Devious Bandit Overhaul

[Fraying9981]

1 hour ago, Mashi said:

Try DBO under OBIS and see what happens.  Can't say it will or won't work,

 

You are tempting me

[Mashi]

17 hours ago, Fraying9981 said:

 

You are tempting me

 

Well if it does work, post an update. I'm taking a look at the script sources right now, but I've been busy as anything the last 4 years and this is really my first chance to play skyrim since then.

 

Boy am I drowning in mod material.

[Giga-Bool]

On 4/22/2025 at 12:13 AM, VenomousOuroboros said:

Has anyone actually tested this on Special Edition, v1.5.97?  I know you said:

 

but I draw special attention to that "No idea if..."

I installed it and created a new game (even though it said you can insert it mid-playthrough), but I believe it does not work for older versions like 1.5.97. Hell I don't even see it in my MCM. Will Update if maybe it just takes longer to install for some reason but so far it isn't playable with 1.5.97

[El_Duderino]

7 minutes ago, Giga-Bool said:

I installed it and created a new game (even though it said you can insert it mid-playthrough), but I believe it does not work for older versions like 1.5.97. Hell I don't even see it in my MCM. Will Update if maybe it just takes longer to install for some reason but so far it isn't playable with 1.5.97

Hi and thanks much for the feedback! This mod doesn't have an MCM as there are no user-configurable settings in it. You can check fairly easily if it works though:

 

1) Bandits that roam the roads/wilds should ignore you and other NPCs (except for guards, with whom they'll start a fight). Note that mod-added bandits might not be included unless they have a compatibility patch for this mod.

 

2) You should be intercepted by bandits with weapons drawn when you enter certain places. White River Watch or Halted Stream Camp in Whiterun hold are convenient places to test that.

 

The mod is very likely functioning as intended when these two things happen.

[Fraying9981]

 

can confirm this doesn't work with More Bandit Camps.

Bandits turn hostile.

 

Location: https://mapgenie.io/skyrim/maps/skyrim?locationIds=4693 Traitor's Post

version: DeviousBanditOverhaul_0.2.0

New game: no OBIS. 

But Bandit Boys Club installed (only changes gender of bandits afaik)

 

Edit:

Traitor's Post is a vanilla bandit location right? so it should work
 

Edited November 16, 2025 by Fraying9981

[El_Duderino]

2 hours ago, Fraying9981 said:

But Bandit Boys Club installed (only changes gender of bandits afaik)

Hi, I don't know this mod, but my guess is that must be editing the Actor records for the gender change. Which means that it's definitely incompatible with DBO without a patch (which merges the actor record changes).

[Fraying9981]

44 minutes ago, El_Duderino said:

Hi, I don't know this mod, but my guess is that must be editing the Actor records for the gender change. Which means that it's definitely incompatible with DBO without a patch (which merges the actor record changes).

 

I see. May i ask why there is no overwrite flagged in MO2 then?

 

Edit:

Would you confirm incompatibility with this mod?

 

 

also putting the link to Bandit Boys Club for reference

https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/68976?tab=description

 

Edit 2:

Btw, this mod which also changes bandits worked fine with bandit boys club

it's much more simplified than yours (only sex, and only if wearing devices. no dialogue), which is why I'm hoping yours work

 

 

Edited November 16, 2025 by Fraying9981

[El_Duderino]

6 minutes ago, Fraying9981 said:

I see. May i ask why there is no overwrite flagged in MO2 then?

As far as I know, MO only checks for file conflicts, but not for conflicts among the records inside the .esps. You'll need to load both mods in xEdit to check for those.

 

Thanks for the links -- if the other mod really only edits the leveled lists, they might work together, after all. The critical part of my mod are the changes to the factions and the NPCs' aggression setting (which is what makes the bandits attack almost everything that moves in vanilla Skyrim). 

[Fraying9981]

20 minutes ago, El_Duderino said:

As far as I know, MO only checks for file conflicts, but not for conflicts among the records inside the .esps. You'll need to load both mods in xEdit to check for those.

