Guest Posted February 21, 2018 Posted February 21, 2018 I watched it a few days ago. The pacing was alright in my opinion though some say it was really slow at first. The movie was ok I guess, biggest plot holes I have ever seen in a marvel movie in recent memory but still what bothers me about it is how racially charged it is... anyone else feel the same/different? I kind of understand all odd tweets about it now.
TheNoble Posted February 21, 2018 Posted February 21, 2018 I genuinely enjoyed the movie and all of the themes, including the racial moments. I probably also just have a lot of patience for movies and their build ups. I didn't notice very many plot holes.
Hania the bard Posted February 21, 2018 Posted February 21, 2018 I don't know all the details but I think meta critic was deleting all the negative reviews of the movie. So I'm not going to watch it.
Deviljho-san Posted February 21, 2018 Posted February 21, 2018 For me the accent they gave him felt a little over dramatic and the they tried to be funny but failed really bad with the lame puns. But the ending was somewhat good felt like they added too much visual effect.
Alan47 Posted February 21, 2018 Posted February 21, 2018 I watched the movie one day after release. It was the german version, but given that Marvel's synchronizations are overall pretty decent, I guess that the english version has a similar quality. To me, the movie felt empty, barren of ideas and creativity. It takes a more serious approach to the Marvel Cinematic Universe, and, frankly speaking, it simply didn't work out. In large parts, it felt more like a study of the culture of a fictitious tribe and its country. There was not nearly enough going on, both in the story and in terms of action on screen. The humor was notably absent in most parts, and even the technical gadgets were kind of "meh", given that Wakanda is being presented as a super-high-tech futuristic country. The acting was mediocre at best, the main character was bland and didn't stand out at all. If anyone, it was the villains and female sidekicks who were interesting to watch. The music was rather annoying, listening to two and a half hours of almost non-stop drumming is not exactly my cup of tea. Yeah, we get it, he's coming from africa. Nice, good for you. Except that I don't care. No need to constantly remind me of that. One thing that really bugged me was how they treated the Black Panther "super powers" (what are those again exactly anyways, aside from the suit?). They gave them to the hero, then took them away again, then gave them to him again and so on... dude, it's supposed to be a super power, you can't just turn it on and off like a damn light switch. It's ridiculous. After the epic firework that was Thor 3, Black Panther in comparison is a bushfire at best. Not necessarily a bad movie overall, but an utterly uninspired movie by Marvel standards. Even Spider Man Homecoming was a lot better than this.
Guest Katherlne Posted February 21, 2018 Posted February 21, 2018 Maybe someone after 100-200 years, gonna make a topic about new film White Panther.
Guest Posted February 21, 2018 Posted February 21, 2018 i think it was good but could have been better its a superhero movie not a race movement, its not that deep.
TheNoble Posted February 21, 2018 Posted February 21, 2018 1 hour ago, Alan47 said: I watched the movie one day after release. It was the german version, but given that Marvel's synchronizations are overall pretty decent, I guess that the english version has a similar quality. To me, the movie felt empty, barren of ideas and creativity. It takes a more serious approach to the Marvel Cinematic Universe, and, frankly speaking, it simply didn't work out. In large parts, it felt more like a study of the culture of a fictitious tribe and its country. There was not nearly enough going on, both in the story and in terms of action on screen. The humor was notably absent in most parts, and even the technical gadgets were kind of "meh", given that Wakanda is being presented as a super-high-tech futuristic country. The acting was mediocre at best, the main character was bland and didn't stand out at all. If anyone, it was the villains and female sidekicks who were interesting to watch. The music was rather annoying, listening to two and a half hours of almost non-stop drumming is not exactly my cup of tea. Yeah, we get it, he's coming from africa. Nice, good for you. Except that I don't care. No need to constantly remind me of that. One thing that really bugged me was how they treated the Black Panther "super powers" (what are those again exactly anyways, aside from the suit?). They gave them to the hero, then took them away again, then gave them to him again and so on... dude, it's supposed to be a super power, you can't just turn it on and off like a damn light switch. It's ridiculous. After the epic firework that was Thor 3, Black Panther in comparison is a bushfire at best. Not necessarily a bad movie overall, but an utterly uninspired movie by Marvel standards. Even Spider Man Homecoming was a lot better than this. I'm not really buying some of your criticism here. You can accept suspending your disbelief that powers can