Animal Mansion 4??? (Dev Thread)

[tasairis]

13 hours ago, pinaman said:

I personally would love to see some multistage quests for the main quest, not just a "go to A and mate with b" next quest "go to C and mate with D", I think some build up (!), some underlying humor and some nice writing is key.

Trying to understand what you mean by "multistage". Is the horse quest a reasonable example of that? Or, how would you improve one of the other quests?

 

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In regards to quest ideas I would like to mention Bestial Essence (as a genric example on how to do kinky quests in a good way)

Bestial Essence has been mentioned a number of times now. I'll have to look into it.

 

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but specifically also Riding Styles (https://www.loverslab.com/topic/56723-riding-styles-2-6-3-18/)

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Riding styles: the principle idea of not only to include mateing but giving it a kinky purpose or it's just a byproduct, I'm aware that messing with the mount system is very tricky and possibly never could be integrated, but maybe the principle is a source for quest ideas

So basically, you like how Riding Styles adds a (sexual) side-effect to some otherwise normal thing? Do you have an example for what sort of thing that could do here?

 

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and Fill Her Up (https://www.loverslab.com/topic/35463-fill-her-up-cum-inflation/ and https://www.loverslab.com/files/file/2381-fill-her-up-netimmerse-override-compatibility-patch/)

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Fill her up: version 2 of the mod also contains a short quest mod ! this quest mod is about a animal splunk collection, delivery and transport service  sadly the mod only has 1,1/2 quests and it was never offically released but the idea is a kinky brain nuke

I thought Fill Her Up was basically a side-effect that's added across the game. Are you talking specifically about its v2 quest whatever thing? Can you tell me more about it and what kind of role the concept could play here?

[tasairis]

8 hours ago, skyrim482 said:

How about this for immersion depth and expanding on training, when you bring a creature back Theana gets excited about certain creatures and wants to try them. Ex "Oh you have brought back a bear! I' Have never been with a creatre that big, lets go to the basement and try him" Theana invites you to the basement to have you watch her try the new creature.

Hmm. That makes sense. I'll think about what I could do with it.

 

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She got you into all this wouldn't she be interested in trying new things too?

That... is a good point. But I think I would ease her into it gradually, though: she came across to me to be more interested in animals than being ready to actually have a go with them. After all, her own dog is one thing, but wolves (scary dogs) and horses (ouch) and spiders (?) are something else entirely.

I'm big on immersion (but I swear not in the "muh immershun" way), and as people playing this game it's easy to forget about how you're regularly fighting venomous spiders the size of cars, and spelunking through ruins filled with fucking zombies. I appreciate perversions and fetishes as much as the next person, but the characters in our game need to have some degree of common sense.

 

So. Perhaps a parallel side quest about introducing Thaena to some of the animals you've collected? That could tie into the "tell her to get off her ass and work" problem. There is a bit of a conflict with some of the story, and it does suggest changing her personality a bit from what I had planned, but I think the idea would still work in some form or another.

 

Ultimately, though, I don't want to change the existing story "too much". Progression and character development are good things, even if it means not giving the reader (or player) what they want when they want it. I'm thinking in the very long term here - as in the nine creatures so far are just the tip of the iceberg.

 

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Training Theana could be trained as well as a player on practicing with an animal separately or on jobs. Complete enough training with certain creatures befor you can inite them to the party as they need to build up their stamina. The player and Theana need to build up their stamina through training too. Over working an animal could play into the vet scenario. Possibility creature could die and you have to get another.      

Yo dawg, I heard you like unlocking creatures...

 

I'm not opposed to requiring a bit more work from the player before creatures can be used in parties (or, in general, for more than simple client shows), but this is getting too complicated for me to think through right now. I have to let stew in my brain first.

 

But creature death, I don't know. It adds a little more technical complexity to the mod, and I'm not sure if there's any concrete benefit to it. Sounds like more effort for little reward.

[Reesewow]

52 minutes ago, tasairis said:

I thought Fill Her Up was basically a side-effect that's added across the game.

Fill Them Up (which is Fill Her Up 2's mini quest addon) basically took the cum inflation effect of the main mod and built a story around the "Quicksilver Trading Co".  The business of the company was the transport of product (read: semen) via specialized couriers (read: women full of said semen) from point to point.  As @pinaman mentioned unfortunately the quests ended all too soon as the mod was never finished, but it actually works well still afaik  - just nothing to do after playing it once other than repeat the same few quests over and over.

