Ok Beth.. it's April...

[Anbeegod]

 

Better than Interplay developed and released Fallout: PoS. Fallout 4 tries too hard to reach the botton F:BOS already reached though. But still far from it.

 

 

 

Because Obsidian is originated from Interplay.

[Wired]

 

 

Better than Interplay developed and released Fallout: PoS. Fallout 4 tries too hard to reach the botton F:BOS already reached though. But still far from it.

 

 

 

Because Obsidian is originated from Interplay.

 

And only insane people lasted in Interplay by the time the whole Fallout franchise trading drama and PoS release. Seems legit, as Bethesda are on par with insanity of Interplay '04 staff.

can't we start a Fallout 4 hate-thread?

[Aria]

 

here we go with the oh so useful term, Dumbing Down.

Yeah, I know what you mean. I much prefer the term "Stupiding Up"

 

Seriously though, do you not see a trend of getting more and more "lightweight" from one release to the next? I mean Skyrim had Unca Todd take out all those nasty scary numbers in case we hurt our pore lil'gamer brains by trying to think too hard. Fallout 4 helpfully gives us a backstory so we don't have to strain our tiny little imaginations, and adds player voice acting so we never get confused abut how we're supposed to feel.

 

I'm all for a better term than "dumbing down" but there doesn't seem to be much doubt that something of that nature is going on.

 

You are talking to a wall Doc.

 

Simplifying doesnt always has to be a bad thing but in beths case its more then clear they dont want to put any more effort into crafting good writting and dialogue.

Not long ago i stumbled upon a vid discussing the dialogue options of FO4, there were many of them where you had two sentences having the same effect just worded differently...i mean.who.the.hell does this nonsense, whats the point, just why...wtf.

[Anbeegod]

 

Not much he can do about it when Mr. Corporate says "I want more Money". same knucklehead that founded Bethesda Founded Zenimax and turned into the same kind of greedy asshat that Mr. EA is and every other Corporate type. So many put the blame on the wrong people. Todd Howard and his team build a game, then Mr. Asshat says chop it up and make more money for me. do you really think any development team goes into it to build a buggy chopped up game. (and because of chopping it up creates a bugfest). It's not like any of them can say "hey fuckface I'm building a complete game so fuck you and your chopshop bullshit". if they want to keep there jobs. every developer that's been bought out by the EA's and Zenimax's of the industry have gone the same route. they once built and sold a great game then Mr. Shit happened and fucked it up with there greed. The first EA buy out that effected me was Westwood Studios, they bought the rights to all there games and the first thing they did was shut them down and let people go. They didn't want any competition for there precious Ultima Online POS. and shut down Earth and Beyond. I hold no ill feelings toward Westwood, they did what they had to or get run out by EA. So much bullshit happened within that deal, they had to agree to not make another MMORPG for a given amount of time. There have been multiple studios bought and shut down as to get rid of choice and competition and it's done all the time. BGS wasn't the first to have to chop up there game to make money and they sure as hell won't be the last.

 

 

 

 

Again, greed is the root cause of everything.

[Wired]

I don't think all these complaints should be used for Bethesda. Oh, no. After Morrowind so far they're swimming in money and appreciation. Publishers always give them carte blanche on everything including ESPECIALLY Fallout 4. They just really think that Emil is good writer, Linda Carter can act and Inon Zur should always sit behind piano and never look back on his Fallout Tactics' soundtrack. They really think that streamlining things is 'modern', 'cool' and 'innovate'. Well, can't say for all but Todd Howard and Pete Hines are indeed sharing the same cancerous thoughts. Lunatics.

[Yami X]

When did this turn into a thread about corporate apologies and acting like it's nothing anyone can do about it?

[Anbeegod]

When did this turn into a thread about corporate apologies and acting like it's nothing anyone can do about it?

 

Welcome to online forums.

[Yami X]

Ah sometimes I forget.

[Anbeegod]

Ah sometimes I forget.

 

lol

[pipdude]

What specifically are people saying was so different in New Vegas? I played both extensively. Other than technology improvements and a few new features, FO4 seems to have the same (if not very close to the same) mechanics, gameplay, etc.

