My saved games have a quirk

[Psalam]

For the longest time I have had a quirk with my saves. This has happened in any number of playthroughs with many different mods in each playthrough. The quirk goes like this. I load a savegame and my character can not use WASD to move. She can jump. I can use "enter". I can not use "R" to equip weapons. When this occurs I simply quit the game (all of Skyrim) and restart. When I reload the same save there is no problem (I once had this happen over and over with a save and had to go back to the previous save but only once). I'd say it happens about once in every 10 saves but it is not consistent. It can happen on every other save for 3 episodes and then go days before it happens again. 

I haven't been (and really I'm still not) worried about it since it is an annoyance and hasn't REALLY caused a problem. I am curious if anyone has any idea of what might cause such a nuisance.

[rafael666]

Not much to go on.  Just guessing I would say you have a mod conflict and/or a dirty save.  Try using a save game tool and then see if it persists.

[Guest]

Does changing between 3rd and 1st person cam helps? Sometimes I can't move my char until I switch camera (happens mostly when I have a mod altering movement speed).

[Psalam]

Thanks, but:

1) This has happened with many different combinations of mods. Only a very few well-known and widely used mods are in my load order all the time. I do not believe that a mod conflict is likely (unless it's between said widely used mods and, if it is, hopefully someone will recognize this and let me know), and

2) While I have used save cleaners on my saves on numerous occasions this does not act like a dirty save because it has happened in many (over thirty) different playthroughs where I have started from a new game.

[Psalam]

Sadly, no. This happens in both first and third person. Most of the time I play in first person and so may save comes up in first person. Some mods bring my character up from saves in third person. Same thing either way. Same problem if I change point of view. But thanks. All help is appreciated.

[GenioMaestro]

The next time you have the problem, go to the ZAZ MCM and see if you have the motion controls blocked.

If they are blocked by ZAZ you have the answer. Use the ZAZ MCM to regain control of your player.

 

If ZAZ says that the control is not blocked, DO THE SAME, try to release controls with ZAZ.

If you regain control of your player, you have another answer.

[Psalam]

Spoiler

8 hours ago, GenioMaestro said:

The next time you have the problem, go to the ZAZ MCM and see if you have the motion controls blocked.

If they are blocked by ZAZ you have the answer. Use the ZAZ MCM to regain control of your player.

 

If ZAZ says that the control is not blocked, DO THE SAME, try to release controls with ZAZ.

If you regain control of your player, you have another answer.

 

That would give me the culprit, certainly. But if that doesn't work do you think that using enable player controls in the console might "fix" it in the short run? 

[Psalam]

As fate would have it my quirk popped up this morning so:

1) completely unaffected by going into ZAP and releasing the controls there, and

2) when I went into the console (yes the tilde key worked) I discovered that I could still not use any key that was tied to a player control (with the exception of the spacer. So, when I tried to type "player" I got "y".

[GenioMaestro]

31 minutes ago, Psalam said:

  Reveal hidden contents

 

That would give me the culprit, certainly. But if that doesn't work do you think that using enable player controls in the console might "fix" it in the short run? 

Really, that only say you WHY you can't move your player, but is NOT a definitive solution.

The problem is inside a bad mod making bad things, and that is a BIG ALERT.

You MUST load the savegame again and NOT PLAY releasing the controls with ZAZ.

Is NOT recomended play with a BAD load game, that can give you a lot of aditional problems like corrupted saves.

You can make it ONLY for try locate the problematic mod.

 

Probably, some mod are doing something wrong in the OnPlayerLoadGame event and inappropriately deactivate the controls of the players. NOT ALWAYS the blocking of the controls is done with the ZAZ functions and the lock is not ALWAYS shown in the MCM of ZAZ because some mods call the game directly to block the controls, but normally ZAZ can restore the controls. 

 

Why did it happen only sometimes? Evident, a mod doing bad things.

 

When the game loads a saved game, it launches a hundred of OnPlayerLoadGame events and each event is processed in a different thread, sorted according to the priority of the Quest and the load order.

When a mod does only things related to its own mod, this is not a problem, but other times, the mod must connect to other mods and sometimes the game executes one thread before another and that gives a malfunction.

 

You can have a load order problem or a bad compatibility patch or an unupdated mod.

If you locate a problem in a mod the creator of the mod must change the priority of the Quest or add a wait function in the OnPlayerLoadGame event for increase compatibility with others mod's.

[GenioMaestro]

28 minutes ago, Psalam said:

As fate would have it my quirk popped up this morning so:

1) completely unaffected by going into ZAP and releasing the controls there, and

2) when I went into the console (yes the tilde key worked) I discovered that I could still not use any key that was tied to a player control (with the exception of the spacer. So, when I tried to type "player" I got "y".

That can be a totally diferent problem... 

Have you any special mod that change the console?

If you can NOT write to the console ONLY can be for a program that eat the key press.

 

Maybe are you playing with a CONTROLER???  A game pad or a special mouse with more than 3 buttons??

Are you ussing any compatibility program for the controler like x360ce or JoyToKey??

