Paid Modding is gone... or is it?

[Gameplayer]

Don't get me wrong I love your work. Bodyslide or not to be honest means little to me as end user. Ultimately it all boils down to does it work and will I use it or not. Rather it is completely original or a repackage or a conversion quite frankly doesn't matter.

Which of course I am guessing it is something creator takes issue with, which then lead to whose metric we use to judge a mod and its relevancy.

 

Kendo was just making sure that I knew some things about the state of modding and that I understood ultimately that Bodyslide wasn't where its at for well even like modder fame.

He also implied to me where the money with the skill sets are and that if Fo4 had a money in it in future that it would be at the shit end of a stick.

So sure it looks like an attack but myself and others know Kendo and we all know that amoung mod authors Bodyslide isn't exactly whats respectable.

Cause that is like being a poser and really one could go as far as saying for an artist that any mod conversion in fact is just being a poser.

 

But that is getting deep into how an Artist thinks which is really different from a gamer or a mod author or game designer.

 

Cause Kendo knows I have like made a living as an artist and ya BS\OS is just being a poser and sure it gets the job done for a game but ultimately what he said was the money and the creative freedom to know that original works are in fact mine are in existence elsewhere.

I've done all I could with Bodyslide and Outfit Studio but have you actually seen a video on anything that was introduced as a slider set modification but heck man we've seen conversions of stuff from other games that are converted absolutely crappy in videos by respected or at least viewed youtubers.

All I can say is I'm at the top of that dogpile.

 

I'm the first person people think of when they think they need a conversion done with Bodyslide despite all the other stuff I can, have, and know how to do.  Of course the get out of jail card comes down to this.....If I had made a whole bunch of original meshes for a game then where would I be?

 

I'm not saying the programs crap, it does the job but at the end of the day, it exists for converting someone elses work and although I see stuff in the program that suggests that I could in fact at some point in the future create meshes...Hell man I know how to jury rig shit in that program in a convincing enough way that you'd swear I made the outfits from scratch.  The issue with Bodyslide and Outfit Studio is basically this one thing...You the converter bypass the entire design process...Now that's not an issue to a gamer, and that will likely fly right over the heads of a lot of people but it doesn't escape me, cause I have created original works and I know for damn sure how much effort that takes.

That doesn't matter.

Cause the original mesh and custome are not mine.

 

My take is that if I got time to bang out all that stuff than I got time to do something that might sell on another platform where I don't run the risk of what every fallout 4 author is running into.

 

[27X]

 

 

My take is that if I got time to bang out all that stuff than I got time to do something that might sell on another platform where I don't run the risk of what every fallout 4 author is running into.

 

 

 

This is why people like Alpha left the Beth/Nexus community and went to the modeling resource community, and now the only issue they have with copyright and sale is from people like kris+a whom lives in a country where no fucks are really given about ownership-implied or otherwise.

 

Bethesda (the publisher) knows they're essentially wrong, and they don't care, cause they want the money and they can already see where the community that plays their games are going. By all means they put in time and a fuckton of money developing the platform that allows modding to occur cleanly and sure as hell they could become Rockstar overnight and still make money hand over fist, and maybe they should, cause there's isn't the faintest chance in hell they're going to give modders the lion's share of any deal, ownership or money.

 

They're one of most insulated publishers and developers in the world outside of Blizzard and BioWare, and it's really shown over the last three years. They consulted Valve, they didn't consult the people making the content, save for people Valve picked for them and Dark "gib moneys or bans" 0ne, whom as we've seen over the last five years does not give the remotest fuck about content produces other than what they can do to drive ever increasing  ad revenue to his site. (which he really doesn't need, the man is independently wealthy to begin with, if Nexus exploded tomorrow he might shed a tear or two, that's about it)

 

And therein is the primary disconnect. These people do not give the remotest of fucks about content creators other than how they can be leveraged. The only reason we're even having this discussion is two people at Beth figured out a rather long LONG time ago the aftermarket content can be up to 50% of your lifetime sales, provided you have the means to make it occur. That's why Sony and Micro$haft are even willing to have their bandwidth hosed keeping the platform alive on consoles as well, they expect a cut, and the "season pass" model is pretty much a starting-to-die concept in light of shit like BattleBorn/Evolve and Mortal Kombat, and everyone knows what the new models is, and that's Warframe's "lifetime whale" model, and all you have to do is look at the deluge of "hab monnies, gib ranger armor NAOW" comments on Bethesda.net in the dl section to see why the EULA is what it is, and the Nexus is absolutely complicit in that up to their eyeballs.

