starfield Working around the space suit cockblock to happy fun time

[Miauzi]

Vor 6 Minuten sagte Halstrom:

Was auch immer Ihr Haken ist, wir reden hier trotzdem immer noch von Raumanzügen ...

 

ich auch ... nämlich was alles NICHT mit diesen Raumanzügen funktioniert im Spiel 

?

[Halstrom]

1 hour ago, DocClox said:

 

That does indeed sound like Piers Anthony. He always had this way of writing about great and terrible events with the sort of light and humerous touch you'd normally reserve for reporting on a church picnic.

 

Yeah, the story was called "Up Schist Creek", I can't find it online anymore. Guy breaks down, discovers a little hick town where everyone roots like rabbits because the suits protect them from all sexual issues. He gets fitted with one himself then want's to leave and share the suits with the world, but realises he can't remove the suit.

 

Edited October 14, 2023 by Halstrom

[DocClox]

I had a quick peek at the spacesuits last night uisingSF1Edit. It looks as though the arms, legs and torso are separate items, which is interesting.

 

[edit]

 

Looked again. It's just the AA records. The armor recs are helmet. pack and suit as you'd expect.

 

 

Legs and sleeves seem to be the same as boots and gloves in Skyrim. I wonder which record holds the body mesh in SF.

 

I also wonder if we can do things with the patch and torso details records.

 

Edited November 6, 2023 by DocClox

[IBAGadget]

On 10/10/2023 at 1:01 AM, DocClox said:

Probably want to give our heroine some way off the rock that she's on as well. Maybe a crappy shuttle like the one you use use escaping from the Lock. No weapons, no shields to speak of, but it'll let you jump out to (hopefully) safety where you can swap the shuttle out for your usual ship.

One problem with this, is that if you have more crew than the new ship has space for, you will lose anyone you've hired. Constellation members are easy to get back, but paid crew disappear - I had this happen when I had two hired crew on my ship, then went on the Mantis quest. As soon as I took off in the Razorleaf, my paid crew vanished.

 

Quote

Posted 2 hours ago (edite

 

 

I also wonder if we can do things with the patch and torso details records.

As far as patch records, yes. There are already mods out that change the patch details on a couple different spacesuits. I'm running one that replaces the Constellation Patch on the Mark I with a NASA Patch.

Edited November 6, 2023 by IBAGadget

[Mr. Otaku]

21 minutes ago, IBAGadget said:

but paid crew disappear - I had this happen when I had two hired crew on my ship, then went on the Mantis quest. As soon as I took off in the Razorleaf, my paid crew vanished.

We're gonna need a follower framework type mod to prevent this i think, like setting a home location for them so if they stop following you for any reason or you dismiss them then that's where they'll go. I don't think it's likely for Bethesda to make a patch for it tbh lol.

 

2 hours ago, DocClox said:

I wonder which record holds the body mesh in SF.

If i understand you correctly, it has to be the torso one right? In Skyrim and Fallout 4 that's the part that holds the body mesh unless i'm totally misunderstanding what you mean. I'm kind of an idiot when it comes to modding lol.

[DocClox]

14 hours ago, Mr. Otaku said:

 

If i understand you correctly, it has to be the torso one right? In Skyrim and Fallout 4 that's the part that holds the body mesh unless i'm totally misunderstanding what you mean. I'm kind of an idiot when it comes to modding lol.

 In Fallout 4 it was in the shoes, for some reason. That's why I had different recommended shoe mods for RRS. There wasn't a body mesh inside the tank tops, so if you had the tops built to a different body shape to nrmal, they clipped horribly. Add a pair of bodyslid shoes and the tops fitted just fine, so long as the shoes were also worn.

 

Weird as hell way to do it, but there it is.

Edited November 7, 2023 by DocClox
Spelling! And phrased things a little better.

[Reigor]

7 hours ago, Mr. Otaku said:

We're gonna need a follower framework type mod to prevent this i think, like setting a home location for them so if they stop following you for any reason or you dismiss them then that's where they'll go. I don't think it's likely for Bethesda to make a patch for it tbh lol.

 

 

Well this looks like the start of that.

 

Swiftly Order Squad - Multiple Followers - Group Commands at Starfield Nexus - Mods and Community (nexusmods.com)

[DocClox]

I think I'm going to give this naked spacesuit thing a go.

