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Is the latest RaceMenu version able to replace ECE?

NNS10

By NNS10,
in Skyrim General Discussion

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Taskmaster

Taskmaster

Posted
Posted

You guys must be talking about this: http://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/45235/?  <- RaceMenu skeleton sliders for XPMS.

 

I don't know, I definitely wouldn't call it junking up the interface. It's one of the best plugins I've ever used on RaceMenu, as you can adjust the stick thin arms of UNP for your character(I'm using 7b and I felt even those arms were too thin for my character), shoulder length, foot size, thigh size, etc. I don't think I can do without it anymore(been using it since last October), and I'm only using the precompiled version - the other download as far as I know, you can make your own list of sliders that show up in the interface. Make personal adjustments that affect the looks of your armors, as well, and not all of the NPCs that wear the same thing.

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Coopervane

Coopervane

Posted
Posted

I think it's purely a relegious question at this point (RaceMenu+ECE-Morphs=They are very clouse to beeing the same now).

ECE has a few nice things RM does not, and RM has a few nice things that ECE does not, so choose your posion, what do you find more valuable?

 

Since i tend to play Dunmer char's, the colour-overlay options of RM have proven invaluable to me to fix rather ugly things like red lips on grey skin and whatnot, so i'm rolling with RM. But if pressed, i could also use ECE, they are both good.

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Sunja44

Sunja44

Posted
Posted

You guys must be talking about this: http://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/45235/?  <- RaceMenu skeleton sliders for XPMS.

 

I don't know, I definitely wouldn't call it junking up the interface. It's one of the best plugins I've ever used on RaceMenu, as you can adjust the stick thin arms of UNP for your character(I'm using 7b and I felt even those arms were too thin for my character), shoulder length, foot size, thigh size, etc. I don't think I can do without it anymore(been using it since last October), and I'm only using the precompiled version - the other download as far as I know, you can make your own list of sliders that show up in the interface. Make personal adjustments that affect the looks of your armors, as well, and not all of the NPCs that wear the same thing.

 

Yep, this mod.

 

As I am no UNP user, but used to CBBE and Bodyslide for years now, the skeleton plugin is handy, but I am able to adjust most of the important stuff (breasts, butts) already by Bodyslide 2 (and far better to be honest, the butt, butt small, chubby butt, apple cheeks, big butt and round butt sliders there make it possible to form a butt much more to one's personal likeness. In compare to Bodyslide 2 the skeleton mod RM plugin just pales in my opinion for the exception of mesh changes Bodyslide does not deliver, aka neck sliders and such).

 

I installed it just for the hope there is a longer neck slider, but it seems that this one is missing (I found a slider to makes necks thinner and thicker, but not longer or shorter, but maybe I missed a few). Some of the new sliders are handy though, even for a Bodyslide user.

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Taskmaster

Taskmaster

Posted
Posted

Yeah if you're a CBBE user that plugin is redundant and can even be considered vastly inferior. One could say the same about UNP, as there's a competent UNP bodyslide that works great.

 

For us mortals that enjoy 7B and 7b oppai, the plugin is what's up though. Keep in mind, that before Bodyslide 2.0, there were some things the plugin adjusted that Bodyslide didn't(like feet/toes). Bombshell and 7b oppai's legs and calves are the best thing about the body(imo), but the titties are just too large for the character I made and the arms were still too thin for my liking - the plugin helped me.

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  • 7 months later...
gvman3670

gvman3670

Posted
Posted

ECE makes Anime toons, Racemenu makes more humanized and real-ish looking toons.  This has been my objective view on these two programs for a long time.  Me personally I like more realistic looking toons as apposed to anime characters.

 

 

Really you could either way with either of those programs. I've made very realistic characters with both and some kinda' 'toonish ones with both.

 

This is with ECE...

 

post-243307-0-51477500-1422139463_thumb.jpg

 

And RaceMenu...

 

post-243307-0-01020300-1422139551_thumb.jpg

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Rayblue

Rayblue

Posted
Posted

ECE makes Anime toons, Racemenu makes more humanized and real-ish looking toons.  This has been my objective view on these two programs for a long time.  Me personally I like more realistic looking toons as apposed to anime characters.

 

Look at gvman's examples -- are you daft, trying to troll, or because you're seeing things with stereotype glasses? 

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dobmc

dobmc

Posted
Posted

ECE makes Anime toons, Racemenu makes more humanized and real-ish looking toons.  This has been my objective view on these two programs for a long time.  Me personally I like more realistic looking toons as apposed to anime characters.

Still better than some of the guys using bella's "better" females face textures.

 

RM has been updated constantly and out-performs ECE when including sub-mods, but the characters that comes from Racemenu is still lacking. Even though you can literally copy faces with RM, most of the known follower mods are made from ECE. 

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yui0820

yui0820

Posted
Posted

 

RM can't play this, so only ECE can bring me fun.

