Devious Bandit Overhaul

[El_Duderino]

1 hour ago, thebombers said:

wouldn't they need one quest alias for every bandit camp in the game? Like if antagonizing the bandits removes the alias would that not affect every bandit camp

That shouldn't be necessary. Even in its current state, there is only one alias quest that can be re-used for every bandit camp. That quest resets every time the player leaves a camp so that it can refill its aliases with different bandits on the next visit, including at another location. Expanding or changing that to run faction changes on the player instead of the bandits shouldn't complicate things (actually, probably make things easier).

[DayTri]

3 hours ago, El_Duderino said:

Thank you, that's an intriguing idea! That really ought to improve compatibility with other mods.

 

The trade-off would be that it wouldn't change how the bandits react to other Skyrim factions, which I found to be a very welcome side-effect of my current approach. By default, the bandits are only friendly with few other factions, such as the Khajiit caravans. That means that roadside bandit camps usually get wiped out by traveling NPCs within the first weeks of a playthrough (especially when using mods that add travelling NPCs).

 

I'll have to think about this. Perhaps it might not even be that difficult to provide two versions of the mod in the end: an "invasive" one that overhauls NPCs and factions, and a light one that handles only bandit-player interaction for improved compatibility.

 

Ultimately it's your mod and you should build it the way you want, hope I do not come across as demanding. But in my opinion, the easiest way to achieve this would be a separate mod that only edited the bandit factions / actors, and then the core mod changing player alias through a faction. That is unless you plan to have content in the core mod which absolutely relies on the faction edits, like scenes where vanilla NPCs visit bandit camps or bandits visit cities. But if there are no plans for that, separating them seems like the best move to me (some players like me won't care that some bandit camps are wiped out, other players might even want the edited faction behaviors without the rest of the mod)

 

4 hours ago, thebombers said:

 

I'm not a modder and don't know much about Skyrim's programming, but... if they did it that way, wouldn't they need one quest alias for every bandit camp in the game? Like if antagonizing the bandits removes the alias would that not affect every bandit camp, instead of just the one you're antagonizing? Would it still be less work that way?

 

The alias is applied to the player, and could just be reapplied whenever the PC left the hostile bandit camp. There are ways to hack it so that the bandit camps "remember" they're hostile to you, like a formlist of antagonized camps, although personally I think it's better if they eventually go non-hostile (like skyrim guards, maybe eventually leading to a parallel "arrest" mechanic for the bandits). There are probably scenarios where editing the factions and actors will be easier and so it definitely depends on the author's vision, I just wanted to suggest it since incompatibility with mods that add new bandits seems like a high price to pay, and wanted to mention this idea for avoiding the price.

[El_Duderino]

7 hours ago, DayTri said:

hope I do not come across as demanding

Oh, absolutely not! Quite the opposite, in fact. Gathering feedback and ideas was the main idea behind posting this rough draft version of the mod.

 

7 hours ago, DayTri said:

a separate mod that only edited the bandit factions / actors, and then the core mod changing player alias through a faction

Another great idea, thanks! I'll give that a try. It would certainly be easier than maintaining two separate and mutually exclusive versions of the mod.  

[Sweet Dave]

This is great.

I’ve been scouring google every couple months or so for years now looking for a mod that lets you role-play beyond either just killing ever bandit ever on sight, or immediately surrendering completely to a sexlab or simply slavery scene… then killing every bandit on sight.

 

Will check back for sure when life gives me some time to Skyrim again.

[El_Duderino]

22 hours ago, DayTri said:

a separate mod that only edited the bandit factions / actors, and then the core mod changing player alias through a faction

Quick update about this: I made a quick test mod for the "player alias as bandit friend" idea and I think it works in principle. With one major issue for my intended theme / play style: Most or all (?) of the Skyrim bandits are set to help friends and allies. Meaning that when you get into a fight with what- or whomever else while in sight of bandits, they come rush to your defense. That makes no sense to me lore-wise unless for a "player as bandit" play style.