 

Bestial Essence has a similar theme, but is based around the collection of critter semen for alchemy usages.  I was also heavily story driven and quite in depth - I believe the SE port is still available.

[skyrim482]

So as far as the progression yes I intended that just to be used sparingly as some radiant quests or return female mansion jobs. Of course Theana might be scared of the animals like a damn troll in the basement lol. It doesn't have to be a real progression system or training just a simple last step to do when you return to the mansion with the creature at the end of their gather quest.  So the way it works now is you bring back a bear and throw a party with him 5 minutes later. Theana should have a go with some  of the creatures when you return ,that would otherwise be considered large or scary if you will, so she could be comfortable performing jobs/ parties with them. Women want to try things in private first before they would ever preform it for somebody else.

 

9 hours ago, tasairis said:

she came across to me to be more interested in animals than being ready to actually have a go

Maybe she is hesitant and wants the player to show her first. She might need to be persuaded or a gradual interest increase / corruption.  The only thing she knows about is a dog to start with. She might not know what to do with a ex. bear, player has to show her first.

 

Overall point of just weaving in some layers and dialogue to an already good story. Thank you for considering our ideas.

 

As far as the stamina / creature death, I agree that would be overly complicated for the mod simplicity. It was just some ideas if you were bringing a vet mechanic in.

[LGmobile]

Always been a huge fan of animal mansion, glad someone is going to make a proper SE version.

SE is way more stable than LE, and most of the mods in LE are available for SE nowadays. i don't see why people nag about LE but that's something for another thread.

 

Would love to be a tester, hmu if you need help.

 

One thing though, please don't make unskippable dialogue, i remember some scene in AMP where they would just talk for over 10 minutes, you would just be standing there doing nothing... which was very boring.

[Twycross448]

10 hours ago, LGmobile said:

i don't see why people nag about LE but that's something for another thread.

*chuckles* Well, for me, there are two reasons why I personally would prefer LE if not for the mentioned stability that simply is better with SE:

1. the look of Oldrim (shader engine, lighting etc.) before applying any ENB is just more to my taste and

2. there still is no stable, bug-free 1st Person Body mod for SE, even after several years. We got JoP, IFPC and Enhanced Camera, all three of which are nowhere near as feature rich, performant and bug free as their Oldrim counterparts are.

 

But that is just my personal view on things. ^_^"

 

@tasairis

If I recall correctly, you mentioned that would like to allow the player to skip animals/quests for them if desired (respectively the animal not being desired).

Does this hold true for the companions arc for the wolves as well? I admit, that whole thing was easily the most bothersome part of the original AM for me. Endless dialogues and forced intercourse with human males made this one a quest I modded out of AM for myself back in the day. (I also switched all male NPCs, including Jesper, into females and replaced the spiders in the respective quest with death hounds. But that is another story alltogether. ^_^" )

[tasairis]

13 hours ago, skyrim482 said:

It doesn't have to be a real progression system or training just a simple last step to do when you return to the mansion with the creature at the end of their gather quest.

I would like to put a little more effort into it. More than just "welcome back, now it's my turn".

I am leaning towards doing a parallel quest. Might run a step or behind the MSQ, but more or less in tandem with it. Can tie into the romance line.

 

13 hours ago, skyrim482 said:

So the way it works now is you bring back a bear and throw a party with him 5 minutes later. Theana should have a go with some  of the creatures when you return ,that would otherwise be considered large or scary if you will, so she could be comfortable performing jobs/ parties with them. Women want to try things in private first before they would ever preform it for somebody else.

Right. Unlock creature for player/client -> unlock for Thaena -> unlock for party. Additional work with additional reward.

 

13 hours ago, skyrim482 said:

Maybe she is hesitant and wants the player to show her first. She might need to be persuaded or a gradual interest increase / corruption.  The only thing she knows about is a dog to start with. She might not know what to do with a ex. bear, player has to show her first.