 

Thanks for the links -- if the other mod really only edits the leveled lists, they might work together, after all. The critical part of my mod are the changes to the factions and the NPCs' aggression setting (which is what makes the bandits attack almost everything that moves in vanilla Skyrim). 

 

update: I reloaded the save and did get a notification "DBO: bandits should be neutral now"

but went again to traitor's post -> they are hostile

[El_Duderino]

1 hour ago, Fraying9981 said:

update: I reloaded the save and did get a notification "DBO: bandits should be neutral now"

but went again to traitor's post -> they are hostile

I'm beginning to connect the dots here. Is that place that you're visiting? https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Skyrim:Traitor's_Post If so, then the bandits being hostile is intended. 

 

In DBO, bandits are:

-- neutral by default

-- intercept the player at select camps near the main roads or around Whiterun

-- are always hostile at the following locations (camps far away from civilization and places where I thought neutral bandits would make questing too easy, like Bleak Falls Barrow).

Spoiler

; Broken Helm Hollow
; Broken Oar Grotto
; Four Skull Lookout
; Frostmere Crypt
; Gallows Rock (Silver Hand)
; Lost Knife Hideout
; Orotheim
; Redoran's Retreat
; Rift Watchtower
; Ruins of Bthalft
; Snowpoint Beacon
; Stony Creek Cave
; Swindler's Den
; Ustengrav
; Uttering Hills Cave
; Wreck of the Winter War
; Pinewatch
; Traitor's Post
; Brinewater Grotto
; Duskglow Crevice
; Liar's Retreat
; Wolfskull Cave
; Irkngthand
; Skybound Watch Pass
; Bleak Falls Barrow
; Volkskygge
; Journeyman's Nook
; Bannermist Towers
; Skybound Underhang

 

[Fraying9981]

19 minutes ago, El_Duderino said:

I'm beginning to connect the dots here. Is that place that you're visiting? https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Skyrim:Traitor's_Post If so, then the bandits being hostile is intended. 

 

In DBO, bandits are:

-- neutral by default

-- intercept the player at select camps near the main roads or around Whiterun

-- are always hostile at the following locations (camps far away from civilization and places where I thought neutral bandits would make questing too easy, like Bleak Falls Barrow).

  Reveal hidden contents

; Broken Helm Hollow
; Broken Oar Grotto
; Four Skull Lookout
; Frostmere Crypt
; Gallows Rock (Silver Hand)
; Lost Knife Hideout
; Orotheim
; Redoran's Retreat
; Rift Watchtower
; Ruins of Bthalft
; Snowpoint Beacon
; Stony Creek Cave
; Swindler's Den
; Ustengrav
; Uttering Hills Cave
; Wreck of the Winter War
; Pinewatch
; Traitor's Post
; Brinewater Grotto
; Duskglow Crevice
; Liar's Retreat
; Wolfskull Cave
; Irkngthand
; Skybound Watch Pass
; Bleak Falls Barrow
; Volkskygge
; Journeyman's Nook
; Bannermist Towers
; Skybound Underhang

 

 

yeah it's that place. thanks so much for your review, tbh I picked the first bandit place I could find to test your mod after spawning in windhelm.

 

I understand there is a blacklist, makes sense. so your mod probably works with levelled lists. good news!

Probably will not make "more bandit camps" bandits neutral then, since its location based.

 

Now, may i ask if these blacklisted locations are a big chunk of vanilla bandit locations? in other terms, how likely is it that when I meet a bandit he will be neutral with your mod (roughly)?

 

Would you be able to give me some coc to bandit camps to try, if it's more relevant to test your mod?

Edited November 16, 2025 by Fraying9981

[El_Duderino]

1 hour ago, Fraying9981 said:

I understand there is a blacklist, makes sense. so your mod probably works with levelled lists. good news!

Probably will not make "more bandit camps" bandits neutral then, since its location based

Yeah, edited leveled list should co-exist just fine with my mod. However, there is one caveat: this only works for leveled lists that use exclusively vanilla bandit NPCs or leveled actors. Any mod that adds new bandit NPCs will most likely be ignored by my mod (which means that those bandits will very likely be hostile by default). The same caveat is true for location mods. 

