Tsukiha738 Posted April 18, 2025 Posted April 18, 2025 I'v been checkout out this mod - like mod, very interesting idea. I have one issue with it though: after defeating chain beasts from mine in Riverwood NPCs who have been attacked by them remain naked and do not retrieve items which they lost from small chests. This made half of RIverwood ppl walk around naked - is there a way to make them retrieve their stuff and re-equip their outfits after Chain Beasts defeated automatically? Didn't find anything related to that in MCM and no possibility to disable undressing for NPCs either.
badbat111 Posted April 19, 2025 Posted April 19, 2025 3 hours ago, Tsukiha738 said: I'v been checkout out this mod - like mod, very interesting idea. I have one issue with it though: after defeating chain beasts from mine in Riverwood NPCs who have been attacked by them remain naked and do not retrieve items which they lost from small chests. This made half of RIverwood ppl walk around naked - is there a way to make them retrieve their stuff and re-equip their outfits after Chain Beasts defeated automatically? Didn't find anything related to that in MCM and no possibility to disable undressing for NPCs either. you need a key from a dead chainbeast with key in inventoy go upto naked bound npc free them they run to there box once they got there gear back talk to them again to recieve a spell showing where your box is for if you forget the location
Jim55 Posted April 23, 2025 Posted April 23, 2025 1. I can't seem to pop "Chained down: Enslave an NPC captured with a summoned beast" Every time I summon a beast and I capture an NPC with it it is already following me and the spell claims "no valid target". If I dominate someone captured by a mine it doesn't pop. Am I doing this wrong? 2. I can't get Aspect of Nocturnal to go. The lore dude says "go ask around for thieves" but nobody in Riftens has dialogue. PDF suggests I talk to Rune but Rune has no dialogue (name's Rune. Yes, just like you think it is" and nothing else). Also PDF suggests that all I need is "access" to Rune. But do I have to progress the Thieves Guild far enough to do something? I think I remember his name coming up and he opens up in another playthrough.
MTB Posted April 23, 2025 Author Posted April 23, 2025 9 hours ago, Jim55 said: 1. I can't seem to pop "Chained down: Enslave an NPC captured with a summoned beast" Every time I summon a beast and I capture an NPC with it it is already following me and the spell claims "no valid target". If I dominate someone captured by a mine it doesn't pop. Am I doing this wrong? 2. I can't get Aspect of Nocturnal to go. The lore dude says "go ask around for thieves" but nobody in Riftens has dialogue. PDF suggests I talk to Rune but Rune has no dialogue (name's Rune. Yes, just like you think it is" and nothing else). Also PDF suggests that all I need is "access" to Rune. But do I have to progress the Thieves Guild far enough to do something? I think I remember his name coming up and he opens up in another playthrough. Spoiler 1. I it's the one I'm thinking of then its about moving your captives to PAHE. Talk to them `your mine now (enslave)' -> releases them from the beast and makes them a PAHE captive. 2. To start the relevant quest (enabling conversation option), you need to ask about his name first and say you'll look out for anything (vanilla conversation-does have some requirement but not sure exactly at what point in TG quest line it's available; should be quite early but maybe not directly on gaining entry to the lair).
Jim55 Posted April 24, 2025 Posted April 24, 2025 (edited) 12 hours ago, MTB said: Hide contents 1. I it's the one I'm thinking of then its about moving your captives to PAHE. Talk to them `your mine now (enslave)' -> releases them from the beast and makes them a PAHE captive. 2. To start the relevant quest (enabling conversation option), you need to ask about his name first and say you'll look out for anything (vanilla conversation-does have some requirement but not sure exactly at what point in TG quest line it's available; should be quite early but maybe not directly on gaining entry to the lair). Spoiler Nghhh. He isn't magical. There is one NPC in the game (Michelle, the door-woman from DCL) that ONLY displays the DCL dialogue, making it impossible to "Here, let me get you out of that" (requiring MCM), but Rune isn't special AFAIK and I played this before. I don't know why it's stuck. Is it because I did them in the wrong order, aka last? I remember playing his quest he asks me to get something related to his name. Spoiler By the way, fun fact, SCB can move NPCs great distances. Michelle, the aforementioned woman-door is in Riften. Supposed to guard the door in Riverwood. I know how it happens, too. She saw the mine and went on the "oooh, shiny" quest. First, walk to player, say "I can't resist" then walk to mine and activate it. I had my back turned, so I didn't see her. When I travelled to Riften, she hitched a ride and, after being waken up, she just stood there. Edited April 24, 2025 by Jim55 brb
