Direction for SexoutDrugs and the Drug Overhaul

[dogface]

So, I'm shameless ripping off Loogie with the thread name, but I want some discussion and suggestions on where to take SexoutDrugs and my Drug Overhaul.

 

On SexoutDrugs, I've abandoned that NG version I posted in favour of NGifying the old one. I've also stripped out the lotion quest in favour of a more general legs-health-degrades a little during all vaginal/oral sex, but slowly heals up later so you don't have to be constantly limping if you take a break. I'm going to include streetwalking-for-caps in Freeside, Westside, North Vegas and the North Sewers, so your jetfiend character can earn enough to eat, but predatory pimps will approach you after a few tricks and demand a cut. If you work hard enough, there will be promotions available (for example, to the Casa in Westside) if you agree to stop using.

 

For the Drug Overhaul itself, which is a bigger concern since it will affect far more in the game than just a few slum areas, I'm trying hard to keep everything lore-friendly, which is important to me. I'm retooling some of the more fantasy-ish drugs to have more realistic qualities, and I'm adding some drugs. Let me know if you disagree or dislike any of these planned features, or if you have suggestions. I'm adding new drugs and sort of retrofitting the concept of existing ones, so please speak up if you having lore or realism-based objections to anything I'm saying here.

 

- Cigarettes can be smoked, BLTC-style (I fixed the crashing bug) and Coyote chew can be rolled into cigarettes (if I had meshes for cigars or selfrolls, I'd use that, but for now they just look like normal cigarettes)

 

- Pill bottles (fixer, buffout, mentats) now give a random number of pills when opened. I'm working on a stacking system so you can pack all your pills into a "pharmacy" that won't clutter your inventory.

 

- For buffout... instead of buffing you up like a strength potion, it now comes in two (three for the IMCN patch) forms. First is BuffOut GelCaps. They have no effect on you, unless you take them consistantly over several days. Then you get a stats change (extra strength and endurance, reduced agility) that lasts until you stop taking your regular dosage. I'm considering making a raceswitching script to turn the player into a Robert's Brawler race for males (search FO3 nexus for that) or Skim's Athletic race for females (you surely have heard of that), but unfortunately, unless somebody finishes refitting all the vanilla clothes it will only show when the player is nekked. Buffout will be mildly dependence-forming, with 'withdrawals' causing mood swings and irritability (-1 CH), and the effects will disappear when there is no more Buffout in the player's system. If you use IMCN, regular Buffout use will LEECH the hell out of your calories, protein and nutrients, so you'll have to be a big eater.

 

- The other forms of Buffout (they all come from the same bottle, and you get a random number of each when you open it ; consider it an entire home-workout-system) will be BuffHard Workout Enhancer, a highly addictive IM cocktail of amphetamines and other stimulants to justify the vanilla effects of buffout, and BuffSafe Nutritional Replenisher for IMCN users, which will be a weaker form of the IMCN Multivitamins, and also increase your protein levels.

 

- Psycho is a Methamphetamine and Heroin #4 speedball in a military IV administration unit. Psycho spikes can be disassembled so that you can take either drug individually, and they can be reassembled if you have the required ingredients.

 

- Steady will be considered a form of aerosolised military-use benzodiazepam/fentanyl hybrid designed to reduce muscle tremors for long-range snipers, without the associated sleepiness or impairment. I'm going to claim it's a derivative of Kolkonol-1 (the Russian valium/fentanyl chemical weapon used in that chechen school massacre). It will still be addictive, it just won't get you high except in large doses.

 

- Hydra is a fast-acting bone-knitting agent, like deferoxamine. Since the storyline clearly depicts it as being recreational and addictive, I'll say that it includes very strong narcotic anaesthetics to reduce the pain and discomfort.

