A Post Nuclear World

[DigitalP]

Have a read of this article

http://motherboard.vice.com/blog/chernobyls-trees-wont-decay-increasing-risk-of-nuclear-forest-fire

 

Basically it supports what Bethseda has done. Why there is lots of debris, why skeletons are still intact, why buildings are still standing and boarded up and the colour pallet used in the game. 

 

Put simply in a post nuclear world the many naturally occuring things that even today in our advanced society rely on do not exist. Think about this. Take Autumn or your compost heap. It's natural organisms that cause them to rot away and form mulch and a damp sludge........Those organisms don't exist to remove the organic matter or any matter that is biodegradable. Even steel only rusts due to organic circumstances. 

 

And this doesn't even include the nuclear winter that occurred that would have lasted by best estimates a good 50 years basically freezing everything above ground in place. 

 

As for boarded up buildings. Still working on a theory for that. 

 

 

[Guest MonsterFish]

You seem to be forgetting that in Fallout the world is actively populated with raiders, merchants, traders, caravans, feral dogs and just about anyone that, when they do come across a skeleton or a building, they may mess with it.

 

As opposed to Chernobyl which has been abandoned since 1986

 

And besides, things like trees are eaten by microorganisms, the same microorganisms that could survive boilling water and would likely be little affected by radiation. Even if those microorganisms were to be somehow mutated their primary objective is to survive and to survive they must eat. The bag of leaves thing is interesting and I can't really come up with any viable theory as to why, possibly because the microorganisms have some semblance of knowing which leaves are radioactive and which aren't.

 

As for boarded up buildings my theory is that raiders actively put fresh ones there as a warning for other raiders not to raid this place as everything that hasn't been nailed down has been stripped and there's no use looking in there. But that does bring up the question of where do they get the boards in the first place?

[sen4mi]

Chernobyl was only officially abandoned: http://thebabushkasofchernobyl.com/

 

 

And there's also a lot of green and wildlife growing there - now that most people have left.

 

 

But.. thinking this through... all those radiers and supermutants and so on? *they* I think would justify the lack of much green growing in the fallout settings.

[Gameplayer]

Microbes are dead or otherwise absent, and that means that the dead tree's are basically still there.

Which means you have a lot of very dry kindling just waiting around for a spark to happen or for the ambient temperatures to get hot enough that those stacks of dry leaves that are not degrading finally achieve ignition.

 

Its a wonder that the piles of dead vegetation haven't already spontaneously combusted but it likely has something to do with the fact that since there are generally no microbes.  The microbes themselves producing waste products that would raise temperatures to ignition levels in those piles of dead debris.

[Guest kimbale]

If there were no "microbes" there wouldn't even be a breathable athmosphere.

 

It's more in line with other extinction events in our planets history, most things die - those which survive fill the "gaps" over time.

And that is kinda where the whole Fallout idea comes from, i mean ... vaults ffs!

[Chbaakal]

You seem to be forgetting that in Fallout the world is actively populated with raiders, merchants, traders, caravans, feral dogs and just about anyone that, when they do come across a skeleton or a building, they may mess with it.

 

As opposed to Chernobyl which has been abandoned since 1986

 

And besides, things like trees are eaten by microorganisms, the same microorganisms that could survive boilling water and would likely be little affected by radiation. Even if those microorganisms were to be somehow mutated their primary objective is to survive and to survive they must eat. The bag of leaves thing is interesting and I can't really come up with any viable theory as to why, possibly because the microorganisms have some semblance of knowing which leaves are radioactive and which aren't.

 

As for boarded up buildings my theory is that raiders actively put fresh ones there as a warning for other raiders not to raid this place as everything that hasn't been nailed down has been stripped and there's no use looking in there. But that does bring up the question of where do they get the boards in the first place?

 

For the bags of leaves theory, I think that radiation would have destroyed any viable nutritional value to microorganisms. Regular dead leaves aren't completely 'dead' to bacteria.