 

I think I'll stick to the more invasive / less compatible approach for now. It shouldn't be too hard to convert the system to the friendly bandits method later.

[Crota]

I gave this a try using the Masterstroke modlist as a base, I have a few other additional mods, mainly babodialogue and its other related mods.

Attempted to approach halted steam camp a couple times, first time they were engaging a patrol and were hostile to me. After noticing that I reloaded to an earlier save where I hadn't engaged them yet then fast traveled away and came back so that they were passively moving about again. I talked with an NPC and got through the first line of dialogue, where I said I was just passing through. Then I could hear another bandit saying a hostile line behind me and was attacked.

The next time I tried I approach the camp made it in successfully(?) and then was immediately attacked again.

My guess is one of the mods is adding additional bandits that maybe aren't considered halted steam camp bandits?

[El_Duderino]

7 hours ago, Crota said:

My guess is one of the mods is adding additional bandits that maybe aren't considered halted steam camp bandits?

Thanks much for the feedback! Incompatibility with another bandits-related mod is a likely cause, though I've also detected a fairly major bug in how the bandit approach quest resets in the current version: The bandits aggro without (intentional) cause if the player leaves and/or re-enters the quest trigger in too rapid succession. I have already changed that in my dev version and am now testing the changes.

[El_Duderino]

New Update Released!

 

The mod should now be in a more playable and reliable state, though still far from being ready for actual use. It's still using the same fundamental concept with "invasive" faction and NPC changes to the vanilla bandit actors.

 

Version 0.0.3

Version 0.0.3 is yet another early alpha and intended solely for testing. It is definitely not ready for use in any serious playthrough. Please completely remove any earlier versions from your mod manager before installing 0.0.3. Starting a new game is mandatory for reliable test results!

 

Changes

 

• Added brief delay in processing after trigger enter/leave to prevent cases where player moves in and out of the trigger quickly (moving near-parallel to the trigger box's boundary)

• Bandits will now remove all restraint keys before equipping devices.

• Device-as-payment should no longer be possible when already wearing conflicting devices.

• Player now has a way to brack-track after initially refusing the bandits' toll demand (fighting is no longer the only option).

• Looting Wrap-up Conversation:

  • now takes a fee even when player hasn't looted a thing

  • now reacts to player looting more than they paid deposit for (can either pay the difference or face punishment)

• You can now get a discount for offering sex.

• Follower handling for restraints equips (fairly rudimentary; only vanilla follower faction)

• Player AddItem tracking no longer reacts when Barter or InventoryMenu are open

• Player AddItem tracking no longer reacts when player in combat

• Device haggling dialogue over the looting price no longer available when already wearing a devious body device.

• Disconnected AddItemTracker from Bandit Encounter quest so that both can be started and terminated separately (should get us fewer cases where the tracker fires when it shouldn't, or not fires when it should)

• Added a "trigger extender" which allows stacking several triggers together to allow creating non-rectangular encounter trigger areas .

• The "toll" can now also be paid with sex (you get a 50% discount).

• Added Triggers to Silent Moons Camp

 

Expected Bandit Behaviour:

 

• Bandits aggro when leaving the trigger before entering dialogue (also if you return with a still valid license).

• Bandits aggro when picking up items before entering dialogue.

• Bandits aggro when tabbing out of dialogue during the license negotiation.

• When attacking the player, bandits should now pursue the player for much longer (up to six minutes) before the quest resets. The player shouldn't be able to yield to them (vanilla yield by sheathing your weapons) before that reset.

• Bandits in a camp that the player did battle with in the past should forever stay hostile to the player and attack without warning the next time the player enters their trigger. Currently, this should even persist through a respawn of a previously cleared camp (I should probably change that in a future update).

[BlackEagle251]

I think if you could add feature like betrayed by bandits. If you pay a fee for looting or mining on their territory, they could betray player by selling her in slavery (Simple Slavery or other mods).  In addition speaking about consequences, bandits may demands to take weapon and armor from the player. And betray, by bandits may be based on probability, and even if player pay toll, they could betray player via dialogue.