Jim55 Posted April 24, 2025 Posted April 24, 2025 OK I'm back. So. I was trying to sniff out the remaining content based on the cheevos. Spoiler Quest Achievements (see also Section on Quests) ✔Chain Saw: Complete Beasts of Chain to reveal and achieve. ✔Minesweeper: Complete Beauty and the Chain Beast to reveal and achieve. ✔Dark Mine, Dark Mind: Start Ebony Mine to reveal, and either ignore it (Snow White) or complete it (Black Widow) to achieve a highest level. ✔Mark of the Beast: start Caged to reveal, complete it to achieve the highest level (Escaped). This is buggy. It goes "Escape" or similar when captured. Then, when you are released, it goes "Escaped". However, all my gear is in there. So, I go back, it relocks. Getting gear and leaving makes it locked. Going back, killing Whatshisface and leaving is also locked. Yes I know you said it's buggy, you are correct. I played this 3 times reloading every time, all 3 ended in disaster. Once my companion refused to surrender and was playing golf with Craig or whatever, once she got captured and the entire pathing of the beasts got nuked between a rock, Craig, the cage and some dust and clogged up, and the third time it sort of worked except a giant bear spawned in. I ended up loading, escaping and MCMing my stuff back. ❌Rune's Hope: Start Runes for Rune to reveal, complete it to achieve the highest level (Bejeweled). Can't start. ✔A Friend in Need: Start any of the aid Chain Beast victim quests to reveal, complete all to achieve the highest level (True Saint). 2 quests I think. Done. ✔A Good Deed Rewarded: Rescue young Klymer, just be happy you did a good deed when talking to old Klymer and wait for a message (1 week later) to reveal and achieve (level: Milk Drinker). Bit iffy, but it worked. The victim was just walking to the pole, but fortunately I chained her. 💔 Payback is a Chain Bitch: Rescue young Klymer, but make them pay. Different end levels depending on your actions (Precision-punish only old klymer, Pay Up-coerce them to pay, My Precious-keep the ring, Overkill-kill someone, Undone return them as you found them, Match breaker-otherwise prevent the wedding.) Is this above, but with a "specific response"? Not getting it, ever. AFAICT you can only play this once? ✔Be Mine Forever: Crash the wedding party (What a Wedding Quest) to reveal and achieve. 10 events is forever if you only have WW events on. I MCM'd it. Idea: flexible number depending on interaction checkboxes. Suggest 5 for MF, 2 MM, 2FF, and add them up. Or add a timeout. ✔Key Miner: Start the Key Miner quest to reveal, complete it multiple times bringing in lots of keys to reach the highest level (Maxed). Easy. I must be a great hunter. I have 400 keys, 200 masks, 200 ankle chains, etc, because I forgot this mod sends me to sleep without letting me know that is what I need in the ebony mine quest. ✔ A Chain of Tasks: Start the P aspect quest (Labors of the Dragonborn) to reveal, gain the aspect of P to achieve the maximum level (Master Mined). Action Achievements 🕒Chainzoologist: Revealed from the start, read all Chain Beast related books (including spell tomes) to achieve the highest level (Professor). I never got this. It speaks of tomes. It speaks not of locations of tomes. 🕒 Ride em Cowboy/girl: Learn the ride chain spider spell to reveal. Realize it also works on other big Chain Beasts, and use it on at least two different classes of beasts to achieve the highest level (Rodeo). Yeah, simple oversight, I'll get it. ✔ Fine mess: Trigger a Chain Beast Trap to reveal and achieve. ✔ MINE over Matter: Conjure up a Chain Beast mine to reveal and achieve. ✔ Unleash the Chain Beast: Summon a Chain Beast to reveal and achieve. ✔ Maker of Chains: Capture an NPC with a summoned Chain Beast to reveal and achieve. ✔ Chain off Command: Help an NPC out of SCB restraints to reveal and achieve. ✔ What Once Was Mine: Cast the Find my Boxes spell to reveal and achieve. ✔ Gifted: Obtain Chain Breaker to reveal and achieve. Level changes depending on whether you are still carrying it. ??? Heart of chain I have this, I think it has to do with the dragons. I assume WIP, it sort of stopped after I got the heart. It has ??? because it's not in the PDF. ??? Hidden No idea. Plugin Specific Achievements ✔ A Magical Gold Mine: Complete Pain in the Netch to reveal and achieve. (SCB_DB Quest Achievement) ❌Chained down: Enslave an NPC captured with a summoned Chain Beast to reveal, after which level will indicate number of victims enslaved. (SCB_PAHE Action Achievement I don't have PAHE I thought this was "???" above but it's listed under the plugin, I missed that. I guess it's down to Rune. And whatever "???" is.
kapibar Posted April 24, 2025 Posted April 24, 2025 I killed a prison chain beast outside of Whiterun, but I can't save game after that (infinite save). Everything is OK during the fight, but when the beast dies, the saving process freezes. Has anyone encountered a similar problem?
Jim55 Posted April 25, 2025 Posted April 25, 2025 No and Google doesn't think it's a common issue. try these: 1. How big is your save? Bloat is a thing with Skyrim 2. Can you save from console? "save kapi" and "load kapi". Does quicksave work? 3. Try to go away from the area, like other side of Skyrim, sleep for 3 days and then come back, see how things are. A full reset happens after 30 days, but there are cell reset mods and you can look into PCB command, though that could affect your game. Try to make a backup and use a save cleaner on your stable save, see if that lessens the game if loaded.
