Yiffy Age of Skyrim

[NightroModzz]

And hey, if it's final you're going to send it to me right? Or give me a link?

It's more or less final, but I can't promise that I won't make some minor tweaks comming back to it while making the female head, which is actually in the same project file. I will send both you and Blaze the low poly OBJ files before I start on the high poly versions.

[NightroModzz]

Here's a picture of the final version of female cheetah

 

 

 

 

 

@Bad Dog - I'll give both you and Blaze69 the OBJ files, although Blaze69 will be the one getting it game ready. You will likely have to use my modifies mouth meshes to avoid seems though.  However, the mouth meshes do need new normal maps and it is on my to do list.

[Bad Dog]

Started playing with the cheetah heads today. Does anybody feel like it's important to stick with the vanilla UV layout exactly? Because I'm going to have to clean up the UVs some. The face is difficult and the ears are a mess. But I'm actually starting to pull something together I don't hate.

 

I also ran through the morphs real quick and there's some cleanup to do there too. The "surprise" morphs look like the ears have been chewed on--I don't know what happened, the rest look okay. If exporting tris is as painless as importing them, I'll clean them up and regenerate.

 

Pics over the weekend, probably.

[NightroModzz]

Started playing with the cheetah heads today. Does anybody feel like it's important to stick with the vanilla UV layout exactly? Because I'm going to have to clean up the UVs some. The face is difficult and the ears are a mess. But I'm actually starting to pull something together I don't hate.

 

I also ran through the morphs real quick and there's some cleanup to do there too. The "surprise" morphs look like the ears have been chewed on--I don't know what happened, the rest look okay. If exporting tris is as painless as importing them, I'll clean them up and regenerate.

 

Pics over the weekend, probably.

I tried making the polygons on the ears as even as I can.

 

Custon textures are needed for the Cheetah and likely any other head morph that changes the head shape enough. If your making textures specifically for it, I don't see why changing the UVs would be a problem. Especially if it's made as it's own race mod and not a Khajiit morph. Either way, existing textures wouldn't look right anyways. Would it cause any problems besides texture compatibility?

[Blaze69]

Started playing with the cheetah heads today. Does anybody feel like it's important to stick with the vanilla UV layout exactly? Because I'm going to have to clean up the UVs some. The face is difficult and the ears are a mess. But I'm actually starting to pull something together I don't hate.

Nope, there is no reason to stick to vanilla Khajiit UVs, at least not if you are going to create new textures for the cheetahs, and since you are, then we should be on the clear.

 

BTW, if you are going to edit the UVs in the OBJ file, then send them to me once you are happy with the result and I'll get those meshes ingame straight away. I haven't done the current ones yet, and I would have to import them again with the new UVs anyway, so it's better if I just use the final ones from the start.

 

I also ran through the morphs real quick and there's some cleanup to do there too. The "surprise" morphs look like the ears have been chewed on--I don't know what happened, the rest look okay. If exporting tris is as painless as importing them, I'll clean them up and regenerate.

I assume you used the method I posted eairler to morph the base head from the tri into the cheetah head and then tried the morphs, yes? Then sure, you can edit the morphs as much as you want, and then save the tri as a separate file for use specifically with the cheetah heads. Just make sure to keep vertex count and order untouched (though I think I've mentioned this a few times already).

 

Pics over the weekend, probably.

Neat! Can't wait to see those  .

[Bad Dog]

Truthfully, getting the obj files in game isn't a thing. I do my thing in blender, rig to the skeleton, and export using the blender nif scripts and I'm not (please God) having any problems with that.

 

Nitro sent some tri files with the cheetah head, which is what I was looking at. This morning I don't remember if they were just the regular Citrus tris or if they were adapted to the cheetah. But I used your method on the Lykaios head and it works fine. The greybeard load screen uses the "shout" morph applied to the Lykaios head.

 

Nitro, do you have any interest in making a hyena head? The current Kygarra is mostly okay but the low polycount on those bat ears really shows.