 

Has anyone noticed any cute boots or gloves in the game that I might lift for a mashup? Everyone seems to be wearing extremely practical wellie boots for some reason.

[Mr. Otaku]

On 11/7/2023 at 12:44 AM, DocClox said:

Weird as hell way to do it, but there it is.

Yeah that is really fucking weird, i guess i never noticed this since i don't have many custom outfits for Fallout 4 outside the the usual skimpy overhaul so i batch built everything all at once. Lets hope Starfield is more sensible about it, but then again they also thought it's a good idea to put the active data folder in documents/my games folder so who knows atp lmao.

[Reigor]

On 11/7/2023 at 9:11 AM, DocClox said:

Has anyone noticed any cute boots or gloves in the game that I might lift for a mashup? Everyone seems to be wearing extremely practical wellie boots for some reason

 

Best form fitting spacesuit I have seen so far is the Mark 1 in the Lodge's basement. Andreja's boots are fairly cute. 

 

There are also spicy outfits that modders are putting out as well. 

 

Vtaw Miranda V0.2 at Starfield Nexus - Mods and Community (nexusmods.com)

[DocClox]

OK. Just a first cut here

 

 

I deleted the torso and the torso detail parts of the armor record, and then I pasted in a body. I copied the one from theenco's The Dress mod on nexus, because I knew there was a body in there to copy. (I probably can't use that since I don't have permissions, and the author seems quite keen on not having his work posted outside Nexus) but it'll do for now.

 

 

I'll delete the pants as well, and paste in a pair of boots from elsewhere,. Probably the ones from The Dress for the time being. And I'll see if I can find a less cumbersome set of gloves.

 

I can also confirm that it works as a space suit. The underlying record is still a constellation spacesuit, so it acts as one, in all respects. Including hiding itself in settlements, which I'll want to think about at some point.

 

 

Could probably do with better nipple textures. The mod I lifted this mesh wasn't showing the nips anyway, so it didn't matter there, I guess.

 

At some point I'll need to adjust the backpack position. Maybe some straps to keep it in place, though I expect most won't care about that. And the constellation patches are floating free. I can just delete them of course, but it occurs to me that since they're already properly weighted, if I can get them to settle on the skin, I can maybe use them as tattoos.

 

 

On the To Do list:

 

• Lose the pants
• better boots and gloves
• better helmet. one of th eplush toys has a perfect clear goldfish-bowl helmet that could be upscaled to serve. That and maybe enable hair under the helmet. We'll get clipping, but probably worth it.
• I want a shader effect for a force field. Easy enough to do with the CK, haven't a clue working with xedit. It can wait.
• Alternatively, I'd quite like skintight bodysuits for in place of the skin. Basically, same as the nude version except pain the skin texture solid red or blue or whatever/ (I'm thinking red for Sarah, blue for Andreja)
• And maybe if I can make it work, a naked but for a thong version. Just because sometimes I find that can be sexier.

 

Anyway, it's a start.

 

Edited November 11, 2023 by DocClox

[DocClox]

OK. The pants worked. I pasted in the default naked skin record on this one so it'll pick up the default skin (possibly including undies if you've not removed them). Seems to work. Still no nipples to speak of, but that's probably more the skin texture I'm using at this point.

 

 

Anyone else think that pubic mound is just crying out of a NASA tattoo?

 

[edit]

 

A bit more field testing....

 

 

 

Yup. Seems to work.

 

[edit]

 

She's going to need hand meshes in there too. I just noticed that her forearms don't quite reach her gauntlets.

Edited November 12, 2023 by DocClox

[DocClox]

OK. I tried copying across that helmet from the plush cat toy.

 

 

It's a bit big, and a little lopsided, but the basics are there.

 

She looks like she's really enjoying those floodlights.

 

 

I think I'd like to get rid of the cowl internally. Maybe keep the collar part. And enable the hair again..

 

I'd also like to lose the smoked glass tint and have a clearer bowl, but that might have to wait until we have a working materials file editor. Right now I'm just cannibalizing existing meshes.