[tamai]

I like the idea I didnt see it written but will they attack you if you have your weapon out?

 

Also another idea is you can equip a collar that prevents user from using magic and also having the player hand over all their weapons upon entering and will get them back when leaving or something like that.

Edited March 23, 2025 by tamai

[117xxx]

sounds like HarsShip in Fallout,have you tried that mod?I think it will be interesting!

[Straeker]

I've been waiting for this idea forever, hope you continue development!

[El_Duderino]

New Update!

 

This update focuses mainly on enhancing and expanding the dialogue / negotiations with the bandits.

 

Version 0.0.4 is yet another early alpha and intended solely for testing. It is definitely not ready for use in any serious playthrough. Please completely remove any earlier versions from your mod manager before installing 0.0.4. Starting a new game is mandatory for reliable test results!

 

Changes

• New hard requirement: Scrab's Papyrus Extender for keyword-based item confiscation: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/115164?tab=description
• Revised and expanded initial dialogue sequence.
• Bandit behaviour now depends on player level:
  • Level >75: bandits actively fear the player and let them roam freely through their territory and allow them to take items worth less than 25 septims (per item). Normal looting license is still available if player wants to get more valuable items peacefully.
  • Level >50: bandits are intimidated by the player and let them roam freely through their territory. Normal looting license can still be bought.
  • Level >20: bandits are worried about the player and demand they hand over their weapons and armor before entering negotiations
  • Level <20: bandits play it safe and demand the player hand over their weapons before entering negotiations, but allow the player to keep their armor
• Bandits now have different initial dialogue if player wears hobble dress or heavy bondage
• Toll can now also be paid by handing over all your clothing and armor (main body slot items; only available is player is actually wearing clothes or armor)
• Toll can be waived if player is wearing heavy bondage or bondage mittens.

[thebombers]

Tried the new version and it all seems to work fine! The only thing I've noticed is that, when approaching while bound, the bandit talks to me like I'm famous. I'm not sure if this is intended or the bandit is misusing dialogue intended for a higher-level character, but the way he recognizes my level 1 character and mentions she's a great warrior is a little jarring, and it didn't strike me as sarcasm, haha.

I also feel compelled to mention that I play with a lot of fairly misogynistic mods on, so in a future release I'd love if there were an MCM that would allow us to customize whether bandits fear us or not. The way I have my game modded out, it'd feel weird and inconsistent if every NPC, friendly or otherwise, was underestimating me for being a woman except bandits, y'know?

[El_Duderino]

1 hour ago, thebombers said:

The only thing I've noticed is that, when approaching while bound, the bandit talks to me like I'm famous.

Thanks much for the feedback and suggestions. The "famous when bound" is definitely a condition bug. The bandits are supposed to have separate bound and not bound dialogue for the same four level brackets.

 

1 hour ago, thebombers said:

I'd love if there were an MCM that would allow us to customize whether bandits fear us or not.

It's a good request but to be honest, I don't think I'm up for that challenge. I've kept the dialogue gender neutral because that's by far the easiest way. Conditioning dialogue by player gender essentially doubles the amount of dialogue and conditions that I'd have to keep track of ... and that's just

 

There's also a matter of personal preference at play, for I don't get how anybody would dare to treat a dragon-slaying, weapon-swinging, level 50+ char in any demeaning way. ... And factoring level and gender into the dialogue conditions is simply waaay too much work.

Edited March 26, 2025 by El_Duderino

[thebombers]

16 hours ago, El_Duderino said:

It's a good request but to be honest, I don't think I'm up for that challenge. I've kept the dialogue gender neutral because that's by far the easiest way. Conditioning dialogue by player gender essentially doubles the amount of dialogue and conditions that I'd have to keep track of ... and that's just

 

There's also a matter of personal preference at play, for I don't get how anybody would dare to treat a dragon-slaying, weapon-swinging, level 50+ char in any demeaning way. ... And factoring level and gender into the dialogue conditions is simply waaay too much work.