MTB Posted April 26, 2025 Author Posted April 26, 2025 (edited) On 4/24/2025 at 4:13 PM, Jim55 said: I'm back. Me too (i.e. reply failed, trying again...) Spoiler >Rune's Hope >He isn't magical. Rune has a `conversationblock' condition on the vanilla name dialog. Not sure what lifts this; joining TG/following TG quest line/TG jobs? I've added an alternate route to starting the quest; when taking to the LM about noc's aspect it will also start the quest and you can ask Rune for the job without name conversation - in next update. Until then a Console work around: startquest SCB_INT_RuneQuest then talk to Rune about job. ?? Payback is a Chain Bitch: Rescue young Klymer, but make them pay. Different end levels depending on your actions (Precision-punish only old klymer, Pay Up-coerce them to pay, My Precious-keep the ring, Overkill-kill someone, Undone return them as you found them, Match breaker-otherwise prevent the wedding.) Is this above, but with a "specific response"? Not getting it, ever. AFAICT you can only play this once? Yes the Klymer quest(line) cannot be repeated, so need to go back to a save from before `talking to old Klymer about a reward' to try out alternate paths. Then choose not to be a milkdrinker in this conversation. (You will pay...) That starts the follow up quest that can lead to this achievement. You have several options from there...you'll have to figure out what they are... > Locations of tomes: Looking up which tomes are needed I noticed a bug; this achievement was not updated to take into account that the ebony mine quest can change which spells you have.. So only possible to obtain if you're still `snow white' and have read: report in Arcanium + notes in Ratway + spell books for riding, conjuring and placing mine(or have obtained the related spells in another way). Will need to add a fix... Edit: (attempted) fix added for next update. > ??? If it's the one after heart of chain then try using aspect of Hirc. reward power. > have this, I think it has to do with the dragons. I assume WIP, it sort of stopped after I got the heart. It has ??? because it's not in the PDF. Yes that's newer than the pdf. It's Seeker or (max:) ReleaseTheBeast. >By the way, fun fact, SCB can move NPCs great distances. Michelle, the aforementioned woman-door is in Riften. Supposed to guard the door in Riverwood. I know how it happens, too. She saw the mine and went on the "oooh, shiny" quest. First, walk to player, say "I can't resist" then walk to mine and activate it. I had my back turned, so I didn't see her. When I travelled to Riften, she hitched a ride and, after being waken up, she just stood there. Just had a similar experience. Should likely add in an `if they get far enough from the mine it's hold on them will release' mechanism. Edit: (attempted) fix added for next update; player changing areas should stop the scene... Edited April 26, 2025 by MTB
Jim55 Posted April 27, 2025 Posted April 27, 2025 16 hours ago, MTB said: >>Rune's Hope >>He isn't magical. >Rune has a `conversationblock' condition on the vanilla name dialog. Not sure what lifts this; joining TG/following TG quest line/TG jobs? Weird. I can tell you what's NOT the block, I've done the Thieves Guild quest until New Management and I don't think I did it last time around, it's a stupid long quest for a very low payout. Whatever it is, It's not the TG main questline. Last time I did this late in the game. > I've added an alternate route to starting the quest; [...] in next update. Hurray. > Until then a Console work around: [...] Works > Yes the Klymer quest(line) cannot be repeated, so need to go back to a save from before `talking to old Klymer about a reward' to try out alternate paths. Eh. I'll live without it. I understand what you were trying to do with the hidden quest, but adding a visible achievement for something that can't be achieved isn't optimal. Personally, I'd make it repeatable. Especially since it's easy to bug it out. >> ??? >If it's the one after heart of chain then try using aspect of Hirc. reward power. I don't know what that is. In fact, I meant to bring this up. All I get is a notification top right that goes away in a second or so. I never get what happened. Maybe add it to the last stage of the quest so it's written down? Either on the tortured quest title (you know what you did) or on the Jyggalag Hypohtesis. Maybe "Aspect of Sanguine", when done, renames to "Sanguine has granted me Chain Stripper" or whatever. I'll even take the PDF. It's not in the quest text, the PDFs or anywhere else I noticed (even the forum has 0 hits for "hircine") How about "Hidden Achievement" in MCM becomes "Hidden Achievement 1", 2, 3, etc? Easier to track locked cheevos. BTW, from story PDF If you do that, the cage relocks and you are boned. Safe from the bear though. Because Katy Perry speech aside, bear beats naked player most of the time. The bear didn't care about my title.
Jim55 Posted April 27, 2025 Posted April 27, 2025 Spoiler Either I'm an idiot or a genius. Shut up. MCM refuses to allow me to interact with the disabled menus via mouse, but keyboard/controller works so I can select the menu bar and it tells me the hint of the hidden achievement. it appears that I need to $SCB_ACHIEVE_HIGHLIGHT_23. I'm kidding, I'm kidding. I'm missing * Slave Herder dream quest Never loaded properly I think, 4 people spawn and change color but never move Additional note on that notification thing. I get told to get the special whip. Go into dream sequence. Use whip. Open inventory, 25 whips from various mods. Who knows. I tried a few random ones. Didn't do anything. Why not have the whip there or equip it when teleporting in? You can keep the "selling the sister" hint. * And the one that uses pheromone beasts to satisfy someone's lust. No idea why, I have that quest completed. (checks) Embry-Sigrid chain lust is done, I have been rewarded. Probably some gold, the little... * Turn beats into statuette. "No target". I'll try again. Maybe it hates the beasts I tried it on. Do they need to be wild and not summoned?
MTB Posted April 27, 2025 Author Posted April 27, 2025 8 hours ago, Jim55 said: Do they need to be wild and not summoned? What did you bring to the hunter.... Spoiler Corpse; has to be dead. 8 hours ago, Jim55 said: I have that quest completed. Then I don't know, I'll have to check for bugs...
