LoversStalkerM

[mem4ob4]

Will you also add the "block male", "block female", "block essential" for the stalked NPCs?

 

Yes. plus creatures and companions.

 

Mem

[Someone92]

Will the NPC stalker independent of the PC stalker, meaning can there be a NPC stalking the player and another NPC stalking a NPC at the same time? Or maybe even multiple NPC stalkers?

[mem4ob4]

Will the NPC stalker independent of the PC stalker, meaning can there be a NPC stalking the player and another NPC stalking a NPC at the same time? Or maybe even multiple NPC stalkers?

 

This will be a separate esp. tentative name- LoverStalkerMN (LSMN).

Currently testing to make sure LSM and LSMN does not conflict with each other.

The player can be raped while other rapes go on around the immediate area.

So independent settings for each one.

Depending on scan time setting of LSMN, another rape can begin before the first one finishes.

No dialog, no harassment in LSMN. Just a notification message "X has started to rape Y!".

Use of RaperS with LSMN not possible at this time, though the future may see the possibility of allowing the player to join in.

 

Mem

[Nepro]

If I play female character which version should I pick?

[Nepro]

If I play female character which version should I pick? I see two 1.5 and 2.0 versions.

[mem4ob4]

If I play female character which version should I pick? I see two 1.5 and 2.0 versions.

 

That is up to you. Do you prefer dialog with fewer options or messages (that you can edit yourself) with more option?

Just check the descriptions in the OP.

 

Happy gaming,

Mem

[sexcapades]

Thanks for this mod!  I always thought it was silly that some fool would stalk my tough as nails character.  I like being able to raise my fists and send the weaklings packing... while still being able to interact with tougher players.  Awesome job.

[rynak777]

The "max median responsibility of those around you"-setting is interesting and fits the purpose of this plugin. It in a single setting elegantly handles most cases for which other similiar plugins need a dozen exceptions.

 

Delegating many options to WRS also is fitting in this case. Normally, i'm sceptic about how lovers plugins tend to fragment into a cocktail a hundred plugins and masters, because the dev will - linux-mentality style - say: "oh, but there is already another mod, that handles this feature, so why should i duplicate it? Okay, that other plugin also does a truckload of other things, that have nothing at all to do with this mod, but who cares?". Here however, depending on WRS makes sense, because WRS *ONLY* handles rape mechanics and nothing else - so if one wants detailed options for that, it makes sense to install WRS, instead of expecting LSM to duplicate the features.

 

Bugs - don't really have any certain ones to report. I have encountered situations, where things did not seem to work properly. The scenario was "commoners" added by "Crowded Cities Improved" (No-Script version), being marked as stalkers and approaching me. The initial trashtalk greeting worked, but none of the usual LSM (v2) answers showed up. This seems to happen randomly: I've looked through the crowded cities plugin in CS, and all the NPCs are basically defined identically - just different appearance and names, but otherwise duplicates. Yet, sometimes for said NPCs the LSM dialog answers do show up, and sometimes not. This however only happens for CC NPCs - the issue hasn't happened for other NPCs, so it might just be a crowded cities incompatibility, instead of an LSM problem.

 

Improvement proposals - don't really have any that are technically feasible. On the one hand, using dialogs is more immersive (v2). On the other hand, the default talk isn't really to my taste, so changing it in an INI is nice (v1.5) - but i guess this technically isn't doable when using dialogs. So, to get the best of both worlds, i guess i'll just go through the one-time discomfort of editing the dialogs in CS.

[rynak777]

Okay, came up with an improvement idea. It's related to the "max median responsibility" setting. It already works quite well, but i think it could work even better. This proposal kinda covers both LSM and LSMN - more on this later.

See, the max median resp setting only takes into account the average responsibility of nearby NPCs. But imagine a crowd, with say 3 people with low responsibility, yet one with very high responsibility. It might seem strange that in such a case the person with very high responsibility simply gets ignored. The intuitive example is guards. I know there is already a setting for guards, but that setting only decides if a guard himself would approach - not if OTHERS nearby would do so in the presence of a guard.

Another problem is that for LSM itself (player-stalking), there currently is no way to adjust stalking chance - only interval of checks.


So, here's my proposal:

Drop the guard settings.

New settings:

- General stalking chance modifier. Normally, the chance of stalking simply is a persons responsibility (or rather, lack thereof). This modifier is a general offset for purposes of stalking chance.

- Max median responsibility setting, just like before.