[Psalam]

Spoiler

15 minutes ago, GenioMaestro said:

That can be a totally diferent problem... 

Have you any special mod that change the console?

If you can NOT write to the console ONLY can be for a program that eat the key press.

 

Maybe are you playing with a CONTROLER???  A game pad or a special mouse with more than 3 buttons??

Are you ussing any compatibility program for the controler like x360ce or JoyToKey??

 

No controller. Razer Keyboard and mouse.

As I said before, and as happened this morning, what gets me is that when it happens I can simply stop Skyrim (doing absolutely nothing else) and restart Skyrim (doing nothing else) and reload the save game that just gave me this result (doing nothing else) and the game works just fine.

It doesn't seem to occur more frequently as I go through a playthrough like I have had happen with a corrupt save, It occurs intermittently and, as best I can tell, entirely randomly. If it is true to form I might very well not have a problem through the entire weekend.

[GenioMaestro]

https://steamcommunity.com/app/72850/discussions/0/490125737458829858/

 

Maybe you have Razer Synapse installed??

 

Razer Synapse is our unified configuration software that allows you to rebind controls or assign macros to any of your Razer peripherals and saves all your settings automatically to the cloud. No more tedious device configurations when you arrive at LAN parties or tourneys, as you can pull them from the cloud, and get owning right away.

[Psalam]

Yes I have Razer Synapse. I have disabled the macro feature. Please bear in mind that I use this keyboard for many other functions than just playing Skyrim, like talking on threads. I only have this problem when I load Skyrim saves. No other time. It appears that it MUST be related to something in Skyrim (mods, etc.) although I grant that my peripherals may be interacting with them.

[GenioMaestro]

Simply search in Google "razer synapse game problem"----> 200k results...

 

The problem, of course is in Skyrim, but not only in Skyrim...

The problem come from HOW the directx libraries and the Operating System catch and process the key press.

As expert C++ programer, I can  aseverate you that the process is very complex and sometimes very chaotic.

Some times depend of OS libraries, others times of drivers versions, and some times from directx versions.

 

Some games have his own directx library in the game directory and not use all the directx dll's from OS.

Sometimes, externals programs that catch the keys not return it in the correct way for the corresponding directx version and/or DLL of the game.

 

One of the best point for learn about that is the x360ce forums and source code.

[Psalam]

Spoiler

Thanks, I'll check into it.

As you know, I just did a DirectX upgrade (part of the process that you recommended). That does not seem to have made any difference with this however.

 

[donttouchmethere]

maybe it an effect from slave tats

careful looong shot incoming (because it should block all your controls):

if they get added by barefoot realism or rape tatoos  or yourself via slavetats your inventory gets locked for a short time, sometimes longer (older game)

thats what @WaxenFigure and @Monoman1 had to say about that:

 

 

On 2/23/2018 at 5:28 PM, Monoman1 said:

So I think I've solved this. 

The problem is something to do with the mod Fade Tattoos or Fade Tattoos interaction with slavetats. Specifically, line 1251 of SlaveTats.psc: 

Commented that out and recompiled and so far I have yet to notice the menu being locked when it shouldn't be. 

I realize there's probably a very good reason for controls to be disabled but at this stage my sanity demands this solution. 

 

Actually a big part of the problem is caused by using the new versions of FadeTats and RapeTats and then having dozens of women in an area that all have tattoos on them.  The more tattooed people the longer it takes to adjust them all and the more often you have the "silent" and SLOW "Please wait while Slavetats works on ..." process going with of course your controls disabled.

 

FadeTats frequently runs through all of the tattooed people and adjusts their tattoos calling Slavetats with it's disable player controls for each one.

 

I made a patch similar to yours to the script but it only disables and then re-enables player controls when the action is silent.  If you see the "please wait" it still does the disable and enable as before.

 

Anyone using the patch will have to manually place the .PEX file (the .PSC file is included but not needed unless you make your own changes to the script).

 

SlaveTatsNoSilentDisable.7z
 

[Psalam]

Spoiler

2 minutes ago, donttouchmethere said:

maybe it an effect from slave tats

if they get added by barefoot realism or rape tatoos  or yourself via slavetats your inventory gets locked for a short time, sometimes longer (older game)

thats what @WaxenFigure and @Monoman1 had to say about that:

 

 

  Hide contents

 

 

Actually a big part of the problem is caused by using the new versions of FadeTats and RapeTats and then having dozens of women in an area that all have tattoos on them.  The more tattooed people the longer it takes to adjust them all and the more often you have the "silent" and SLOW "Please wait while Slavetats works on ..." process going with of course your controls disabled.

 

FadeTats frequently runs through all of the tattooed people and adjusts their tattoos calling Slavetats with it's disable player controls for each one.

 

I made a patch similar to yours to the script but it only disables and then re-enables player controls when the action is silent.  If you see the "please wait" it still does the disable and enable as before.

 

Anyone using the patch will have to manually place the .PEX file (the .PSC file is included but not needed unless you make your own changes to the script).

