Spectator Crowds Ultra Edition (for Skyrim LE, SE, and VR)

[HexBolt8]

50 minutes ago, wpg97541 said:

I'm a bit unsure how to tell the difference between consensual aggressive (BDSM) vs. non-consensual aggressive (actual rape) and handle those separately.

For non consensual the victim flag is set for the SexLab event.  Not sure though if that's easily accessible to you.  Hopefully it is.  But if not, perhaps the PC as participant toggle might still be practical.   It was just a suggestion, but my thought was that the follower toggle was a good idea and there might be a few other useful ways for players to selectively configure things if crowds are forming a little too often. 

[worik]

If I jump in the NPC spectator perspective, all I need is my own gender, my orientation, and my likes and dislikes to decide about any comment I give.

4 hours ago, wpg97541 said:

• SpectatorSexTargetPrefersMenFaction
• SpectatorSexTargetPrefersWomenFaction
• SpectatorSexTargetPrefersBothFaction
• ...

I must confess, I am a bit confused about those many factions and what they are good for.

 

But let's take them and add "neutral" to the possible dispositions. And, further below, I want to add the issue that we DO KNOW the positive attitude of an NPC by the SL stats. But we can't derive from that what the NPC dislikes. These dislikes/neutral dispositions could be open for random usage in this mod.

 

The quoted 3 factions above ☝️ can make sense and you COULD use faction ranks to distinguish between

• dislike (0=default)
• neutral (1)
• like (2)

Lets call them now SpectatorSexTargetLikes_XXX_

It also means that SpectatorSexTargetLikesBothFaction is not needed anymore. That outcome would just be a "2" in both factions, since they are NOT intended to be mutual exclusive.

 

Next: Spice up the sexual preference for the possible sex acts from Sexlab with those faction ranks

• SpectatorSexTargetLikesHeteroActFaction (0-2)
• SpectatorSexTargetLikesFemaleHomoActFaction (0-2)
• SpectatorSexTargetLikesMaleHomoActFaction (0-2)
• SpectatorSexTargetLikesCreatureActFaction (0-2)

That should suffice to adjust the comments for whatever scene a spectator can see.

Part of that can be filled by the SL stats. That's where the "like=2" can be derived and you can throw a randomly generated outcome if the NPC is neutral(1) or opposed(0) to the remaining factions.

 

Example setting: A female lesbian NPC is automatically assigned by her SL stats with

Spoiler

• SpectatorSexTargetLikesFemalesFaction = 2
• SpectatorSexTargetLikesFemaleHomoSexActFaction=2

• All other factions would get their ranks in this example randomly filled with 0 or 1. (exclude "2" because it wouldn't make sense)

 

Example 1: Above female lesbian spectator of a hetero fm scene could make

Spoiler

• a positive comment about the involved woman (because she is positive about woman - ..LikesFemalesFaction=2)
• a neutral comment about the man (because she is neutral about men and doesn't care - ..LikesMalesFaction=1)
• a negative comment about the heterosexual act itself (because she opposes hetero sexual acts - ..LikesHeteroSexActFaction=0)

Example 2: Same spectator could also randomly end up with

Spoiler

• a positive comment about the involved woman (because she is positive about woman - ..LikesFemalesFaction=2)
• a negative comment about the man (because she opposes men - ..LikesMalesFaction=0)
• a neutral comment about the heterosexual act itself (because she doesn't care - ..LikesHeteroSexActFaction=1)

 

Last thought: for a positive/negative outcome and for usae with the morality guards, we could draw in

• daytime (day/night)

 

 

[wpg97541]

Interesting idea of using faction ranks to differentiate between neutral, like and dislike. Right now, someone can either like or dislike something but no different levels like that. I'll think about implementing that in the future.

 

The problem that I have is many of the existing comments addressing not only the sex target but are also sometimes addressing the other participants. If I include only the info on the sex target then there is not enough information as to what the other participants like (in most cases, where there is no threesome, there will only be one other). So I want to not only be able to determine the sexual preference of the sex target but also the other participants so that comments can address them directly and specifically.

 

You have given me an idea though - for my OtherSexActors I can actually use the rank to store the quantity of sex actors (other than the target) that have that orientation, then dialogue can be catered for that.

 

We can already use day/night for comments I am pretty sure, since it would just be a generic dialogue rule.

[wpg97541]

13 hours ago, HexBolt8 said:

For non consensual the victim flag is set for the SexLab event.  Not sure though if that's easily accessible to you.  Hopefully it is.  But if not, perhaps the PC as participant toggle might still be practical.   It was just a suggestion, but my thought was that the follower toggle was a good idea and there might be a few other useful ways for players to selectively configure things if crowds are forming a little too often. 

