Theory of Stupidity

[Darkpig]

I never saw the appeal of police video recordings. I don't need recordings to know most people are stupid.

 

Edit: Let me rephrase that last sentence. Why bother with police recordings when I only need to go outside to see people acting stupid?

Edited May 16, 2025 by Darkpig

[Count Chocula]

11 hours ago, woodsman30 said:

Did you watch the video at all? If you did you would not have wrote this.

 

Hate to burst your bubble but it was long before that well over 100 years ago sad to say read and research learn the progression nothing happens overnight.

It ought to be pretty clear from my wording that I did not watch the video.

 

And what are you even trying to say with your second sentence? Punctuation is your friend.

[Algarinor]

Funny to see this topic now, when you know that this is question on philophical text 3000 years ago.
Just the impression that people, when they get older, think that all they learn they was already knowing it when thez born, and so young are stupid beacause they don't born with natural knowledge.

You are just more old than before.

[Grey Cloud]

 

 

On 5/14/2025 at 9:17 PM, legendarytoyou said:

Uh here you want more proof that some people are to stupid for certain tasks.  Here you go.  Hope this guy sued the ever living hell out of them for gross negligence.

😲😒

"TheCivilRightsLawyer.com" plastered across the video and the guy with the camera has 'access all areas' in the police station.

Any police officer with half a brain would just phoned the guy doctor or pulled the info from a computer.

Edited May 16, 2025 by Grey Cloud

[Grey Cloud]

1 hour ago, Algarinor said:

when you know that this is question on philophical text 3000 years ago.

What text would that be?

 

1 hour ago, Algarinor said:

Just the impression that people, when they get older, think that all they learn they was already knowing it when thez born, and so young are stupid beacause they don't born with natural knowledge.

I'm 67 and do not know one person of any age who thinks that "they was already knowing it when thez born". Babies are born with natural knowledge.

 

1 hour ago, Algarinor said:

You are just more old than before.

One is also more experienced than before.

[Grey Cloud]

On 5/15/2025 at 6:03 AM, 竹柏影 said:

I don't know about other countries, but I can tell you for sure that the IQ of Americans has plummeted since Obama came to power. Go check out "its" "reform" of American education.

How can you tell us for sure?

Can you show us a direct causal link between Obama' administration and the plummeting of American IQ scores?

Why is an IQ score the measure of stupidity, or lack thereof? One does not need any knowledge of history, geography, politics or philosophy to achieve a high IQ score.

Who is this 'its' and what is its 'reform'?

Do you think a copy of the Decalogue in every classroom and renaming the Gulf of Mexico to the Gulf of America will help rectify the situation?

 

Edited May 16, 2025 by Grey Cloud

[Count Chocula]

3 hours ago, Algarinor said:

Funny to see this topic now, when you know that this is question on philophical text 3000 years ago.
Just the impression that people, when they get older, think that all they learn they was already knowing it when thez born, and so young are stupid beacause they don't born with natural knowledge.

You are just more old than before.

If you are saying that people have said, for the entire time there have been people, that people are getting more stupid, that is the case. People said that 20 years ago, 50, 100, 50,000 years ago, I have no doubt.

[porkybork]

2 hours ago, chocula said:

If you are saying that people have said, for the entire time there have been people, that people are getting more stupid, that is the case. People said that 20 years ago, 50, 100, 50,000 years ago, I have no doubt.

Reminds me of when older folks complain about the younger generations destroying the world, as if older people haven’t been complaining about the youth since forever ago. Socrates spoke of the youth in his day thusly:

 

“Our youth love luxury.  They have bad manners and despise authority.  They show disrespect for their elders and love to chatter instead of exercise.  Young people are now tyrants, not the servants of their household.  They no longer rise when their elders enter the room.  They contradict their parents, chatter before company, gobble up food and terrorize their teachers.”
 

This was dated back to around 400 BCE.

[Count Chocula]

No doubt old people have been telling young people to get off the lawn since the invention of lawns.