[Anbeegod]

What specifically are people saying was so different in New Vegas? I played both extensively. Other than technology improvements and a few new features, FO4 seems to have the same (if not very close to the same) mechanics, gameplay, etc.

 

To begin with, NV has what F4 lacks:

 

1. Interesting and realistic characters

Name some interesting characters from NV. Cass, Veronica, House, Arcade, Ulysses, The King etc.

Name 5 interesting and memorable characters from F4. Nick, Codsworth, Deacon, MacCready... that's all.

 

2. Freedom and roleplayability

http://www.loverslab.com/topic/57622-a-matter-of-choice/

 

3. Epic and sensible story

 

4. An actual ending

 

 

While F4 beats NV due to:

 

1. Higher stability

 

2. Better graphics

 

3. Combat system

 

All thanks to what the engine provides.

 

 

Seriously, I'm going to make a mod to kick that unimpressive main quest away by making a whole new world and standalone story.

 

F4 sucks mainly due to its story and roleplayability, otherwise it's an okay open-world FPS.

[Guest endgameaddiction]

 

 

 

Not in Fallout by Bethesda case. More like the game was completed way earlier but someone didn't liked it (too not bethesdy or simple?) and things went redone, several times. Everything in F4 is reeks of this problem. In Bethesda case, they just have TOO MUCH time, not NOT ENOUGH. 

 

 

Also, INTERPLAY WASN'T ANY SAINT. Interplay has mismanaged things and burn themselves.

 

 

No one's saying interplay is saint, but it just happens to have made actual Fallouts, while Beth is only making a post-apocalypse FPS using Fallout's background.

 

Or New Vegas (at least they published a good game). And New Vegas actually got more love from loverslab than F3.

 

 

The reason why New Vegas got more love was because it was determined by script extended team that the upgraded engine in New Vegas was more stable. They decided to opt out of Fallout 3 and their FOSE, move to New Vegas.

 

It's rather disappointing because Skyrim is by far the most unstable game out there and they put more time and effort into that game. So,. Fallout 3 didn't get much love. Otherwise it would of had much more mods. So this is why NV has more complex mods in comparison to Fallout 3.

 

[Wired]

 

3. Combat system

Well... How? By removing an rpg element from gunplay and just doing callofduty thing called 'point-n-shoot'? Or do I miss something right now? Enemies are still a problem at higher lvls due to enormous HP they have, it still busy work.

[pipdude]

 

What specifically are people saying was so different in New Vegas? I played both extensively. Other than technology improvements and a few new features, FO4 seems to have the same (if not very close to the same) mechanics, gameplay, etc.

 

To begin with, NV has what F4 lacks:

 

1. Interesting and realistic characters

Name some interesting characters from NV. Cass, Veronica, House, Arcade, Ulysses, The King etc.

Name 5 interesting and memorable characters from F4. Nick, Codsworth, Deacon, MacCready... that's all.

 

2. Freedom and roleplayability

http://www.loverslab.com/topic/57622-a-matter-of-choice/

 

3. Epic and sensible story

 

4. An actual ending

 

 

While F4 beats NV due to:

 

1. Higher stability

 

2. Better graphics

 

3. Combat system

 

All thanks to what the engine provides.

 

 

Seriously, I'm going to make a mod to kick that unimpressive main quest away by making a whole new world and standalone story.

 

F4 sucks mainly due to its story and roleplayability, otherwise it's an okay open-world FPS.

 

 

Hm. It seems to me that FO4 does have the things you list about NV also.

 

I do agree that the main quest model (that they both used) is limited. I'm interested to see how your mod will change things up.

[Anbeegod]

 

 

 

Hm. It seems to me that FO4 does have the things you list about NV also.

 

I do agree that the main quest model (that they both used) is limited. I'm interested to see how your mod will change things up.

 

 

 

To each his own then.

 

My mod would take place in the old world where everything isn't screwed up by radiation and mutants yet. The player would stop the apocalypse before it begins by working with their spouse, or go with an entirely different way and bring the literal doom upon the human species (when the vaults weren't even ready to accept residents yet, it will be the darkest and grimmest ending in Fallout history besides the Fallout 1 Super Mutant ending).