 

The only way you're going to get this to turn around is getting Bethesda to be content with taking the high road in other installments of their product, to let software and section managers make the decisions they're actually qualified to make without having a paid-to-nanny lawyer sniffing every decision they make, for those section devs to work out the agreements on external tools and cross licensed production applications.

 

Allow the creation community to give as much effort back as they put in, otherwise the writing is rather obvious on the wall. Duke Nukem, Blood, every old game Atari vultured up and is now literally holding for ransom, same for Vivendi.

 

As the people working at Beth get older, much like Valve they are steadily losing sight of how they got their feet into the door to begin with, and nothing good can come of it.

[GrimReaper]

I suppose bethesda.net will die soon anyway. Steam Workshop didn't live that long either and was plagued by the same problems. Only now on beth.net you have tards constantly spamming XBONE PLS or PS4 PLS, so it might die even faster than the workshop did.

[afa]

From a pure business point of view I still think it is completely logical for them to follow this idea. The success of Dota 2 hats can't really be undermine and was likely a prequel to this and I guess custom meshes and textures is the closest parallel.

What I am seeing is people saying they shouldn't do this for completely opposite reasons:

1. People want free shit, well ok I am not going to blame them.

2. Modders feel like they deserve a higher cut and more control over their content after putting it on sale, which is essentially they want more out of the system than the proposed rather than saying they don't want pay mod. Understandable as well.

On top of it however it seems like the content lock down desired among modders is already reaching the sun setting portion of modern day content and copyright fiasco without ever basking in the, supposedly, honeymoon era of yesteryear. Complicated issue.

[Gameplayer]

From a pure business point of view I still think it is completely logical for them to follow this idea. The success of Dota 2 hats can't really be undermine and was likely a prequel to this and I guess custom meshes and textures is the closest parallel.

What I am seeing is people saying they shouldn't do this for completely opposite reasons:

1. People want free shit, well ok I am not going to blame them.

2. Modders feel like they deserve a higher cut and more control over their content after putting it on sale, which is essentially they want more out of the system than the proposed rather than saying they don't want pay mod. Understandable as well.

On top of it however it seems like the content lock down desired among modders is already reaching the sun setting portion of modern day content and copyright fiasco without ever basking in the, supposedly, honeymoon era of yesteryear. Complicated issue.

 

Ya well its like,

 

Kendo was saying don't use original works in the modding scene with Bethsada....If your in it for money Bethsada is uh well toxic even if your in it for free.

Cause the risk that modders run when making anything is that they may stumble into a good idea that's worth money.

 

Its like this sure I may be the guy that's done all the sliders and the first one that people think of when they think oh I need conversion...Well sure I developed an Industrial Process to convert shit over in 15 minutes.  So is that claim outside the realm of possibility...No its not I converted a whole pack of 356 full weight meshes, improved on the weight paint scheme to UUNP, and well from start of the decision to upload and launch of the pack it all got done in under 30 hours.  Of course you gotta realize that I slept, ate, took restroom breaks, and uh did other stuff while I was working on that Vanilla Sized Pack.  A normal person would take the whole afternoon or maybe 5 afternoons to convert just one outfit to CBBE\UUNP....

Me, I take about 100-1,000 meshes (In fact I'd argue that its faster to convert meshes in volumes of hundreds rather than one outfit) in a go and convert it over in under an afternoon with full weight paints....Tidy folders, nicely laid out....What really burns people up is I went as far as to improve on shit I did.

