Assistance for HDT, Body, Skeleton, Gear needed

[Desufire]

After doing about 6 hours of reading on this forum, I've hit my limit. I need help and I can't seem to find any solid answers here. So, here's a shot in the dark with a post in the general, for help.

 

The following is the information I'm looking for:

 

1 - Where to find a stable, UTD version of HDT Physics and what other files are needed for collision and stuff.

 

2 - Information on the install order and load order for any HDT mods (if needed).

 

3 - A stable body mod that works with HDT and can be CBBE geared without clipping and/or other issues.

 

4 - A stable skeleton to use with HDT and the body. I don't care about where my weapons sheath and crap.

 

5 - Gear that is HDT ready for CBBE body.

 

6 - Information on how to use Outfit Studio because that program keeps laughing at me every time I attempt to convert or fix clipped armors. (I've tried the tutorials linked on the Nexus page for OS, they gave me no results at all.)

 

I currently use RealVision ENB and a majority of the recommended mods listed on the page and I run a stable 20-35 fps. Depends where at in game, you know.

 

Please do not reply to this with links that you "think" will help me. I need SOLID information. I do not need links of 30+ paged topics full of contradictions and maybe's.

 

And for any of the big names that may read this (every forum has those known names), I'm not one of those that will post that one common question on your mod. I'm sure you understand what I'm saying there.

 

 

[gvman3670]

I don't use CBBE, but I only needed to make sure my XPMS Extended skeleton was installed last (or at the bottom of the list in Mod Organizer) for it to work. Nothing else matters as far as install order and overwrites. Just be sure your skeleton never gets overwritten.

 

I have only JUST started playing with BS2 because I am testing out Blabba's CITRUS body. So I won't be a big help when it comes to Outfit Studio. But the CITRUS body is ready for HDT.

 

If you were willing to use a UNP variant you'd probably already have it working.

[Budroi]

Most of your needs can be answered HERE

 

Substitute requirement 3 and 5 with any pregnant or belly bone enabled body and armors you can find on lovers lab, there is more than a few.

I say pregnant bodies because any body with belly bone attached also has breasts and butt set up.

 

I use the Adec DM body and armors from here.

http://www.loverslab.com/topic/10270-conversions-for-manga-body/

 

And to make it easier I have done all the work for you already, especially if you don't want to equip an item to enable HDT.

Most of my files, even if they don't say it, have HDT enabled.

http://www.loverslab.com/topic/30449-conversions-for-manga-body-add-ons/

 

[Desufire]

Sweet, thank you Budroi, but I got a follow up now. When using a pregnant body (No idea that was even an option) does it HAVE to be pregnant? Pregnant belly just doesn't do it for me, so it's putting me off a bit unless I can suck the belly in to make it normal or something.

[Budroi]

Sorry. I guess I should clarify. calling it a pregnant body is misleading.

It would be more accurate to call it "a body that can look pregnant if using the right pregnancy mod" but that is kinda long.

Basically your character will look normal (not pregnant) when using the basic character creator weight slider.

If you want the belly to bulge out like the women is pregnant you would need another mod that would scale up the size of the belly bone on the skeleton.

 

Here is what the body I use normally looks like (relatively)

 

And that same body if using a pregnancy mod AND the character is actually pregnant

 

To sum everything up the belly will not look pregnant unless you use a mod to make them pregnant

[Desufire]

I realized I should have done some reading first before asking the question. I did see those pictures from your link and it answered it right away lol. Since I still got you here though, your manga body/conversions that you linked, are those bodyslide compatible? I'm one of those players who try to go as real with sizes as possible and the huge breasts don't sit right with me.

 

Using the weight slider to do adjustments is a huge reason I stopped using UNP bodies, so if I can edit the ADEC body you recommend in bodyslider, I'd go for that since I know where to find some great armor for the body already.

[Budroi]

I realized I should have done some reading first before asking the question. I did see those pictures from your link and it answered it right away lol. Since I still got you here though, your manga body/conversions that you linked, are those bodyslide compatible? I'm one of those players who try to go as real with sizes as possible and the huge breasts don't sit right with me.

 

Using the weight slider to do adjustments is a huge reason I stopped using UNP bodies, so if I can edit the ADEC body you recommend in bodyslider, I'd go for that since I know where to find some great armor for the body already.

 

unfortunately there is no bodyslide.

 

Google search "loverslab pregnant body" should net some results for different types.