 

SlaveTatsNoSilentDisable.7z
 

 

 

Certainly worth considering. I do have slavetats in this game but I can not swear that it has always been present when this has happened. It is certainly NOT caused (in my game) by a large number of females with tats since my character is the only one who has one at this point in this game. I don't use it enough to make a difference and may just leave it off in my next new game in order to see if that resolves the issue.

[Monoman1]

Don't think I've ever seen that happen and I've been doing skyrim a long time. 

 

I get the feeling this isn't a mod problem but a keyboard/driver/skyrim problem. If it was a mod problem then quiting the game and reloading a save where you are already stuck via disableplayercontrols would never free you in my experience. You would still be stuck. 

 

the fact that the keys arent working in the console is important. Maybe next time it happens alt tab to the desktop and see if the keys still work in notepad etc. Or unplug the keyboard and plug it in again. Or switch control to a gamepad if you have one and see if you can move with it. 

 

Edit: it's definitely not the slavetats problem though. That only locked menus not movement. 

[Psalam]

As I said, I don't use a controller but all the rest of it makes sense. I'll add the alt tab to the list of things to try (those keys seem to work). Fortunately, some of the keys and the mouse work so it's not like I have to restart the computer. Depending on the timing of when it recurs I may try the slavetat thing anyway - nothing ventured, nothing gained.

[GenioMaestro]

1 hour ago, Monoman1 said:

the fact that the keys arent working in the console is important. Maybe next time it happens alt tab to the desktop and see if the keys still work in notepad etc.

45 minutes ago, Psalam said:

I'll add the alt tab to the list of things to try (those keys seem to work).

Very good idea... i'm with Monoman1 and add the trick of press crtl+alt+sup and select task manager for get access to the desktop if alt+tab not work.

But maybe the keys can work perfect in notepad or web browser because the problem can be in the redirection of the keys inside the directx libraries.

 

I think the problem is not related to mod's and the problem is Razer Synapse and/or Windows 10.

You can try make a batery of test.

Enable Razer Synapse and open your game 20 times.

Open the console from the main menu WITHOUT load game or new game.

If you can NOT write normally to the console the problem can NOT be related to mod's because is imposible execute a script before load game or new game.

Press alt+tab or crtl+alt+sup, DISABLE Razer Synapse and return to game.

If the problem instantly disappear you have locate the problem. Look for an updated version of Razer Synapse.

If the problem persist can be a problem in device drivers or directx libraries.

 

If you can write normally to the console but the problem appear AFTER load the game can be a mod problem, but is too strange because, as i know, a mod can NOT PROHIBIT write some keys to the console.

[Psalam]

I'm afraid that you've confused me on a detail so let me try to rewrite it to make certain I understood correctly. What you are suggesting is that I open the Skyrim game to the main menu, open the console and see if I can type into it. Regardless of the result I should then load Skyrim to see if my movement is restricted, or not. The number 20 times is simply meant to do it as many times as it takes to get a save that "freezes."

Once I've done that with Razer Synapse "on" I should repeat it with Razer Synapse "off." 

Now, I'm happy to do the experiment but I believe my Razer Synapse is always "off" now but I can't confirm that since I am not at my home computer right now. I turned it off months ago because of the incessant upgrades interrupting my game. And, before anyone jumps on that as my cause my problem predates turning it off but it might not predate getting this keyboard and mouse (I have had them for a long time now).

[GenioMaestro]

You say that the problem appear one time of each 10, then i say 20 times for be sure the problem appear.

Probably, if you can write normally to the console before load the save game, when you load it all run good.

But if you can NOT write normally to the console WITHOUT load the savegame, when you load it i'm totally SURE you can't move your player.

Then, for make the things FAST, is not necesary you load a savegame.

And make the test with Razer Synapse because the problem can be in Razer Synapse.

 

Simply open the game, open the console and write. Works good?? Close and repeat.

Until the problem appear and your game not let you write normally to the console.

In that moment, press alt+tab and take corrective actions for try locate the problem.

Close Razer Synapse and return to game. If problem persist close all background programs, like fps monitor, printer monitor, all icons that you have in the lower rigth corner near the clock, and return to game. If persist, disable ANTIVIRUS(some have game mode) and return to game.

If persist, close your game, restart the machine and look for updated drivers and/or Directx.

 

If you open and close your game 20 times WITHOUT load the savegame and the problem NOT appear, then, and only then, can be a problem in a mod. And you must make LONG test loading the savegame and disabling mod's for locate the problematic mod.

[Psalam]

Got it. I'll get on it when I get home.

[Psalam]

So, methodology:

I ran SKSE from Steam as I usually do. When the main menu showed I opened the console using the tilde (~) key since mine is an English keyboard and typed in the word "rewashed." Lo and behold on the 9th attempt I could get no letters.

So now I have to go back and try the corrective actions as described above.

[Psalam]

Looks like it's Razer. 

This time it took 8 attempts to keep the console from working. I went out, got Razer's functions off, went back in and can type. Now all I have to do is see if it will stay this way.

 

Now, does anyone have a suggestion for a good game keyboard and mouse when I decide I've had enough of messing with this?