 

As for the buildings, no survivors would give a rat's ass about boarding up houses, unless for creating defensive positions in close proximity to their encampments, or for keeping dangerous areas (creature and humanoid infestations) closed off. The other buildings would have been practically raped for any resources, including lumber, to sustain any group of survivors taking up residence close by. Even the brave, curious and/or greedy wouldn't let a few boards come between a possible treasure trove of tradeable, useful materials.

 

Oh, and just one of many things missing that Derpthesda didn't include that bothers me; Why in (insert fictitional deity's name) is there no such thing as a crowbar in this universe? They'd be quite handy as tools or weapons, ya'know.... ....Gordon wants one.

 

[DigitalP]

Further thoughts. 

 

After a global nuclear exchange a nuclear winter would last between 20 to 50 years. Basically destroying all agriculture and there would be roughly a 70 to 90 percent drop in the global human population. Boston's metro population is currently 4,628,910 so based on that we are left with roughly 700,000 people. Add in the fact that according to the opening sequence even Sanctuary was effected by the shockwave there would hardly be anyone left alive who is not in shelter. 

 

Diamond City

 

https://goo.gl/maps/tmuufYezpsN2

 

Bunker Hill

 

https://goo.gl/maps/RfU3iimZnXK2

 

Goodneighbour

 

https://goo.gl/maps/qpgj7rbpnJ72

 

Thats the location of the major settlements plus a few scattered farms, raider camps and the Gunners headquarters. 

 

The rough area of Fo4 in real life

https://goo.gl/maps/KyxjAAB53CU2

 

Now when you consider this. There would barely be a thousand people left living in the Commonwealth. Combine that with the Nuclear winter, radiation levels, raider activity there is actually very little reason to go out scavaging since all three sites are close to places that have all the necessities. Diamond City has police rationing site, hardware town, prospect reservoir, Goodneighbor has vault 114 and Bunker Hill is close to the rivers and is on the main trade routes. 

 

 

[Zor2k13]

There is a crow bar in the game it is called a tire iron yeah I know but it is slightly more useful since you can upgrade it with a blade.

 

There was some kind of site that would allow you to see different types of nuclear destruction based on known data about the three big idiot super powers weapons?

 

 

[Guest MonsterFish]

For the bags of leaves theory, I think that radiation would have destroyed any viable nutritional value to microorganisms. Regular dead leaves aren't completely 'dead' to bacteria.

 

 

I actually gave this a thought last night and it came across my mind that the microorganisms in fact ARE eating the leaves which would explain why the leaves are 40% decayed but are then dying off because you know, radiation be bad and eating that radiation is a big no-no. Slows down the rate of decay as opposed to the regular leaves.

 

[Kendo 2]

Decomposition requires two things; oxygen and moisture.  The presence of microbes, bacteria, insects, worms, etc. aren't needed and if they are absent decay happens on the atomic level, like oxide (rust) on carbon-based metals.

 

All of the standing structures in the Fallout universe defy one major factor in nature, and that's fire.  Either set intentionally by humans, the result of methane accumulation or a lighting strike, fires will happen.  In fact that Motherboard article is about this very thing.  How the leap was made from that article to 'the Bethesda devs got it right' is mystery though.

 

If anyone is interested (doubtful) there is a book named Warday.  It is worth reading for any post-apocalyptic genre fan.

[Snoopy101]

Isn't the nuclear exchange only between China and the US ? That would leave plenty of regions from where microbes, animals, plant seeds etc. could migrate.

 

Also it does strike me odd that there is farming with the produce being safe for consumption, but allegedly no trees, bushes, gras or other green. That just doesn't seem right. more than 200 years after a nuclear war, Boston should look more like a collection of Maya ruins in the Jungle than piles of concrete with only sprinkles of gras in between.

[sen4mi]

Isn't the nuclear exchange only between China and the US ? That would leave plenty of regions from where microbes, animals, plant seeds etc. could migrate.