be granted by eating a plant from a living God - one of many in the universe- but can't accept that the powers can be suspended by another plant? Remember, these folks had their powers given to their culture by a deity. I assume that you also don't like the Hulk because violates the law of conservation of mass by spontaneously growing 800 pounds of muscle whenever he gets mad. I think we saw a lot of interesting technology, a large city-state hidden from all forms electronic surveillance, including satellites, for hundreds of years. An elaborate ruse involving the whole people of the country to deceive the rest of the world. I don't know what you mean by there wasn't enough action on screen. There was plenty of drama, and some interesting meanings behind what was going on. How much is Wakanda going to sacrifice in order to preserve its isolation? How does T'challa want to accept the traditions of his ancestors and reject diplomacy with the people he's grown to hate because of history? In the end, the biggest monster that he's had to face comes from the sacrifices his ancestors made. The problem is, the main villain doesn't even commit many crimes against Wakanda, he's just doing what he sees as right. You might not like the movie, but calling it uninspired isn't really deserving. 17 minutes ago, daedal said: i think it was good but could have been better its a superhero movie not a race movement, its not that deep. There are a lot of things about race in the movie industry that the movie does seek to make a critique out of. Tokenism, the customs of high society being normalized to be European. Just because a movie has to be about super heroes doesn't mean that it can't criticize society. Look at the Bacchai and the Greek tragedies. Supernatural beings literally descending from heaven to cause havoc. Look at some of the older superman comic books and their relationship and their comments about nationalism. People generally dismiss a lot of the interesting things about the movie because it has super heroes. I mean what if a technological superpower was exporting weapons to start insurgencies in Europe, and the United States?
Myst42 Posted February 21, 2018 Posted February 21, 2018 Is it? I was planning on seeing it maybe, but later. It kinda triggers me a bit how everything in murica is a political crusade I mean, there was already a comic book movie about a black hero, it was called Blade and it was awesome But all I hear on the web is about how much of a masterpiece or #woke it is Newsflash: nobody cares about murica's racial wars in other parts of the planet. And here's more shocking news: diversity is not about black people. It's about actual diversity, which includes whites, asians, latins, indians, nords, argonians and khajiits too. Believe it or not, there are countries on this same planet, where hating black people is not a thing like they say it is in the USA. So this pandering is getting obnoxious. tldr: a movie that is not about fun, but about some murican political agenda instead doesn't really seem appealing.
Guest Posted February 21, 2018 Posted February 21, 2018 10 minutes ago, Myst42 said: Is it? I was planning on seeing it maybe, but later. It kinda triggers me a bit how everything in murica is a political crusade I mean, there was already a comic book movie about a black hero, it was called Blade and it was awesome But all I hear on the web is about how much of a masterpiece or #woke it is Newsflash: nobody cares about murica's racial wars in other parts of the planet. And here's more shocking news: diversity is not about black people. It's about actual diversity, which includes whites, asians, latins, indians, nords, argonians and khajiits too. Believe it or not, there are countries on this same planet, where hating black people is not a thing like they say it is in the USA. So this pandering is getting obnoxious. tldr: a movie that is not about fun, but about some murican political agenda instead doesn't really seem appealing. My only problem regarding the race bating was two fold. 1) How could Wakanda (sp?) realistically keep their technology hidden without one of their citizens spilling the beans? What about war? If they used their super tech then every neighbor would know. What about immigration...? Are they like North Korea? and so on... 2) the villain says he wants to free the black folks from the tyrants in America and Europe. Lol what? Dude you are a hundred years late and I think most African nations are way... WAY worse than what you would see in a California Ghetto. It was just so odd how Wakanda had to establish help centers in fucking USA rather than... lol I don't know... Sudan? Ethiopia? Nigeria? It was just so silly... Far better just to say "they enslaved our people before so now we enslave them now." That's way more believable than ignoring all the fucked up things happening in Africa right now and focusing on uneven wealth and education of white folks and other minorities of USA.
Darkening Demise Posted February 21, 2018 Posted February 21, 2018 Outside the political BS all over the internet. I don't know nothing about it. How about another Blade? Hopefully without Snipes dressing as a woman.