Jim55 Posted April 28, 2025 Posted April 28, 2025 (edited) On 4/28/2025 at 12:35 AM, MTB said: > What did you bring to the hunter.... A debug spawn, I'm not carrying something she might not accept across the whole map. I don't know if the ridden beast has a limit, if it despawns, if it throws me off, if it bugs out. I get it, it's supposed to teach me the ride function, but there's no beasts around her. How about a quest where I need to get something from a cave that is INFESTED and I can't go in directly, so to get past I have to ride a spider like I were a victim to get to someone inside or retrieve a MacGuffin. Looking back, I remember having an elephant spawn in front of Laura's shop and there's a dragon one where the dragon quest happened, but, since mines don't have labels, I didn't bother indexing them. Besides, took a long while to realize some mines are specialized, since the ones I summon and at least some of the story ones are random leveled, usually spitting out dogs and a random spider. Speaking of which, I have basically completed Solstheim and all I saw was dogs, only the gold floatie quest produced a not-dog. I mostly get dogs. I only had 2 dragons in game, one in the heart quest and another spawned literally next to me when I exited Proudspire manor. Gold, top tier dragon. I have no idea what I did. Maybe some text or shape of mine or something. Or maybe mine sizes. Small, medium, large, that prefer swarms of small things, medium things or big things. I feel your pain, as a dev, but users don't know what things do, and with a mine trigger being a whole event it's hard to experiment. This could be a good way to weave that god aspect into the thing, maybe associate beasts to deities and stuff if small-medium-big isn't your thing. So, a shrine of Mephala on a chain could spawns mostly spiders. Also, chain mimics are making my game worth playing, they are so much fun. Any word on a fix for the reverting mimics not reverting and thus eating the original contents? Some contents are important. Spoiler Additional idle thoughts. Mimics bite you with a chance to give you mimic disease "weakness to chains" While weakened, mimics triggered have a (100%?) chance to get a buff: * Hunter mimic: mimics are stronger (2x) and bite harder (2x). * Carrier mimic: mimic can summon several small mimics that gank * Alchemimic (name WIP): mimic attacks by lobbing projectiles at you (that do splash damage or don't miss or just play an animation and you get the effects). These act as potions, of drain stamina, paralize, etc. Cured as any other disease Mimics that bite you have a chance to give you a timed status effect called "Smell of chains" This stench warns the mimics you are coming, so, instead of you getting the drop on them, they get the drop on you. While efect is active, mimics bite when activated, equipping one of the 3 restraints on you (hands, legs, head), making defense challenging. Hands restraint severely decreases strength, collar magika, mask stops shouts and legs kill stamina. This is meant as a sort of challenge, but I need to think more, as my follower can one shot mimics. Smell of Chains is timed. These would need a modal text box first time they happen. Edited April 29, 2025 by Jim55 I found the Proudspire mine, very sneaky
MTB Posted April 29, 2025 Author Posted April 29, 2025 Spoiler On 4/28/2025 at 4:58 PM, Jim55 said: across the whole map If only there were some power with which that was not necessary, that could take you back to some spot you chose in the blink of an eye. Spoiler cough aspect of mephala cough. Spoiler >maybe mine sizes You mean like how the ones that summon only spiders are lower, that mine at whiterun that summons the mobile prison is a lot larger than the ones that summon beasts, and the ones that summon dragons ever larger ? Yes that would be a good idea.... On 4/28/2025 at 4:58 PM, Jim55 said: Any word on a fix for the reverting mimics not reverting and thus eating the original contents? Can't reproduce and haven't thought of anything that could be causing this...,maybe if I put some debug code in the `ondeath' method that should trigger the reverting then someone with the issue can test.... On 4/28/2025 at 4:58 PM, Jim55 said: Hands restraint severely decreases strength, collar magika, mask stops shouts and legs kill stamina. Hands; what's the point - you cannot attack anyways? collar - does that already if you enable in MCM mask - and magic; should already be doing that, like any zaz mask... legs - slows you down. As the capture mechanism is stamina based that might mess with the balance. What balance ? "Shut up." On 4/28/2025 at 4:58 PM, Jim55 said: Mimics bite you with a chance to give you mimic disease "weakness to chains" While weakened, mimics triggered have a (100%?) chance to get a buff: * Hunter mimic: mimics are stronger (2x) and bite harder (2x). * Carrier mimic: mimic can summon several small mimics that gank * Alchemimic (name WIP): mimic attacks by lobbing projectiles at you (that do splash damage or don't miss or just play an animation and you get the effects). These act as potions, of drain stamina, paralize, etc. Cured as any other disease Carrier mimic ; sort of like the one in Asp. Nam. quest. Hunter: Stronger if as in more HP, sure easy. Bite harder - nope, that requires new races, spells, etc. etc. Could make them faster (like the book ones). Alchemimic : like the idea, especially for the alchemy table mimic, but a lot of things needed that I've not messed with before (custom projectiles, explosions, etc.), and the base beast would need to be something with a range attack to begin with. e.g. a spider based mimic instead of a crab based one ... not something quick and easy.