 

Also it does strike me odd that there is farming with the produce being safe for consumption, but allegedly no trees, bushes, gras or other green. That just doesn't seem right. more than 200 years after a nuclear war, Boston should look more like a collection of Maya ruins in the Jungle than piles of concrete with only sprinkles of gras in between.

 

I think maybe they were trying to emulate a "hollywood can't get anything right" sort of thing...

[Jazzman]

In the not actively involved Southern hemisphere and especially in the Deep South (where I live), we were told, we'd have a couple of years left in the Fallout to make our will under changed climatic conditions, of course only those of us who live in rural areas with access to increasingly radiated water, rapidly dwindling livestock/wildlife and sufficient firewood (and ammunition) to make a brief last stand in the grey, marauder-infested cold. The Northern hemisphere, however, would turn into a uninhabitable glowing sea for ages, not just a multiple Chernobyl for some time. Nobody would survive there for a quarter, not even a ghoulified carrion feeder or cannibal and nobody from outside would ever immigrate to that hell where the devil holds sway... by foot or canoe following the stars he barely could see on the blurred night sky. End of human stupidity, it'd be the Age of the Cockroach. Making the Wasteland a better place... by rebuilding the very same devastating social (and political) structures that have led to the Fallout? C'mon guys, tell that the raiders driven by nagging thirst and hunger before they kill ya w/o much fuss...

[sen4mi]

In the not actively involved Southern hemisphere and especially in the Deep South (where I live), we were told, we'd have a couple of years left in the Fallout to make our will under changed climatic conditions, of course only those of us who live in rural areas with access to increasingly radiated water, rapidly dwindling livestock/wildlife and sufficient firewood (and ammunition) to make a brief last stand in the grey, marauder-infested cold. The Northern hemisphere, however, would turn into a uninhabitable glowing sea for ages, not just a multiple Chernobyl for some time. Nobody would survive there for a quarter, not even a ghoulified carrion feeder or cannibal and nobody from outside would ever immigrate to that hell where the devil holds sway... by foot or canoe following the stars he barely could see on the blurred night sky. End of human stupidity, it'd be the Age of the Cockroach. Making the Wasteland a better place... by rebuilding the very same devastating social (and political) structures that have led to the Fallout? C'mon guys, tell that the raiders driven by nagging thirst and hunger before they kill ya w/o much fuss...

 

And, do not forget, also: when a nuclear reaction goes off, there will be nothing to stop it until it destroys the entire world. This is why planets do not exist.

[Jazzman]

And, do not forget, also: when a nuclear reaction goes off, there will be nothing to stop it until it destroys the entire world. This is why planets do not exist.

Aye, apparently there is a decisive obstacle for any civilization in the universe - the Nuclear Age. Most civilizations fail at it, scientists believe based on the fact that we had no signal response yet after some 80 years of sending radio signals happily into space with the speed of light. Instead, they'd probably have blown themselves up w/o ever leaving low orbit because the collective mind, the way populations think and act, would by far not keep pace with the technological development - Moore's law goes for the AI, not for the biological mind. In the year 2016 I tend to agree - state officials as 'the state' act in a frakkin' stupid and really life-endangering way no average, modern citizen that hasn't yet lost their marbles would ever accept as an individual, but as a collective they remarkably do. Insect-like group think and the common lack of risk assessment that inevitably comes with it might easily annihilate us, that's for sure.

[sen4mi]

 

And, do not forget, also: when a nuclear reaction goes off, there will be nothing to stop it until it destroys the entire world. This is why planets do not exist.