[竹柏影]

On 5/15/2025 at 1:58 PM, chocula said:

What is your conclusion based on?

George W. Bush👉NCLB

 

1. Significant improvement in math scores ‌
‌Primary school (4th grade):
From 2003 to 2009, the average math score rose from 235 to 240 (NAEP 500-point system), reaching a historical peak. The improvement of low-income families and African-American students was higher than the national average.
‌Junior high school (8th grade):
From 278 to 283 during the same period, but the improvement rate was slower than that of elementary school.
‌2. Slight improvement in reading scores ‌
‌4th grade reading: From 2002 to 2009, the average score rose from 219 to 221, and African-American and Latino students narrowed the gap with white students.
‌8th grade reading: basically the same (263 points → 264 points), with no obvious improvement.

 

‌PISA Test‌:
From 2003 to 2018, the global ranking of 15-year-old American students in mathematics, science and reading has always been in the middle (between 25th and 38th in mathematics).
‌TIMSS Test‌:
Grade 4 mathematics has improved slightly (1995: 518 points → 2019: 539 points), but still lags behind Asian countries such as Singapore and South Korea.

 

Obama👉ESSA

 

1. Math scores: first rise, then fall ‌
‌Short-term rise (2009-2013)‌:

The average math score in the fourth grade rose from 240 (2009) to 242 (2013), and the eighth grade rose from 283 to 285 (NAEP 500-point system).
Low-income and minority students have made significant progress, such as the Latino fourth-grade math passing rate increased by 5%.

‌Long-term decline (2013-2017)‌:

The fourth-grade math score dropped to 240 (2017), and the eighth grade dropped to 283, returning to the end of NCLB.
‌2. Reading scores: basically stagnant ‌
The average reading score in the fourth grade remained at 221-223 (2009-2017), and the eighth grade dropped slightly from 264 to 263.
The reading gap between African-American and white students narrowed by only 2 points (25 points → 23 points), and the progress was limited.
‌3. Increased high school graduation rate‌
The national high school graduation rate increased from 78.2% in 2010 to 84.1% in 2016 (the highest in history), with a greater increase for ethnic minorities (e.g., Latinos from 71% to 79%).

 

‌PISA Test (2012-2018)‌:

American 15-year-old students maintain a mid-range ranking in mathematics, science, and reading (math 2018 37th/79 countries).
Science has improved slightly (497 points in 2012 → 502 points in 2018), but mathematics has declined (481 points → 478 points).
‌TIMSS elementary school mathematics (2011-2019)‌:

Grade 4 mathematics dropped from 541 points (2011) to 539 points (2019), surpassed by more countries (such as South Korea and Japan, both over 600 points).

 

It is worth noting that although Obama's reforms increased high school graduation rates, the problem was that he lowered the standards.

[竹柏影]

8 hours ago, Grey Cloud said:

How can you tell us for sure?

Can you show us a direct causal link between Obama' administration and the plummeting of American IQ scores?

Why is an IQ score the measure of stupidity, or lack thereof? One does not need any knowledge of history, geography, politics or philosophy to achieve a high IQ score.

Who is this 'its' and what is its 'reform'?

Do you think a copy of the Decalogue in every classroom and renaming the Gulf of Mexico to the Gulf of America will help rectify the situation?

 

1. "Why is an IQ score the measure of stupidity, or lack thereof? One does not need any knowledge of history, geography, politics or philosophy to achieve a high IQ score." People who can't even do basic math calculations correctly are obviously below the human average😥
2. "Who is this 'its' and what is its 'reform'?" Why can't I call him that? He should be the president of South Africa😁
3. "Do you think a copy of the Decalogue in every classroom and renaming the Gulf of Mexico to the Gulf of America will help rectify the situation?" American students' geography will obviously not improve just because all the place names in the world have "America", even if they are "rednecks"🥱

[竹柏影]

22 hours ago, woodsman30 said:

Hate to burst your bubble but it was long before that well over 100 years ago sad to say read and research learn the progression nothing happens overnight.