[Desufire]

You, good sir, are my hero. I d/led your files and installed them in the order you listed and I now have jiggles, collision, and all. Using your less bounce 2 idle xml, fits my tastes.

 

I got the clipping on my characters right hand going through her breast with the sexy idle 1, but if I understand HDT and everything I've shoved in my eyes, I believe it's because the hand nifs "hit box" is smaller than my hands are. It's a shame because I don't like ECE at all and can't resize them from RaceMenu. Do you by chance know of a file lurking around here or a tutorial for nifscope on resizing the nifs? If not, the clipping is something I can ignore lol.

 

I will start looking for some armor using your suggestion .

 

Thank you for your time answering these questions. I'm happy that I'm finally getting results lol.

 

EDIT:: After some more tests I've encountered that all gear gives my breasts a conal shape. Also, when I use your idle xml, I get collision, but when I move the breasts go haywire and when I walk, then crush. If I use a different xml like Loremongers, it stops the crazy and crushed, but the collision is gone. This HDT bull is ... well ... BS to understand.

 

I tried looking through the xml to find out what to change, but that thing is so long and it is an unfamiliar format to me since I've never edited an HDT xml. Guess I'll keep researching and trial and errors until I find a combination that actually works.

[Budroi]

Its odd that your HDT would be reacting like that.

possibly bad install of something?

 

Also you kinda have the right idea about the hands but are looking in the wrong area.

the change to make breast not clip would be handled in the hdt.xml.

There is a program on loverslab called JFF (just for fun) that is designed to allow you to change hdt.xml's

you need to change the radius of the hpkCapsuleShape.

 

open xml in JFF

double click one of the hands.

then click on the hpkCapsuleShape in JFF

and increase the radius slightly.

[Desufire]

Yeah, I think I know what happened. I batched the CT77 Crono gear using a pregnant weighted bodyslide I found here made for his mod. But I think I may have missed a body while deselecting.

 

Going to just uninstall every armor, body, animation mods and the skeleton. Make sure all the files are cleaned out, then reinstall carefully. It'll take some time, but not as much time as a fresh install ... which I'll end up doing if this doesn't work.

 

I've already got JFF from when I first started this HDT adventure, haven't really looked into it though. Guess I'll be doing that when I get it all working right.

[Monsto Brukes]

WHILE YOU'RE IN THERE STARTING FROM MOD-SCRATCH

 

Give Mod Organizer a try. You've already got the zip files, and you're starting from a base install... may as well give it a crack. That way if your install order is off, you can just drag/drop to change/fix it.

 

(linked in my sig)

[Desufire]

HOLY HELL I GOT IT!!!

 

So, I went through and uninstalled everything HDT (armor, bodies, skeleton, xml's, etc.)

 

Reinstalled everything in a specific order that I've read from the links you provided above. Created the HDT body using HDT 1.3 sliders (because it's good for OS). Logged in and fail. Breasts with minds of their own. So, got rid of 1.3 and went with 1.4. Same result.

 

So I decided that I'd just try the CBBEAdvancedTBBP body for the hell of it. While scrolling up I see CT77 Body and it clicked that his newest version includes HDT in his gear. So I looked at the sliders and saw everything required for HDT, even pregnancy. Created a new body using CT77 Body and WIN!

 

I don't know what it is with HDT Body, but it seems that something must be off in the nifs, because everything is working fantastically with CT77. I can even enlarge my breasts a bit more to my liking because the hands aren't even clipping now.

 

Monsto Brukes - I've went through your links and some of your info has helped me out with this. I looked at MO and decided that I honestly did not feel like learning a new organizer. I use NMM and while I see a lot of people say it's crap for organizing mods, I only use it to manually place a few. I use Loot (previously BOSS), then go into Nexus to move the ClimatesofTamriel esps into their correct order. I use RealVision and it calls for a specific order with the CoT patches. Other than that, Loot organizes every other mod perfectly.

[Monsto Brukes]

Monsto Brukes - I've went through your links and some of your info has helped me out with this. I looked at MO and decided that I honestly did not feel like learning a new organizer. I use NMM and while I see a lot of people say it's crap for organizing mods, I only use it to manually place a few. I use Loot (previously BOSS), then go into Nexus to move the ClimatesofTamriel esps into their correct order. I use RealVision and it calls for a specific order with the CoT patches. Other than that, Loot organizes every other mod perfectly.

 

/me shrugs

 

"To each his own" said the man when he kissed the pig.