 

I figure I'll use Nitro's leopard head for panther and snow leopard and if the UV issues are in the original Citrus I'll have to fix things there too (I did look at them briefly and I think there are issues).  There it might matter more to stick with the current layout.

[Blaze69]

Truthfully, getting the obj files in game isn't a thing. I do my thing in blender, rig to the skeleton, and export using the blender nif scripts and I'm not (please God) having any problems with that.

Oh, good to hear, then. Still, if you run into any issues, just let me know and I'll get it done as soon as I can .

 

Nitro sent some tri files with the cheetah head, which is what I was looking at. This morning I don't remember if they were just the regular Citrus tris or if they were adapted to the cheetah. But I used your method on the Lykaios head and it works fine. The greybeard load screen uses the "shout" morph applied to the Lykaios head.

I will have to check (or Nightro will have to confirm it, whatever happens first), but I'm pretty sure those are indeed the default CITRUS morphs. Still, the idea is to use that same procedure to edit the morphs and change their base shape into the cheetah one (or the leopard one for them if needed). That way, you can directly edit the final result of the morphs and can fix any issues or oddities they may have.

 

Good thing you got them to work, BTW. And looking forward to seeing all the progress in the statics and statues and stuff.

 

Nitro, do you have any interest in making a hyena head? The current Kygarra is mostly okay but the low polycount on those bat ears really shows.

I second this, if it's possible. The current heads are okay, but the higher polycount the better, and it's true the low polycount of the vanilla heads shows pretty badly on some areas like the ears.

 

Also, the "male" hyena head happens to be an actual female head with an edited neck to more or less cover the male neck seam, which means the neck transition itself is even more awkward than the vanilla Khajiit one and some (male) hairs don't match the head. So if you were to create new hyena heads, all of that could be fixed as well simply by using a male head as a base for the male one.

 

Just my (and BD's, I guess) two cents, though.

 

I figure I'll use Nitro's leopard head for panther and snow leopard and if the UV issues are in the original Citrus I'll have to fix things there too (I did look at them briefly and I think there are issues).  There it might matter more to stick with the current layout.

I think there is no need to use the CITRUS heads for the other races if the vanilla Khajiit ones fit them good enough, specially if it would require more work on them to fix the issues, though that would be up to you. I'm happy either way.

[NightroModzz]

@Bad Dog - I didn't send you the tri files, just the OBJ head files. You likely got it when I linked you to my mod page "Detailed Khajiit Heads," Or Blaze69 gave it to you when he sent you the leopard heads.

 

As for the hyena heads, my plate is full enough as it is. In all honesty, cute or cool isn't the first thing that comes to mind when looking at a hyena. I already did a lot of the work in my edited base khajiit heads which makes multiple variations a lot easier to make. On average females take twice as long or longer to make because they have much more polygons to move around compared to their Citrus counterpart. I also try to keep most of the tri-polygons looking like even squares as it comes if I can.

 

Also, making a drastic change from the base takes a lot more work and the Sharkmer heads were a nightmare. Especially since I had to make the female sharkmer twice lol. Although the hyenas will likely be easier and already comes with a three dimensional map. I'm not saying I won't (or will), just send me the head and mouth meshes and I will consider doing it in either late June or sometime in July.

[NightroModzz]

A bit off topic:

 

@Bad Dog - Before when you updated to the Creators update for Windows 10, you said that you had some problems with Skyrim right? I have not tested it because I have yet to launch Skyrim since August 2016. But my theory is that the problem is "Game Mode" which is on by default. For the 32-bit version of Skyrim, we rely on some none-native applications/stuff like ENB or anything that isn't installed directly into the data folder like MO, SKSE, etc. Game Mode works by limiting the use of other programs in the background which may cause problems. It's found in settings, then the new "Gamming" section.

 

I've recently just updated because I think I have given it enough time to work out some kinks. Also because we have less than 60 days to update before the update/upgrade is no longer free. After that, they also announced that they will no longer offer security updates for the current version of Windows 10. (Current as in not the Creators update)

[NightroModzz]

Taking requests for tail meshes for June. Mainly because they are easy to make and I can do them from scratch instead of morphing.