Jim55 Posted April 30, 2025 Posted April 30, 2025 9 hours ago, MTB said: Hide contents > If only there were some power with which that was not necessary, that could take you back to some spot you chose in the blink of an eye. god damn it. >>maybe mine sizes > You mean like how the ones that summon only spiders are lower, that mine at whiterun that summons the mobile prison is a lot larger than the ones that summon beasts, and the ones that summon dragons ever larger ? Yes that would be a good idea.... I couldn't tell. I assumed they were placed weird and the rest of the chain was underground. Look, it's a mod, I have a minimum amount of jank I expect. Mine height wasn't on my radar. And I suspect that side by side I could tell but 30 mins apart? I noticed gold vs iron, but some spawn iron beasts and some spawn gold, so I assumed that was it, then they spawned steel beasts so I stopped caring. So these do different things? >> Chest mimics not reverting > Can't reproduce and haven't thought of anything that could be causing this...,maybe if I put some debug code in the `ondeath' method that should trigger the reverting then someone with the issue can test.... I have logging on. So what happens is they pop out, we have a fight, I win quite easily, and they play a linear animation where they slide back to their deathspot. Then: 98% of the time they just disappear while sliding, the slide projects to them sliding back under the map slightly, but if TCL'd they aren't there. 1% of the time, they slide back correctly, but once in place they fade out of existence 1% of the time, they go back correctly, but when activated they have a mix of items, some are stolen. If I wait a little after the animation is done, the items correctly revert to not taken, usually except for one lockpick that is stolen for no reason. Tons of chests and barrels and sacs don't open, but after casting the fix spell they work as regular chests. Which is kinda weird, because regular mimics spawn too. I started this game with 0.9.3, I think. I have Deviously Enchanted Chests, if that matters, but it's off in this installation (off in MCM). I probably should have mentioned that, now that i think about it. I use it in combination with quickloot to make quickloot trigger stuff. It's probably fighting over chest triggers. How did it work before? Also, for testing purposes, I upped my mimic mania to 100% and of 10 chests and barrels, 0 opened. They all had to be cleaned. So it's not a fluke. Different issue to not reverting though. > Hands; what's the point - you cannot attack anyways? I was thinking of slowdown or a debuff to damage. Or health. AKA a different restraint. I keep forgetting you're not using Devious gear and you would have to craft things. > collar - does that already if you enable in MCM Only if it wins? Or is there something I missed? If you mean reuse the regular one, yes, that would work fine. > mask - and magic; should already be doing that, like any zaz mask... > legs - slows you down. As the capture mechanism is stamina based that might mess with the balance. What balance ? "Shut up." It was my intention to mess with the balance. At level 80, with a powerful crossbow, I basically one shot most things. I brought this up before, with the percentage capture thing. And ok, maybe I'm OP, but even my follower can down a chest mimic in 1-2 hits, with a dragonbone warhammer. She loses when there's more enemies, true, so the point was to sort of buff mimics in certain circumstances. Like later levels. Around my level, enemies have 1200 health. I forged and sharpened a Greatsword for test and took the base perks. Without any buffs, any gear fortifying and no pots, I go about 250 per swing. About 500 with a heavy attack and a crit, meaning 2 hits. I have a follower. So even though I am an archer with archer gear, I still basically 2-hit a gold chest mimic. 1200 health is a regular enemy, which I am supposed to dispatch in groups of 5 at least. And regular enemies are modded because they are weak. Devious Strikers are cool. (Do you think I like the idea too much? maybe I'm letting it influence me. I really like the fact that DS has no idea nor does it care about your level or strength. It Just Works.) What chance does a mimic have? By the time it did its little dance it already ate a crossbow shot worth (checks) 9872 damage of its 1150 lifespan. This is why I'm suggesting some sort of advantage that mimics could have to at least have a chance to bite first. Which is why I suggested a roll for it to bite first and give itself a chance. I sharpened Chainbreaker and took the base one handed perks and it now does 300 damage. This is without enchanted armor. So, what, basically two hit? I mean it makes sense, it's a chain breaker, it's supposed to do this, but because this is base damage and not an enchantment, all swords do 300 damage, its only boost is the absorb stamina. Maybe boost the armor a bit and make chainbreaker damage armor? I'm probably thinking too hard about this. Regular mines with several dogs do well balance-wise, and there's the fader to add more. It's the solo mimic that has issues. Which is why I was considering some sort of level-independent buff. Say, dodge/bounce damage, 100% on first hit then every bounce its chance to block drops by 25%? I'm throwing it out there. > Carrier mimic ; sort of like the one in Asp. Nam. quest. I admit I don't remember them off-hand, but yes, I have seen this. > Hunter: Stronger if as in more HP, sure easy. Bite harder - nope, that requires new races, spells, etc. etc. Could make them faster (like the book ones). I like the book mimics, they are harder to hit and usually surprise me. They don't really bite that hard. In fact, the hardest for me is the serpent beast. It's hard to hit no matter how many levels you have and they hit pretty hard. Anything more than one is a problem. They routinely fly away with my companion while I'm busy. IMO, the only balanced ones. How would an elephant ever hope to hit me? Elephants should have a horn (as in sound) animation where they do an AOE attack or spit chains around them. As cool looking as they are, I am very far away or behind it. I eat dragons for breakfast, what would an elephant do? Chain dragons are cool, but they take 20 seconds to even get into position, by which time it's down to 75% of health by city defenders alone. Then, the attack spawns one beast where the entire town is gathered with weapons. It's doing nothing. What it should do is it should have a cone and just capture anyone in the cone, possibly spawning some beasts. To balance it, it would have a limited amount of attacks. Alternately, since it doesn't kill NPCs, it could spawn immune (or very high health) and only de-immunize once it fires its first shot. So, its attack would do 500 stamina damage in a cone and damage armor 100% on self, damage health 10000 on self. It's a dragon, it's supposed to be a force of nature. By they way, I know that corpses despawn, but do restraints? Game's getting a bit littered. I try to pick them up but they get everywhere. Debug cleanup option? > Alchemimic : like the idea, especially for the alchemy table mimic, but a lot of things needed that I've not messed with before (custom projectiles, explosions, etc.), and the base beast would need to be something with a range attack to begin with. e.g. a spider based mimic instead of a crab based one ... not something quick and easy. I was thinking something like, it gets in range, and then the chest does an animation where it opens its flap and glows. If the animation ends and you are closer than X to it, you get spawned and consumed one potion. The weirder the better. These could get you addicted to skooma, damage attributes or whatever you can do with effects. I'm sure there's one that dims your view or something. I don't think anyone checks if what it does is a pot. Effects work too, as do forcefully equipped gear. I won't bring up Devious gear, I don't want to imply you should, just that the code exists to forcefully equip debilitating gear in chain form.