Right. Thaena teaches the player about dogs (if that's the backstory you go with), then the player teaches her about everything else. For example, going from dog to wolf isn't too much of a stretch, and she could probably be okay with just the player proving the animal is tamed and friendly. Going to sabre cat is a bit more of a leap since they're fairly exotic, and while horses aren't exotic they are Bigger Animals ? to be concerned about. On the further end is a spider or a chaurus, which should be difficult to convince her about.

 

13 hours ago, skyrim482 said:

Overall point of just weaving in some layers and dialogue to an already good story. Thank you for considering our ideas.

More layers is good.

 

[Evilhomer]

Quest suggestions, maybe there could be risky jobs (either main or side quest) where there is a chance of things going sideways, like the Forsworn want to do some weird ritual with animals, maybe it will just be sex, or maybe something else,  or some bandits are having a big drunken party and they want some entertainment but sometimes they dont want to pay etc.

 

DLC wise, maybe you get a request to go to Solstheim from a certain hall up in the north and you and a couple of followers (maybe Theana as well?) go over there for a big old party, then that opens up the chance they will help to capture some of the local wildlife for the mansion, or even broker deals with their less than friendly kin for animal trade.

[tasairis]

12 hours ago, LGmobile said:

SE is way more stable than LE, and most of the mods in LE are available for SE nowadays. i don't see why people nag about LE but that's something for another thread.

3. There are a good number of people out there who have LE functioning well (relatively) and with the mods they want. They don't see a need to buy SE and go through the whole setup process all over again.

 

12 hours ago, LGmobile said:

Would love to be a tester, hmu if you need help.

At some point there will be an alpha version, with the first one mostly aimed at testing the technical aspects. I'll explain more when it happens.

 

12 hours ago, LGmobile said:

One thing though, please don't make unskippable dialogue, i remember some scene in AMP where they would just talk for over 10 minutes, you would just be standing there doing nothing... which was very boring.

The troll?

I'm not a fan of the way AMP did those kinds of conversations, even if it is basically the cleanest way to do a three-way conversation. I'd rather redo the whole thing to work more like player dialogue typically does.

And yes, I am taking deliberate measures to (1) keep the conversations fairly short, with the occasional exception, and (2) to try to keep you engaged as it goes.

[tasairis]

2 hours ago, Twycross448 said:

If I recall correctly, you mentioned that would like to allow the player to skip animals/quests for them if desired (respectively the animal not being desired).

Yes: nearly all main quest animals will be skippable. I'll try to keep the unskippable animals to just the "normal" species.

 

2 hours ago, Twycross448 said:

Does this hold true for the companions arc for the wolves as well? I admit, that whole thing was easily the most bothersome part of the original AM for me. Endless dialogues and forced intercourse with human males made this one a quest I modded out of AM for myself back in the day.

I'll admit it is a bit stretched out (ha), but I actually rather liked it. Probably because I like orgies in general.

 

Anyway yes, all side quests will be optional and skippable. You may have to go out to the location the first time you get it, like to see what it's about, but you will be able to turn down any quest without significant repercussions. For complex ones like the Companions party, I'll see about making some of their stages optional - at least regarding player involvement.

 

2 hours ago, Twycross448 said:

(I also switched all male NPCs, including Jesper, into females and replaced the spiders in the respective quest with death hounds. But that is another story alltogether. ^_^" )

I really do want to keep Jesper male, so you'd have to do more than simply change his NPC record to avoid facing some unusual situations, but I hope the mod will meet your satisfaction regarding skippable spiders so at least you won't have to do worry about changing that part yourself. (And yes, death hounds are on my list.)

 

And I'll go on the record for this now: I do have intentions and desires for this mod that some people may disagree with - hopefully not strong feelings about anything major - but if someone becomes willing to go through the effort of developing a patch to change things (eg, make Jesper female), then I'd be willing to lend my knowledge towards that end (eg, help identify places that use male pronouns or include him in animations).

[Reesewow]

3 minutes ago, tasairis said:

I'll admit it is a bit stretched out (ha), but I actually rather liked it. Probably because I like orgies in general.

 

Anyway yes, all side quests will be optional and skippable. You may have to go out to the location the first time you get it, like to see what it's about, but you will be able to turn down any quest without significant repercussions. For complex ones like the Companions party, I'll see about making some of their stages optional - at least regarding player involvement.