Aye, apparently there is a decisive obstacle for any civilization in the universe - the Nuclear Age. Most civilizations fail at it, scientists believe based on the fact that we had no signal response yet after some 80 years of sending radio signals happily into space with the speed of light. Instead, they'd probably have blown themselves up w/o ever leaving low orbit because the collective mind, the way populations think and act, would by far not keep pace with the technological development - Moore's law goes for the AI, not for the biological mind. In the year 2016 I tend to agree - state officials as 'the state' act in a frakkin' stupid and really life-endangering way no average, modern citizen that hasn't yet lost their marbles would ever accept as an individual, but as a collective they remarkably do. Insect-like group think and the common lack of risk assessment that inevitably comes with it might easily annihilate us, that's for sure.

 

 

I was being totally sarcastic, but the problem with the state is not so much the state but something else which is extremely difficult to talk about (because if it would be easy to talk we would have been talking about it already).

 

The purpose and justification of the state is to dampen catastrophic changes. The problem comes when that is overdone and you get reverse catastrophes.

 

We are right now in the middle of one of those "reverse catastrophes". 

 

I think the underlying mechanism has to do with amplifying governance to the point where it prevents the transfer of critical knowledge between generations. But, whatever the causes, innovation and hard work and practical knowledge has been partitioned in a way that ...

 

... well, essentially, that nuclear age you are talking about? Most of the people with the actual practical know how for that stuff can be made to work are dead now. So that leaves outfits like north korea and maybe iran or pakistan or wherever with the knowledge of how to make that stuff work (which, as it happens, is also the knowledge you need for how to regulate it - if you just try to follow some rote set of rules without the practical side of what those rules are about you get the "frakkin stupid and really life-endangering" stuff you were talking about).

 

I imagine there must still be some of the relevant knowledge left in the u.s., somewhere, but most everything nuclear over here was literally built by people who are all dead (of old age) now. We got so scared of nuclear problems (and for good reason) that we regulated it out of existence. But our regulations mostly only apply to ourselves (because that is how regulations work). Meanwhile, our news organizations have mostly been going the way of buzzfeed (or, worse, the news outfits that repeat and blow up rumor without giving enough detail to know who to talk to to try to verify whatever they are claiming) and nowadays it's routine for people to only trust the news when it's people making up stuff that no one has any way of verifying. No one really cares, it seems like. Unless it has to do with people they talk to personally.

 

If it sounds scary, and if it can be an excuse to mostly not do anything, we believe it. But actually turning that into something useful?

 

That is the hard part. And by hard I mean frustrating and time consuming.

 

Anyways... if we are going to be responsible about that nuclear thing (which, by the way, was invented by people who did not have computers or even calculators and so long ago that most of the fundamental details are available in just about every country on the planet) we are going to need to have at least some people with practical problem solving experience involved. And, mostly, that's not people living in the usa, nowadays... 

 

I am just scratching the surface of the problems. And I might be off base on some of the details? If you notice something I said that is wrong here, please point me towards the details so I can try to understand better.

[Kimy]

To me, the issue with FO4 is the timescale. Fallout 4 is set 210 years after the war. Even the worst scenarios for nuclear winter conditions after a total nuclear war do not see the conditions lasting for more than a decade. The radiation would be back to livable levels (people are living in Hiroshima today, and that happened less than 210 years ago...) and life would absolutely have recovered by then. Even if humanity suffered a 90% reduction of population (that's the absolute worst figure estimated to happen), that would mean that in Boston alone there would still 500,000 people left after the war and its aftermath. After all this time, the population would probably have bounced back even more. They certainly would have started to rebuild after all that time, no? In WW2, Germany's cities got devastated by conventional destruction pretty much to the same extent a nuclear war would have, but it needed only about 25 years to completely rebuild. And yet the Commonweath in FO4 is depicted as pretty much dead and ruined? That doesn't strike me as overly realistic.