 

- Plants/high-sugar foods, yeast and purified water can be combined with a lunchbox to make a "macerate". After a few gamedays, the macerate will be ready to cook in a distillery (built from surgical tubing, a hotplate, a pressure cooker and using energy cells for power) to create various alcohol beverages. Potatos become vodka, corn becomes scotch, ant nectar becomes rum, fruits become wine or brandy, etc. I'm still not sure what the recipe should be for "whiskey". I'm thinking corn and sugary-food, but I don't know...

 

- I'm thinking a good recipe for Jet would be Abraxo Cleanser (for the lye), Turpentine (for the solvent), 5mm bullets (for the red phosphorous), Rad-X (for the iodine) and Brahmin shit... where to get Brahmin shit, though? How should I have the player harvest brahmin shit? From live brahmins? From an option to 'search the immediate area' when out in the wasteland? Should I make a "brahmin shit" world object and randomly spawn it next to any live Brahmins on cell load? What do you think would be the best way to let the player collect shit in an immersive and non mood-breaking way?

 

- I'm adding the new drugs Brocaine and Xander Latex, which will act as analogues to cocaine and opium. Why use silly fake made-up drugs instead of real ones? Because Myron explicitly states in Fallout 2 that opium poppies and coca plants are extinct. My lore-explanation will be that Myron or one of his colleages experimented with genetically altering Broc and Xander to create narcotic-producing plants. The experiment was considered a failure, but over the generations the altered strains gradually mutatated and infected the wasteland's flora. Broc flower now produces a tropane alkaloid which can be refined into something very similar to old world descriptions of cocaine, dubbed "brocaine". Xander root will produce opiate alkaloids which can be harvested and refined further into morphine and heroin.

 

- Likewise, I'm adding WH0 instead of marijuana, since cannabis is extinct.

 

That's all the progess and plans I can think of now, but please let me know which parts you hate and which parts you want gone, and any other ideas you have.

[GSBmodders]

this all sounds good one thing that comes to mind though is that med x seems to be over looked.

 

I did not play through any of the Gomorrah content much be it vanilla or modded but if I remember right that seemed to be the drug of choice among prostitutes there, and there was even an option to get a girl for the night by giving her a shot of med x

 

considering that description i read for it makes it out be something like morphine which is very close to heroine I would say its very likely that pushers and pimps would be sure keep that in ready supply

 

I'm thinking a good recipe for Jet would be Abraxo Cleanser (for the lye)' date=' Turpentine (for the solvent), 5mm bullets (for the red phosphorous), Rad-X (for the iodine) and Brahmin shit... where to get Brahmin shit, though? How should I have the player harvest brahmin shit? From live brahmins? From an option to 'search the immediate area' when out in the wasteland? Should I make a "brahmin shit" world object and randomly spawn it next to any live Brahmins on cell load? What do you think would be the best way to let the player collect shit in an immersive and non mood-breaking way?

[/quote']

 

placing one or two pieces of respawning brahmin shit next to the brahmin spawns would probably be the way to go.

[dogface]

I was planning on restricting med-x whores to the brothels and casinos instead of the street trade, since opiates are more expensive, last longer, and are generally better for your health, looks and mental stability than meth/jet. The Omertas will certainly be the go-to guys for Med-X. I figure the dopefiends can hold down steady jobs, while the jetfreaks have to be constantly out mugging, thieving or offering five-cap blowjobs for their next fix.

 

edit ; I'll look into trying to add brahmin shit as a "plant" item, if I can get or learn to make meshes... that probably is the best option, although mods seem to get really fubared when anything changes in exterior worldspaces... I'll just have to hope for the best.

[prideslayer]

Just to flipside opiates for a second, they are also extremely addictive, with tolerances building up fairly rapidly. Withdrawal from many of them is often terribly painful. It's uncommon for poor people to get their hands on them to begin with, but no matter how rich you are, it's also hard to not go broke and end up homeless once you start getting a real habit to feed. Rockstars can manage, but even they run out of money once they stop producing.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opioid_withdrawal

some studies suggest a permanent dysregulation of the endogenous opioid receptor system after chronic exposure to opiates

 

Witnessed firsthand with Heroin, not pretty.