 

Hell, I'd even make an option which you can roleplay as another person other than the daddy/mommy who lost their child. I'm not going to hardcode so much thing in the story as the vanilla MQ did.

 

However, I'll only start the mod's development process after I finish my Skyrim mod. And, I need to learn advanced CK handling before I can make anything solid besides the story.

[DocClox]

Hm. It seems to me that FO4 does have the things you list about NV also.

 

I do agree that the main quest model (that they both used) is limited. I'm interested to see how your mod will change things up.

Your role-playing options are a little constrained in F4. I mean you can play an excellent selection of early-thirties, recently bereaved, pre-war, lady lawyers in search of their abducted infant sons, but outside of that your role-playing involvement is pretty much limited to "do I spend this perk point on Perception or Agility?" and "Which do I do first: rescue the kidnapped settler from the Supermutants, or wipe out the feral ghouls that have just moved into the area on the extreme far side of the map". I'm not a huge fan of NV, but as the Courier you had rather more scope to use your imagination.

 

I agree there isn't a whole lot to choose between the main quests in one sense, but NV scores because I can at least understand the objectives of the factions. You don't need a page and a half of complex psychological analysis before Caesar's motivations make sense, and House never decided the only way to safeguard and protect a unique technology was by nuking it into oblivion.

 

[Wired]

Combat in Fallout 4 is simpler, not better. Comparison with STALKER will be fatal to F4. And New Vegas can be modded to have a bit better gunplay. Sometimes more realistic.

[Anbeegod]

Combat in Fallout 4 is simpler, not better. Comparison with STALKER will be fatal to F4. And New Vegas can be modded to have a bit better gunplay. Sometimes more realistic.

 

It's more fluent and realistic, and the animations are light-years better than NV's. It isn't fair counting mods in, with mods F4 can be light-years better than NV, just like how Skyrim is better than Oblivion with the mod community developed.

[Guest Mogie56]

Not everyone will like FO4's storyline, I didn't like NV storyline, no thinking had to be done it was strictly a revenge game. it wasn't about Fallout and the bombs dropped it was about getting revenge for being shot in the head by one person. the closest thing it had of being fallout was the wasteland you had to travel across to get your revenge. People bitched about FO3 ending but once NV's MQ was done it may as well have ended because there was nothing to hold the rest together. House was pointless in the Fallout world, it was about keeping control of a city by a shriveled up ghoul of a man in a glass case. But it could be made to work with a little imagination. It's addon DLC's were it's "saving grace" and were much more enjoyable then the actual game itself. Many complain that FO4 is an FPS but yet bitch about it's combat not being up to snuff. it isn't DOOM ya know. if you don't want a FPS don't complain about combat. if you want a storyline look beyond what you are afraid of and see the story for what it is. You want an RPG...just not this one...you want a story...just not this one...but it seems no one can be bothered to use what is at hand because they weren't given everything they wanted. No one wants to take the time to roll play because it's spent in threads like this on the internet.

[Zor2k13]

Uh... no just no.

 

The time is spent waiting for beth to fix this crap so it is worth playing and then waiting for arthmoor and co to fix everything else to a point so others can really fix the broken stuff that most people don't like. The combat and gunplay are already good enough we just need a legitimate reason to wear power armor and kill things instead of sitting through all that radiant crap and bad story.

 

For example imagine a mod that stops garvey from sending you to settlements once you have done them all? the mod would also have the option of having the settlement build itself as long as you place enough materials in the workshop after securing it. The radiant garvey shit could be toned down so you don't ever go back there unless you have to, there is no need to give a dam about those sims and their problems. Once you get a settlement going it could expand into a small city with their own guards and some services. Then some new npcs with names could spring up there.

 

The radiant stuff could be limited to killing ferals and mutants and raiders blah blah and maybe someone will fix the dam settlers so they will STAY at their posts during an attack instead of fleeing the security of the settlement walls to stand directly in front of an enemy while fighting it:-(

 

Also maybe someone can fix the pathetic excuse for a main story in this game and change it enough so you don't have to kill your own son but simply be there when he dies and disband or redirect the institute so it doesn't screw up the commonwealth anymore. Maybe even find and free all or some of the people that were replaced by the synths. Maybe they weren't disposed of afterall but sold into slavery or left to rot at some institute prison.