[ralfetas]

To me, the issue with FO4 is the timescale. Fallout 4 is set 210 years after the war. Even the worst scenarios for nuclear winter conditions after a total nuclear war do not see the conditions lasting for more than a decade. The radiation would be back to livable levels (people are living in Hiroshima today, and that happened less than 210 years ago...) and life would absolutely have recovered by then. Even if humanity suffered a 90% reduction of population (that's the absolute worst figure estimated to happen), that would mean that in Boston alone there would still 500,000 people left after the war and its aftermath. After all this time, the population would probably have bounced back even more. They certainly would have started to rebuild after all that time, no? In WW2, Germany's cities got devastated by conventional destruction pretty much to the same extent a nuclear war would have, but it needed only about 25 years to completely rebuild. And yet the Commonweath in FO4 is depicted as pretty much dead and ruined? That doesn't strike me as overly realistic.

 

Different scenarios, after WW2 the world tries to be in piece, everyone was rebuilding, the humanity change a lot.

Nuclear weapons used in Japan in WW2 was very weak compared to any nuke that was made after.

Nuclear weapons are massive, but not as massive as we believe, the last hidrogen bomb tested have a blasting of 16km, this is not enoght to complete destroy a big city (not so big).

One thing is one atomic bomb, another is a lot of atomic bombs, the radiation could take a lot of time to vanish, much more them 200 years.

Humanity could rebuild in 210 years yes, but the situation is very problematic... we have a lot of predators like death claws and even mole rat, them we have super mutants causing trouble, and people becoming raiders (just read libertalia terminal and see their history), with all that is very difficult to create a nice society, is more like a feudal society.

But the real problem is, in 200 years would not have a city do rebuild, the buildings would have colapse by now, in special with all the war that still is going on.

Another point, if vault-tec, the responsible to keep people safe, made all that experiments on people, who would gather the results??? There not a single working vault in FO4... Even vault 81 that is ok, was not made to be ok, everyone there should be dead.

[ijakor]

The Cause 28 Feb 1954

 

http://images.google.de/imgres?imgurl=http%3A%2F%2F66.media.tumblr.com%2Ftumblr_magz7pIhpF1r47h8ko1_500.jpg&imgrefurl=http%3A%2F%2Fel-pibe-josi.tumblr.com%2Fpost%2F31700455538%2Fcastle-bravo-nuclear-test-detonated-february-8&h=444&w=500&tbnid=QJiDddcBUJVFeM%3A&docid=WpoolGr_RWNckM&ei=QxrgV_n2OcSaU8afvogC&tbm=isch&iact=rc&uact=3&dur=1772&page=1&start=31&ndsp=48&ved=0ahUKEwi5pJ3G9JvPAhVEzRQKHcaPDyEQMwiBAShMMEw&bih=974&biw=1920

 

The Effect

 

http://images.google.de/imgres?imgurl=http%3A%2F%2F1.bp.blogspot.com%2F_Q-PuSGjFHvY%2FSRbN6HcoEHI%2FAAAAAAAACos%2FPstBVY0l6hE%2Fs640%2Fmap.jpg&imgrefurl=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.artificialowl.net%2F2008%2F12%2Fcastle-bravo-biggest-usa-atomic-bomb.html&h=480&w=640&tbnid=HPwvxcLwNt_GFM%3A&docid=wgY4EMN-G74j1M&ei=QxrgV_n2OcSaU8afvogC&tbm=isch&iact=rc&uact=3&dur=1588&page=1&start=31&ndsp=48&ved=0ahUKEwi5pJ3G9JvPAhVEzRQKHcaPDyEQMwhtKDgwOA&bih=974&biw=1920

 

And Today 

 

http://images.google.de/imgres?imgurl=http%3A%2F%2Fcdn.c.photoshelter.com%2Fimg-get2%2FI0000W5s7_29AJlU%2Ffit%3D1000x750%2F3308-1813-Bikini-Atoll-Lagoon.jpg&imgrefurl=http%3A%2F%2Fgregvaughn.photoshelter.com%2Fimage%2FI0000W5s7_29AJlU&h=671&w=1000&tbnid=hU20Mc4h7bIT7M%3A&docid=CrXOmuTMTxJu8M&ei=thngV6fELcz5UvaqvYAN&tbm=isch&iact=rc&uact=3&dur=900&page=2&start=79&ndsp=48&ved=0ahUKEwin9_KC9JvPAhXMvBQKHXZVD9AQMwiNAShVMFU&bih=974&biw=1920