[prideslayer]

mods seem to get really fubared when anything changes in exterior worldspaces... I'll just have to hope for the best.

 

Don't associate them with the worldspace, associate them with nearby brahmin. Make a spell that sits on the player (or the brahmin) and has some chance of dropping a cowpie from a nearby brahmin every 2 hours or whatever, and do it that way; add it to their inventory with AddItem, then drop it with the Drop script command.

 

This way you can limit it to occurring when the player is nearby and you also avoid the worldspace issues.

 

 

[GSBmodders]

Witnessed firsthand with Heroin' date=' not pretty.

[/quote']

 

I lost both a brother and a sister to heroin in both cases I was one to find them. Where I live these kids dont even stand a chance heroin is far to available and cheap its cheaper to buy a bag of heroin in this city then it is to buy grass

 

 

 

 

 

[mirwayneth]

I know precisely jack shit about modding, so this may or may not be a stupid idea, but there is a mod I use that has both cigarettes and cigars. Perhaps you could get your meshes from there?

 

Can be found here: http://www.newvegasnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=38002

 

And while I know that it probably won't work - if you manage to somehow add pipes, you're my hero.

[Cathal]

On SexoutDrugs' date=' I've abandoned that NG version I posted in favour of NGifying the old one. I've also stripped out the lotion quest in favour of a more general legs-health-degrades a little during all vaginal/oral sex, but slowly heals up later so you don't have to be constantly limping if you take a break. I'm going to include streetwalking-for-caps in Freeside, Westside, North Vegas and the North Sewers, so your jetfiend character can earn enough to eat, but predatory pimps will approach you after a few tricks and demand a cut. If you work hard enough, there will be promotions available (for example, to the Casa in Westside) if you agree to stop using.

[/quote']

 

^-this

How about expanding on the story in addition to new drugs(apart from what you've mentioned), for example make the dealer have you spike some drinks/food for Cass/Veronica/(insert npc here) to make them addicted in time and increase the dealer's junkie base.

As for Casa as I remember Sarah wasnt too keen on letting a junkie work there, if you get "promoted" and get to work there you could expand on that somewhat, Sarah/girls trying to push you back into drugs so you get kicked out/abused, something along these lines.

 

 

[iron_jack]

Dogface, I don't have any suggestions at the moment, but let me just say that this all sounds fucking wonderful. I've always wished the drugs in-game had a harder, grittier, more dangerous feel to them - and of course drug problems go along great with all the rape/sex/prostitution of Sexout. So thank you so much for your work.

[zippy57]

I did not play through any of the Gomorrah content much be it vanilla or modded but if I remember right that seemed to be the drug of choice among prostitutes there' date=' and there was even an option to get a girl for the night by giving her a shot of med x

 

considering that description i read for it makes it out be something like morphine which is very close to heroine I would say its very likely that pushers and pimps would be sure keep that in ready supply[/quote']Med-X isn't "like" Morphine, it is Morphine; if you look in the GECK the ID for it is "Morphine", and it was called Morphine in-game until Australia refused to rate it.

[Halstrom]

Med-X isn't "like" Morphine' date=' it [i']is[/i] Morphine; if you look in the GECK the ID for it is "Morphine", and it was called Morphine in-game until Australia refused to rate it.

yeah some stupid churchie extremist polititian single handlily managed to block the creation of an "R" rating catagory for video games but still allowed "R" rating for movies. So anything above "M" rating in Games is banned.

[Kashked]

As long as this is compatible with Imps more complex needs, which it sounds like you plan it to be, it all sounds wonderful. What I would like to see however is graphical effects to druguse, to really give the player the feeling of being "high" besides the purely statistical stuff that goes on "under the hood" of the game. I used to have a mod for this, but it doeasn't work togheter with IMCN unfortunatly.