 

Populated Skyrim is a good example here: This mod adds a bunch of new bandits NPCs which all attack on sight. Those new NPCs in Populated get added to the vanilla locations which my mod tries to "pacify" -- but when the player enters there, the Populated NPCs will attack the player, and then the "pacified" vanilla NPCs will join the fight because they're in the same faction as the Populated bandits (and thus support each other in battle).

 

That, in a nutshell, is why my mod is such a nightmare for compatibility. It's just too invasive.

 

1 hour ago, Fraying9981 said:

Now, may i ask if these blacklisted locations are a big chunk of vanilla bandit locations? in other terms, how likely is it that when I meet a bandit he will be neutral with your mod (roughly)?

The locations above are the entire list of where bandits with my mod will attack the player on sight. However, once in battle, ALL bandits will be hostile, even at the pacified locations. That's why I left that "bandits are neutral again" message in the mod, to notify the player when the coast is clear again after a skirmish with some bandits.

 

Anywhere else on the map, (vanilla) bandits will completely ignore the player and even most other, non-guard NPCs. The list below has all the locations where the bandits will intercept the player and demand a toll. 

Spoiler

; 01 = Cracked Tusk Keep
; 02 = Cragslane Cavern
; 03 = Embershard Mine
; 04 = Faldar's Tooth
; 05 = Fort Fellhammer
; 06 = Knifepoint Ridge
; 07 = Treva's Watch
; 08 = White River Watch
; 09 = Bilegulch Mine
; 10 = Fort Greymoor
; 11 = Fort Dunstad
; 12 = Halted Stream Camp
; 13 = Fort Greenwall
; 14 = Fort Hraggstad
; 20 = Robber's Gorge
; 22 = Silent Moons Camp
; 29 = Valtheim Towers

 

[Fraying9981]

19 minutes ago, El_Duderino said:

Populated Skyrim is a good example here: This mod adds a bunch of new bandits NPCs which all attack on sight. Those new NPCs in Populated get added to the vanilla locations which my mod tries to "pacify" -- but when the player enters there, the Populated NPCs will attack the player, and then the "pacified" vanilla NPCs will join the fight because they're in the same faction as the Populated bandits (and thus support each other in battle).

 

That, in a nutshell, is why my mod is such a nightmare for compatibility. It's just too invasive.

 

Thanks a lot! really helpful to understand the situation.

 

tbh, I'm sure a lot of people would want to try your mod. For example in my case, the reason why I want to try it is to combine it with Skyrimnet which puts a LLM behind each character. This way, I can get a more realistic option of talking to bandits before being attacked/assaulted.

From there (if you still have faith  ), you could have a different module for forsworn, etc. it would be so immersive to enjoy the right chemistry of agressivity for each faction like you did for bandits, combined with the AI mod I mentioned, because this is what would happen IRL = criminals/evil people dont straight up assault you

 

Btw, just tried DBO on halted stream camp, it seems to work with masculinized levelled list! So I guess you may be a bit conservative about the term incompatible. It works fine, the only caveat is to not add bandits to the game imo, which breaks the immersion, but does not crash (which was my fear).

 

 

Edited November 16, 2025 by Fraying9981

[Fraying9981]

On 10/29/2025 at 7:32 PM, Mashi said:

 

Well if it does work, post an update. I'm taking a look at the script sources right now, but I've been busy as anything the last 4 years and this is really my first chance to play skyrim since then.

 

Boy am I drowning in mod material.

 

So bottom line is it might not kill your game but will make DBO irrelevant. As explained by OP above: OBIS adds bandits so will likely mix OBIS hostile bandits with DBO pacified bandits, therefore you will just get hostile bandits and probably never the DBO behavior. 

This mod made me figure out that actually OBIS/any mods adding bandits like SD as well are not so great. They just add damage sponge enemies and create the effect that you will be overwhelmed no matter what. Its not very interesting.
If you enjoy being overwhelmed, then keep vanilla bandits and just dont fight: its quicker, less laggy, less buggy.

 

On the contrary DBO adds some real gameplay loop that imo is superior and interesting in its own way.