I also quite enjoyed the companion arc - it seemed to fit well with the Companions and their general competitiveness.  If they have brawls regularly to let off some steam, why not have a fucking contest with their lupine blood brothers?

 

It does definitely drag on a bit since it essentially boils down to the player sitting in one spot watching back-to-back SL scenes with no input.  Which is always a bit of a danger for mods heavily based on Sexlab like AM.  A few thoughts about how this might be improved for the Companions event as an example (but possible relevant for future events or parties ect):

• The quest could offer the player more agency in the scenes they see.  Instead of the Companions calling out what would be next, perhaps the player as the "underdog" (ha!) competitor could be given a selection of choices for the round (number of partners, oral/vaginal/anal/rough ect).  What you pick could result in unique dialogue, and offer more variety between replays.
• Minor gameplay and the chance to win or lose based on your choices.  For example the contest could turn into a contest to see who can get their partner off the hardest, and the player has to interpret their partner's mannerisms to see which type of activity would have the greatest effect.
• Option to place minor bets on the outcome.
• Animation variety has improved incredibly since AM was first made.  Scenes like the Companions orgy would be the perfect place to set up the rarer F/F/C animations.  When the competition is down to two competitors, why not have them engage in a tie-breaker with a wolf or werewolf who will be the ultimate judge of the winner? 

Largely, I think if a mod can break up longer dialogue + sex scenes with minor player input or decisions it really helps to make the scene more interesting and likely to be worth more than one run through to see the other options/outcomes.

 

3 minutes ago, tasairis said:

And I'll go on the record for this now: I do have intentions and desires for this mod that some people may disagree with

Feel like that is simply unavoidable - definitely can't please everyone all the time, especially when continuing an old mod that some people may have preconceptions about for better or for worse.  IMO feel free to make the changes you think improve the mod and take the story in the direction you find interesting, and a lot of people will likely enjoy your efforts.  At worst if someone finds they heavily prefer the other versions, most of those are still available.

[Taak]

Oh, that sounds great! 

I have one suggestion, if I may. Its in regards to how the story in original mod is being set up. I felt like it starts out of nowhere like "here ya go, its an animal mansion now thanx to the Jarl having some particular kinks". So, the thing I wanted to suggest is making some sort of a prologue. Something about finding ruins underneath the construction site (ynderneath the Inn/Mansion). So that the MC can be hired to help clear these ruins (that then will become basement) in which some artifact will be found (a book?) that describes the purpose of these ruins and the rituals that were performed there rituals with animals wink wink. 

I think this way the whole story that is told in original mod will be making much more sense (especially it will explain that huge and weird basement underneath the supposed-to-be-inn). I think it will also give more reason for why there are guests in the mansion. They heard about that finding, and were intrigued by the rituals described and they want to experience  themselves like the priests (priestesses?), and nobles )audience) that were described in that artifact. 

But I see that you aren't planning to change much in regards to assets in this mod. Still tho, I wanted to share my thoughts on how the story can be improved because I doubt that I will ever get enough patience and/or time to start modding myself even though I have a few ideas for a few mods. ?

[tasairis]

36 minutes ago, Evilhomer said:

Quest suggestions, maybe there could be risky jobs (either main or side quest) where there is a chance of things going sideways, like the Forsworn want to do some weird ritual with animals, maybe it will just be sex, or maybe something else,  or some bandits are having a big drunken party and they want some entertainment but sometimes they dont want to pay etc.

I'm thinking an aggressive/rape MCM toggle. Then I can do whatever, wherever.

 

36 minutes ago, Evilhomer said:

DLC wise, maybe you get a request to go to Solstheim from a certain hall up in the north and you and a couple of followers (maybe Theana as well?) go over there for a big old party, then that opens up the chance they will help to capture some of the local wildlife for the mansion, or even broker deals with their less than friendly kin for animal trade.

Sounds good.

[tasairis]

40 minutes ago, Reesewow said:

I also quite enjoyed the companion arc - it seemed to fit well with the Companions and their general competitiveness.  If they have brawls regularly to let off some steam, why not have a fucking contest with their lupine blood brothers?

Aela and Skjor would totally be on board. Kodlak wouldn't.

 

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• The quest could offer the player more agency in the scenes they see.  Instead of the Companions calling out what would be next, perhaps the player as the "underdog" (ha!) competitor could be given a selection of choices for the round (number of partners, oral/vaginal/anal/rough ect).  What you pick could result in unique dialogue, and offer more variety between replays.