[dogface]

Med-X is Morphine in the gamefiles, but since Myron states opium went extinct I just consider it to be a synthetic substitute... fentanyl or methadone, something like that. When I bring in morphine (refined from Xander root) it will be slightly different from Med-X.

 

As far as everything else goes,

 

@ prideslayer, drop scripts on the cowpies sounds like the best way to do it. Thanks, prideslayer.

 

@ mirwayneth, Those cigar and cigarello meshes appear to be wearable apparel. They won't work for a smoking animation. What I really need is cigars, pipes, etc. made in the same style as the cigarette animobject. I'll ask around when the mod is close enough to being finished, until then I'll use placeholders.

 

@ Cathal, I'm not real keen on having 1980's PSA style drug dealers, giving out free samples is probably the limit as far as aggressive drug-pushing goes. Drugs sell themselves, especially in the wasteland. As for getting harrassed in the Casa, it's a good idea. Maude will probably be in charge of that, since she's got the most to lose by your staying.

 

@ GSBModders ; sorry to hear about your family members. Heroin can be really nasty stuff. I hope you don't get the impression I'm glamorising its use. I plan to make opium withdrawels the most potent in the short-term (the only one capable of outright killing the PC), but Jet withdrawals will be longer lasting and harder to deal with.

 

@ Kashked ; I play with IMCN, so an IMCN-incompatible version would be useless to me. There will be visuals on most drugs, mostly just blurred vision for the sedatives, but the stimulants will also play around with switching between fast-motion and slow-motion at random intervals to fuck with your head.

[iron_jack]

Just.. please don't go overboard on the blur effects. With the old jet classic, I had to uninstall it because the completely blurred screen gave me a headache almost immediately.

 

 

Just a thought, anyway, as I'd really like to use this once it's released.

 

 

 

On another note, hallucinogens could be fun, though they probably wouldn't serve any real in-game purpose.

 

Something like this, heh.

[Guest Loogie]

Something not really used in NV, but from what I gather the Gamebryo engine is good for hallucinatory effects.

 

There's this

from Point Lookout, and that vault with "ghosts" in it.

[zippy57]

Med-X is Morphine in the gamefiles' date=' but since Myron states opium went extinct I just consider it to be a synthetic substitute... fentanyl or methadone, something like that. When I bring in morphine (refined from Xander root) it will be slightly different from Med-X.[/quote']I guess I'll be creating a compatibility patch for myself, then. I use Arwen's and it restores the Morphine name to Med-X, it'd be a bit confusing having two Morphine items floating around.

 

And a bit off-topic, since we're talking about IMCN, anyone ever try Arwen's and IMCN at the same time? I tried it once, and was constantly jumping between dehydrated and not-dehydrated. It kept switching the percentages around and was incredibly annoying.

[dogface]

I use Arwen (including medtec, but not onelife) and IMCN together. It took a fair bit of work patching them to work together, but I've got them running smoothly. Basically I just hacked everything out of Arwen's MedTec that concerns food/drink/primary needs and left in the injury treatment only.

 

So you can bet I'll be making an Med-Tec patch too, to let any strong opiates be used in place of morphine, etc.

[GSBmodders]

@ GSBModders ; sorry to hear about your family members. Heroin can be really nasty stuff. I hope you don't get the impression I'm glamorising its use. I plan to make opium withdrawels the most potent in the short-term (the only one capable of outright killing the PC)' date=' but Jet withdrawals will be longer lasting and harder to deal with.

[/quote']

 

dont think to much of it, i had almost 10 years to get over it all and I'm done with beating up myself or anyone else over it. The bottom line always comes to this no one forced them into it.

 

if you need advice on realistic symptoms of heroine use i can provide you with a wealth of information, on that and the substitutes that heroine addicts use when they cant get a bag.