- Max individual responsibility setting (more on this further down)

- Responsibility breakdown chance (more on this further down). This can be set to zero to disable it.

- Responsibility breakdown duration


Here's how this would work:

1. If "responsibility breakdown" is currently active (see further down), then the restrictions described in #2 and #3 further down are disabled. ONLY the normal stalking chance check matters.

2. If "median responsibility of those near you" is too high, no one considers stalking (just like before).

3. Additionally, if at least one person nearby is above "max individual resp", no one considers stalking (i.e. no stalking while a guard is nearby).

4. At the begin of a scan-interval, if responsibility breakdown is NOT active, then we first check "responsibility breakdown chance". If successful, then during our scan, we for people that are above "max individual responsibility" ignore the "max median responsibility" as well as "max indiv. resp." restrictions. If such a person becomes a stalker during the scan, then we set "responsibility breakdown" (some var) to active for the specified duration.


Soo, to summarize: People will not stalk, if the median resp in the crowd is too high, or if there are highly responsible people nearby (i.e. guards). However, there is a chance of those two limitations breaking down, by such a highly responsible person (i.e. guard) him/herself becoming a stalker. Once that happens, the crowd follows the "example" and ignores the "median resp" and "individual resp" limitations for a while.


Issue is: This kinda applies to the player as well as NPCs, yet duplicating it in LSM as well as LSMN would be strange. Why are LSM and LSMN seperate plugins anyways? (honest question, not criticism: I'd like to understand the reason)

 

[mem4ob4]

Edit-responce to first post before seeing your second-

Thank you for the feedback rynak777.

The max median responsibility code is my way of simplifying something that felt like
trying to shove an elephant through a keyhole.
Coming from MUD coding, integrating job specific plugins in new ways, seems the 'right'
way to do things. I also hate to 'reinvent the wheel' and have drawn on methods
developed by those before me such as WappyOne, Gabriel, Galgat, etc.
A quest that allows the PC to deal with situations in different ways based on what
plugins are installed would be a wonderful project. Options like- 'Dance for me',
'show me how you get yourself off', 'You gonna fight or make love?'.
It would be a matter of plugins that allow communication between them. WappyOne,
in his latest release of RaperS has made a big step in this direction (which I
took advantage of in my LSMN). Others have made variables publicly usable and that
is a great gift to the community.

As far as LSMv2-
Sometimes I see similar problems in my own game.
To put it simply, I have very little knowledge on setting up dialog.
I am sure there are much better ways to do it than what I used. I hope and encourage
anyone with good skill in this area to freely 'fix' or adjust what I have in this area.
It definitely could be improved.

When you choose to edit the dialog in v2 may I suggest the construction set Extender.

Mem

[rynak777]

Thanks for the hint. By now i only edit plugins with CSE enabled, because i'm too lazy to every time check if said plugin uses OBSE.

[mem4ob4]

There are currently no specific checks for guards in LSM/LSMN. Most guards have a
responsibility of 100 but are processed just like all other actors.

The philosophy behind using just 'median responsibility': crowd mentality.
In a group of 4 people, 3 being low responsibility and one being high, I feel
there is as much (or more) chance of that higher person succumbing to the crowds
mood as the other three being influenced by the one. The lower the responsibility
of the three, the more likely the one will ignore or join in with them. If on the
other hand, there are only 2 low responsibility and 1 high, it may not be enough
to sway that 1 person and the max check would not pass. No distinction is made
between 'guard' and 'upstanding citizen', only the 'situation' they are in.
If during a stalk, (responsibility scans continue) the crowd members change, one
moves off and/or another comes in range, a stalk can be stopped.
Special case: Creatures (example: city dogs). If they are allowed to stalk,
they really pull the median responsibility down (they dont care, the just smell
something they want and it effects the other npcs also). This is one point that
does not always make sense.

Stalking chance = max median responsibility

You make a good proposal.
It could definately be done with:
Max median crowd
Max individual
breakdown chance
breakdown duration
However, I would prefer to hold to a 'one variable' check that takes the whole situation
into consideration. For me it is: how simple or complex do we make this.
With that in mind: If you would like to make adjustments like this to LSM I encourage
you to do so. I am more than willing to assist if needed.

LSM/LSMN: They use different scans and cycle time drift. But it would be possible.
Actually LSMv1.5, v2, and LSMN could be in one plugin with 3 quests, but that is
not a project on my table right now.

 

Mem

[theskid]

Enjoying the improvements I am seeing here with the 2.0 version, along with your npc stalking add on as well (makes the roxey inn a bit of an orgy though;), when the guard is outside). 