Jim55 Posted April 30, 2025 Posted April 30, 2025 (edited) Spoiler Opinionated fish. Spoiler The chest on the right keeps spawning clones Edited April 30, 2025 by Jim55
MTB Posted May 3, 2025 Author Posted May 3, 2025 On 4/30/2025 at 7:28 AM, Jim55 said: Also, for testing purposes, I upped my mimic mania to 100% and of 10 chests and barrels, 0 opened. They all had to be cleaned. So it's not a fluke. Different issue to not reverting though. Conflicts with mods like Deviously Enchanted Chests are possible, but unresponsive chest could also just be a `script state not kept on unload' issue - I've built in more safeguards against that in the fix/new version. Did you install the MM quick fix; that may help with this part. (Also integrated in the new version I'm uploading as I type but that's LE only for now, need to convert it yet). No idea about the post kill problems. Expected: Spoiler For `Integration' Mimics (newly added items) : After dying they just leave a CB corpse that stays in that spot. (Until cleaned up by the game, or used as a mount...) For MM Mimics (replace existing items): - with auto revert on: Quickly after dying they should start translating back to their original position (i.e. where the chest was when you opened it). (Not expected you activate it before/during that but if you would, you'd only see CB `on death' items, not the original content of the chest.) After 1/2 sec it will start to fade away and the original chest should reappear, which now contains all items; the ones that were in the chest before and the ones that you typically get when you loot a CB corpse. - with auto revert off: The corpse will stay there, the items of the original container will be in beast corpse. Only when you empty it entirely (or you leave and the cell detaches) will it move back to it's original position.
Jim55 Posted May 4, 2025 Posted May 4, 2025 (edited) Spoiler Reporting in, issue: MM chests. 1. New chests, as a rule, Just Work. They have reverted to their original place, with original loot and added stuff. 10/10. 2. Going to places where chests were known bugged are still bugged. In fact, chests that are fairly recently checked retain their bugged status. Can be cleaned. 3. Now the weird part. I went in search of untouched chests. I found one in the middle of nowhere. I have been there before, but way back. - Nuke enemies - Click chest - MIMIC! - Kill - Revert - Disappear. I think to myself, "I should record that". Load a save nearby (as in, in view of chest), nuke enemies, click chest, nothing. Bugged chest. Equip cleaner spell, spell says "Cleaned chest, Act not blocked, state=inactive". Click chest, _dead_. As in, will not do anything, sounds goes "bonk" as if you pressed interact in front of a wall. Tried recleaning, nothing. Click chest, disable/enable, chest comes back fine (vanilla). This is repeatable. Load a save FAR AWAY, walk all the way to the chest, dispatch, click chest, MIMIC! Dispatch mimic, reverts and disappears. I THINK that new mimics revert, and old ones marked as mimics don't. This "cleaned" that does nothing is weird. Happened before, but only once or twice. Is there a way to "refresh" chests? Other than a new game. Do I have to roll over with 100 chests I think I vaguely remember? Do they have to be mimics, or any 100 opened chests roll over? Also, it seems that at least in part, loading a save is part of the problem. Loading near chests bugged it, loading far away did not. Chest was probably already tagged as old MM since it didn't revert. I'll keep experimenting. P.S. i like the graphics on mines and spells and the ebony mine is now black. ETA: I started the Dawnguard quest and this is the first I've been in this area, mimic did not revert correctly. :< https://streamable.com/75nmuh Further tests show that the barrel DOES revert into place, I can hover it and it prompts me to interact, but then gets disabled. I can see its contents for a fraction of a second and it's the original contents, no additions from the mimic. 4 apples 2 bread. Further-further test seems to indicate that if I camp where the chest is supposed to be and mash interact, it will stay. Even after being looted, it will stay empty. Edited May 4, 2025 by Jim55
MTB Posted May 4, 2025 Author Posted May 4, 2025 With so much weirdness I expect a mod conflict, likely with DEC and/or Autoloot and/or something else you've got installed; anything that could influence activation of containers etc. ? Btw does DEC also do barrels, or only chests? If cleaner spell say activation not blocked then the container should have been interactive to begin with. No script prevents normal activation in this case... I'd expect a broken container to say something like act blocked state= First (or maybe "").