[zzz72w3r]

I use NMM and was able to successfully test all kinds of HDT stuff with it so MO is not needed if you know how to play with mods.   

 

@Desufire - 6 hours hmm... let me recount this very amusing anecdote of mine for you : 

 

(This is a summarized reenactment of many conversations I had recently here and the words are NOT exact.)

 

Me: I have been reading everything about HDT PE I could find for weeks and I don't understand why authors cannot standardize and release different ready made packages for us to use? 

 

clp2011 (not the actual person but a dramatic reenactment): You have been reading for weeks, good for you.  I have been reading about this for MONTHS since Hydrogen released it and like other modders we are learning and figuring out how to best use HDT PE.  (skip the very long and detail technical stuff why standardization is so difficult)  So how about you keep reading and see what we, many individuals and not a collective, are trying to do.

 

PS: if you don't know who clp2011 is then you haven't read enough about HDT PE.  This is not a putdown, just so you don't reinvent the wheel 

[Desufire]

I use NMM and was able to successfully test all kinds of HDT stuff with it so MO is not needed if you know how to play with mods.   

 

@Desufire - 6 hours hmm... let me recount this very amusing anecdote of mine for you : 

 

(This is a summarized reenactment of many conversations I had recently here and the words are NOT exact.)

 

Me: I have been reading everything about HDT PE I could find for weeks and I don't understand why authors cannot standardize and release different ready made packages for us to use? 

 

clp2011 (not the actual person but a dramatic reenactment): You have been reading for weeks, good for you.  I have been reading about this for MONTHS since Hydrogen released it and like other modders we are learning and figuring out how to best use HDT PE.  (skip the very long and detail technical stuff why standardization is so difficult)  So how about you keep reading and see what we, many individuals and not a collective, are trying to do.

 

PS: if you don't know who clp2011 is then you haven't read enough about HDT PE.  This is not a putdown, just so you don't reinvent the wheel 

 

I actually saw that post lol.

 

I must say though, I've run into the crushed/haywire breasts again though. Everything was perfect and then I went into character creation and got my character made exactly how I like her. Then realized that the breasts seemed more elongated than before and when I walked, they crushed.

 

I just saved and quit at that point. I'm about to start a few things now to figure out what exactly is causing this. I have 2 ideas:

 

1 - I chose an HDT hair style in creation. The xp32 Azur ponytail edited by Daio (or something like that.) I'm gonna switch to a different non-HDT hair and see if maybe the HDT for the hair is causing issues with the body.

 

2 - Creation may have messed with the skeleton in some way. In which case, a simple uninstall/reinstall should fix the issue.

 

Something tells me it isn't 2 though.

[yatol]

I use NMM and was able to successfully test all kinds of HDT stuff with it so MO is not needed if you know how to play with mods.   

so what? mo is better

 

and you can load your files from multiples harddrives with it

[zzz72w3r]

 

I use NMM and was able to successfully test all kinds of HDT stuff with it so MO is not needed if you know how to play with mods.   

so what? mo is better

 

and you can load your files from multiples harddrives with it

 

 

And your contribution to our understanding of HDT PE is?

 

 

[Desufire]

Stop with the MO / NMM! I don't want this getting off track! It's an argument like which is better Playstation or Xbox. Everyone has their own preferences.

 

Now, with HDT PE. The above ideas didn't work at all.

 

The fact that I had it working perfectly after uninstalling all HDT items, skeleton, and body means that it does work damnit. I am using a custom race (Temptress) and was saved on it when it was working.

 

So, it has to be something with character creation or just the fact that it'll work or it won't. Maybe something just isn't stable at all since it appears no one really understands HDT PE 100%.

 

I'll most likely try what I describe above again since it worked for awhile.

[yatol]

 

And your contribution to our understanding of HDT PE is?

 

 

 

 

i have no idea how that work

 

but there are tutorials in the hdt section, just follow one and it work

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Budroi]

Stop with the MO / NMM! I don't want this getting off track! It's an argument like which is better Playstation or Xbox. Everyone has their own preferences.

 

Now, with HDT PE. The above ideas didn't work at all.

 

The fact that I had it working perfectly after uninstalling all HDT items, skeleton, and body means that it does work damnit. I am using a custom race (Temptress) and was saved on it when it was working.

 

So, it has to be something with character creation or just the fact that it'll work or it won't. Maybe something just isn't stable at all since it appears no one really understands HDT PE 100%.