 

That process itself and the capacity to develop and use a process like it that's also worth a whole hella lot of cash to corporations.  Because its a tremendous times savings....Time being a costly form of capitol in the real world.   If people had looked at the body of work they'd realize that I did about 3 people's amount of work in Bodyslide total in just a matter of 7 days.  There are guys that spent year on the amount of 1/3 that volume in Bodyslide...And others years in render programs.

 

The issue is that modders develop methods to tackle situations and overcome obstacles and those methods are also worth cash.

 

Kendo is saying that the issue is that the people putting the time in may think oh its just a game but the thing is that even the guy that is saying its just a game may actually be the guy that develops something anything it might not even be a thing that normal people even recognize as being valuable but the problem is that it all goes to a Corporation.

 

There used to be a time that people knew that Corporations were by definition evil.   Gamer's expect corporations to be like these loving all caring god entities that will provide a retirement check or something at the end.  They act like Corporations are there to enhance their well-being,....But the truth about the current trend with Bethsada's Terms of Service is that its there to rob you of your ideas no matter how big or small they are and all to the applause of sheeple.

 

The last couple of pages have been basically....Kendo2 comes on and says to me....Gamefever....This, this, and this....That makes money that doesn't ....Whats a guy like you still doing modding when you know whats going on?

 

I don't have an answer to that, I've just been goofing off after studies, and well I would have been better off either playing with Daz3D or just playing my game since uh ya I study a shit ton for school.

[Kendo 2]

The people who are flippant and so cavalier with other people's content are the ones who don't know how to make anything for themselves.  It happened when New Vegas was released and people were stealing FO3 mods and submitting them as their own work.  This happened again with Skyrim and people taking mods and uploading them to SteamWorkShop as their own work.  Later still with Skyrim and OutfitStudio mod poaching.  More of the same.

 

Basically the people with the least amount of talent are free-wheeling with the content made by those who do have talent.  The general attitude is 'I don't see what the big deal is.  It's just a mod.'  But if it is 'just a mod' then the people doing the thieving and poaching shouldn't have any problems making their own meshes and textures instead of stealing them.  But they don't do that.  In fact there are entire threads here at LL devoted to taking content without permission from various sites and using OutFitStudio to convert them.  There's a den of thieves under our noses and no one says anything and the staff here does nothing about it.  They won't allow DAZ/Poser conversions to be hosted here but stealing content from modders is A-OK.

 

None of this misdemeanor bullshit amounts to anything (obviously) until monetized modding is thrown into the mix.  There will be a real cash incentive to be a thieving cunt.  They won't be rewarded with Nexus kudos or other meaningless internet praise; they'll be getting a paycheck on the backs of the people doing the real work.  If modders are counting on the Bethesda.net TOS to protect them then they have a rude awakening coming.  FO4 mods stolen from Nexus are being uploaded to Bethesda.net and once they get uploaded there that's the end of it.  Zenimax/Bethesda then owns it in totality (according to them) and the Nexus staff will do nothing to stop it or punish the uploaders.  In this environment someone would have to be brain-dead to upload original content for FO4, but it will eventually happen.  Bethesda took a giant shit modders with their FO4 EULA and the Bethesda.net TOS.  WHY anyone is modding it is a fucking mystery.

[27X]

It isn't just the corporations. Mods are nothing without a base to consume them, and when the base is actively hostile or mercenary to the modding community it's just as detrimental.

 

I did a complete hard canon conversion of AvP2 to fit entirely and exactly in line with the movies. 8 gigs of assets directly sourced from master material gained from knowing people at FOX, and people who took over the source material when it went to auction.

 

I've been done with this thing for almost four years, and it still sits in silence because the community that remains has become entirely ruled by petty douchenozzles that think they're entitled to claim anything made as their own, to take it and slap a new name on it and throw it up in their private servers as their work.

 

Sorry but I spent five years and almost 20 grand getting this shit together, and that simple answer to that is fuck you. I worked for those permissions, I worked to set up stuff  where if I used something inspired or done by someone else they got their proper due.

 

The same logic is why nothing I've made for Skyrim is public, because for every person grateful for new life in the product they paid 5 bucks for in a steam sale, there's fifteen that think the game exists to literally service them and only them.