Jim55 Posted May 6, 2025 Posted May 6, 2025 I have removed my previous answer because I was wrong on something important. So. On 5/5/2025 at 1:11 AM, MTB said: > With so much weirdness I expect a mod conflict, likely with DEC and/or Autoloot and/or something else you've got installed; anything that could influence activation of containers etc. ? I have DEC, but it never triggers in this installation. I use it for configuration of events. I also have DCL. Also off in settings. I have QuicklootIE and a DEC plugin for IE. What happens is QIE allows you to pull items out of the chest without opening it, and as a result DEC and DCL never trigger. Thus, the plugin has a percentage to trigger per item pulled, number, value, etc. And if it procs, it calls DEC to do the trigger. You can also press Q while in QIE UI to open the chest traditionally, and allow DCL to trigger and add stuff to the chest. DEC never triggers with this. It is possible that there's some sort of conflict with opening chests that renders them dead, but I suspect it's more of a Skyrim loading problem. I only have 3 events committed to memory where a chest was dead and 2 of them I loaded nearby and on the 3rd I don't remember. By the way, I did intentionally load near known mimics and it didn't happen yet. > Btw does DEC also do barrels, or only chests? DEC does any container, triggered by QIE. Chests, barrels, sacks, urns, bodies, you name it. If it opens, it does it. It basically clones DCL, except with a finer tuned probability filter and some extensions. And traps. > If cleaner spell say activation not blocked then the container should have been interactive to begin with. No script prevents normal activation in this case... I'd expect a broken container to say something like act blocked state= First (or maybe ""). I suspect it's broken-broken. As in, Skyrim doesn't work right, I don't think mods have to do with loading things Spoiler OK, so. the revert MM mimic thing is not reliable. It was reliable yesterday, but stopping and starting Skyrim again and now it's 50/50 if a reverting mimic disappears or not. Clicking it to loot it is also 50/50, so MAYBE that was a fluke? Starting it again, and now all mimics never revert. Starting again, it's about 50/50. Same room, 2 identical chests, first one reverts, second does not. It's starting to sound like it's timing. I wish I knew more about this so I could help. Sidenote, as I spent a big chunk of time doing Dawnguard stuff, I probably rolled over the old chests and I haven't seen any stuck chests, I'm yet to cast the fix spell. So that's better at least. However, the non-reverting mimic thing ate my collectible Dawnguard Rune hammer, so that's an issue. I get around it by clicking the chest in console before so I can recycle it if it goes wrong. Can't you set a timer on death and just enable the chest X seconds after it died, no matter what? Having something quest critical in a chest and having it tracked reveals that the chest is indeed there, reverted and working, but disabled. If you have it selected you can just enable it. This is probably a dud, just like previous post, but selecting it in console before the fight made it appear consistently. I wanted to test enable on a chest that didn't come back and I couldn't. I'll edit this if if I make it happen. It fading in and out of existence just feels like a script is just disabling it after the "revert" script ran. You can see it be enabled and disabled again.
MTB Posted May 7, 2025 Author Posted May 7, 2025 On 5/6/2025 at 10:03 AM, Jim55 said: Starting again, it's about 50/50. Same room, 2 identical chests, first one reverts, second does not. Could you check the SCB script log; it should say something like `disabled X' (when mimic created) .... `enabled X' (when mimic reverts). Does it perhaps say `stashed in the basement X' but then later `enabled X' (rather then moved up from the basement X) for the one that did not return? (Or is there any difference you can see between the messages for the one that does return and the one that does not?) If so that would narrow down the cause... On 5/6/2025 at 10:03 AM, Jim55 said: Can't you set a timer on death and just enable the chest X seconds after it died, no matter what? That's basically what the script does now...
Jim55 Posted May 9, 2025 Posted May 9, 2025 (edited) On 5/8/2025 at 12:37 AM, MTB said: Could you check the SCB script log; it should say something like `disabled X' (when mimic created) .... `enabled X' (when mimic reverts). Does it perhaps say `stashed in the basement X' but then later `enabled X' (rather then moved up from the basement X) for the one that did not return? (Or is there any difference you can see between the messages for the one that does return and the one that does not?) If so that would narrow down the cause... That's basically what the script does now... Is there another log, or just the papyrus log? It'll be a while I'm off for the weekend. ETA: My log has a lot of these, are these relevant? Spoiler [05/06/2025 - 08:31:26AM] error: Unable to call RegisterForSingleUpdate - no native object bound to the script object, or object is of incorrect type stack: [None].magicProjectileStormScript.RegisterForSingleUpdate() - "<native>" Line ? [None].magicProjectileStormScript.OnEffectStart() - "magicProjectileStormScript.psc" Line 155 [05/06/2025 - 08:31:26AM] DBA: Mod disabled. [05/06/2025 - 08:31:28AM] error: Failed to setup moving reference because it has no parent cell or no 3D stack: [ (FF00223E)].scb_mm_mimicscript.TranslateTo() - "<native>" Line ? [ (FF00223E)].scb_mm_mimicscript.TranslateToRef() - "ObjectReference.psc" Line 583 [ (FF00223E)].scb_mm_mimicscript.Revert() - "SCB_MM_MimicScript.psc" Line 33 [ (FF00223E)].scb_mm_mimicscript.OnClose() - "SCB_MM_MimicScript.psc" Line 20 [05/06/2025 - 08:31:28AM] error: Failed to setup moving reference because it has no parent cell or no 3D stack: [ (FF00223E)].scb_mm_mimicscript.TranslateTo() - "<native>" Line ? [ (FF00223E)].scb_mm_mimicscript.TranslateToRef() - "ObjectReference.psc" Line 583 [ (FF00223E)].scb_mm_mimicscript.Revert() - "SCB_MM_MimicScript.psc" Line 33 [ (FF00223E)].scb_mm_mimicscript.OnClose() - "SCB_MM_MimicScript.psc" Line 20 and these Spoiler [05/06/2025 - 08:32:07AM] Dumping stack 11769364: [05/06/2025 - 08:32:07AM] Frame count: 3 (Page count: 3) [05/06/2025 - 08:32:07AM] State: Waiting on other stack for return (Freeze state: Freezing) [05/06/2025 - 08:32:07AM] Type: Normal [05/06/2025 - 08:32:07AM] Return register: [Form < (000877A7)>] [05/06/2025 - 08:32:07AM] Has stack callback: No [05/06/2025 - 08:32:07AM] Stack trace: [05/06/2025 - 08:32:07AM] [ (00000014)].Actor.GetNthForm() - "<native>" Line ? [05/06/2025 - 08:32:07AM] IP: 0 [05/06/2025 - 08:32:07AM] [param1]: 954 [05/06/2025 - 08:32:07AM] [XjMBARFunctionsQuest (FE065801)].xjmbarfuncscript.IterateThroughPlayerInventoryForBooks() - "XjMBARFuncScript.psc" Line 96 [05/06/2025 - 08:32:07AM] IP: 202 Instruction: 6 Line: 96 [05/06/2025 - 08:32:07AM] [::temp18]: 954 [05/06/2025 - 08:32:07AM] [::temp19]: True [05/06/2025 - 08:32:07AM] [iCurrentlySelectedInventoryIt]: 954 [05/06/2025 - 08:32:07AM] [::temp20]: [Armor < (19016ECD)>] [05/06/2025 - 08:32:07AM] [::NoneVar]: None [05/06/2025 - 08:32:07AM] [alias XjMbarInventoryFilterFormListPlayerAlias on quest XjMbarPlayerAliasInventoryFilterQuest (FE06580D)].XjMbarFillInvFilterFormListScript.OnItemAdded() - "XjMbarFillInvFilterFormListScript.psc" Line 61 [05/06/2025 - 08:32:07AM] IP: 327 Instruction: 4 Line: 61 [05/06/2025 - 08:32:07AM] [frmBaseItem]: [Armor < (1900BC5B)>] [05/06/2025 - 08:32:07AM] [UnneededItemCount]: 1 [05/06/2025 - 08:32:07AM] [UnneededItemReference]: None [05/06/2025 - 08:32:07AM] [UnneededSourceContainer]: [scb_mm_mimicscript < (FF002217)>] [05/06/2025 - 08:32:07AM] [::temp9]: [FormList < (FE06580C)>] [05/06/2025 - 08:32:07AM] [::NoneVar]: None [05/06/2025 - 08:32:07AM] [::temp10]: False Spoiler [05/06/2025 - 07:48:34AM] error: Element of property traplist on script scb_int_corescript attached to SCB_INT_Core (1B000D62) cannot be bound because <nullptr form> (1B01450A) is not the right type I also had a Nemesis error but I have to check if that's my fault or not. Edited May 9, 2025 by Jim55
MTB Posted May 9, 2025 Author Posted May 9, 2025 (edited) 7 hours ago, Jim55 said: Is there another log, or just the papyrus log? Yes in the User subfolder of where they Papyrus logs are. These errors do hint at conflicts between mm and other mods. My best guess is that the mimic is somehow being reverted multiple times. (That could explain the `its there for just a moment and then disappears again; it comes back, but then the second revert would cause an issue.) Likely onclose is somehow being called multiple times on the mimic while it is empty (which is not possibly normally as it would disappear as the chest reverts). (If correct, the SCB log will likely show two (different) `revert' messages for the same beast/container.) I've built in a safe guard against this, but of course have no way to test. Updated scripts attached (place in data/scripts/). I think it should work on anything that has not reverted yet, but best to try it out in a fresh area/fresh containers if possible. 2e error (stackdump) Seems like this XjMBAR... mod (?inventory manager?) does not like iterating over things that are not there anymore...it seems to be trying to do something with a chain collar (a beast on death item) from a dead beast (sorting it after autoloot adds it / displaying it for selecting in an autoloot menu, just guessing here). However, as the mimic will move such items back into the original container when reverting, it may be removed between the time it was found and the attempt to do something with it... 3e error: harmless. (Just a no longer existing ref that's not used anymore anyways.) MM_Updated_Scripts.7z Edited May 9, 2025 by MTB
Jim55 Posted May 11, 2025 Posted May 11, 2025 On 5/9/2025 at 3:37 PM, MTB said: > [files] I have PEXed the files where (I think) they go and went for a play, with MM set to 50% and freshly reset logs. So far, after maybe 30 mimics, zero issues. They all have the loot from them and previously held loot, they all trigger and they all revert. I thought I found a box that went "boop" and did nothing, bit 1.5 seconds later it transformed and correctly mimic'd. It's possible some delays are linked to my autosave mod. So yeah, so far so good. Will keep testing. -- Sidenote, Serana is unusable. Serana is a magic follower, in that she can be a follower when you have other followers. If you get a follower in a part of her quest, she becomes permafollower and with Devious Followers I think she's stuck. I disabled her. Point is though, if she EVER gets captured, she is not listed as captured by debug page, in her place 2 marauders are listed. She can be interacted with, given follower commands (she ignores them), told to go home or follow (ignores them) to be freed (let me get you out of that) which works in that the animation reverts to idle instead of tied idle and the metal stuff drops off, but she resumes walking. She never works again as anything other than a broken follower. If she is ever given any instruction by SCB, she never reverts. Only person in the game. *shrug*
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