Well, I once again will not claim to know how modding works, but... is there a way you could add a simple toggle? Like, you don't need to add gendered dialogue or anything, but if there was a way to, in the MCM, force the bandits to always use the <20 dialogue, or the 20-50 dialogue, I think that'd work fine!

[El_Duderino]

New Update!

 

This update expands the trigger-based bandit handling across all of Skyrim (or at least to all bandit locations that I could find with the help of UESP).

 

Unfortunately, the limitations of my concept are becoming quite clear to me. I am considering abandoning this mod. Compatibility is a nightmare and the whole trigger-based concept isn't as reliable as I had hoped it would be. Worse still, I can't determine if this mod won't break vanilla quest content as bandits (or other NPC in the bandit faction) are in so many quests and not just as radiant targets.

 

Having said that, I'm uploading my current progress here in case anybody would like to take a look. Please completely remove any earlier versions from your mod manager before installing 0.1. Starting a new game is mandatory for reliable test results!

 

Changes:

• Bandits will now remain hostile for 15 minutes after first engaging in combat with the player. Note that this affects on the whole faction, not just the location where you entered combat (think of it as the news of the combat spreading to nearby folks.) After the 15-minute cooldown, bandits will go back to being neutral except for the camp in which you started the fight.
• Removed all warlock and Forsworn edits. Focusing purely on the bandit faction is tricky enough.
• Forwarded USSEP record changes
• Created separate quest to track AddItem in interiors, to avoid the Trigger events en- and disabling tracking out of sequence when switching between ex-/interior cells

Added:

• Added encounter triggers to bandit locations that are either near important roads or which contain mines: Cracked Tusk Keep, Cragslane Cavern, Embershard Mine, Faldar's Tooth, Fort Dunstad, Fort Fellhammer, Fort Greymoor, Knifepoint Ridge, Treva's Watch, White River Watch, Bilegulch Mine, Robber's Gorge, Valtheim Towers
• Edited vanilla Valtheim Towers and Robbers Gorge quests/actors/dialogue which conflicted with this mod (and never worked too well to begin with). All their files and records are still present for compatibility reasons, but they don't do anything any more.
• Optional toggle to prevent the bandits from reacting to the player's level. This is OFF by default. Type this command once into the console to enable it: "Set DBO_G_LowLevelDialogueOnly to 1" (set it to 0 to disable this feature again).

• Added a new type of bandit location trigger for bandits that are always hostile. That trigger has been added to various unmarked encounter locations on the map and locations that are far away from the roads and/or targets for non-radiant quests. This includes bandit-inhabited dungeon locations such as Bleak Falls Barrow.

• Note that the player will be hostile to all bandits for 15 minutes after entering any of these always-hostile trigger boxes even when no bandits are nearby. Hostilities could ensue later on and elsewhere on the map until the 15-minute timer has elapsed!

[pedrojuan123]

sad news, this a good concept. good job nonetheless

[demerest]

Hello, author! Good mod.
To avoid conflicts with vanilla, it is worth setting a trigger: if the MC has a weapon in his hands or it is selected in the inventory, then the hostile factions behave as standard.
But if the MC does not have a weapon in his hands and it is not selected in the inventory, then your mod comes into play.
I think you should set conditions.

[El_Duderino]

1 hour ago, demerest said:

if the MC has a weapon in his hands or it is selected in the inventory, then the hostile factions behave as standard.
But if the MC does not have a weapon in his hands and it is not selected in the inventory, then your mod comes into play.

Thanks, that's a good idea but I'm not sure if it wouldn't cause other problems:

• I could attach the weapons check to the trigger enter/leave boxes in a performance friendly manner, but then it would not work for random (road/wilderness) bandit encounters
• To work everywhere, it would probably have to rely on frequent (expensive) polling, cell scans, or worse.
• It wouldn't solve conflicts with other bandit-adding or -altering mods that come with custom bandit NPCs like "Populated Skyrim".