Yes, I forgot, the morality guards part of the mod uses this. I don't use the morality guards myself, so I've mostly just steered clear of making any modifications of it that could potentially break it. But I should be able to leverage the "victim" part. I will do that right away actually, since in my original mod I had made comments for just generic rough sex "Yeah, plow that bitch!" etc which could be consensual rough sex or could be rape, and the expanded dialogue has added many comments that seem to only apply to rape into that category. I think I may need to add another faction or rank to the existing faction to store this so that I can have those rape-specific comments only be triggered in those particular cases.

 

The other toggle options I will think about, but currently the mod doesn't have a toggle to prevent crowds from forming at all in certain cases - the toggles are just to prevent certain people from being members. The way the current feature works is Lydia could still have a sex act and attract followers, but the filter would stop her from going to watch someone else's sex act, so that if some random bandits start going at it, she won't go running off towards them.

[worik]

2 hours ago, wpg97541 said:

The problem that I have is many of the existing comments addressing not only the sex target but are also sometimes addressing the other participants. If I include only the info on the sex target then there is not enough information as to what the other participants like (in most cases, where there is no threesome, there will only be one other). So I want to not only be able to determine the sexual preference of the sex target but also the other participants so that comments can address them directly and specifically.

Or you do it like a human would do. Like if I am allowed to comment only on ONE fact of a complex situation.

=> You would need a decision hierarchy for this.

It questions: "What is the most relevant fact to be commented on?" And this is answered for each NPC in his/her own value system.

 

You can randomize the winner or we go psychology-101 on this:

Average behaviour is it to comment on offensive things first as long as they are below the -do-not-talkabout-taboooooo level.

Applied to Skyrim, the most disliked fact would be commented and all other facts be ignored for that NPC.

A more complex algorithm would build a stack of these facts for each NPC and spawn comments from top(important) to the (irrelevant) bottom

 

[wpg97541]

8 minutes ago, worik said:

Or you do it like a human would do. Like if I am allowed to comment only on ONE fact of a complex situation.

=> You would need a decision hierarchy for this.

It questions: "What is the most relevant fact to be commented on?" And this is answered for each NPC in his/her own value system.

 

You can randomize the winner or we go psychology-101 on this:

Average behaviour is it to comment on offensive things first as long as they are blow the -do-not-talkabout-taboooooo level.

Applied to Skyrim, the most disliked fact would be commented and all other facts be ignored for that NPC.

A more complex algorithm would build a stack of these facts for each NPC and spawn comments from top(important) to the (irrelevant) bottom

 

I honestly don't see how that would work with the HELO greetings that this mod uses. They are really meant for random chatter with the player when you are walking by someone. So they have filters, and that is it. It is quite limited. I don't believe it is even possible to build a per-NPC stack because that would require that the HELO messages could be customized. The HELO greetings are stored in the esp file and the order is set in Creation Kit, so the per-NPC stack is just not feasible. It ends up being random, and filters are the only way of customizing the responses. I doubt I can even use the "target" reference for the HELO greeting for any useful purpose since the target would probably always be the player.

[worik]

1 hour ago, wpg97541 said:

It ends up being random, and filters are the only way of customizing the responses.

ok, then. Back to square one.

That sounds like we can only comment on one thing in that scene.

That means we need to find the most relevant fact of that scene and let's take that as our filter?

[wpg97541]

They will keep picking random comments from the list, but by having a lot of filters on the comments we can make them very specific. That's the best way. And again, we are relying mostly on the spectator factions for this.

 

I did end up adding most of the proposed factions, but made a single SpectatorSexTargetSexualOrientationFaction where the rank is 0 for prefers men, 1 for prefers women, 2 for bisexual, since this then is set up almost the same way as my SpectatorSexualOrientationFaction

 

I also have a few other factions that are not necessary - I have a SexTargetGenderIsMale faction and a SexTargetGenderIsFemale faction. It makes much more sense to have a single SexTargetGender faction and have those two as ranks. I also have separate SoloFemaleSexAct and SoloMaleSexAct factions, but those should be completely redundant if there is a single participant since the SexTargetGender will indicate that, so I really only need a single solo category. This way even though I'm adding 7 new factions I will be merging a few existing ones.

[wpg97541]

14 hours ago, worik said:

That means we need to find the most relevant fact of that scene and let's take that as our filter?

I am now removing some of the more "generic" dialogue and replacing it with tailored dialogue based on the spectator's gender and sexual orientation and the target's gender and sexual orientation. This is probably the best way for it to feel like it is customized to the situation. I'm also considering adding a SexTargetRace faction where the rank can be the race name, to allow comments like "I'd love that dark elf cock of yours inside my wet pussy" etc.