In a word, variation. There's enough to work with that I should be able to mix things up a bit.

 

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• Minor gameplay and the chance to win or lose based on your choices.  For example the contest could turn into a contest to see who can get their partner off the hardest, and the player has to interpret their partner's mannerisms to see which type of activity would have the greatest effect.

Sounds tricky.

 

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• Option to place minor bets on the outcome.

Maybe starting to get too complicated?

 

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• Animation variety has improved incredibly since AM was first made.  Scenes like the Companions orgy would be the perfect place to set up the rarer F/F/C animations.  When the competition is down to two competitors, why not have them engage in a tie-breaker with a wolf or werewolf who will be the ultimate judge of the winner? 

Already doing this for everything.

 

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Largely, I think if a mod can break up longer dialogue + sex scenes with minor player input or decisions it really helps to make the scene more interesting and likely to be worth more than one run through to see the other options/outcomes.

Places for input and some multiple choice options - already doing this for everything.

[tasairis]

1 hour ago, Taak said:

I have one suggestion, if I may. Its in regards to how the story in original mod is being set up. I felt like it starts out of nowhere like "here ya go, its an animal mansion now thanx to the Jarl having some particular kinks". So, the thing I wanted to suggest is making some sort of a prologue.

 

Something about finding ruins underneath the construction site (ynderneath the Inn/Mansion). So that the MC can be hired to help clear these ruins (that then will become basement) in which some artifact will be found (a book?) that describes the purpose of these ruins and the rituals that were performed there rituals with animals wink wink. 

That's really convoluted, and I don't want to be sucked into a hole like the one that drowned AMR. But the plot would work remarkably well for, say, when we start dealing with the Dwemer.

 

What if I told you that I've already added a lot of backstory to the prologue? Cryptically,

1. Thaena was doing fine opening her inn until she hit a snag
2. The road to hell is paved with good intentions
3. Jarl Siddgeir is a narcissistic douchebag and Jarl Dengeir is a paranoid schizophrenic
   (quick confession: I put more effort into Siddgeir's version of the plot)

 

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(especially it will explain that huge and weird basement underneath the supposed-to-be-inn)

It's not a stretch to explain that away. I'm also trying to avoid putting too much effort into something that eventually won't matter ?.

 

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I think it will also give more reason for why there are guests in the mansion.

That needs a reason? It's a business...

Regardless, I am going to ease into it - won't go from nobody to a full waiting room overnight.

 

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But I see that you aren't planning to change much in regards to assets in this mod. Still tho, I wanted to share my thoughts on how the story can be improved because I doubt that I will ever get enough patience and/or time to start modding myself even though I have a few ideas for a few mods. ?

If it helps, I mean specifically that I'm not significantly changing the mansion itself (layout and location) or the main characters (their designs).

 

Well, one exception: I'm changing Bailey to be a husky. I hope people aren't too attached to him as a plain gray mutt. Figured he should be something special.

 

But other than that and some tweaks to things inside the mansion, they are the same. And again, eventually won't matter. Just about everything else is up for grabs.

 

[Guest]

Dragons?

 

 

[tasairis]

29 minutes ago, Bromum said:

Dragons?

Of course. They're inherently hostile to the Dragonborn so there will have to be some excuse for (consensual) interactions, but it'll happen somehow.

[skyrim482]

What if Theana had a Sister....

 

 

 

Maybe she could be a long lost sister that reaches out to Theana after she hears about the mansion. She might be interested in coming aboard after you find out she has similar "interests"  or Maybe she has a wardog breeding farm in the hills of solitude. She finds out about you and the mansion from a dog seller.

[tasairis]

1 hour ago, skyrim482 said:

What if Theana had a Sister....

GO GO GADGET INCEST

[skyrim482]

Deleted

[monty359]

Hallo Tasairis,

thank you for adopting this mod.

Playing the AM Plus, i had several problems with quests because other mods like SL Aroused Creatures. Sometimes the mod starts a animation prematurely and it causes then problems with dialogs or quest updates. Could you try and "integrate" Aroused Creatures, SLAroused und maybe other "must have" SL mods? I know, there are many mods... maybe you already have an idea how to solve or at least reduce the problems.