 

 

ugOZT4y.jpgbZENx8e.jpg0Kf8pGL.jpgZQ54Msc.jpg

So... ECE still my only one. :)

 

 

Ehm RM can do that and it can also be used with citrus head and not only with that shitty no poly vanilla head...

 

 

I'm not saying "vertex edit", I know RM now can do the vertex edit, but I'm not talk about that.

 

Well, you can try to do the same like me with RM, but I doubt it did any one can.

post-89240-0-55262100-1422198690_thumb.gif

post-89240-0-70897400-1422200080_thumb.gif

 

 

 

post-89240-0-58548800-1422199090_thumb.jpg

post-89240-0-06158000-1422199095_thumb.jpg

Same pose, free to move the head.

 

 

 

Well, if you just wanna play the game, sure RM or ECE it doesn't matter, choose what you want.

 

But if want take the SS, set the pose, free to move the head any direction in the pose, edit the facial,

ECE is way more better for me.

 

But I must said... RM's edit warpaint system is so~~~ good.

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yui0820

yui0820

Posted
Posted

 

 

not only with that shitty no poly vanilla head...

 

 

that look like a demonica fanboy comment

 

citrus head is a shitty "no poly" head compared to victoria 4.2 (the real one, not demonica that is a decimated version with a mess up uv map for performance), that have 7000 verticles for the face (back of the head and neck are on the body)

 

is that a shitty head?

 

 

t08mVsh.jpg

 

 

i didn't gave sofia her citrus head, there's not much difference, so i didn't bother as some animations don't look right on citrus

 

 

 

Well, you can try to do the same like me with RM, but I doubt it did any one can.

 

many can do that, how do you think those facial animations mods were made...

 

 

The animations mod is animations mod.

Those animations is all the same on everyone's game.

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Groovtama

Groovtama

Posted
Posted

 

 

RM can't play this, so only ECE can bring me fun.

 

 

ugOZT4y.jpgbZENx8e.jpg0Kf8pGL.jpgZQ54Msc.jpg

So... ECE still my only one. :)

 

 

Ehm RM can do that and it can also be used with citrus head and not only with that shitty no poly vanilla head...

 

 

I'm not saying "vertex edit", I know RM now can do the vertex edit, but I'm not talk about that.

 

Well, you can try to do the same like me with RM, but I doubt it did any one can.

attachicon.gif003.gif

attachicon.gif01.gif

 

 

 

attachicon.gif12.jpg

attachicon.gif13.jpg

Same pose, free to move the head.

 

 

 

Well, if you just wanna play the game, sure RM or ECE it doesn't matter, choose what you want.

 

But if want take the SS, set the pose, free to move the head any direction in the pose, edit the facial,

ECE is way more better for me.

 

But I must said... RM's edit warpaint system is so~~~ good.

 

You know that XPMSE2 has a pose plugin for RM that supports like 4 thousand poses including pinup poser etc? directly choosable from the pose category. That is not meant in a bad way just telling. 3.0 and XPMSE have far more new features than old versions.

 

 

 

 

not only with that shitty no poly vanilla head...

 

 

that look like a demonica fanboy comment

 

citrus head is a shitty "no poly" head compared to victoria 4.2 (the real one, not demonica that is a decimated version with a mess up uv map for performance), that have 7000 verticles for the face (back of the head and neck are on the body)

 

is that a shitty head?

 

 

t08mVsh.jpg

 

 

i didn't gave sofia her citrus head, there's not much difference, so i didn't bother as some animations don't look right on citrus

 

 

 

Well, you can try to do the same like me with RM, but I doubt it did any one can.

 

many can do that, how do you think those facial animations mods were made...

 

no proper tri files no proper head => yeah half assed.

 

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yatol

yatol

Posted
Posted

 

no proper tri files no proper head => yeah half assed.

 

 

the sofia head i upload some month ago is a vanilla head, it have a tri file

and the citrus version have a tri file too

 

and if you talking about victoria 4.2... citrus can't compete, it's just an edit of skyrim head that is years old

 

 

o4owNrZ.jpg

 

 

victoria 4.2 is a high poly body that use 3 4096*4096 textures, have hundred of morph, hundred of textures, and hundred of armors

unp and citrus would be history is someone made a real conversion (if you have the daz file, it take 2 minutes to convert an outfit to skyrim)

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blabba

blabba

Posted
Posted

 

 

no proper tri files no proper head => yeah half assed.

 

 

the sofia head i upload some month ago is a vanilla head, it have a tri file

and the citrus version have a tri file too

 

and if you talking about victoria 4.2... citrus can't compete, it's just an edit of skyrim head that is years old

 

victoria 4.2 is a high poly body that use 3 4096*4096 textures, have hundred of morph, hundred of textures, and hundred of armors

unp and citrus would be history is someone made a real conversion (if you have the daz file, it take 2 minutes to convert an outfit to skyrim)

 

 

1. Victoria is a fucking Daz licenced model. It is high poly and is meant for rendering still images NOT for realtime gameplay. The FPS hit would be INSANE. A straight port isn't going to happen because it probably exceeds the poly limits of the game. Hence why Demonica had to decimate it.