 

You can't fight an attitude like that unless you have the logistical means to get up their asses legally, and Bethesda fucked that avenue from hell to breakfast on purpose.

 

 

 

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tUV7AvzGuDI

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fcs2Itz-5rc

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ThncxvPxvOE

 

 

 

[Gameplayer]

The people who are flippant and so cavalier with other people's content are the ones who don't know how to make anything for themselves.  It happened when New Vegas was released and people were stealing FO3 mods and submitting them as their own work.  This happened again with Skyrim and people taking mods and uploading them to SteamWorkShop as their own work.  Later still with Skyrim and OutfitStudio mod poaching.  More of the same.

 

Basically the people with the least amount of talent are free-wheeling with the content made by those who do have talent.  The general attitude is 'I don't see what the big deal is.  It's just a mod.'  But if it is 'just a mod' then the people doing the thieving and poaching shouldn't have any problems making their own meshes and textures instead of stealing them.  But they don't do that.  In fact there are entire threads here at LL devoted to taking content without permission from various sites and using OutFitStudio to convert them.  There's a den of thieves under our noses and no one says anything and the staff here does nothing about it.  They won't allow DAZ/Poser conversions to be hosted here but stealing content from modders is A-OK.

 

None of this misdemeanor bullshit amounts to anything (obviously) until monetized modding is thrown into the mix.  There will be a real cash incentive to be a thieving cunt.  They won't be rewarded with Nexus kudos or other meaningless internet praise; they'll be getting a paycheck on the backs of the people doing the real work.  If modders are counting on the Bethesda.net TOS to protect them then they have a rude awakening coming.  FO4 mods stolen from Nexus are being uploaded to Bethesda.net and once they get uploaded there that's the end of it.  Zenimax/Bethesda then owns it in totality (according to them) and the Nexus staff will do nothing to stop it or punish the uploaders.  In this environment someone would have to be brain-dead to upload original content for FO4, but it will eventually happen.  Bethesda took a giant shit modders with their FO4 EULA and the Bethesda.net TOS.  WHY anyone is modding it is a fucking mystery.

 

Hey just so people are clear on this,

 

I have permissions from each mod author whose stuff I converted.

 

 

 

_______________________________________________

 

Part 3 sucks, cause are they really actually...I mean I guess they are counting on Beth to look out for them shit....

 

[Guest]

The people who are flippant and so cavalier with other people's content are the ones who don't know how to make anything for themselves.  It happened when New Vegas was released and people were stealing FO3 mods and submitting them as their own work.  This happened again with Skyrim and people taking mods and uploading them to SteamWorkShop as their own work.  Later still with Skyrim and OutfitStudio mod poaching.  More of the same.

 

Basically the people with the least amount of talent are free-wheeling with the content made by those who do have talent.  The general attitude is 'I don't see what the big deal is.  It's just a mod.'  But if it is 'just a mod' then the people doing the thieving and poaching shouldn't have any problems making their own meshes and textures instead of stealing them.  But they don't do that.  In fact there are entire threads here at LL devoted to taking content without permission from various sites and using OutFitStudio to convert them.  There's a den of thieves under our noses and no one says anything and the staff here does nothing about it.  They won't allow DAZ/Poser conversions to be hosted here but stealing content from modders is A-OK.

 

None of this misdemeanor bullshit amounts to anything (obviously) until monetized modding is thrown into the mix.  There will be a real cash incentive to be a thieving cunt.  They won't be rewarded with Nexus kudos or other meaningless internet praise; they'll be getting a paycheck on the backs of the people doing the real work.  If modders are counting on the Bethesda.net TOS to protect them then they have a rude awakening coming.  FO4 mods stolen from Nexus are being uploaded to Bethesda.net and once they get uploaded there that's the end of it.  Zenimax/Bethesda then owns it in totality (according to them) and the Nexus staff will do nothing to stop it or punish the uploaders.  In this environment someone would have to be brain-dead to upload original content for FO4, but it will eventually happen.  Bethesda took a giant shit modders with their FO4 EULA and the Bethesda.net TOS.  WHY anyone is modding it is a fucking mystery.