TheNoble Posted February 21, 2018 Posted February 21, 2018 4 minutes ago, Grine said: My only problem regarding the race bating was two fold. 1) How could Wakanda (sp?) realistically keep their technology hidden without one of their citizens spilling the beans? What about war? If they used their super tech then every neighbor would know. What about immigration...? Are they like North Korea? and so on... 2) the villain says he wants to free the black folks from the tyrants in America and Europe. Lol what? Dude you are a hundred years late and I think most African nations are way... WAY worse than what you would see in a California Ghetto. It was just so odd how Wakanda had to establish help centers in fucking USA rather than... lol I don't know... Sudan? Ethiopia? Nigeria? It was just so silly... Far better just to say "they enslaved our people before so now we enslave them now." That's way more believable than ignoring all the fucked up things happening in Africa right now and focusing on uneven wealth and education of white folks and other minorities of USA. What they probably did was have a rotation of families who would grow up within the city, become indoctrinated to secrecy, and then rotate out to live in the wilderness for a certain period of time to maintain the lie. Probably some form of mandatory conscription through a lottery. After a while, it would be seen as a national duty. You would be very unlikely to die, or have anything happen to you. Very few people escape the North Korean DMZ, we can imagine something like this existing here, except people have no reason to want to leave. Killmonger wants to start a world-wide revolution that includes people in the, US, Europe and Africa. Its reasonable to assume that he's talking about global economic influences - IMF, foreign interventions - more than he's talking about direct tyranny in Europe and the US. What he probably wants to do is use military force to redirect economic powers to bring African exports, services, and labor back home, and begin first pan-African union under Wakandan leadership, then subvert global powers by causing civil unrest, assassinating leaders, etc. It probably wouldn't end up working out in the long run, but it would cause a tremendous amount of human suffering given the things that Wakanda can manufacture. Why are you assuming that Wakanda only establishes help centers in the USA and has no outreach program for neighboring nations? The help center there was built because of its connection to the plot, rather than its significance. The after credits scene with T'challa at the UN seems to suggest something completely different. Would you really have preferred a 2 minute montage of Wakandan drones building things around Africa? I think that's not necessary.
27X Posted February 21, 2018 Posted February 21, 2018 I knew as soon as this was out there would a grine or zombiepoonani thread about it and here we are. The advertising and the movie itself are two different things. The advertising and "progressive" political heraldry declaring this the greatest movie of all time over 100% are hyperbole right up and with the black and white TIME cover with attending "greatest of all ever movies" article to go with it and should be treated as such. The movie itself does in fact tackle political issues, but the comic iterations, all of them, always have as well, because that's the entire point of the character, and it does so for the most part cleanly and without contrivance. It has the standard marvel issue of kill the villains as quickly as possible and the "mid movie chase fight where the hero "fails"" and "Let's team up and do each characters' quirky things in the finale fight that we telegraphed three times earlier" in the movie but those exist in every marvel movie except Winter Soldier so getting riled up about it is getting riled about vanilla ice cream still tasting like vanilla since the last time you ate it. It is the best ->intro<- movie yet, but it isn't the best marvel movie by a long shot, and the political twang lathered all over everything marketing put out about the movie won't change that. It's still a good movie, with an absolutely amazing 100% perfect cast. It is not more or less than a good movie, and it is neither Norbert nor is it Lawrence of Arabia. Quote racebaiting There is no race baiting, colonialism happened, maybe you should research you some books. If you want to legit critique the movie on biased projection, the obvious target is the fact that China is basically doing to afrcan countries right now what the dutch, french spanish and english did in the past, and the movie goes completely out of its way to ignore China existing at all despite its pointed global plot, and the fact that marvel #2 market in the world after the us is ... China. Also T'Challa says straight up the outreach centers are global and he and his sister are setting them up everywhere. As for how the Wakandans kept Wakanda isolated, there's literally forty years of comics about that, so your plot hole doesn't actually even exist. Whether you like the exegesis or not is another matter entirely.