[DocClox]

This is the mesh whence I lifted the fishbowl helmet.  You can see why it's bit elongated. I'm not sure there's any smoke effect in the glass though, which makes me wonder if it's in helmet esm record,

 

 

Is it just me, or is that cat shooting up through his nose?

[DocClox]

In case anyone's interested. the information on how to do this comes from a couple of Nexys tutorials

 

A Guide To Starfield Mashups

 

A guide to making new clothing items

 

[edit]

 

Just so long as I'm making notes here - there's a second sub-record in that helmet called "glow". I deliberately didn't touch that because I wanted to keep the face lighting. (It's a bit immersion breaking in Skyrim, perhaps, but makes sense for space helmets). Anyway, the "glow" itself has three meshes, and I'll bet at least one of them has to do with that smoky effect. I'll try that later today.

 

Possibly worth looking at as a source for that cowl as well.

Edited November 13, 2023 by DocClox

[buzzbombr]

On 11/12/2023 at 7:37 AM, DocClox said:

OK. I tried copying across that helmet from the plush cat toy.

 

 

It's a bit big, and a little lopsided, but the basics are there.

 

She looks like she's really enjoying those floodlights.

 

 

I think I'd like to get rid of the cowl internally. Maybe keep the collar part. And enable the hair again..

 

I'd also like to lose the smoked glass tint and have a clearer bowl, but that might have to wait until we have a working materials file editor. Right now I'm just cannibalizing existing meshes.

 

Heck yeah! A dream becoming reality. Man, you are nailing it! There is a palpable retro-scifi vibe that is nothing but cool. I'm glad you're going to use the player's default body (If I read that correctly). Everyone has their own favorite. I agree with not worrying about the straps for the pack. I think they would simply detract from the overall look. I think the bowl size is perfect, front to back, but definitely kind of strange in the side to side.

 

When you release this as a mod you could have a couple options. Without the cowl, or with for those who don't want the hair clipping. As far as the smoke tint goes, I'd be good either way. I think there's something to be said for either with or without.

 

I dig the little elfen boots you've chosen. They definitely work with the vibe. It's a shame you probably can't use them for the final release. I agree that less bulky gauntlets would be nice, though it's not a game-breaker for me.

 

Assuming you  are going to release with just a few suits (un)covered, I would suggest the Mark 1 be one of them. You can get it early game and it stays viable throughout.

 

Keep at it, Doc! I've been looking forward to this one almost since they announced the game!

[DocClox]

4 hours ago, buzzbombr said:

Heck yeah! A dream becoming reality. Man, you are nailing it! There is a palpable retro-scifi vibe that is nothing but cool. I'm glad you're going to use the player's default body (If I read that correctly). Everyone has their own favorite. I agree with not worrying about the straps for the pack. I think they would simply detract from the overall look. I think the bowl size is perfect, front to back, but definitely kind of strange in the side to side.

 

Well, I hope the resized one doesn't look too small

 

 

 

 

Could probably be usefully rotated back a little  so there's more room at the back of the helm than at the front. We'll see more fluffy hairdos than long noses, I'd guess.

 

That neck seal needs attention as well.

 

 

 

4 hours ago, buzzbombr said:

When you release this as a mod you could have a couple options. Without the cowl, or with for those who don't want the hair clipping. As far as the smoke tint goes, I'd be good either way. I think there's something to be said for either with or without.

 

Happy to do a cowl version.

 

4 hours ago, buzzbombr said:

I dig the little elfen boots you've chosen. They definitely work with the vibe. It's a shame you probably can't use them for the final release. I agree that less bulky gauntlets would be nice, though it's not a game-breaker for me.

 

I think they're basically Andreja's shoes, trimmed and recolored. If so I can probably do that myself. I'm thinking the mark 1 gloves might work. I was hoping for something a little more fasionable and impractical, but these at least look fairly lightweight. At least compared to the bulky Constellation gauntlets, anyway.

 

 

4 hours ago, buzzbombr said:

Assuming you  are going to release with just a few suits (un)covered, I would suggest the Mark 1 be one of them. You can get it early game and it stays viable throughout.

 

Yeah, it's going to need a few. Constellation suits suck, armor-wise.

 

4 hours ago, buzzbombr said:

Keep at it, Doc! I've been looking forward to this one almost since they announced the game!