What happens over a few years can tell a lot.

[Darkpig]

26 minutes ago, 竹柏影 said:

George W. Bush👉NCLB

 

‌PISA Test‌:

‌TIMSS Test‌:

 

Obama👉ESSA

 

‌PISA Test (2012-2018)‌:

‌TIMSS elementary school mathematics (2011-2019)‌:

Abbreviating everything makes a person sound lazy and dumb. Use actual words.

 

Edit: Also TIMSS sounds like a clothing brand.

Edited May 17, 2025 by Darkpig

[Count Chocula]

1 hour ago, 竹柏影 said:

Spoiler

George W. Bush👉NCLB

 

1. Significant improvement in math scores ‌
‌Primary school (4th grade):
From 2003 to 2009, the average math score rose from 235 to 240 (NAEP 500-point system), reaching a historical peak. The improvement of low-income families and African-American students was higher than the national average.
‌Junior high school (8th grade):
From 278 to 283 during the same period, but the improvement rate was slower than that of elementary school.
‌2. Slight improvement in reading scores ‌
‌4th grade reading: From 2002 to 2009, the average score rose from 219 to 221, and African-American and Latino students narrowed the gap with white students.
‌8th grade reading: basically the same (263 points → 264 points), with no obvious improvement.

 

‌PISA Test‌:
From 2003 to 2018, the global ranking of 15-year-old American students in mathematics, science and reading has always been in the middle (between 25th and 38th in mathematics).
‌TIMSS Test‌:
Grade 4 mathematics has improved slightly (1995: 518 points → 2019: 539 points), but still lags behind Asian countries such as Singapore and South Korea.

 

Obama👉ESSA

 

1. Math scores: first rise, then fall ‌
‌Short-term rise (2009-2013)‌:

The average math score in the fourth grade rose from 240 (2009) to 242 (2013), and the eighth grade rose from 283 to 285 (NAEP 500-point system).
Low-income and minority students have made significant progress, such as the Latino fourth-grade math passing rate increased by 5%.

‌Long-term decline (2013-2017)‌:

The fourth-grade math score dropped to 240 (2017), and the eighth grade dropped to 283, returning to the end of NCLB.
‌2. Reading scores: basically stagnant ‌
The average reading score in the fourth grade remained at 221-223 (2009-2017), and the eighth grade dropped slightly from 264 to 263.
The reading gap between African-American and white students narrowed by only 2 points (25 points → 23 points), and the progress was limited.
‌3. Increased high school graduation rate‌
The national high school graduation rate increased from 78.2% in 2010 to 84.1% in 2016 (the highest in history), with a greater increase for ethnic minorities (e.g., Latinos from 71% to 79%).

 

‌PISA Test (2012-2018)‌:

American 15-year-old students maintain a mid-range ranking in mathematics, science, and reading (math 2018 37th/79 countries).
Science has improved slightly (497 points in 2012 → 502 points in 2018), but mathematics has declined (481 points → 478 points).
‌TIMSS elementary school mathematics (2011-2019)‌:

Grade 4 mathematics dropped from 541 points (2011) to 539 points (2019), surpassed by more countries (such as South Korea and Japan, both over 600 points).

 

It is worth noting that although Obama's reforms increased high school graduation rates, the problem was that he lowered the standards.

 

Why do you characterize 2009-2013 as a "short-term rise" and 2013-2017 as a "long-term decline?"

 

The numbers you rely on are mixed and don't show any strong evidence of overall academic decline during the Obama years. More telling, you put this, "Grade 4 mathematics has improved slightly (1995: 518 points → 2019: 539 points), but still lags behind Asian countries such as Singapore and South Korea" under your G.W. Bush heading. 1995-2019 spans Clinton, Bush, Obama and Trump.