 

Great post.

 

I think it's interesting how for the most part fan run communities like Nexus and LL are mostly able to police their own very effectively and keep the thievery / bullshit at bay.

 

It's only when large company platforms like Workshop and Bethesda.net come onto the scene that all fair play and creative honor fall apart.

[Gameplayer]

The people who are flippant and so cavalier with other people's content are the ones who don't know how to make anything for themselves.  It happened when New Vegas was released and people were stealing FO3 mods and submitting them as their own work.  This happened again with Skyrim and people taking mods and uploading them to SteamWorkShop as their own work.  Later still with Skyrim and OutfitStudio mod poaching.  More of the same.

 

Basically the people with the least amount of talent are free-wheeling with the content made by those who do have talent.  The general attitude is 'I don't see what the big deal is.  It's just a mod.'  But if it is 'just a mod' then the people doing the thieving and poaching shouldn't have any problems making their own meshes and textures instead of stealing them.  But they don't do that.  In fact there are entire threads here at LL devoted to taking content without permission from various sites and using OutFitStudio to convert them.  There's a den of thieves under our noses and no one says anything and the staff here does nothing about it.  They won't allow DAZ/Poser conversions to be hosted here but stealing content from modders is A-OK.

 

None of this misdemeanor bullshit amounts to anything (obviously) until monetized modding is thrown into the mix.  There will be a real cash incentive to be a thieving cunt.  They won't be rewarded with Nexus kudos or other meaningless internet praise; they'll be getting a paycheck on the backs of the people doing the real work.  If modders are counting on the Bethesda.net TOS to protect them then they have a rude awakening coming.  FO4 mods stolen from Nexus are being uploaded to Bethesda.net and once they get uploaded there that's the end of it.  Zenimax/Bethesda then owns it in totality (according to them) and the Nexus staff will do nothing to stop it or punish the uploaders.  In this environment someone would have to be brain-dead to upload original content for FO4, but it will eventually happen.  Bethesda took a giant shit modders with their FO4 EULA and the Bethesda.net TOS.  WHY anyone is modding it is a fucking mystery.

 

There is a mod here on Lovers Lab,

I'm sure everyone here has heard of it the mod is called Devious Devices Integration.

 

 

 

A common complaint that often came up with the narrow range of body selections and what was on offer....In fact that was often the whole reason why people wouldn't even use the DDI Framework which by the way has a whole wide range of mod authors making mods for it, in fact about 100 people have been a part of that team at one point or another.

So I fixed that, by making the outfits work on UUNP Bodyslide.

 

The next issue something that a lot of end-users are likely unaware of is that the outfits in the vanilla game wouldn't work well cause the bodies in the outfits did not have the same weight paints.

 

So, Kendo2 .................

 

What did I do?

 

I fixed that too.

 

What I wonder is do you understand that the entire DD team and a good deal of their fans are all thankful for the work I put in to accomplish that for the community and I wonder if you and others know that even though according to some that I am in fact the King Asshat of Bodyslide that the body of work accomplished a great deal for a good many mod authors and their Mod users that they would otherwise not have at all.

 

Cause what I see is that you would have had all those mod authors facing a dwindling user-base. 

 

And it was all done under proper permissions.

 

I make this statement because its true and due to the outpouring reaction that I'm watching on YouTube over the Fo4 mod crisis, and what I see as something you said that could be mis-interpreted.  There is a reason why a whole lot of people are appreciative towards me and I get that you and other Artists don't understand that.  But at the time that I moved everything over to UUNP we were facing down Fo4 but hey here all those mod authors that create stories and entertainment that LoversLab is known for well hey sorry man they actually like the fact that no one can say hey Im not using your mod doesn't support XYZ body.

 

Heh anyway we went over this before but some of my DDI buddies got all over your case about it.

 

 

And dont

 

Cause the bottom line we got too with you when we went into this was pretty much that all those users were

 

SOL if you had it your way.

 

Well fuck that means the authors that make the DD stories don't have an audience.

 

 

So you have probably been wondering why I got involved with the Bodyslide program and well you've made some jabs at me well.

That's why.