 

this is something that drug abuse prevention sites usually get wrong

 

Just.. please don't go overboard on the blur effects. With the old jet classic' date=' I had to uninstall it because the completely blurred screen gave me a headache almost immediately.[/quote']

 

the blur was something i liked, it added a bit to the immersion i thought. I understand completely what you are saying about the headaches though, I went through that and worse when I attempted to play a H-game titled first anchor. 5 mins into the game I had to turn off just something about it made me sick to my stomach

 

back on topic, I would love to see actual animations for using the drug. I uploaded a syringe in the props thread but it will need animations created for it and I have no clue if possible to set an animation to play on use for consumables

 

another thought is that when withdrawl symptoms start depending on the severity of the addiction or withdrawl auto use of the drug might be something to explore. I have never seen an addict willingly deprive themself of using if they are carrying

 

[Halstrom]

another thought is that when withdrawl symptoms start depending on the severity of the addiction or withdrawl auto use of the drug might be something to explore. I have never seen an addict willingly deprive themself of using if they are carrying

Yeah that sounds good, would even use any other drugs if the ones they needed weren't available.

[dogface]

@ GSBModders

Thanks for the offer. Do you know which type of heroin is in your area? I'm a former user, although I've never been addicted, I did build up physical dependence and suffered a fair bit when I stopped. What I'm interested in knowing more about is "tar" heroin, which doesn't exist where I live but is apparently common in the American southwest and fits the NV theme best. I am researching everything I add in, but it's always good to know somebody I can take specific questions to.

 

For substitutes, I'm not going to make it too complicated. Drugs in the same general family will all share the same addiction (but with different addiction rates), so once you get hooked on any opiate you can use any other opiate to satisfy your needs. I'm also planning to have a range of sedatives (benzos, barbs, etc.) that can be used to reduce the effects of the withdrawal of unrelated drugs, but will also be fairly addictive themselves.

 

As for a shooting animation, it's a little tricky, but I can set animations to play on consumables, I've already got animated smokable cigarettes added in. There's a vanilla IM injection animation for NPC's using stimpacks, but I've never seen a proper IV animation in any mod. Hopefully some animator will volunteer to make one.

 

Auto-using drugs in your inventory is a good idea. I'm adding that in.

[GSBmodders]

I have no idea what type it is in my area, being just 5 minutes from philly 2 hours from nyc and an hours drive of atlantic city its most likely a wide variety. The only thing I have never heard of being sold around here is meth.

 

masterchris would probably be the go to guy for asking to have an animation made

 

 

[Kashked]

While you are messing about with the drugs, do you think you could make them last longer? Meaning a couple of hours in-game time. I haven't used drugs myself, but I imagine that they last a couple of hours atleast, just like alcohol. If you are increasing the severity of withdrawal this is almost a must, since I don't think there are enough drugs availible in the game to support a char with a habit as it is.

 

Also, not meaning to rush you or complain, I appriciate that these things take time, but do you have any kind of ETA? I was planning to start a new game, but I want this mod in place before I do.

[dogface]

Jet will last about fifteen minutes to half an hour because characters in FO2 have mentioned it's prized by manufacturers for it's high turnover rate, but I'll do some script-magic to make sure the big drug dealers never run out of stock. The auto-use when addicted function should keep it from being too tedious to constantly have to open the pipboy and fix. Other drugs will have timeframes based on real life. I'm not going to get too complicated with halflives and such but brocaine should last around 15 minutes, WH0 should last you an hour or so, heroin should last you ~8 hours, old-world meth ~6, etc. I might make a script to keep track of how much you're using and reduce the time it lasts to around ~50% if you're a heavy user, but there's more important stuff to be done first.

 

Definitely don't wait on this to start a new playthrough. You'll probably take Hoover Dam before I come close to a release.

[dogface]

Also, I should ask here...

 

Is it okay etiquette if I make a thread in Non Adult Mods to ask for contributions with meshes, textures, animations, voice-acting and all the stuff I can't do myself (and learning to do it would slow the development by over 9000%)? The Nexus community are kinda assholes compared to loverslab perverts.

[prideslayer]

Why wouldn't it be ok?