 

Most people want to just get in some power armor and go around killing things and join the BoS to wipe out monsters etc. they don't want to put up with a bunch of crappy plot twists and killing off factions just because. People should be able to enjoy a game and be entertained by it not be annoyed and pissed off by it. Anyone wanting to be pissed off by a game just has to play dark souls games. Who wants to be angered by something that is supposed to be entertainment anyway? Nobody liked shamalan movies either.

 

I hope that modders fix the dam beginning of the game, get rid of the scene where the spouse is shot in the head while holding a baby because that shit is way too extreme. We could see the pc watching it on a security monitor after waking up and the audio could play through the monitor speakers we could watch the expression on their face instead of having to sit through that shit every single time we start a new game.

 

I really wish they would have made legitimate alternate starts for this game like the player would start from a different vault with a different background and the main story stuff would be disabled to an extent. You would still end up going through the institute stuff but more as a hand picked merc or contracted help offer instead of the parent of the leader. The player could hear that the leader died but not see it as if the main character was in the room with him and the player could not interfere etc. so like side stepping certain parts to maintain that alternate start plot. We don't need to play the silver shroud every time, we don't need to be the leader of every faction every time etc. for alternate starts. For the sex stuff there could be a start out as a slave thing. The player is almost never freed just bought and sold to various npcs around the commonwealth.

 

 

If I could think this shit up then they already have thought of it before finishing the game, why is it that modders ALWAYS have to fix their dam games? This is what we are angry about, what is at hand as you say is not good enough and it appears that was done on purpose.

 

 

EDIT

 

Some options to replace radiant crap

 

 

As a member of the brotherhood of steel you could be called on to participate in an ongoing firefight against supermutants or raiders attacking a city or settlement, since the BoS claims to be helping the commonwealth I say let them do it then. Fly that gunship mission against gunners or mutants etc not just as part of that one main quest objective.

 

As a member of the minutemen you could be called on to do the same thing or to escort a supply convoy or free slaves that were replaced by synths etc.

 

As a member of the railroad you could be called on to defend an operative and help them escape or rescue them from somewhere.

 

There are all kinds of things to mod in to replace the stale boring radiant shit that is super duper mart and some military post over and over again.

 

 

The only thing that can fix this rediculous hamster wheel of a game is the CK and modders with the time and skills to do it. That should not be the case for every game this company makes. If the next ES game turns out like this I will just ignore it for three or four years because there would be no point in sitting through the same broken thing over and over again. Also we don't know if arthmoor and co will be around long enough to fix every game they make in the near future.

 

 

[Guest Mogie56]

um no...you are not most people, not even the entire LL website is "most people" so don't use that. and outside LL are just a bunch of "louder then most" complainers. and Arthmoor and anyone like Arthmoor fix what "They" see as a problem not what "Most" people see as a problem. Because "most" is in the millions. if there were that many people condemning the game Bethesda would have gone out of business long ago because Arthmoor and people like him wouldn't have given the time or energy to bother fixing what "they" saw as problems. ...weak.

[DocClox]

You want an RPG...just not this one...you want a story...just not this one...

I think that's fair. I'm not a big fan of the way they handled the storytelling, and I find the role-playing support to be somewhat lacking. Surely that's allowed?

 

No one wants to take the time to roll play because it's spent in threads like this on the internet.

That seems fair as well. I also didn't like "The Matrix: Reloaded", and I'd far sooner bitch about that on the Internet than actually sit down and watch it again.

 

So does that make me a bad person?

[Zor2k13]

So you enjoy doing the same pointless things over and over again? The same dumb radiant crap? Putting up with broken merchants that end up dead or missing or both after recruitment? I could go on and on but what you might enjoy doing is considered as the definition of insanity by others.

[Wired]

Again, why people so like being on a short silk leash? Especially in Bethesda game? Why do you rank F4 so high, are you slaves of linear storytelling? It's one of the biggest fail Bethesda achieved in this game.

[Zor2k13]

Good storytelling makes for good entertainment, bad storytelling makes for m night shamalan yuk.

 

I'm just glad the writers of lost or the recent star trek movie flops don't write for beth.