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Proper way to use other peoples mods?


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So if in creating a mod, it builds on another persons work, or requires certain mods to be installed in order to function, what is the proper protocol and etiquette to do so? I assume it is frowned upon to simply to use another's work in its entirety without permission. However, I am not sure what is required for different levels of integration of the other persons work as it relates to your own mod.

 

At what level is it best to ask for permission?

 

What about dead mods where it is impossible to contact the original author?

 

Is simply having another mod as a prerequisite the deciding factor, or is it the use of code, or the other mod as a basis of your mod? Is mere attribution enough?

 

If your mod is substantially similar to another mod, but not based on their code is it frowned on to create it?

 

I love a ton of the mods here, and would like to begin work on a few of my own and I want them to play nice with each other, but I hate plagiarism and do not want violate any norms of the modding community as I make mine. 

 

Any advice on this is appreciated.

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As far as i know and my logic tells me, the moment you want to release a mod with assets of another one you should always ask the Author who created said assets. For example you use mesh and texture files from Mod A to create your mod, before publishing it it is not only a courtesy but the only right thing to do to ask the Modder who created them. Just using stuff from others is just outright shithead attitude you wouldn't want me to use your Kitchen without permission either. 

 

If a mod is dead it doesn't mean the author lost his rights to his or her work but i think there is a bit of a loophole? Dunno might better wait for someone else to add to this point.

 

 

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15 minutes ago, Azailahab said:

So if in creating a mod, it builds on another persons work, or requires certain mods to be installed in order to function, what is the proper protocol and etiquette to do so? I assume it is frowned upon to simply to use another's work in its entirety without permission. However, I am not sure what is required for different levels of integration of the other persons work as it relates to your own mod.

 

At what level is it best to ask for permission?

 

What about dead mods where it is impossible to contact the original author?

 

Is simply having another mod as a prerequisite the deciding factor, or is it the use of code, or the other mod as a basis of your mod? Is mere attribution enough?

 

If your mod is substantially similar to another mod, but not based on their code is it frowned on to create it?

 

I love a ton of the mods here, and would like to begin work on a few of my own and I want them to play nice with each other, but I hate plagiarism and do not want violate any norms of the modding community as I make mine. 

 

Any advice on this is appreciated.

Let me start with a simple proviso: I am not a Moderator. I have been here for some time and I have seen this discussion occur more than once. It is with that in mind that I am going to attempt to answer your questions.

 

It is entirely acceptable to create a mod that simply requires another mod in order for yours to function. My mods, for instance, all require SexLab. If you try to load Skyrim with one of my mods and don't have SexLab (and its requirements) your game will CTD.

 

It is most certainly frowned upon (that is, it violates the rules of LL) to use someone else's work, in whole or in part, without their permission and, if asked, attribution. So, when I made my followers I used KS hairs. The authors of that mod gave a general permission to use it as long as attribution is given - which I have done. If I had so much as used a single texture that was created by KS hair without their permission, that would violate the rules. That should answer the question about permission. If you are using anything from another mod within your mod (as opposed to simply requiring the presence of another mod in the load order) then permission is required. At what point, precisely is this line crossed? At one point LL's guidelines included the phrase (related to another topic) "should I post this?" And the answer was to the effect that if you have to ask the question then you shouldn't post it. Similarly, if you have a question as to whether your action might be construed as piracy then simply don't do it.

 

Unless someone has left specific instructions, a "dead mod" is still the sole property of its author. All of what I wrote above applies to it as well as one that is currently supported.

 

Not only is creating a mod similar to an existing mod not frowned upon but it is celebrated (usually). That is just so long as you don't use the material of the mod that you are emulating. A current example is VirginMarie is making a mod entitled "Toys" (now in alpha) that has many similarities to the better known Devious Devices (lead maintainer, Kimy). I trust that there will be no use of any DD material in Toys although some older mods (whose authors have left their work to the entire community) is being incorporated.

 

Hopefully I've covered your questions. I've answered as best I could based on what I've read here in the last few years. Good luck and make LOTS of mods. I enjoy using them!

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Sometimes mods are realesed with licences such as GPL or creative commons, in those cases the rules of the software licences would apply.

So in GPL you could share and modify it without any requirements other than share your modifications also under GPL for others to use.

In case creative comons I dont really know the legal stuff but you can read that here https://creativecommons.org/about/cclicenses/

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Thanks for all the replies. Yes they have answered my questions, my primary concerns were about if a mod requires another mod to function, and making mods similar to other mods that do the similar things, both of which were addressed. The advice on using assets without permission is exactly what I expected and makes perfect sense. 


As for making lots of mods, we shall see, I am an engineer by trade and not a professional coder so the going will be slow as I learn the way the game works on the inside. The majority of the modding tools do not seem too complicated, however, often times the documentation and tutorials seem fragmented and are littered with conflicting advice, all of which takes some time to sift through. So I will be taking it slow and starting far less ambitiously than I would like. I think for any mod (like most projects in industry), it requires a solid foundation that is designed from the beginning for expansion, and rushing that part only makes headaches later on. 

