MUST READ if you play LGBT sims with WW.

[Clay86]

Many a time Ive seen asked here what governs top/bottom dynamics without ever an explanation but I've seemed to have figured it out. Well at least within households having more than one sim. In those households the top will always be to the furthest left in the CAS window. Meaning in CAS if you want a sim to be a "top" make sure their face icon is first in character creation simple. This is important because It means you don't have to misgender sims to setup roles. You can set both sims to male or in a lesbian relationship both female and know who will be the top and bottom when sex autonomously starts. I'm not sure why Turbo never highlighted this because even although the system isn't perfect it alleviates some frustration over all the randomness. Further testing has to be done on the extent outside of the household in maintaining dynamics but I'm quite sure being left most will uphold role status outside of the household. The whole thing has made my game much more interesting.

[Clay86]

Forgot to add too that the dynamics extend with bigger households in sequential order. So for e.g if a household has 4 sims. Leftmost will always be the top for everyone down the line. While second in the face icon order will only be topped by left most but will top everyone else . Third in line will be topped by the first two and not the fourth in icon order. Fourth bottoms for everyone lol. May sounds a bit confusing but it's not really. This is only as pertains to what happens role wise when sex initiates. You can still swap positions as sex is going, but its a big deal for immersion and not having to swap on the onset every time or misgender.

[Clay86]

Last thing but it's important. The icon order I'm referring is for the manage household's CAS window. Disregard ordering in hover previews over the household. You may have to save sims in library then delete and place them again to get w.e order you want too.

[rock0101]

Thanks for this lol

[SlickWillyLongstroke]

Great info. Know if this works in bi group sex, too?

[Clay86]

15 hours ago, SlickWillyLongstroke said:

Great info. Know if this works in bi group sex, too?

It should improve bi sex in general since with this ordering method no genders have to be changed. So say in the case of a bi girl that likes to strap other girls but wants penetration from guys. Since her gender doesn't need to be changed to "male" at any point she will never likely end up fucking a guy. Same thing for a bi guy that wants to bottom/top for guys but likes to fuck girls. Just make sure your ordering is correct and have fun.

[Clay86]

18 hours ago, rock0101 said:

Thanks for this lol

Yw. I know how frustrating it can be the randomness so when I found this out I had to share.

[SlickWillyLongstroke]

6 hours ago, Clay86 said:

It should improve bi sex in general since with this ordering method no genders have to be changed. So say in the case of a bi girl that likes to strap other girls but wants penetration from guys. Since her gender doesn't need to be changed to "male" at any point she will never likely end up fucking a guy. Same thing for a bi guy that wants to bottom/top for guys but likes to fuck girls. Just make sure your ordering is correct and have fun.

Thanks Clay.

[GarbageNameHere]

This is literally PHENOMENAL. Thank you SO very much!

[Clay86]

2 hours ago, GarbageNameHere said:

This is literally PHENOMENAL. Thank you SO very much!

No problem. I just hope more gaymers and the like who play with WW know about it since its pretty much a game changer for immersion imo

[fooob]

Are you referring to the bar at the bottom of the screen when ingame? How do I move the sim faces into different places? I want the sim that I use the most often to be the first on the left.

 

Is that what you meant? And if so, how do I do that?

[Clay86]

On 10/26/2020 at 7:16 PM, fooob said:

Are you referring to the bar at the bottom of the screen when ingame? How do I move the sim faces into different places? I want the sim that I use the most often to be the first on the left.

 

Is that what you meant? And if so, how do I do that?

No you have to go to edit household in household manager and in the CAS window that pops up that's where you can rearrange. When the window pops up if the sim you want left is not there currently firstly save the household to library. Then delete the other sims except the one you want to be furthest left. His/Her icon will now be the furthest left. Then all you have to do is load the other sims you saved from your library again. That's basically how I rearranged households.

 

Edit: Read the most recent post did more testing. The window to setup ordering that sticks is through manage household.

[Clay86]

Testing more it seems in order to make sure your ordering sticks the "manage household" when you expand the three dots in the bottom right hand of the screen after clicking on an actual home is key. I got order resets trying to edit homeless households. So basically if you want to reorder these types of sims make sure you at least put them in a temp home first.