 

2. Even if someone did port the victoria body over to  skyrim, you'd still need to port skyrim vanilla armours to it.

 

3. The Demonica head does not contain proper tri files for the morphs, that was what Groovtama was calling out. The Demonica head was a decent attempt at a higher poly head, but without morphs it's just as useless to everyone else as any of the other similar high poly head replacers.

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GrimReaper

GrimReaper

Posted
Posted

 

You know that XPMSE2 has a pose plugin for RM that supports like 4 thousand poses including pinup poser etc? directly choosable from the pose category. That is not meant in a bad way just telling. 3.0 and XPMSE have far more new features than old versions.

 

 

 

I think what he meant was that ECE has better camera controls than RM and I have to agree there. I tried making a good looking screenshot during a pose while in the race menu, with ECE that works like a charm, with RM not so much. As far as I am aware, you can't turn the camera in RM, just the body of your character.

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yatol

yatol

Posted
Posted

 

1. Victoria is a fucking Daz licenced model. It is high poly and is meant for rendering still images NOT for realtime gameplay. The FPS hit would be INSANE. A straight port isn't going to happen because it probably exceeds the poly limits of the game. Hence why Demonica had to decimate it.

 

2. Even if someone did port the victoria body over to  skyrim, you'd still need to port skyrim vanilla armours to it.

 

3. The Demonica head does not contain proper tri files for the morphs, that was what Groovtama was calling out. The Demonica head was a decent attempt at a higher poly head, but without morphs it's just as useless to everyone else as any of the other similar high poly head replacers.

 

 

1. insane fps hit? what are you talking about

 

 

ySoApnd.jpg

 

MUH0fvG.jpg

it don't have msn, sk or s textures, don't know how to do that

i have copy paste demonica weight on that v4, so some things are wrong (v4 feets are longer, v4 fingers don't match, dem shoulders are much bigger, i don't care, that was just a test while waiting for a nif)

 

another one, low poly version on the left (demonica, so it have msn, sk and s textures), high poly version on the right (v4)

Gmjoeyo.jpg

that one have a problem with her head (it only show up from under, and i didn't remade it)

tIDWvGp.jpg

 

 

 

poly limit? with victoria 4.2 that only have about 50 000 verticles?

 

battlemaiden is 150 000 verticles, it's not my biggest nif, but that was the biggest fps hit, about 2-3 fps

textures were about 200 mo, i have reverse the uv map of some parts, now the left shoulder is loading the right shoulder texture, and reduced their size

now textures are about 60 mo and it eat about 1 fps (it still have 150 000 verticles of course)

 

2.it's the same for unp, cbbe, 7base, un7b...

 

3.that's because of the fanboys, the ones that do something for that body, don't feel like releasing it (their stuff is so superior, they don't need our crap)

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blabba

blabba

Posted
Posted

 

1. insane fps hit? what are you talking about

poly limit? with victoria 4.2 that only have about 50 000 verticles?

 

battlemaiden is 150 000 verticles, it's not my biggest nif, but that was the biggest fps hit, about 2-3 fps

textures were about 200 mo, i have reverse the uv map of some parts, now the left shoulder is loading the right shoulder texture, and reduced their size

now textures are about 60 mo and it eat about 1 fps (it still have 150 000 verticles of course)

 

2.it's the same for unp, cbbe, 7base, un7b...

 

3.that's because of the fanboys, the ones that do something for that body, don't feel like releasing it (their stuff is so superior, they don't need our crap)

 

 

You seem to not understand.

 

What you speak of is not possible in the game. You cannot have a single nif (that is skinned for animating) at 150 k vertices.

The amount of math and calculations that would be required to animate the keyframes would be insane. Let alone the game crashes any nif with more than around 60-70k vertices that is skinned to the body.

 

Source: I dicked around with a subdivided citrus body model and the game refused to load it past subdivision level 3 which was close to around 60k vertex wise. I dunno what the tri count was but I don't think it exceeded the maximum that the nif format can hold since nifskope opened and verified the file just fine.

 

There's a dam good reason why you'll find on NO modern games with excessive poly counts the likes of which your talking about.

There's a reason why normal mapping was invented and a reason why tessellation maps exist. Because they are much more performance effective than having to skin and calculate animation data than adding a bunch of extra verts.

 

Edit:

 

Lol just remembered there's nifskope documentation about this:

http://niftools.sourceforge.net/doc/nif/NiTriShapeData.html

 

The numverts field is a ushort data type which means it holds a maximum value of 65535.

So that's the MAXIMUM amount of vertices a valid nif file can contain. Not even accounting for number of poly tri's the format can hold.

 

So yea, in essence having a 150k vertex object in-game is pure BS.

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