 

 

edit: never mind the question just doublechecked  the op

[theskid]

Hmm i think I may switch back to 1.5. I seem to have lost the dialogue completely on stalkers coming at my character, the forced greeting works, but none of the dialogue options that should show up do, so the scenario can't progress. This happened only a few hours into my playthrough (character is still level 1) so not a huge loss, but I have no idea why it would be happening. This was with vanilla npcs in imperial city, not ones added by any mod, as far as I can tell. The npc stalker add on is working relatively flawlessly though.

[mem4ob4]

@theskid

You are saying that the npc actually gives the greeting (with no LSM player responses available) or is it a 'no greeting'?

I am going to have to work out my flags and may need to resort to a token for the v2.

 

Mem

[theskid]

He actually gives the greeting (dogbitches don't need shoes or what have you, take those shoes off and so on) but then no speech options from the mod are there, just the standard conversation options. If i exit the convesration he contiinues to stalk, and will come up with the greeting again but still no options.

[mem4ob4]

Could I take a peek at your load order inside spoilers and have you done any editing to the esp (gotta ask that one).

Mem

 

Edit: Oh and have you masterbated lately (in the game), or stalker requested you do so just before probem?

[theskid]

No edits to the esp itself. Here is my load order. It actually does not have stalkers in it right now as I had just taken it out to clean save to 1.5 stalkers. It wwas right under loversrapers and right before the LoversStalkerMN.esp originally.

 

 