 

Bikini atoll

[Kimy]

 

To me, the issue with FO4 is the timescale. Fallout 4 is set 210 years after the war. Even the worst scenarios for nuclear winter conditions after a total nuclear war do not see the conditions lasting for more than a decade. The radiation would be back to livable levels (people are living in Hiroshima today, and that happened less than 210 years ago...) and life would absolutely have recovered by then. Even if humanity suffered a 90% reduction of population (that's the absolute worst figure estimated to happen), that would mean that in Boston alone there would still 500,000 people left after the war and its aftermath. After all this time, the population would probably have bounced back even more. They certainly would have started to rebuild after all that time, no? In WW2, Germany's cities got devastated by conventional destruction pretty much to the same extent a nuclear war would have, but it needed only about 25 years to completely rebuild. And yet the Commonweath in FO4 is depicted as pretty much dead and ruined? That doesn't strike me as overly realistic.

 

Different scenarios, after WW2 the world tries to be in piece, everyone was rebuilding, the humanity change a lot.

Nuclear weapons used in Japan in WW2 was very weak compared to any nuke that was made after.

Nuclear weapons are massive, but not as massive as we believe, the last hidrogen bomb tested have a blasting of 16km, this is not enoght to complete destroy a big city (not so big).

One thing is one atomic bomb, another is a lot of atomic bombs, the radiation could take a lot of time to vanish, much more them 200 years.

Humanity could rebuild in 210 years yes, but the situation is very problematic... we have a lot of predators like death claws and even mole rat, them we have super mutants causing trouble, and people becoming raiders (just read libertalia terminal and see their history), with all that is very difficult to create a nice society, is more like a feudal society.

But the real problem is, in 200 years would not have a city do rebuild, the buildings would have colapse by now, in special with all the war that still is going on.

Another point, if vault-tec, the responsible to keep people safe, made all that experiments on people, who would gather the results??? There not a single working vault in FO4... Even vault 81 that is ok, was not made to be ok, everyone there should be dead.

 

 

In an actual nuclear war, they wouldn't have dropped just one bomb on a city. They would have used many. Recently published documents suggested that in the cold war the US planned to drop as many as 90(!) nuclear bombs on East Berlin ALONE. Basically every single installation (airfields, barracks etc) got assigned its own personal bomb, and the near total elimination of the population was a desired effect, not collateral damage. Yes it's crazy.

In the end, after a total nuclear exchange, you can safely assume that the world would be a peace, too. Simply because there wouldn't be any armies left to fight with.

 

As for the mutants and raiders in FO4 - I dunno, but logic dictates that the safest way to handle their threat is banding together for common defense. One should think the remaining humans would build walled cities (like Diamond City) and expand from there, driving the mutants and raiders gradually out over time. But I would expect the 'safe zones' to be a lot, lot larger than they are in the Commonwealth.

[Kendo 2]

As for the mutants and raiders in FO4 - I dunno, but logic dictates that the safest way to handle their threat is banding together for common defense. One should think the remaining humans would build walled cities (like Diamond City) and expand from there, driving the mutants and raiders gradually out over time. But I would expect the 'safe zones' to be a lot, lot larger than they are in the Commonwealth.

 

 

 

After the Romans abandoned Britain the very civilized and very Romanized Celts began seeking protection from local lords.  They weren't afraid of invaders, but the general Post-Roman lawlessness and chaos.  As things devolved and the invasions began (Welsh and Cornish raiders, the Scots Picts, and eventually the Saxons and Angles) peaceful lords became warlords out of necessity.  The Heptarchy and the associated foundations of British feudal society took at least two centuries to mature.  By the time Normans arrived in 1066 the system of serfdom and lords was well established.  They simply took it over.

