in your calculation, in replace mode, the node value is ignored except for the mix (as described above). 

 

Both multiply and replace support the mix percentage, but if you use multiply, you probably want 100% mix. This is most likely to match the appearance you see, but you may find it varies depending on how your mods change the nodes and morphs.

 

You can use morphs with SLIF, and it's more efficient. You probably should use them if you have SLIF, as it generally prefers to modify morphs, because the results are more controllable, especially for making giants boobs. Scaling the node values doesn't work that well, especially for a "perky" base model.

 

 

Another little feature of interest is the ability to tweak the trip/fall chances in and out of combat. This allows you to scale the chances up if you're in combat, so you can run around normally with the occasional mishap, but once you get in a fight, your clumsy legs will really punish you.

 

This feature was particularly designed to work with detection of DD items, but that feature won't appear until version 14 now.

 

 

SLD rapes are a bit different to how most rape mods do it. They are more restricted, but generally make better animation choices.

Spoiler

 

There is no creature rape support, and rapes are only for non-hostiles.

You can't be raped by enemies, or horses, or chickens. At least, that's my intent. If you can, let me know.

Combat defeat mods handle rape by enemies, so there's no point SLD getting mixed up in that.

 

You can't be raped by females either. They simply aren't supported, by design. Maybe this feels wrong to you, but this makes the cloak more efficient, and makes the animations make more sense, and saves me from doing gender sorting, The main reason I avoided it was because there are pretty much no lesbian rape animations, and so we end up with females magically conjuring up strap-ons. It feels so unimmersive to me, and plenty of mods do it already anyway.

 

As an aside, I wish I had access to some lesbian furniture animations with some bondage face-sitting. That would make sense to me. But if I was a female bandit, and the men decided to start raping a defeated captive, I'd get well away from that s**t before they decided I was fair game too.

 

SLD rapes involve a chase, but you always get caught. Always. If you aren't caught within a time limit, you fall over so they can catch you.

I might make it possible to escape in future, but I didn't want to make it too like SL Adventures.

Also, the chases are not really fair and balanced, so I don't think the escapes would be either.

Currently rapists get a speed buff (though it's mild). I think maybe it's better to debuff the player.

 

SLD masturbation makes you vulnerable to rapes if you enable it.

 

Because you don't get to choose where you masturbate, this creates a hazard for whatever you use to trigger the masturbates.

 

You may set a minimum rapist count. This may lead to fewer rapes overall, as if SLD can't find that many rapists, you won't get raped.

 

Rapists may appear to join a rape incrementally, but they should still obey the maximum rapists limit. So, if you set a min rapists of three and a max of nine, you may start off being raped by one guy, but at least two more will join, and no more than eight. But you might get raped by four straight off. It's somewhat random.

 

There are no follower control options. However, female followers can't rape you. 

 

If I ever extend this to support females, then a chance for follower rape or not is a likely addition. If you have a male follower... watch out.

 

You can set a chance that trips and falls will result in a rape check. Rapes can't happen if there are no attackers around though. In dungeons, for example, the only potential rapist around will be one you brought with you, and if your follower if female, she can't rape you. Sorry.

 

 

Other major additions:

• Visual effects
• Save and load settings to slots
• Apropos2 Wear and Tear values as inputs.

[Lupine00]

I found a small bug with a clean install. You see a message about it updating on your first load. It's fairly harmless, but not intended.

Obviously, clean installs shouldn't need to update. I guess some mods work that way though. I haven't found any other problems yet.

[Ekirts Ykcul]

Hi there,

 

thanks for releasing your dev-version for testing. Unfortunately i have very little time at the moment to try out all the great new features you implemented.

 

After a quick testrun i found the following:

 

- SLIF found, looks like values are read correctly

- Apropos 2 found, values are read correctly

- Save and Load works for sliders but it looks like the checked boxes (example activate Wear&Tear, activate arousal, ...) are not checked or vice versa not unchecked after loading

- tested the new rape mechanic with some values after stumbling / tripping / falling. It looks like everything is working fine. The animations are choosen pretty fast and work with multiple participants. Maybe its just my mod configuration at the moment but in comparison to other systems i used before it works incredibly smooth and fast. Great work.

- one bug/debug-feature/problem though the rapists are renamed after the event. Saving and loading the game does not fix this. (NPC name is "[...] Rapist [...] ZERO")

- visual effects seem to work great too

 

Thank you very much for creating such a detailed system to combine all those values and consequences to tailor the Skyrim/Sexlab experiance to ones liking.

 

Keep up the good work

 

[Edit:] The testing was done on an existing save with a previously installed version of Sexlab Disparity and many other mods active. The installation runs pretty stable but i did not check for any conflicts with SDi.

[Lupine00]

Thanks for this useful feedback.

 

4 hours ago, Ekirts Ykcul said:

- one bug/debug-feature/problem though the rapists are renamed after the event. Saving and loading the game does not fix this. (NPC name is "[...] Rapist [...] ZERO")

Is just one rapist renamed? Or several?

 

I thought I had fixed this; it's in the ESP. Originally, I tagged all rapists so I could debug their AI, then later only one rapist, to make sure he was coming out of his alias.

However, they would reliably be returned back to their normal names at the end of the rape.

 

It sounds like the flags didn't take properly in the save when I cleaned this behaviour off the aliases.

 

I might have to fix it in Tes5Edit or something if the CK won't do as its told.

 

Rapists not renamed at the end of the rape is an odd/bad sign. I'll check the ESP and make sure it is definitely gone for release.

At this point it's unclear if they are still in the alias, or whether they aren't be renamed. It could be either.

 

You can test if they're still in the alias, because you can't have a proper conversation with them, they'll just make rape comments.

If you could confirm this detail, would be great.

 

As long as this was just one rapist, I've fixed this. Was a basic failure to operate 7zip on my part. Never hit OK to make new archive and so it was an old one.

 

I'll look at the checkboxes too. It's possible they were consistently missed.

This turned out to be more of a puzzle than expected. They were being written out and read back just fine...

Then overwritten with values pulled back from the co-save.

Now fixed.

 

Working on uploading a new dev-test with all known issues fixed. Shouldn't be long.

 

Now updated, see original post.

[Ekirts Ykcul]

Such a fast update. Thanks.

 

I did another testrun with the new version (beta 2).

This is what i found:

 

- discovered the morphs section. didnt try it but looks like a huge amount of additional customization options.

- tested the save&load funktion again. the checkboxes work now. thank you for the quick fix.

- Set the rape chance to 100 for breast 0.00 to 6.00 for testing purposes. Works just fine. Got the debug messages in the top left corner and action with 10 participants.

- none of the above mentioned participants got renamed. testet again with just one participant, no renaming either. Looks like that bug was squashed.

- noticed the vibrant visual option has no description/tooltip

 

Some suggestions:

- more detailed options for rape initiation, outcomes or as mentioned in previous posts tie in to sl adventures or other mods. It gets more and more difficult to remember which mod  

  initiates rape under what circumstance.   (maybe not that high a priority, i dont know which direction you want to take your mod)

 

- visual effect for saturation, from bleak to oversaturated

   (dont know if the vibrant visual option does this already)

 

- integration with Sexlab PayCrime or a similar system. I would love to start with being able to pay really huge bounties by offering a blowjob and get that amount reduced by values

   like how many times victim, how many sex acts, maybe bad reputation.

   (I think Devious Mind Break does something similar by changing the values in Sexist Guards)

 

Your MCM has to be the one with the most detailed tooltips ever. Thank you for your great work. ?