 

If you just want a normal map upgrade, I can make a high poly mesh now or soon. Just send the low poly mesh. it will only take me 10-15 minutes for both genders. But just for fur detail for now. I would have to look for fish scale and reptile/dragon scale type alpha maps for those kind of tails in order to get fast results.

 

 

EDIT:

@Bad Dog - Did you forget about sending the Sharkmer feet mesh and body in the digi position? After the cheetah normal map mesh, I think I'm gonna give the Sharkmers another go. Me and blaze have a plan set that should resolve an issue, and is for the entire body. However, it will kind of be an off and on editing process with projects in between.

 

Can you send the SOS male body and UUNP Female body in the digi position?

[Bad Dog]

Durr, well, I kinda lost focus on those feet once I got into it enough to see the issues. I can scare them up again.

 

Good theory about the Creators Update. I might try that again. I haven't found anything online about others having problems with it.

[Akzyra]

Well, CS:GO gave me this link after the update because it might hurt performance.

This setting is now in the normal settings as well. I turned everything off as I don't need it.

 

The models and your creations in general are awesome, take your time

[NightroModzz]

Well, CS:GO gave me this link after the update because it might hurt performance.

This setting is now in the normal settings as well. I turned everything off as I don't need it.

Well, we launch Skyrim through MO not the Xbox app, so it's not an issue. Plus record in background is off by default, so it doesn't matter if that is on or off. The Xbox app has been present before the Creators update, so it's unlikely to be the issue.

[Bad Dog]

Tried again, failed again, at least so far. Turning off game mode didn't do it. Did some more google searching, reinstalled drivers. Not that. Reinstalled Skyrim from scratch, that actually got Skyrim working. Now trying the same with CK.

 

Also, too:

 

 

Shit ton of work still to do, but it's on its way.

[Blaze69]

Also, too:

 

Cheetah preview.jpg

 

Shit ton of work still to do, but it's on its way.

[Voldearag]

I think that texture might be /too/ good, enough to make other limitations start to look bad.

[NightroModzz]

Looking good so far. Normal maps still in prgress and I had to seperate the khajiit head into three meshes. Been a bit busy though and currently out of town again. The high poly male will be done tomorrow or the day after.

 

EDIT:

@Bad Dog - Would it be possible to ad a bit of a glossy wet effect on the nose? And don't forget the lips unless you want to rely on this (More accurate Khajiit chin and lips paint), which may not work right with the new UVs. Again, not sure if you can preview the textures over the normal maps in Blender(which I think you can), but I'm gonna leave some flatness (no fur) in the lip area if you want to line it up.

[Bad Dog]

Went and played with the skeletons some. 

 

Good news is that I can raise the whole skeleton as we talked about, so with that and a little scripting I can make room for the feet but get the guy back on the ground for sneaking. 

 

Bad news is that I can't modify rotations at all. "pos" changes the XYZ position and I thought "rot", "rotation", or "rotate" might change the rotation in the same way. But nothing I did worked. So I went back to tweaking the skeleton nif file. 

 

With a bit of fooling around, I got this:

 

   

 

Which I think is pretty good. There's no scaling of bones so thigh and calf are full size. The thigh is in vanilla position so there should be a lot less clipping. The calf and foot are out of position, obvs, so things like the cross-legged position may still be not quite right and they'll still hook their feet behind the crossrail when sitting down. But that might be fixable with the same script that fixes sneaking--detect when sitting and rotate the knee a bit more open. I can see how to do rotations with the NIOverride calls.

 

I'm thinking maybe reduce the overall height of everybody by a small fraction just so they fit furniture, counters, alchemy tables, and such.

Re textures, the cheetah is the same level of detail as the tiger and lykaios, so it should be fine. For noses and lips (and nipples on the ladies), I've been known to try for some glossiness using the specular map. I'll have a look at the mod you referenced, Nitro.

[Blaze69]

Went and played with the skeletons some. [...]

 

With a bit of fooling around, I got this: [...]