 

Thank you! I shall do my best.

Edited November 13, 2023 by DocClox

[RohZima]

If/when the climate effects on planets is sorted out to be more immersive, we could then have "states of dress" requirements dependent on the conditions.

 

For example, extreme solar radiation or no atmosphere would definitely require spacesuit, but merely having no oxygen would not - you could get away with a rebreather...

 

We could make more planets to be fit for humans, like those ones that a flush with life but somehow -21c and no oxygen???

 

So that would be my type of solution. For a joke you could have "sun cream" instead of the spacesuit to deal with solar radiation.

[buzzbombr]

7 hours ago, DocClox said:

 

Well, I hope the resized one doesn't look too small

 

 

 

 

Could probably be usefully rotated back a little  so there's more room at the back of the helm than at the front. We'll see more fluffy hairdos than long noses, I'd guess.

 

That neck seal needs attention as well.

 

 

 

 

Happy to do a cowl version.

 

 

I think they're basically Andreja's shoes, trimmed and recolored. If so I can probably do that myself. I'm thinking the mark 1 gloves might work. I was hoping for something a little more fasionable and impractical, but these at least look fairly lightweight. At least compared to the bulky Constellation gauntlets, anyway.

 

 

 

Yeah, it's going to need a few. Constellation suits suck, armor-wise.

 

 

Thank you! I shall do my best.

 

You are definitely on the right track! Full agreement with the bubble. It looks great! Just a little further back and a neck seal. I think you've got the size right. In my head I imagine looking up, down and all around with my neck without having to bend my body. You'd need room inside to do that without bumping your head. It's scifi/fantasy and that suspension of reality while maintaining the mental images of how we think things would work is what makes the genre work. If you can be naked in space with a bubble on your head, then you need to be able to move your head around inside of the bubble and it's gotta be sealed so you can breathe. The fact you are naked is already accepted.

 

The Mark 1 gloves are great looking. More fashionable would be better, but a simple flat black recolor with some silver trim (perhaps with matching flat black and silver-trimmed elfen boots) would definitely work. If Photoshop isn't your thing, I'd say roll with it. Those gloves look realms better than the previous gauntlets.

[DocClox]

3 hours ago, buzzbombr said:

The Mark 1 gloves are great looking. More fashionable would be better, but a simple flat black recolor with some silver trim (perhaps with matching flat black and silver-trimmed elfen boots) would definitely work. If Photoshop isn't your thing, I'd say roll with it. Those gloves look realms better than the previous gauntlets.

 

Not Photoshop so much, but I know my way around The Gimp and Paint.Net, so I can do retextures. Just not material file edits. Not until someone figures out how to edit them. Or where they're stored. They seem to be inside one big database file which itself is stored inside the materials ba2 file. I begin to understand why so many developers are complaining about the Starfield internals being counter intuitive.

 

Mesh editing might be another thing, however. Andreja's boots do all sorts of crazy physics effects if I cut them down. I corrected the meshes for flipped normals and duplicate verts, and I changed the tri and vertex count in the nif, but I must have missed something because those boots render as crazy flickering silly putty all over the screen. So I'll hang fire on that for now, maybe try again when I''ve had a chance to ponder on it.

 

Worst case, I'll put a 0.1 version out  with a dependency on The Dress.

 

Actually, I if they're like the Constellation gloves, I can probably use the mark 1 gloves without edits. That's got to be worth a shot.

Edited November 14, 2023 by DocClox

[buzzbombr]

17 hours ago, DocClox said:

 

Not Photoshop so much, but I know my way around The Gimp and Paint.Net, so I can do retextures. Just not material file edits. Not until someone figures out how to edit them. Or where they're stored. They seem to be inside one big database file which itself is stored inside the materials ba2 file. I begin to understand why so many developers are complaining about the Starfield internals being counter intuitive.

 

Mesh editing might be another thing, however. Andreja's boots do all sorts of crazy physics effects if I cut them down. I corrected the meshes for flipped normals and duplicate verts, and I changed the tri and vertex count in the nif, but I must have missed something because those boots render as crazy flickering silly putty all over the screen. So I'll hang fire on that for now, maybe try again when I''ve had a chance to ponder on it.

 

Worst case, I'll put a 0.1 version out  with a dependency on The Dress.