Oblivion.esm

Beautiful People 2ch-Ed.esm

Cobl Main.esm

Oscuro's_Oblivion_Overhaul.esm

Lovers with PK.esm

LoversCreature.esm

x117race.esm

Chanpon.esm

EURN.esp

Unofficial Oblivion Patch.esp

UOPS Additional Changes.esp

UOP Vampire Aging & Face Fix.esp

Oblivion Citadel Door Fix.esp

DLCShiveringIsles.esp

Unofficial Shivering Isles Patch.esp

Enhanced Economy.esp

DLCHorseArmor.esp

DLCHorseArmor - Unofficial Patch.esp

DLCOrrery.esp

DLCOrrery - Unofficial Patch.esp

DLCVileLair.esp

DLCVileLair - Unofficial Patch.esp

DLCMehrunesRazor.esp

DLCMehrunesRazor - Unofficial Patch.esp

DLCSpellTomes.esp

Featherwynd - Amazon Priestess.esp

Gizmodian - Shell of the Artifice.esp

Hentai DarkSisterhoodArmor.esp

HGEC Witch Queen Ritual Robe.esp

minibloomers.esp

Mithris_HGEC.esp

Sister_of_Eisen_HGEC.esp

Stained Glass Equipment.esp

Underworld Armor.esp

LexMiscClothes.esp

LexMiscClothesII.esp

LexScalesArmour.esp

RogueLeather.esp

Ryk_AtholBrose.esp

TGND.esp

TGND_SI.esp

TGND Accompt of the Delitescent.esp

TGND_Corsets_of_the_Rose.esp

TGND Exnem Rogue Outfits.esp

TGND - Kogane's Ranger Armor.esp

TGND_Lingerie_Underwear.esp

TGND Warrior Skin.esp

DLCThievesDen.esp

DLCThievesDen - Unofficial Patch.esp

DLCThievesDen - Unofficial Patch - SSSB.esp

Cobl Glue.esp

Cobl Si.esp

Oscuro's_Oblivion_Overhaul.esp

OOO 1.32-Cobl.esp

TGND - OOO.esp

TGNDNessaStore.esp

TGND - Nessa Store Lingerie Patch.esp

TGND - Nessa Store Athol Patch.esp

TGND - Nessa Stores OOO Patch.esp

TalosBridgeGateHouse.esp

Tavern-Goers 2.esp

DLCBattlehornCastle.esp

DLCBattlehornCastle - Unofficial Patch.esp

DLCFrostcrag.esp

DLCFrostcrag - Unofficial Patch.esp

Knights.esp

Knights - Unofficial Patch.esp

Faregyl.esp

Feldscar.esp

Gottshaw Village.esp

Molapi.esp

Reedstand.esp

Urasek.esp

Vergayun.esp

Frostcrag Village.esp

Salmo the Baker, Cobl.esp

Sutch Village.esp

Harvest [Flora].esp

Harvest [Flora] - DLCFrostcrag.esp

RMDailyIncomeV2.esp

LoversAdultPlayPlusforSSP.esp

LoversVoiceSSPplus.esp

LoversHooker.esp

LoversAdultPlayPlusforSSP_HookerPatch.esp

LoversStripper.esp

LoversRaperS.esp

LoversStalkerMN.esp

LoversBed.esp

LoversPayBandit.esp

Lovers with PK.esp

LoversCreature.esp

LoversBackup2.esp

LoversEscapeRapeVPlayer.esp

LoversRapeSlave.esp

LoversLight.esp

LoversTrueCrimeEx.esp

Alternative Beginnings.esp

Woman's Move - Animation Replacer.esp

DiabloEF 6 in 1.esp

Beautiful People 2ch-Ed Sheogorath Eye.esp

Beautiful People 2ch-Ed MS Elves - NoSc.esp

x117race.esp

Lop-ears Elf.esp

OCR Orc.esp

Bashed Patch, 0.esp

LoversMB2.esp

LoversIdleAnimsPriority.esp

LoversAnimObjectsPriority.esp

 

This doesn't show what is in my bashed patch very well... sorry not finding a way to export from wyre.

[theskid]

 

 

Edit: Oh and have you masterbated lately (in the game), or stalker requested you do so just before probem?

 

Not that I recall. I actually only have used the masturbate spell once, and not on this save.

[mem4ob4]

Alright, thank you theskid.

Since you get the greeting but not the player responses then I must think one of the checks got screwed and saved in your game.

I will be reworking v2 dialog this coming week.

 

Mem

 

Oh, LSMN will have an update within a day to help preserve the working girls business if tests go well.

[theskid]

Do you think a clean save would fix the problem?...though I have been spending most of the day in between calls poking at the dialogue ini for 1.5, so I may well just go with that anyways.

 

 

[mem4ob4]

Do you think a clean save would fix the problem?...though I have been spending most of the day in between calls poking at the dialogue ini for 1.5, so I may well just go with that anyways.

 

It wouldn't hurt. But there just may be something going on between both my plugins and LoversHooker that I have to catch 'in the act'. So go ahead with v1.5 and enjoy for now.

 

Mem

[mem4ob4]

If you (anyone) are using LoversHooker with LSM and LSMN, I have uploaded an LSMN version that checks and rejects a stalker/victim that is transacting hooker business with you instead of being involved in an LSMN rape.

I have not experienced the exact same dialog problems as those mentioned above (just an occasional 'no greeting'),

LSM itself rejects stalkers while player is working a john.

As I stated above, I will be going through the dialog checks to see if I can make them more solid this next week.

Thank you for your support,

Mem

[sexcapades]

I sometimes have the same problem as skid.  Especially with folks that are following me for one reason or another. 

 

Sometimes, when the glitch kicks, I can initiate conversation with them and the dialog is there. If that doesn't work - putting up my fists and sending them away frustrated seems fair.  If an NPC doesn't have the courage to tell a girl (who just stripped on his command) what he wants - hey - maybe he doesn't really deserve any action.

 

On a side note - I wear a one piece outfit - if I put it back on - they do ask me to strip again - Next time it glitches, I will try dawning my clothes through the 3 piece cycle and see what happens.

[mem4ob4]

I sometimes have the same problem as skid.  Especially with folks that are following me for one reason or another. 

 

Sometimes, when the glitch kicks, I can initiate conversation with them and the dialog is there. If that doesn't work - putting up my fists and sending them away frustrated seems fair.  If an NPC doesn't have the courage to tell a girl (who just stripped on his command) what he wants - hey - maybe he doesn't really deserve any action.

 

On a side note - I wear a one piece outfit - if I put it back on - they do ask me to strip again - Next time it glitches, I will try dawning my clothes through the 3 piece cycle and see what happens.

 

"...sending them away frustrated seems fair"  fair indeed.

 

Following could be part of the situation. LSM checks if they are using a follow package before adding its own. It wont if they do have one. I will need to look through and see if/how I am using that in dialog conditions.

 

There should not be problem with one piece outfits. It checks shoe, top, bottom slots in that order, so if you have a one piece that fills just the top slot but covers bottom and shoes, they should focus on you baring your breasts.

I think I mean to say: it is not a 1, 2, 3 type of progression. It is by priority to get those slots emptied.

 

I do have an Idea to work out this coming week that should greatly simplify the dialog conditions and eliminate possible errors like has been seen.

Time will tell.

 

Mem