 

Feet Again 1.jpg Feet Again 2.jpg Feet Again 3.jpg Feet Again 4.jpg

Okay, that looks really nice, and it should indeed fix most of the issues I have with the current digi skeleton, most notably clipping and/or anims and poses getting distorted anywhere below the waist. Looking forward to this  .

 

BTW, as far as scripting is concerned, remember you don't need to reinvent the wheel. There's this mod: NiOverride High Heels - NIOVHH Fixes, which already does most of what you want, and it was built by ousnius, and apparently with help from expired. You know, those ousnius and expired. So you can trust the mod to be as optimized and efficient as it can be.

 

You can use that one as a base and simply add your required tweaks, like the sneaking fix. Should save you some time and ensure maximum efficiency and minimum script load. Just my two cents, though.

[Bad Dog]

Oh yeah, that's the code I'm looking at. But if I recall correctly I already have a cloaking spell for the hoodies, so I'll probably add this to that. Multiple cloaking spells give me hives.

[Blaze69]

Oh yeah, that's the code I'm looking at. But if I recall correctly I already have a cloaking spell for the hoodies, so I'll probably add this to that. Multiple cloaking spells give me hives.

Oh, so it uses a cloaking spell? Should have expected it, though; not like there is any other method to apply such scripts to NPCs. I guess adding it to your Hoodies spell won't have much of a performance impact, if anything, right?

[Bad Dog]

Right, I think the overhead is mostly in applying and spinning it up. Once you're running a script a few extra checks shouldn't add much overhead.

 

For modularity, it would be better to keep everything separate. Then hoodies could be hoodies and feet could be feet. But Skyrim realities generally work against modularity.

 

I'd love to see a generic cloak spell modder's resource, where a single cloak spell could call back to multiple mods. But given Skyrim, that would probably end up generating a bunch of overhead all by itself.

[NightroModzz]

@Bad Dog - Sorry it's taking so long. I've put a lot of time into it, just not as much as I wanted. This is all I have so far. Maybe it will be done in the morning or the next day.

 

 

 

 

Khajiit heads are just extra complicated and a long process for a high detailed normal map. I separated it into 3 meshes and the fur mesh (bottom neck) was creating holes in an area when trying to dynamesh. Dynamesh works better at removing seams. I prefer to just remesh and divide, but needed to dynamesh for khajiits and open the mouth before that, then close it again. Dynamesh creates 0 seams in the mesh and fuses things close together. Meaning I have to cut parts off again. In order for best results and fur detail I also have to convert it back into a tri (in order to keep it bellow 1 million polygons), but of course I have to get the detail in before that and fur after.

 

High poly meshes are usually made before the low poly ones, so every time I smooth, I need to make sure the high poly overlaps the low poly. The female will likely take longer, but will likely have it done before June. I am very busy and after the female, I'm gonna have to take a 1-2 week break from mod projects.

[NightroModzz]

@Bad Dog & Blaze69

 

Well, I'm not getting the fur results under 1 million polygons I thought I would. Even when converting to tri. I need up to 2 million or under I think. Does anybody know the polycount limit for xNormal? I already tried looking into it and found nothing. I did hear that people were able to bring in over 1.5 million in Subastance painter with a little wait, so I guess it's both a software and hardware limitation for that software.

 

For now, I will give both of you the smooth version.

[Blaze69]

@Bad Dog & Blaze69

 

Well, I'm not getting the fur results under 1 million polygons I thought I would. Even when converting to tri. I need up to 2 million or under I think. Does anybody know the polycount limit for xNormal? I already tried looking into it and found nothing. I did hear that people were able to bring in over 1.5 million in Subastance painter with a little wait, so I guess it's both a software and hardware limitation for that software.

 

For now, I will give both of you the smooth version.

Already replied in the PM, but I'll post it here as well just in case: XNormal doesn't seem to have a polycount limit per-se, which would mean the only limit is the one imposed by your own rig's specs (CPU and RAM).

 

The only post on that matter I could find said that on a PC with 4GB of RAM, XNormal was able to handle a ZBrush exported OBJ file with around 30 million polys just fine, so 2 million should not be a problem at all.