 

That said, when I get my first mod working without breaking the game I will post to get feedback from the more experienced members of the community. 

 

Thanks again.

 

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1 hour ago, Psalam said:

Unless someone has left specific instructions, a "dead mod" is still the sole property of its author. All of what I wrote above applies to it as well as one that is currently supported.

And what seems like a dead mod can come alive again, as happened in A Rubber Facility. That mod was up for adoption for years - and it actually was adopted and the original author comes along and gives a big thumbs up. Just because someone doesn't have the time for modding, doesn't mean they're not around.

I'm no modder myself, but from what I've seen in the threads, people here on LL are a friendly, helpful bunch.

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2 hours ago, Azailahab said:

At what level is it best to ask for permission?

 

At any level.

2 hours ago, Azailahab said:

If your mod is substantially similar to another mod, but not based on their code is it frowned on to create it?

 

 

If it uses different assets, methods or code it's no one else's business whether it's frowned on or not, particularly in environments where all "property of intellect" is actually owned by the parent company as soon as a mod is published in public.

 

 

2 hours ago, Azailahab said:

 

If your mod is substantially similar to another mod, but not based on their code is it frowned on to create it?

 

If it has a license it's not dead, if it doesn't have a license you are literally playing russian roulette and don't be surprised if you get spanked. This also depends on the community. In l4d and Gmod this happens all the time because A 14 year olds don't care what copyright is, they just need to fap to hatsune miku anthropomorphized guns that can break glass at 4 decibels and B chinese people of any age don't give a fuck about getting permission for anything because IP stealing is the literal norm there. Mods get deleted from said workshops on a literal daily basis for stealing and breaking permission, but since the environment is literally uncurated it continues. You'll find the nexus and here a very different place, and you can eventually expect to get IP banned and account permabanned for such behavior. Other places like 9damao and schaken literally pay people to steal mods.

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3 hours ago, Azailahab said:

So if in creating a mod, it builds on another persons work, or requires certain mods to be installed in order to function, what is the proper protocol and etiquette to do so? I assume it is frowned upon to simply to use another's work in its entirety without permission. However, I am not sure what is required for different levels of integration of the other persons work as it relates to your own mod.

 

At what level is it best to ask for permission?

 

What about dead mods where it is impossible to contact the original author?

 

Is simply having another mod as a prerequisite the deciding factor, or is it the use of code, or the other mod as a basis of your mod? Is mere attribution enough?

 

If your mod is substantially similar to another mod, but not based on their code is it frowned on to create it?

 

I love a ton of the mods here, and would like to begin work on a few of my own and I want them to play nice with each other, but I hate plagiarism and do not want violate any norms of the modding community as I make mine. 

 

Any advice on this is appreciated.

If a mod is a framework (Sexlab, ZAP, DD, ect.) then no permission is required.  Common courtesy dictates sending the author a PM rough explaining what you intend to do.  This might also make them look kindly at any help requests you might have.

 

I always ask for permission BEFORE I start work on anything.

There's no such thing as a 'dead' mod.  If you think a mod is abandoned and fair pickings then PM a moderator and let THEM decide if it's okay to use.  That's what they're for.

Don't need permission to have a mod listed as a prerequisite unless you intend to repackage their content.  Sending them a heads up PM would be nice though.

'Similar' doesn't make the cut for people getting upset about anything.  A Ford and a Bentley are 'similar'.  If someone doesn't like what you've done on that level then they're the one with the problem, not you.

General rule of thumb; if you don't think you should then don't.

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  • 5 months later...
On 2/9/2021 at 2:37 PM, 27X said:

 

At any level.

 

If it uses different assets, methods or code it's no one else's business whether it's frowned on or not, particularly in environments where all "property of intellect" is actually owned by the parent company as soon as a mod is published in public.

 

 

 

If it has a license it's not dead, if it doesn't have a license you are literally playing russian roulette and don't be surprised if you get spanked. This also depends on the community. In l4d and Gmod this happens all the time because A 14 year olds don't care what copyright is, they just need to fap to hatsune miku anthropomorphized guns that can break glass at 4 decibels and B chinese people of any age don't give a fuck about getting permission for anything because IP stealing is the literal norm there. Mods get deleted from said workshops on a literal daily basis for stealing and breaking permission, but since the environment is literally uncurated it continues. You'll find the nexus and here a very different place, and you can eventually expect to get IP banned and account permabanned for such behavior. Other places like 9damao and schaken literally pay people to steal mods.

Paying people to steal mods...you commit liable much?  You realize everybody  is taking these outfits and such from the same libraries because one person beat another to a 3BA build doesn't in any sense give the first person exclusive rights t make a 3BA outfit or use those resources.  Saying they are paying people is super uninformed defamation.  YOu are alot less likely to get sued making a similar mod than saying stupid unfounded things in a forum.

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