 

I'll most likely try what I describe above again since it worked for awhile.

 

Hdt hair should not conflict as long as it did not replace any of your HDT files. I'm currently using HDT body with the HDT NumeNume Hair.

I recommend getting the HDT hairs that were redone (here) - they use a separate xml install files and location so they do not mess your main HDT files.

 

Also...

Check to see if your custom race has a separate folder location for the skeleton.

Some do and that is where a lot of HDT issues arise when using custom races.

 

Easiest way to check would be to check the custom race mod folder (if using MO) or unpack the archive on your desktop so you don't have to hunt through your data folder.

[galgat]

I used MO for awhile, I had a power outage or blink, and for some crazy reason I lost everything, sense then I have been staying with NMM, My back up of the entire directory was NMM, when I had to re install everything after MO went crazy on me.

 

   I had had power blinks before when I was just running NMM, and never had a problem, but what ever  happened while running MO, scrabbled everything

 

  Don't get me wrong, I want to go back to MO, "and eventually I probablly will after a full Back Up", but I have been leary of it for now.

 

 

As to the HDT::: I have been using "UNP TBBP" and liking it very much the main thing that kept it from working right for me, was I had XP32 latest eddition, but it was not XP32 Extended version.. Once i finally realized that was my problem, everything TBBP, and HDT snapped into place.

 

  But as you are running CBBE which I think is a very nice body, I guess this info is useless, I just wanted to throw it in.

[Desufire]

 

Stop with the MO / NMM! I don't want this getting off track! It's an argument like which is better Playstation or Xbox. Everyone has their own preferences.

 

Now, with HDT PE. The above ideas didn't work at all.

 

The fact that I had it working perfectly after uninstalling all HDT items, skeleton, and body means that it does work damnit. I am using a custom race (Temptress) and was saved on it when it was working.

 

So, it has to be something with character creation or just the fact that it'll work or it won't. Maybe something just isn't stable at all since it appears no one really understands HDT PE 100%.

 

I'll most likely try what I describe above again since it worked for awhile.

 

Hdt hair should not conflict as long as it did not replace any of your HDT files. I'm currently using HDT body with the HDT NumeNume Hair.

I recommend getting the HDT hairs that were redone (here) - they use a separate xml install files and location so they do not mess your main HDT files.

 

Also...

Check to see if your custom race has a separate folder location for the skeleton.

Some do and that is where a lot of HDT issues arise when using custom races.

 

Easiest way to check would be to check the custom race mod folder (if using MO) or unpack the archive on your desktop so you don't have to hunt through your data folder.

 

 

I use the numenume HDT hairs also. I got them from the link you provided in your first reply . I realized that those were the meshes, so I have the original files and yada yada.

 

The Temptress Race doesn't use a separate skeleton. The race only has separate tri files for the face morphs.

 

 

As to the HDT::: I have been using "UNP TBBP" and liking it very much the main thing that kept it from working right for me, was I had XP32 latest eddition, but it was not XP32 Extended version.. Once i finally realized that was my problem, everything TBBP, and HDT snapped into place.

 

  But as you are running CBBE which I think is a very nice body, I guess this info is useless, I just wanted to throw it in.

 

I'm about to go back to UNP to see if it'll help stabilize it. I used to use UNP for my character and CBBE for the NPCs, but found that using both would conflict with some mods. So I decided to use CBBE only because of the bodyslide. But now with Bodyslide 2, I see that they have UNP meshes in there so that I don't have to rely on the weight slider.

[Desufire]

Well, I finally broke the game. Looks like it's time to just do a fresh install .... again .... gah.

[Budroi]

Well, I finally broke the game. Looks like it's time to just do a fresh install .... again .... gah.

 

Not to be the parrot in a cage but..

If your going to do a fresh install think about making the MO switch.

If used correctly you will never need to do a fresh install again.

[zzz72w3r]

If you are like me incapable of tinkering with xml or Nifskope then just stay with a specific public release HDT PE kit that comes with its own support thread.  Mix and match without knowing why, especially with modified body nif and all kinds of xml posted in forums will get you into glitches and difficult to get help.  IMHO this thread kind of muddy the water even more and does disservice in helping others.  The All-in-One kit is probably the go to thread now and if you follow its very well written instructions to the letter and still have problems people there will be quick to help because they have repeated those same steps many times.  

 

EDIT: the All-in-One thread is Daiemonic's thread linked by Budroi above.