 

Saw an issue and I just said hell I'll fix that.

That was that.

[afa]

This is interesting, asset and methods could worth money, certainly, but the only way in which a modder should release them is if it can be free because the potential lost is higher in a paid environment.

The safer option would actually be to upload directly to beth instead of going through other sites, but the TOS is not palatable by modders.

[Kendo 2]

@Gameplayer

 

There is a world of difference between YOU (seeking permissions, and having principles and scruples) and the OutfitStudio mod poachers I'm talking about.

 

When I first uploaded UNP Jiggle I had all sorts of comments about how I used 'the wrong HDT skeleton' or that my weight painting was flawed.  Come to find out, the reason I was getting those comments IN MY UPLOAD THREAD was because OutfitStudio losers couldn't simply plug my meshes into OutfitStudio and have them work with whatever Tinker Toy projects they were trying to do.  CBBE users were trolling because I wasn't bending over to make their lives easy.  The way I made UNP Jiggle was a happy accident since it gives potential thieves a headache.  My feelings aren't hurt in the least since I made the body for myself and it works with the Devious Devices UNP TBBP meshes that come with the mod.  In fact I made UNP Jiggle to work specifically with Sexlab and DD.  The only mesh replacers needed are the nipple piercings, which I provide (with permission) in my UNP Jiggle uploads.  See, I don't need BodySlide and OutfitStudio and the people who use my mods don't either.

 

Anyway, the 'I don't care who made it, I'm taking it' attitude doesn't benefit modding.  When Oblivion was hot people with this mentality were stealing mods from Asian websites.  The result was those communities withdrawing and forbidding Westerners from using ANY of the content.  That hurt Oblivion modding.  When people were stealing FO3 mods and using them for NewVegas that ended up hurting NV modding for a long time.  FO3 modders simply refused to mod NV or allow their content to be used for it.  After Skyrim and people stealing mods to upload them to Steam modders either placed more restrictions on their work or deleted it altogether.  Again, a greedy and thieving few fucked it up for everyone.  Now with the advent of OutfitStudio any joker can be a 'modder' in about 10 to 15 minutes worth of moving sliders around.  It takes longer to upload what they've made than it did to convert it in the first place.  And somehow I'm supposed to be 'thankful' that someone is doing me a 'favor' and converting things I've made to work with a body mod I don't use or care about.  And if I stand up for my work and question what is being done with my content I get called names and rode down on by the very group of people who're stealing my work in the first place.  That's just all kinds of fucked up and wrong.  These people act like entitled assholes with free mod content.  Imagine the level of dickery they'd perpetrate if monetized modding and a potential cash payout were involved.

 

Bethesda doesn't have a clue as to how to operate a storefront modding venue that won't be plagued with thievery, copyright violations and all the other wankery going on at Bethesda,net right now.

 

 

The safer option would actually be to upload directly to beth instead of going through other sites, but the TOS is not palatable by modders.

 

IF I did decide to mod FO4, Bethesda.net would be the place I'd upload to.  It would end up there anyway and at least if monetized modding revived the mods would be under my name and I'd be the one to profit from them.  Even then I would only upload mesh and texture tweaks of Bethesda-owned content.  There's no way I would ever just give them original meshes or textures.  That simply isn't how business relationships work.  If I make something original then I get paid market price and I get paid in CASH; not 5 cents on the dollar and in BethesdaBucks credits.  Since they're too asinine to be fair all they would get would be armor mash ups and retextures from shit they made.  That's the only way to 'win' with Bethesda.net at this point. 

[Drakenred]

in all fairness they had to start learning sometime.

 

you would think though that they would at least have payed some attention to what was going on with nexus and Steam....

[DocClox]

On a related note, I see there's a lot of noise today about "industry insiders" predicting a "Skyrim Remastered" announcement at E3.

 

If it happens, what do you want to bet the remastered version comes with a new EULA and a CK release tied to beth.net?

 

http://gematsu.com/2016/06/rumor-elder-scrolls-v-skyrim-remaster-announced-e3-2016

[Dracula19]

I kinda wanna wear Parachute pants in skyrim now I'm not sure why !