 

I have no reason to dispute your numbers, just your conclusions. Furthermore, if one of your conclusions (and I'm not sure it is; I'll let you clarify that, if you are inclined) is that No Child Left Behind was "good," there's more than one article saying it's not, or at least not all good. This one, for example, https://edpolicy.stanford.edu/library/blog/873.html

 

EDIT: Anecdotally, I remember talking to a few teaches who expressed frustration with NCLB because the pressure was on to "teach to the test" rather than "teach."

Edited May 17, 2025 by chocula

[Grey Cloud]

3 hours ago, chocula said:

Anecdotally, I remember talking to a few teaches who expressed frustration with NCLB because the pressure was on to "teach to the test" rather than "teach."

We had the same thing over here with SARS tests. When I worked in IT in schools I witnessed a meeting of teachers to finagle the results to make the school look better.

 

 

9 hours ago, porkybork said:

Reminds me of when older folks complain about the younger generations destroying the world, as if older people haven’t been complaining about the youth since forever ago. Socrates spoke of the youth in his day thusly:

 

“Our youth love luxury.  They have bad manners and despise authority.  They show disrespect for their elders and love to chatter instead of exercise.  Young people are now tyrants, not the servants of their household.  They no longer rise when their elders enter the room.  They contradict their parents, chatter before company, gobble up food and terrorize their teachers.”
 

This was dated back to around 400 BCE.

https://quoteinvestigator.com/2010/05/01/misbehave/

 

It would have been Plato as Socrates did write down anything.

 

 

4 hours ago, 竹柏影 said:

People who can't even do basic math calculations correctly are obviously below the human average

1. That's not not quite how averages work and doesn't really answer my question.

2. That is not remotely funny or worth responding to.

3. I didn't mention improving geography knowledge. Anyone who thinks that unilaterally renaming an international body of water is going to change anything is a fool. As for the Decalogue, why not go whole hog and use the 42 Negative Confessions from the Laws of Ma'at in the Egyptian Book of the Dead. See also the 42 Positive Affirmations.

https://www.egyptconnection.com/42-laws-of-maat/

[woodsman30]

6 hours ago, 竹柏影 said:

What happens over a few years can tell a lot.

1913 creation of the federal reserve

Tariff act 1930 contributing factor to the depression

1947 NSA act passed created the alphabet gang

1969-1973 a whole host of labor laws and wages issues

1980's Reaganomics

1970-1990 de-industrialization of the USA see above

2001 not going into it

2001-2005 patriot act took away a lot from the peoples rights/freedoms 

2005 housing act result 2008 housing market crash

2016- current Shit show of a epic scale cannot go into against site guild lines

 

This is just a small list and all well documented I will not go into any of these as I am just citing history.  Going into more than this maybe construed as breaking site rules. Given this time line people have been stupid for a long time before the education act.... frogs and a pan come to mind.

 

 

 

[woodsman30]

19 hours ago, chocula said:

And what are you even trying to say with your second sentence? Punctuation is your friend.

sleep is a friend as well 70 plus hour work weeks do that to you

[竹柏影]

On 5/17/2025 at 1:17 PM, Darkpig said:

Abbreviating everything makes a person sound lazy and dumb. Use actual words.

 

Edit: Also TIMSS sounds like a clothing brand.

My fault.

NCLB👉No Child Left Behind Act

ESSA👉Every Student Succeeds Act

[竹柏影]

On 5/17/2025 at 2:26 PM, chocula said:

Why do you characterize 2009-2013 as a "short-term rise" and 2013-2017 as a "long-term decline?"

 

The numbers you rely on are mixed and don't show any strong evidence of overall academic decline during the Obama years. More telling, you put this, "Grade 4 mathematics has improved slightly (1995: 518 points → 2019: 539 points), but still lags behind Asian countries such as Singapore and South Korea" under your G.W. Bush heading. 1995-2019 spans Clinton, Bush, Obama and Trump.