[BenjiThatFoxGuy]

On 10/22/2020 at 10:20 AM, Clay86 said:

Many a time Ive seen asked here what governs top/bottom dynamics without ever an explanation but I've seemed to have figured it out. Well at least within households having more than one sim. In those households the top will always be to the furthest left in the CAS window. Meaning in CAS if you want a sim to be a "top" make sure their face icon is first in character creation simple. This is important because It means you don't have to misgender sims to setup roles. You can set both sims to male or in a lesbian relationship both female and know who will be the top and bottom when sex autonomously starts. I'm not sure why Turbo never highlighted this because even although the system isn't perfect it alleviates some frustration over all the randomness. Further testing has to be done on the extent outside of the household in maintaining dynamics but I'm quite sure being left most will uphold role status outside of the household. The whole thing has made my game much more interesting.

thank you so much for this! this is way better than my own workaround to set bottoms manually in WW as females. too bad there's no official way to reorder them other than the save->load thing. still, thanks again!

[jidajidari]

Greatly appreciate this! It'd be nice if in a future version of Wicked Whims you could set sims as top, bottom or vers without having to do something like this, which most people wouldn't even know to do - I certainly didn't, and was frustrated having to repeatedly go through the "Swap positions with..." dialogue.

[GaymerX]

Hello Clay, thank you sooo much for this information. I love Wicked Whims and its the only motivation still playing Sims 4. I created over the years a complete gay Simsworld. All my Households are gay men with gay children. It is a pity that we still can not define in WW if a gay guy is only Top or only Bottom. Why? You have soo many options in WW but not to define a gay bottom? Maybe there are not enough Gaymers using WW or gay Patreons?  Thank you so much Clay for finding out how to trick WW. Sorry for my bad english.

[Clay86]

8 hours ago, deejayz said:

Hello Clay, thank you sooo much for this information. I love Wicked Whims and its the only motivation still playing Sims 4. I created over the years a complete gay Simsworld. All my Households are gay men with gay children. It is a pity that we still can not define in WW if a gay guy is only Top or only Bottom. Why? You have soo many options in WW but not to define a gay bottom? Maybe there are not enough Gaymers using WW or gay Patreons?  Thank you so much Clay for finding out how to trick WW. Sorry for my bad english.

No worries when I found it out it changed my game so I had to share the info. Maybe a top/bttm/vers option may be available someday. In the patreon version of WW penis size manipulation was introduced so maybe features are becoming less one-sided as WW progresses.

[Oops19]

Not sure how this should work reliable. The actors are coded in XML and one may assume that the bottom actor is added often first and will be added last. I think WW has no idea about top/bottom and just uses the order within the XML file. Hopefully one animation creator can confirm this.

 

It seems to make no difference for me. Classic missionary and cowgirl positions both have one 'top' and 'bottom' actor. But one may want to have a 'giving' and a 'receiving' sim no matter of the top/bottom position. I asked Turbo for an option to define sim preferences, some sims may want to stick their finger in the own butt or of other sims while other sims may hate to have a finger in it. With face/mouth/tongue, body, arm, hand/fist/finger, genitals, ass, tights, legs and feet (as sources and targets) there are about 9x9 (x2 for self and other) options for a sim what to like and what to hate. Teens could be limited to hold hand-hand interactions, later to kiss (mouth-mouth) until they become adults.

[Clay86]

6 hours ago, Oops19 said:

Not sure how this should work reliable. The actors are coded in XML and one may assume that the bottom actor is added often first and will be added last. I think WW has no idea about top/bottom and just uses the order within the XML file. Hopefully one animation creator can confirm this.

 

It seems to make no difference for me. Classic missionary and cowgirl positions both have one 'top' and 'bottom' actor. But one may want to have a 'giving' and a 'receiving' sim no matter of the top/bottom position. I asked Turbo for an option to define sim preferences, some sims may want to stick their finger in the own butt or of other sims while other sims may hate to have a finger in it. With face/mouth/tongue, body, arm, hand/fist/finger, genitals, ass, tights, legs and feet (as sources and targets) there are about 9x9 (x2 for self and other) options for a sim what to like and what to hate. Teens could be limited to hold hand-hand interactions, later to kiss (mouth-mouth) until they become adults.