[Mardor, Vixen and Cheese]

So I wrote a simple Skypatcher that lowers the aggression of bandit NPCs added by Deadly Wenches and Full Random NPC Pack. Initial testing suggest this works... but there may still be unforeseen problems. Feel free to use these as an example of how to lower aggression of NPCs added by other mods end such.

DBO Aggro Skypatcher for Deadly Wenches & Full Random NPC Pack.zip

[Fraying9981]

troubleshoot:

dialogue unavailable + bandits not turning hostile after hitting them

version: DeviousBanditOverhaul_0.2.0

no OBIS, no other bandit mod installed except devious bandit captives. i have conquest of skyrim.

male PC

location: robber's gorge

 

 

 

[El_Duderino]

Hi and thanks,

 

21 hours ago, Fraying9981 said:

dialogue unavailable + bandits not turning hostile after hitting them

I had that happen once or twice in my tests, too. I think it got caused by the approach scene stalling, but I'm not sure. There should be a fallback that triggers combat if the approach times out, but maybe this doesn't cause all possible ways for this to happen. 

 

Other mods may also impact this logic by raising the hit count threshold for neutral NPCs (I think some mods do that to prevent neutrals aggroing when taking friendly fire from magic casting followers, or similar Skyrim shenanigans). While their aliases for the approach scene are filled, the bandits listen to OnCombatStateChanged, but critically not OnHit events (i.e., they only enter combat once the times-hit threshold has been exceeded).

 

Edit: Oh! And I've just realized that this was at Robber's Gorge, which is one of the two vanilla toll places that I tried to keep intact. It's easily possible that this attempt broke DBO's own functionality at those locations (Robber's Gorge and Valtheim).

Edited December 20, 2025 by El_Duderino

[Fraying9981]

46 minutes ago, El_Duderino said:

Edit: Oh! And I've just realized that this was at Robber's Gorge, which is one of the two vanilla toll places that I tried to keep intact. It's easily possible that this attempt broke DBO's own functionality at those locations (Robber's Gorge and Valtheim).

 

thank you! alright, then yeah it should be fine in other locations. no worries. the mod is great :)

[El_Duderino]

5 hours ago, Fraying9981 said:

then yeah it should be fine in other locations.

Ah, we spoke too soon... I've just verified it in my game; this is indeed a global bug (or rather, error in the mod's concept). I can walk up to any of the neutral bandits in my game and kill them by sinking one arrow after the other into them. I don't know what my friendly fire thresholds are, but they're clearly higher than what it takes them to get killed by some arrows.

 

Edit: Based on your important discovery and my own experience with the mod in my current playthrough, I've added the following warning to the mod page.

 

Known Issues

 

The two biggest known issues to date are:

 

1) All the neutral bandits will react like ordinary citizen NPCs when getting hit by you or your followers. In other words, they'll regard the initial hits as "friendly fire", which often means that you can kill them one after the other with a few well aimed shots or hits and none of the other bandits in the area will even lift a finger. Note that this only applies to the neutral bandits, not those that engage you in a "toll" extortion dialogue or which are always hostile to you.

 

2) I missed some bandit locations that are used in (radiant or story) quests when deciding which to make hostile. For example, some of the ship wrecks along the Sea of Ghosts. As it stands, you can just waltz into those places, take what you need or kill whom you got sent to kill and none of the other bandits around will give a damn. 

Edited December 20, 2025 by El_Duderino

[Fraying9981]

45 minutes ago, El_Duderino said:

Ah, we spoke too soon... I've just verified it in my game; this is indeed a global bug (or rather, error in the mod's concept). I can walk up to any of the neutral bandits in my game and kill them by sinking one arrow after the other into them. I don't know what my friendly fire thresholds are, but they're clearly higher than what it takes them to get killed by some arrows.

 

Edit: Based on your important discovery and my own experience with the mod in my current playthrough, I've added the following warning to the mod page.

 

Known Issues

 

The two biggest known issues to date are:

 

1) All the neutral bandits will react like ordinary citizen NPCs when getting hit by you or your followers. In other words, they'll regard the initial hits as "friendly fire", which often means that you can kill them one after the other with a few well aimed shots or hits and none of the other bandits in the area will even lift a finger. Note that this only applies to the neutral bandits, not those that engage you in a "toll" extortion dialogue or which are always hostile to you.