On a happier note, I am currently testing the mod in a longer game and my full load order. So far, the results have been pretty promising:

• Creating a compatibility patch for "Populated Forts Tower Places Reborn" was easier than expected (see attachment below).
• I'm also using the Improved Roads mod (IMHO a better balanced alternative to the "Populated Lands Roads Paths") and that works well with DBO.
• I observed a bunch of NPC-NPC encounters and they all felt believable:
  • Roaming guards/militia groups attacked the bandits on sight. Thanks to the populated forts, the bandits usually won.
  • Neutral travelers withdrew to a safe distance of the bandit-soldiers battles and observed the battle, then proceeded along their paths when the air was clear again. Some stopped to inspect the corpses (normal Skyrim behaviour).
• Roaming solitary bandits are fully neutral to the player, which I'd say makes a lot of sense esp. as those are usually fairly low-level NPCs.
• Traveling along the main roads feels a lot safer to a low-level player char, which was one of my main goals with this mod. Neutral low-level NPCs like farmers should stay alive a lot longer now, too, especially if you play with delayed dragon attacks (Skyrim Unbound or similar).
• Other usually or always hostile NPCs like assassins or thieves seem completely unaffected, which is good.

So far, so good. The big unknown is still how the mod might impact quests, especially the ones where bandits are not an integral part of the quest but just "decoration" like at Bleak Falls Barrow. All in all, I suspect that I've taken the idea pretty much as far as the trigger-based concept allows, but perhaps this might actually be good enough. I'll keep testing the mod and see what happens. (Wish me luck, lol).

Populated Forts UnaggrBandits.esp

[asdfabcd]

I'm not brave enough to try this right now, but I really like the idea and want to see where it goes! (Especially if there are ways to enslave the player character or have the player character join the bandits)

[El_Duderino]

New Version Uploaded!

 

This is likely the final version of this mod (potential future bugfixes notwithstanding).

 

Removed the earlier test versions.

 

Disabled the debug message/log spam. Should be safe to update mid-playthrough from version 0.1. Don't update from earlier versions.

 

Added patch for Populated Forts, Towers, Places to make its bandits work alongside this mod. Place below the populated mods in your load order.

 

The mod is now "final". It's not everything that I intended it to be, but I think I've taken the concept as far as my skills allow. I have tested it for several weeks in an ongoing game and it appears to work fine so far. Should be safe to use in your game in a "proper" playthrough.

[Vyru]

Is Scrab's papyrus extender a hard requirement? Is powerofthree's not sufficient and can Scarb's be installed alongside it?

[El_Duderino]

3 hours ago, Vyru said:

Is Scrab's papyrus extender a hard requirement? Is powerofthree's not sufficient and can Scarb's be installed alongside it?

To be honest, I don't know. I used exactly one function from Scrab's extender for writing this mod: GetItemsByKeyword (such a wonderful thing!) That function usually from Pyramid Utils if I'm not mistaken (which is now included in Scrab's PapExtender). I don't konw if the same (identical) function is also part of powerofthree's extender.

 

In any case, does anything speak against installing Scrab's extender in your mod manager? As far as I know, these are all separate things and can be installed alongside each other without problems.

[Vyru]

57 minutes ago, El_Duderino said:

In any case, does anything speak against installing Scrab's extender in your mod manager?

No no i was just gonna ask if you happen to know if they conflict cause i've never heard of Scrab's extender before nor seen it as a requirement for anything i ever used. 

59 minutes ago, El_Duderino said:

As far as I know, these are all separate things and can be installed alongside each other without problems.

And this answered it, gonna give the mod a try, looks promising as all your stuff does. I'm about to give Ebonitium a try too... in fact i already got sent there via Simple Slavery but had to load a save before cause i had to push trough dark brotherhood quests so i can finish a little project involiving shadowmere first.