Not sure how its able to work either, but I can guarantee within a household this system works for defining role dynamics in gay/lesbian/bi relationships without having to tag a male female or vice versa. Reading your second paragraph I think we're talking about vastly different things though.

[GaymerX]

What Clay86 found out works 100 percent - but only inside one household and not family. I have Sim 1 in Household 1 first in CAS Order, which is a TOP and a Sim 2 in Household 2 last in CAS Order, which is a Bottom. When both get together, Sims 2 is the TOP or rather both are versatile again. Likewise it does not work in one household with family relationship. When the Teenage son is First in CAS Order and his Father is last in CAS Order, the son is yet still a Bottom. If you have other results, maybe some WW settings have influence as well. Sorry for my bad english.

[Clay86]

Yes you're right on the dynamics 100% working in a household. Ive been trying to figure out how to extend roles outside of a single household. I can say for certain sometimes it extends and others times it doesn't. I have a sim for instance who is always the top every single time regardless of who he has sex with. This is in his household with the ordering system and outside of it. I'm not sure why that is the case, but if I figure it out I will post here. When I next play I will test to see if life stage (Teen/YA/Adult) plays a role in anything outside of the household as well.

[ferofero]

Holy shit, this is game changing.

Thanks dude

[IfYouOnlyKnewMe]

If animation authors would add tags to their animations, we wouldn't need to figure out random things like this. Devious Desires provides many tags to alleviate this, but mod authors refuse to add them simply because I am the one asking them to add tags. If more people asked or even demanded animation authors to properly tag their animations, the world would be a much better place.

 

Who cares who is asking you to add them, it is for the good of everyone! Their petty bias is hurting everyone.

 

 

Note: Devious Desires doesn't just contain rape, zoophilia, and lactation, it contains normal sex too!

[SlickWillyLongstroke]

On 10/22/2020 at 2:18 AM, Clay86 said:

Last thing but it's important. The icon order I'm referring is for the manage household's CAS window. Disregard ordering in hover previews over the household. You may have to save sims in library then delete and place them again to get w.e order you want too.

Has anyone found a work-around for this where you don't have to Save Sim In Library > Delete Sim > Re-Add Sim From Library? I've tried moving them to different households or spare lots, then moving them back. Still a no-go. The Sim first created is still displayed left-most in CAS. Many of my households have a lot of playtime and built-up relationships with friends and love-interests, and though the saved/re-added sim would still have their skills and traits, all of that relationship info gets wiped and has to be re-added if they're deleted.

[Clay86]

On 11/27/2020 at 6:33 AM, SlickWillyLongstroke said:

Has anyone found a work-around for this where you don't have to Save Sim In Library > Delete Sim > Re-Add Sim From Library? I've tried moving them to different households or spare lots, then moving them back. Still a no-go. The Sim first created is still displayed left-most in CAS. Many of my households have a lot of playtime and built-up relationships with friends and love-interests, and though the saved/re-added sim would still have their skills and traits, all of that relationship info gets wiped and has to be re-added if they're deleted.

Yes this is unfortunate but so far its the only way to reorder. I'll be interested as well if someone can figure out another way so as to preserve relationships.

 

On 11/27/2020 at 2:21 AM, ColonolNutty said:

If animation authors would add tags to their animations, we wouldn't need to figure out random things like this. Devious Desires provides many tags to alleviate this, but mod authors refuse to add them simply because I am the one asking them to add tags. If more people asked or even demanded animation authors to properly tag their animations, the world would be a much better place.

 

Who cares who is asking you to add them, it is for the good of everyone! Their petty bias is hurting everyone.

 

 

Note: Devious Desires doesn't just contain rape, zoophilia, and lactation, it contains normal sex too!

Does the WW framework offer lgbt tags for roles? I'm only aware from looking within the xmls of the male, female and both tags.