 

2) I missed some bandit locations that are used in (radiant or story) quests when deciding which to make hostile. For example, some of the ship wrecks along the Sea of Ghosts. As it stands, you can just waltz into those places, take what you need or kill whom you got sent to kill and none of the other bandits around will give a damn. 

 

Its exactly whats happening! I can kill them one by one they dont react.

 

So moving forward im not sure i got it right: it happens only in robbers gorge and the other locatiob you mentioned right? Because there is no bandit "leader" coming to collect the toll?

 

Btw im saying it again: your mod has crazy potential. With mods like skyrimnet for example to bargain with bandits

[El_Duderino]

11 hours ago, Fraying9981 said:

im not sure i got it right: it happens only in robbers gorge and the other locatiob you mentioned right?

Alas, no, it's the opposite. The bandits waiting patiently to get killed is their (unintended) default behaviour by this mod. The only places where they react is in those hand-picked locations that have the extortion scene from this mod, or if they are temporarily hostile to the player faction-wide (for example, after entering one of the always-hostile trigger boxes or failing a negotiation).

 

You can easily replicate the "wait to get killed" thing by walking up to any group of bandits in an untreated location and starting shooting at one of them. So for example, the bandits lingering at the Orphan's Tear shipwreck (on the coast quite some ways northwest of Solitude) or any of the traveling bandits added by mods as long as they're compatible.

 

11 hours ago, Fraying9981 said:

your mod has crazy potential

Thanks, I appreciate that, but there are also insane flaws in the execution (as just proven, lol) and also concept. The whole approach to use a static system with tons of vanilla overrides the trigger boxes is just way too clumsy and inflexible. The only way to make this work is most likely to use a dynamic/situational system (kinda like Deviously Helpless on steriods), but I don't know how to make that work without creating a performance-munching Papyrus monster (heck, I don't even know how to code that as a performance-munching Papyrus monster.)

[shadson]

Okay, thats rly interesting. What about make it like in gothic 3 the rebels, so bandits are a faction who want to sabotage the citys and giving quests for that? And for me it would be essential if i kill one of the neutral bandits they all going hostile against the player. And maybe quests from jarls to kill those bandits, so choice thingy.

Edited January 9 by shadson

[VaCR]

Ahh, I wish we had something like that without DD dependency...

[Plaguetard2.0]

So, I've got quite a bit into a game, and everything was working fine... until I made it to Treva's Watch. I saw that is one of the listed places by this mod, but the issue seems to be that I see the dialogue come across they want to talk to my PC, but when they come up, no conversation happens. If I try to talk to them, they go into hostile pose, don't attack the PC, but wander around looking for the 'threat' which seems to be me. 

 

Oddly, after leaving this location, now ALL bandits refuse to turn hostile, no matter how many times I hit them, even with fists. I'm guessing it is because the script for this mod is triggering, and somehow hanging? I do get the text that all DBO hostiles have become neutral, and they put their weapons away, but then it just rinses and repeats.

 

I've tried removing this mod, and yet, alas, the Treva's Watch bandits don't seem to revert back to normal, and as I've tested it it seems I have to make sure to stay far away from Treva's Watch in order to ensure this mod doesn't trigger anyways. May have to remove and do a restart and see what happens without the mod in a new playthrough and see if there is some other mod conflicting with this one

[El_Duderino]

On 2/15/2026 at 4:26 PM, Plaguetard2.0 said:

...

Thanks much for the feedback. I'll inspect Treva's Watch to see if I can replicate this. Maybe the game is treating them differently in a way that clashes with this mod.

 

As for random bandits not turning hostile, I'm afraid that is expected behaviour with the mod. A known issue. This is because of the bandits all having lowered aggression, which makes them act like ordinary citizen NPCs and largely ignore being attacked by the player. This gets even more pronounced when you have mods that make neutral NPCs more forgiving to friendly fire.

 

I'm not sure if uninstalling the mod can revert the bandits' aggression, etc., to vanilla values or if these get baked into your savegame once they have been changed.