[wpg97541]

New alpha version is released on the main download page. No previous patches made by other people in this thread are necessary. I've only done limited testing. If upgrading from an old version please make sure you remove any .pex files you added, they are no longer necessary and will break this new version due to major changes. Extended dialogue add on is no longer necessary since extended dialogue is integrated.

 

Please report any issues. There is so much dialogue in this version I fear I may have set some of the filters incorrectly (it took forever and was mind-numbing, since I basically had to manually copy every line of the expanded dialogue over line by line), so if you see dialogue that seems to be misplaced in regards to the gender and sex act, please report it.

[Lilzt3hcat]

Not sure if it can be done but could there be a option for 'stealth voyeurs'? That is npcs watch but try not to be caught watching - sneaking - keeping their distance. (Dialogue in this case would be replaced with things like "you feel like you're being watched".) Obviously if you're blatant about it (middle of a town) normal spectator behavior would take place instead.

[wpg97541]

That kinda thing really sounds like a different mod to me. You can prevent spectators from appearing indoors and in non-LOS situations by playing with the distance settings, and that way you could use a stealth voyeur mod alongside this, but a "stealth voyeur" mod is really not what this is intended to be. A stealth voyeur would probably not be giving comments on the sex act, and that's the main thing this mod is for.

[neva100]

a have a probleme it's doesn't work for me , may be because i can't make work propley sexlab aroused redux (no suported , i don'tkw why.....),can you pls make a patch for SexLab Aroused eXtended ?

[wpg97541]

1 hour ago, neva100 said:

a have a probleme it's doesn't work for me , may be because i can't make work propley sexlab aroused redux (no suported , i don'tkw why.....),can you pls make a patch for SexLab Aroused eXtended ?

It should work fine with Sexlab Aroused eXtended as well because the API hasn't changed, and my script doesn't do anything weird. Please try doing a sex act that should call spectators and provide your papyrus log for that session, and I will have a look. Also make sure you are using the new 0.95 alpha and not the 0.91 beta from 2014. And as I said in the previous post, make sure you delete the manual patches (.pex files) for the older version of this mod, or it won't work.

[Wayward1]

1 hour ago, neva100 said:

a have a probleme it's doesn't work for me , may be because i can't make work propley sexlab aroused redux (no suported , i don'tkw why.....),can you pls make a patch for SexLab Aroused eXtended ?

I'm having the same issue. I tried the old and new versions, but no luck so far.

[wpg97541]

26 minutes ago, Wayward1 said:

I'm having the same issue. I tried the old and new versions, but no luck so far.

I need to see a papyrus script log to figure out what is going on as it works on my system with the current version of SexLab and Aroused. Please upload.

[neva100]

where i can find it ? in the data or in doc/ mygame/skyrim ?

 

[neva100]

this one ?

 

Papyrus]

fPostLoadUpdateTimeMS=500.0

bEnableLogging=0

bEnableTrace=0

bLoadDebugInformation=0

[Water]

bReflectLODObjects=1

bReflectLODLand=1

bReflectSky=1

bReflectLODTrees=1

[wpg97541]

Documents\My Games\Skyrim\Logs\Script, you'll see Papyrus.#.log, Papyrus.0.log should be from the most recent playthrough.

[wpg97541]

You may have to enable logging first if not already enabled, follow instructions here: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/articles/368

[Wayward1]

2 hours ago, wpg97541 said:

I need to see a papyrus script log to figure out what is going on as it works on my system with the current version of SexLab and Aroused. Please upload.

Here is a log from a scene that should have triggered spectators, but didn't. 

Papyrus.0.log

[neva100]

this is that ?

 