I can make that for 500 USD )))))) and to dont tink is to expensive I add the pants to all skyrim chickens to! for free!

[afa]

To be honest who gains how much control and how much should the paid out be is just contract negotiation at that point, everyone is going to aim for a larger cut.

Although I do think they have gone too far to not do something with it, at the moment the entire thing feels like it is stuck in limbo. Then again that might not be a huge deal which could means either mods were never that big of a deal to begin with or somehow it is actually back to business as usual.

 

Also Skyrim remaster? Intrigued, can see how it could be carried out (improve lightning, better textures, meshes upgrade maybe,) but not impress.

I thought Morrowind would make more sense, and that's coming from someone who doesn't care much for Morrowind.

[Kendo 2]

On a related note, I see there's a lot of noise today about "industry insiders" predicting a "Skyrim Remastered" announcement at E3.

 

If it happens, what do you want to bet the remastered version comes with a new EULA and a CK release tied to beth.net?

 

http://gematsu.com/2016/06/rumor-elder-scrolls-v-skyrim-remaster-announced-e3-2016

Yep.  Skyrim mods for consoles, a new EULA forced through Steam, Bethesda sabotaging existing Skyrim game installs, etc.  I doubt they will pander it as a 'new game' that people will have to buy.  They will simply hi-jack what people already have.  I'm saying any of that will hapen, but it sounds like something Bethesda would do.

[bjornk]

Bethesda sabotaging existing Skyrim game installs, etc.  I doubt they will pander it as a 'new game' that people will have to buy.  They will simply hi-jack what people already have.

It's certainly not impossible. With a sneaky Steam update, they might replace existing installations with the "remastered" version and a new EULA.

[27X]

 

Bethesda sabotaging existing Skyrim game installs, etc.  I doubt they will pander it as a 'new game' that people will have to buy.  They will simply hi-jack what people already have.

It's certainly not impossible. With a sneaky Steam update, they might replace existing installations with the "remastered" version and a new EULA.

 

 

Actually they're legally obligated to keep the original version.

 

See: Unreal, DooM, Witcher, Mass Effect.

 

 

 

remastered

 

They don't have to, even though they probably will; the updated CK terms says thus:

 

 

Skyrim Creation Kit End User License Agreement, "If You distribute or otherwise make available New Materials [Mods], You automatically grant to Bethesda Softworks the irrevocable, perpetual, royalty free, sublicensable right and license under all applicable copyrights and intellectual property rights laws to use, reproduce, modify, adapt, perform, display, distribute and otherwise exploit and/or dispose of the New Materials (or any part of the New Materials) in any way Bethesda Softworks, or its respective designee(s), sees fit,"

 

If you've made content for Skyrim since 1.9 using their tools, or their content, they own your shit as soon as it's public.

[GrimReaper]

To be fair, many asian communities gave a fuck about permissions back then - unless they were the ones that saw their mods being uploaded somewhere else. Don't know how many of those communities handle it today, but in the olde Oblivion days it was a shit flinging contest without much substance because everyone just took stuff from everyone. I remember AlienSlof getting pretty pissed about her dick meshes getting used without anyone asking her in xLovers, for example.

 

As far as I remember it, xLovers was a joint effort from some japanese modders, western modders translated and expanded it and later on you'd find link to the xLovers extensions made by LL on japanese, chinese and korean sites. Despite the language barriers and arguably shady ways permissions were sought (I guess so many people were involved in making xLovers that everybody thought the next dude got the permission for what was in the mod already or something like that), it was one of the biggest and most interesting mods for Oblivion, something a single person couldn't have done alone.

[bjornk]

 

 

Bethesda sabotaging existing Skyrim game installs, etc.  I doubt they will pander it as a 'new game' that people will have to buy.  They will simply hi-jack what people already have.

It's certainly not impossible. With a sneaky Steam update, they might replace existing installations with the "remastered" version and a new EULA.

 

 

Actually they're legally obligated to keep the original version.

 

See: Unreal, DooM, Witcher, Mass Effect.