Another thing is, there is a relatively new mod, Sexlab Confabulation. It brings lots af new things into the game. Maybe take a look at it, in order not to overlap with it contentwise. The same is with SL Solutions.

 

[Twycross448]

19 hours ago, tasairis said:

I'll admit it is a bit stretched out (ha), but I actually rather liked it. Probably because I like orgies in general.

? I am the opposite, to be truthful. I hate gangbangs and orgies and vastly prefer nice (or not so nice *insert evil laughter here* ) one-on-one, with special emphasis on non-sentient partners.

 

19 hours ago, tasairis said:

I really do want to keep Jesper male, so you'd have to do more than simply change his NPC record to avoid facing some unusual situations, but I hope the mod will meet your satisfaction regarding skippable spiders so at least you won't have to do worry about changing that part yourself. (And yes, death hounds are on my list.)

 

And I'll go on the record for this now: I do have intentions and desires for this mod that some people may disagree with - hopefully not strong feelings about anything major - but if someone becomes willing to go through the effort of developing a patch to change things (eg, make Jesper female), then I'd be willing to lend my knowledge towards that end (eg, help identify places that use male pronouns or include him in animations).

 

I'll go on record here as well: I am totally fine with your approach.

And please understand that it certainly is no sign of disrespect or not appreciating the efforts put into a mod when I talk about modifications I made for myself to better fit the original AM to my personal tastes. I do not expect any mod maker to cater to my specific whims.

(Side note: making modifications for myself is one of the reasons why I previously asked about keeping NPCs and other mod resources as independent from vanilla assets as possible. ^_^" )

 

That said, who knows if I even have to make any modifications in the end? Maybe the end result will be close enough for me that I don't need to make any. Time will tell. Until then, I'll juist root for you and wish you the determination you'll need to see it through. ?

[tasairis]

12 hours ago, skyrim482 said:

Tasairis do you know of any sources or videos that could show me how to tie sexlab animations into quests and dialouge. I know there is plenty on how to place buildings and create npcs.

Not really.

You need to learn some Papyrus scripting, which creationkit.com can help with. Then you need to learn how to use SexLab, which you do mostly by reading SexLabFramework.psc and checking out how other mods work.

[tasairis]

4 hours ago, monty359 said:

Playing the AM Plus, i had several problems with quests because other mods like SL Aroused Creatures.

Yeah. But there are a bunch of mods that can create problems with scripted situations: Aroused Creatures, Approach, Attraction, Scent of Sex, Random Sex...

 

It's not simple to just "integrate" with them though. They don't have a "disable mod when X" feature. Like, I can't put keywords on an actor or cell that those mods can identify and know to ignore. The only option is to handle it with Papyrus scripting, as in "when the player enters the mansion then disable stuff, and when the player leaves then enable stuff", but that means some complexity that isn't going to be foolproof. I also just don't want to be restrictive like that.

 

What I was going to do is tell people, in the mod description, "Hey, if you have mods that do random stuff, please turn them off during <situations> or else you might screw something up" - and then try to make my stuff use keywords and just generally be as foolproof as possible.

 

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Another thing is, there is a relatively new mod, Sexlab Confabulation. It brings lots af new things into the game. Maybe take a look at it, in order not to overlap with it contentwise. The same is with SL Solutions.

AM was written to use that "Fuck me" popup to know when things happen, but I will only be using the popup to start animations. Knowing when things happen will use SexLab's hook system, so theoretically any mechanism (eg, Aroused Creature's invite action) could be used - as long as the necessary actors were involved, of course.

 

[tasairis]

2 hours ago, Twycross448 said:

And please understand that it certainly is no sign of disrespect or not appreciating the efforts put into a mod when I talk about modifications I made for myself to better fit the original AM to my personal tastes. I do not expect any mod maker to cater to my specific whims.

No worries. Everybody has their own tastes and fetishes.

 

2 hours ago, Twycross448 said:

(Side note: making modifications for myself is one of the reasons why I previously asked about keeping NPCs and other mod resources as independent from vanilla assets as possible. ^_^" )

Yup. Vanilla everything as much as possible. In fact I had to fix some of the AM/AM+ stuff because it was creating a pretty good number of new object types when the existing objects would have worked just as well.