[10/12/2019 - 05:40:16] Papyrus log opened (PC)
[10/12/2019 - 05:40:16] Function GetEffectMagnitudes in the empty state on type Ingredient does not exist. Function will not be flagged as callable from tasklets.
[10/12/2019 - 05:40:16] Update budget: 1.200000ms (Extra tasklet budget: 1.200000ms, Load screen budget: 500.000000ms)
[10/12/2019 - 05:40:16] Memory page: 128 (min) 512 (max) 76800 (max total)
[10/12/2019 - 05:40:28] Cannot open store for class "zbfbondageshell", missing file?
[10/12/2019 - 05:40:28] Cannot open store for class "daymoyl_QuestTemplate", missing file?
[10/12/2019 - 05:40:28] Error: Unable to link "daymoyl_QuestTemplate" - the parent of "Defeatdadefeated".
[10/12/2019 - 05:40:28] ERROR: Unable to bind script Defeatdadefeated to DefeatPADefeated (0D0C16D8) because their base types do not match
[10/12/2019 - 05:40:28] Cannot open store for class "daymoyl_PlayerValidateQuestAlias", missing file?
[10/12/2019 - 05:40:28] ERROR: Unable to bind script defeatdatrigger to DefeatPlayerQST (0D000D62) because their base types do not match
[10/12/2019 - 05:40:28] ERROR: Unable to bind script DefeatDALeftForDead to DefeatPALeftForDead (0D0C1173) because their base types do not match
[10/12/2019 - 05:40:28] Cannot open store for class "QF_daf_testquest_02001830", missing file?
[10/12/2019 - 05:40:28] ERROR: Unable to bind script QF_daf_testquest_02001830 to daf_testquest (24001830) because their base types do not match
[10/12/2019 - 05:40:42] ERROR: Unable to bind script daymoyl_PlayerValidateQuestAlias to alias PlayerRef on quest DefeatPlayerQST (0D000D62) because their base types do not match
[10/12/2019 - 05:40:42] warning: Property SLAPPDooLockPerk on script SLApproachPlayerAliasScript attached to alias PlayerRef on quest SLApproach_Main (20000D62) cannot be initialized because the script no longer contains that property
[10/12/2019 - 05:40:42] ERROR: Property SLA_ArmorHalfNaked on script slhh_Monitor attached to SLHHMonitorScript (1F0089B9) cannot be bound because <NULL form> (0708E855) is not the right type
[10/12/2019 - 05:40:42] ERROR: Property SLA_Brabikini on script slhh_Monitor attached to SLHHMonitorScript (1F0089B9) cannot be bound because <NULL form> (0708E856) is not the right type
[10/12/2019 - 05:40:42] ERROR: Property SLA_ThongLowleg on script slhh_Monitor attached to SLHHMonitorScript (1F0089B9) cannot be bound because <NULL form> (0708EDC2) is not the right type
[10/12/2019 - 05:40:42] ERROR: Property SLA_ArmorSpendex on script slhh_Monitor attached to SLHHMonitorScript (1F0089B9) cannot be bound because <NULL form> (0708E858) is not the right type
[10/12/2019 - 05:40:42] ERROR: Property SLA_ThongCString on script slhh_Monitor attached to SLHHMonitorScript (1F0089B9) cannot be bound because <NULL form> (0708EDC3) is not the right type
[10/12/2019 - 05:40:42] ERROR: Property SLA_ArmorHalfNakedBikini on script slhh_Monitor attached to SLHHMonitorScript (1F0089B9) cannot be bound because <NULL form> (0708E854) is not the right type
[10/12/2019 - 05:40:42] ERROR: Property SLA_ArmorPretty on script slhh_Monitor attached to SLHHMonitorScript (1F0089B9) cannot be bound because <NULL form> (0708E853) is not the right type
[10/12/2019 - 05:40:42] ERROR: Property SLA_ThongT on script slhh_Monitor attached to SLHHMonitorScript (1F0089B

[wpg97541]

Sorry about that. Thanks for the Papyrus logs. Found the problem. The "create archive" function in Creation Kit somehow missed one of the script files needed for the mod to work when it made the .bsa file, so I created the .bsa manually instead. Please give the new version a try, it should work now.

[Wayward1]

47 minutes ago, wpg97541 said:

Sorry about that. Thanks for the Papyrus logs. Found the problem. The "create archive" function in Creation Kit somehow missed one of the script files needed for the mod to work when it made the .bsa file, so I created the .bsa manually instead. Please give the new version a try, it should work now.

Gave it a try, but still no luck. I am seeing this error in the log if it helps:

 

[01/29/2020 - 03:48:00PM] Error: Cannot call SexStartDetected() on a None object, aborting function call
stack:
    [mf_SpectatorCrowdsMain (86000D63)].mf_SpectatorCrowdsMainScript.StartCallNPC() - "mf_SpectatorCrowdsMainScript.psc" Line 35

[wpg97541]

4 minutes ago, Wayward1 said:

Gave it a try, but still no luck. I am seeing this error in the log if it helps:

 

[01/29/2020 - 03:48:00PM] Error: Cannot call SexStartDetected() on a None object, aborting function call
stack:
    [mf_SpectatorCrowdsMain (86000D63)].mf_SpectatorCrowdsMainScript.StartCallNPC() - "mf_SpectatorCrowdsMainScript.psc" Line 35

That's probably not enough info - can you give a full papyrus log again please? The problem before was this error was appearing:

[01/29/2020 - 01:38:37PM] Cannot open store for class "mf_SpectatorCrowdsThreadBase", missing file?