 

They might release it as a "version" of Skyrim for people who already have it and in that case, your Steam client will update your game to the new "remastered" version. From 1.9.32 to version 2.0.0 perhaps.

 

They might also remove the LE from Steam completely and replace it with the remastered version.

[Sural Argonus]

For the most part, I am against "Paid modding"...However, I am ok with backing specific modders such as Patreon.  That way I know that the modders you like are getting the support, and it gives me the feeling that I can show my appreciation to said developer.  Right now I back 4 game creators, if I could afford to back more, I would.  

I don't like the idea of buying mods, but a voluntary support system is ok.  

However this idea of remastered games intrigues me.  Problem is, I am having trouble getting the game running stable as it is...so I wonder how bad it will be with a Remastered Edition.  haha

For the most part, I am against "Paid modding"...However, I am ok with backing specific modders such as Patreon.  That way I know that the modders you like are getting the support, and it gives me the feeling that I can show my appreciation to said developer.  Right now I back 4 game creators, if I could afford to back more, I would.  

I don't like the idea of buying mods, but a voluntary support system is ok.  

However this idea of remastered games intrigues me.  Problem is, I am having trouble getting the game running stable as it is...so I wonder how bad it will be with a Remastered Edition.  haha

[27X]

 

 

 

Bethesda sabotaging existing Skyrim game installs, etc.  I doubt they will pander it as a 'new game' that people will have to buy.  They will simply hi-jack what people already have.

It's certainly not impossible. With a sneaky Steam update, they might replace existing installations with the "remastered" version and a new EULA.

 

 

Actually they're legally obligated to keep the original version.

 

See: Unreal, DooM, Witcher, Mass Effect.

 

They might release it as a "version" of Skyrim for people who already have it and in that case, your Steam client will update your game to the new "remastered" version. From 1.9.32 to version 2.0.0 perhaps.

 

They might also remove the LE from Steam completely and replace it with the remastered version.

 

 

 

Actually they're legally obligated to keep the original version.

 

[GrimReaper]

Paid modding is a can of worms nobody in their right mind want to open, imo. Just a simple armor can have a few dependencies, and if all those + the mod itself cost money, you're in for an expensive shopping trip.

 

If you want to do an armor for Skyrim, you need: The tools of your choice, like blender or 3DS Max. If you want to make money with your work, you'd need the appropiate license, at least for Max, dunno about blender. But blender needs nifscript otherwise it can't import or export nifs. Without those, even the most talented 3D artist can't do shit, because most of them have no clue about programming something that allows them to edit meshes themselves. Then you have to consider which body to use for your armor, unless you decide to use the awful vanilla meshes, which is a bad idea. CBBE and UNP are the two most used base bodies for Skyrim - depending on how tight Caliente and Dimon might sit on their stuff, you have to pay for it and maybe every armor mod has to include a cut for these authors. Then you need a skeleton unless you decide you work with the awful vanilla skeleton. That might cost money, too. Then there's stuff like the HDT frameworks for bouncing bits and high heels. And don't forget the script extender that is needed for pretty much any advanced mod ever. No matter how talented you are or think you are, it's virtually impossible for a single person to do all that without relying on others for help, tools and content to work with.

 

And that's not even speaking about discoveries on how to do certain stuff with the tools available, imagine if everyone tried to hog every bit of information instead of sharing it so they can have the monopoly on, dunno, bouncing boobs or scripts.

 

Then you have complex monsters like sexlab which needs a ton of stuff itself to even work properly, and that is without anything happening because you need modules for that, too.

 

 

 

Modding is different from say, how Daz3D works - because to my knowledge, all they do is concentrating on meshes. You have standardised (afaik) tools you can work with to create content and sell it if you like. But as soon as you add a thousand possible dependencies on every piece of content created things change rapidly.

 

 

tl;dr: paid modding = this kills the mods.

[Guest endgameaddiction]

So the team that makes nifscripts/niftools could start charging to use their patch since it's a essential tool to get nifs to import and export into blender. Seriously, why would I sit there and work on a plugin/patch for free for others to use as a means of benefit to making money? I might as well sell it for a very reasonable price.