Guest Posted February 21, 2018 Posted February 21, 2018 55 minutes ago, 27X said: There is no race baiting, colonialism happened, maybe you should research you some books. Yeah? It happened all over the world. Whats your point? Are you specifically referencing racism? Almost all the slaves brought to the Europeans were from other African nations who sold the captives of their own wars to the Europeans in exchange for weapons and technological trinkets who helped them to conquer more tribes and bring in more slaves. The idea that the British or french were marching tens of thousands of troops in Africa capturing village to village for the slave trade is pure fiction. The settlement of Africa happened much later. Quote If you want to legit critique the movie on biased projection, the obvious target is the fact that China is basically doing to afrcan countries right now what the dutch, french spanish and english did in the past, and the movie goes completely out of it's way to ignore China existing at all despite it's pointed global plot, and the fact that marvel #2 market in the world after the us is ... China. Yeah China is much more active in Africa than America or Europe. They are using the insane corruption there to get what they can from there. I would not be surprised if USA and France would soon be exporting more freedom to the Sub-Saharan African countries. Quote Also T'Challa says straight up the outreach centers are global and he and his sister are setting them up everywhere. As for how the Wakandans kept Wakanda isolated, there's literally forty years of comics about that, so your plot hole doesn't actually even exist. Whether you like the exegesis or not is another matter entirely. Really all I saw were visits in a California Ghetto. Killmonger grew up in the US and despite being so mistreated (as he claims) he was still able to reach the highest level of his profession. And in the movie all he talked about were USA and Europe and the hardships of African Americans almost specifically. Not a single word as I recall talked about gee I don't know the Rwandan or Sudan genocides. As far as the movie seemed concerned the outside world meant USA.
TheNoble Posted February 21, 2018 Posted February 21, 2018 The first fight scene in the movie directly related to girls in Nigeria being kidnapped. The queen was infiltrating them when T'challa showed up to bring her home for his ceremony. Her whole conflict is that she would rather live her life outside of Wakana to personally help those people rather than return home to live with the royalty. The struggle of the African continent is a pretty big part of the movie.
27X Posted February 21, 2018 Posted February 21, 2018 As a mutt flavored person I'm perfectly aware of how slaves were procured in africa and where and *when* slaves existed in the americas, so your point again is completely self derived, this is an american movie from an american company that has spenty fifty years rewriting cultural norms slathered in glistening pander and 2 dimensional portrayals and almost 100 years rewriting history period, from Snow White to Mary Poppins, again your point about THIS particular piece being what extra rewritey, extra pandery as opposed to the last 70 years of Disney content? Disney released Black Panther, Disney also released Song of the South, so again? You're also either purposefully skipping or missed the part where T'Challa says to T'Chaka "abandoning our neighbors and brothers and sisters is wrong, you were wrong" You're also skipping the part where the movie spends twenty minutes breaking up a Nigerian to Rwandan human traffic ring. It's the part after the marvel logo if you need to rewatch it.
Guest Posted February 22, 2018 Posted February 22, 2018 46 minutes ago, 27X said: As a mutt flavored person I'm perfectly aware of how slaves were procured in africa and where and *when* slaves existed in the americas, so your point again is completely self derived, this is an american movie from an american company that has spenty fifty years rewriting cultural norms slathered in glistening pander and 2 dimensional portrayals and almost 100 years rewriting history period, from Snow White to Mary Poppins, again your point about THIS particular piece being what extra rewritey, extra pandery as opposed to the last 70 years of Disney content? I am well aware of how much the American movie business likes to rewrite history and whitewash roles where they can hence I did not watch Ghost in the Shell. Even now that its on Netflix. My only issue with it is again as I described how unlikely it is that this country could stay hidden and two its selective outrage (especially the main villains). Quote Disney released Black Panther, Disney also released Song of the South, so again? never saw Song of the South. Quote You're also either purposefully skipping or missed the part where T'Challa says to T'Chaka "abandoning our neighbors and brothers and sisters is wrong, you were wrong" You mean that single sentence is suppose to make up for Killmonger's dad arming himself after visiting California and the 20 minute exposition by Killmonger? I did not even understand his plan... he said he will send weapons to all the black folks so they rise up... what does that even mean? it makes no sense. I kind of found it racist too, like a black university student and a ghetto thug are both going to grab those weapons and start a revolution against their elected officials? Like some kind of a hive mind? Or are the weapons suppose to be given to the various people in Africa? How are they distributed? Or are they given to the already existing anti government movements already raping and pillaging across the africa for decades? Quote You're also skipping the part where the movie spends twenty minutes breaking up a Nigerian to Rwandan human traffic ring. It's the part after the marvel logo if you need to rewatch it. They broke a convey and they were just a couple of faceless nameless bad guys that we never saw or heard from again like who were they? Boko Haram? And wasn't that whole scene just to grab the queen?
farlibarcai Posted February 22, 2018 Posted February 22, 2018 There's no point in paying to see Black Panther. And, by the wat, I haven't seen a good Marvel movie ever. Even Shaolin Soccer has better use of VFX and more entertaining stories.
gregathit Posted February 22, 2018 Posted February 22, 2018 Aparently this topic can't be discussed here in a civil manner. Thread closed due to multiple violations of rule 9.
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.