No reason something like that wouldn't play out in a post apocalyptic scenario.  It would happen a lot faster though.  If it took people 10 years to get their shit together they would start rebuilding some sort of society because that's just how humans are.  Strong leaders and their 'gangs' would rise to the top.  Depending on how these gangs are, people would go to them voluntarily for protection and safety.  Or they might have 'protection' forced on them.  In the real world prewar relics like light bulbs, medicine, preserved food, etc. would eventually run dry.  People-as-maggots feeding off of the old world's carcass wouldn't have any choice but to start growing food.  The lack of centralized power, resources and safety, etc. would usher in an age of neo-feudalism based on agriculture...yet again.

 

 

 

Blather-blather-TL;DR 

[Wast1980]

Fallout is the wrong franchise to talk about what would be real, it doesn't take itself serious and there is also no point to talk about lore (StarTrek, Monty Python and the holy grail in Fallout 2).

Judging by Chernobyl, there is no doubt that it isn't as dead as the world in Fallout:

The Zone is full of life, healthy life (flora and fauna), no mutated genes, yes there is still radiation, but life has adapted.

[Kendo 2]

Fallout is the wrong franchise to talk about what would be real, it doesn't take itself serious and there is also no point to talk about lore (StarTrek, Monty Python and the holy grail in Fallout 2).

The Zone is full of life, healthy life (flora and fauna), no mutated genes, yes there is still radiation, but life has adapted.

All of the Fallout universe is a 'cartoon' based on 1950's pulp.  Giant invertebrates that Earth's gravity would crush under their own weight are plausible.  Radiation exposure causing mutations that result in FEV super mutants and ghouls, the persistent 210 year old radiation fields despite little things like the weather, the isotope-infested rain storm stupidity 210 years after the fact, etc.

 

Realistically, the Fallout universe if perfect for Bethesda writers.  It requires no imagination to be be made plausible in game context.  #CuzRadiation *derp*

[Guest enip]

The modern Fallout universe is for Beth writers, rather. They never understood the Fallout lore let alone realism. You have people exposed to irradiated water and live to grow old if they aren't eaten by a mutated creature, or some raider killing them. Then you have meds. Not everyone has access to meds, and meds can only last for so long. But lets not forget realistically all meds have an expiration date. They lose their potency eventually and after 200+ years, it shouldn't have any effect. I don't recall anyone in Beth Fallout games ever making meds. I just know the Great Khans making chems but that's a different story and not done by Beth. Then you have weapons and armor fully intact. I don't mean weapon condition. I mean physical appearance tip top shape. They are also overly used and spread all over the place like Easter eggs just waiting to be picked up. After 200+ years you would think that every single weapon has been scavenged or weathered to the point of useless. The only weapons I can say that may still be of use are ones out of people's reach. Like say some police station that has high volumes of radiation levels which people cannot simply walk in and grab it and walk back out without suffering from poisoning that leads to death.

 

Their games are not meant to be taken serious because they are not people who can take their writing skills serious. Realism or fantasy, doesn't matter. It still has to make sense in the direction it is going. If you make a brainless game with no fundamental background, it's more of a kids game who just wants to point and laugh at things because it's meant to be funny and not serious. These games were not meant for adults. These games were not meant for the rated M player.

[ralfetas]

Indeed bethesda don't give fu** to the lore... I don't play much the older fallout games, but i like to read about it, i know that the jet was made after the war, pipe weapons probably was made after the war, that fancy armor with chains and stuff too, people don't eat dog or mole rats in 2077, why i am telling this? Because you can find this stuff in bunkers were no one enters in 200 years. So even if everything could last forever because it was 2077, there is no way we could find jet, pipe pistols etc... around places that should be close all this time.

 

I would like to see more cities like diamond city in fo4, i remember when i arrive to quincy the first time, i was all "hey! Were is the bar?" and them my last hope die and my character too, and no, bunker hill is not a city.