 

I have no reason to dispute your numbers, just your conclusions. Furthermore, if one of your conclusions (and I'm not sure it is; I'll let you clarify that, if you are inclined) is that No Child Left Behind was "good," there's more than one article saying it's not, or at least not all good. This one, for example, https://edpolicy.stanford.edu/library/blog/873.html

 

EDIT: Anecdotally, I remember talking to a few teaches who expressed frustration with NCLB because the pressure was on to "teach to the test" rather than "teach."

This is a very interesting question. In fact, this is the data I asked AI to check.😫

Teachers' dissatisfaction with "teach to the test" (at least in my opinion) is simply because they are under more pressure.

In the end, I think this is just a difference in educational philosophy. I personally prefer NCLB.

[竹柏影]

20 hours ago, Grey Cloud said:

1. That's not not quite how averages work and doesn't really answer my question.

2. That is not remotely funny or worth responding to.

3. I didn't mention improving geography knowledge. Anyone who thinks that unilaterally renaming an international body of water is going to change anything is a fool. As for the Decalogue, why not go whole hog and use the 42 Negative Confessions from the Laws of Ma'at in the Egyptian Book of the Dead. See also the 42 Positive Affirmations.

https://www.egyptconnection.com/42-laws-of-maat/

First of all, I want to clarify that when I say "basic math calculations", I mean addition, subtraction, multiplication and division within ten.
Then I am just a little bit unbelievable, so my words are a bit sharp. I apologize.
Finally, I am an atheist, and I implore you to stop talking about Decalogue.

[竹柏影]

18 hours ago, woodsman30 said:

1913 creation of the federal reserve

Tariff act 1930 contributing factor to the depression

1947 NSA act passed created the alphabet gang

1969-1973 a whole host of labor laws and wages issues

1980's Reaganomics

1970-1990 de-industrialization of the USA see above

2001 not going into it

2001-2005 patriot act took away a lot from the peoples rights/freedoms 

2005 housing act result 2008 housing market crash

2016- current Shit show of a epic scale cannot go into against site guild lines

 

This is just a small list and all well documented I will not go into any of these as I am just citing history.  Going into more than this maybe construed as breaking site rules. Given this time line people have been stupid for a long time before the education act.... frogs and a pan come to mind.

 

 

 

Sorry I don't quite understand what you mean (stupid😫)

[Count Chocula]

20 minutes ago, 竹柏影 said:

This is a very interesting question. In fact, this is the data I asked AI to check.😫

Teachers' dissatisfaction with "teach to the test" (at least in my opinion) is simply because they are under more pressure.

In the end, I think this is just a difference in educational philosophy. I personally prefer NCLB.

If you did some of that with AI, no wonder some of it does not make sense.

 

We can't get to "difference in philosophy" until we decide whether or not NCLB encourages teachers to "teach to the test." If it does, I say that's bad. Teaching to the test throws learning out the window in favor of getting higher scores on standardized tests. One issue at the time was that one of the purposes of NCLB was to enrich the Bush family. https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm-2006-oct-22-na-ignite22-story.html EDIT: Which illustrates the larger problem in general of for-profit education.

Edited May 18, 2025 by chocula

[woodsman30]

55 minutes ago, 竹柏影 said:

Sorry I don't quite understand what you mean (stupid😫)

All of these was passed with little or no opposition all are not good for the people in general most have had severe ramification. Stupid is just what I said there is no push back because people are to stupid to see a long term picture.  If you do not understand I get it.  To really know about those topics takes a lot of time and research and I am not talking just what google says.  

[Grey Cloud]

On 5/18/2025 at 8:11 AM, 竹柏影 said:

First of all, I want to clarify that when I say "basic math calculations", I mean addition, subtraction, multiplication and division within ten.
Then I am just a little bit unbelievable, so my words are a bit sharp. I apologize.
Finally, I am an atheist, and I implore you to stop talking about Decalogue.

None of that addresses anything.

Edited May 19, 2025 by Grey Cloud

[竹柏影]

18 hours ago, Grey Cloud said:

Not of that addresses anything.

People really laugh when they are extremely speechless.