 

Actually, I if they're like the Constellation gloves, I can probably use the mark 1 gloves without edits. That's got to be worth a shot.

 

At this point, I wouldn't stress the mesh edit on Andreja's boots. Honestly, they're not bad just as they are, I simply never paid any attention to them. I would suspect that is case for most players. A recolor wouldn't hurt. Maybe my original thought of flat black and silver (just going for that scifi vibe) but a metallic look like the ones for the dress would also work with it, and may be closer to your vision. I wonder if there are any Romanesque sandal type footwear in the game, with the wrapping straps that go up the calf? That'd also be pretty cool, I think.

 

Edit: Just happened upon this https://www.nexusmods.com/starfield/mods/4776 don't know if it'll help.

Edited November 15, 2023 by buzzbombr
Found Something

[Serioli]

Fan of skintight suits or good ol' fashioned 'shield projectors'.

 

https://www.cassiopeiaquinn.com/comic/the-prize-page-9

 

Liking the idea of symbiote too...  "My stonking great badonka-donks aren't a fetish, they keep me alive in space!"

[DocClox]

2 hours ago, buzzbombr said:

At this point, I wouldn't stress the mesh edit on Andreja's boots. Honestly, they're not bad just as they are

 

Trouble is, the boots and the bodystocking are all one mesh. In Skyrim of Fo4 I'd just zap the unwanted tris, but we don't have Outfit Studio yet, and I don't know how that feature was implemented, or if the approach will work for Starfield.

 

2 hours ago, buzzbombr said:

Edit: Just happened upon this https://www.nexusmods.com/starfield/mods/4776 don't know if it'll help.

 

Oddly enough, I was just thinking about that. The Mark One gauntlets aren't gauntlets at all it turns out, but three different pairs of gloves, plus a separate cuff. The trouble I'm having there is that if I include the hand mesh, it clips through the gloves. And if I don't, there's a gap between arm and glove. Again, usually I'd use Outfit Studio to zap the hand and leave the wrist on the body mesh.

 

Oh, and the damn fishbowl helmet started freaking out yesterday as well. Which was weird because all I did was scale down the hole in the bowl..

 

Never mind. This is how we learn

 

2 hours ago, Serioli said:

Fan of skintight suits or good ol' fashioned 'shield projectors'.

 

https://www.cassiopeiaquinn.com/comic/the-prize-page-9

 

Liking the idea of symbiote too...  "My stonking great badonka-donks aren't a fetish, they keep me alive in space!"

 

Nice. I could do with a new webcomic.

[Halstrom]

Nice, I like the no-hood and hood options for those incompatible hair, maybe 2 sizes is good too.
Have you looked at that Latex suit mod, its a skin replacer, I would rather it be a suit though

[DocClox]

2 hours ago, Halstrom said:

Nice, I like the no-hood and hood options for those incompatible hair, maybe 2 sizes is good too.

 

Well, I can do that

 

 

 

Currently that's two different esm files, but I think I'll make one esm with two different helmets

 

I want the collar from that hood for the hoodless variant as well, but I still haven't managed to edit a mesh without the result rubberbanding all over the landscape. I will try again.

 

2 hours ago, Halstrom said:

Have you looked at that Latex suit mod, its a skin replacer, I would rather it be a suit though

 

I have, just now.  Trouble is, being a skin replacer, it applies to everyone. I could make a copy of the body mesh ... but I don't know how to change the texture used at the moment. We can overwrite in game assets, but completely new ones is still a bit obscure.

 

What I want to do, by preference is to use either a shader or a texture set/materials swap. But those options are locked way in beth's new material system and no-one seems to know how that works yet.

 

Here's a couple more no-cowl shots:

 

 

 

 

 

 

I also added the hand meshes back and removed the gloves so they wouldn't clip. (It's either that or use something clunky like the Constellation mitts).  If I ever do get a bodysuit option working, I can color the hands and all will be good.

 

 

 

Problem now is that the cuffs don't have an inside mesh, so you can still see daylight at the edges. It's probably less distracting than having no forearms, but still not ideal.

 

Still, all told it's looking pretty decent. I think I might go for an alpha release based on this.

Edited November 15, 2023 by DocClox